NationStates Jolt Archive


Jewish Avengers

Amtray
24-12-2005, 13:53
Holocaust 'avengers' recount deadly deeds

A group of elderly Holocaust survivors came forward yesterday with accounts of a death squad they formed after World War II to take revenge on their Nazi persecutors, recounting a brazen operation in which they poisoned hundreds of SS officers.

In a broadcast on Israel Channel Two TV, the survivors – some of whom fought in the Warsaw Ghetto uprising – recalled hunting down SS officers in the dead of night. Disguised as British or American officers, they would drag the SS men out of their homes and execute them, they said.

In their largest operation, the group, code-named “the Avengers,” received a large amount of arsenic from Paris and laced loaves of bread fed to hundreds of SS officers imprisoned in an American camp after the war.

They said they were also planning a broad operation in Dachau and Nuremberg, but the Jewish leadership in what would soon become Israel forced them to abandon the plan.

“I didn’t see myself as a murderer, not then and not today,” group member Simcha Rotem told Channel Two.

The broadcast focused on a rare reunion of the group that took place earlier this month in a Tel Aviv suburb. Sixty years after the end of World War II, with most of several dozen “Avengers” either dead or in their late 70s and 80s, Rotem said they gave in to family pressure to recount their experiences to their children, grandchildren and other relatives.

Over the years, reports of such Jewish death squads have surfaced and several books have been written. The Israeli government has often turned a blind eye to the reports. Earlier this year, it refused a request from Poland to extradite a suspected death squad member.

Aaron Breitbart, senior researcher at the Simon Wiesenthal Centre in Los Angeles, said the tale of the bread-poisoning plot is plausible.

“This is not a story that somebody is telling out of a hat. There was such a plan. We just don’t know how close they got” to carrying it out, Breitbart said.

With just a handful of Avengers left, and their actions part of history, the elderly survivors feel they have nothing to lose by speaking publicly about their operations.


One of the few surviving members of the fighters in the Ghetto Uprising, Rotem spent the entire war battling the Nazis. At the end of the war, he went to Bucharest where he met Nava (Abba) Kovner, the head of a group of Avengers from eastern Poland who spent most of the war as partisan fighters.

“I don’t remember how I found out that they were thinking of this idea, but I also had this idea,” Rotem said. “We walked around for two or three hours and we agreed to things and we began to work. It was very simple.”

Rotem, 81 and living in Jerusalem, took charge of a plan to poison to death 28,000 SS officers imprisoned by the Americans in Dachau and Nuremberg in Germany.

“I wanted to finish off the SS officers who were held by the Americans … unfortunately we did not succeed,” Rotem said.

But another plan, carried out in part by Joseph Harmatz, largely succeeded. Harmatz found work at a bakery that supplied bread to American-run prisoner camps.

He said he received arsenic in rubber bottles from Paris, which he then used to poison 3,000 loaves of bread. About 2,280 SS men ate the bread, he said, but couldn’t say how many – or if any – died.

News reports at the time said more than 200 people were hospitalised, but made no mention of deaths.

“We fled (the Nazis) and we took revenge,” the elderly Harmatz told Channel Two in a raspy voice. “We saw ourselves as obligated not to leave Europe so we could settle accounts with the Germans.
Michael Bar-Zohar, author of a book, “The Avengers,” published in 1967, said the bread poisoning was the group’s biggest operation.

They also considered an attempt to poison the water supply of five German cities but decided against it, Bar-Zohar said. Rotem confirmed they had other plans that were called off because they were afraid of killing innocent people.

The group, which included about 40 members, was largely made up of Jews who spent the entire war fighting the Nazis, Bar-Zohar said.

“Their spirit hadn’t been broken by the concentration camps,” Bar-Zohar said. The camp survivors “didn’t have the will or desire to avenge
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Not too concerned about the SS officers they tried to kill but even considering hitting the water supplys of any major city is not on.
So the question is should they be tried for what they did.Bear in mind they did not spend any time in the camps.
Neu Leonstein
24-12-2005, 14:02
“I didn’t see myself as a murderer, not then and not today,” group member Simcha Rotem told Channel Two.
Well, as much as I hate Nazism, Racism and Antisemitism...he is a murderer, no two ways about it.
The war was over, he had no legal right, and some of his targets were helpless prisoners.

Not too concerned about the SS officers they tried to kill but even considering hitting the water supplys of any major city is not on.
That too.

So the question is should they be tried for what they did.Bear in mind they did not spend any time in the camps.
Well, it's been many years, and the people who they got probably deserved it. You could turn that into a mitigating circumstance, I presume.

But I have to say that I'm not happy when people engage in revenge, for whatever reason.

There are better ways to deal with it. Like this woman (http://service.spiegel.de/cache/international/0,1518,389491,00.html) did.
Eutrusca
24-12-2005, 14:05
I don't blame them. Not at all. In their place I would probably have done the same.
Amtray
24-12-2005, 14:08
Prehaps this guy was right in saying that camp suvivours had lost the will to avenge.I still don't believe that killing prisoners in custody was a legitimate act.Even the fledging 'Isreali' government seemed to have issues with it.I do believe that trying them at this age would serve no real purpose but I also believe that if the shoe were on the other foot and it was a Nazi coming forward the Isrealis' would not hesitate for one second to try him.
Kryozerkia
24-12-2005, 15:16
An eye for an eye makes the world go blind.

While it may have made them feel slightly better at the time, by being able to strike at those who systematically hurt and killed them, the revenge method they sought made them no better than the Nazis that perpetrated the crimes in the first place.
Ice Hockey Players
24-12-2005, 16:28
Not that it's right for them to go around killing Nazis, but frankly, I have better things to worry about than whether Nazis were being killed by Jews when, frankly, they deserved at least a taste of their own medicine, though a lethal dose is a bit much.

And frankly, the woman who forgave the Nazi octor who injected her with lethal bacteria has a better heart than I do. If the rubber band were on the other claw, I might just have rustled up some non-contagious strands of some lethal bacteria and injected his fascist ass with them and shouted, "How do you like them apples now, motherfucker?"
Drunk commies deleted
24-12-2005, 16:32
If I'd had my friends and family systematically exterminated I'd certainly want to take vengence on the people responsible. From an ethical standpoint I guess it's not right, but sometimes emotion overrules ethics.
Zero Six Three
24-12-2005, 16:39
Was anybody else expecting this post to be about a duo of secret agents?
Drunk commies deleted
24-12-2005, 16:41
Was anybody else expecting this post to be about a duo of secret agents?
I thought it would be about the Hebrew Hammer.


http://gauntlet.ucalgary.ca/imgcache/200__~gauntlet_eg_eg2_20041209_hebrewhammer-web.jpg

Shabat Shalom Motherfucker!
Harlesburg
25-12-2005, 10:20
How many Russians did they go after?
Stalin sat on his hands while the uprising went on.
Gauthier
25-12-2005, 10:56
When Jews go on a revenge murder spree, it's heroism.

When Muslims go on a revenge murder spree, it's terrorism.

Yay double standards.
Harlesburg
25-12-2005, 11:08
When Jews go on a revenge murder spree, it's heroism.

When Muslims go on a revenge murder spree, it's terrorism.

Yay double standards.
Yay Double Standards!
Keruvalia
25-12-2005, 11:42
Huh .... Ninjews ... who knew?
Murderous maniacs
25-12-2005, 13:49
When Jews go on a revenge murder spree, it's heroism.

When Muslims go on a revenge murder spree, it's terrorism.

Yay double standards.
yeah, but some would say that the situation is slightly different, not that i condone what they were doing. nobody realises that "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth" is not meant to be taken literally.
my poor jewish brethren, though i would probably want to do the same in their position
Cabra West
25-12-2005, 14:10
I can understand the emotional motivation for the killings, and as far as I know this group wasn't the only one who took revenge on SS officers and other high-ranking Nazi officials shortly after the war. However, I cannot in any way justify the killings.

By killing these people they have put themselves on the same level, disregarding human rights and all ethical and moral values just as their victims had done. Those killings were cases of murder, not justice.
Personally, I feel that considering the age of the murderers, the time span between the murders and now and the fact that the time in which the murders were comitted was basically lawless should be held in favour of the offenders. There is little point in persecuting them today to make a moral example of them. It would do little more than to create martyrs and draw unnecessary attention to an isolated group and isolated acts.
Super-power
25-12-2005, 15:46
When Jews go on a revenge murder spree, it's heroism.
When Muslims go on a revenge murder spree, it's terrorism.
Yay double standards.
Mmmmkay, last time I checked, civillians != government officials
OceanDrive3
25-12-2005, 15:52
Mmmmkay, last time I checked, civillians != government officialsThe minute the Gov of Hitler (or the Japanese Emperor)is deposed by the Allies.. They are no longer Gov officials.. they legally become civilians.
Heavenly Sex
25-12-2005, 16:10
I can very well understand what they did, so they should let them live the rest of their lifes in peace...