NationStates Jolt Archive

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4556576.stm
"Chad is today in a state of war with Sudan," the statement says.

It asks Chadians to form a patriotic front against what it calls "the common enemy of the nation".

The statement thanks the international community for its support so far, but says condemnations of the recent violence in Adre do not go far enough.

It appeals to the international community, including the African Union, to specifically condemn what it alleges is Sudan's involvement in the attack on Adre.

I feel I'm obliged to post this, since the news probably won't report it...but Chad has declared war on Sudan over the apparent inaction (and maybe even support) of anti-government rebel troups in the border area.

So what do you say?

These are the two militaries by the way:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Chad
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_of_Sudan

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/3049/inthearmynow5pt.jpg

Is it hot in Chad???



Seriously, this could get very bloody. I wonder if the UN will send in forces to keep the peace.

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/3049/inthearmynow5pt.jpg

Is it hot in Chad???

Seriously, this could get very bloody. I wonder if the UN will send in forces to keep the peace.

Probably not. The US is on the security council and they would rather stay in Iraq at the moment.

Hmmm how long before this goes into UN bashing?

Fair enough, if the sudanese are really supporting the rebels, I suppose. Still you have to favor Sudan coming out of this in better shape than Chad, unless the french get involved.

So what do you say?

Toyota Wars II?

Probably not. The US is on the security council and they would rather stay in Iraq at the moment.

Hmmm how long before this goes into UN bashing?


Well, other nations could lend a helping hand to the Sudan/Chad situation. It's not just the U.S. that has to deal with this. And I don't think the U.S. would vote against defusing this situation in the security council.

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/3049/inthearmynow5pt.jpg

Is it hot in Chad???



Seriously, this could get very bloody. I wonder if the UN will send in forces to keep the peace.

no way will the UN do anything......Sudan has been in the middle of a civil war for the past 10 years.
they are using child soliders and the world has turnded its head ignoring the problum why would they change now?

Well, other nations could lend a helping hand to the Sudan/Chad situation. It's not just the U.S. that has to deal with this. And I don't think the U.S. would vote against defusing this situation in the security council.
Particularly since on the Sudanese side, I believe the Darfur region would be the region in which much of the combat might happen. Which kinda sucks for the refugees there.

http://www.lib.utexas.edu/maps/africa/darfur_sudan_usg_704_2004.jpg

Whatever happens, blame the US.

The Region of Africa is dealing with the current crisis in Chad/Sudan and are working with the parties through the institution of the African Union.

We invite all nations of the world to collaborate in the negotiation process. This will really require sustained diplomatic effort with international pressure to diffuse at this late stage, where forces are being mobilized on both sides as we speak.

More information available at: www.nationstatesafrica.com

President Bingu wa Mutharika
Malawi

Seriously, the West should just reconquer and colonize Africa. They've had their chance at self-governance and completely fucked it up. We should just retake Africa to be charitable.

And just as the Ethiopia-Eritrea conflict was being defused. Let's hope this situation doesn't get too hot.

Seriously, the West should just reconquer and colonize Africa. They've had their chance at self-governance and completely fucked it up. We should just retake Africa to be charitable.
good point, unfourtionatly it would not work

The Region of Africa is dealing with the current crisis in Chad/Sudan and are working with the parties through the institution of the African Union.

We invite all nations of the world to collaborate in the negotiation process. This will really require sustained diplomatic effort with international pressure to diffuse at this late stage, where forces are being mobilized on both sides as we speak.

More information available at: www.nationstatesafrica.com

President Bingu wa Mutharika
Malawi

We invite you to learn the difference between play and reality. Take it to the RP forums and stop wasting our time here with your make believe.

Seriously, the West should just reconquer and colonize Africa. They've had their chance at self-governance and completely fucked it up. We should just retake Africa to be charitable.

Yeah, it was so much better with the Belgians in charge of parts of Africa. A veritable golden age that we all still look back upon.

We invite you to learn the difference between play and reality. Take it to the RP forums and stop wasting our time here with your make believe.

To be fair, their website is a lot nicer than the 'real' african union's.

To be fair, their website is a lot nicer than the 'real' african union's.

http://www.africa-union.org/ ?

I quite like the look of their one: its late-nineties stylings lend it a certain ernestness and innocence.

you know, i've always said that what africa needs is a few more wars...

Seriously, the West should just reconquer and colonize Africa. They've had their chance at self-governance and completely fucked it up. We should just retake Africa to be charitable.

ah yes, a time when there were free puppies for all. and not the slightest bit of ethnic cleansing, enslaved children working in diamond mines, and general no-goodness all around.

ah yes, a time when there were free puppies for all. and not the slightest bit of ethnic cleansing, enslaved children working in diamond mines, and general no-goodness all around.

I mean what kind of half-assed ex-colony lets itself get dragged into a war over terrorism?

http://www.africa-union.org/ ?

I quite like the look of their one: its late-nineties stylings lend it a certain ernestness and innocence.

It's a little early 'dot-bomb' for my tastes. The gothic style font for the title seems a tad in apropos as well.

The fake one is nice and up to date - though marred by dead links and silly content.

It's a little early 'dot-bomb' for my tastes. The gothic style seems a tad in apropos as well.

The fake one is nice and up to date - though marred by dead links and silly content.

The fact that about 70% of the national leaders appear to be white strikes me as a tad 'interesting'.

Due to the different tribes located in africa, alot of these countries will invade another country and commit genocide in an attempt to become the strongest tribe. sought of like a more violent foreign policy. this is gonna continue until they wipe themselves out or one tribe controls all of africa. its sad but true

The fact that about 70% of the national leaders appear to be white strikes me as a tad 'interesting'.

Just curious. Are you counting the Sith Lord as 'white'?

Due to the different tribes located in africa, alot of these countries will invade another country and commit genocide in an attempt to become the strongest tribe.

Good thing us Euros never tried anything like that.

Just curious. Are you counting the Sith Lord as 'white'?

Not having seen the new SW films I didn't even recognise a Sith Lord in there. Wizened chap in some sort of cowl?

Not having seen the new SW films I didn't even recognise a Sith Lord in there. Wizened chap in some sort of cowl?

Yes. And that answers my question for me.

Due to the different tribes located in africa, alot of these countries will invade another country and commit genocide in an attempt to become the strongest tribe. sought of like a more violent foreign policy. this is gonna continue until they wipe themselves out or one tribe controls all of africa. its sad but true

so do you see this as something inevitable among all people, or is it just those with darker skintones?

Due to the different tribes located in africa, alot of these countries will invade another country and commit genocide in an attempt to become the strongest tribe. sought of like a more violent foreign policy. this is gonna continue until they wipe themselves out or one tribe controls all of africa. its sad but true

No, it's not. I don't know how else to qualify this than to say that you're talking nonsense. Africans are all in tribes! There's like forty primitives there, which makes this possible! Not eight hundred odd million human beings!

Ow, my head.

For once I have to agree with BG! People over history have been able to put tribal loyalties aside time and time again, and it's an oversimplification of the issue anyhow.

Good thing us Euros never tried anything like that.

:eek: You are money? :eek:

:eek: You are money? :eek:

Could be worse, I could be forced by accident of geography to employ 'Dongs'.

For once I have to agree with BG! People over history have been able to put tribal loyalties aside time and time again, and it's an oversimplification of the issue anyhow.
Indeed. This is a lot more complex than simple tribal warfare. Politics, Religion, Foreign Aid and even Oil gets into all this.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/country_profiles/1068700.stm
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/IRIN/f9e27c48f3237c8363ebd9376026aa72.htm

The rebel group they are talking about is the "Rally for Democracy and Liberty", led by someone called Mohammed Nour. I could find out little about their motives and their goals - but they seem to have something to do with Darfur as well.
http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/D6AC95E6-5C3A-433D-8982-28CFFAEABDE1.htm

The Region of Africa is dealing with the current crisis in Chad/Sudan and are working with the parties through the institution of the African Union.

We invite all nations of the world to collaborate in the negotiation process. This will really require sustained diplomatic effort with international pressure to diffuse at this late stage, where forces are being mobilized on both sides as we speak.

More information available at: www.nationstatesafrica.com

President Bingu wa Mutharika
Malawi

Chellis wasn't aware we were allowing our Malawian subjects access to the internet. We apologize to the community, and will take care of this.

*Promptly sends the secret police to eliminate all non-government servers in Malawi*

Life expectancy: 42 years (men), 45 years (women) (UN)
That's for Chad. Man, surely they're worse enough already.

That's for Chad. Man, surely they're worse enough already.
You'd think so...

Well, for now we can't tell whether this is just empty talk, or whether they will actually fight. But if they do, it would get ugly.
Neither side has a properly trained army, and both sides would basically resort to sending violent militias - and in between is not only the foreign helpers, but also the refugees in the Darfur region.

I'm thinking someone would have to put a sizable force on the table to keep everyone apart down there.

I feel I'm obliged to post this, since the news probably won't report it...but Chad has declared war on Sudan over the apparent inaction (and maybe even support) of anti-government rebel troups in the border area.
SIGH! Perhaps someday mankind will finally learn to not covet that which others have, and figure out that the cost of war is far too high to see it as a viable alternative. I'll be long gone before that happens though. Perhaps my grandchildren will see it.

I am betting on Chad. I mean, they won a war against Lybia. True, Lybia is real good at surrendering, but I mean.. Chad is a landlocked hellhole, suitable only for scorpions..

Anyway, I was asking for a nuclear exchange for christmas to bright up the news, and all I got was this lousy war.

No one is going to do anything about it, gentlemen.
Chad is a piece of desert.
Sudan is an ally against alqaeda (don't believe me? Research!)

Oh well

Merry christmas

So,

A tiny nation with no economy has declared war on a once-wealthy nation that has squandered it's strength on a ten year civil war.

I'd really like to say "go for it boys! Improve the gene pool!"

Unfortunately, it's this kind of thing that has the decided capacity to spread, particularly into the relatively stable countries in the vicinity (including Egypt, btw.)

Which means SOMEBODY is going to have to go in and stabilize the situation.

Guess who? A hint - the country everyone is always decrying as being "too aggressive" - except, of course, when they want something done and are too weak to do it themselves...

http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/3049/inthearmynow5pt.jpg

Is it hot in Chad???



Seriously, this could get very bloody. I wonder if the UN will send in forces to keep the peace.

Figured this would happen. They kicked the UN observers out of Chad a week or so ago.

We invite you to learn the difference between play and reality. Take it to the RP forums and stop wasting our time here with your make believe.

ROFLMAO

I hope Sudan gets the crap knocked out of it. I didn't know they were funding rebels in Chad, but I know they've been supporting Lord's Resistance Army in Uganda, are a habitual violator of human rights, and have supported Al Quaeda in the past. I hope Chad teaches Sudan a long overdue lesson.

I am betting on Chad. I mean, they won a war against Lybia. True, Lybia is real good at surrendering, but I mean.. Chad is a landlocked hellhole, suitable only for scorpions..

Anyway, I was asking for a nuclear exchange for christmas to bright up the news, and all I got was this lousy war.

No one is going to do anything about it, gentlemen.
Chad is a piece of desert.
Sudan is an ally against alqaeda (don't believe me? Research!)

Oh well

Merry christmas
The only reason they can feed us information is because they allowed Al Quaeda to conduct business within their borders for so long. They kicked Bin Laden out because they saw more profit making opportunities by offering token intelligence to the west.

Which means SOMEBODY is going to have to go in and stabilize the situation.

Your solution to troops being mobilised is mobilising more troops?

I hope Sudan gets the crap knocked out of it. I didn't know they were funding rebels in Chad, but I know they've been supporting Lord's Resistance Army in Uganda, are a habitual violator of human rights, and have supported Al Quaeda in the past. I hope Chad teaches Sudan a long overdue lesson.

Same here. I don't know why anyone would want to mess with Uganda. It's one of the only countries in Africa ruled by someone whose not a kleptocrat, genocidal maniac, or totalitarian scumbag. I wish Chad, Uganda, and the Darfur refugees would all team up and demolish the Sudanese army.

Over a decade ago, Chad and Libya were fighting (Libya got their butts kicked) and there was no UN intervention.

Seriously, the West should just reconquer and colonize Africa. They've had their chance at self-governance and completely fucked it up. We should just retake Africa to be charitable.
The West fucked it up in the first place, Einstein.

The West fucked it up in the first place, Einstein.

It is called the 'smother the flames with petrol' solution.

Same here. I don't know why anyone would want to mess with Uganda. It's one of the only countries in Africa ruled by someone whose not a kleptocrat, genocidal maniac, or totalitarian scumbag. I wish Chad, Uganda, and the Darfur refugees would all team up and demolish the Sudanese army.
Really? *Researches*

The West fucked it up in the first place, Einstein.

Yes, but it's not completely our fault. Africa's not exactly renowned for having good leaders. Mobutu Sese Seko, Agostinho Neto, Samora Machel, Jose Eduardo Dos Dantos, Kwame Nkrumah, Julius Nyerere, Sekou Toure, Hastings Banda, Kenneth Kaunda, Robert Mugabe, Thabo Mbeki, the apartheid regime, Muammar al-Quaddafi, Gamal Nasser, Ahmed Ben Bella, Charles Taylor, Samuel Kanyon Doe, Mohammed Siad Barre, Mengistu, Omar Bongo, Sani Abacha...

Really? *Researches*

Africa's not known as the "continent of dictators" for nothing. What few African countries are not run by tyrants are cesspools of corruption. Botswana being the only notable exception.

Yes, but it's not completely our fault. Africa's not exactly renowned for having good leaders. Mobutu Sese Seko, Agostinho Neto, Samora Machel, Jose Eduardo Dos Dantos, Kwame Nkrumah, Julius Nyerere, Sekou Toure, Hastings Banda, Kenneth Kaunda, Robert Mugabe, Thabo Mbeki, the apartheid regime, Muammar al-Quaddafi, Gamal Nasser, Ahmed Ben Bella, Charles Taylor, Samuel Kanyon Doe, Mohammed Siad Barre, Mengistu, Omar Bongo, Sani Abacha...

Not to mention Francisco Macias Nguema, Teodoro Obiang Nguema, Idi Amin, Milton Obote, Jean-Bedel Bokassa, Laurent Kabila, Hissein Habre, etc.

Originally Posted by Aggretia
Seriously, the West should just reconquer and colonize Africa. They've had their chance at self-governance and completely fucked it up. We should just retake Africa to be charitable.

The West fucked it up in the first place, Einstein.

It wasn't ideal, no occupation is, but at least a lot less people died of famine, drought and civil war was virtually non-existent.

Meh. Maybe if the trade laws didn't lock them into unsustainable debt the few uncorrupt people could do something about the problems...

I fear the UN will do nothing. Oh, sure there will be strong words...but words do not have any bite.

The only nations capable of supplying the UN with bite are the ones with power projection capability.: The US, Britain and France.

The first two are already tied up and I can't see France commiting the Foreign Legion to go fight against a Muslim country (Sudan) when the domestic situation is so iffy.

It is called the 'smother the flames with petrol' solution.

No thats more of the recent solution. It used to be lets play the tribal primitives against eachother strategy back then.

Maybe this will help end those annoying rebels and militias that terrorize those in Darfur and, quite frankly, violate Chadian sovereignty.
The thing to watch here is oil politics. Any oil in the region is far too small to be internationally significant, but it is a regional factor. Will this end up hurting Chad's oil sector? Also, look for an opprotunistic Lybia here. If Chad grows weak from this, Lybia will occupy large parts of the country.

It would be nice if this turned out to be another Vietnam-invading-Cambodia episode, but I have no such hope. Chad is the weaker power and probably don't have much of an interest in making life better for the oppressed of Sudan.

Hmmm, the refugees in Darfur must be jumping with joy.

Is this the same Chad who was the jock asshole at my high school? Figures he'd try to fight a whole nation. I hate Chad, he's a big jerk.

At least SOMEONE is doing something about Sudan.

The only reason they can feed us information is because they allowed Al Quaeda to conduct business within their borders for so long. They kicked Bin Laden out because they saw more profit making opportunities by offering token intelligence to the west.

More than token inteligence, but that's about it.
The sudanese goverment is reliable enough to justify.. tolerance for certain actions.

This could make a good movie if it really comes to out and out war.

This could make a good movie if it really comes to out and out war.


A good point you have.

It's not even a declaration of war. It's nothing even approaching that.

Chad is just in "a state of belligerence" with Sudan. They're still maintaining diplomatic ties etc. They're just a teensy bit upset is all.

bump

Chad could win if they fight a streetwar but the military numbers are greater with Sudan.

This is obviously something to keep an eye on. Chad's fortunes looked like they might turn around in an article from National Geographic's Africa special this September profiling the Chadian people's fight to make sure the oil funds were spent properly. Anyone read it?

Here's the link. (http://www7.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0509/feature3/)

[Uganda]'s one of the only countries in Africa ruled by someone whose not a kleptocrat, genocidal maniac, or totalitarian scumbag.
Hold your horses there...Museveni has changed the constitution recently so he can keep getting reelected, he closed radio stations because they said things that inconvenienced him, and now he jailed the opposition leader.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4482456.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/4555450.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4552624.stm

Does anyone have a guess about how a war between Chad And Sudan will affect Darfur? It seems to me that any conflict between Chad and Sudan will likely be fought there.

Hold your horses there...Museveni has changed the constitution recently so he can keep getting reelected, he closed radio stations because they said things that inconvenienced him, and now he jailed the opposition leader.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4482456.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/4555450.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4552624.stm


So there are no African democracies then? Not even post-Apartheid South Africa?

Does anyone have a guess about how a war between Chad And Sudan will affect Darfur? It seems to me that any conflict between Chad and Sudan will likely be fought there.
Yep. So we got a few hundred thousand (millions?) of starving refugees, and a bunch of aid workers in the middle, and two poorly trained militias on either side, trying to kill each other.

So there are no African democracies then? Not even post-Apartheid South Africa?
No, there are a few. But Uganda probably isn't one of the brighter candidates.
Museveni has turned to the dark side, as so many of his kind have.

Your solution to troops being mobilised is mobilising more troops?


Hell, it's no sort of a solution, but it just might stop the whole situation from escalating out of anyone's control. We don't want WWIII to start in Africa the way WWI started in the Balkans.