NationStates Jolt Archive

Alright. We all pay lip service to the idea that every nation and society has its problems, but I think we all also secretly gloat at certain times that we have it better than others, and the reason is due to some great policy we have, or attitude, or 'specialness' on our part. How valid is this, really?

We compare dissimilar things to prove our points..."oh, they have more sudden mob violence than we do, (forgetting that overall levels of regular violence may actually be higher in your society) and that must be because of 'x'." "We have a higher GNP than they, and it is due entirely to 'y'." Nothing is that simple. Nothing as complex as the societal issues we discuss are linked to only one factor.

But it feels good sometimes to think we just do it better than others.

Well, fuck it. We've all got problems. So what are we actually doing about them? We can look at the examples of other nations, but their solutions are not necessarily going to work for us. And simply saying, "our levels of poverty are not as extreme as it is in *z country*, therefore we don't need to worry about it" is silly too.

No system is perfect...and exporting one 'sort of good, slightly lessed flawed than others' system is not the answer. I think it was best said by Whispering Legs:



As an aside, the obvious fact that what works in one country doesn't always work in another is evidence to me that:

a) not everyone needs or wants the same kind of government
b) not everyone needs or wants the same kinds of laws
c) not everyone needs or wants the same political philosophy

I don't believe for a minute that democracy or socialism or any other -ism is a universal antidote for poverty, war, crime, etc., in all countries.

So what are your societies' problems? And what is being done about them?

People don't stop eating here in the States. It's gross. And then they say it's glandular or genetic. Lemme tell ya, look at wherever your ancestors are from and chances are they aren't all fatasses. I don't know how we'll ever cure our selves of this epidemic short of famine.

Pretty old Skool going with the quote from WL.

People don't stop eating here in the States. It's gross. And then they say it's glandular or genetic. Lemme tell ya, look at wherever your ancestors are from and chances are they aren't all fatasses. I don't know how we'll ever cure our selves of this epidemic short of famine.

My ancestors are German, so can't help you there.

lack of good education amongst most people. culture of not caring about education or intelligence - kids pretending to be thick cos being a geek isn't 'cool'... all sparked off by massive underfunding of the education system and public services in the 80s, which created "generation x", who have now bred and created the chav endemic, a main problem of which this lack of caring about education (coupled with a lack of respect for others, both learned from parents...)

whats being done about it? the govt has been pumping money into the education system for the last 5+ years but it will take time to see the fruits of that labour - just as its taken 20+ years to see the negative effects of underfunding in the 80s. the national schools capital investment fund alone has risen from 700 million pounds per year to 5.2 billion pounds since labour took power from the conservatives in 1997.

this will pay off, but not soon enough.
initiatives like using different teaching techniques and using more technology in the classroom will pay off sooner.

but the real problem is this chavvish dismissal of education, knowledge, intelligence and learning... its a cultural problem and i don't really see anything done about it in the short run :(

UK

We import _half_ of American ideas. But only the crap half. Single constitutional document, bill of rights, statement of the ideals of government? No.

Frivilous lawsuits, ambulance chasing, weakening education, obesity? Yes!

Plus we've got Tony Blair... combines the worst halves of Clinton and Bush in one body. Big on the erosion of civil and political liberties, without replacing them. Worst PM we've had, lately.

We do nothing to fix this.

We've all got problems. So what are we going to do about it?

Grow old and die, usually.

I plan to ignore my problems and hope that they go away. If they become too difficult to ignore, I'll drink more.

I'll probably put them off or apply band-aid solutions until I'm too old and senile to deal with them myself and my kids are forced to deal with them while i happily watch the birds out the window and occasionally crap myself. :)

I plan to ignore my problems and hope that they go away. If they become too difficult to ignore, I'll drink more.
I like this idea. I shall try it.

I plan to ignore my problems and hope that they go away. If they become too difficult to ignore, I'll drink more.

They will ... and if you drink enough, they'll go away even faster.

Take an old Frenchman's advice, and tend to my garden. It's sage advice.

all sparked off by massive underfunding of the education system and public services in the 80s
It started before then. I read a bit in the paper (so it must be true :rolleyes:) saying it started back when Comprehensive schools were introduced, and another that it's even older; Britain's never really been fond of intelligence.

It might be chavs now, but Britain's had a reputation as the home of the football hooligan for quite a while.

I'd be at least equally inclined to blame the parents for a youth's misbehaviour; they only spend a few hours per day at school, after all...

Elgesh']UK

We import _half_ of American ideas. But only the crap half. Single constitutional document, bill of rights, statement of the ideals of government? No.

Frivilous lawsuits, ambulance chasing, weakening education, obesity? Yes!

Plus we've got Tony Blair... combines the worst halves of Clinton and Bush in one body. Big on the erosion of civil and political liberties, without replacing them. Worst PM we've had, lately.

We do nothing to fix this.

What can we do? Its not like we've got an alternative.

What can we do? Its not like we've got an alternative.
Middle class revolution? Nah, they'd all be too polite. Radical Liberal Democrats - kick down the doors to the Houses of Parliament brandishing cricket bats, say "We'll pay for the door..."

It started before then. I read a bit in the paper (so it must be true :rolleyes:) saying it started back when Comprehensive schools were introduced, and another that it's even older; Britain's never really been fond of intelligence.

It might be chavs now, but Britain's had a reputation as the home of the football hooligan for quite a while.

I'd be at least equally inclined to blame the parents for a youth's misbehaviour; they only spend a few hours per day at school, after all...
thats my point - kids spend a fair amount of time with their parents: ergo parents are partially responsible. when you add that to the fact that kids' formative years are definatley spent majoritatively with the parents, you really can blame the parents... behaviourally, yes, but also in their attitudes to things in life (such as education) and culturally too.

yes britain has had a long history of loutishness and poor education, but the chavs just seem to be taking the biscuit when the whole "culture" revolves around - in essense - being thick. thick is cooler than geek (and only geeks do work), and being cool or popular, or whatever, is more important than so many things - especially education. another american import??
i mean very few kids actually like learning of course, and fewer still fully realise the value of what they are doing at school (which is why education is the very definition of a merit good... god i sound old :p), but all i'm trying to say is that it seems to be getting worse, and i think you can trace the 'turning point' when it went from bad to worse when thatcher created gen x.
i mean britain may have a longstanding tradition and reputation for 'hooliganism' but we also have a reputation for being a traditionally well educated country, with ancient schools, world-class, brilliant universities, brilliant engineers and a generally decently educated populace. this is the britain we should be heading back towards, and we are... but too slowly.
[/rant]

SCOTTTT-LUND! SCOTTTT-LUND!

We now officially have the fattest kids in world, finally beating America. 1/3 overweight, and 1/5 clinically obese by the age of 12.

wha's like us, indeed...:rolleyes:

Elgesh']SCOTTTT-LUND! SCOTTTT-LUND!

We now officially have the fattest kids in world, finally beating America. 1/3 overweight, and 1/5 clinically obese by the age of 12.

wha's like us, indeed...:rolleyes:

Arn't Samoans the fattest? I heard that somewhere.

Arn't Samoans the fattest? I heard that somewhere.
Not now, we got 'em beat!

This is just looking at children, though, not adults; those samoans may be beating us _now_, but give us 15 years, our fat kids'll have grown up by then, and we'll take em!

Problems? I'm not sure what problems me, or my country has. But I do know for a FACT that nuking Iran will solve all of them. Every last one.

Pretty old Skool going with the quote from WL.
I'm hardcore like that:D

Okay, obesity has come up a number of times, so I'll focus on that for a spell. (sorry for the long post...I type like a maniac)

It actually does worry me. My husband's family came to Canada from Chile...from a very poor neighbourhood, eating the bare minimum because of poverty. When they came here, they were still kind of on starvation mode. My mother and father in law both work like dogs, and really don't eat that much...their weight has not suffered. My sister-in-law went from being a stick to being overweight, though not extremely so...and some of that is what having a couple of kids will do to you. But it's the KIDS that are fat. They've been raised on a fairly healthy diet...but their parents are constantly stuffing them. They push them to eat, I believe, because of a subconscious fear that they may soon go hungry. But they don't. When the kids aren't hungry, it doesn't matter. They still have to eat their food. Now, these kids aren't eating chips and pop...but they ARE eating a fair amount of bread, and way too much of what is normally not fattening food (beans, lentils, and so on). These kids already have poor eating habits...stuffing themselves even when they have no hunger.

As a consequence, my husband and I really try to listen to our kids and feed them when they're hungry...rather than at specific times. And junk food is always DESERT...if given at all. I used to stuff my kids because I was afraid they weren't getting enough food...but they are fit, and healthy, and don't need it. When they're hungry, they'll let us know.

Now, I don't think families are all stuffing their kids like my in-laws do...I think it's more of a junk food issue and lack of exercise. But we do our kids no service when we set for them bad food habits at an early age...it's going to haunt them for life.

I don't understand all the factors though...even in Chile now, there are rising rates of obesity. There are more obese people in this world than there are undernourished ones. It used to be a problem only in the richer nations...what the hell is happening? What is going wrong?

This site ( http://www.truehealth.org/obesity.html) actually blames plastics as being part of the reason obesity is becoming a world-wide phenomenon. I've actually heard this argument before, something about chemicals in plastics approximating estrogen or something. Not that I buy this theory...