NationStates Jolt Archive

I was posting in that thread regarding women being blamed for being raped, and noticed several posts that were about how strongly women felt about being able to dress how they liked without it provoking rape. Which is fair enough, but I've noticed that this also extends to women sometimes being offended at any serious sexual attention paid to them if they dress provocatively.

In a sense this is just one example of how somehow we've come to feel we should never ever be offended or have social difficulties. This is a strange and depressing sentiment; life is messy and people will have problems. We should be able to resolve them without constant resorting to legalism.

I was posting in that thread regarding women being blamed for being raped, and noticed several posts that were about how strongly women felt about being able to dress how they liked without it provoking rape. Which is fair enough, but I've noticed that this also extends to women sometimes being offended at any serious sexual attention paid to them if they dress provocatively.

In a sense this is just one example of how somehow we've come to feel we should never ever be offended or have social difficulties. This is a strange and depressing sentiment; life is messy and people will have problems. We should be able to resolve them without constant resorting to legalism.

I take offense to this post. :p

It depends on what you mean by offended. If you mean making lewd comments, well that depends on the age of the "victim", I'd say when you pass 16 you can handle a bit of verbal abuse.
However, intruding within a couple inches uninvited (nevermind touching) is an offense that should get you kicked in the 'nads big time.

I'm not referring to defending yourself or taking personal issue with people's misbehavior or rudeness or whatever is bothering you. I'm talking about the way legalism seems to have taken over good manners or social interaction. Sometimes social interaction is negative, that is how we learn.

I'm not referring to defending yourself or taking personal issue with people's misbehavior or rudeness or whatever is bothering you. I'm talking about the way legalism seems to have taken over good manners or social interaction. Sometimes social interaction is negative, that is how we learn.
Which was my point too, I think. So long as the other person is keeping a couple inches between the two of you and you are hold enough to handle it, then what they say should hardly cause you great distress.

I was posting in that thread regarding women being blamed for being raped, and noticed several posts that were about how strongly women felt about being able to dress how they liked without it provoking rape. Which is fair enough, but I've noticed that this also extends to women sometimes being offended at any serious sexual attention paid to them if they dress provocatively.

In a sense this is just one example of how somehow we've come to feel we should never ever be offended or have social difficulties. This is a strange and depressing sentiment; life is messy and people will have problems. We should be able to resolve them without constant resorting to legalism.
In this post, you jump from rape directly to "serious sexual attention" and other messy social interactions. That's quite a jump to make.

Rape is a form of assault and it is a violent crime and therefore a proper subject for "legalism." It is also completely unrelated to the victim's dress or behavior.

Offensive sexual attention that is not rape is a) not rape, b) subjective as to its offensiveness, and c) not the subject of the rape/blame thread you refer to. However, the habit of blurring the line between rape and other forms of sexual interaction did become a topic of that thread. What's the problem with that?

im not sure what your point is.

some people in general think that there should be no reaction to their clothing no matter how obvious it is that they are dressing to get a reaction. women in skimpy clothing, teenagers with spikey green hair and black makeup, gangsta wannabes with droopy pants, whoever, they are being disingenuous when they pretend to be shocked at being treated according to their manner of dress.

but that doesnt mean that its ok to abuse people who dress for a reaction or to make a statement. some treatment needs to be illegal.

I was posting in that thread regarding women being blamed for being raped, and noticed several posts that were about how strongly women felt about being able to dress how they liked without it provoking rape. Which is fair enough, but I've noticed that this also extends to women sometimes being offended at any serious sexual attention paid to them if they dress provocatively.

In a sense this is just one example of how somehow we've come to feel we should never ever be offended or have social difficulties. This is a strange and depressing sentiment; life is messy and people will have problems. We should be able to resolve them without constant resorting to legalism.

your post wasn't politically correct enough. I am offended by your "hate" speech.

rofl, j/k

it is funny how concern is so quickly (and illogically) branded as "hate" these days.

Person 1: "I don't like something you're doing."

Response from Person 2: "STOP SPREADING HATE!"

In this post, you jump from rape directly to "serious sexual attention" and other messy social interactions. That's quite a jump to make.

Rape is a form of assault and it is a violent crime and therefore a proper subject for "legalism." It is also completely unrelated to the victim's dress or behavior.

Offensive sexual attention that is not rape is a) not rape, b) subjective as to its offensiveness, and c) not the subject of the rape/blame thread you refer to. However, the habit of blurring the line between rape and other forms of sexual interaction did become a topic of that thread. What's the problem with that?
To be fair he did not "make the jump" he was just explaining about the thread which the idea came from not nessisarily his reasoning line

im not sure what your point is.

some people in general think that there should be no reaction to their clothing no matter how obvious it is that they are dressing to get a reaction. women in skimpy clothing, teenagers with spikey green hair and black makeup, gangsta wannabes with droopy pants, whoever, they are being disingenuous when they pretend to be shocked at being treated according to their manner of dress.

but that doesnt mean that its ok to abuse people who dress for a reaction or to make a statement. some treatment needs to be illegal.
Again I did not get the feeling that him or her was trying to justify rape

Rather making the extention off the thread that delt with that topic to discuss exactly what you did in the first part of your post

Since I have the right to offend you and your rights end where mine begin, I have to say that you don't have the right to not be offended.

:D

I'll leave my thoughts to be expressed by the inimitable Carlos Mencia:

"I tell you, I will go to a club or a bar tonight and I will see some chick in a skirt this short [here he mimes on his thighs a line less than an inch lower than his scrote might dangle] and a top exposing damn near everything. When I see this woman dressed in a way clearly designed to attract sexual attention, she will look at me as I lavish upon her the very attention she dressed for and yell What the fuck are YOU lookin' at?!?.

[pause]

Your pussy! Your panocha is winking at me!"

Sorry ladies, but you wanna show off the goods, they're gonna get ogled. Adopt a little modesty or live with it. Now, IN NO WAY does this statement condone rape or any other kind of assault. To me, the guys who think it's okay to do things like fondle women against their will or worse yet drug them to get their way with them need to lean into the plate, take one for the team, and kill themselves.

To be fair he did not "make the jump" he was just explaining about the thread which the idea came from not nessisarily his reasoning line
Just reread the original post, and you're right. I saw a jump there on first read. Now I see that he's talking about women complaining about getting sexual attention when they are clearly dressing to be sexually attractive. I apologize. I'm still sensitive from arguing with the troglodytes-in-denial on that other thread.

Yeah, dressing sexy and then bitching at attracted guys is an annoying habit. But even so, I don't get the point about "legalism." Is the complaint about those few cases of super-freak anti-sex-leaguers who claim any sexual attention is an insult against women and should be a crime? In that case, I agree 100%. When I dress sexy, I get offended if a guy doesn't look at my breasts. Goddammit, I put on that uncomfortable bra for a reason, you know.

Whoa whoa whoa here...first of all, what is 'sexy'? I think most people seeing a woman in clothes that hardly cover an inch of flesh kind of wince...I mean...ewww. Even if she's hot...that kind of dress is just too revealing for comfort. Especially in Canada (temperature you know). But 'dressing attractively'? That covers a lot of ground...pretty much everything past 'wearing a mumu or a paper bag'. I've gotten unwanted attention from wearing a SUIT...yeah, that's pretty damn modest in my mind, but I got all sorts of shit said to me, and one drunken buffoon actually said, when I rebuffed him, "Why'd you come here dressed like that if you didn't want some action?"

WTF? Dressed in a suit that looks good on me instead of, oh, I don't know...muddy overalls? FUCK OFF!

I don't have the right to not be offended by him...but I do have the right to pepper spray his drunken ass if he gropes me.

I don't have the right to not be offended by him...but I do have the right to pepper spray his drunken ass if he gropes me.

Surely eyes would be more effective?:p

Surely eyes would be more effective?:p
I was using metonymy. "His drunken ass" actually refers to his person, not his ass. And no, I wouldn't spray him all over:)

Whoa whoa whoa here...first of all, what is 'sexy'? I think most people seeing a woman in clothes that hardly cover an inch of flesh kind of wince...I mean...ewww. Even if she's hot...that kind of dress is just too revealing for comfort. :snip:

Haha I'm sorry but the differences between men and woman are so blaringly present in your post it is comical. Guys look at utterly naked woman and total sluts in porn ALL the time. We love to see a hot girl dressed like a ridiculous slut. Now do we want to go out with them or marry them or anything? Maybe not. But "wince" I don't think so.

PS I'm sure some guys will come forward and be like blah blah we don't like hot girls dressed scantily but they're lying :D

Haha I'm sorry but the differences between men and woman are so blaringly present in your post it is comical. Guys look at utterly naked woman and total sluts in porn ALL the time. We love to see a hot girl dressed like a ridiculous slut. Now do we want to go out with them or marry them or anything? Maybe not. But "wince" I don't think so.


Oh yeah? (http://answers.typepad.com/fatfree/images/fathat377-thumb.jpg)

*PIC WARNING: may not be appropriate to view in a public place*

Oh yeah? (http://answers.typepad.com/fatfree/images/fathat377-thumb.jpg)

We love to see a hot girl dressed like a ridiculous slut.

That is what we call selective listening. Nice try though.

Oh yeah? (http://answers.typepad.com/fatfree/images/fathat377-thumb.jpg)

**shudders** Geez, thanks, Sin.

That is what we call selective listening. Nice try though.
I just wanted to burn your retinas:)

But you'll notice in my original quote about skimpily dressed women, that I did not specify they were hot either.

I was posting in that thread regarding women being blamed for being raped, and noticed several posts that were about how strongly women felt about being able to dress how they liked without it provoking rape. Which is fair enough, but I've noticed that this also extends to women sometimes being offended at any serious sexual attention paid to them if they dress provocatively.

In a sense this is just one example of how somehow we've come to feel we should never ever be offended or have social difficulties. This is a strange and depressing sentiment; life is messy and people will have problems. We should be able to resolve them without constant resorting to legalism.

I take the stance of David Chappelle on this.

Now if I dress like a cop and walk around in public and someone runs up to me and say "Hey officer!!! I need some help!" I cant reasonbly expect to be able to answer "Hey hey, buddy! Just because I am dressed like a cop doesnt make me one!!"

In short
If you dont want to be treated like a whore, dont wear the uniform.

I just wanted to burn your retinas:)

But you'll notice in my original quote about skimpily dressed women, that I did not specify they were hot either.

I'd fuck her. And she'd work harder at it than most other broads that think they're hot.

I'd fuck her. And she'd work harder at it than most other broads that think they're hot.
That could very well be true...well...enjoy!

I just wanted to burn your retinas:)

But you'll notice in my original quote about skimpily dressed women, that I did not specify they were hot either.

Yea I had a feeling you were waiting to whip out that pic. Haha and that is why I did specify in my comment. I'm gonna go fill the sink with some soap and water and dip the old glozzies in there now ;) . Later

I'd fuck her. And she'd work harder at it than most other broads that think they're hot.
Yup

In short
If you dont want to be treated like a whore, dont wear the uniform.

You know the problem, right? There's no such thing as a "whore uniform", but there is an official regulation of whatever makes a police uniform.

I was posting in that thread regarding women being blamed for being raped, and noticed several posts that were about how strongly women felt about being able to dress how they liked without it provoking rape. Which is fair enough, but I've noticed that this also extends to women sometimes being offended at any serious sexual attention paid to them if they dress provocatively.

In a sense this is just one example of how somehow we've come to feel we should never ever be offended or have social difficulties. This is a strange and depressing sentiment; life is messy and people will have problems. We should be able to resolve them without constant resorting to legalism.

A modern trend is to assume some "right" to not be subject to offense...

No such right can exist, simply because if it did, there would not be any other rights...

Thats sweet, so you have never looked at scantly clad female and uttered the words tramp,slut,whore,loose, etc etc. No of course not.

You can pretend I am wrong but I am not. No woman deserves to be raped--but if a woman places her ass out on display she has no reasonbable expectation to not be asked the price.

I dont know where you are but there is an official whore uniform here--and you can spot them from a mile away.

I'd fuck her. And she'd work harder at it than most other broads that think they're hot.

I said this in another post, but I think it's appropriate (or inappropriate,) here as well.

"Is it in you, or just a fold?"

Have I offended everyone yet?

Thats sweet, so you have never looked at scantly clad female and uttered the words tramp,slut,whore,loose, etc etc. No of course not.

You can pretend I am wrong but I am not. No woman deserves to be raped--but if a woman places her ass out on display she has no reasonbable expectation to not be asked the price.

I dont know where you are but there is an official whore uniform here--and you can spot them from a mile away.

And the specifics of this uniform would be?

Maybe you just think all women are whores **shrug**

If you dont want to be treated like a whore, dont wear the uniform.
Whores are allowed to say "no", too.

Edit (just noticed):Thats sweet, so you have never looked at scantly clad female and uttered the words tramp,slut,whore,loose, etc etc. No of course not.
No, actually. I have not.

I just wanted to burn your retinas:)

But you'll notice in my original quote about skimpily dressed women, that I did not specify they were hot either.

Dammit, Sin, I'm a work right now! Put a warning on stuff like that.

Dammit, Sin, I'm a work right now! Put a warning on stuff like that.
Oops...good point. Sorry. *runs to edit*

I said this in another post, but I think it's appropriate (or inappropriate,) here as well.

"Is it in you, or just a fold?"

Have I offended everyone yet?


think about that-does it really matter?

She'd probably make a great sandwich afterwards too...

Whores are allowed to say "no", too.

Edit (just noticed):
No, actually. I have not.
Where the hell did I say that any women did not have the right to say no?
I said they had no reasonble expectation not to be asked.

Whoa whoa whoa here...first of all, what is 'sexy'? I think most people seeing a woman in clothes that hardly cover an inch of flesh kind of wince...I mean...ewww. Even if she's hot...that kind of dress is just too revealing for comfort. Especially in Canada (temperature you know). But 'dressing attractively'? That covers a lot of ground...pretty much everything past 'wearing a mumu or a paper bag'. I've gotten unwanted attention from wearing a SUIT...yeah, that's pretty damn modest in my mind, but I got all sorts of shit said to me, and one drunken buffoon actually said, when I rebuffed him, "Why'd you come here dressed like that if you didn't want some action?"

WTF? Dressed in a suit that looks good on me instead of, oh, I don't know...muddy overalls? FUCK OFF!

I don't have the right to not be offended by him...but I do have the right to pepper spray his drunken ass if he gropes me.

*clap clap clap

And Go Canada

All the stuff about the way you dress aside...that was really just an example...what I meant is that sometimes I think there needs to be a dividing line between a person dealing with an unpleasant situation and howling for some kind of legal resolution. I think we as a society have forgotten how to resolve issues on our own without involving the law, which is really meant for those times when we are at a loss as to how to resolve problems.

Like, fair enough if you are going to pepper spray some guy who won't leave you alone. Fair enough if you are going to tell someone to back off. Fair enough if you are going to complain about service you've not received.

However I would add to this that we have a social responsibility to be aware of the results of our actions. We need to be aware that we aren't operating in some kind of social vacuum.