NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.xs4all.nl/~ernstmul/images/yahoo/20.gif

The Corvette Z06 (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/61257/chevrolet_corvette_z06.html) has done something that no other car from America has ever managed to do: It made me nod in an approving fashion.

The reason? It lapped the Nürburgring Nordschleife in 7 minutes and 42 seconds. That's fast - in fact, it's as fast as the Porsche GT3 RS (http://www.rsportscars.com/eng/cars/911_gt3rs.asp) (which of course has some 130 horses less, but still - it's American!).

Combine that with a very low price (about 80,000 Euros) compared to its rivals (a Porsche Turbo S with similar output costs 140k) and you get a very competitve package.

Sure, it may still suck a little dynamically (compared to Porsche that is), and interior quality may not be up to "European" standards...but that still is a lot of bang for your buck.

I congratulate Chevrolet, and I hope the Corvette will finally take off in Europe.

That's good, but if I could buy either, I know straight away which it would be. The one with the flat 6.

I'm glad you approve! I love this car! I have always liked the Vettes, because though they aren't quite as glamorous as some European sports cars, they are certainly very impressive when you also factor in the price tag. You can basically buy two for the price of a low end Porsche, if I'm not mistaken.

And keep in mind, all of that horsepower comes from a "naturally aspirated engine" so throw a turbo charger or a blower on it, and it will eat a Porsche for breakfast, and keep up with some of the fastest cars on the planet.

They do need to "Europeanize" the interior a bit though! ;)

The limited edition will do 0-60 in 3.9 seconds stock. *drools*

I don't know, I think some of the new cars are actually kinda cool-now that the big ugly truck thing is starting to wane...sweet crap, who kept buying Avalanches?

I like this new Solstice (http://www.pontiac.com/solstice/index.jsp) and the SKY (http://www.saturn.com/saturn/vehicles/futurevehicles/sky_hi/index.jsp).

Where I in the market for a new car (lord knows what that would take, since I have a preference for vintage, but anyway...) There is some promise.

Besides, the Vette (loath as I am to admit it) has been proving itself in Europe for a few years now consistantly winning the GT class at Le Mans, against Ferraris and Aston Martins no less.

But I'd still go for the GT3, I just want to be fair to the beast.

I congratulate Chevrolet, and I hope the Corvette will finally take off in Europe.

That'd be nice.. but how many Europeans have 80,000 Euro to spend on a car? About as many as those who have $94,000 to spend on a car, I'd imagine.. not many.

I'm glad you approve! I love this car! I have always liked the Vettes, because though they aren't quite as glamorous as some European sports cars, they are certainly very impressive when you also factor in the price tag. You can basically buy two for the price of a low end Porsche, if I'm not mistaken.

And keep in mind, all of that horsepower comes from a "naturally aspirated engine" so throw a turbo charger or a blower on it, and it will eat a Porsche for breakfast, and keep up with some of the fastest cars on the planet.

They do need to "Europeanize" the interior a bit though! ;)

The limited edition will do 0-60 in 3.9 seconds stock. *drools*
You're mistaken. A Boxster is about the same price as a Vette.

eh... 06 Viper owns the Vette.

You're mistaken. A Boxster is about the same price as a Vette.
Oh, is it? My bad!

EDIT Actually, it's cheaper($45,000). Of course it won't get to 60mph (0-60 in 5.9) till the Vette is close to 100mph(0-60 in 4.0, 3.9 in the limited).

That'd be nice.. but how many Europeans have 80,000 Euro to spend on a car? About as many as those who have $94,000 to spend on a car, I'd imagine.. not many.
Well, it won't be a mass product, but there is a market for them. I mean, there are quite a lot of people buying cars like this in Europe (and the economy has actually been going really well for rich people in recent years - the whole "Europe in Crisis" thingy concerns poor people, not corporations...).

Lamborghini has announced that they sold 1592 cars in 2004...and they are a fair bit more expensive than the Corvette or Porsche.

You're mistaken. A Boxster is about the same price as a Vette.

Again, I'd choose the flat 6 over the V8.

eh... 06 Viper owns the Vette.
If it could stay on the road that is...:rolleyes:

eh... 06 Viper owns the Vette.
On the top of that heap then would have to be the Ford GT (http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/)...but mostly becuase I like the original so much...

Oh, is it? My bad!

EDIT Actually, it's cheaper($45,000). Of course it won't get to 60mph (0-60 in 5.9) till the Vette is close to 100mph(0-60 in 4.0, 3.9 in the limited).
The Boxster wasn't designed for straight lines.

eh... 06 Viper owns the Vette.
OH REALLY?

06 Viper 0-60 in 4.0 seconds
06 Vette 0-60 in 3.9 seconds

OH REALLY?

06 Viper 0-60 in 4.0 seconds
06 Vette 0-60 in 3.9 seconds
You do know that getting to 60 is only the begining of the driving experience, yes?

You do know that getting to 60 is only the begining of the driving experience, yes?
Yeah, I know, but the only thing the Viper has is take off power. It corners like a couch. So if the Viper owned the Vette, it would HAVE to be in the 0-60. (which it doesn't)

You do know that getting to 60 is only the begining of the driving experience, yes?
That was what intrigued me about the Z06 - it lapped the Nordschleife as fast as a GT3 RS.

I wouldn't take a Viper if they paid me...and I still wouldn't buy a Z06 if I had that money (there are nicer alternatives...Cayman S?) but as far as American cars are concerned, it certainly is a step forward.

OH REALLY?

06 Viper 0-60 in 4.0 seconds
06 Vette 0-60 in 3.9 seconds

Really... 0-60 time does not a battle win. Show me HP ratings, lap times, 1/4 miles stats, etc...

Well, it won't be a mass product, but there is a market for them. I mean, there are quite a lot of people buying cars like this in Europe (and the economy has actually been going really well for rich people in recent years - the whole "Europe in Crisis" thingy concerns poor people, not corporations...).

Lamborghini has announced that they sold 1592 cars in 2004...and they are a fair bit more expensive than the Corvette or Porsche.

I noticed this in the article
The 7-litre unit
To big for the European market, where cars have to have an engine that is as small as possible. Porsche's sell good because they combine their status with a small engine (6 cylinder, usually 3.6l) at an acceptable price(for the basic models, not the GTs)

Really... 0-60 time does not a battle win. Show me HP ratings, lap times, 1/4 miles stats, etc...
Read this excellent British review, and you'll understand a little better.
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/52255/dodge_srt10.html

Back when Ferraris were more about passion and soul than scalpel-sharp dynamics there was an old cliché that covered a multitude of sins. I'm sure you remember the classic line 'you pay for the engine and get the rest for free' from many a road test. I used to think that a terribly romantic and wonderfully evocative phrase and wondered if I'd ever get to use it. Of course, really it's just a cheesy way of saying that a car is pretty ropey but it makes a decent noise and goes very quickly. And so we come to the new Dodge SRT-10 and an opportunity not to be missed. Your £77,500 buys the engine, the rest you get for free...

That was what intrigued me about the Z06 - it lapped the Nordschleife as fast as a GT3 RS.

I wouldn't take a Viper if they paid me...and I still wouldn't buy a Z06 if I had that money (there are nicer alternatives...Cayman S?) but as far as American cars are concerned, it certainly is a step forward.
Mmmmmm Cayman....that's gonna be a grippy little monster...

Tadjikistan']To big for the European market, where cars have to have an engine that is as small as possible.
Pagani Zonda? Bugatti Veyron?
Pretty much all big AMGs?

Read this excellent British review, and you'll understand a little better.
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/52255/dodge_srt10.html

and?

I saw this episode of 5th Gear about the Vett and Viper, and of the 3 tests they went through, the Viper won the 1/4 mile and the 3 lap race. The vette won the... don't laugh... power sliding (yes, I know, stop laughing) test.

Having said that, the 2 testers then declared the Viper "rubbish" "impractical" and someother wacky euro slang, even though it SOUNDLY whipped the vette like a rented mule.

I saw this episode of 5th Gear about the Vett and Viper, and of the 3 tests they went through, the Viper won the 1/4 mile and the 3 lap race. The vette won the... don't laugh... power sliding (yes, I know, stop laughing) test.
And a McLaren F1 can soundly beat a Carrera GT in all three of those. Does that mean the F1 comes even remotely close to the Porsche? Of course not.
I'm rather surprised about the lap...but the question is what kind of track it was.
On the Nürburgring the Viper does an 8:55...that's about as fast as a Honda Civic Type R.

And a McLaren F1 can soundly beat a Carrera GT in all three of those. Does that mean the F1 comes even remotely close to the Porsche? Of course not.
I'm rather surprised about the lap...but the question is what kind of track it was.
On the Nürburgring the Viper does an 8:55...that's about as fast as a Honda Civic Type R.

Let me see if I can dig that episode up and I'll get back to you.

Let me see if I can dig that episode up and I'll get back to you.
HERE (http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14145) ya go! ;)

HERE (http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14145) ya go! ;)

That would be it

That would be it
I have other torrents downloading, so it's gonna be a bit before I see it, but I'll check it out!

BTW, my Brother in law and I are now arguing over which is better! Thanks! :p

The best cars of all time are the Aston Martin,s the new DB9 V12 Touchtronic auto is a perfect machine + you,ve also got the class that comes with it, i mean bloody hell James Bond had a Aston Martin

You do know that getting to 60 is only the begining of the driving experience, yes?
You're still in first gear...

http://www.xs4all.nl/~ernstmul/images/yahoo/20.gif

The Corvette Z06 (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/61257/chevrolet_corvette_z06.html) has done something that no other car from America has ever managed to do: It made me nod in an approving fashion.

The reason? It lapped the Nürburgring Nordschleife in 7 minutes and 42 seconds. That's fast - in fact, it's as fast as the Porsche GT3 RS (http://www.rsportscars.com/eng/cars/911_gt3rs.asp) (which of course has some 130 horses less, but still - it's American!).

Combine that with a very low price (about 80,000 Euros) compared to its rivals (a Porsche Turbo S with similar output costs 140k) and you get a very competitve package.

Sure, it may still suck a little dynamically (compared to Porsche that is), and interior quality may not be up to "European" standards...but that still is a lot of bang for your buck.

I congratulate Chevrolet, and I hope the Corvette will finally take off in Europe.

check out the Ford GT... it has something like 550 hp.

http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordgt/home.asp

I like vettes, but you know what they say about the "size" of people who drive them? LOL

Pagani Zonda? Bugatti Veyron?
Pretty much all big AMGs?

The Pagani is a nice vehicle, but it isnt sold very often. The only reason the car is brought on the commercial market is because it has to to be allowed in car racing (GT racing) where the car makes more money than anywhere else.
Bugatti almost went bankrupt a year or two ago because it couldnt sell enough cars, the new model is nice but hasnt really amazed me in sales.

The only models that really work in Europe are the Ferrari's and¨Porsche's, mostly with 3.6L engines (and an occasional 5L of limited production like the F50)

Another cool thing about the Z06 is that Chevy implicitly states that you can take it out on the race track WITHOUT voiding the warranty. I may be wrong, but I don't know any other company that does that!

Any purist will tell you that the Ford GT is nothing but an insult to the heritage of the GT40. The GT40 was a beast of a car, it crushed everything else with unmatched power from raw cubic inches and monster speed.

The new GT uses a supercharged small block truck motor.:rolleyes: Pardon me while I yawn at ford's appalling lack of enginuity and effort. Let's see, you took your 5.4L Triton V8 motor out of your F-150, gutted it, put in some stronger pieces and forced air into it... and still only came out with 550hp for $150,000? Ok...

Chevy developed and built an N/A 427ci JUST for the Z06 that produces 500hp... for under $80k. Yet Ford used parts off the shelf... Hmm, maybe Ford is gouging on the name? Perhaps something else makes the car worth twice as much...


Ford will say something about using aluminum chasis pieces for lightweight... but the car still weighs ~3400lbs. Oops. Thats pretty average for a two door sports car.

Chevy has been using an all-aluminum chasis for the 'vette since the C5. The Z06 includes Carbon Fiber fenders, a Magnesium roof support structure, and Titanium exhaust, and all of these elements are extremely expensive, none of which Ford included to any great lengths. It has some CF, but not enough to matter, obviously, as the 'vette undercuts the GT's weight by 350lbs.


Performance-wise, they are nigh identical. The GT has a slight edge in handling, but the Z06 out brakes it. Acceleration is nearly the same.
Factor in the fact that the LS7 is making over 600hp with a cam and bolt-ons (ie, cheap, easy mods) and the argument for the Ford is dead.

The statement the Ford GT makes to me is, "Oops, I'm stupid and paid an $80,000 premium for a name and retro styling." If that's what you enjoy, give yourself five. But open your mouth abou the performance and prepare to be owned.




The Viper gets only a slight nod here b/c even though it's closer priced to the Z06 than the GT, it can't hang with those cars on the track. The Viper is primarily a style statement, road going vehicle. Sure, it does well on the track too, but when pushed it becomes obvious that was not its intention. For its slightly lack performance, higher price, and somewhat compromised reliability record, it doesn't get the nod the Z06 does.

I like this new Solstice (http://www.pontiac.com/solstice/index.jsp) and the SKY (http://www.saturn.com/saturn/vehicles/futurevehicles/sky_hi/index.jsp).


I gotta say the SKY takes a crap load of design from the Nissan 350Z IMHO whilst the Solstice looks like the designers looked at a Mazda RX-8 and a dozen old photos of British sports cars and moulded them together.

That said though, i agree, they both look pretty decent :)

nice..very nice

I gotta say the SKY takes a crap load of design from the Nissan 350Z IMHO whilst the Solstice looks like the designers looked at a Mazda RX-8 and a dozen old photos of British sports cars and moulded them together.

That said though, i agree, they both look pretty decent :)
I thought that the SKY was stealling most from this guy (http://www.fastcoolcars.com/images/wallpaper8/opel_speedster.jpg) my self, but I'm totally cool with that.

As far as the Solstice stealing (I would argue that it's the last RX-7 that it better resembles) that would just be part of Mazda's pattern anyway, consider the Lotus Elan (http://www.barlowco.com/html/restorations/autos/67lotus_elan/67_lotus_elan_img/67_lotus_elan_00.jpg) and the original Mazda Miata (http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-14243-292587-6254/Mazda%20Miata.jpg) or the Lotus Elite (http://memoiresdestands.hautetfort.com/images/medium_lotus_elite_1960.jpg) and the last RX-7 (http://vnexpress.net/Vietnam/Oto-Xe-may/2002/05/3B9BC6AF/mazda-rx-7-spirit-r-to.jpg).

At least they're borrowing from something cool.

I thought that the SKY was stealling most from this guy (http://www.fastcoolcars.com/images/wallpaper8/opel_speedster.jpg) my self, but I'm totally cool with that.

Yeah I can see that too, the back set of tail lights looks familiar too, although I can't pin t down right now.

As far as the Solstice stealing (I would argue that it's the last RX-7 that it better resembles) that would just be part of Mazda's pattern anyway, consider the Lotus Elan (http://www.barlowco.com/html/restorations/autos/67lotus_elan/67_lotus_elan_img/67_lotus_elan_00.jpg) and the original Mazda Miata (http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-14243-292587-6254/Mazda%20Miata.jpg) or the Lotus Elite (http://memoiresdestands.hautetfort.com/images/medium_lotus_elite_1960.jpg) and the last RX-7 (http://vnexpress.net/Vietnam/Oto-Xe-may/2002/05/3B9BC6AF/mazda-rx-7-spirit-r-to.jpg).

At least they're borrowing from something cool.

Yeah, the Lotus is the one I was thinking of, Top Gear (i think you know it ;) ) had a review of a car that looked similar to the Solstice. Made in Germany it looked a little like the old Lotus, apart from it had a BMW M3 engine in it. Speedy? Just a little. :D But from the looks of things it corners beautifully too. Can't for the life of me remember the name of it though.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~ernstmul/images/yahoo/20.gif

The Corvette Z06 (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/61257/chevrolet_corvette_z06.html) has done something that no other car from America has ever managed to do: It made me nod in an approving fashion.
( shrug ) Looks like just another LRC to me. :headbang:

:D

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7243450867989414744&q=%22top+gear%22

Its called a Wiessman and its cool. And it takes style cues from Lotus and Austin. MEGA COOL

:D

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7243450867989414744&q=%22top+gear%22

Its called a Wiessman and its cool. And it takes style cues from Lotus and Austin. MEGA COOL
Me wanty!

( shrug ) Looks like just another LRC to me. :headbang:
Still a refreshing change from all those BUTts (Big Ugly Trucks).

Seriously, any grown man buying an H2 or H3 is just like a kid putting a playing card in the spokes of his bicycle. "Looky, I'm just like daddy." Ugh.

check out the Ford GT... it has something like 550 hp.
And for that money I could buy a Carrera GT and blow away the lot of them.

By the way...I'm not sure how popular, or well-known the Nürburgring Nordschleife is in the US, so I thought I'd just show you the track. Probably the most awesome race track in the world, to get a good time you need to have driven on it for decades, it's that intimate. They used to race the F1 there...but it was deemed to dangerous.
Anyways, this track will take everything a car has to offer and a little more, which is why I was so impressed that an American car managed to do well there.

http://213.239.207.198/nuerburgring.de/typo3temp/2d10fa70ec.jpg

And in other news, German Tuning Company Hartge just went insane and put a modified E39 M5 V8 into the 1-Series BMW...that's 450bhp.
I like a sense of humour (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/60585/hartge_h1_v8_50.html) (especially in the Pricing Department). :D

And for that money I could buy a Carrera GT and blow away the lot of them.

By the way...I'm not sure how popular, or well-known the Nürburgring Nordschleife is in the US, so I thought I'd just show you the track. Probably the most awesome race track in the world, to get a good time you need to have driven on it for decades, it's that intimate. They used to race the F1 there...but it was deemed to dangerous.
Anyways, this track will take everything a car has to offer and a little more, which is why I was so impressed that an American car managed to do well there.

http://213.239.207.198/nuerburgring.de/typo3temp/2d10fa70ec.jpg

And in other news, German Tuning Company Hartge just went insane and put a modified E39 M5 V8 into the 1-Series BMW...that's 450bhp.
I like a sense of humour (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/60585/hartge_h1_v8_50.html) (especially in the Pricing Department). :D
Dude, c'mon now. Lets not get silly. If you're a fan of sports cars you know of the track. Even if that didn't exist, Nurburgring is in almost all of the simulator racing games. I know it's fun to poke, but seriously...

Dude, c'mon now. Lets not get silly. If you're a fan of sports cars you know of the track. Even if that didn't exist, Nurburgring is in almost all of the simulator racing games. I know it's fun to poke, but seriously...
Well...you do have Nascar! What am I supposed to think? ;)

Looks like a rice rocket crossed with a door jam and a ferrari. je ne l'aime pas.

One of my old pals' dad's cars is a 1974 vette. Very pretty car, and fun.

eh... 06 Viper owns the Vette.
The viper does a straight line very well, but if all I wanted was to blow money on a straight line I'd buy a top fuel dragster. Burns a $1000 dollars a second.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~ernstmul/images/yahoo/20.gif

The Corvette Z06 (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/driven/61257/chevrolet_corvette_z06.html) has done something that no other car from America has ever managed to do: It made me nod in an approving fashion.

The reason? It lapped the Nürburgring Nordschleife in 7 minutes and 42 seconds. That's fast - in fact, it's as fast as the Porsche GT3 RS (http://www.rsportscars.com/eng/cars/911_gt3rs.asp) (which of course has some 130 horses less, but still - it's American!).

Combine that with a very low price (about 80,000 Euros) compared to its rivals (a Porsche Turbo S with similar output costs 140k) and you get a very competitve package.

Sure, it may still suck a little dynamically (compared to Porsche that is), and interior quality may not be up to "European" standards...but that still is a lot of bang for your buck.

I congratulate Chevrolet, and I hope the Corvette will finally take off in Europe.

It does look "new". I'll give it that much.

It still screams "Look at me! I'm a cheap production sports car!". Loudly.

Still a refreshing change from all those BUTts (Big Ugly Trucks).

Seriously, any grown man buying an H2 or H3 is just like a kid putting a playing card in the spokes of his bicycle. "Looky, I'm just like daddy." Ugh.
I wouldn't touch an H2 or H3 with a ten-foot pole! :p

I wouldn't touch an H2 or H3 with a ten-foot pole! :p

did you know that there is a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving the bird to a hummer? :D

did you know that there is a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving the bird to a hummer? :D
ROFLMAO! No, but I could have gone all day without knowing! :p

did you know that there is a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving the bird to a hummer? :D

Tell me more, I've been missing out on an awful lot of dollars.

Well...you do have Nascar! What am I supposed to think? ;)
That we have a wide tapestry of tastes and respect for the go fast crowd and recognize that close competition is a vital part of motorsport? Say what you will about NASCAR (Tauras is not the sexiest car to be rooting for and locked left for three hours isn't the most dynamic) it is close and hotly contested-a competitive event and not a pagent. Remember that racing is about who's fastest, not who has the best looking pit models.

Don't get me wrong, it is not my favorite form of racing by a looooooonnnnnnnggg shot. But I can respect that they put on a good show of close, competitive racing. Have to be fair.

And for that money I could buy a Carrera GT and blow away the lot of them.
What was that?

Ford GT Specs: http://ford.jbcarpages.com/GT/2005/index4.php
Model Ford GT

General Information

Price [$US] ca. $139,995 (Get the latest price here)

Layout mid-engine / rear-wheel-drive
Drag Coefficient [cd] NA
Curb Weight [lb (kg)] 3485 (1580)
Weight Distribution [%f / r] 43 / 57
Trunk Space [cu ft.] 1.0

Overall Length [in. (mm)] 182.8 (4643)
Overall Width [in. (mm)] 76.9 (1953)
Overall Height [in. (mm)] 44.3 (1125)
Wheelbase [in. (mm)] 106.7 (2710)
Track Front [in. (mm)] 63.0 (1600)
Track Rear [in. (mm)] 63.7 (1618)

Steering Rack & Pinion; power-assisted
Turning Radius [ft. (m)] 20.0 (6.2)
Tires front 235/45 ZR18
Tires rear 315/40 ZR19

Engine

Type Supercharged V8; aluminum block and heads
Valvetrain DOHC 4-valve / cyl.
Displacement [cc] 5409
Bore & Stroke [mm] 90.2 x 105.8
Compression Ratio 8.4:1
Redline [rpm] 6500

Max. Power [Bhp at rpm] 550 at 6500
Max. Torque [lb-ft (Nm) at rpm] 500 (678) at 3750
Bhp/Liter 101.7

Accommodation

Seating Capacity 2
Front Head Room [in. (mm)] 35.4 (899)
Front Leg Room [in. (mm)] 44.6 (1133)

Interior Noise

Idle in neutral [dBA] 60
70 mph coasting [dBA] 79

Gear Ratios

1st 2.61:1
2nd 1.71:1
3rd 1.23:1
4th 0.94:1
5th 0.77:1
6th 0.63:1
Final drive 3.36:1

Suspension

Front Double Wishbone; coil springs, tube shocks, anti-roll bar
Rear Double Wishbone; coil springs, tube shocks, anti-roll bar

Braking

Front - Brakes 14.0 in. (356 mm) Brembo cross-drilled and ventilated discs
Rear - Brakes 13.2 in. (335 mm) Brembo cross-drilled and ventilated discs
70 - 0 mph [ft (m)] 153 (47.5)
60 - 0 mph [ft (m)] 110 (34.2)

Performance*

0 - 60 mph [secs] 3.3
0 - 100 mph [secs] 7.4
1/4 mile [secs at mph] 11.2 at 131.2

Top Speed [mph] 200
Lateral acceleration [g] 0.99

Fuel Economy [City/Hwy in mpg] 14 / 21


Carrera GT Specs: http://www.porsche.com/usa/models/carrera-gt/modelinformation/technicalspecifications/

No. of cylinders 10
Displacement 5.7 liters
Maximum power (SAE) 605 hp @ 8,000 rpm
Maximum torque 435 lb-ft @ 5,750 rpm
Maximum engine speed (revs) 8,400 rpm
Compression ratio 12.0 : 1
Transmission
Layout Rear-wheel drive
Gearbox Six-speed manual
Clutch Two-plate ceramic dry clutch (Porsche Ceramic Composite Clutch)
Limited-slip differential Multi-plate with locking under power and on overrun
Running Gear
Front suspension Double wishbones with inboard spring-and-damper units
Rear suspension Double wishbones with inboard spring-and-damper units
Steering Power-assisted rack-and-pinion steering
Brake Porsche Ceramic Composite Brake (PCCB) with 14.96 in (380-mm) ceramic discs internally vented and cross-drilled, six-piston monobloc aluminium fixed calipers front and rear
Traction control/ABS Traction control with ABD and ASR; ABS 5.7 (four-channel system)
Wheels Front: 19 x 9.5
Rear: 20 x 12.5
Tires Front: 265/35 ZR 19
Rear: 335/30 ZR 20
Weights
Unladen weight (DIN) 3,042 lbs (1,380 kg)
Performance
Top track speed 205 mph (330 km/h)
0-60 mph 3.8 secs
0-62 mph 3.9 secs
0-124 mph 9.9 secs
50-75 mph 4.0 secs (in fifth gear)
Quarter mile 11.4 secs
Fuel economy
Not available at time of publishing
Dimensions
Length 181.61 in (4,613 mm)
Width 75.63 in (1,921 mm)
Height 45.91 in (1,166 mm)
Wheelbase 107.48 in (2,730 mm)
Luggage compartment volume (VDA) 2.2 cu ft (63 liters)
72 liters non US markets
Tank capacity (refill volume) 24 US gallons (92 liters)

Only on the loooong straightaways.

did you know that there is a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving the bird to a hummer? :D

That makes me wonder...

...Is there a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving a hummer to a bird?

*runs*

Have to be fair.
:eek:

That makes me wonder...

...Is there a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving a hummer to a bird?

*runs*
Oh GROAN!! [ buries head in hands and weeps softly ] :D

did you know that there is a website that will send you a dollar if you take a picture of yourself giving the bird to a hummer? :D
Seriously? The city of Santa Cruz could bankrupt that site....

:eek:
Dude, I'm always fair.

Tell me more, I've been missing out on an awful lot of dollars.

http://www.fuh2.com/index.php

took a few minutes to find that site! havnt been there in a while. looks like they got thousands of pictures :p lol, maybe they dont give dollars anymore...

What was that?

Ford GT Specs: http://ford.jbcarpages.com/GT/2005/index4.php



Carrera GT Specs: http://www.porsche.com/usa/models/carrera-gt/modelinformation/technicalspecifications/



Only on the loooong straightaways.
The solution is clear. Both companies need to put 'em on the track. Then we can get the showdown we where robbed of when the GT40 and the 917 never really met.

At the very least it'd be cool.

The solution is clear. Both companies need to put 'em on the track. Then we can get the showdown we where robbed of when the GT40 and the 917 never really met.

At the very least it'd be cool.

But then, it depends on the driver. The only way to do it correctly would be to build a fully realistic simulation and put the cars on the exact same driving path.

Seriously? The city of Santa Cruz could bankrupt that site....

lol, well your prolly right. looks like they dont do that anymore. i posted the site if you want to check it out.

But then, it depends on the driver. The only way to do it correctly would be to build a fully realistic simulation and put the cars on the exact same driving path.
Not really. Just get Schumacher to run them both around Nordschliffe for 20 laps each on comparable days. Problem solved.

lol, well your prolly right. looks like they dont do that anymore. i posted the site if you want to check it out.

That site kicks ass!

Only on the loooong straightaways.
And corners. And racetracks.
Only in inner-city traffic might the Ford have something because it has an ancient transmission, while the Porsche uses a Carbon Clutch system that has been said to be a little snatchy at low speed (but they apparently took care of it, the last few cars had much more easy-going versions).

Ultimately I don't believe in Spec-Sheets. I believe in either driving myself (which is difficult on a budget like mine) or reading articles from serious testing on real roads.
Who gives a shit how fast it is to 100? Or the Quarter Mile?

The only spec that I really take seriously is the Nordschleife Time, just because that track will ultimately challenge every car to its limits, and to get a good time it requires everything - not just engine power.
Ford GT: Never did a serious lap. :(
Carrera GT: 7:32 (http://www.germancarfans.com/news.cfm/newsid/2040920.004/porsche/1.html)

But then, it depends on the driver. The only way to do it correctly would be to build a fully realistic simulation and put the cars on the exact same driving path.
No, I want the race. I want to see the race. I want to buy tickets to the race and watch it with a big Porsche flag flapping over my head while I struggle to listen in to the radio only to remember "Oh right. German. I don't speak German..." I want them snaking down Turn 8 at Laguna Seca locked in battle. I want the race, where's the race? Why can't I watch the race!!!!

ahem.

I mean, racing would be cooler.

No, I want the race. I want to see the race. I want to buy tickets to the race and watch it with a big Porsche flag flapping over my head while I struggle to listen in to the radio only to remember "Oh right. German. I don't speak German..." I want them snaking down Turn 8 at Laguna Seca locked in battle. I want the race, where's the race? Why can't I watch the race!!!!

ahem.

I mean, racing would be cooler.

Laguna Seca? Pff, everybody knows that Suzuka is the superior circuit.

lol, well your prolly right. looks like they dont do that anymore. i posted the site if you want to check it out.
Quality. I have film of my brother and what looks like Bubblehead (the anthropromorphic VW symbol, not to be confused with Fast Guy) flipping off a Rolls Royce, but that's only becuase they are cutting us off. I wish now that it had been an H2...

Laguna Seca? Pff, everybody knows that Suzuka is the superior circuit.
You wanna take this outside????

all in good fun, any ansy cats quoting this...

Quality. I have film of my brother and what looks like Bubblehead (the anthropromorphic VW symbol, not to be confused with Fast Guy) flipping off a Rolls Royce, but that's only becuase they are cutting us off. I wish now that it had been an H2...

lol. makes me want to carry a camera with me while im driving. just in case... :)

Finally, a thread I like... The new Z06 is freaking awesome!!! 0-60 in less then 4 seconds! it's awesome, and the engine is a work of art.

it's awesome, and the engine is a work of art.
Well, I wouldn't exactly call a 7 litre V8 special.

Special is a 4.3 litre V8 (http://www.ferraricars.org/ferrari-f430/engine.html) with just as much power and no turbos or superchargers.

You wanna take this outside????

all in good fun, any ansy cats quoting this...


Still not as good as Nuerburgring Nordschleife circuit. EVER! :p ;)

Still not as good as Nuerburgring Nordschleife circuit. EVER! :p ;)
Always with the penis measuring. "This thing is better than that mentioned thing." "Well, that really wasn't the point of-" "THIS IS BETTER!" "Okay, but that's really not-" "BETTER!!!!!" "....sure."

Always with the penis measuring. "This thing is better than that mentioned thing." "Well, that really wasn't the point of-" "THIS IS BETTER!" "Okay, but that's really not-" "BETTER!!!!!" "....sure."

LOL! I was taking the mick a bit ;)

I do like Laguna Seca though, the chicane (turn 8 yeah?) is unbelieveable. But i only see it on computer games hehe, seen it once on TV. Might be interesting for an F1 race.

But I do like the Nurburgring, and, lets face it, its the only one I am ever going to be able to drive around :D

LOL! I was taking the mick a bit ;)

I do like Laguna Seca though, the chicane (turn 8 yeah?) is unbelieveable. But i only see it on computer games hehe, seen it once on TV. Might be interesting for an F1 race.

But I do like the Nurburgring, and, lets face it, its the only one I am ever going to be able to drive around :D
Laguna Seca has track days and two racing schools on it (one for motorcycles). While it was brought to FIA specs for the FIA GT series a few years ago, I think there is something about it that disqualifies it as a F1 track. Maybe it's just money. The CART races are pretty spectacular there, like The Pass, where someone cut off Turn 8 (the corkscrew) for a last lap pass. My favorite events there are the AMLS and the Historics. And I live an hour away from the track, so that's pretty sweet.

[QUOTE=FireAntz]And keep in mind, all of that horsepower comes from a "naturally aspirated engine" so throw a turbo charger or a blower on it, and it will eat a Porsche for breakfast, and keep up with some of the fastest cars on the planet.QUOTE]

Hmmmmm. Let me see. The Corvette Z06 engine is almost twice the size of the Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine. Corvette 7 liter, Porshe 3.6 liter. Oh yea, the Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine is also naturally aspirated. Here is the link to prove it: Porsche 911 GT3 RS (http://www.porsche.co.za/911/gt3rs/performance_engine/default.htm).
The Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine comes up to 105.8 hp per liter while the Corvette Z06 engine comes up to 72.1 hp per liter. Take the Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine to 7 liters and that would be 740.6 hp.

And keep in mind, all of that horsepower comes from a "naturally aspirated engine" so throw a turbo charger or a blower on it, and it will eat a Porsche for breakfast, and keep up with some of the fastest cars on the planet.

Hmmmmm. Let me see. The Corvette Z06 engine is almost twice the size of the Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine. Corvette 7 liter, Porshe 3.6 liter. Oh yea, the Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine is also naturally aspirated. Here is the link to prove it: Porsche 911 GT3 RS (http://www.porsche.co.za/911/gt3rs/performance_engine/default.htm).
The Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine comes up to 105.8 hp per liter while the Corvette Z06 engine comes up to 72.1 hp per liter. Take the Porsche 911 GT3 RS engine to 7 liters and that would be 740.6 hp.
I don't think it really works that way. But do the similar supercharging or turbo charging to the GT3 (or get the already turbo charged GT2) and that Corvette again takes up residence in the rear view mirror.

I don't think it really works that way. But do the similar supercharging or turbo charging to the GT3 (or get the already turbo charged GT2) and that Corvette again takes up residence in the rear view mirror.

Carrera GT
Displacement 5.7 liters
Maximum power (SAE) 605 hp (105.5 hp per liter)
So I would say they could get a 7 liter pretty damn close to 700 hp.

Carrera GT
Displacement 5.7 liters
Maximum power (SAE) 605 hp (105.5 hp per liter)
So I would say they could get a 7 liter pretty damn close to 700 hp.
I'm sure they could. The 917/30 put out close to 1100hp with 5.4 litres. It's not really the point, though.

That was what intrigued me about the Z06 - it lapped the Nordschleife as fast as a GT3 RS.

I wouldn't take a Viper if they paid me...and I still wouldn't buy a Z06 if I had that money (there are nicer alternatives...Cayman S?) but as far as American cars are concerned, it certainly is a step forward.
Heh, you'd take a 295hp Cayman S over a 505hp Corvette Z06.
The Corvette is out-run and out-handle the Cayman S without breaking a sweat.

That Z06 Vette is great. 0-60 in 3.6 seconds, a 198mph top speed, 505hp and 470ft-lbs of torque, 7000rpm redline, aluminum & magnesium construction (featuring carbon fiber), 1.00g on the skidpad, a 71mph slalom speed, braking from 70 in 160ft, and 26mpg highway for just $65k and with a full factory warranty. Yes, the Z06 is a full @7k cheaper than a base 911. And it has 180 more hp and 175 more ft-lbs of torque while getting nearly indentical fuel economy.

Lets look at the Vette for a moment here

Price: $65,000
Fuel Economy: 16mpg city, 26mpg highway
Engine: 7.0l OHV V-8 (505hp, 470ft-lbs, 7000rpm redline)
Transmission: heavy-duty 6-speed manual (w/ OD for better gas mileage)
Suspension: fuly independent (don't know the exact type)
Brakes: 4-wheel power discs w/ big vented rotors (ABS-equipped)
Performance-
0-60: 3.6 seconds
0-100: 7.9 seconds
1/4 Mile: 11.7s @ 127.1MPH
Top Speed: 198mph (redline ltd.)
Skidpad: 1.00g
Slalom: ~70mph
70-0 Braking: ~160ft.
Warranty: 3 years, 36,000m

And the Viper
Price: $85,745
Fuel Economy: 12mpg city, 20mpg highway
Engine: 8.3l OHV V10 (510hp, 535ft-lbs, 6000rpm redline)
Transmission: 6-speed manual (w/ OD)
Suspension: double-wishbone front & rear
Brakes: 4-wheel power discs w/ 14" vented rotors (ABS-equipped since '01)
Performance-
0-60: under 4 seconds
Top Speed: 190mph est.
1/4 Mile: low 12-second range
0-100-0mph: low 12-second range
Skidpad: 1.05g
60-0mph: less than 100ft.
Warranty: 3 years/36,000m (basic), 7 years/70,000m (powertrain)

Both whoop the Cayman S' Stuttgart-made butt. That said, the Cayman S gets 8/10 of the cool scale.

Last note, the Ford GT will hand the Viper, Z06, 911 Carrera S, Gallardo, and F430 their collective asses.

Any purist will tell you that the Ford GT is nothing but an insult to the heritage of the GT40. The GT40 was a beast of a car, it crushed everything else with unmatched power from raw cubic inches and monster speed.

The new GT uses a supercharged small block truck motor.:rolleyes: Pardon me while I yawn at ford's appalling lack of enginuity and effort. Let's see, you took your 5.4L Triton V8 motor out of your F-150, gutted it, put in some stronger pieces and forced air into it... and still only came out with 550hp for $150,000? Ok...

Chevy developed and built an N/A 427ci JUST for the Z06 that produces 500hp... for under $80k. Yet Ford used parts off the shelf... Hmm, maybe Ford is gouging on the name? Perhaps something else makes the car worth twice as much...


Ford will say something about using aluminum chasis pieces for lightweight... but the car still weighs ~3400lbs. Oops. Thats pretty average for a two door sports car.

Chevy has been using an all-aluminum chasis for the 'vette since the C5. The Z06 includes Carbon Fiber fenders, a Magnesium roof support structure, and Titanium exhaust, and all of these elements are extremely expensive, none of which Ford included to any great lengths. It has some CF, but not enough to matter, obviously, as the 'vette undercuts the GT's weight by 350lbs.


Performance-wise, they are nigh identical. The GT has a slight edge in handling, but the Z06 out brakes it. Acceleration is nearly the same.
Factor in the fact that the LS7 is making over 600hp with a cam and bolt-ons (ie, cheap, easy mods) and the argument for the Ford is dead.

The statement the Ford GT makes to me is, "Oops, I'm stupid and paid an $80,000 premium for a name and retro styling." If that's what you enjoy, give yourself five. But open your mouth abou the performance and prepare to be owned.




The Viper gets only a slight nod here b/c even though it's closer priced to the Z06 than the GT, it can't hang with those cars on the track. The Viper is primarily a style statement, road going vehicle. Sure, it does well on the track too, but when pushed it becomes obvious that was not its intention. For its slightly lack performance, higher price, and somewhat compromised reliability record, it doesn't get the nod the Z06 does.

The only bolt-ons you could do to a Z06 would be a blower or turbos, and NOS. Maybe a cam, but it'd hardly be driveable on the street. A Chevy engineer himself said that they'd exhausted all of their tricks on the Z06. That is, while keeping it emissions- and noise-legal.

Also, bout the Viper, its kinda funny consdering EVERY car mag published in the US says the Viper is a thoroughbred race car that, while amazing on the street, is even more-so on the track, and that the experience of driving one to the fullest is the closest you can get to driving a full-blown rac car.

Heh, you'd take a 295hp Cayman S over a 505hp Corvette Z06.
The Corvette is out-run and out-handle the Cayman S without breaking a sweat.

-snip a bunch of stats that tell you little about how the car drives-
You have to be Mopar Rocks, because you have the same obsession with listing the stats of the cars like it's supposed to mean something.

I wouldn't be so sure that the 'Vette will out handle the Cayman S-handling is what Porsche does and they've set out that that is what the Cayman should be all about.

What you are seeing is that the stats don't tell the whole story. Sure the Viper has the 1.05 skidpad score, but the long nose and squirly power band have made it difficult for the test drivers to get it to grip reliabily through the twisties, wrestling it through rather than dancing.

You need to get over your stat sheet fascination and learn the actual joy of driving.

Heh, you'd take a 295hp Cayman S over a 505hp Corvette Z06.
Any day.
I'd also take a Lotus Exige over it. Power is pretty much irrelevant, especially now with Brabus building Mercedes CLS-Classes with 730bhp.

Last note, the Ford GT will hand the Viper, Z06, 911 Carrera S, Gallardo, and F430 their collective asses.
Well, I sincerely doubt it.

When the Ford GT first came out, my favourite car magazine evo tested it alongside the 360CS and the Gallardo, and while they reckoned they liked its appeal and sheer power, in terms of handling it couldn't quite keep up.
The 997 911 (hehe) is the best sports car ever made. The F430 takes a very close second, and the Gallardo is right up there as well.

The Ford GT is nice, and I appreciate that Ford tried something new, but really...for that money, I could get something better.

Any day.
I'd also take a Lotus Exige over it. Power is pretty much irrelevant, especially now with Brabus building Mercedes CLS-Classes with 730bhp.


-snip-
Lotus Elises have started showing up 'round here (on one glorious strip of redwood lined road next to one of the best roads in the world, Hwy 1). The owners all look like very happy people. And I hate them with a jealous rage...

Lotus Elises have started showing up 'round here (on one glorious strip of redwood lined road next to one of the best roads in the world, Hwy 1). The owners all look like very happy people. And I hate them with a jealous rage...
I wanted a 1st Gen. when I set out looking for a car. I found two for sale in the entire country for...get this...$70,000 (Australian).
For that money, I could buy the basic version new from the dealership. In the UK, you could get one for less than 10k Pounds.

Both whoop the Cayman S' Stuttgart-made butt. That said, the Cayman S gets 8/10 of the cool scale.

Last note, the Ford GT will hand the Viper, Z06, 911 Carrera S, Gallardo, and F430 their collective asses.

:yawn:

And a modified 930 would happily destroy anything you just mentioned, and cheaper as well. And still be street legal.

Of course, you could also just get a motorcycle.

If your only selling point is better performance for the price, the game can't be won because there is always going to be something that will outperform you for less when your price tag is 65k

I wanted a 1st Gen. when I set out looking for a car. I found two for sale in the entire country for...get this...$70,000 (Australian).
For that money, I could buy the basic version new from the dealership. In the UK, you could get one for less than 10k Pounds.
Here in the states the first gen ones where nothing but a pipe dream. I wish they where cheaper here. My brother is convinced that he can afford one if he can settle up the down payment. I'm rooting for him.

Aah, the European vs. American Car market debate. "My car is only a four-liter! Yours is seven! That means mine is better!" :rolleyes: Since the beginning of time American Cars have displaced more. Doesn't it matter that almost every car Porsche makes looks alike? :p

Honestly? Hasn't been a halfway decent sports car since the 60s and the GT40. If I had a time machine that I could only use once, i'd go to Le Mans in '66. Or at least to a point before so I could learn French before going.

Doesn't it matter that almost every car Porsche makes looks alike? :p
It's a timeless design.

And besides, they made plenty of cars that were not 911s.

Aah, the European vs. American Car market debate. "My car is only a four-liter! Yours is seven! That means mine is better!" :rolleyes: Since the beginning of time American Cars have displaced more. Doesn't it matter that almost every car Porsche makes looks alike? :p

Honestly? Hasn't been a halfway decent sports car since the 60s and the GT40. If I had a time machine that I could only use once, i'd go to Le Mans in '66. Or at least to a point before so I could learn French before going.
The 911 has changed gently over the years resisting change for changes sake. The 914, 924, 944, 968, 928, Chayanne all do not look like the 911.

The 1966 race would have been a good one to go to, with Ickx walking to his car and the close finish that followed. Had he lost I think it would have been a while longer before the traditional start was abandoned...

It's a timeless design.

And besides, they made plenty of cars that were not 911s.

Yes, but how many cars have they made that were 911s? I think the design is tired and overused, and it wouldn't kill the mighty Porsche engineers to change a few lines once and a while.

The 914, 924, 944, and 968 all followed one another as base models anyway. I'm not suprised those continuously changed.

Yes, but how many cars have they made that were 911s? I think the design is tired and overused, and it wouldn't kill the mighty Porsche engineers to change a few lines once and a while.
You don't think this (http://city.tomsk.net/~porsche/images/1969acaa911s.jpg) has been changed to get to this (http://www.myautoworld.com/autos/porsche/porsche-05-911s/porsche-05-911-1D.jpg)?
That's like saying this (http://www.edmunds.com/media/reviews/generations/vw.beetle/1955.vw.beetle.500.jpg) and this (http://www.atsdesigns.com/images/Catalog/larger/VW-Beetle-3_4-Front.jpg) are the same...

The 914, 924, 944, and 968 all followed one another as base models anyway. I'm not suprised those continuously changed.
The 914 was not part of that line. Its closest cousin (though some would be offended) is the 986, the Boxster.

Aah, the European vs. American Car market debate. "My car is only a four-liter! Yours is seven! That means mine is better!" :rolleyes:

That would generally be the American vs Japanese debate. The debate here isn't being engine-centric but performance for the price. Which is the typical European vs American car debate.

Since the beginning of time American Cars have displaced more.

Not actually the case, but hey who'd expect you to know automotive history?

Doesn't it matter that almost every car Porsche makes looks alike? :p

You know, except the SUV and the upcoming Sedan. Nevermind that you'd have to be blind to not tell the difference between a Boxster and a 911. Of course Porsche never made the 550 Spyder, never made the 356, the 914, 924, 944, 928. And Porsche never did that little project for Mercedes the E500. In fact Porsche didn't design the VW Bug either.

Honestly? Hasn't been a halfway decent sports car since the 60s and the GT40.

Uh right. And what other Le Mans cars do you know of? Maybe a good old fashioned 917K? That lovely little car that kicked the GT40s ass? And Hey I know the McLaren F1 isn't a decent sports car. Nor is the 959, nor is the F40, F50 or Enzo. Hell the Elise can't possibly be. Nor could the 308, 328, 348, 355 or 360. The various Aston Martins haven't been on the ball either. The Lotus Esprit is obviously not much of a sports car. In fact the C4 Corvette was obviously a piece of shit. ZR-1? Nah That corvette was a pile. In fact the Mosler is also not worth mentioning. The Saleen S7 is obviously not an adequate sports car. In fact the Miata is a good pile of shit. Of course the NSX doesn't even bear mentioning, nor the Skyline. Hell the Viper is just a coupe after all, not a sports car.

If I had a time machine that I could only use once, i'd go to Le Mans in '66. Or at least to a point before so I could learn French before going.

Get a better set of priorities. Seriously.

I think it's been changed. The problem is that the only change that seems to have happened is the windshield is at a lower angle and the bumps for the headlights are more subdued. That's all. I think the thing still looks stubby.

I just don't have an emotional bond to Porsche as a brand to unconditionally love the 911 along with everything else they make.

You're flaming someone for not liking a Porsche, not knowing everything about automotive debates, and then attacking my priorities. Wow. Irony, huh?

You're flaming someone for not liking a Porsche, not knowing everything about automotive debates, and then attacking my priorities. Wow. Irony, huh?

I don't see a single flame in there. Perhaps you could point out an insult? Or perhaps you could provide some reasoning for how a race-car was the last great sports car?

I just don't have an emotional bond to Porsche as a brand to unconditionally love the 911 along with everything else they make.
I've only ever sat in one Porsche (a 996 Carrera S), and that was enough.

And besides, find me one bad review of a Porsche (other than the Cayenne :mad: ).

The New Vette fails to reach my high-water mark among sub 100k cars: The Noble M12 GTO -3R.

One day, you will be mine

I don't see a single flame in there. Perhaps you could point out an insult? Or perhaps you could provide some reasoning for how a race-car was the last great sports car?

Because I like to judge a sports car on a racing pedigree instead of what a production model can do.

Oh, Flames?

Not actually the case, but hey who'd expect you to know automotive history?

Well, you seem to have a low opinion of my knowledge of automotive history...

You know, except the SUV and the upcoming Sedan. Nevermind that you'd have to be blind to not tell the difference between a Boxster and a 911. Of course Porsche never made the 550 Spyder, never made the 356, the 914, 924, 944, 928. And Porsche never did that little project for Mercedes the E500. In fact Porsche didn't design the VW Bug either.


You seemed to have a fit over me not knowing every aspect of Porsche history, which, by the way, I did have to look up what some models are, because I'm not interested in Porsches.

Uh right. And what other Le Mans cars do you know of? Maybe a good old fashioned 917K? That lovely little car that kicked the GT40s ass? And Hey I know the McLaren F1 isn't a decent sports car. Nor is the 959, nor is the F40, F50 or Enzo. Hell the Elise can't possibly be. Nor could the 308, 328, 348, 355 or 360. The various Aston Martins haven't been on the ball either. The Lotus Esprit is obviously not much of a sports car. In fact the C4 Corvette was obviously a piece of shit. ZR-1? Nah That corvette was a pile. In fact the Mosler is also not worth mentioning. The Saleen S7 is obviously not an adequate sports car. In fact the Miata is a good pile of shit. Of course the NSX doesn't even bear mentioning, nor the Skyline. Hell the Viper is just a coupe after all, not a sports car.

Forgive me, but this does seem the least bit sarcasticly dragging out a good number of sports cars, many of which I do or don't like for various reasons which I don't care to get into here.

Get a better set of priorities. Seriously.

Oh yeah, and this.

So, yeah. This is what came from me saying I liked the GT40, there hasn't been a decent sports car since, I thought were clearly opinions, although I might have been mistaken, and expressing a desire to see Le Mans in 66.

Go figure what I thought that was, huh?

Anyway-

I remember seeing that Noble, that is a nice car.

I remember seeing that Noble, that is a nice car.

It would be a nice car at 190k, at 80k US, it's not only an awesome car, its an awesome car that upper middle class has a hope of acheiving

Because I like to judge a sports car on a racing pedigree instead of what a production model can do.


I'm going to call shenanigans on this one, since Porsche has the best racing pedigree that could be had. The first privately sold Porsche was raced the next weekend and that tradition has remained. Save for the current models (something that upsets me a bit) every Porsche model has proven itself dominant on the track. The most amount of Le Mans wins by a looooonnnggg shot, something like 20,000 sports car victories since the company began.

No, sir. If you where trully about on track performance you would not be so dismissive about Porsche.

I don't have a problem with you not being into Porsches. That's fine, not everything is for everybody. But, lets be honest with ourselves and our reasoning...

Untitled by Vanilla Bean
Your wallet’s fat, your car is rank
Fuck you and your H2!
Each burst of speed costs half a tank
Fuck you and your H2!
At each stop sign and traffic light
Regardless if it’s day or night
They’ll mutter “asshole” and they’re right
Fuck you and your H2!



You can’t drive mud, you can’t clear rocks
Fuck you and your H2!
With Chevy Tahoe frame and shocks
Fuck you and your H2!
What illness do you suffer from?
Are your aesthetic senses numb?
How does it feel to be so dumb?
Fuck you and your H2!



If I gave you what you deserve
Fuck you and your H2!
I’d cut you off and make you swerve
Fuck you and your H2!
I’d follow you across the land
I’d top your gas tank off with sand
And flip the bird with my free hand
Fuck you and your H2!



It’s true you are the Tax-break winner
Fuck you and your H2!
You spent it on ‘roo-bars and Spinners
Fuck you and your H2!
Full fifty-grand you can omit,
But what remains to show for it?
A four-point-three-ton pile of shit.
Fuck you and your H2!



Despite my venomous complaint
Fuck you and your H2!
I’ve got an atom of restraint
Fuck you and your H2!
I hope this point you haven’t missed
Your car selection makes me pissed
In spite of that I can resist
Fuck you and your H2!



For 3 or more: the carpool lane
Fuck you and your H2!
But what if you have half a brain?
Fuck you and your H2!
You solo drive each day to work
That’s why your friends all joke and smirk
Come Humm on THIS, you fucking jerk!
Fuck you and your H2!




Haiku by Tim


Hulking black Hummer
Purchased in rank atonement
small peckered driver

Aye, it's an awesome car which I would have to import, however. =p I think I saw it on an episode of Top Gear though. It is a very pretty car, with some very nice angles.

Because I like to judge a sports car on a racing pedigree instead of what a production model can do.

Oh, Flames?

Well, you seem to have a low opinion of my knowledge of automotive history...

Yep, as justified by multiple ignorant and inaccurate statements in your posts here in this thread.

You seemed to have a fit over me not knowing every aspect of Porsche history, which, by the way, I did have to look up what some models are, because I'm not interested in Porsches.

Yep thats fine, you made a comment about how 'all porsches look alike' and consider it a flame when the variety are demonstrated to you. Good job.

Forgive me, but this does seem the least bit sarcasticly dragging out a good number of sports cars, many of which I do or don't like for various reasons which I don't care to get into here.

Yep, if sarcasm was lighter fluid my post would be highly flammable. As it stands sarcasm is infact not lighter fluid.

Oh yeah, and this.

Heartfelt advice.

So, yeah. This is what came from me saying I liked the GT40, there hasn't been a decent sports car since,

You might want to go look up the racing pedigree of various cars then, seeing as you claim that is your criteria.

I thought were clearly opinions, although I might have been mistaken, and expressing a desire to see Le Mans in 66.

Go figure what I thought that was, huh?

Nah, thats what comes to you when you make a post fill with sarcasm, get a reply thats dripping in sarcasm and then (oh oh oh, here comes a flame) you get your panties in a twist.

I have nothing but respect for Porsche's racing pedigree as well, and it's clearly a sign of dominance that every single Le Mans GT/GT2 class is entirely loaded with 911 GT3 Cups and what have you. I personally like the 944. But it's hard to appreciate a car like the 911 for it's race wins when everyone drives it and it would win regardless. It kind of pales in the face of a strong competitor.

But just because Ferrari has a great reacing pedigree doesn't mean I like the F40 or the Enzo, both of which I think of as ugly as sin.

Ok, Blauschild, you don't like my opinions. Wow. I will now cry myself to sleep because I do not live up to your high expectations of someone who takes part in an automotive thread on nationstates. :rolleyes:

I have nothing but respect for Porsche's racing pedigree as well, and it's clearly a sign of dominance that every single Le Mans GT/GT2 class is entirely loaded with 911 GT3 Cups and what have you. I personally like the 944. But it's hard to appreciate a car like the 911 for it's race wins when everyone drives it and it would win regardless. It kind of pales in the face of a strong competitor.
The GT2 catagory being all 911s is a recent phenom, since drivers can pick another car or win but not do both. There are 360s and something else I can't remember at the moment currently racing in the series. Oh, M3s.

But just because Ferrari has a great reacing pedigree doesn't mean I like the F40 or the Enzo, both of which I think of as ugly as sin.
Now here, and I'm not trying to get up in your grill (see what I did there?), but it seems demonstrable in what you've said about the cars you like and don't like that your tastes are far more influenced by asthetics than pedigree. That's fine, everyone has a different criteria, but you can be honest about it.

Still a refreshing change from all those BUTts (Big Ugly Trucks).

Seriously, any grown man buying an H2 or H3 is just like a kid putting a playing card in the spokes of his bicycle. "Looky, I'm just like daddy." Ugh.

You can not diss what you call big ugly trucks for a simple reason, they are one of few vehichles that are actually useful. Their design has a purpose and people use them for that purpose. The Hummer line was built to offer top notch off road capabilities combined with luxury to those who can afford it. It is a hyperbole, a show car, of all things that actual utility trucks like Ford F series and Chevys could embody. The people who buy them rarely use their capablities, I'll admit that, but trucks have a true purpose in American society. I come from a small town in Nebraska and you need them for task around farms, clearing land, and for small to medium scale construction projects. They are for things that would break any of the other cars discussed here.

You can not diss what you call big ugly trucks for a simple reason, they are one of few vehichles that are actually useful. Their design has a purpose and people use them for that purpose. The Hummer line was built to offer top notch off road capabilities combined with luxury to those who can afford it. It is a hyperbole, a show car, of all things that actual utility trucks like Ford F series and Chevys could embody. The people who buy them rarely use their capablities, I'll admit that, but trucks have a true purpose in American society. I come from a small town in Nebraska and you need them for task around farms, clearing land, and for small to medium scale construction projects. They are for things that would break any of the other cars discussed here.
Technically the Hummer was designed to be a versitle vehicle to get troops around in. "Luxury" didn't come into the picture until Arnie and a bunch of other rich twits insisted on having one for driving around Southern California, where it is not needed.

I'm willing to bet that those who trully need a truck don't have the H2 or H3 very high on thier lists. If you need a truck and have a truck, that's cool. If you're cruising suburbia in an H2, you're just someone in a BUTt.

But just because Ferrari has a great reacing pedigree doesn't mean I like the F40 or the Enzo, both of which I think of as ugly as sin.
Well, the Enzo is something of an acquired taste (I only saw one in the metal once at a motor show), but you really can't diss the F40.
At the time it was the absolute pinnacle of what a sports car could be. And after it came electronic gadgets. It's the last of its kind.
Plus it is notorious because it has killed so many people. Huge turbos midcorner tend to do that to you...