NationStates Jolt Archive

Now this is a worrying idea:
Iran's space agency is trying to snap up technology from abroad as fast as possible for its satellite program, fearing the West will seek to impose restrictions like those put on the Iranian nuclear program.

Iran has major ambitions in space, looking to show off its technological abilities, monitor its neighborhood – where the United States has hundreds of thousands of troops – and establish itself as a regional superpower.
Full article here (https://www.space.com/news/ap_051130_iran_space.html).

At least they aren't talking about going to the moon. Yet.

:eek:

Why is this so shocking?

America's time as the worlds only super power is over.

China, EU, India, and now Iran are becoming global powers in their own right and America has since the end of the Cold War lost it's willpower and focus...

Like ancient Rome and all empires America's time is ending forever, but we will never be forgotten.

If they try anything, we'll launch tactical strikes against their space program like the Israelis did in the 1980's with Iraq's nuclear plants. They don't stand even the slightest chance against the US.

If anything, it's proof that Iran will never be a major power. They have to obtain all but the most basic technology from abroad and produce nothing in terms of scientific innovation...they're stagnant technologically.

They should just try hacking our sattelites instead; probably a lot easier and cheaper in the long run

I doubt the US will let that happen. I mean, look how pissed they were about the "Galileo" system, and that was being run by their allies. No way are they going to let Iran get one.

Why is this so shocking?

America's time as the worlds only super power is over.

China, EU, India, and now Iran are becoming global powers in their own right and America has since the end of the Cold War lost it's willpower and focus...

Like ancient Rome and all empires America's time is ending forever, but we will never be forgotten.

What is your definition of "power" exactly? Because I don't see any of those nations supplanting America's current role in the world anytime soon.

What is your definition of "power" exactly? Because I don't see any of those nations supplanting America's current role in the world anytime soon.


China has the power to royally fuck us economically, or so I have heard (something about selling off all the US debt they purchased or something???)

And where are the all Europeans claiming that if the US gets nukes and spaceships, why shouldn't the psycho "death to Isreal" Iranians?

Come on guys!

And where are the all Europeans claiming that if the US gets nukes and spaceships, why shouldn't the psycho "death to Isreal" Iranians?

Come on guys!

Why would we possibly claim that? Iran is no ally of Europe.

If they try anything, we'll launch tactical strikes against their space program like the Israelis did in the 1980's with Iraq's nuclear plants. They don't stand even the slightest chance against the US.

No, we really don't care about their space program, unless they try to build an orbital battle station like the Soviets wanted to (and almost did, it fell tho)
But their nuclear reactors have about a year left, before the Isreal launches Jercho rockets, and blows them back to the Stone Age. Ready for another seven day war?

They should just try hacking our sattelites instead; probably a lot easier and cheaper in the long run
Can't be too hard to hack who knows how old software.

Can't be too hard to hack who knows how old software.


I'm quite surprised actually that we don't hear more about hacking incidences. You think they just keep them quiet so they don't encourage the practice?

You have to look at the big picture here. Besides launch satellites into space, what else can you do with a giant rocket capable of breaking through the atmosphere? Four letters. ICBM. America will never let any nation, who publicly wishes to destroy another nation, to get anything that could possibly be turned into a long range weapon. PERIOD.

If Iran wants to play with the adults, then they need to act like one first. As long as they continue to threaten other nations, they will get anything of significant that they build blown up, sabotaged, stolen, or whatever else we need to do.

America will not stand for it. That's why even though we allow people the right to bear arms, we don't let felons own handguns.

China has the power to royally fuck us economically, or so I have heard (something about selling off all the US debt they purchased or something???)

That would screw China as much if not more than the US. The US has alot of options to counter such a move from another nation. Whomever you heard that from is just scaremongering.

So Iran is seeking satelites, so what, anything they can do in orbit with their own assests they can get cheaper from private companies (i.e. imagry and communications). The true threat to western nations, purely in a space ops argument, comes when they begin denying our capabilities to project effects from space.

You have to look at the big picture here. Besides launch satellites into space, what else can you do with a giant rocket capable of breaking through the atmosphere? Four letters. ICBM. America will never let any nation, who publicly wishes to destroy another nation, to get anything that could possibly be turned into a long range weapon. PERIOD.

Apparently they don't want to let anyone put anything in space that would make America redundant strategically either. If memory serves, America hotly contested the European attempt to put up their own GPS system. Why? Because that would allow them to be weaned off reliance on the American system.

Uncle Sam wasn't too happy about his allies becoming independent it seems.


If Iran wants to play with the adults, then they need to act like one first. As long as they continue to threaten other nations, they will get anything of significant that they build blown up, sabotaged, stolen, or whatever else we need to do.

Really, you need to be more specific. Threatening other nations? "Severe consequences if you don't comply" sound familiar to you? If that was the case, wouldn't that mean American military assets should be destroyed on a significant scale everyday?


America will not stand for it. That's why even though we allow people the right to bear arms, we don't let felons own handguns.

Yes, that's why North Korea has nukes and Washington is really quiet about "severe consequences" isn't it?

The true threat to western nations, purely in a space ops argument, comes when they begin denying our capabilities to project effects from space.

Yeah they better not try to block the Pink Floyd laser light show they plan to put on.

Good point though... they should just hire people to send their satelites up for them.

America will never let any nation, who publicly wishes to destroy another nation, to get anything that could possibly be turned into a long range weapon. PERIOD.
Hmm...

Anyways, I'm not really a fan of Iran these days. Their Prez has not acted up to my expectations at all, and now he's also screwing with the Ayatollahs.

I think he might want to take the "Islamic Republic" and turn it into some sort of "Nationalist, Militaristic, Isolationalist Republic". The quicker his term is over the better.

I'm generally a fan of space exploration, but I'm not at all sure that that is what Iran is planning to do. That being said, Iran already has the missiles it needs to strike the targets it wants to strike (courtesy of the DPRK) and I'm more worried about the Nuclear Program than a few spy satellites about the technological level of the 1970s.

Really, you need to be more specific. Threatening other nations?

I believe there was some presidential decree about wiping Israel off the map.

Now this is a worrying idea:

Full article here (https://www.space.com/news/ap_051130_iran_space.html).

At least they aren't talking about going to the moon. Yet.

:eek:
Heh! Muslims in space! ieeee! :D

I believe there was some presidential decree about wiping Israel off the map.
It was a speech made in front of a bunch of students attending a conference called "A World without Zionism".
Not official government policy, but still not really excusable.

Yes, that's why North Korea has nukes and Washington is really quiet about "severe consequences" isn't it?
No. It's because the US has adopted a policy of "Asia for Asians" pretty thoroughly. :p

It was a speech made in front of a bunch of students attending a conference called "A World without Zionism".
Not official government policy, but still not really excusable.

Not big into their subtlety, these Iranians.

Heh! Muslims in space! ieeee! :D

You know there's only one way to prevent that, right?

Pigs in space!!!
http://www.watchermagazine.com/wp-content/wp-photos/pigsinsp.jpg

You know there's only one way to prevent that, right?

Pigs in space!!!
http://www.watchermagazine.com/wp-content/wp-photos/pigsinsp.jpg
ROFLMAO! Just what we need: Porkers in pressure suits! :D

ROFLMAO! Just what we need: Porkers in pressure suits! :D
Glad I got a chuckle out of you - I'm off to bed now (after all, it is 04:20 here...)

BTW, have you seen "your" picture in Gillie suit yet (other thread) ;)

*something witty about ham from uranus*

Glad I got a chuckle out of you - I'm off to bed now (after all, it is 04:20 here...)

BTW, have you seen "your" picture in Gillie suit yet (other thread) ;)
Huh? Ut oh! I have a feeling I'm not gonna like this! [ braces self ] :cool:

Good point though... they should just hire people to send their satelites up for them.

You're missing the point. Iran or anyone, not even countries, do not need space access to cause effects to and from space. Why are people always hung up on the rocket putting something in orbit (though, admittedly, its pretty freakin cool), when a $5k balloon with a $500 electronic box floated into near or tranistory space could jam GPS for an area roughly the size of Afganistan.

You're missing the point. Iran or anyone, not even countries, do not need space access to cause effects to and from space. Why are people always hung up on the rocket putting something in orbit (though, admittedly, its pretty freakin cool), when a $5k balloon with a $500 electronic box floated into near or tranistory space could jam GPS for an area roughly the size of Afganistan.

No I'm not I'm just putting words together for fun.

I like the space elevator idea.

Or if they could maybe hire out the Greatest American Hero to take them up - that would be neat

The space elevator is a nice idea and raises some interesting questions about the future uses of space. But in the now, everything humans do in space can be compromised by easier actions terrestrially (air, land, sea). Instead of taking a Mahanian view, understanding that attacking the lines of communication is much more effective. Disrupting the signal makes the bird useless. Think about applying what Corbett said about seapower to space. Its scary!

The space elevator is a nice idea and raises some interesting questions about the future uses of space. But in the now, everything humans do in space can be compromised by easier actions terrestrially (air, land, sea). Instead of taking a Mahanian view, understanding that attacking the lines of communication is much more effective. Disrupting the signal makes the bird useless. Think about applying what Corbett said about seapower to space. Its scary!


I dunno Corbett but he sounds smart.

On page one I suggested they try hacking.

I dunno Corbett but he sounds smart.

On page one I suggested they try hacking.

Thing with hacking is that its not very effective. Comming from the USAF point of view... anything hackers could do to satelites can be corrected pretty quickly, its why we pay people to be space control geeks. And stealing the signal, comms or GPS, is pretty worthless, since your going to get the signals anyway if you listen to properly. And as an espionage tool, again the signal is encrypted and if you listen properly, you'll get it anyway.

didnt some 12 year old hack a telecommunications satelite and knock it out for a couple days?

China has the power to royally fuck us economically, or so I have heard (something about selling off all the US debt they purchased or something???)

Not really. Selling the $150 billion of US government debt they hold would be in the secondary market, and wouldn't effect the US's outstanding obligations. They are - along with Japan - probably responsible for some of the low interest environment, so if they stopped buying, interest rates would go up. That would be bad for the US consumer, but I doubt it would destroy the economy, just slow it down.

At the same time, they are pretty much forced to recycle their trade surplus with the US back into T-bills anyway, in order to keep their currency artifically devalued against the dollar, thus giving their exports an advantage.

Iran is not really looking into developing satellite launchers, they want ICBM's. Using them to launch satellites is a secondary function, perhaps a little revenue raiser, but the real point here is ICBM's.

Iran is not really looking into developing satellite launchers, they want ICBM's. Using them to launch satellites is a secondary function, perhaps a little revenue raiser, but the real point here is ICBM's.
And have you some source for that concrete assertion or it is just your opinion?

Why is this so shocking?

America's time as the worlds only super power is over.

China, EU, India, and now Iran are becoming global powers in their own right and America has since the end of the Cold War lost it's willpower and focus...

Like ancient Rome and all empires America's time is ending forever, but we will never be forgotten.

The nice thing about the decline of major superpowers (like Rome), is that the world then enters hundreds of years of internecine warfare and societal collapse that make the wars during the time of superpowers look like kids playing in the playground.

This is then followed by several hundred years of "Dark Ages".

Nice thought.

iran wants to get rid of isreal, and is trying to get into space.
china wants to conquer taiwan and has sent a person into space.
hopefully will motivate the other 'space power' to be a bit more innovative.

Iran beinga devout country and all... should they send people into space, will they still have to pray towards mecca or just aim at the earth...