NationStates Jolt Archive

A US military spokesman had called Wednesday for some insurgent groups to be brought into the political process, while insisting that Al-Qaeda was being hit hard by offensives.

"We understand the capabilities, the vulnerabilities and the intentions of each group of the insurgency -- the foreign fighters, the Iraqi rejectionists and the Saddamists," Major General Rick Lynch told reporters.

"The group in the middle, the Iraqi rejectionists -- (which) includes the Shia rejectionists and the Sunni rejectionists -- we believe that deliberate outreach will allow them to participate in the political process and allow them to become part of the solution and not part of the problem," he said.

Meanwhile, Japan sealed a deal with Iraq to forgive about 6.1 billion dollars or 80 percent of the debt it is owed by the war-ravaged country in line with an international accord reached last year.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/iraq;_ylt=Aqoj7qxrzX036EXC0I97.O6s0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA2Z2szazkxBHNlYwN0bQ--

Anyone think its not coincidence that this came out shortly on the heels of the agreement between the Iraqi government and the insurgency that more or less came to a hands off policy on Iraqis but not US troops? Or at least that was how I recall it.

Anyone think its not coincidence that this came out shortly on the heels of the agreement between the Iraqi government and the insurgency that more or less came to a hands off policy on Iraqis but not US troops? Or at least that was how I recall it.huh?
What agreement?

Well, this just puts the icing on the cake, doesn't it?
1. Iraq is invaded to remove a despotic regime and find all those WMDs
2. 10-100,000+ people die
3. There are no WMDs
4. Elements of the former despotic regime kill enough people that they force a way into the current political process
5. The current regime uses many of the same tactics as the old one
6. Radical islamist elements get a foothold, or rather a major base of operations, in a state formerly closed off to them...
and as bonus points...
7. The infrastructure, including healthcare, of an entire nation has been wrecked, and socioeconomic indicators have plummeted
8. Civil war looms as a fragile and barely cohesive state gradually fractures (anyone remember the Balkans?)
9. Western oil interests are maneuvering into contracts which will hold the country economically hostage for decades
10. and everyone is free... to adopt reactionary social practices as a Shia theocracy veils Iraqi women and slowly but surely takes the nation into Sharia.

So congratulations to the pro-Iraq war camp!

huh?
What agreement?

Oh, sorry. It was a concensus of the government that the insurgency had a right to blast US troops, not an agreement between them and the insurgency.

This is not, I think, a good decision. We're doing the same stuff we did with Bin Laden. See, we're going to take these people, give them more "proffessional" training, and arm them with better weapons. Then we send them after the insurgency.

Then ten years later they become rabidly anti-american and start using the weapons and training they were provided with against us.

It was a concensus of the government that the insurgency had a right to blast US troops.interesting point you raise...

Oh, sorry. It was a concensus of the government that the insurgency had a right to blast US troops, not an agreement between them and the insurgency.

This is what an insurgency is. You go after military and government targets but not civilian targets.

Fine, let the insurgency come against the US Military. Everytime they have, they've been massacred.

This is what an insurgency is. You go after military and government targets but not civilian targets.

Fine, let the insurgency come against the US Military. Everytime they have, they've been massacred.

That's why they use IEDs, mortars and other means of striking without being hit back. If you think the insurgency won't adapt, think again.

That's why they use IEDs, mortars and other means of striking without being hit back. If you think the insurgency won't adapt, think again.

If you don't think we'll adapt (and we have) think again. Luckily, thanks to taskforces, IEDs are being found and disabled before they have a chance to go off. Sometimes though, the insurgents who place them detonate them while they are there.

Of course it has to do with the recent declaration about the right to resist an occupation (not my words).

The idea is for an amnesty. Ever heard of it? It's not exactly a new idea to deal with rebel groups.

There is no way you can build a democratic government against groups like this. Democracy requires at least some basic stability, and therefore it is necessary to deal with the various insurgents.

Since the Iraqi Government cannot defeat them (and neither can the US in any practical way), they need to arrange with them somehow.
Remember Al-Sadr? They finally got him to get involved in the political process, and things calmed down.

I think this is a good idea - and the more the Iraqi Government's view differs from the American one, the better it will work, because ultimately it has to establish its own independent credibility, and it needs to do so better than Karzai did.

If you don't think we'll adapt (and we have) think again. Luckily, thanks to taskforces, IEDs are being found and disabled before they have a chance to go off. Sometimes though, the insurgents who place them detonate them while they are there.

So the US forces adapt, as does the insurgency. Dumb people get pruned from the genome. The net result is nothing changes since the insurgency will think of something new when the US counters their existing tactics and so on.

Either way, the Iraqi government is more or less telling the US to scram with this consensus. The government that the US put in place. If they ignore this, it will only prove that the US is there to, as has been said before, only further their own interests, so-called freedom of the Iraqi's be damned.

Freedom to be puppets if the US stays when it is being told to get lost in a sovereign nation.

So the US forces adapt, as does the insurgency. Dumb people get pruned from the genome. The net result is nothing changes since the insurgency will think of something new when the US counters their existing tactics and so on.

Of course, that's why we try to bring the insurgents in to the democratic process rather than fight them, since ultimately we're going to fight them forever unless they are encouraged to participate in their nation's management rather than fight.