NationStates Jolt Archive

Canadian aboriginals had their children forcibly taken away and put in boarding 'Residential' schools run by the Catholic and Anglican churches. Assimilation was the goal, and children were beaten for speaking their language, some severely sexually and physically abused. The system began in the 20s, and the last Residential School closed in 1996 in Saskatchewan. Individual survivors have sued the churches, and the government, but finally there is a framework for total compensation and closure.

The Residential School Deal (http://www.canada.com/saskatoon/starphoenix/news/story.html?id=177fbc94-6526-47e2-8f61-1e7d170cba28)

Another article (http://www.canada.com/news/national/story.html?id=daa46b02-97b0-487d-85e3-251fd7972f57)

The news likes to stick the big figures up front, but here are the basics. Every living student of a Residential School will receive compensation. $10,000 for the first year they attended, and $3000 for each subsequent year. This will cost about $2 billion. As well, a truth and reconcilliation commision is finally to be set up, and about $125 million is earmarked for treatment programs, and a further $20 for commemoration projects.

Survivors who suffered particularily severe abuse can apply for further compensation. The government has committed to settling no less that 2500 of these cases a year. The very elderly can apply for fast-tracked compensation of $8000. Money will also be provided to cover the cost of the lawsuits, so that legal fees aren't taken out of people's lump-sum payments.

The estimated price of this whole process is in the area of $4 billion.

Once all the claims have been settled, that's it. It's done, and we can finally move on. Thoughts?

More background (http://www.shannonthunderbird.com/residential_schools.htm) for those not familiar with Residential Schools.

Thats pretty f'd up what they went through. I'm glad to hear that they are being compensated. 2 billion eh? wow - impressive!

It's roughly similar to the way the Chilean government approached compensation packages to those tortured during Pinochet's regime. A one shot deal, taking the time to admit what happened and deal with it, and then a chance to move on and focus on present problems.

Haven't you heard?



According to Harper this is just another unaffordable Liberal election ploy that has no basis in reality!

Thats pretty f'd up what they went through. I'm glad to hear that they are being compensated. 2 billion eh? wow - impressive!
The money isn't going to make everything better. But it's at least a concrete way to say, 'we're sorry, we admit what happened, and we are making restitution'. Considering some survivors were in the schools for 10 years, that's a fair chunk of money. I'm glad they aren't just holding the money out to those who can prove serious abuse...the system itself was incredibly abusive, and I think the government is acknowledging this.

It is really an incredible thing that so many groups were able to come together and agree on this in a fairly short period of time.

Haven't you heard?



According to Harper this is just another unaffordable Liberal election ploy that has no basis in reality!
Yes well. It really goes beyond political manipulation. Election or no election, it's a done deal. The only thing that could hold it up...hold it up mind you, not stop it, is that the judges hearing current cases need to agree to the deal. And so far, they are doing so. It's essentially one big class-action lawsuit.

I don't doubt that some people are going to die before they are compensated...and the money won't necessarily go to their families. I have no doubt that some people will wait many, many years to get a cent. But the fact that the step is taking is an important thing. We need to close the wound before it can truly heal.

Yes well. It really goes beyond political manipulation. Election or no election, it's a done deal. The only thing that could hold it up...hold it up mind you, not stop it, is that the judges hearing current cases need to agree to the deal. And so far, they are doing so. It's essentially one big class-action lawsuit.


And, as you say, something long overdue.

Too bad that it will become political fodder due to the timing issue (as if this hasn't been under negotiation for a while), and so some of our more bigotted citizens will use it as just another validation for their dislike of first nations peoples....

More sources ( http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000082&sid=acxxWso87eKk&refer=canada)

The Globe and Mail ( http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20051123.wresident1123/BNStory/National/)

CBC News ( http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2005/07/06/afn-school-package050706.html)

And it is estimated anywhere from 80,000 to 150,000 people are eligible for compensation. That's how many survivors are still alive, and who had direct experience with these schools. My eldest aunt is among them, having spent four years in an Anglican Residential School.

I understand that some people are not going to want to accept this deal, and who feel that they are just being paid off. But I can't see how else this issue can be closed. It won't fix things, it won't erase what was done, but more than anything we have simply wanted recognition of what happened.

I don't give a rat's ass if non-aboriginals use this as ammunition against us "oh, look, they're getting handouts again". I think the average Canadian realises what was done affects us deeply, and needs to be addressed.

The money isn't going to make everything better. But it's at least a concrete way to say, 'we're sorry, we admit what happened, and we are making restitution'. Considering some survivors were in the schools for 10 years, that's a fair chunk of money. I'm glad they aren't just holding the money out to those who can prove serious abuse...the system itself was incredibly abusive, and I think the government is acknowledging this.

It is really an incredible thing that so many groups were able to come together and agree on this in a fairly short period of time.

well of course it won't, but that's what the treatment programs are for right? :)

well of course it won't, but that's what the treatment programs are for right? :)
Well, there are already some treatment programs in place, but they haven't had great success. Hopefully this new acknowledgement of wrong doing will ease the hearts of those who feel betrayed by the Canadian government. Before, the blame was placed almost entirely on the churches, and the government took a 'we didn't know' attitude. I think this is a good step towars healing in and of itself. The healing programs may be a bit too late...but then again, maybe for some they won't be.

Ok, if this were happening in the US, I'm sure people would be jumping in saying compensation is wrong...wouldn't they? Sheesh! Come on Canuks! Show us your dark side too! (And go ahead you non-Canuks...feel as free as you normally do to insert your opinions!:))

Yeah I dont expect the treatment programs to be 100% successful, but at least they have them. I'm just saying that that is the aim of the treatment programs and not the money. The money is just a nice bonus to show sincerity (sp?).

I wish they would do something similar for the native Americans here in the states. Even with the little I make and the huge amount of taxes they take already, I would agree to a tax increase if I felt the program was set up right.

I would agree to a tax increase if I felt the program was set up right.
Which you know it won't be...but it's better than nothing:)

Which you know it won't be...but it's better than nothing:)


Nothings perfect, but I would just hope that it would be modelled after the Canadian program mostly. I wouldn't go for it if all teh money was used to do something stupid and pointless like throw a party (not that that is what they would do I am just not creative enough to come up with something more plausible ATM)

I think that the people who ran those schools, (Those still alive) Should be arrested on Charges of Torture and Criminal Negilgance.

More reasons to hate the Catholic Church in my opinion.

I believe that this is a step in the right direction.



And thats all i will say on this subject.

I think that the people who ran those schools, (Those still alive) Should be arrested on Charges of Torture and Criminal Negilgance.

More reasons to hate the Catholic Church in my opinion.
And the Anglicans.

Though the abuse was more likely in the Catholic run schools.

What...no one resents the money yet?

I'll bite. I have to admit I was not happy when I found out that the Government was doing this. Typical Liberal Government throwing money at problems. I have to say punishing the Taxpayers of Canada for the wrongs of a Church and the Federal Government is not the way to deal with this issue. Especially since most if not all Natives do not pay taxes. Is that not enough. I am fed up with all this crap. I know I wouldn't be happy if someone sent me to a school and forced me to learn some foreign language and punished me for speaking English but seriously us European descendants are not leaving. We should not be paying for the mistakes of our elders. I would go so far as to say that if you want rights from the federal government maybe you should start paying taxes to support that government. I am one of those that thinks that the Treaty System is outdated and should be abolished. I see many ethnic groups keeping their heritages alive everywhere in Canada without special rights. Why do you have to have these special rights? Oh and I don't care for the we were here first argument cause we're here now and we're not leaving.

Yay! Someone to talk to:)
I'll bite. I have to admit I was not happy when I found out that the Government was doing this. Typical Liberal Government throwing money at problems. I have to say punishing the Taxpayers of Canada for the wrongs of a Church and the Federal Government is not the way to deal with this issue. Then who should be 'punished' for it? Someone has to take responsibility...and it's not like the Federal Government is an entity separate from the Canadian people. They act on our behalf, they represent us. As our representatives, they committed heinous wrongs...not just to us, but to Japanese Canadians, Ukrainian Canadians etc. Wrongs need to be righted. Racist immigration policies have been changed. All sorts of unjust Federal laws have been changed...and sometimes, reparations need to be made. Shitty for the current taxpayers that it took so long for them to do this...but that's part of living in a representative democracy. When your government screws up, you pay the price.

Especially since most if not all Natives do not pay taxes. Is that not enough. I am fed up with all this crap. This is the most common misconception that Canadians have about us. I'm going to copy and paste from another thread:


To clear up any lasting confusion about Aboriginal people in Canada being tax exempt, here is some information taken from the Canada Revenue Agency ( http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/aboriginals/menu-e.html):



Only natives ON reserve can be exempt from income and employment tax. ( http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/aboriginals/status-e.html#heading2) That is the exemption under section 87 of the Indian Act. Again, 70% of natives in Canada live off Reserve.

Natives must pay GST/HST on all goods bought off Reserve. ( http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/aboriginals/status-e.html#heading16) Only goods sold on Reserve are exempt.

Many bands charge a First Nations Tax (http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tg/rc4365/rc4365-e.html#P68_1719) of 7% on goods and services on the Reserve.

First Nations who have negotiated a self-governing or tax agreement with the Government of Canada are not ( http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/aboriginals/status-e.html#heading1) covered under the tax exemptions.
So no. The majority of aboriginals DO pay taxes, like anyone else. And paying taxes or no should not make us ineligible for reparations.


I know I wouldn't be happy if someone sent me to a school and forced me to learn some foreign language and punished me for speaking English but seriously us European descendants are not leaving. Don't mix up the issues here. It's not about you not leaving. That has nothing to do with this at all. It has to do with the official policy at the time that sought to exterminate native peoples via assimilation. "Let everything that is Indian within you die." Your people and my people can live together quite well, without one culture being dominant, and the other eradicated.



We should not be paying for the mistakes of our elders. Why not? You reap the rewards from their actions? It can't be a one way street. One thing to consider with this package is that this signals an end to it. Once the cases are settled, this can never again be brought back to haunt Canada financially. I say, pay it now, get it over with and be done with it. Action needs to be taken if you actually want to include native people in this country. If you wish to continue alienating us, then be prepared for the continued problems that will cause. So which is higher...the immediate pay out, or the lasting consequences of social and cultural alienation?



I would go so far as to say that if you want rights from the federal government maybe you should start paying taxes to support that government. I've already shown that this idea that we pay no taxes is a very false assumption.


I am one of those that thinks that the Treaty System is outdated and should be abolished. The treaty system in many places is quite modern and current. BC is only now settling treaties, and treaties are being negotiated elsewhere. You can not simply do away with a treaty...understand that these agreements are made between sovereign nations. The Europeans that designed the first treaties did so with the understanding that they were dealing with nations, not subjects. The precedent has already been set. To 'abolish' the treaties now would wreak more havoc than you seem to realise...consider if Canada simply refused to abide by a treaty signed with a foreign nation. Who would trust this government to enter into further treaty negotiations...trade, defence, or otherwise? Like it or not, the treaties exist, and must be upheld. They do not place an undue burden on the Canadian taxpayers, AND the move is for self-rule and self-sufficiency.

We want to take over our own governance. Currently, reservation lands are administered by the federal government, not by us. That control is shifting over to us, and in return, reservations are losing their tax-exemptions, and being required to provide economically for themselves. I think it's a fair trade-off.

It sounds like what you want is for the aboriginal issue to be settled. We want it settled as well. This is a step in the right direction. Self-rule is also an important step in 'weaning' us off the Federal government, and in taking control of our own affairs. I think most Canadians would support this if they understood that it's not a situation of getting everything handed to us.

And don't forget. 70% of us live off-reservation, and are treated no differently than any other Canadian.



I see many ethnic groups keeping their heritages alive everywhere in Canada without special rights. Why do you have to have these special rights? Before I can really address that, I need to know what special rights you think we have. Because most of the assumptions people make about our 'special status' are false. Get back to me on this, and I'll be happy to answer your questions, and provide you with sources. It's something I think you need to understand a bit better, and I have no problem discussing it:)


Oh and I don't care for the we were here first argument cause we're here now and we're not leaving. No one's asking you to leave, love. Seriously. I'd have to cut myself in half and said the Irish parts of me home:)

You might also be interested in an earlier thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=451839) on the preservation of aboriginal culture.

What...no one resents the money yet?
I do.

Where do I apply to evade paying my taxes?

I think the money would be better spent fixing the education and healthcare system, which EVERYONE benefits from. Or fail that, maybe investing money in the infrastructure rather than giving federal hand outs.

It's more beneficial if the money was used to fixed civil infrastructure for all, with an allocated sum to help fix the infrastructre on the reserves...

And why object? According to the statistics provided Sinhue, 70% of Natives don't live on reserves, so, it only makes sense.

I do.

Where do I apply to evade paying my taxes?

I think the money would be better spent fixing the education and healthcare system, which EVERYONE benefits from. Or fail that, maybe investing money in the infrastructure rather than giving federal hand outs.

It's more beneficial if the money was used to fixed civil infrastructure for all, with an allocated sum to help fix the infrastructre on the reserves...

And why object? According to the statistics provided Sinhue, 70% of Natives don't live on reserves, so, it only makes sense.
Well, it doesn't really make sense to say, "Alright. We're sorry for the Residential Schools thing. To show how sorry we are, we're going to invest $4 in public education. There. That settles that! Woopee!"

Would you say something similar should be done in Chile? "Hey! Thousands of you were tortured! We are SO SORRY about that...here is a bunch of money that we are going to put into improving roads! Doesn't that make things better?"

Well, it doesn't really make sense to say, "Alright. We're sorry for the Residential Schools thing. To show how sorry we are, we're going to invest $4 in public education. There. That settles that! Woopee!"
If you read the whole thing, didn't say just education, I said healthcare and civil infrastructure, including those on reserves.

That way, there is an improvement for future generations.

If you read the whole thing, didn't say just education, I said healthcare and civil infrastructure, including those on reserves.

That way, there is an improvement for future generations.
Yeah, I got all of that. It still sounds pretty silly. And seriously...how sincere is that going to be? "Hey, we were planning on spending this money on other things anyway, why don't we just TELL the natives that we're doing it on their behalf, to apologise for Residential Schools! That's BRILLIANT! It's just like making a charitable donation on behalf of someone we beat the shit out of, instead of going to jail or paying a fine!"

$4 billion is rather a paltry sum in the grand scheme of things. Cripes...they spent more than half that on this stupid gun registration alone. NOT doing this is simply going to keep the wound open, and the lawsuits coming anyway.

And by the way. A question. A child is sexually or physically abused, sometimes for years on end. Would you not consider that a crime? Do you not think that someone should be held accountable for that? A child is kidnapped...forcibly removed from his or her family and raised by strangers. Is that not a crime? Would you seriously begrudge those people...even as adults, some sort of justice?

In this case, the 'people responsible' are the Churches and the Federal government...who created this system, and gave the churches the mandate to operate them. It's not enough to say that one particular government Minister or church official should be held accountable and they alone. When governments commit crimes, governments should be held accountable.

Well, you see, there's the thing... the 'church' keeps coming up and yet, it is the majority whose getting screwed because we want nothing to do with the churches and we're stuck paying their fine because our taxes go to the government.

Rather than going after the federal government, since they only had a role in the making of treaties, it would've been far more wise to bankrupt the church and drive them out of the country.

Well, you see, there's the thing... the 'church' keeps coming up and yet, it is the majority whose getting screwed because we want nothing to do with the churches and we're stuck paying their fine because our taxes go to the government.

Rather than going after the federal government, since they only had a role in the making of treaties, it would've been far more wise to bankrupt the church and drive them out of the country.
But the churches are not the only ones responsible...so how would that be fair? The Residential School system was set up to be assimilationalist. Whether the churches, or some Joe down the block ran them, they STILL would have been culturally damaging. And the Federal Government should get off...why exactly? Because it's costing tax dollars? Well so is the soft-wood lumber dispute...for about the same fricking amount of money...where is the outrage now?

I wonder how long the election is going to delay the compensation process...I can't seem to find any information on whether the administration of it has been halted or not...