NationStates Jolt Archive

so here is the next step in the evolution/design debate. the vaticans cheif astronomer makes the statement that intelligent design is not science. interesting...



VATICAN CITY - The Vatican's chief astronomer said Friday that "intelligent design" isn't science and doesn't belong in science classrooms, the latest high-ranking Roman Catholic official to enter the evolution debate in the United States.

The Rev. George Coyne, the Jesuit director of the Vatican Observatory, said placing intelligent design theory alongside that of evolution in school programs was "wrong" and was akin to mixing apples with oranges.

"Intelligent design isn't science even though it pretends to be," the ANSA news agency quoted Coyne as saying on the sidelines of a conference in Florence. "If you want to teach it in schools, intelligent design should be taught when religion or cultural history is taught, not science."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10101394/

so here is the next step in the evolution/design debate. the vaticans cheif astronomer makes the statement that intelligent design is not science. interesting...




http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10101394/
W00t. Intelligent Design is teh suxors.

Of course, Intelligent Design is taught circumspectly in any intermediate Biology class anyways. Have you ever done a fruit fly experiment? Intelligent Design at its best. We play God :)

Saying that Intelligent Design is not a science means that the person who said it has never really had any understanding of manipulating genes or done a biology science experiment. Humanity has been doing Intelligent Design ever since we could eat apples, strawberries, etc.

Wild strawberries are about the size of the average fingernail.

Grocery store strawberries are about the size of a big toe.

Seedless grapes anyone?

Tell me that's not a form of intelligent design and I'll kick your ass. However, this time, it's not an immortal being that's playing God.

It's a bunch of mortal beings.

And they happen to be us.

Edit: I am not saying we should teach 'God' creating the universe in our science classes. But to just dismiss Intelligent Design is to be rather shallow and ignorant of what Intelligent Design is truly saying.

Hurray!

And people think Catholicism is backwards. Though, why'd anyone listen to heretic Protestants for anything is beyond me.:confused:

PS. the last part was a friendly snipe and not meant as an afront to anyone's religion. i just read too much Hellsing.:D

VATICAN CITY - The Vatican's chief astronomer said Friday that "intelligent design" isn't science and doesn't belong in science classrooms, the latest high-ranking Roman Catholic official to enter the evolution debate in the United States.

The Rev. George Coyne, the Jesuit director of the Vatican Observatory, said placing intelligent design theory alongside that of evolution in school programs was "wrong" and was akin to mixing apples with oranges.

"Intelligent design isn't science even though it pretends to be," the ANSA news agency quoted Coyne as saying on the sidelines of a conference in Florence. "If you want to teach it in schools, intelligent design should be taught when religion or cultural history is taught, not science."

My thoughts exactly.

Of course, Intelligent Design is taught circumspectly in any intermediate Biology class anyways. Have you ever done a fruit fly experiment? Intelligent Design at its best. We play God :)

Saying that Intelligent Design is not a science means that the person who said it has never really had any understanding of manipulating genes or done a biology science experiment. Humanity has been doing Intelligent Design ever since we could eat apples, strawberries, etc.

Wild strawberries are about the size of the average fingernail.

Grocery store strawberries are about the size of a big toe.

Seedless grapes anyone?

Tell me that's not a form of intelligent design and I'll kick your ass. However, this time, it's not an immortal being that's playing God.

It's a bunch of mortal beings.

And they happen to be us.

Edit: I am not saying we should teach 'God' creating the universe in our science classes. But to just dismiss Intelligent Design is to be rather shallow and ignorant of what Intelligent Design is truly saying.


Uh intelligent design is saying god paved the way for the evolution of HUMANS, not STRAWBERRIES. There's a big difference there in complexity.

VATICAN CITY - The Vatican's chief astronomer said Friday that "intelligent design" isn't science and doesn't belong in science classrooms, the latest high-ranking Roman Catholic official to enter the evolution debate in the United States.

The Rev. George Coyne, the Jesuit director of the Vatican Observatory, said placing intelligent design theory alongside that of evolution in school programs was "wrong" and was akin to mixing apples with oranges.

"Intelligent design isn't science even though it pretends to be," the ANSA news agency quoted Coyne as saying on the sidelines of a conference in Florence. "If you want to teach it in schools, intelligent design should be taught when religion or cultural history is taught, not science."


Couldn't agree more.

Uh intelligent design is saying god paved the way for the evolution of HUMANS, not STRAWBERRIES. There's a big difference there in complexity.

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:rolleyes:

Uh intelligent design is saying god paved the way for the evolution of HUMANS, not STRAWBERRIES. There's a big difference there in complexity.

Not really. The human genetic code is only so complex. Human scientists have already created their first bacterium. It'll only be a matter time before we can make creatures such as plants, then move up to animals. As I said, to just dismiss Intelligent Design is rather shallow and ignorant of the present human scientific state.

And whoever said it had to be 'God'. Why not the Xel'Naga?

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nuh uh

And whoever said it had to be 'God'. Why not the Xel'Naga?

Why not the Flying Spaghetti Monster with his noodly appendage?

Why not the Flying Spaghetti Monster with his noodly appendage?

Well, if the Flying Spaghetti Monster with his noddly appendage has the technology and/or the ability to create life, more power to it :)

Of course, Intelligent Design is taught circumspectly in any intermediate Biology class anyways. Have you ever done a fruit fly experiment? Intelligent Design at its best. We play God :)

Saying that Intelligent Design is not a science means that the person who said it has never really had any understanding of manipulating genes or done a biology science experiment. Humanity has been doing Intelligent Design ever since we could eat apples, strawberries, etc.

Wild strawberries are about the size of the average fingernail.

Grocery store strawberries are about the size of a big toe.

Seedless grapes anyone?

Tell me that's not a form of intelligent design and I'll kick your ass. However, this time, it's not an immortal being that's playing God.

It's a bunch of mortal beings.

And they happen to be us.

Edit: I am not saying we should teach 'God' creating the universe in our science classes. But to just dismiss Intelligent Design is to be rather shallow and ignorant of what Intelligent Design is truly saying.

Er, not really. Artificial pressures, such as genetic manipulations, count as the factors of selection in evolutionary theory. By contrast, 'Intelligent Design' claims at best that evolution was guided by a super-intelligence from the beginning, and at worst that this is 'proven' through things like the presence of flagella, which is purported to be irreducibly complex (well, not counting unabashed Young Earth Creationists). The former is purely a religious view and deserving of a mention in a philosophy or religious class, not a science class, and the latter is just plain wrong.

Your definition of Intelligent Design is pedantic hair-splitting- false hair-splitting at that, for (as I said) human pressures are included in standard evolutionary theory.

And whoever said it had to be 'God'. Why not the Xel'Naga?

To understand this, you must understand why I.D. was introduced to begin with. I.D. was introduced because Creationists(Christian Creationists to be exact) didn't get their way, adn couldn't have "God did it" taught in school. So, they revised "God" to "Intelligent Designer", and adding some fluff such as "Irreducibly complex" to make it sound all sciency. However, as I.D. is not science, practically by definition, it cannot be taught as such.

And this ruling does not surprise me in the least bit. The Catholic Church's stand, for several years, has been that the Bible does not infact support either Creationism or Evolution, and that both are possible. The Catholic Church actually works very closely with the Scientific community, in many fascets of it's structure. They are very thorough in their work. The Vatican doesn't just take the easy way out. Which is why I have a great deal of pride in my Catholic blood, although I am an agnost. But that's a bit off topic.

Uh intelligent design is saying god paved the way for the evolution of HUMANS, not STRAWBERRIES. There's a big difference there in complexity.

Joke's on you! Potaria is actually a giant Strawberry.

And whoever said it had to be 'God'. Why not the Xel'Naga?

Well then we ought get ready for the Zerg Swarm to come for our DNA.

*builds himself a BattleCruiser, accidentally triggers the Yamato Cannon and destroys New Jersey*

eh, no loss :D

And this ruling does not surprise me in the least bit. The Catholic Church's stand, for several years, has been that the Bible does not infact support either Creationism or Evolution, and that both are possible. The Catholic Church actually works very closely with the Scientific community, in many fascets of it's structure. They are very thorough in their work. The Vatican doesn't just take the easy way out. Which is why I have a great deal of pride in my Catholic blood, although I am an agnost. But that's a bit off topic.

Aye, in some regards, the Catholic Church seems to be growing more liberal by the day. This is a good thing. I guess they understand how stupid Galileo's arrest made them look, even though the real reason he was arrested was that he stealthily called the Pope a simpleton. Hurray for Vatican II!

Of course, Intelligent Design is taught circumspectly in any intermediate Biology class anyways. Have you ever done a fruit fly experiment? Intelligent Design at its best. We play God :)

Saying that Intelligent Design is not a science means that the person who said it has never really had any understanding of manipulating genes or done a biology science experiment. Humanity has been doing Intelligent Design ever since we could eat apples, strawberries, etc.

Wild strawberries are about the size of the average fingernail.

Grocery store strawberries are about the size of a big toe.

Seedless grapes anyone?

Tell me that's not a form of intelligent design and I'll kick your ass. However, this time, it's not an immortal being that's playing God.

It's a bunch of mortal beings.

And they happen to be us.

Edit: I am not saying we should teach 'God' creating the universe in our science classes. But to just dismiss Intelligent Design is to be rather shallow and ignorant of what Intelligent Design is truly saying.


Of course, the difference that you completely fail to note is that you are equating the fact that we CAN do gene manipulation to design new genuses with the theory of ID which states that this is the ONLY POSSIBLE explanation for the emergence of life on earth.

Big difference.

It's like saying that because we CAN specifically redirect a river by altering the landscape that all changes in river direction over time were caused by a deity doing just that with precise forethought.

Which just ain't sound science.

Which is the point that even the Vatican understands.