NationStates Jolt Archive

No it wasn't Dean. It was actually Lieberman. However, I guess he was to conservative for the Dems so they didn't nominate him :(

He actually believes in national Security and defense. The two things I look for in a leader.

I would've actually voted for Clark if they'd put him up. The thing that pissed me off was looking at the exit polls for why people chose the nominee they did, they had specific reasons for picking Lieberman, Clark, Dean, etc. The reaons for Kerry being chosen was predominantly, "I think he can beat Bush." Yeah, who cares what he stands for or if he stands for anything? All anyone should care about is victory. So lame. The Dems lost a lot of my respect in 2004.

Steph I'd vote for either the past or current VA governors were they in MO. At least they aren't the kooky left wing nuts like Schumer.

-_-...

YOU MISSED MY POINT COMPLETELY!

Sorry for yelling. But it's true. I was not advocating the Democrats! I was saying that I'm tired of people not analyzing the issues at hand and instead voting straight on the party line, and then you go on to plug a party! Switching blindly to one party is not going to solve America's problems, it is one of the causes of America's problems!

I did not miss your point. I decided your point wasn't valid.
Consider...

1971...Nixon...Republican...Recession
1982...Reagan...Republican...Recession
1991...Bush Sr...Republican...Recession
2001...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession
2005...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession still ongoing

1995-2000 Best economy in modern history!!...Bill Clinton...Democrat!

What's that say to you?

P.S. ON EDIT - if you were not working for an extended period of time, between 1995 and 2000, you had to be TRYING to not work!!

Nowadays, people are DESPERATE for work!

I would've actually voted for Clark if they'd put him up. The thing that pissed me off was looking at the exit polls for why people chose the nominee they did, they had specific reasons for picking Lieberman, Clark, Dean, etc. The reaons for Kerry being chosen was predominantly, "I think he can beat Bush." Yeah, who cares what he stands for or if he stands for anything? All anyone should care about is victory. So lame. The Dems lost a lot of my respect in 2004.

There are still lots of people out there who want nothing more than to stick it to Bush. Count me among them.
I can't wait until impeachment trials finally begin for that evil monster.

There are still lots of people out there who want nothing more than to stick it to Bush. Count me among them.
I can't wait until impeachment trials finally begin for that evil monster.

Umm... impeachment on the basis of what?

I did not miss your point. I decided your point wasn't valid.
Consider...

1971...Nixon...Republican...Recession
1982...Reagan...Republican...Recession
1991...Bush Sr...Republican...Recession
2001...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession
2005...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession still ongoing

1995-2000 Best economy in modern history!!...Bill Clinton...Democrat!

What's that say to you?

P.S. ON EDIT - if you were not working for an extended period of time, between 1995 and 2000, you had to be TRYING to not work!!

Nowadays, people are DESPERATE for work!

Damn, I could've sworn that the President wasnt solely responsible for the economy. But, I suppose I should go study economics again, I must've missed that chapter.

Once again, why does this have to be a damn party line? Talk about the REAL issues that caused the recession - not which party was in power at the time.

Damn, I could've sworn that the President wasnt solely responsible for the economy. But, I suppose I should go study economics again, I must've missed that chapter.

Once again, why does this have to be a damn party line? Talk about the REAL issues that caused the recession - not which party was in power at the time.

Not to mention the fact that 2005, we're not in a recession, nor is a recession ongoing at this time.

Lyric needs to read the papers once a year, at least.

Not to mention the fact that 2005, we're not in a recession, nor is a recession ongoing at this time.

Lyric needs to read the papers once a year, at least.


Ok, the first line was fine. The 2nd was a character attack and they need to stop.

See, the problem with character attacks is that instead of strengthening your stance or statement, they in fact erode it. It leads those who read it to see that you dont truly believe in your assertation enough so you must attack the other side in an attempt to discredit them through mud.

Ok, the first line was fine. The 2nd was a character attack and they need to stop.

See, the problem with character attacks is that instead of strengthening your stance or statement, they in fact erode it. It leads those who read it to see that you dont truly believe in your assertation enough so you must attack the other side in an attempt to discredit them through mud.

More like this then?

The economy in 2005 is not in a recession. Three straight quarters of growth in excess of 3 percent (3.8 percent in the 3rd quarter, despite Katrina).

http://www.bea.gov/bea/newsrelarchive/2005/gdp305a_fax.pdf

In fact, if you look at the graph, we came out of the recession in mid-2003.

I would've actually voted for Clark if they'd put him up. The thing that pissed me off was looking at the exit polls for why people chose the nominee they did, they had specific reasons for picking Lieberman, Clark, Dean, etc. The reaons for Kerry being chosen was predominantly, "I think he can beat Bush." Yeah, who cares what he stands for or if he stands for anything? All anyone should care about is victory. So lame. The Dems lost a lot of my respect in 2004.

Even nationally yea. The local governments are starting to reject the national leaders and listening to their local leaders. Even in some conservative places, it is conservative democrats are now starting to win.

If the national leaders of the Democratic Party aren't careful, they are going to lose the Conservative democrat vote on a national level.

2001...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession

This started before the election of 2000.

2005...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession still ongoing

It ended in 2001. Nice Try Lyric. You best go back and study more.

1995-2000 Best economy in modern history!!...Bill Clinton...Democrat!

And why did he have that? The Republicans took over Congress and cut spending. Again, nice try.

What's that say to you?

That you have no idea what the hell your talking about.

P.S. ON EDIT - if you were not working for an extended period of time, between 1995 and 2000, you had to be TRYING to not work!!

Now this is bull.

Nowadays, people are DESPERATE for work!

Then why is the job force growing in High Skills industry?

There are still lots of people out there who want nothing more than to stick it to Bush. Count me among them.
I can't wait until impeachment trials finally begin for that evil monster.

You'll be waiting forever because no impeachment will happen since Bush has done NOTHING impeachable.

Even nationally yea. The local governments are starting to reject the national leaders and listening to their local leaders. Even in some conservative places, it is conservative democrats are now starting to win.

If the national leaders of the Democratic Party aren't careful, they are going to lose the Conservative democrat vote on a national level.

Ahhh, seems as though people are finally starting to come around (albeit, they're still arguing party politics) to what I said back on page 3/4/5(?)

People are less concerned with the parties and more concerned with what they're going to do. Besides all that, people want less partisan politics (which is what this board generally devolves to) in Congress and more action. They're tired of seeing measures stalled by one side or the other simply because of the party that introduced it.

Ironically, the people that argue politics here and despise some of the actions taken by Congress to delay / defeat measures are hardly any less partisan.

Ahhh, seems as though people are finally starting to come around (albeit, they're still arguing party politics) to what I said back on page 3/4/5(?)

People are less concerned with the parties and more concerned with what they're going to do. Besides all that, people want less partisan politics (which is what this board generally devolves to) in Congress and more action. They're tired of seeing measures stalled by one side or the other simply because of the party that introduced it.

Ironically, the people that argue politics here and despise some of the actions taken by Congress to delay / defeat measures are hardly any less partisan.

In Illinois state politics, it's more of a North/South division w/ north of I-80 being almost exclusively "democrat" (more like Daleycrat as that's who controls them) and Dems & Repubs south of I-80 voting similarly on many issues.

I did not miss your point. I decided your point wasn't valid.
Consider...

1971...Nixon...Republican...Recession
1982...Reagan...Republican...Recession
1991...Bush Sr...Republican...Recession
2001...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession
2005...Bush Jr...Republican...Recession still ongoing

1995-2000 Best economy in modern history!!...Bill Clinton...Democrat!

What's that say to you?

P.S. ON EDIT - if you were not working for an extended period of time, between 1995 and 2000, you had to be TRYING to not work!!

Nowadays, people are DESPERATE for work!

Um, this is inaccurate. 1991 begain the best economy. This was when the internet was opened to commercial traffic, the even that was responsible for the beautiful economy of the 90's. I'm pretty sure Clinton was not yet President at the time. And I'm trying to think, does anyone know when they HUGE stock market blow-out was? When did the market drop out for dot-coms? The even the sparked the recent recession? Seems to me that happend during CLINTON'S PRESIDENCY. I don't like Bush Jr. or Sr., but let's be accurate. Clinton walking into a dream economy and left when it was dying on the side of the road.

Um, this is inaccurate. 1991 begain the best economy. This was when the internet was opened to commercial traffic, the even that was responsible for the beautiful economy of the 90's. I'm pretty sure Clinton was not yet President at the time.

Nope, Clinton was not president yet when the Economy started to expand.

And I'm trying to think, does anyone know when they HUGE stock market blow-out was?

It was in 2000 I believe.

When did the market drop out for dot-coms?

2000.

The even the sparked the recent recession? Seems to me that happend during CLINTON'S PRESIDENCY.

You sir/ma'am get a medal :)

I don't like Bush Jr. or Sr., but let's be accurate. Clinton walking into a dream economy and left when it was dying on the side of the road.

*applauds*

Ahhh, seems as though people are finally starting to come around (albeit, they're still arguing party politics) to what I said back on page 3/4/5(?)

People are less concerned with the parties and more concerned with what they're going to do. Besides all that, people want less partisan politics (which is what this board generally devolves to) in Congress and more action. They're tired of seeing measures stalled by one side or the other simply because of the party that introduced it.

Ironically, the people that argue politics here and despise some of the actions taken by Congress to delay / defeat measures are hardly any less partisan.

I hate it when people applaud posts, but I have to do it on this one. This is exactly what I've been arguing since I joined the board. The hyperbole of both sides has to stop. Lyric's post is an obvious example. It lays the economy on the shoulders of President which is simplifying our economy grotesquely and she created the dates to make them coincide with the Presidents she likes or dislikes, a common tactic by partisans on both sides. I'm so tired of partisan politics. I'm so tired of hearing about GWB choked on pretzel or Bill Clinton is arguing with his wife. I don't want to hear what a horrible person our President is. I want to hear about their politics. I want to hear what they are and are not doing.

Another example of partisan politics. Bill Clinton was painted as an advocate for civil rights for homosexuals and GWB the opposite. GWB is obviously and openly against homosexuality, but in looking at it they both threw homosexuals on the fire to warm up the religious right. DOMA, a clear violation of the US Constitution, anyone?

You sir/ma'am get a medal :)



*applauds*


Soooo, just a couple of posts back you were CREDITING the Republican's in Congress for the success of the economy during the clinton years.

Now you are applauding someone for pointing out that the economy in fact was taken from something good to something bad during this term.


Which, by your previous logic, should be taken to be the FAULT of the Republicans in Congress.


So, given that it is the Republican's fault - please explain to me why you continue to have faith in them?

They tried cutting spending and taxes, and by your own statement this had a detrimental effect on the economy. They have continued to control Congress and have since reversed course and started spending like drunken sailors and are now infighting on how much to screw over the poor people in an atempt to gain control of the deficit.

Seems to me that your Republicans are having one hell of a time getting it right over the past decade!

Soooo, just a couple of posts back you were CREDITING the Republican's in Congress for the success of the economy during the clinton years.

Spending was cut and saved us money to spend on things that were necessary.

Now you are applauding someone for pointing out that the economy in fact was taken from something good to something bad during this term.

I have never stated that Bill Clinton was responsible now did I? No I didn't. Also if you look back at my posts, you would see that I never applauded Bill Clinton either.

Which, by your previous logic, should be taken to be the FAULT of the Republicans in Congress.

The Republican's fault for what?

So, given that it is the Republican's fault - please explain to me why you continue to have faith in them?

Depends on what you are blaming them for.

They tried cutting spending and taxes, and by your own statement this had a detrimental effect on the economy.

They did cut spending which was necessary. They also cut taxes which was necessary as well.

They have continued to control Congress and have since reversed course and started spending like drunken sailors and are now infighting on how much to screw over the poor people in an atempt to gain control of the deficit.

And the Dems aren't doing anything about it so they are just as guilty about it as the Republicans.

Seems to me that your Republicans are having one hell of a time getting it right over the past decade!

The dems haven't done any better.

It was in 2000 I believe.

Oh, so close. 1999.

EDIT: Actually, I looked it up and it was officially March 11, 2000, I believe. However, having been a major stockholder/employee in a dot com that suffered when the bottom dropped out, I can assure you the bubble burst much sooner than that.

Oh, so close. 1999.

EDIT: Actually, I looked it up and it was officially March 11, 2000, I believe. However, having been a major stockholder/employee in a dot com that suffered when the bottom dropped out, I can assure you the bubble burst much sooner than that.

I'll take your word for it :)

I had it down between 1999 and 2000. I choose the wrong one. Thanks though :)

1995-2000 Best economy in modern history!!...Bill Clinton...Democrat!
Um, just as an aside, in order for clinton to not have a high growth rate with all of the new shit that came out in the nineties he would have had to raise taxes to the 70% range, put tariffs on almost everything, and outlawed the use of computers in business.

In Illinois state politics, it's more of a North/South division w/ north of I-80 being almost exclusively "democrat" (more like Daleycrat as that's who controls them) and Dems & Repubs south of I-80 voting similarly on many issues.

As a south of I-80 voter, I agree with you. I grew up just south of I-80 near Chicago Heights, in fact.

As a south of I-80 voter, I agree with you. I grew up just south of I-80 near Chicago Heights, in fact.

I'm originally from Evergreen Park, north of I-80 but now live near Charleston (south of Champaign)

In Illinois state politics, it's more of a North/South division w/ north of I-80 being almost exclusively "democrat" (more like Daleycrat as that's who controls them) and Dems & Repubs south of I-80 voting similarly on many issues.
Except for the north shore cities, Glencoe, Winnetka, etc.. etc... which tend to vote republican.

I'm originally from Evergreen Park, north of I-80 but now live near Charleston (south of Champaign)

Champaign is one of the places I live now (I do consulting so I travel a lot). The other is Sarasota, FL.

On point, I have found Chicago to be one of the most corrupt cities in the country.


Obviously, that's my opinion, and I'm not willing to support it with evidence because I do business with the state of Illinois and I'd be violating agreements. For the record, I realize that claiming I can support and won't does not validate my opinion in the least /disclaimer

Umm... impeachment on the basis of what?

For starters, how about LYING TO CONGRESS in order to get Congress to support a war of choice?
And what...and how soon, did Bush know about the outing of Valerie Plame?
Why has he yet failed to take action on this...he claimed anyone involved in leaking would be gone from his Admionistration, so why is Dick Cheney still around, and why is Karl Rove still around?

There is ample evidence to suggest that Bush KNEW the "intel" that led up to the war with Iraq was falsified. Yet, he continued to knowfully pass that "intel" on to Congress, and use it to justify a war with Iraq that has gotten over 2000 US servicepeople killed, thousands more maimed, and has so far pissed away about 600 billion dollars of our tax money, which could have been used to help AMERICANS.

That's just for starters.

At least when Clinton lied, no one fucking DIED.

Damn, I could've sworn that the President wasnt solely responsible for the economy. But, I suppose I should go study economics again, I must've missed that chapter.

Once again, why does this have to be a damn party line? Talk about the REAL issues that caused the recession - not which party was in power at the time.
The very AGENDA of Republicans is to create recessions. That way, their cronies in big business are able to shaft workers, by paying them less, because there are less jobs available.

This is a party line. The agenda of Republicans is very anti-worker, and very pro-big business.

Not to mention the fact that 2005, we're not in a recession, nor is a recession ongoing at this time.

Lyric needs to read the papers once a year, at least.

Aren't we? That's why jobs are so scarce? That's why more and more good-paying jobs are going away? That's why the consumer-confidence index is so high (sarcasm)

The unemployment numbers don't mean shit, because long-term unemployed people, like me, for example, are not counted as unemployed anymore, because we have run out our benefits, not because we have gotten JOBS.

And the numbers also fail to take into account the number of people who are under-employed.

The average household income has DECREASED in recent years.

Far as I am concerned, those ingredients add up to a recession, I give a FUCK what the lap-dog Corporate Media has to say about it! The corporate media has a vested interest in keeping the assholes currently in power...and so they are not very likely to report negative news about them.

More like this then?

The economy in 2005 is not in a recession. Three straight quarters of growth in excess of 3 percent (3.8 percent in the 3rd quarter, despite Katrina).

http://www.bea.gov/bea/newsrelarchive/2005/gdp305a_fax.pdf

In fact, if you look at the graph, we came out of the recession in mid-2003.

couldn't prove it by me. Where's MY fucking job, then?

Then why is the job force growing in High Skills industry?

Really? Where? Fucking PAKISTAN???

Um, this is inaccurate. 1991 begain the best economy. This was when the internet was opened to commercial traffic, the even that was responsible for the beautiful economy of the 90's. I'm pretty sure Clinton was not yet President at the time. And I'm trying to think, does anyone know when they HUGE stock market blow-out was? When did the market drop out for dot-coms? The even the sparked the recent recession? Seems to me that happend during CLINTON'S PRESIDENCY. I don't like Bush Jr. or Sr., but let's be accurate. Clinton walking into a dream economy and left when it was dying on the side of the road.

Oh, really? Is THAT why the redirect of the 1992 Presidential campaign was "It's the ECONOMY, stupid?"
Because the economy was so great? I think not!

I remember having one hell of a hard time finding work back then, too. Because the economy fucking stunk.

Soooo, just a couple of posts back you were CREDITING the Republican's in Congress for the success of the economy during the clinton years.

Now you are applauding someone for pointing out that the economy in fact was taken from something good to something bad during this term.


Which, by your previous logic, should be taken to be the FAULT of the Republicans in Congress.


So, given that it is the Republican's fault - please explain to me why you continue to have faith in them?

They tried cutting spending and taxes, and by your own statement this had a detrimental effect on the economy. They have continued to control Congress and have since reversed course and started spending like drunken sailors and are now infighting on how much to screw over the poor people in an atempt to gain control of the deficit.

Seems to me that your Republicans are having one hell of a time getting it right over the past decade!


Ah, but, see...they are just as partisan as I am...except that I will at least own up to MY partisanship!
See, when the economy does great, it isn't the Democratic President, it's the REPUBLICAN Congress.
When the economy turns to shit, it's CLINTON'S fault...not the fault of the REPUBLICAN congress.

See, they want to take all the credit for the good, and none of the blame for the bad. Read between the lines and you will see what I mean.

This is why partisan Republicans piss me off so badly!

It pisses me off more when I have to POINT THIS OUT before anyone notices the double-speak! glad I'm not the only one who notices, your post seems to indicate that, at the very least, YOU noticed it, too.

For starters, how about LYING TO CONGRESS in order to get Congress to support a war of choice?

Agreed, but does Congress count as under Oath legally? I sadly think it dies not: oh well. :(

At least when Clinton lied, no one fucking DIED.

Lots of Sperm probably died those nights he cheated. But than they have no rights so no worry :D

Spending was cut and saved us money to spend on things that were necessary.

Like what? Pouring 600 billion down the pisshole in Iraq? Making sure all Iraqi's have health insurance when 45 million AMERICANS don't? WTF??

And then, when they try and cut, who do they go for?? The needy, of course!!

They try to cut food stamps for people who are starving, so that the already-wealthy can have yet another fucking tax cut!

As a south of I-80 voter, I agree with you. I grew up just south of I-80 near Chicago Heights, in fact.

Shit. I grew up in Richton Park and Park Forest!

Agreed, but does Congress count as under Oath legally? I sadly think it dies not: oh well. :(

Lots of Sperm probably died those nights he cheated. But than they have no rights so no worry :D

Yeah, and lots of sperm die every night when millions of teenage boys and some grown men jerk off. Your point?

Yeah, and lots of sperm die every night when millions of teenage boys and some grown men jerk off. Your point?
That somethings did diue when Clinton lied, but they were largely un-important since sperm lack rights.

Who needs a point in a debate when on the forums? :p

Aren't we? That's why jobs are so scarce? That's why more and more good-paying jobs are going away? That's why the consumer-confidence index is so high (sarcasm)

Then why is the High Tech job markets hiring people? Why is the Economy Going up and not down? Why is our GDP going up? This isn't a recession Lyric.

Really? Where? Fucking PAKISTAN???

Nice!!!!

No Lyric! Those jobs are actually being created here in the United States. Manufacturing jobs are being shipped overseas.

Like what? Pouring 600 billion down the pisshole in Iraq? Making sure all Iraqi's have health insurance when 45 million AMERICANS don't? WTF??

We weren't IN Iraq During the Clinton years. Unless you know something I don't. Was there a secret invasion that wasn't broadcasted? The only operation against Iraq was in 1998 when Bill Clinton targeted Hussein Chem and Bio facilities.

Oh wait, I thought Hussein didn't have those.

And then, when they try and cut, who do they go for?? The needy, of course!!

Even Defense got their budget cut to you know.

Shit. I grew up in Richton Park and Park Forest!

No, you didn't! I'm a hill rat. Richton Hills just north of Sauk School about four houses down.

Aren't we? That's why jobs are so scarce? That's why more and more good-paying jobs are going away? That's why the consumer-confidence index is so high (sarcasm)

The unemployment numbers don't mean shit, because long-term unemployed people, like me, for example, are not counted as unemployed anymore, because we have run out our benefits, not because we have gotten JOBS.

And the numbers also fail to take into account the number of people who are under-employed.

The average household income has DECREASED in recent years.

Far as I am concerned, those ingredients add up to a recession, I give a FUCK what the lap-dog Corporate Media has to say about it! The corporate media has a vested interest in keeping the assholes currently in power...and so they are not very likely to report negative news about them.

Do you realize that the average familial income hasn't kept up with inflation for the last 30 years? Not under Clinton, not under Reagan, not under Carter, not under the Bushes. Republicans and Democrats are both screwing you, one of the parties is just better at making you like it.

Oh, really? Is THAT why the redirect of the 1992 Presidential campaign was "It's the ECONOMY, stupid?"
Because the economy was so great? I think not!

I remember having one hell of a hard time finding work back then, too. Because the economy fucking stunk.

Um, you do know that our economy is a HUGE entity that doesn't swing on a dime, yes? You know the commercial traffic of the internet drove the 90's economy and commercial traffic on the internet started in 1991. A brand new industry came around in that year under a Republican President (who frankly had little to do with it, but neither did Clinton). At first those jobs only affected the new industry, but as that industry grew it changed our entire economy and caused most business sectors to grow as the whole world got attached to this thing called the internet. Clinton had NOTHING to do with it. His policies could have required that everyone over five use dollars for toilet paper and it would have still been a great economy.

No, you didn't! I'm a hill rat. Richton Hills just north of Sauk School about four houses down.

Yes I did. Went to O.W. Huth Upper Grades Center in Matteson for junior high. Then we moved to Texas.
I lived on Ridgeway Ave. in Richton Park. In fact, you may even know the house. I grew up in the somewhat locally-famous haunted house...22811 Ridgeway.

The last block of Ridgeway before the dead end where we all used to take our bikes out on the track that we all built jump ramps on. Used to go sledding in wintertime at The Craters, if you remember that, too. That's what we all called it, anyway. It was way back from the main road, alongside the farmer's field there, you got to it along a path from the 22700 block of Ridgeway.

Hell, when I was a kid, I used to deliver newspapers in the Cedar Ridge Apartments, on Richton Square Road!

Convinced yet?

Yes I did. Went to O.W. Huth Upper Grades Center in Matteson for junior high. Then we moved to Texas.
I lived on Ridgeway Ave. in Richton Park. In fact, you may even know the house. I grew up in the somewhat locally-famous haunted house...22811 Ridgeway.

The last block of Ridgeway before the dead end where we all used to take our bikes out on the track that we all built jump ramps on. Used to go sledding in wintertime at The Craters, if you remember that, too. That's what we all called it, anyway. It was way back from the main road, alongside the farmer's field there, you got to it along a path from the 22700 block of Ridgeway.

Hell, when I was a kid, I used to deliver newspapers in the Cedar Ridge Apartments, on Richton Square Road!

Convinced yet?
Oh, I believed you, I was just surprised. I went to huth as well (a couple years after you I think, I'm 31) and Sauk school and Rich South. Hillsrats didn't usually swing out to the Square if we could help it (as you know, we were blocked in by major highways on three sides and tended not to cross them), but I used to run over there a lot because I had some friends that lived in the apartment complexes there. The funny part is those are the only parts of Richton Park I ever really saw until I hit high school. I didn't know there was a rich part of town until I was 14. I just assumed all of RP was as poor as we were.

Small world. You know, Lyric, it's amazing how much we have in common.

Nice!!!!

No Lyric! Those jobs are actually being created here in the United States. Manufacturing jobs are being shipped overseas.

You see, that's actually a really bad thing. When poor people lose their jobs, they become unemployed, and as every revolutionary throughout history has demonstrated, unemployment breeds very angry thoughts.

The ruling class must be nice to its subjects or risk being overthrown.

Oh, I believed you, I was just surprised. I went to huth as well (a couple years after you I think, I'm 31) and Sauk school and Rich South. Hillsrats didn't usually swing out to the Square if we could help it (as you know, we were blocked in by major highways on three sides and tended not to cross them), but I used to run over there a lot because I had some friends that lived in the apartment complexes there. The funny part is those are the only parts of Richton Park I ever really saw until I hit high school. I didn't know there was a rich part of town until I was 14. I just assumed all of RP was as poor as we were.

Small world. You know, Lyric, it's amazing how much we have in common.

LOL. Amazingly small world. My brother briefly went to Rich South, too. i never did, because we ended up moving to Texas in the middle of my junior high, eighth grade. I ended up staying behind and living with my grandma, to finish my school year in Illinois, fearing that the Texas system might be different, and, as a result, I might end up getting held back.

I knew about the rich part of town, but that wasn't where I lived. At least, I never thought of where we lived as "rich." That was the part over near Country Club Hills and Olympia Fields. We lived such that Park Forest was literally just beyond our back fence...and we were fairly close to Crete. I remember riding bikes to the miniature golf course there in Crete in the summertime.

And, being as I'm 34...we probably just missed each other at Huth. for elementary school, I started out at richton Square School...then they closed it, and I ended up at Indiana School...then Illinois School starting in 4th Grade. I still remember the principal there, Mr. Fifer. His wife had been a teacher at Indiana. I liked Mrs. Fifer, but Mr. Fifer was a first-class butthole!

Funny thing is...you may very well have known either me or my brother as we were growing up. Or, if you did know one, likely, you knew us both! I'm totally curious now...if it just might be possible that we may even have been childhood friends!

You see, that's actually a really bad thing. When poor people lose their jobs, they become unemployed, and as every revolutionary throughout history has demonstrated, unemployment breeds very angry thoughts.

The ruling class must be nice to its subjects or risk being overthrown.


Precisely. And I am VERY ANGRY, in case no one has noticed. And I'm not alone. Lots of others are very angry, too. will I start a revolution? Nope. But if one starts, bet your ass I'll join in!

"If there's a better way
I'll be the first in line
Bet it better work this time!!"
- excerpt from "Peace Sells" by Megadeth

And you are quite correct....this ruling class has UTTERLY FAILED to be anything even RESEMBLING "nice" to it's poor citizens! And that is why we're pissed.

You see, that's actually a really bad thing. When poor people lose their jobs, they become unemployed, and as every revolutionary throughout history has demonstrated, unemployment breeds very angry thoughts.

The ruling class must be nice to its subjects or risk being overthrown.

But you know what else I find amuzing? Manufacturing has actually gone up :D

Not only are we outsourcing but we also have seen an increase in manufacturing.

Intresting thing. It's of my own opinion that America is going to change into a Consumer Economy Similar to the UK, however, this [i]isn't going to happen overnight, yes stuff is being outsourced to China and the Far East in General.

However, The PRC doesn't quite have all the specialist machinery that the USA, and the EU does have [hence an increase in some manufacturing industries this side of the pond too for specialist parts in various things], so manufacturing in these sectors have gone up quite considerably as we make the special parts to slot into something that a Chinese-based industry made.

Another industry that has recently exploded is the scrap metal industry, the PRC is very big on forms of recycling [hard to beleive?] The PRC is buying Scrap metal, parts that they can melt down and re-forge, aswell as incredible amounts of Oil as they go from Coal firing to Oil firing in alot of their industries, this also explains the "justified" high oil prices. OPEC is pumping more barrels of oil per year than ever, China is also buying more oil than ever, thus leaving some strange sort of balance in the world.

Anyway Lyric, my advise to you for a job is check out the labour exchange, the newspapers, or failing that, start up your own junk yard and start shipping to China!

LOL. Amazingly small world. My brother briefly went to Rich South, too. i never did, because we ended up moving to Texas in the middle of my junior high, eighth grade. I ended up staying behind and living with my grandma, to finish my school year in Illinois, fearing that the Texas system might be different, and, as a result, I might end up getting held back.

I knew about the rich part of town, but that wasn't where I lived. At least, I never thought of where we lived as "rich." That was the part over near Country Club Hills and Olympia Fields. We lived such that Park Forest was literally just beyond our back fence...and we were fairly close to Crete. I remember riding bikes to the miniature golf course there in Crete in the summertime.

And, being as I'm 34...we probably just missed each other at Huth. for elementary school, I started out at richton Square School...then they closed it, and I ended up at Indiana School...then Illinois School starting in 4th Grade. I still remember the principal there, Mr. Fifer. His wife had been a teacher at Indiana. I liked Mrs. Fifer, but Mr. Fifer was a first-class butthole!

Funny thing is...you may very well have known either me or my brother as we were growing up. Or, if you did know one, likely, you knew us both! I'm totally curious now...if it just might be possible that we may even have been childhood friends!

Maybe. Or you might have known my brother, Brian, who is 35 right now, and was very popular back then.

Send me a telegram.

Sidenote: I had Mrs. Thompson for Kindergarten (her husband was a gym teacher at Huth) and so did my nephew twenty years later (not really a coincidence since my nephew was living in the same house).

Precisely. And I am VERY ANGRY, in case no one has noticed. And I'm not alone. Lots of others are very angry, too. will I start a revolution? Nope. But if one starts, bet your ass I'll join in!

"If there's a better way
I'll be the first in line
Bet it better work this time!!"
- excerpt from "Peace Sells" by Megadeth

And you are quite correct....this ruling class has UTTERLY FAILED to be anything even RESEMBLING "nice" to it's poor citizens! And that is why we're pissed.

I agree, but don't forget who the ruling class is and who represents them. Last I checked Democrats and Republicans are ALL rich, usually white, usually members of big business (Heinz Ketchup, Halliburton), etc. Democrats act like they are for the people but they are just as bad. Like I said, the average familial income has not kept up with inflation for thirty years under any president during that time. That's a scary fact. The familal salaries of the top 5% have exceeded inflation however. That means every one else's salary has to be lower in order for the mean income to increase slower than inflation.

I agree, but don't forget who the ruling class is and who represents them. Last I checked Democrats and Republicans are ALL rich, usually white, usually members of big business (Heinz Ketchup, Halliburton), etc. Democrats act like they are for the people but they are just as bad. Like I said, the average familial income has not kept up with inflation for thirty years under any president during that time. That's a scary fact. The familal salaries of the top 5% have exceeded inflation however. That means every one else's salary has to be lower in order for the mean income to increase slower than inflation.


Agreed. But it is, at least, LESS BAD under the Dems than it is under the Reps.

Mind if I bookmark this to shove in the face of guys like Corny, when they claim things are all hunky-dory, and they deny things like the fact that familial income is not keeping up with inflation whereas fat-cat asswipe CEO's are making way too much?

Maybe. Or you might have known my brother, Brian, who is 35 right now, and was very popular back then.

Send me a telegram.

Sidenote: I had Mrs. Thompson for Kindergarten (her husband was a gym teacher at Huth) and so did my nephew twenty years later (not really a coincidence since my nephew was living in the same house).

Unsure. I knew a Brian, back then, but might not be the same guy.
How about we continue this part of the thread private, as we may end up exchanging some personal info best not shared in the whole Forum?

Agreed. But it is, at least, LESS BAD under the Dems than it is under the Reps.

Mind if I bookmark this to shove in the face of guys like Corny, when they claim things are all hunky-dory, and they deny things like the fact that familial income is not keeping up with inflation whereas fat-cat asswipe CEO's are making way too much?

Shove what in my face? That the economy is actually firing on all cylinders? That is a fact. That jobs are being created? Another fact.

Don't tell me about familial income. My parents have to live off of military pay for over 20 years. There were times when we have to live paycheck to paycheck because of their screwups. There was a time when we were literally on fumes. We hardly had any money because we weren't getting paid because of a government shut down. We barely scraped enough money together to buy food. Yea that's right. We almost didn't have enough money to buy food. The military sure as hell ain't gettin paid enough. At least our pay has been better under reps than under dems.

Shove what in my face? That the economy is actually firing on all cylinders? That is a fact. That jobs are being created? Another fact.

You exaggerate and it doesn't help your point. An economy 'firing on all cylinders' would have jobs being created in every sector, something you admitted is not true. Your hyperbole aside, the economy is not in recession but it is certainly not impressive.

Don't tell me about familial income. My parents have to live off of military pay for over 20 years. There were times when we have to live paycheck to paycheck because of their screwups. There was a time when we were literally on fumes. We hardly had any money because we weren't getting paid because of a government shut down. We barely scraped enough money together to buy food. Yea that's right. We almost didn't have enough money to buy food. The military sure as hell ain't gettin paid enough. At least our pay has been better under reps than under dems.

You actually accentuate the point. Military pay is actually better than most familial incomes and has increased a lot more than the average familial income in the last 30 years.

Both my parents worked at professional jobs and we spent several years where we barely had enough money to buy food, so I'm not crying in my beer for you. Military families have free health care, free housing, and lots of support for almost every type of service a familiy needs. I was in the Marine Corps so you're going to have to sell that elsewhere.

You had to deal with very short times of government instability. The average family has been getting screwed for 30 years by both parties.

You exaggerate and it doesn't help your point. An economy 'firing on all cylinders' would have jobs being created in every sector, something you admitted is not true. Your hyperbole aside, the economy is not in recession but it is certainly not impressive.



You actually accentuate the point. Military pay is actually better than most familial incomes and has increased a lot more than the average familial income in the last 30 years.

Both my parents worked at professional jobs and we spent several years where we barely had enough money to buy food, so I'm not crying in my beer for you. Military families have free health care, free housing, and lots of support for almost every type of service a familiy needs. I was in the Marine Corps so you're going to have to sell that elsewhere.

You had to deal with very short times of government instability. The average family has been getting screwed for 30 years by both parties.

Free healthcare is only a benefit if you injure yourself. Up until this fall when I started seeing a doctor for my knee problems, that "benefit" was hardly a benefit. As for free housing, that's only if you live in the dorms, or have a family and live on-base. Neither of which are an option for me, so, I have to pay rent. Yes, I recieve BAH, but where I live, BAH hardly covers a DECENT apartment. DoD does not base BAH on decent apartment costs, they base BAH on what the average off-base resident pays in rent. Thus, if all the off-base residents can afford is crappy apartments, all BAH will ever cover is those same crappy apartments.

Someone in my job in the civilian sector with 5yrs experience would be making at least $20-30K a year more than I currently make, and I'm paid enough for working 60-80hr weeks and holidays without overtime or bonuses? Not to mention being on-call 24/7...

Free healthcare is only a benefit if you injure yourself. Up until this fall when I started seeing a doctor for my knee problems, that "benefit" was hardly a benefit. As for free housing, that's only if you live in the dorms, or have a family and live on-base. Neither of which are an option for me, so, I have to pay rent. Yes, I recieve BAH, but where I live, BAH hardly covers a DECENT apartment. DoD does not base BAH on decent apartment costs, they base BAH on what the average off-base resident pays in rent. Thus, if all the off-base residents can afford is crappy apartments, all BAH will ever cover is those same crappy apartments.

Someone in my job in the civilian sector with 5yrs experience would be making at least $20-30K a year more than I currently make, and I'm paid enough for working 60-80hr weeks and holidays without overtime or bonuses? Not to mention being on-call 24/7...

More proof that the military pay needs to be raised as well as military benefits.

Shove what in my face? That the economy is actually firing on all cylinders? That is a fact. That jobs are being created? Another fact.

Don't tell me about familial income. My parents have to live off of military pay for over 20 years. There were times when we have to live paycheck to paycheck because of their screwups. There was a time when we were literally on fumes. We hardly had any money because we weren't getting paid because of a government shut down. We barely scraped enough money together to buy food. Yea that's right. We almost didn't have enough money to buy food. The military sure as hell ain't gettin paid enough. At least our pay has been better under reps than under dems.


Well, MINE sure as shit hasn't!
which is one of the myriad of reasons I have for hating Republicans.
The others are largely social-issues things, as you might well imagine. The Republicans have all but declared themselves my enemy, and they, on social issues, stand against everything I'm FOR...and for everything I'm AGAINST. How could I NOT hate them?

You exaggerate and it doesn't help your point. An economy 'firing on all cylinders' would have jobs being created in every sector, something you admitted is not true. Your hyperbole aside, the economy is not in recession but it is certainly not impressive.



You actually accentuate the point. Military pay is actually better than most familial incomes and has increased a lot more than the average familial income in the last 30 years.

Both my parents worked at professional jobs and we spent several years where we barely had enough money to buy food, so I'm not crying in my beer for you. Military families have free health care, free housing, and lots of support for almost every type of service a familiy needs. I was in the Marine Corps so you're going to have to sell that elsewhere.

You had to deal with very short times of government instability. The average family has been getting screwed for 30 years by both parties.


Thank you. My points exactly. military families sure as shit never had to worry about not getting health care. They never had to worry about not having housing. Maybe it wasn't always the greatest, but they never had to worry about not having a roof over their head...or not being able to see a doctor when they are sick. sorry, but I, too, have little sympathy for the military on this point.

More proof that the military pay needs to be raised as well as military benefits.

how much MORE do you guys want while your fellow Americans are fucking starving and homeless?

I'd be one of 'em, if not for my mom. And you wouldn't give a rat's ass, either.

You'd see them take the food out of my mouth, or the mouth of some other poor person, just to give you more.

Well, MINE sure as shit hasn't!
which is one of the myriad of reasons I have for hating Republicans.
The others are largely social-issues things, as you might well imagine. The Republicans have all but declared themselves my enemy, and they, on social issues, stand against everything I'm FOR...and for everything I'm AGAINST. How could I NOT hate them?

Hate is such a strong word. Hate actually goes against christian teachings. The bible says to love thy enemies.

They haven't declared themselves your enemy. It is only in your mind. They don't all stand against what you believe. Some do some dont. You should never group ALL republicans in one light. Just like I shouldn't group ALL dems in one light.

Thank you. My points exactly. military families sure as shit never had to worry about not getting health care. They never had to worry about not having housing. Maybe it wasn't always the greatest, but they never had to worry about not having a roof over their head...or not being able to see a doctor when they are sick. sorry, but I, too, have little sympathy for the military on this point.

Up until the last few years, Military members were expected to foot something of up to 25% of their housing costs out of their pocket and depending on which healthcare plan their family members are enrolled in, there are co-pays.

Remember, base pay isnt all that great to begin with. I make approx $30k a year...barely enough to pay the bills. I'm fortunate that I've owned my truck long enough for it to be paid off or I'd really be broke. Job security isnt there for me either, I can give you a list of people that have been 'kicked' out of the military within the past year or so because their enlistments were up and the AF wouldnt let them reenlist because of 'overmanning.'

Before you start saying the Military has it made in this 'recession' economy, get the facts from military members.

how much MORE do you guys want while your fellow Americans are fucking starving and homeless?

Enough where I don't have to worry about living paycheck to paycheck. You think you have it tough? We have to put up with shit from Congress. It is the Congress that gives us pay raises and cuts or nothing at all.

I'd be one of 'em, if not for my mom. And you wouldn't give a rat's ass, either.

You sure about that? I don't want to see anyone homeless. I do my best to help the homeless.

You'd see them take the food out of my mouth, or the mouth of some other poor person, just to give you more.

This is so very childish, it doesn't deserve the response it was going to get.

Up until the last few years, Military members were expected to foot something of up to 25% of their housing costs out of their pocket and depending on which healthcare plan their family members are enrolled in, there are co-pays.

Remember, base pay isnt all that great to begin with. I make approx $30k a year...barely enough to pay the bills. I'm fortunate that I've owned my truck long enough for it to be paid off or I'd really be broke. Job security isnt there for me either, I can give you a list of people that have been 'kicked' out of the military within the past year or so because their enlistments were up and the AF wouldnt let them reenlist because of 'overmanning.'

Before you start saying the Military has it made in this 'recession' economy, get the facts from military members.

Well said Neutered Sputniks. I couldn't have put it better. Thank you for telling the truth!

Why don't you ask Senator Chuck Schumer why he thinks that being vocal about believing in God is a bad thing?
I dont know why he thinks such but I personaly think would not be the best of things to broadcast ... personaly I like to know my polliticians are making decisions based on facts and provable cost/benifit weighing then because of whatever fiction he or she has a belief in

You sure about that? I don't want to see anyone homeless. I do my best to help the homeless.

Yes, I am quite sure of it. I haven't even had a TEMP job now in the last six and a half months. And what's left currently in my bank account would not have covered six and a half month's rent anywhere.

so, yeah, if not for my mom, I'd be out on the street and starving, and I doubt you or any other Republican would give a rat's ass about it, either.

You'd just drive right by me in your Lexus and act like you didn't see me.

You Republicans are all the same. Heartless, soulless people who care not for the less-fortunate.

P.S. And before you go off all foaming at the mouth over that last statement, I can say, with all honesty, I never saw a cut to programs for needy people that Republicans didn't like!

and I never saw a tax cut for the already-wealthy that Republicans didn't like.

And I never saw an increase in military spending that Republicans didn't like.

Well said Neutered Sputniks. I couldn't have put it better. Thank you for telling the truth!

Jeez, if I made 30K a year, and had to foot only 25% of my housing bill, and had to only make co-pays on my health bills, I'd have it made!

What's YOUR problem?

Hell, I've never made more than 25K a year in my entire life, except one year when I had a windfall from a lawsuit, and made just over $40K that year.

Most years, I make less than 20K.

And, until recently, I paid ONE HUNDRED PERCENT of my housing bill...and had co-pays on my health bills too.

Now, of course, I don't even have health insurance at all, much less a job, and I have shit for income...in fact, this year, I may even qualify for the EIC, which is a new low for me!

In fact, this year, I have already suffered thru two chronic ear infections with no medicine, because I could not afford to go see a doctor, and, because of that, the infections lasted weeks, and I have partially lost my hearing. Isn't America WONDERFUL?!!?

And I never saw an increase in military spending that Republicans didn't like.
Their pleasure there is twofold: it helps the bottom line of the arms & munitions firms they are shareholders in; it also shunts a continuous stream of young, fiscally disadvantaged Americans into service. And Republicans do so very much love the whole idea of service - provided they are the ones being served.

Their pleasure there is twofold: it helps the bottom line of the arms & munitions firms they are shareholders in; it also shunts a continuous stream of young, fiscally disadvantaged Americans into service. And Republicans do so very much love the whole idea of service - provided they are the ones being served.

BING BING BING BING BING!!

What kind of cigar did you want, Dobbs?

BING BING BING BING BING!!

What kind of cigar did you want, Dobbs?
Cubans burn best. Of course, I could just run to the corner store and get one...

Heh.

Hell, I've never made more than 25K a year in my entire life, except one year when I had a windfall from a lawsuit, and made just over $40K that year.

Most years, I make less than 20K.

And, until recently, I paid ONE HUNDRED PERCENT of my housing bill...and had co-pays on my health bills too.

Now, of course, I don't even have health insurance at all, much less a job, and I have shit for income...in fact, this year, I may even qualify for the EIC, which is a new low for me!

In fact, this year, I have already suffered thru two chronic ear infections with no medicine, because I could not afford to go see a doctor, and, because of that, the infections lasted weeks, and I have partially lost my hearing. Isn't America WONDERFUL?!!?
Oh boohoo. Should have worked harder. Life sucks, deal with it.

Oh boohoo. Should have worked harder. Life sucks, deal with it.
That's an awful attitude. If you'd lost your legs under a bus, d'you think I'd say, "Oh boohoo. Should've looked both ways crossing the street"?

Life doesn't have to suck. Deal with that.

That's an awful attitude. If you'd lost your legs under a bus, d'you think I'd say, "Oh boohoo. Should've looked both ways crossing the street"?
Actually I would. I take responsibility for my actions. I know I am not entitled to anything, even my legs.
Life doesn't have to suck. Deal with that.
What planet do you live on? One without natural selection? Life sucking is what makes everything function, so it can adapt to the sucking.

This is a ridiculous showcase of why people always get pissy with the Republicans.

Actually I would. I take responsibility for my actions. I know I am not entitled to anything, even my legs.

And speaking of ridiculous...:rolleyes:

Jeez, if I made 30K a year, and had to foot only 25% of my housing bill, and had to only make co-pays on my health bills, I'd have it made!

What's YOUR problem?

Hell, I've never made more than 25K a year in my entire life, except one year when I had a windfall from a lawsuit, and made just over $40K that year.

Most years, I make less than 20K.

And, until recently, I paid ONE HUNDRED PERCENT of my housing bill...and had co-pays on my health bills too.

Now, of course, I don't even have health insurance at all, much less a job, and I have shit for income...in fact, this year, I may even qualify for the EIC, which is a new low for me!

In fact, this year, I have already suffered thru two chronic ear infections with no medicine, because I could not afford to go see a doctor, and, because of that, the infections lasted weeks, and I have partially lost my hearing. Isn't America WONDERFUL?!!?

Woah, I dont think you understand. I suppose I should clarify. I make $30k a year including my housing and food allowances.

Anyone ever tried feeding a family on $200 a month? It's not easy.

BAH only covered 75% of housing costs - not including cable and internet as those are extras - up until a few years ago when Congress finally forced it to increase to 100%. And once again, that's depending on where you live. If I lived in a crap apartment, I'm sure I'd have my costs covered. As is, I live in a DECENT apartment and still foot an extra $100-150 every month on basic living expenses.

As I stated before, if not for my truck being paid off, I'd be living paycheck to paycheck (barely) as most military members do. Do you realize most military families qualify for some kind of 'welfare'?

BTW, if the Military paid so well, why havent you reenlisted?

As for your generalizations of Republicans, what makes you think all the rich, fat Democrats out there give every bum on the streets a second look? Lets look at this realistically...there are poor Republicans just the same as there are poor Democrats and there are rich Democrats just as much as there are rich Republicans. Stop making distinctions based on wild partisan bullshit and maybe a real discussion could ensue (goes for both sides).

Oh boohoo. Should have worked harder. Life sucks, deal with it.
I'd be GLAD to work harder...IF THERE WERE ANY FUCKING JOBS TO BE HAD, WHICH THERE AREN'T, BECAUSE I HAVEN'T FOUND ONE!!

Do you honestly suggest that, just because someone has a long string of bad louck that the price they should pay for that is their HEARING...when it doesn't have to BE that way?

BTW, if the Military paid so well, why havent you reenlisted?

As for your generalizations of Republicans, what makes you think all the rich, fat Democrats out there give every bum on the streets a second look? Lets look at this realistically...there are poor Republicans just the same as there are poor Democrats and there are rich Democrats just as much as there are rich Republicans. Stop making distinctions based on wild partisan bullshit and maybe a real discussion could ensue (goes for both sides).

Bzzzt. Wrong. there ARE no poor Republicans. Poor people don't vote for Republicans, because we know they are out to screw us even worse than we already are. so we vote for the lesser of two evils, and for us, that means, we vote for Democrats.

As to your question about the military, no fucking way would I enlist in the first place, let alone RE-enlist!

Shit, I'd be more afraid of OUR guys than the enemy, being as I am a transsexual, I'd be afraid that some of our less-than-tolerant military boys would fucking have me FRAGGED!!

I'd sincerely be more afraid of our guys...and being "accidentally" killed in "friendly" fire. Let's face it, a lot of our military is not exactly very liberal. And it would be far from the first GLBT military member who got fragged, or got "accidentally" killed in "friendly" fire, and you know I'm right!

I'd fucking be scared to DEATH to be in the military, being as I am who I am. I think OUR side would be more likely to kill me than the enemy would!

and, yes, I truly DO believe that.

And for those who would foam at the mouth over that statement, I say to you "PFC Barry Winchell." Look him up sometime.

I'd be GLAD to work harder...IF THERE WERE ANY FUCKING JOBS TO BE HAD, WHICH THERE AREN'T, BECAUSE I HAVEN'T FOUND ONE!!
Perhaps that is a statement of your ability and intelligence, not of the job market?
There are always ways to supplement your income. Dress up as a bum, go out on the street and sell oranges and ask for handouts.
Do you honestly suggest that, just because someone has a long string of bad louck that the price they should pay for that is their HEARING...when it doesn't have to BE that way?
If they must encroach upon the earnings of other against their will, yes.

Bzzzt. Wrong. there ARE no poor Republicans. Poor people don't vote for Republicans, because we know they are out to screw us even worse than we already are. so we vote for the lesser of two evils, and for us, that means, we vote for Democrats.
I personally know poor white trash who vote Republican because they hate gays.

Perhaps that is a statement of your ability and intelligence, not of the job market?
There are always ways to supplement your income. Dress up as a bum, go out on the street and sell oranges and ask for handouts.

If they must encroach upon the earnings of other against their will, yes.
That's one nasty damn lifestyle you're promulgating. Thanks for reminding me why I never tried getting a green card. Believe it or not, your POV is very much in the minority in a number of other western democracies. Not non-existant... just marginal, as it ought to be.

I personally know poor white trash who vote Republican because they hate gays.
Who - the pobuckers or the GOP?

That's one nasty damn lifestyle you're promulgating. Thanks for reminding me why I never tried getting a green card. Believe it or not, your POV is very much in the minority in a number of other western democracies. Not non-existant... just marginal, as it ought to be.
I'm a minority in the US as well, unfortunately. The vast majority of Republicans (including our president) actually do support limited welfare, emotionalist simpletons.
Who - the pobuckers or the GOP?
The white trash, of course.
It is politically inexpedient for a politician to hate anyone but the US’s current foreign enemy.

Bzzzt. Wrong. there ARE no poor Republicans. Poor people don't vote for Republicans, because we know they are out to screw us even worse than we already are. so we vote for the lesser of two evils, and for us, that means, we vote for Democrats.

As to your question about the military, no fucking way would I enlist in the first place, let alone RE-enlist!

Shit, I'd be more afraid of OUR guys than the enemy, being as I am a transsexual, I'd be afraid that some of our less-than-tolerant military boys would fucking have me FRAGGED!!

I'd sincerely be more afraid of our guys...and being "accidentally" killed in "friendly" fire. Let's face it, a lot of our military is not exactly very liberal. And it would be far from the first GLBT military member who got fragged, or got "accidentally" killed in "friendly" fire, and you know I'm right!

I'd fucking be scared to DEATH to be in the military, being as I am who I am. I think OUR side would be more likely to kill me than the enemy would!

and, yes, I truly DO believe that.

And for those who would foam at the mouth over that statement, I say to you "PFC Barry Winchell." Look him up sometime.


Easy there killer. No one is attacking YOU, I'm suggesting a change in our rhetoric would be conducive to this discussion.

All I'm saying is that you overestimate what the Military is paid. Very few other jobs deal with putting your life on hold at any time, day or night - much less putting your life on the line in the same manner.



Before you say there are no poor Republicans, please PLEASE fucking PLEASE think about what you're saying. You wouldnt know every Republican out there, how would you know if they're all rich? My Republican friends sure as hell are no better off than the Democrats I know. In fact, I know more rich Democrats than rich Republicans.

While I empathize with your plight, getting worked up before every post is hardly the way to make friends and influence people. If you can show me undeniable proof that all poor people vote a straight democrat party ticket, I'll shut up and leave this thread. Until then, please remember that all you're doing is spitting party-line rhetoric in a manner that is most definately not conducive to debate.

If you wish to debate, then debate. If you want to fly off the handle at every opportunity, then expect it in return.

Party-line rhetoric gets us no closer to finding a solution for the problem - look at our current Congress. They cant get shit done because everyone's so worried about party lines. WHO GIVES A FUCK WHICH PARTY IT IS, the problem is that there are poor people. What do we do about it?

A big thanks to various voters around that country to the south for giving me the gift of acknowledgement that people are finally waking up and smelling the coffee. Virginia run by a Dem? Unheard of! And the good citizens of Dover chucking out all but one of the school board members that tried to stick their kids with theology in the science classroom. That was a thing of beauty. The court case is now thankfully irrelevant, but it also did a wonderful job of showcasing just how ridiculous the ID movement is.

Arnie with egg on his face?


Well, let us just start calling him the one-term-inator. And to think that when he was first elected some people started talking about a Constitutional Amendment so that he could have a crack at running for the White House.

He still can.

Janitorial positions in Washington ARE elected are they not? :D

All I know is that a lot of GOP members must have been hanging out in bars consoling each other last night, having to firmly acknowledge that the tide is shifted. the people can cherry pick policies to agree with or not and still follow a party out of loyalty, but when the public trust gets broken it takes a while to get that back. And frankly, the trust IS circling the drain - along with much of the loyalty.

Arnie future I think relies also on the success of GWB at rebuilding the economy - if the national economy isnt' going well, Californias won't, and if that doesn't work well, then California will be right back at the start wit the fiscal issues it faced under Grey.

The problem is, Californians want all the services but pay hardly any tax - it just doesn't add up; if you want the services, you must pay the tax, its as simple as that; and it doesn't matter how much dancing the terminator does, one can't avoid the simple the economic realities there are.

1. Perhaps that is a statement of your ability and intelligence, not of the job market?
2. There are always ways to supplement your income. Dress up as a bum, go out on the street and sell oranges and ask for handouts.

3. If they must encroach upon the earnings of other against their will, yes.

1. I take that as a personal assault and flame. How DARE you suggest that 15 years of professional office experience leaves me in some way unqualified for work? You don't KNOW what my skills are!

2. First you have to buy the oranges. Wouldn't work in my area, anyway, as I live rural, not in a big city. Which is part of the problem I am having finding suitable work. Unfortunately, this is where my mom lives, and, as I have no other choice, financially, at this time, I have to deal with this.

3. Just as I suspected. You are a cold, heartless, selfish, rotten person who would see someone else suffer while you have more than enough. You are greedy, you are sick, you are selfish, and I have no further use for you. Enjoy your ride on my Ignore list.

I personally know poor white trash who vote Republican because they hate gays.

Yeah, and they are really stupid, bigoted bastards! They'd cut their own nose off to spite their face. They will vote against their own economic self-interest, just to act out their hatred against gays. Please tell me...in what way does it negatively impact anyone to give gays the same legal standing in their relationships that heteros enjoy without question?

No one is saying that a church should be forced to recognize or perform ceremonies that they object to. If they object to the relationship, I can safely assume gay people would not want to go to that church, anyway.

Why can't some people get the fuck over themselves?

That's one nasty damn lifestyle you're promulgating. Thanks for reminding me why I never tried getting a green card. Believe it or not, your POV is very much in the minority in a number of other western democracies. Not non-existant... just marginal, as it ought to be.

No shit. why do you think I...and a lot of like-minded people are fed up with America to the point where we would honestly consider moving to Canada, getting Canadian citizenship, and telling the country of our birth to go fuck itself, and hope the selfish assholes left here kill each other in their damn stupid pursuit of acquiring bigger and bigger piles of the rancid remains of what once was a great country?

I'm a minority in the US as well, unfortunately. The vast majority of Republicans (including our president) actually do support limited welfare, emotionalist simpletons.

The white trash, of course.
It is politically inexpedient for a politician to hate anyone but the US’s current foreign enemy.

Nope. It is politically expedient to hate gays, and proclaim so loudly...if you are pandering to the radical right...which basically describes the modern-day GOP.

Easy there killer. No one is attacking YOU, I'm suggesting a change in our rhetoric would be conducive to this discussion.

All I'm saying is that you overestimate what the Military is paid. Very few other jobs deal with putting your life on hold at any time, day or night - much less putting your life on the line in the same manner.



Before you say there are no poor Republicans, please PLEASE fucking PLEASE think about what you're saying. You wouldnt know every Republican out there, how would you know if they're all rich? My Republican friends sure as hell are no better off than the Democrats I know. In fact, I know more rich Democrats than rich Republicans.

While I empathize with your plight, getting worked up before every post is hardly the way to make friends and influence people. If you can show me undeniable proof that all poor people vote a straight democrat party ticket, I'll shut up and leave this thread. Until then, please remember that all you're doing is spitting party-line rhetoric in a manner that is most definately not conducive to debate.

If you wish to debate, then debate. If you want to fly off the handle at every opportunity, then expect it in return.

Party-line rhetoric gets us no closer to finding a solution for the problem - look at our current Congress. They cant get shit done because everyone's so worried about party lines. WHO GIVES A FUCK WHICH PARTY IT IS, the problem is that there are poor people. What do we do about it?


Well, the Republican Party agenda and platform sure as shit offer no solutions to the problem...short of making the poor curl up and die with no assistance whatsoever.
That's THEIR solution to the problem. Fuck the poor. Let 'em die.

I find it quite amusing that I put up a sensible answer, and, God help me, a suggestion for Lyric's new job, and it gets shunned, rather flawed logic.

And Lyric, I assume you personally know every last republican yourself by name and house number to make the opinion "There ARE no poor Republicans."?

Odd that you have no job, yet on state welfare [or whatever the US equivalent is] you can pay for you electricity, internet access etc...

Well, the Republican Party agenda and platform sure as shit offer no solutions to the problem...short of making the poor curl up and die with no assistance whatsoever.
That's THEIR solution to the problem. Fuck the poor. Let 'em die.

Ok, but that doesnt refute my point that there are rich and poor of both parties. Nor have you quit with the personal attacks and extremist rhetoric. You want to debate, lets debate. If you want to simply go-off about how unfortunate your life has become, then dont expect people to take anything you say as a valid argument.

Bad shit happens to everyone. That's just part of life. It happens to Republicans the same as it happens to Democrats. And regardless of what the Democratic "platform" is, I sure as hell dont see any selfless Democrats sitting in Congress right now. If there were, there wouldnt be problems balancing the budget because only a very few of the Congressmen (and women) are willing to give up their pork projects (why would they, it's gov't subsidized campaigning for reelection).

Well, the Republican Party agenda and platform sure as shit offer no solutions to the problem...short of making the poor curl up and die with no assistance whatsoever.
That's THEIR solution to the problem. Fuck the poor. Let 'em die.

If you believe the Democratic propaganda, then that's your view of the world.

Odd that you have no job, yet on state welfare [or whatever the US equivalent is] you can pay for you electricity, internet access etc...
Just drop it. There's no fun to be had kicking someone while they're down. Unless you're a chronic asshole who indulges in far too much schadenfreude to be considered at all healthy.

Just sayin'.

Just drop it. There's no fun to be had kicking someone while they're down. Unless you're a chronic asshole who indulges in far too much schadenfreude to be considered at all healthy.

Just sayin'.

Agreed. As I stated in my last post, sometimes we're all down. I've been down before, and I'm still working my way back up.


Personal attacks from either side are not conducive to a healthy discussion. Please, refrain from attacking each other.

Just drop it. There's no fun to be had kicking someone while they're down. Unless you're a chronic asshole who indulges in far too much schadenfreude to be considered at all healthy.

Just sayin'.

You are, of course, assuming that he knows what schadenfreude is...

You are, of course, assuming that he knows what schadenfreude is...
Well, with Google, Wikipedia and online translation services available, people have fewer and fewer excuses for gormless ignorance these days. Dontcha just love this Golden Age of technology we're living in?

Just drop it. There's no fun to be had kicking someone while they're down. Unless you're a chronic asshole who indulges in far too much schadenfreude to be considered at all healthy.

Just sayin'.

Merely an observation that Lyric's life isn't as bad as him/her is making it, certainly gotta be somewhere above the breadline in order to have the internet.

Merely an observation that Lyric's life isn't as bad as him/her is making it, certainly gotta be somewhere above the breadline in order to have the internet.
Not nessisarily

Just about all public librarys over here offer internet machines to use free of charge

Free healthcare is only a benefit if you injure yourself. Up until this fall when I started seeing a doctor for my knee problems, that "benefit" was hardly a benefit. As for free housing, that's only if you live in the dorms, or have a family and live on-base. Neither of which are an option for me, so, I have to pay rent. Yes, I recieve BAH, but where I live, BAH hardly covers a DECENT apartment. DoD does not base BAH on decent apartment costs, they base BAH on what the average off-base resident pays in rent. Thus, if all the off-base residents can afford is crappy apartments, all BAH will ever cover is those same crappy apartments.

Someone in my job in the civilian sector with 5yrs experience would be making at least $20-30K a year more than I currently make, and I'm paid enough for working 60-80hr weeks and holidays without overtime or bonuses? Not to mention being on-call 24/7...

I'm not saying it's fair, but considering many people who enter the military either got them to pay for their college or entered with no college and were trained in their field. They certainly do better for themselves than they would with the same qualifications (none) in the civilian sector. You receive training, healthcare at no cost (even if there is a co-pay), housing and food. Considering about forty percent of the population makes less than you with none of those benefits, if mililtary personnel are struggling then imagine forty percent of families are going through?

Not to mention that many companies will pay you more just for having been in the military (mine included) and you've gotten training and experience in your field while you were in the military, it's not such a bad gig. And I'm not just talking out of my butt, I've been there, done that.

NOTE: I'm not saying life in the military is easy, I'm just saying it's better than a large portion of our population which Corny was saying live a lifestyle that's all peaches and cream.

And I'm not just talking out of my butt, I've been there, done that.
Do you see how that particular prounoun could be thought to refer to the underlined passage?:D [/streak]

I find it quite amusing that I put up a sensible answer, and, God help me, a suggestion for Lyric's new job, and it gets shunned, rather flawed logic.

And Lyric, I assume you personally know every last republican yourself by name and house number to make the opinion "There ARE no poor Republicans."?

Odd that you have no job, yet on state welfare [or whatever the US equivalent is] you can pay for you electricity, internet access etc...

Everytime I think ignorance has bounds, someone proves me wrong. As pointed out, your attacks on people are not helpful, and considering your attack was made from ignorance and assumption, it serves no point, not even a little. Lyric lives with her mother if you're curious, as she often states, or she likely would not be able to afford to live as she does. I don't know her personally (although I may have as a kid for all I know) but the plight she describes all too common in the US because of the damage we've done to our manufacturing base. It's the reason why we watch the bottom 20% of earners' average salaries decrease every year while the top 20% of earners' average salaries increase every year. I don't agree with her politics but I'm certainly not looking to kick her while she's down. You should expect better from yourself.

Do you see how that particular prounoun could be thought to refer to the underlined passage?:D [/streak]

Who says I haven't ;) Everyone has imitated that scene from that Jim Carrey movie. You know the one.

Virginia run by a Dem? Unheard of!

Not really...

Tim Kaine [D] is replacing Mark Warner [D], who replaced Jim Gilmore [R] who replaced George Allen [R], who replaced L. Douglas Wilder [D], who replaced Gerald L. Bailes [D] who replaced Charles S. Robb [D]... etc....

Who says I haven't ;) Everyone has imitated that scene from that Jim Carrey movie. You know the one.
I haven't yet. But only because my anus deagrees with Jim Carrey's pretending to talk. He said if I so that I get the run's for a month. I dare not tempt him.

Odd that you have no job, yet on state welfare [or whatever the US equivalent is] you can pay for you electricity, internet access etc...

Actually, I am on mom welfare!
That's right. After ten years being out on my own, I had to move back home, a 34-year old loser at life, and my pride is now completely shattered, so why don't you just grind my face under your heel some more, you insensitive heartless monster!!

Just drop it. There's no fun to be had kicking someone while they're down. Unless you're a chronic asshole who indulges in far too much schadenfreude to be considered at all healthy.

Just sayin'.

Heartless, soulless, insensitive, mean, rotten people like Republicans just LOVE kicking people when they are down. This guy might as well grind my face under his heel while he's at it. He'd probably enjoy it, too.

Merely an observation that Lyric's life isn't as bad as him/her is making it, certainly gotta be somewhere above the breadline in order to have the internet.

Yeah. If it weren't for my mom...AND THE LOSS OF MY PRIDE THAT GOES ALONG WITH THAT KNOWLEDGE...I fucking a well WOULD be on the breadline. Not that you'd give a fuck.

Yeah. If it weren't for my mom...AND THE LOSS OF MY PRIDE THAT GOES ALONG WITH THAT KNOWLEDGE...I fucking a well WOULD be on the breadline. Not that you'd give a fuck.

Ok Lyric, please tone down the rhetoric. It won't do nothing but turn people off and have them ignore your posts.

Everytime I think ignorance has bounds, someone proves me wrong. As pointed out, your attacks on people are not helpful, and considering your attack was made from ignorance and assumption, it serves no point, not even a little. Lyric lives with her mother if you're curious, as she often states, or she likely would not be able to afford to live as she does. I don't know her personally (although I may have as a kid for all I know) but the plight she describes all too common in the US because of the damage we've done to our manufacturing base. It's the reason why we watch the bottom 20% of earners' average salaries decrease every year while the top 20% of earners' average salaries increase every year. I don't agree with her politics but I'm certainly not looking to kick her while she's down. You should expect better from yourself.

Thank you.
As to the rest of you...do you not understand that I AM SCREAMING OUT FOR HELP!!! I WANT YOU PEOPLE TO HEAR THE STORIES, LIKE MINE, THAT THE NEWS MEDIA WILL NEVER TELL YOU ABOUT!! THE PEOPLE, LIKE ME, WHO ARE SUFFERING...LONG-TERM UNEMPLOYED, FORCED TO MOVE BACK HOME WITH PARENTS...
I'm not the only one in my boat. Others have had to move back home because this economy is just so wonderful! But the fucking pro-Bush news media will never report on it!!

HOW ELSE TO GET THE WORD OUT TO PEOPLE SO SOMETHING CAN BE DONE ABOUT IT?!!?

I am screaming and crying, BEGGING TO BE HEARD...so that people will be aware that there IS a big problem in this country, even if the news media won't tell you about it!!

Ok Lyric, please tone down the rhetoric. It won't do nothing but turn people off and have them ignore your posts.

Well, her posts wouldn't be like that if some of you (who I shall refrain from naming) weren't acting like titwashers.

Ok Lyric, please tone down the rhetoric. It won't do nothing but turn people off and have them ignore your posts.
Well, but damn, I am sick and tired of people shoving my face in the knowledge that...but for my mom, I'd be on the streets, destitute and on the damned breadline.

Well, her posts wouldn't be like that if some of you (who I shall refrain from naming) weren't acting like titwashers.

egg-fucking-zactly!!!

Well, her posts wouldn't be like that if some of you (who I shall refrain from naming) weren't acting like titwashers.

Alot of the responses towards her is due to her anger. That is what sets people off. If she said what she wanted in a calm manor like I know she is capable of, then maybe she'll have more people sympathizing with her.

I do symapthize with her. The street I used to live on when I first moved to PA was that if you weren't born and raised her to get out. They also didn't like the fact that my dad worked for the USAFR and not for US Air (now US Airways)

I have been discriminated against but not to the degree she has been.

Alot of the responses towards her is due to her anger. That is what sets people off. If she said what she wanted in a calm manor like I know she is capable of, then maybe she'll have more people sympathizing with her.

I do symapthize with her. The street I used to live on when I first moved to PA was that if you weren't born and raised her to get out. They also didn't like the fact that my dad worked for the USAFR and not for US Air (now US Airways)

I have been discriminated against but not to the degree she has been.

I am angry, and I am terrified of the future...which leads to the angry stle of most of my writing. In my situation, can you tell me anyone who wouldn't be angry and terrified?!?!

Alot of the responses towards her is due to her anger. That is what sets people off. If she said what she wanted in a calm manor like I know she is capable of, then maybe she'll have more people sympathizing with her.

I do symapthize with her. The street I used to live on when I first moved to PA was that if you weren't born and raised her to get out. They also didn't like the fact that my dad worked for the USAFR and not for US Air (now US Airways)

I have been discriminated against but not to the degree she has been.

Well, I explained my situation months ago in a very calm, concise manner, and I still got a load of shit from some very special posters, which I will gladly name (Frangland and Santa Barbara).

My way of retorting? I tell them that I'm going to buy a buttload of candy with food stamp money that their tax money pays for. Works every time. :D

I am angry, and I am terrified of the future...which leads to the angry stle of most of my writing. In my situation, can you tell me anyone who wouldn't be angry and terrified?!?!

Ok, you have me there but really, you do need to calm down. You'll win over more support and have more people listen to you if you 1) stop cussing and 2) stop yelling.

This is just friendly advice :)

Well, I explained my situation months ago in a very calm, concise manner, and I still got a load of shit from some very special posters, which I will gladly name (Frangland and Santa Barbara).

My way of retorting? I tell them that I'm going to buy a buttload of candy with food stamp money that their tax money pays for. Works every time. :D

Now that is good. Here's a cookie for originality :)

*hands you a cookie*

I am angry, and I am terrified of the future...which leads to the angry stle of most of my writing. In my situation, can you tell me anyone who wouldn't be angry and terrified?!?!


The problem is that if there were 0% unemployment, the economy would become stagnant. Dont get me wrong, I'm not attempting to trivialize your plight. Yes, it's horrible. I've been damn destitute myself, before and I know how it feels to not know anything about the future.

The problem is there, and we've acknowledged that there's a problem. Now, how would you fix this problem?

The problem is that if there were 0% unemployment, the economy would become stagnant. Dont get me wrong, I'm not attempting to trivialize your plight. Yes, it's horrible. I've been damn destitute myself, before and I know how it feels to not know anything about the future.

The problem is there, and we've acknowledged that there's a problem. Now, how would you fix this problem?

I don't know. Truth is, I'm frozen in place by my terror, and blinded by my anger. I NEED HELP!! Problem is, no one gives it. all they give is pat answers that won't work, because they don't know my situation!

Go into business for myself?? Yeah, wonderful...that'll solve all my problems!! Sure, now, just where am I supposed to get the start-up capital to launch said business? Am I supposed to just dig it out of my ass?

And, anyways, i'm not the entreprenuerial type, I prefer the security of a steady paycheck over the risks of business ownership. First time anything started to go wrong, i'd react in a blind panic, and likely do more harm than good to my business...I know my own reactions.

Ok Lyric, please tone down the rhetoric. It won't do nothing but turn people off and have them ignore your posts.

I love how you chastise Lyric's rhetoric but not that of the uninformed and incredibly insensitive poster she's responding to. I'd be curious as to why if I didn't already know. Don't pretend like you want her message to get out or you feel for her. Two seconds ago you were talking about how great the economy was, etcetera, etcetera, blah, blah, blah. You have the same problem she does (sorry, Lyric) but you BOTH are only looking at your side and you BOTH only care about what you think will make things better for YOU. Let's not pretend like Republicans give a flying fart about the economy or what happens to it as long as their corporations keep making money and feeding it to their campaigns. And let's not pretend like the Democrats, the party of the people, isn't filled with a bunch of rich people who generally have no idea what the plight of the poor and under-priveleged is in this country.

I suspect if the federal politicians for either of the parties were ever in any danger of being on welfare that we would see a welfare system like we've never seen before or since. If they were ever in danger of relying on unemployment we would see an unemployment system that is more efficient than any ever seen before. Same with medicaid, the insurance industry, minimum wage, etc. And how they keep us from noticing that the systems they will never rely on are nearly non-functional while the things that matter to them and the groups that keep them in the chips always manage to have things work out in their favor (big business, special interest groups, etc.) is that they keep us divided and spewing their rhetoric and catfighting while they pick our pockets.

I'll be honest. I'm rich. I have no debt and my bills are a very small percentage of what I make. I often don't cash expense checks for months at a time because I really don't need them. Republicans don't represent the rich, they represent the selfish and the priveleged. Scratch that, both parties represent the priveleges (just one of them is more open about it than the other). I'll likely never need any of the systems I'm talking about, but I'm not about to buy into whatever party helps me step on others so that I can have the biggest possible television. I'm not going to vote for whichever party SAYS they care about me because the fact is under the rule of these two parties most of America has been getting screwed. Both of these parties are doing the ol' throw a rock at you while your back is turned and pointing at the the other guy when you turn around. They're both bullies so walk over and hit 'em both in the mouth, then STOP turning your back on them.

How's that for some rhetoric?

Alot of the responses towards her is due to her anger. That is what sets people off. If she said what she wanted in a calm manor like I know she is capable of, then maybe she'll have more people sympathizing with her.

I do symapthize with her. The street I used to live on when I first moved to PA was that if you weren't born and raised her to get out. They also didn't like the fact that my dad worked for the USAFR and not for US Air (now US Airways)

I have been discriminated against but not to the degree she has been.
Corny, if she was saying anything in a manor, I hardly think she'd be complaining about breadlines.

Do yourself, your profs, your parents, and everybody on NS a big ol' favour and learn to spell correctly.

Corny, if she was saying anything in a manor, I hardly think she'd be complaining about breadlines.

Do yourself, your profs, your parents, and everybody on NS a big ol' favour and learn to spell correctly.

I know how to spell thank you very much. I did post that at around 1230 AM and I was also tired when I typed that. When I get tired, my spelling goes down hill.

I know how to spell thank you very much. I did post that at around 1230 AM and I was also tired when I typed that. When I get tired, my spelling goes down hill.
So stop posting when you're tired - which, going by the consistency of certain errors, would seem to be fairly often.

O....k, Few things.

1) Not a Republican, British Monarchist actually.

2) http://www.sq.4mg.com/stateIQ-income.htm <-- Proof that Republicans are infact poorer than the average Democrat voter, your statement of "All Republicans are Rich" is false.

3)

No, all I did was place some logic in response to your argument, I am hardly grinding your face down with my heel by making a logical observation to your sweeping answer, don't bother making a personal attack on me when I sure as heck haven't done so to you.[Your report is imminent after this post.] Also, see point number 1.

4) I highly doubt the US media is seriously interested in yet another "out of work" story, I saw several of those on the rare occasion I actually see US news at a friend’s house, hardly new, hardly needs more attention. Also, the economy is having more jobs created for it in the US, you just have to look.[Recommendation by a Civil servant who finds people jobs, my own Mother, for clarification]

5) If you believe that you are a "34-year-old loser at life" then that is your title for yourself, not mine.

6) I am simply looking at this from an outside PoV, I am not angry, or "threatening" in my conduct, you however, seem to be the exact opposite and enjoy making sweeping statements and personal attacks when somebody punches a hole or makes an observation towards your argument.

7) Not exactly "Rotten" merely Logical and observant.

7) Not exactly "Rotten" merely Logical and observant.
Not exactly "Fresh", either. Merely cold-hearted and seemingly taking no terribly small amount of pleasure in observing and commenting upon the misery of others.

You're a mean one, Mr. Grinch...

Corny, if she was saying anything in a manor, I hardly think she'd be complaining about breadlines.

Do yourself, your profs, your parents, and everybody on NS a big ol' favour and learn to spell correctly.
Actually, Cornelieu didn't mispell anything--just used the wrong word.

Besides that, didn't Steph quit NS a while ago? Is this her coming back to stir political hornets' nests after vowing to leave...again?

Actually, Cornelieu didn't mispell anything--just used the wrong word.

Besides that, didn't Steph quit NS a while ago? Is this her coming back and stir political hornets' nests after vowing to leave...again?

Steph never really leaves. She just says that.

Actually, Cornelieu didn't mispell anything--just used the wrong word.Actually, he did mispell 'manner' - no matter how you slice it. If I use the word 'elephant' instead of 'elevate', I've mispelled 'elevate', now haven't I?
Besides that, didn't Steph quit NS a while ago? Is this her coming back and stir political hornets' nests after vowing to leave...again?And this is salient because... ?

Steph never really leaves. She just says that.
Than she minds me of a guy named Kupo on VGAmp forums... he does the exact same thing.

Steph never really leaves. She just says that.
She left, once.

So did I, for that matter.

And I'm pretty sure you left at least once, Whispering Legs.

She left, once.

So did I, for that matter.

And I'm pretty sure you left at least once, Whispering Legs.

Only because I was having great sex...

I know how to spell thank you very much. I did post that at around 1230 AM and I was also tired when I typed that. When I get tired, my spelling goes down hill.
Downhill What time is it now?

Your post should say:

I know how to spell. Thank you very much. I posted that around 12:30AM and I was also tired when I typed that. (We'll ignore that about half of those words are redundant. "I posted around 12:30AM and was tired.") When I get tired, my spelling goes downhill.

Actually, he did mispell 'manner' - no matter how you slice it. If I use the word 'elephant' instead of 'elevate', I've mispelled 'elevate', now haven't I? Writing "there" instead of "their" isn't mispelling to me, it's using the wrong homophone (so long as you correctly spell "there"). "Manor" and "Manner" would seem to be a similar case, depending on what Corneliu's thought process was, which neither myself nor you can divine.

And to respond to the bolded section on your statement I'm thinking you don't know what "no matter how you slice it" means. Obviously, I see him as not having misspelled it, so in the way I "slice it"--from my point of view--there's a high likelihood that he actually didn't misspell it, again, from my point of view. Countering my point of view with your point of view doesn't make mine non-existent.

Not exactly "Fresh", either. Merely cold-hearted and seemingly taking no terribly small amount of pleasure in observing and commenting upon the misery of others.

You're a mean one, Mr. Grinch...

How does merely pointing out the facts make me "Mr. Grinch"?

I'm not taking great pleasure out of this, and there is also hardly any pleasure in listening to somebody's current status of employment and who they are blaming because of it either. I also see people like Lyric all the time when I visit my mother's workplace, her story is hardly unique, I am merely looking at this from my point of view, it isn't my fault that you are reading it as "cold and heartless"

O....k, Few things.

1) Not a Republican, British Monarchist actually.

2) http://www.sq.4mg.com/stateIQ-income.htm <-- Proof that Republicans are infact poorer than the average Democrat voter, your statement of "All Republicans are Rich" is false.

3)

No, all I did was place some logic in responce to your argument, I am hardly grinding your face down with my heel by making a logical observation to your sweeping answer, don't bother making a personal attack on me when I sure as heck haven't done so to you.[Your report is imminent after this post.] Also, see point number 1.

4) I highly doubt the US media is seriously intrested in yet another "out of work" story, I saw several of those on the rare occassion I actually see US news at a freind's house, hardly new, hardly needs more attention. Also, the economy is having more jobs created for it in the US, you just have to look.[Reccomendation by a Civil servant who finds people jobs, my own Mother, for clarification]

5) If you beleive that you are a "34-year-old loser at life" then that is your title for yourself, not mine.

6) I am simply looking at this from an outside PoV, I am not angry, or "threatening" in my conduct, you however, seem to be the exact opposite and enjoy making sweeping statements and personal attacks when somebody punches a hole or makes an observation towards your argument.

7) Not exactly "Rotten" merely Logical and observant.

And here I thought they expected more in schools in Britian. Your spelling is atrocious.

You didn't make any attacks? How about insulting assumptions? Did you make any of those?

7) Let me inform you about logic and observation, the LOGICAL conclusions one reaches from observations should in fact be logical and based on observations. Yours were neither. If you were actually logical and observant, you would noticed that Lyric is not on welfare (mentioned just a page or two earlier than your post) and that your post was unnecessary and insulting.

How does merely pointing out the facts make me "Mr. Grinch"?

Facts? Really. So what you pointed out is all fact-based? So if I find anything that is based on an uninformed (which there is no excuse for considering the information was there) and insulting assumption, will you agree to apologize and admit that you made a rude statement from ignorance and not some inocuous representation of your POV?

I'm not taking great pleasure out of this, and there is also hardly any pleasure in listening to somebody's current status of employment and who they are blaming because of it either. I also see people like Lyric all the time when I visit my mother's workplace, her story is hardly unique, I am merely looking at this from my point of view, it isn't my fault that you are reading it as "cold and heartless"
You really should add adjectives to YOUR point of view. How about "intentionally ignorant and insulting"?

Again, care to let ANYONE know what you added to the thread?

Writing "there" instead of "their" isn't mispelling to meWell, you're flat-out wrong.

Facts? Really. So what you pointed out is all fact-based? So if I find anything that is based on an uninformed (which there is no excuse for considering the information was there) and insulting assumption, will you agree to apologize and admit that you made a rude statement from ignorance and not some innocuous representation of your POV?

You really should add adjectives to YOUR point of view. How about "intentionally ignorant and insulting"?

Again, care to let ANYONE know what you added to the thread?

It’s hardly mean when you find it “odd” that somebody has the luxury of internet access, yet is unemployed, I merely assumed that they were perhaps using state benefits to pay for the ‘net access, State benefits around here hardly stretch far, it’s not insulting to wonder why/how she is managing to pay for food, electricity, water, gas, and the internet on “$small_amount” [unsure as it may vary state-to-state, but in the UK it’s around $150 USD]Her living with her Mother hardly means anything, I live with mine and I have to pay for things.

What's with the personal attacks?

Life isn't going to fall into your lap and that all Republicans are not rich?

Well, you're flat-out wrong.
Geez! Why didn't you tell me before?

I mean, now that you've sunk my argument with the finality of guillotine-induced headlenssness, I deeply apologize for my severe ignorance and send a dozen roses--addressed to "Betty" as is my custom--to beg forgiveness for having being so abysmally wrong and not having realized your intense correctitude earlier.

Ok. As a 34 year old mother of two who came back off a 4 year break in working, who doesn't have a shiny degree, and has somehow managed quite well in spite of it, some suggestions. This is not to be rude, not to be snarky, not to rub it in your face that some have jobs while you don't - just an honest effort at trying to offer something helpful and useful. If you've already exhausted all these options, I'm sorry. Please take it for what it's worth - well-meaning suggestions gotten from experience both when I first started way back in HS to present in getting what I needed from the job market, and some insight from the corporate and supervisory positions I've had on the employer side of things.

--- --- --- --- ---

The unemployment office: Apply, apply, apply. They also have programs there for displaced workers, for help in getting sufficient training if you lack, along with financial aid to assist while you do so. Don't be afraid to dig for details - sometimes you have to hound 'em to get what you need. Some employees there are more helpful than others - don't let one bad apple put you off.

Newspaper/Online Listings/Online Job Boards: Again, apply to everything you think you might be qualified for. Many offer email options and ways to send your resume direct. Places like Monster.com and such have a bunch of resources as well - see resumes, approaches, etc - much like the unemployment office, nevermind you can put your resume out there for all to see, and search for viable jobs all in one place.

At-work Postings: Places post 'now hiring' signs all the time, and most have applications right on hand. Never hurts to check them out.

Networking: Know people who work places that might be hiring? Get that resume out there to them. Even if they're not at the time, lots of places keep them on file for a while. If you've tried a place previously, but haven't in the last few months, ask again. Sometimes persistence alone pays off.

Agencies: This is a fast-track in to getting a job, even if at first you might be shifted from place to place on a temp or temp-to-hire thing. From what I've seen, there's some surprising opportunities through these places, and they do the legwork for you. There's all sorts of different ones, some that focus on office, tech, or general jobs depending - find one that fits your needs, and sign up.

Appearance: Do some research before you go in to apply or for an interview. Make sure you're dressed appropriately for the job. Even if it's a floor job, or something casual, it's a good idea to look nice and professional when you go in to talk to them.

Attitude: Yes, it makes a difference. I know it can be hard if you've been struggling for a long time, but a positive impression is key to getting a job, and attitudes (or percieved attitudes) can make or break you there. Folks want to know you're bringing assets to their company, not a lot of baggage. Again, perhaps not entirely 'fair', especially seeing how stressful job interviews can be even in the best of times, but that's how it goes.

Resume: There are all sorts of sites out there for easy help on this one if you need it, as well as assistance at the unemployment office. I've no idea on your skills, but a good resume is always a good idea to have on hand. Concise, to the point, and of course, talking yourself up as best you can without laying it on too thick. Point out your strengths, what skills you have, education level, including any special training, etc.

Training: If you need it, get it. In addition to the opportunities at the unemployment office, there's a lot of trade schools and such out there where you can get the skills needed for jobs in different fields - and yes, financial aid is usually available.

Relocation: If the job situation is horrible where you're at, there's always the possibility of moving somewhere where it isn't. Again, no idea on your skills which makes this a 'last resort' sort of suggestion, as moving does take $$, and I'm well aware of this. Still, some jobs out there will pay for your move if you're qualified - my husband's job did for us, for example. Including meals spent on the trip and hotel expenses. The whole enchilada.

In a recent link from CNN (can't find it or I'd post it here), they showed a list of the states ranking them from best to worst for job opportunities. Delaware was at number one, unsurprisingly with all those gov jobs. Iowa was at number 5 - this is where I'm at currently. Where we came from, Utah, is tied for 46-48. Yeah. Location can make a world of difference.

--- --- --- --- ---

In my experience, even when things seem bleak, there are always options, even if some may not seem like the best at the time. Just getting your foot in the door and employed is the first step. Once you can show you've been employed and have recent experience, it gets easier to move up to better jobs. Gaps in employment and long periods of unemployment make employers uneasy in hiring. It's a bum deal, but them's the facts.

I'm sorry things have been so rough for you, but truth - channel some of that energy into more positive things, and I think you'll get more positive results. From what I can see, all that anger isn't helping at all, just making you feel worse about yourself, your situation, and the people around you. No, I realize I can't put myself in your shoes adequately - I'm not you. Yes, it is easy enough to sit back and offer suggestions when one isn't in the same situation. No, I don't think that precludes folks from at least trying to be helpful.

And no, I'm not a Republican. Or Democrat. Or any other such thing entirely, really. Got my own opinions politically, and they have nothing whatsoever to do with this here.

In any case, I do hope things improve, and that you manage to get things worked out. If this has been in any way helpful, great. If not ... well, at least hope it wasn't a complete waste of your time.

--Nathi's Player

It’s hardly mean when you find it “odd” that somebody has the luxury of internet access, yet is unemployed, I merely assumed that they were perhaps using state benefits to pay for the ‘net access, State benefits around here hardly stretch far, it’s not insulting to wonder why/how she is managing to pay for food, electricity, water, gas, and the internet on “$small_amount” [unsure as it may vary state-to-state, but in the UK it’s around $150 USD]Her living with her Mother hardly means anything, I live with mine and I have to pay for things.

What's with the personal attacks?

Life isn't going to fall into your lap and that all Republicans are not rich?

Look, someone learned HTML. Goody.

You assumed she is on state benefits to ask your question and that the computer and internet she uses is purchased with those benefits. Is her mother not permitted to have internet service or a computer simply because her daughter lives with her? Is it your business what her mother purchases and lets her daughter use? How does it make any point at all? Oh, wait, it doesn't.

And correcting you when you make incorrect claims are not personal attacks. I'm certain you find them offensive but, according to you, taking offense does not make them personal attacks.

Geez! Why didn't you tell me before?

I mean, now that you've sunk my argument with the finality of guillotine-induced headlenssness, I deeply apologize for my severe ignorance and send a dozen roses--addressed to "Betty" as is my custom--to beg forgiveness for having being so abysmally wrong and not having realized your intense correctitude earlier.
Thanks for the bouquet. And thanks for acknowledging that you were indeed wrong.

I forgive you. But I won't forgive sloppy spelling errors from a University student like Corneliu.

Actually, he did mispell 'manner' - no matter how you slice it. If I use the word 'elephant' instead of 'elevate', I've mispelled 'elevate', now haven't I?
And this is salient because... ?

I put Manor which is a house as you so politely put it.

2nd, Manner was what I was trying to get across. however, I didn't misspell manor. :D

Thanks for the bouquet. And thanks for acknowledging that you were indeed wrong.

I forgive you. But I won't forgive sloppy spelling errors from a University student like Corneliu.

Actually, it'll be grammatical errors and not spelling errors. There is a difference between the two :D

Ironically, on my International Law paper, it was free of Grammatical errors as well as typing errors

Actually, it'll be grammatical errors and not spelling errors. There is a difference between the two :D

Ironically, on my International Law paper, it was free of Grammatical errors as well as typing errors

The paper must have been very unlike your post.

And I fail to see how incorrectly spelling a word, and you did since you were attempting to spell "manner", is not a spelling error. Did you accidentally think the sentence would make sense with the word manor? Nope. You knew manor was the wrong word, but you accidentally thought manor was the correct spelling for manner. The fact that it happens to be a word doesn't change the you spelled manner incorrectly.

The paper must have been very unlike your post.

Duh. Even I wouldn't want to turn in a grammatically incorrect paper nor a paper with several typos.

And I fail to see how incorrectly spelling a word, and you did since you were attempting to spell "manner", is not a spelling error.

Actually, I did spell manor right. However, it was grammatically incorrect because it was supposed to be manner. Any english teacher would tell you that.

Did you accidentally think the sentence would make sense with the word manor? Nope. You knew manor was the wrong word, but you accidentally thought manor was the correct spelling for manner. The fact that it happens to be a word doesn't change the you spelled manner incorrectly.

Its called grammer. It was grammatically incorrect.

So how does bitching about some one elses grammar make your penis bigger?

So how does bitching about some one elses grammar make your penis bigger?

It doesn't. However, people on here just love to point out all of your grammer and spelling errors. After awhile, it does get quite annoying.

Duh. Even I wouldn't want to turn in a grammatically incorrect paper nor a paper with several typos.

Actually, I did spell manor right. However, it was grammatically incorrect because it was supposed to be manner. Any english teacher would tell you that.

That's a dumb assertion. You weren't attempting to spell manor. You were attempting to spell manner and spelled it wrong and it happened to be another word. If I was attempting to spell your nation's name and I spelled it j-o-c-a-b-i-a, did I make a spelling error?

Its called grammer. It was grammatically incorrect.

If you used the wrong word on purpose it's only grammar. If you attempted to spell a word and spelled it wrong, it's a spelling error.

On the bigger penis comment: The attack on spelling and grammar (and style of posting) was in response to a similar attack on the style of posting. The intent was to point out that Corny is not exactly in a position to be lecturing people on less rhetoric and better posting.

I love how you chastise Lyric's rhetoric but not that of the uninformed and incredibly insensitive poster she's responding to. I'd be curious as to why if I didn't already know. Don't pretend like you want her message to get out or you feel for her. Two seconds ago you were talking about how great the economy was, etcetera, etcetera, blah, blah, blah. You have the same problem she does (sorry, Lyric) but you BOTH are only looking at your side and you BOTH only care about what you think will make things better for YOU. Let's not pretend like Republicans give a flying fart about the economy or what happens to it as long as their corporations keep making money and feeding it to their campaigns. And let's not pretend like the Democrats, the party of the people, isn't filled with a bunch of rich people who generally have no idea what the plight of the poor and under-priveleged is in this country.

I suspect if the federal politicians for either of the parties were ever in any danger of being on welfare that we would see a welfare system like we've never seen before or since. If they were ever in danger of relying on unemployment we would see an unemployment system that is more efficient than any ever seen before. Same with medicaid, the insurance industry, minimum wage, etc. And how they keep us from noticing that the systems they will never rely on are nearly non-functional while the things that matter to them and the groups that keep them in the chips always manage to have things work out in their favor (big business, special interest groups, etc.) is that they keep us divided and spewing their rhetoric and catfighting while they pick our pockets.

I'll be honest. I'm rich. I have no debt and my bills are a very small percentage of what I make. I often don't cash expense checks for months at a time because I really don't need them. Republicans don't represent the rich, they represent the selfish and the priveleged. Scratch that, both parties represent the priveleges (just one of them is more open about it than the other). I'll likely never need any of the systems I'm talking about, but I'm not about to buy into whatever party helps me step on others so that I can have the biggest possible television. I'm not going to vote for whichever party SAYS they care about me because the fact is under the rule of these two parties most of America has been getting screwed. Both of these parties are doing the ol' throw a rock at you while your back is turned and pointing at the the other guy when you turn around. They're both bullies so walk over and hit 'em both in the mouth, then STOP turning your back on them.

How's that for some rhetoric?

Jocaiba, in spite of some personal differences we may have had...the bolded and underlined parts of your post, which I am re-posting here...you have earned my respect. from now on, when I speak of the heartless, soulless, evil, greedy rich...know that I'm not including YOU in that grouping.

Every rule has it's exception. YOU are the exception to the rule I have about rich people.

Corny, if she was saying anything in a manor, I hardly think she'd be complaining about breadlines.

Do yourself, your profs, your parents, and everybody on NS a big ol' favour and learn to spell correctly.

Dobbs, I appreciate the support, I really do...and corny is one of those people on this Forum who literally annoy the fucking SNOT out of me...especially in political discussions. He strikes me as utterly without compassion or caring, and that is why he gets under my skin.

On the other hand, Corny and I can talk baseball or bowling just fine.

I appreciate your support, but it's a pretty low blow to attack someone just for their spelling.

O....k, Few things.

1) Not a Republican, British Monarchist actually.

2) http://www.sq.4mg.com/stateIQ-income.htm <-- Proof that Republicans are infact poorer than the average Democrat voter, your statement of "All Republicans are Rich" is false.

3)

No, all I did was place some logic in response to your argument, I am hardly grinding your face down with my heel by making a logical observation to your sweeping answer, don't bother making a personal attack on me when I sure as heck haven't done so to you.[Your report is imminent after this post.] Also, see point number 1.

4) I highly doubt the US media is seriously interested in yet another "out of work" story, I saw several of those on the rare occasion I actually see US news at a friend’s house, hardly new, hardly needs more attention. Also, the economy is having more jobs created for it in the US, you just have to look.[Recommendation by a Civil servant who finds people jobs, my own Mother, for clarification]

5) If you believe that you are a "34-year-old loser at life" then that is your title for yourself, not mine.

6) I am simply looking at this from an outside PoV, I am not angry, or "threatening" in my conduct, you however, seem to be the exact opposite and enjoy making sweeping statements and personal attacks when somebody punches a hole or makes an observation towards your argument.

7) Not exactly "Rotten" merely Logical and observant.

i'm not going to bother to respond to all of this except to say this:

Perception is reality to the person experiencing it. It is MY perception that you ARE grinding my face under your hell. that is what it feels like to me. Therefore, whether or not it is your intent (and I rather think that it IS your intent...I believe the worst in everyone until they have proven I shouldn't) the fact is that you ARE grinding my face under your heel...and reminding me more and more about what a fucking loser I am, because I had to move back home, and because I can't support myself, and because I can't find a job. so thatnk for another sleepless night for me. I'll be up crying all night again thanks to you. so I hope YOU have pleasant dreams, and can look at yourself in the mirror, knowing you have kicked a fellow human being in the teeth when they were already down. Hope you feel REAL FUCKING GOOD about yourself!

How does merely pointing out the facts make me "Mr. Grinch"?

I'm not taking great pleasure out of this, and there is also hardly any pleasure in listening to somebody's current status of employment and who they are blaming because of it either. I also see people like Lyric all the time when I visit my mother's workplace, her story is hardly unique, I am merely looking at this from my point of view, it isn't my fault that you are reading it as "cold and heartless"

Oh, yes you are! If you aren't, prove it by shutting up about it.
You're absolutely loving it, and you are loving feeling all smug and superior because it isn't YOU that this shit is happening to.

Sleep well tonight. You've deprived me of another night of sleep, I'll be up all night crying again, thanks to YOU.

It’s hardly mean when you find it “odd” that somebody has the luxury of internet access, yet is unemployed, I merely assumed that they were perhaps using state benefits to pay for the ‘net access, State benefits around here hardly stretch far, it’s not insulting to wonder why/how she is managing to pay for food, electricity, water, gas, and the internet on “$small_amount” [unsure as it may vary state-to-state, but in the UK it’s around $150 USD]Her living with her Mother hardly means anything, I live with mine and I have to pay for things.

What's with the personal attacks?

Life isn't going to fall into your lap and that all Republicans are not rich?

My mother is well off enough that I DON'T. and I do have a small amount of saving left from my unemployment benefits, because I hardly spent a dime of them, except, of course, to burn more gasoline, to go on more interviews with more companies who have no intention of hiring me. They just wanna make me burn my gas for no damned reason.

Ok. As a 34 year old mother of two who came back off a 4 year break in working, who doesn't have a shiny degree, and has somehow managed quite well in spite of it, some suggestions. This is not to be rude, not to be snarky, not to rub it in your face that some have jobs while you don't - just an honest effort at trying to offer something helpful and useful. If you've already exhausted all these options, I'm sorry. Please take it for what it's worth - well-meaning suggestions gotten from experience both when I first started way back in HS to present in getting what I needed from the job market, and some insight from the corporate and supervisory positions I've had on the employer side of things.

--- --- --- --- ---

The unemployment office: Apply, apply, apply. They also have programs there for displaced workers, for help in getting sufficient training if you lack, along with financial aid to assist while you do so. Don't be afraid to dig for details - sometimes you have to hound 'em to get what you need. Some employees there are more helpful than others - don't let one bad apple put you off.

Newspaper/Online Listings/Online Job Boards: Again, apply to everything you think you might be qualified for. Many offer email options and ways to send your resume direct. Places like Monster.com and such have a bunch of resources as well - see resumes, approaches, etc - much like the unemployment office, nevermind you can put your resume out there for all to see, and search for viable jobs all in one place.

At-work Postings: Places post 'now hiring' signs all the time, and most have applications right on hand. Never hurts to check them out.

Networking: Know people who work places that might be hiring? Get that resume out there to them. Even if they're not at the time, lots of places keep them on file for a while. If you've tried a place previously, but haven't in the last few months, ask again. Sometimes persistence alone pays off.

Agencies: This is a fast-track in to getting a job, even if at first you might be shifted from place to place on a temp or temp-to-hire thing. From what I've seen, there's some surprising opportunities through these places, and they do the legwork for you. There's all sorts of different ones, some that focus on office, tech, or general jobs depending - find one that fits your needs, and sign up.

Appearance: Do some research before you go in to apply or for an interview. Make sure you're dressed appropriately for the job. Even if it's a floor job, or something casual, it's a good idea to look nice and professional when you go in to talk to them.

Attitude: Yes, it makes a difference. I know it can be hard if you've been struggling for a long time, but a positive impression is key to getting a job, and attitudes (or percieved attitudes) can make or break you there. Folks want to know you're bringing assets to their company, not a lot of baggage. Again, perhaps not entirely 'fair', especially seeing how stressful job interviews can be even in the best of times, but that's how it goes.

Resume: There are all sorts of sites out there for easy help on this one if you need it, as well as assistance at the unemployment office. I've no idea on your skills, but a good resume is always a good idea to have on hand. Concise, to the point, and of course, talking yourself up as best you can without laying it on too thick. Point out your strengths, what skills you have, education level, including any special training, etc.

Training: If you need it, get it. In addition to the opportunities at the unemployment office, there's a lot of trade schools and such out there where you can get the skills needed for jobs in different fields - and yes, financial aid is usually available.

Relocation: If the job situation is horrible where you're at, there's always the possibility of moving somewhere where it isn't. Again, no idea on your skills which makes this a 'last resort' sort of suggestion, as moving does take $$, and I'm well aware of this. Still, some jobs out there will pay for your move if you're qualified - my husband's job did for us, for example. Including meals spent on the trip and hotel expenses. The whole enchilada.

In a recent link from CNN (can't find it or I'd post it here), they showed a list of the states ranking them from best to worst for job opportunities. Delaware was at number one, unsurprisingly with all those gov jobs. Iowa was at number 5 - this is where I'm at currently. Where we came from, Utah, is tied for 46-48. Yeah. Location can make a world of difference.

--- --- --- --- ---

In my experience, even when things seem bleak, there are always options, even if some may not seem like the best at the time. Just getting your foot in the door and employed is the first step. Once you can show you've been employed and have recent experience, it gets easier to move up to better jobs. Gaps in employment and long periods of unemployment make employers uneasy in hiring. It's a bum deal, but them's the facts.

I'm sorry things have been so rough for you, but truth - channel some of that energy into more positive things, and I think you'll get more positive results. From what I can see, all that anger isn't helping at all, just making you feel worse about yourself, your situation, and the people around you. No, I realize I can't put myself in your shoes adequately - I'm not you. Yes, it is easy enough to sit back and offer suggestions when one isn't in the same situation. No, I don't think that precludes folks from at least trying to be helpful.

And no, I'm not a Republican. Or Democrat. Or any other such thing entirely, really. Got my own opinions politically, and they have nothing whatsoever to do with this here.

In any case, I do hope things improve, and that you manage to get things worked out. If this has been in any way helpful, great. If not ... well, at least hope it wasn't a complete waste of your time.

--Nathi's Player


I appreciate your suggestions. If I were a normal person, instead of a FREAK...these things might actually be helpful.
However, you have not read very thoroughly, or you would know that my number one problem is legal discrimination. i'm a transsexual, and potential employers know it, and use it against me. They discriminate. And they do it legally.

I am registered with every agency around, none of them has placed me in six freaking months. they always claim it is slow...I call bullshit. I'd love for someone of my equal skills to come up here and register with these same agencies, and see how fast THEY get placed...and then sue their asses off! I know goddamn well they are discriminating.

Meanwhile, I have already been in touch with my state's Office of Vocational Rehabilitation...and am scheduled for an intake interview next week, to get some assistance in vocational training, rehabilitation, and hopefully, some professional therapy for my ongoing depression, which is very severe at this point.

I'm to the point where some days, I don't even want to get out of bed anymore, I just want to die. I mean, if life is gonna be nothing but a huge shit popsicle, then what the hell do I want with it. I want to die, rather than go on living like this.

the point is...I know that one day, maybe, I WILL want to live.
The only things keeping me alive right now are my mom, and my dog. I couldn't do it to them...or I'd have already stepped out of the picture a long time ago...and in dramatic fashion.

I even had it all planned out, once. I was gonna make the bastards who caused my depression so traumatized by what they had done to me that they would NEVER forget. I planned to...and I mean this, I LITERALLY PLANNED to go to the office of the last employer who fucked me over...and I was gonna go with a gun. I was gonna get every last one of those bastards on their KNEES...begging ME for their lives.

Then I was gonna tell them..."look at you pitiful bastards...on your knees, begging for your life! You know...this is where you had ME a few months ago....begging for MY life! The difference is...you didn't let me have my life. i'm gonna let you have yours....AND MINE!! And with that, I was gonna blow my own brains out, right in front of them, and make sure the brains splattered all over them, so that they would never forget what their heartlessness had driven another human being to. I was going to so fuck them up, and so traumatize them that they were gonna NEED professional help to come back.

Yes, I fucking planned that! You see why I need professional help? I am honestly that depressed and fucked up at this point, over the way life has treated me.

appreance is not a problem for me. As for attitude, I always try to hide what I'm feeling inside, on an interview. Maybe it shows thru, I don't know.

As for resume, I have it covered. I have a couple different resumes, in different formats, which highlight different areas of my skills, depending on the type of job I am applying for, as I am looking in more than one field.

Agencies, as I have already explained....are doing me no damn good whatsoever. Not that I'm not still bugging the crap outta them!

Relocation is no option. I cannot afford it, and my skills are too available in any market for a company to justify paying for my move. They can get my kind of talent locally. I have no SPECIALIZED SKILLS that would justify the expense.

And I bomb out resumes like nuts off the online job sites. I get plenty of interviews, and burn lots of gas going to them, only to always be told..."We hired someone else."

and it is getting very frustrating and very aggrivating!

Short of holding a potential employer at gunpoint until he gives me the job, I honestly don't know what the fuck else I can do!!

And, no, I wouldn't actually do that.

I'll never physically hurt someone else. that is not my style. But, if not for my mom and my dog, I'd have no qualms about hurting MYSELF physically...and doing it in such a manner as to cause real psychic torture on those who drove me to the point of harming myself!

Duh. Even I wouldn't want to turn in a grammatically incorrect paper nor a paper with several typos.



Actually, I did spell manor right. However, it was grammatically incorrect because it was supposed to be manner. Any english teacher would tell you that.



Its called grammer. It was grammatically incorrect.
Uhhhh, Corny...hate to do this to you but, it's grammar.
Grammer is the actor Kelsey...you know, the guy who played Frasier?

Uhhhh, Corny...hate to do this to you but, it's grammar.
Grammer is the actor Kelsey...you know, the guy who played Frasier?

Now that was a spelling mistake.

Long time no see Stephistan. How to address so many mis-statements? Let me count the ways...
A big thanks to various voters around that country to the south for giving me the gift of acknowledgement that people are finally waking up and smelling the coffee.Nice statement full of fluff, taking credit for...what? I am not sure. But so be it. Pat your own back.
Virginia run by a Dem? Unheard of!You must have missed the fact that the Governor-elect of Virginia, a Dim, is succeeding...another Dim. Big whoop. If I recall correctly, and I do, Virginia voted in 2000 and 2004 for...wanna guess?...Bush! And let's face it, the GOP candidate for Governor of Virginia ran a lackluster campaign, plus he wasn't helped by the State Senate Republican majority. All in all, a draw.
And the good citizens of Dover chucking out all but one of the school board members that tried to stick their kids with theology in the science classroom. That was a thing of beauty. The court case is now thankfully irrelevant, but it also did a wonderful job of showcasing just how ridiculous the ID movement is.Again, a draw. An ill-conceived attempt by a school board to impose its own values through the classroom. They (the school board) should have left it in the hands of the parents. Unfortunately, it tried too hard to counteract the Leftist indoctrination our children have been getting under the banner of "education," and it paid a price.

Arnie with egg on his face?Arnold faced insurmountable odds, once the corrupt unions and even more corrupt Dims in the State Assembly decided to block his efforts at real reform in the state. So, let the unions and the Dims celebrate now...they remind me of Nero fiddling while Rome burns. The sound you hear is that of major corporations and the best and brightest minds in California, fleeing the state as the Dims prepare to raise taxes AGAIN, in order to be able to pay for the crippling welfare state...but only after they pay off the enormous loans the state has to take, with the highest interest rates, due to California's dismal credit rating, courtesy of the Dims in the Statehouse.


Well, let us just start calling him the one-term-inator. And to think that when he was first elected some people started talking about a Constitutional Amendment so that he could have a crack at running for the White House.

He still can.

Janitorial positions in Washington ARE elected are they not? :DWow, so clever...did you come up with that one, all by yourself? The truth is, his victory in 2003 was completely unexpected, and highly welcome. The only true reasons he won are name recognition and a highly-split electorate in Gray-out Davis' recall. Thanks to out-of-control illegal immigration, and a Dim-controlled Assembly bent on giving the illegals full rights, it will be a very hard battle for Arnold to be re-elected. As for the Constitutional Amendment, it won't happen, and Arnold is the first one to realize it. His job for now is to bring some sense of fiscal responsibility to Sacramento, which is what Prop 76 intended to do. Too bad, though, the tax-and-spend crowd with (D) after their names will make sure California never has to stick to a budget.

All I know is that a lot of GOP members must have been hanging out in bars consoling each other last night, having to firmly acknowledge that the tide is shifted.I have one number for you...2001. In 2001, the New Jersey and Virginia governorships were retained by the Dims, in the first real test of the "hated Bush White House" and its so-called "tainted" election. Sound familiar? What happened in 2002's mid-term elections? Why, the GOP reclaimed the Senate and grew its edge in the House, in the middle of the "quagmire in Afghanistan." Eerily familiar, isn't it? True conservatives are not worried. The Dims, on the other hand, have to feel a little antsy...after all, Howlin' Mad Howard Dean hasn't energized the Dims' money machine...the only voice of "reason" in the party is Hillary, and the Left's most visible face right now are, Lyin' Joe Wilson, Cindy Jihad and MoreOn.org. (http://www.americanprowler.com/dsp_article.asp?art_id=9028) Not a pretty picture...
the people can cherry pick policies to agree with or not and still follow a party out of loyalty, but when the public trust gets broken it takes a while to get that back. And frankly, the trust IS circling the drain - along with much of the loyalty.The real problem with this "statement" is that it relies on the old "Bush Lied" mantra, which has been completely disproven time and time again. Unfortunately for the GOP, the President has been a little too late to defend his case, but the truth is that WMD components WERE found in Iraq, and it's been proven that Al-Qaida personnel trained in Iraq, that Al-Qaida and Saddam's regime were in-cahoots, and that Saddam's regime WAS supporting terrorism worldwide. Of course, it could only be a coincidence that Sarin gas was found, that a terrorism training facility was found within Baghdad, and that Saddam was paying $25,000 to the families of PLO suicide bombers...

And, (and answer only yes or no) would you rather have Saddam free and ruling Iraq again? One word answer, please...your answer will reveal a lot.

I appreciate your support, but it's a pretty low blow to attack someone just for their spelling.
Look, it's hardly my fault. The boy gave me the rope to hang him with, as per usual. Who am I to not indulge masochism?

Look, it's hardly my fault. The boy gave me the rope to hang him with, as per usual. Who am I to not indulge masochism?

LOL...don't worry, I ended up doing it later. But I just couldn't help myself.

One of my absolute favorite misspellings is "grammer" instead of "grammar." Especially when one challenged on spelling and grammar claims to have "used proper grammer." It's hilarious. I even apologized before getting on Corny's case about that one, but, in the end, I couldn't help myself...God help me, but that particular misspelling amuses me endlessly!

LOL...don't worry, I ended up doing it later. But I just couldn't help myself.

One of my absolute favorite misspellings is "grammer" instead of "grammar." Especially when one challenged on spelling and grammar claims to have "used proper grammer." It's hilarious. I even apologized before getting on Corny's case about that one, but, in the end, I couldn't help myself...God help me, but that particular misspelling amuses me endlessly!

The thing was Corny was giving you a hard time about your dramatization of your side and it's definitely a pot/kettle thing. Hell, I'm in the middle and still manage to make that as hyperbolous as possible by acting like everyone in both parties are evil bastards (when it's really only like 99 out of 100).

As much as I hate seeing people behaving callously and uncaringly, I hate having to endure crappy spelling and mealy-mouthed excuses for same to an even greater extent.

It pains me to think that someone who blithely refers to it being "a doggy-dog world" is also someone on the road to a university degree.

As much as I hate seeing people behaving callously and uncaringly, I hate having to endure crappy spelling and mealy-mouthed excuses for same to an even greater extent.

It pains me to think that someone who blithely refers to it being "a doggy-dog world" is also someone on the road to a university degree.


And to think, some of us college drop-outs have better grammatical and spelling skills than those who claim to be working towards a degree...

Hardly lends any sort of credibility to their arguments...

Hardly lends any sort of credibility to their arguments...
At the risk of beating the subject to death, I agree with this statement. I think it badly undermines the credibility they wish to establish for themselves, and I don't think I or anyone else is doing them any favours by letting too much slip by without comment.

Why, if no-one were to take a stand and demand better of their fellows, you could end up someday having, say... a national leader who cannot properly and clearly express himself in his native language - one who so badly mangles turns of phrase as to widely make himself an object of derision and scorn. And nobody'd want to see that.

Again.

I appreciate your suggestions. If I were a normal person, instead of a FREAK...these things might actually be helpful.
However, you have not read very thoroughly, or you would know that my number one problem is legal discrimination. i'm a transsexual, and potential employers know it, and use it against me. They discriminate. And they do it legally.

I am registered with every agency around, none of them has placed me in six freaking months. they always claim it is slow...I call bullshit. I'd love for someone of my equal skills to come up here and register with these same agencies, and see how fast THEY get placed...and then sue their asses off! I know goddamn well they are discriminating.

Meanwhile, I have already been in touch with my state's Office of Vocational Rehabilitation...and am scheduled for an intake interview next week, to get some assistance in vocational training, rehabilitation, and hopefully, some professional therapy for my ongoing depression, which is very severe at this point.

I'm to the point where some days, I don't even want to get out of bed anymore, I just want to die. I mean, if life is gonna be nothing but a huge shit popsicle, then what the hell do I want with it. I want to die, rather than go on living like this.

the point is...I know that one day, maybe, I WILL want to live.
The only things keeping me alive right now are my mom, and my dog. I couldn't do it to them...or I'd have already stepped out of the picture a long time ago...and in dramatic fashion.

I even had it all planned out, once. I was gonna make the bastards who caused my depression so traumatized by what they had done to me that they would NEVER forget. I planned to...and I mean this, I LITERALLY PLANNED to go to the office of the last employer who fucked me over...and I was gonna go with a gun. I was gonna get every last one of those bastards on their KNEES...begging ME for their lives.

Then I was gonna tell them..."look at you pitiful bastards...on your knees, begging for your life! You know...this is where you had ME a few months ago....begging for MY life! The difference is...you didn't let me have my life. i'm gonna let you have yours....AND MINE!! And with that, I was gonna blow my own brains out, right in front of them, and make sure the brains splattered all over them, so that they would never forget what their heartlessness had driven another human being to. I was going to so fuck them up, and so traumatize them that they were gonna NEED professional help to come back.

Yes, I fucking planned that! You see why I need professional help? I am honestly that depressed and fucked up at this point, over the way life has treated me.

appreance is not a problem for me. As for attitude, I always try to hide what I'm feeling inside, on an interview. Maybe it shows thru, I don't know.

As for resume, I have it covered. I have a couple different resumes, in different formats, which highlight different areas of my skills, depending on the type of job I am applying for, as I am looking in more than one field.

Agencies, as I have already explained....are doing me no damn good whatsoever. Not that I'm not still bugging the crap outta them!

Relocation is no option. I cannot afford it, and my skills are too available in any market for a company to justify paying for my move. They can get my kind of talent locally. I have no SPECIALIZED SKILLS that would justify the expense.

And I bomb out resumes like nuts off the online job sites. I get plenty of interviews, and burn lots of gas going to them, only to always be told..."We hired someone else."

and it is getting very frustrating and very aggrivating!

Short of holding a potential employer at gunpoint until he gives me the job, I honestly don't know what the fuck else I can do!!

And, no, I wouldn't actually do that.

I'll never physically hurt someone else. that is not my style. But, if not for my mom and my dog, I'd have no qualms about hurting MYSELF physically...and doing it in such a manner as to cause real psychic torture on those who drove me to the point of harming myself!

Perhaps dropping the Matyr complex would get you a job quicker?

All I have seen here is a very rude person who is angry because they cannot get a job, perhaps you should stop swearing and telling us about how you cry at night because somebody has hurt your feelings, and just grow up. You are not unique, and your "sob story" is getting like the proverbial broken record.

You being a Transvestite, strange and "out of place" in a vast majority of society as it is, has nothing to do with it, it's just a random fact to make yourself feel the martyr. I'm gay and seriously "out-of-place" where I live, but I don't use it as a weapon of sympathy.

Instead of responding to my post you ignored it and put the focus back on you, I had you blatantly snookered and you simply flip-flopped to avoid defeat.

Also, coming to somebody's defence over spelling and Grammar, is, just... bleh. Instead of structuring an argument against me you choose to attack how I type?

Perhaps dropping the Matyr complex would get you a job quicker?

All I have seen here is a very rude person who is angry because they cannot get a job, perhaps you should stop swearing and telling us about how you cry at night because somebody has hurt your feelings, and just grow up. You are not unique, and your "sob story" is getting like the proverbial broken record.

You being a Transvestite, strange and "out of place" in a vast majority of society as it is, has nothing to do with it, it's just a random fact to make yourself feel the martyr. I'm gay and seriously "out-of-place" where I live, but I don't use it as a weapon of sympathy.

Instead of responding to my post you ignored it and put the focus back on you, I had you blatantly snookered and you simply flip-flopped to avoid defeat.

Also, coming to somebody's defence over spelling and Grammar, is, just... bleh. Instead of structuring an argument against me you choose to attack how I type?

Actually I seem to remember several people saying you were rude and insensitive without adding anything to the conversation. Since you didn't add anything it's hard to refute what you said. You attacked a person and you used invalid assumptions to do so. Your argument was based on Lyric purchasing internet service with while on the unemployment/welfare and your point was shown to be invalid since it was based on a strawman. We pointed out your strawman, burned it to the ground, and then made fun of your spelling and grammar to boot.


Ok, serious question - why does everyone keep capitalizing grammar? Did it become a political party while I wasn't looking?

Ok, serious question - why does everyone keep capitalizing grammar? Did it become a political party while I wasn't looking?
Naw, they're just getting it confused with their Grandmas. Must be due to all the Christmas wish lists people are writing of late.

Hyuck-hyuck-hyuck...

Perhaps dropping the Matyr complex would get you a job quicker?

All I have seen here is a very rude person who is angry because they cannot get a job, perhaps you should stop swearing and telling us about how you cry at night because somebody has hurt your feelings, and just grow up. You are not unique, and your "sob story" is getting like the proverbial broken record.

You being a Transvestite, strange and "out of place" in a vast majority of society as it is, has nothing to do with it, it's just a random fact to make yourself feel the martyr. I'm gay and seriously "out-of-place" where I live, but I don't use it as a weapon of sympathy.


It sounds more like a problem with a mood disorder than being a transvestite. There are plenty of places where transvestites are in good company, and I've offered Lyric the chance to move to Washington DC and see first hand - but the offer was rebuffed.

So, I've taken in another victim of domestic violence (a woman and two daughters).

I think that before Lyric can succeed in the world, perhaps some therapy and medication would help enormously.

Always been taught to spell Grammar with a capital G, ain't my problem, don't make it yours.

Also, it was hardly a "straw man" more "Lack of information" shame on me evidently. :rolleyes:

Perhaps checking my post afterwards instead of this constant... rubbish would help? Y'know, when I do add something useful?

Y'know, instead of finding stuff to put against the points I made here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9936796&postcount=377) you choose to mock my spelling and a "straw man" over one silly little assumption.
Lyric on the other hand just dives around it and makes the assumptions that I am the following:

1) Grinding her face into the dirt.
2) That I am a Republican; I'm not even a Yank!
3) Taking great pleasure over poking her.

Yet, when I respond to it all, I get "mocked" over spelling and Grammar.

It's not, in fact after 20-odd pages of what simply sums up to whining and self-pity I am thoroughly un-enjoying continuing this, however I have now committed myself to this thread and intend to bring it to some form of conclusion.


Anyhow, around here it is quite a given that:

Unemployed = on State Welfare, or benefits from the state of some kind.

I find the one person that couldn't be bothered to sign on and you choose to mock me over it, and spelling? Why not try to dismember the argument/points I later place here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9936796&postcount=377)?

Instead you choose to mock as opposed to debate or try to change my point of view? Or has General now slipped that far down the chain of sanity that "everybody has an opinion and to hell and back with you, and while I'm at it, I'm going to mock how you type!" As opposed to, say, trying to change my opinion on something?

Stop being childish both of you, nobody likes Martyrs and people who are so picky over something like spelling, as opposed to trying to argue against me.

Always been taught to spell Grammar with a capital G, ain't my problem, don't make it yours.

Also, it was hardly a "straw man" more "Lack of information" shame on me evidently. :rolleyes:

Perhaps checking my post afterwards instead of this constant... rubbish would help? Y'know, when I do add something useful?

Y'know, instead of finding stuff to put against the points I made here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9936796&postcount=377) you choose to mock my spelling and a "straw man" over one silly little assumption.
Lyric on the other hand just dives around it and makes the assumptions that I am the following:

1) Grinding her face into the dirt.
2) That I am a Republican; I'm not even a Yank!
3) Taking great pleasure over poking her.

Yet, when I respond to it all, I get "mocked" over spelling and Grammar.

It's not, in fact after 20-odd pages of what simply sums up to whining and self-pity I am thoroughly un-enjoying continuing this, however I have now committed myself to this thread and intend to bring it to some form of conclusion.


Anyhow, around here it is quite a given that:

Unemployed = on State Welfare, or benefits from the state of some kind.

I find the one person that couldn't be bothered to sign on and you choose to mock me over it, and spelling? Why not try to dismember the argument/points I later place here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9936796&postcount=377)?

Instead you choose to mock as opposed to debate or try to change my point of view? Or has General now slipped that far down the chain of sanity that "everybody has an opinion and to hell and back with you, and while I'm at it, I'm going to mock how you type!" As opposed to, say, trying to change my opinion on something?

Stop being childish both of you, nobody likes Martyrs and people who are so picky over something like spelling, as opposed to trying to argue against me.

*ring, ring* Hello
Pot?
Yes, I'm Pot. Who's calling?
Oh, it's Kettle. Just wanted to note that you're black.

Our mocking of you is in response to your mocking of Lyric. If you think mocking is an inappropriate way to make a point, perhaps you should follow your own advice. As shown here, it obfuscates the point and thus isn't a very effective way to debate. You're welcome to try again.

It sounds more like a problem with a mood disorder than being a transvestite. There are plenty of places where transvestites are in good company, and I've offered Lyric the chance to move to Washington DC and see first hand - but the offer was rebuffed.

So, I've taken in another victim of domestic violence (a woman and two daughters).

I think that before Lyric can succeed in the world, perhaps some therapy and medication would help enormously.

I don't know why everyone always jumps to medication. Perhaps a decision better made by a medical professional. I do think Lyric could use therapy. I would recommend that to anyone who appears to be as angry and hurt as she does.

Anyhow, around here it is quite a given that:

Unemployed = on State Welfare, or benefits from the state of some kind.

You're deluding yourself.

I am unemployed, and I receive no benefits whatsoever, either from the state, or from any other source.

Care to tickle yourself behind the tonsils with that left big toe of yours some more?

I don't know why everyone always jumps to medication. Perhaps a decision better made by a medical professional. I do think Lyric could use therapy. I would recommend that to anyone who appears to be as angry and hurt as she does.

I've seen Seroquel work far too well on far too many people who were bipolar (and on whom therapists had given up or refused to see the patients anymore).

Therapy is a must, but a doctor needs to see if medication will work.

I've seen Seroquel work far too well on far too many people who were bipolar (and on whom therapists had given up or refused to see the patients anymore).

Therapy is a must, but a doctor needs to see if medication will work.

I personally think medication should be a last resort. In an age when pharmaceutical companies are permitted to pay doctors to hock their goods, it seems like we are having medication recommended as a fix for everything. The effort should be to limit any necessary medication to the least possible use of it.

I went to a doctor for problems concentrating and she put me on the highest recommended dosage of Strattera right from jump. I felt GREAT if not for all the side-effects. However, side-effects are rare so I would never known that I don't really need so much because I would not have wanted her to lower my dosage after feeling that good. I switched doctors. However, I have since found that half that dose corrected the problem to within normal parameters. Unfortunately, the side-effects never went away so I ended up switching medications. Now I take a medication I barely notice except when I don't take it. My new doctor gave me a fairly low dosage and raised the dosage until it started to work. It allows me to function without making me feel really any different than what I would consider normal, meaning normal for me. This should be the goal. Again - the least possible use of medication.

I personally think medication should be a last resort. In an age when pharmaceutical companies are permitted to pay doctors to hock their goods, it seems like we are having medication recommended as a fix for everything. The effort should be to limit any necessary medication to the least possible use of it.

Agreed because what one doesn't realize is you will be addicted to that drug (not to the chemicals), but in the need to be "normal'" requires the drug.

You won't learn self control or anyway to adapt. If you ever miss your "fix" you'll be terribley off.

My Mom decided to teach and help my brother instead of relying on drugs like Ritalin. And he never needs the stuff for that. He was very hyper-active and attention deficient at first.

I went to a doctor for problems concentrating and she put me on the highest recommended dosage of Strattera right from jump. I felt GREAT if not for all the side-effects. However, side-effects are rare so I would never known that I don't really need so much because I would not have wanted her to lower my dosage after feeling that good. I switched doctors. However, I have since found that half that dose corrected the problem to within normal parameters. Unfortunately, the side-effects never went away so I ended up switching medications. Now I take a medication I barely notice except when I don't take it. My new doctor gave me a fairly low dosage and raised the dosage until it started to work. It allows me to function without making me feel really any different than what I would consider normal, meaning normal for me. This should be the goal. Again - the least possible use of medication.

Agreed, least mediation useage..

Agreed because what one doesn't realize is you will be addicted to that drug (not to the chemicals), but in the need to be "normal'" requires the drug.

You won't learn self control or anyway to adapt. If you ever miss your "fix" you'll be terribley off.

My Mom decided to teach and help my brother instead of relying on drugs like Ritalin. And he never needs the stuff for that. He was very hyper-active and attention deficient at first.

I made it 31 years without medication for being hyperactive and attention deficient. I taught myself tricks to deal with it that were very effective until my recently. Apparently stress aggravates the condition and I also developed some sleep problems when I broke my neck the second time so the road got a bit rougher. I think definitely in the case of ADD we are too quick to diagnose and too quick to medicate. Kids are supposed to be a little wild. I hope I never see a classroom full of kids that are all paying attention and sitting at the position of attention.

I hope I never see a classroom full of kids that are all paying attention and sitting at the position of attention.
Oh how I wished the other kids would have paid attention and done their work quietly as I had.

Damn noisy ADD kids with their jumping around and demanding the teacher's full attention all the time.

Perhaps dropping the Matyr complex would get you a job quicker?

All I have seen here is a very rude person who is angry because they cannot get a job, perhaps you should stop swearing and telling us about how you cry at night because somebody has hurt your feelings, and just grow up. You are not unique, and your "sob story" is getting like the proverbial broken record.

You being a Transvestite, strange and "out of place" in a vast majority of society as it is, has nothing to do with it, it's just a random fact to make yourself feel the martyr. I'm gay and seriously "out-of-place" where I live, but I don't use it as a weapon of sympathy.

Instead of responding to my post you ignored it and put the focus back on you, I had you blatantly snookered and you simply flip-flopped to avoid defeat.

Also, coming to somebody's defence over spelling and Grammar, is, just... bleh. Instead of structuring an argument against me you choose to attack how I type?


Correction. Transsexual. not transvestite.
Another blatant example of how gay people refuse to educate themselves on transgender issues.

Correction. Transsexual. not transvestite.
Another blatant example of how gay people refuse to educate themselves on transgender issues.

Knock it off. No need to troll, ok?

Knock it off. No need to troll, ok?

I'm not trolling. If anything...HE WAS!!
If you understood our issues, you would understand why the term "transvestite" is particularly insulting to us.

I'm not trolling. If anything...HE WAS!!
If you understood our issues, you would understand why the term "transvestite" is particularly insulting to us.

It would be nice if you could be a bit calmer. I'm sure that since most of us are not familiar with your issues, there's nothing meant by using the wrong term.

Instead of getting angry, why not educate us?

It would be nice if you could be a bit calmer. I'm sure that since most of us are not familiar with your issues, there's nothing meant by using the wrong term.

Instead of getting angry, why not educate us?

Because my community is sick and tired of "educating" the GLB community, which has proved, time and again, they don't really WANT to be educated...they just want to use that as an excuse to continue putting off refusing to include us in legislation like the Employment Non-Discrimination Act.

HRC, the biggest GLB lobby group in America...has, for the last ten years, constantly used this as an excuse to keep us out of the legislation. they claim they "need more education" and yet, ten years later, they are no more educated than they were back then....in spite of the efforts of the best in our community. They have proven they don't really WANT to be educated.

Because my community is sick and tired of "educating" the GLB community, which has proved, time and again, they don't really WANT to be educated...they just want to use that as an excuse to continue putting off refusing to include us in legislation like the Employment Non-Discrimination Act.

HRC, the biggest GLB lobby group in America...has, for the last ten years, constantly used this as an excuse to keep us out of the legislation. they claim they "need more education" and yet, ten years later, they are no more educated than they were back then....in spite of the efforts of the best in our community. They have proven they don't really WANT to be educated.

Screw them. What about educating the rest of us? That is what Deep Kimchi met by the word us.

Because my community is sick and tired of "educating" the GLB community, which has proved, time and again, they don't really WANT to be educated...they just want to use that as an excuse to continue putting off refusing to include us in legislation like the Employment Non-Discrimination Act.

HRC, the biggest GLB lobby group in America...has, for the last ten years, constantly used this as an excuse to keep us out of the legislation. they claim they "need more education" and yet, ten years later, they are no more educated than they were back then....in spite of the efforts of the best in our community. They have proven they don't really WANT to be educated.

Once again, you're making rash generalizations and flying off the handle in doing so.

SETTLE DOWN.