NationStates Jolt Archive

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.

Join in.

Join in.

This is going to be a simultaneous :headbang: and :rolleyes: for this post.

Figure out a way to get her prescribed Prozac. It tastes like mint!

At the risk of being shot, I'll say that cutters are hot, but then I always enjoyed the scent of self-loathing and desperation.

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.
It depends is her health worth potentialy endangering your friendship
If that is a yes Tell your school counsilor

Cutting is the sign of some much much deeper issues

If you want her to deal with thoes issues and make her life inmesurably better for the future ... then you have to tell

This is going to be a simultaneous :headbang: and :rolleyes: for this post.
You just wanted an excuse to use those emoticons. You should cut yourself to.

There have been situations in my life when I told, and when I didn't.

Telling works out better in the long run.

Stab her in the stomach. Then she'll know real pain.

Seriously, though, that's not healthy and a sign of deeper personal issues. I'd talk to someone about getting her into see a therapist. I wouldn't go so far as to go to authorities of any kind, but it's definately the sort of thing you might want to get her to talk to someone about.

I'd appreciate it if we could keep this to serious comments. This is my life, after all.

No idea. Unfortunately, these people are way beyond telling to "get a grip". She wouldn't even try to pull herself together if you told her too, she'd just assume she couldn't and then be sad about that as well.

Like I said, get her a prescription for antidepressants.

I'd appreciate it if we could keep this to serious comments. This is my life, after all.
I tried ... Like I said if you want her to adress the issues that are causing this and for her to get her life togeather she NEEDS therapy and counsiling

You should tell a school councilor

I'd appreciate it if we could keep this to serious comments. This is my life, after all.
I am being serious.

1. Tell
2. Be honest with your friend

That works for me much better than not telling.

I'd appreciate it if we could keep this to serious comments. This is my life, after all.
Who (other than Rotovia) wasn't being serious? A few scars make anyone look better.
If you want to somehow stop her, then you should try and find someone else who you can blame the discovery on. For instance, does she cut her self in a place that a parent or teacher might notice? If so (and if you can trust them to keep their fat faces shut) tipping them off might get her some help without involving you at all. You could even be her shoulder to cry on, and feel all the nicer for it.

You just wanted an excuse to use those emoticons. You should cut yourself to.

Maybe if the emoticons were :upyours: or :sniper: . But :rolleyes: and :headbang: I can use fairly often here.

On the serious side of the discussion you should tell someone. As other people have said this is probably a sign of deeper trauma or troubles the person is having. Worst case senario your friends ostracize you but you've helped the friend in the long run. But also don't forget you can talk to your friend as well. Provide support and be willing to listen to what they have to say.

from experience: Itys always better to be a good friend than it is to be a trustworthy friend although the two usually shouldn't be mutually exclusive.

If you after your friend gets help theyy hate you for it then they need more help, if after that they still don't like you (for whatever reason) then you don't need that person to be your friend, there are better people out there that will appreciate that you would help them if they needed it.

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.she needs help. try to encourage her to seek help. if need be, go with her. if need be, talk to someone. Sure you'll break her trust but if the choice is my friends life or their trust, think about this; you can always work to regain your friends trust.

It depends is her health worth potentialy endangering your friendship
If that is a yes Tell your school counsilor

Cutting is the sign of some much much deeper issues

If you want her to deal with thoes issues and make her life inmesurably better for the future ... then you have to tell

A very sensible answer.

Perhaps suggest she sees the counsilor, it's good to get her to make that move for herself. If not, then as Upawrd said.
Also, talking with the counsilor means she can keep it a confidential matter.

Also, perhaps you too could see the school counsilor, and get some good advice from a pro' as to how you can help with this the best way possible for her, as her friend.

Tell a counselor at your school. He or she is best equipped to talk to your friend and to get whatever help she needs to her.

I'm surprised at all the comments this thread is getting. I really appreciate all the advice. Thank you and keep it coming!

A lot of people are mentioning school councelors and I'd just like to say that my school is so small we don't have one.

Maybe she has some repressed sexual anxieties that you can help with.

:rolleyes:

I'm joking, I'm joking. (So don't kill me mods.)

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.
Talk with a teacher you trust. Tell her/him that you have a friend ( unnamed ) who does this to herself. If the teacher agrees to not use your name, tell her who your friend is. Cutting one's self is indication of deep-seated neuroses and may indicate suicidal tendencies. You'll be doing your friend no favor by keeping this to yourself. Good luck!

Maybe she has some repressed sexual anxieties that you can help with.

:rolleyes:

I'm joking, I'm joking. (So don't kill me mods.)
That was pretty funny.... I don't think she wants anything to do with sex, though.

Tell her to see a doctor. They should recognise the marks on her and guide her towards the appropiate help. Other than that do nothing.

Tell her to see a doctor. They should recognise the marks on her and guide her towards the appropiate help. Other than that do nothing.
I strongly disagree with this. What if her friend becomes suicidal and makes an attempt ( successful or not ) to take her own life? What would be the impact of this on Songwai?

[QUOTE=Eutrusca]...What if her friend...[QUOTE]
I'm a guy....

That was pretty funny.... I don't think she wants anything to do with sex, though.

Phew. I just came back from a Forumbann (7 days) for what the mods called "crude sexual behavior". :p

I didn't want to get forumbanned again on my first post. >_<

A lot of people are mentioning school councelors and I'd just like to say that my school is so small we don't have one.

If it's a school with no councillor, then ask advice from the teacher you feel you can trust the most. He or She will know the right way of dealing with this, and should know the best way of helping your friend.

My idea isn't that bad...if you can get something to take her mind off of cutting...

I strongly disagree with this. What if her friend becomes suicidal and makes an attempt ( successful or not ) to take her own life? What would be the impact of this on Songwai?

You're right. Although I would talk to the friend and put pressure on them to come foward themselves before going to anyone. And not mention a name around the teacher unless the friend has no intention at all of coming forward.

Ok, I'll put my psych class knowledge to good use. You know what you need to do, if you don't tell someone and get her help you will end up blaming yourself... and you should! Any friend who doesn't help a friend out in a situation like this because they are afraid of the friend not liking them anymore is selfish.

Tell someone, get here help, maybe she won't end up killing herlself.

Either that or join her.

Stab her in the stomach.

+1

[QUOTE=Eutrusca]...What if her friend...[QUOTE]
I'm a guy....
Oh. My apologies. :(

'Cutting herself'? With a knife, I assume you mean? And deliberately, rather than simply being clumsy, I guess? Let me guess, you're in America, right? For someone to do something so utterly bizarre and downright moronic to themselves, there must be a chemical imbalance in there somewhere. For her safety, and potentially those around her, tell someone who has a qualification in psychiatry, and tell them sooner rather than later. If you're a genuine friend, it's the only option -- she needs help, before she cuts something particularly important to her continued existence.

This girl I knew in college used to cut herself... had a psychiatrist and was taking just about every pill you could name... didn't help. She quit cutting the day she threw out the pills and told her psych to go fuck himself.

Ok, I'll put my psych class knowledge to good use. You know what you need to do, if you don't tell someone and get her help you will end up blaming yourself... and you should! Any friend who doesn't help a friend out in a situation like this because they are afraid of the friend not liking them anymore is selfish.

Tell someone, get here help, maybe she won't end up killing herlself.

Either that or join her.
Good advice, except for that last part there. Heh!

In the abscence of a school councelor, go to the principal. You friend will be angry, but that's better than what she'll be if she doesn't get the help she needs. She may very well be looking for a way to tell someone herself, but can't. Maybe, just maybe, she can be helped to pull herself out of the hell she's apparently in. But the only way to really be her friend is for you to break this implicit confidentiality with her. Trust me, the sooner you act, the better for her. And there are ways she can she protected from her father should that be necessary. Don't wait on this, she needs someone to care enough to help her.

Ok, I'll put my psych class knowledge to good use. You know what you need to do, if you don't tell someone and get her help you will end up blaming yourself... and you should! Any friend who doesn't help a friend out in a situation like this because they are afraid of the friend not liking them anymore is selfish.

Tell someone, get here help, maybe she won't end up killing herlself.

Either that or join her.
Rotovia...? PSYCH CLASS...? This throws my whole philosophy on life out of balance!

I stand by my statement that you ask her out.

Maybe she has some repressed sexual anxieties that you can help with.

:rolleyes:

I'm joking, I'm joking. (So don't kill me mods.)
you may have been joking but repressed sexual abuse often contributes to this sort of behavior

I stand by my statement that you ask her out.
I'm taken and she's.... Not into my.... Gender....

I stand by my statement that you ask her out.


NO! Some guy hitting on her is just about the last thing this girl needs right now. And if you meant that as a joke, you need to grow up. That was completely inappropriate.

A lot of people are mentioning school councelors and I'd just like to say that my school is so small we don't have one.
then talk to the Principal. explain your situation and you'll have to trust him/her to be circumspect about it.

Ok, I'll put my psych class knowledge to good use. You know what you need to do, if you don't tell someone and get her help you will end up blaming yourself... and you should! Any friend who doesn't help a friend out in a situation like this because they are afraid of the friend not liking them anymore is selfish.

Tell someone, get here help, maybe she won't end up killing herlself.

Either that or join her.

True! (except the end bit..)

Also, by talking to a teacher you trust, you're not putting the whole thing on yourself. Instead you'll have support from someone else.

Good luck. ;)

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.
Why does she cut herself. You have to find that out before you do anything. It is ritual? Is she depressed?

You might want to figure out why she's cutting herself, and if it seems like it might lead to something worse, like suicide or lasting damage.

If the situation doesn't seem like it's going to get any worse, talk to her about her reasons for it, see if there's any way to talk her out of it. Suggesting that she see a trained professional may be a good idea. However, I'm not sure that actually telling someone is the best idea, especially if she seems fairly stable beyond the cutting (which as long as it's shallow and she's careful about infection and bloodloss isn't technically that harmful). You need to decide for yourself what you think is worse for her, the cutting or having her on who-knows-what-drugs for who-knows-how-long.

I don't know, I'm on the fence as to which is worse. I know several people that cut, and for one I was horrified about it when she told me, but for her it seemed like a cry for help and of depression, the other... it was just there. It was just something she did now and then for herself, and otherwise she well-adjusted barring some things. For her, it didn't seem at all a cry for help, and her personality flies in the face of ever committing suicide. I talked to the first about it, and so did others and she got over it and stopped. The second, I never talked to her about it and it didn't come up. Maybe I should have done something more, but neither of them were that close to me as friends, it didn't seem appropriate. But for the second friend, I don't think psychiatric help and drugs would have done her any good, in fact, she might have had both before.

So yeah... it's your decision in the end, but in any decision you make I think you should talk to her about her reasons first off.

Kill her then yourself


(why are you asking an internet message board for advice :confused: )

Kill her then yourself


(why are you asking an internet message board for advice :confused: )

because not everyone on the internet would suggest something so juvenile.

hmm. I'm sorry that you have to deal with this. My friend considered cutting but we all abused her verbally and physically, so she decided it wasn't a good idea. We are very outspoken and spontaneous at our school. Anyway, I don't recommend doing that since she is already cutting herself. You need to try to find out why. Depending on her personality she could either get defensive or just tell you straight so you'll want to do it in a nonchalant sort of way. It could be a cry for attention or an outlet of emotion. Once you find out why it'll be easier to come up with reasons for her to stop. Hope you figure it out.

Rotovia...? PSYCH CLASS...? This throws my whole philosophy on life out of balance!
Yeah I'l do that...

But for the record, I never finished. I'm now doing a Diploma of Finance and Certificate III in Financial Planning, with pre-enrollement in and Advanced Diploma of Finance/Bachelor of Art Majoring in Psycholog, which I plan to top off with an MBA and PhD. The first three are paid for by my work!

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.

Self harm is a serious issue, I hate to tell you this but you do have an ethical responsibility to talk to someone, if her father is not who to speak with, the principal of your school is who to speak with. She could move on from cutting herself to other things. I used to know a 'cutter' when I was at school. I hated that. She would carve little square shaped mazes on her legs. It left scars. I don't know what became of her, she was a beautiful girl but I could not bear to sit by her in music class and no one understood about 'cutters' in those days. Your friend needs help and you are not a trained person, she needs the help of a trained person. If the intervention is handled correctly you shouldn't lose your 'friends' although I don't think they are real friends, I understand, problems with them coulod be bad. Have you spoken with your own parents at all about this? Do you feel safe talking about this with them? Maybe prepareing them ahead of time to be helpful to you is a good idea as well.

Tell a counselor at your school. He or she is best equipped to talk to your friend and to get whatever help she needs to her.

Yes, but more often than not, I've heard of disastrous consequences. The counselor was hostile, breached student-counselor confidentiality..etc.

Someone close to me cut for years, and it tooks years of slow help, mostly from themselves, and from me when they ran out of strength, to stop. You can't just medicate it away...You have to treat the cause. It's an attempt to control one's life, by inflicting pain..the one thing they truly feel they have control over. You can't outright condemn it, because that may exacerbate the problem, but you also can't condone it. The best thing you can do, right now, is to let them know you're always willing to listen, and give advice about their life.

In addition, compliment them from time to time..but mean it. It's very likely they suffer, among other things, from low-self esteem and depression. Having even one non-judgement, true friend will help immensely. Try to broach the subject of considering a doctor, and if they feel they'd be comfortable. By no means should you try to pressure them into going, or stopping..It likely will backfire. They have to want to heal, first and foremost.

As to the people who're being smart asses...this is one of the few subjects I'm sensetive about. If you can't say something helpful, just stay quiet, please.

My advice? Tell no one. I know, shock, horror! How could Zanato advise such a thing?! Madness!

Oftentimes cutting oneself is just a way to deal with stress, gain a sense of control, or merely to satisfy curiosity or boredom. Rarely does it pose a serious risk to the cutter unless they are seriously suicidal. Those who claim to be suicidal are normally just out looking for sympathy and a shoulder to cry on. Even if you tell someone about her 'problem' it will not help the situation. That would drive her further away from seeking help, possibly becoming truly suicidal due to a close friend betraying her. Just let life sort it out, don't interfere. Only she can stop cutting, medication and psychiatrists won't solve it.

From my experience there are two types of cutters:

1) A goth kid who does it for kicks. The probs. with this is that they may cut too deep or catch something if they drink others blood.
If this is the type of cutting you are referring to, I'd avoid the situation and let her know YOU disaprove.

2) A kid who is really crying out for help. If she is cutting & telling then she wants help. The next step will be an attempted suicide.
It is also very easy for these people to "accidentally" kill themselves.

They will drink too much, overdose, cut too deep and will feel it's not a suicide attempt.

On an odd note - if she speaks of suicide she needs to be watched, but the ones that really do it, most of the time don't say a word to anyone - they just do it.

If she falls into this second category - she needs help now.
A start would be talking with the principal - express your concern over the situation with her father.

That is all you can do. You then have to leave it up to the adults to deal with the situation. If she commits suicide you have done your part, there was nothing you can do to stop her. I have had several friends who went this way and it hurts for a long time, but remember you were a friend to her & you did what you could to help.

Unfortunately not alot is done for a very common problem of teen depression issues. This is the time of life where a lot of psychological problems (that will be life long) begin to manifest themselves and are left untreated, which will then take longer as an adult to manage. The red tape with insurance and doctors who do not suffer from mental illness can really be problematic :-(
I'd suggest to her to find a doctor who has experience with depression, bi-polar or other issues that they have managed to get where they are.

Good Luck
Starry

My advice? Tell no one. I know, shock, horror! How could Zanato advise such a thing?! Madness!

Oftentimes cutting oneself is just a way to deal with stress, gain a sense of control, or merely to satisfy curiosity or boredom. Rarely does it pose a serious risk to the cutter unless they are seriously suicidal. Those who claim to be suicidal are normally just out looking for sympathy and a shoulder to cry on. Even if you tell someone about her 'problem' it will not help the situation. That would drive her further away from seeking help, possibly becoming truly suicidal due to a close friend betraying her. Just let life sort it out, don't interfere. Only she can stop cutting, medication and psychiatrists won't solve it.


And as Drache posted, be her friend. Obviously she's put you in a place of trust. She trusts you enough to let you know about her problems (apparently hidden from most people or you'd likely have known already). Be there for her when she needs it. When she feels like cutting herself and tells you as much, remember that it's a cry to YOU for help so offer to go somewhere / do something to keep her busy / improve her mood / whatever she needs at the time.

Ultimately, you just need to be the best friend you can be.

My idea isn't that bad...if you can get something to take her mind off of cutting...

On the face of it it doesn't sound bad, but here's why it is a bad idea, no one should have sex unless they can deal with the possibility of children, and a cutter is in no fit shape to deal with that possiblity. Plus the tendancy runs in families sometimes. Is this a trait you want to see passed on?
Anything that leads to this girl getting help is a good thing. Sex isn't a bad thing normally but in this instance it probably is.
I feel bad that anyone feels so bad they do that.
Part of the mechanism is the fact that injury releases endorphins. Hard exercise also releases endorphins so does hot food. She should be turned on to those alternatives.

And as Drache posted, be her friend. Obviously she's put you in a place of trust. She trusts you enough to let you know about her problems (apparently hidden from most people or you'd likely have known already). Be there for her when she needs it. When she feels like cutting herself and tells you as much, remember that it's a cry to YOU for help so offer to go somewhere / do something to keep her busy / improve her mood / whatever she needs at the time.

Ultimately, you just need to be the best friend you can be.

What he said. Also, ask her to try to promise to phone/IM you whenever she feels like wanting to cut, and to talk about why. This way, she thinks about her problems, and tries to resolve them. Also, try asking her to wear a rubber band around her wrist. When she gets the urge to..tell her to snap it.

You should tell a school therapist, seriously. Cutting will escalate, maybe she might hate you for awhile. (One other thing, telling you was probably a cry for help. Either sub-consiensly (SP?) or she was trying to get your help) But if you lose her this way, it will be only a little while. But if you dont do anything, it could escalate and you could lose her forever. Seek professional help.

Do your best to let an athority know, preferably without them knowing who informed them. She needs help, but you shoudn't suffer for it.

Unrelated Side Bonus Comment: Neut? woah! :eek:

A good friend is willing to lose a friendship to save a friend. I know it sucks, I'm deeply sorry, but sometimes life does. So do what is best to get her to stop cutting and ignore whether your friendship survives.

Kill her then yourself


(why are you asking an internet message board for advice :confused: )


You can go piss yourself man! Maybe some people need help and this is one place to get it. Why must you be so blind to issues at hand that are poisoning the youth of today? (By the way this is coming from a "youth") Maybe you should wise up and act like an adult (If you are) or grow up and get a life.




(why are you so ignorant :confused: )

I agree it's maybe foolish to ask for advice here, and I urge you to listen to Drache/Neut, but even so, to try to seek independent, qualified advice. Even so, giving deliberately crappy advice seems unnecessarily mean-spirited.

A good friend is willing to lose a friendship to save a friend. I know it sucks, I'm deeply sorry, but sometimes life does. So do what is best to get her to stop cutting and ignore whether your friendship survives.

Having a friend's shoulder to cry on is more helpful than a psychiatrist's cold stare and the bitter taste of anti-depression meds.

Unrelated Side Bonus Comment: Neut? woah! :eek:

um, huh?

um, huh?

Perhaps he has an interest in neutered newts. ;)

Don't tell. It'll only add to their stress, paranoia and well having someone watch them constantly might just push them over the edge and consider suicide. I have known a lot of kids who cut. Normally following a traumatic issue (death of a mom from cancer...that was really bad) or just from extreme depression (i know a girl that doesn't take meds cause none of them helped and one even made her bipolar...meds arent always the answer).
From what I have seen and what I have done all I can say is just be there for her. Be her friend, listen to her. If anything, find out how and where she cuts. If it is vertical on her arms, then get help. That is attempted suicide. If it is horizontal and away from any major arteries...she is just doing it to get relief. Help her in ways you can, it really does mean a lot to anyone to be listened to and respected. If she has trust in you, you should have trust in her.

Cutting one's self is indication of deep-seated neuroses and may indicate suicidal tendencies. [/QUOTE]

True, it may be neuroses,but more likely it is a plea for attention. Did your friend tell you about this or did you see the marks? Quite likely she made this obvious to you, or to others she trusts. And in essence she is saying "I am being hurt, in fact I am being hurt so bad that cutting myself does not even compare." So, your friend is asking YOU for help and you can certainly give her some of this help by being there. However, you can only give her some help and in many ways she needs to help her self. Sounds like your friend has a long road to travel. You should certainly talk with someone you can trust who knows her, they can help you find the best solution. But, if there is any chance of suicide, or if she hints at it you need to tell some one right away, eventually she will realize that you did it because you cared...which is what she wanted in the first place. Obviously this forum is not a good place for advice given many of the posts...c'mon people!

um, huh?
Erk. I hadn't seen you in a while. Didn't know you were still here even. Now I'll stop hijacking.

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.
okay I didn't read the whole thred so I don't know how many times you have heard this, but you need to tell someone that you and your friend can both trust. Cutting feels good at the time, but it not only leaves physical scars but it is emotionally damaging too. If the cutting is not enough for you to worry about your friend (and it is) you need to realize there is a reason that people cut, and a lot of times it is much worse than you can imagine. Cutting gives you both control over something in life, and is also an escape from times when you have to zone out to live through it. Something seriously bad is going on for your friend, and you are going to have to be the one to help.

Ok, I'm condemning myself for doing this because I know I am about to be completely socially shunned. I used to be a cutter (teenage angst was a bitch). Nobody could say anything to make me do any different. No amount of counseling made me feel like a better person. Not one person could show me a reason why I should stop cutting. Why? I was too immersed in my own self-pitying world of personal loathing. Self-mutilation releases endorphins that give the cutter an impression of "feeling better" however temporary that is.

Attempted suicide might be a follow-up from self-mutilation as it was for me, but I realized that was stupid because if I were going to kill myself I would have just done it. It is a cry for attention, but only to those most trusted not a complete stranger. It's hard for me to say whether or not you should seek professional help for your friend because, on one side it never helped me or anyone else I talked to who did the same, but on the other side you'll never forgive yourself if your friend does commit suicide and you didn't take an active effort in preventing it while the signs were there.

Personally, what worked for me was realizing all the good things in life I would've missed if I died and seeing that after awhile the scars were just plain ugly. They're with me to this day and I just shake my head when I see them.

I hope you stay supportive of your friend because she could use someone like you who cares.

okay I didn't read the whole thred so I don't know how many times you have heard this, but you need to tell someone that you and your friend can both trust. Cutting feels good at the time, but it not only leaves physical scars but it is emotionally damaging too. If the cutting is not enough for you to worry about your friend (and it is) you need to realize there is a reason that people cut, and a lot of times it is much worse than you can imagine. Cutting gives you both control over something in life, and is also an escape from times when you have to zone out to live through it. Something seriously bad is going on for your friend, and you are going to have to be the one to help.

It depends on the cutting. I have my ways of handling stress, some of them are dangerous and could cause me to die probably easier than cutting myself would. When I have a friend that I relate my problems to, and talk to about those problems, I somewhat refrain from my previously mentioned dangerous antics when upset.

The fact that this girl has allowed her friend to know about the cutting (something she apparently hides) is a cry for help. The best response is to help her without involving authority figures (at this time - when she starts talking suicidal, that's when to be her friend the most). Authority figures will only add to the stress and are likely to remove her current stress-relief simply because it's misunderstood by so many people.


Songwai:

This is why I suggested finding something else to do when your friend feels like cutting. My personal favorite is to take long drives down back-country roads on my way to wherever I feel like cruising to - whether that be to a movie, a late-night run to Wal-Mart, to get something to eat, even to a gas-station to get something to snack on. Sometimes we all just need an escape from what stresses us - if you can get her away from her house, doing something somewhat aimless, perhaps you can relieve the stress some (seems to work for most people I know).

Dont make her drive alone, go pick her up and you do the driving and listening. Dont force her to talk about it, just let it come out on her own. She will, when she's ready. And that's when you can help her figure out what to do. Remember, though, that being an advisor does not mean telling her what to do. Rather, it means that you help her sort out her options and make the "best" decision for her - whether it's the one you would make or not.

Having a friend's shoulder to cry on is more helpful than a psychiatrist's cold stare and the bitter taste of anti-depression meds.
Wholeheartedly seconded

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.
I've only read your post, but...

Perhaps contrary to popular belief, your friends behaviour is fairly normal.
But it leaves scars. And the scars will get her no end of shit. Unless she lives on one of the friggin poles, she's not doing herself any favours (this comming from a guy with tatoos on his face). Tell her in no uncertain terms that you'll never sell her secret out, but that her self-esteem issues are adding injury to insult, 'cos not only will people usually be able to see it, but people who're turned on by scars are usually wankers.

Tell him/her that if it's so fucking bad, then you insist on finding a psychologist (one that can't prescribe drugs) for him/her. And that you'll either try to make her/his life hell or have him/her see the wanker.

Tell the person that if it'sd really that bad, then the person owes you to try your suggestions for at least half a year. Tell the person that you will help him/her do whatever s/he desires, as long as s/he'll do the same.

Help your friend clean up his/her flat. Have her/him stay with you. Take the person shopping. Show the person that s/he can be 100% self-reliant.

And try to get the wanket to fall in love.

I've only read your post, but...

Perhaps contrary to popular belief, your friends behaviour is fairly normal.
But it leaves scars. And the scars will get her no end of shit. Unless she lives on one of the friggin poles, she's not doing herself any favours (this comming from a guy with tatoos on his face). Tell her in no uncertain terms that you'll never sell her secret out, but that her self-esteem issues are adding injury to insult, 'cos not only will people usually be able to see it, but people who're turned on by scars are usually wankers.

Tell him/her that if it's so fucking bad, then you insist on finding a psychologist (one that can't prescribe drugs) for him/her. And that you'll either try to make her/his life hell or have him/her see the wanker.

Tell the person that if it'sd really that bad, then the person owes you to try your suggestions for at least half a year. Tell the person that you will help him/her do whatever s/he desires, as long as s/he'll do the same.

Help your friend clean up his/her flat. Have her/him stay with you. Take the person shopping. Show the person that s/he can be 100% self-reliant.

And try to get the wanket to fall in love.

Or, just suggest getting tattoos. Dont just let her get them spur of the moment, make her pick them out when she's not feeling depressed or self-loathing (if there are such times), and then go with her to make sure she doesnt make on-the-spot tattoo decisions. While she'll still have to live with them the rest of her life, at least they might not be as ugly as the scars.

Or, just suggest getting tattoos. Dont just let her get them spur of the moment, make her pick them out when she's not feeling depressed or self-loathing (if there are such times), and then go with her to make sure she doesnt make on-the-spot tattoo decisions. While she'll still have to live with them the rest of her life, at least they might not be as ugly as the scars.
Sorry did I say anything about adding insult to injury? Oh, I didn't? Arse...

Basically, I told the poster to treat his/her friend as a PERFUCKINGSON. To respect that people are different, and give advice based on what can kill you, what can make your life unnecesserily hard, and what may just help you get along.

Cutting your skinny little arms need neither be suicidal or an indication of sexual abuse. It doesn't even have to be begging for attention.

But just in case it's any of those things, then the only, fucking ONLY thing that matters, is focusing on the positive aspects of everyday-life. Negativity & meds get depressed people killed

Sorry did I say anything about adding insult to injury? Oh, I didn't? Arse...

Basically, I told the poster to treat his/her friend as a PERFUCKINGSON. To respect that people are different, and give advice based on what can kill you, what can make your life unnecesserily hard, and what may just help you get along.

Cutting your skinny little arms need neither be suicidal or an indication of sexual abuse. It doesn't even have to be begging for attention.

But just in case it's any of those things, then the only, fucking ONLY thing that matters, is focusing on the positive aspects of everyday-life. Negativity & meds get depressed people killed

Easy there, Killer. Go back and read all my posts in this thread before you start attacking my last post.

Perhaps then you'll understand...if not, and you still think I'm an arse for suggesting tat's, well, that's your own personal opinion. I just want it to be a well-informed one, not just one based on a single post without taking into account my previous 2-3 posts in this thread.

Originally Posted by Zanato
Having a friend's shoulder to cry on is more helpful than a psychiatrist's cold stare and the bitter taste of anti-depression meds.

In many cases yes, which is why I urged caution in making a decision. However, I was merely pointing out that if the best course of action (one that gets the friend safe and healthy) has the unfortunate effect of harming their friendship, then it should be done. After all it's hard for a friendship to survive if one of the friends can't.

Easy there, Killer. Go back and read all my posts in this thread before you start attacking my last post.

Perhaps then you'll understand...if not, and you still think I'm an arse for suggesting tat's, well, that's your own personal opinion. I just want it to be a well-informed one, not just one based on a single post without taking into account my previous 2-3 posts in this thread.
Providing I have something to be sorry about: Sorry

I jumped to conclusions. The above is the only post, beyond the OP, that I've read in this thread.

I'll withhold judgment 'till I've read the rest. My advice, however, stands, as it's based on personal experience rather than crap on a messageboard.

Having a friend's shoulder to cry on is more helpful than a psychiatrist's cold stare and the bitter taste of anti-depression meds.

It's that belief that leads some people to cut themselves so that their friends can see just how sad they are and will lavish attention on them. Sometimes a cold stare and an unbiased opinion is a great way to make people get over themselves.

It's that belief that leads some people to cut themselves so that their friends can see just how sad they are and will lavish attention on them. Sometimes a cold stare and an unbiased opinion is a great way to make people get over themselves.

It's also a great way to make people think that even their friends don't care if they commit suicide.... so what are they living for?

It's that belief that leads some people to cut themselves so that their friends can see just how sad they are and will lavish attention on them. Sometimes a cold stare and an unbiased opinion is a great way to make people get over themselves.

Ahhh, but in this case, the friend has been hiding it from pretty much everybody. It's a cry for help, but not so much one for lavish attention.

I commend you for using the verb "to cut" correctly.

Many incorrectly believe that "to cut" has an intransitive sense, and make mistakes like "my friend cuts" or "my parents found out that I cut."

Cut is, however, strictly a transitive verb, which is to say that it takes a direct object.

Thank you for your correct use of English.

You should tell the relevent authorities, probably the school psychologist.

It's that belief that leads some people to cut themselves so that their friends can see just how sad they are and will lavish attention on them. Sometimes a cold stare and an unbiased opinion is a great way to make people get over themselves.


is that why people cut and then hide it? :rolleyes:

You should tell the relevent authorities, probably the school psychologist.

And if her friend is not ready for this, it's probably the worst thing she can do (short of nothing). To get help, and for that help to be effective, one must do so of their own volition - not because someone turned them in. Especially not when it's a teen / young adult and they're suspicious of authority or rebellious in their own way. It can also create a dependancy on authority figures to help her friend cope with stress many years down the road instead of being able to deal with stresses of life on her own.

Easy there, Killer. Go back and read all my posts in this thread before you start attacking my last post.

Perhaps then you'll understand...if not, and you still think I'm an arse for suggesting tat's, well, that's your own personal opinion. I just want it to be a well-informed one, not just one based on a single post without taking into account my previous 2-3 posts in this thread.
Read your posts now, and I agree with you. Sorry, I think I'm a slightly different breed than you, but basically you, me & Rotovia (however unlikely on his part) are saying the same thing.

Stopping self-abuse isn't what matters at all. The method is what matters. People don't commit suicide because they can't affort levi's, people doesn't stone the authorities 'cos they have no money, and people don't cut themselves 'cos they can't kill themselves.

When people do something, it's either to achive something, or to supress their need for the same.
Friends can't always help, and recognising that you can't always help alleviate something you don't believe you're the cause of, is just as important as realising that there's something you need to do.

While it might not help a whole lot if the OP go smootch with her friend & start all sorts of love-shite, it might. Threatning, and living by that threat, to do the same, will probably make the problem so immediate that the 'cutter' will want to resolve it immediately, just to minimize the threat to the OP.

Setting the 'cutter' up for falling in love may do the same thing.

Regardless, never be afraid of seeking professional help, but never seek help that can, or would even suggest, medicating the knife-happy friend. Seek help where people can't possiply apply any pressure on the 'cutter'm whrether it's throgh medication ot changing her routine.

If she's suicidal - and she might be - then forcing a change in her routine, and especially forcing her on medication, may kill her.

And always consider whether it's actually a cry for help, or whether it's a fascination for something. It may be the latter, and if it is, then focusing attention on something she can consider abnormal or sick behaviour will only strenghten that behaviour. That's why answer No.1 is to occupy your friend in a way that leaves her no room to cut herself.

If you can, start painting with you, or horseriding ot some shit. Anything where all but a t-shirt is detrimental & there's a drive for her to either be Mo.1 or help you be it.

It depends on the cutting. I have my ways of handling stress, some of them are dangerous and could cause me to die probably easier than cutting myself would. When I have a friend that I relate my problems to, and talk to about those problems, I somewhat refrain from my previously mentioned dangerous antics when upset.

The fact that this girl has allowed her friend to know about the cutting (something she apparently hides) is a cry for help. The best response is to help her without involving authority figures (at this time - when she starts talking suicidal, that's when to be her friend the most). Authority figures will only add to the stress and are likely to remove her current stress-relief simply because it's misunderstood by so many people.

the cutting isn't really the problem though, in my experience cutting is a symptom of a bigger problem, but again I am only speaking from my experience with dealing with cutters professionally and also being a former cutter myself. everyone is different, but in most of the cases I have seen (including my own) cutting was the least of the person's worrys in fact it was about the healthiest thing in thier life, if you know someone is cutting you can almost assume that they need your help, it is an addiction that is hard to break.

the cutting isn't really the problem though, in my experience cutting is a symptom of a bigger problem, but again I am only speaking from my experience with dealing with cutters professionally and also being a former cutter myself. everyone is different, but in most of the cases I have seen (including my own) cutting was the least of the person's worrys in fact it was about the healthiest thing in thier life, if you know someone is cutting you can almost assume that they need your help, it is an addiction that is hard to break.

That's what I've been saying...why do people never read my posts / listen to what I tell them?

Yes, but more often than not, I've heard of disastrous consequences. The counselor was hostile, breached student-counselor confidentiality..etc.

Someone close to me cut for years, and it tooks years of slow help, mostly from themselves, and from me when they ran out of strength, to stop. You can't just medicate it away...You have to treat the cause. It's an attempt to control one's life, by inflicting pain..the one thing they truly feel they have control over. You can't outright condemn it, because that may exacerbate the problem, but you also can't condone it. The best thing you can do, right now, is to let them know you're always willing to listen, and give advice about their life.

In addition, compliment them from time to time..but mean it. It's very likely they suffer, among other things, from low-self esteem and depression. Having even one non-judgement, true friend will help immensely. Try to broach the subject of considering a doctor, and if they feel they'd be comfortable. By no means should you try to pressure them into going, or stopping..It likely will backfire. They have to want to heal, first and foremost.

As to the people who're being smart asses...this is one of the few subjects I'm sensetive about. If you can't say something helpful, just stay quiet, please.
Excellent, excellent post! [ cheers loudly ]

and people don't cut themselves 'cos they can't kill themselves.

I have to disagree here... the sense of finality that comes with putting a knife to your throat can deter lethal cuts for a long period of time. One can spend months working up the courage for the final cut, the whole time slowly building up a resiliency against the natural sense of dread that comes with applying pressure with a sharp utensil and preparing to pull

That's what I've been saying...why do people never read my posts / listen to what I tell them?
I thought I was agreeing (somewhat) sorry if I was unclear. ;)

the cutting isn't really the problem though, in my experience cutting is a symptom of a bigger problem, but again I am only speaking from my experience with dealing with cutters professionally and also being a former cutter myself. everyone is different, but in most of the cases I have seen (including my own) cutting was the least of the person's worrys in fact it was about the healthiest thing in thier life, if you know someone is cutting you can almost assume that they need your help, it is an addiction that is hard to break.
Seconded. And worth repeating:
It's usually the least of that person's problems
... And it's adictive as shit.

I know people who to this farkin day start cutting themselves when they're too drunk to just go home sleep it off, 'cos they're afraid their boyfriends will give them shit about it... Or at least, that's the excuse.

Focusing negative attention on the problem makes it all the more present & all the worse.

I have to disagree here... the sense of finality that comes with putting a knife to your throat can deter lethal cuts for a long period of time. One can spend months working up the courage for the final cut, the whole time slowly building up a resiliency against the natural sense of dread that comes with applying pressure with a sharp utensil and preparing to pull
Disagree all you like. I don't believe you for a second. Cutting oneself has nothing to do with suicide.
Sure, people may be suicidal, but the cutting has absolutely nothing to do with finding courage to do away with oneself.

Seconded. And worth repeating:
It's usually the least of that person's problems
... And it's adictive as shit.

I know people who to this farkin day start cutting themselves when they're too drunk to just go home sleep it off, 'cos they're afraid their boyfriends will give them shit about it... Or at least, that's the excuse.

Focusing negative attention on the problem makes it all the more present & all the worse.

Which is why taking the long way to watch a comedic movie, making yourself available to just listen, is often the best thing you can do. Most people can figure their life out for themselves, sometimes they just need to verbalize it, or bounce it off a friend, etc.

Disagree all you like. I don't believe you for a second. Cutting oneself has nothing to do with suicide.
Sure, people may be suicidal, but the cutting has absolutely nothing to do with finding courage to do away with oneself.

Most suicides arent a result of cutting, nor a knife to the throat. Most people who commit suicide do so with 2-3 different methods to ensure finality - example: overdose and then stick the shotgun barrel in their mouth. If the shotgun doesnt kill them, the pills will and vice versa.

Those that dont succeed in suicide are using it as an extreme cry for help (and at this point, they need professional help and good friends to be by their side through the recovery).

But, this isnt about suicide. It's about a method of stress relief - something that can be changed into a different, "healthier" method.

Seconded. And worth repeating:
It's usually the least of that person's problems
... And it's adictive as shit.

I know people who to this farkin day start cutting themselves when they're too drunk to just go home sleep it off, 'cos they're afraid their boyfriends will give them shit about it... Or at least, that's the excuse.

Focusing negative attention on the problem makes it all the more present & all the worse.
when I was doing it, there was such major stuff going on in my life that I had to basically be numb to deal with it, the pain of cutting actually felt good, it felt like I was me again, I felt alive. It is a great feeling in a sick kinda way.
I have tried to learn better ways to deal with life now, and I am out of the bad situation that I was in, but there are still somedays when cutting sounds like a good idea (even talking about it now has me thinking about it) but having a "cutting buddy" who I can talk to, and vent to, and cry with, really really has helped me to stop completely. If the OP thinks that help will hurt the situation, the best help you can give is to be the "unconditional friend" no matter what they tell you, no matter how bad you think it is (unless they talk about suicide) you listen and don't judge.

and if they do talk about suicide, listen, try to understand what they are feeling and get help, even after they get help, they still need thier "cutting buddy" someone they can let it all out around, that they can rid thier brain of any stress and not worry about the implications.

in fact everyone needs that friend and everyone needs to be that friend.

in fact everyone needs that friend and everyone needs to be that friend.

Wiser words are not often posted in these forums.

is that why people cut and then hide it? :rolleyes:

Oh please. How well can this person be hiding it if her friend knows? I'm not saying that all people who cut are making an overt and conscious effort to draw attention to themselves. What I am saying is that the cutting is an outward representation of something inside that person that is needing an outlet. I'm not saying that people who cut themselves are bad people or should be looked on with disdain. What they are are people who have something serious going on that needs clearing up, and usually that serious thing requires more than just understanding and sympathy.

One of my greatest friends in the world used to cut herself, but that was merely a sign of some rather serious self-image problems she had. She got help, and it helped her immensely.

She too complained that anti-depression medication she took made her feel horrible, and yet she was so much (outwardly at least) happier with herself and her life, and much much much more in control when she was taking her meds. When she'd go off them, it was immediately apparent. She abused herself in various ways. Her self esteem crumbled. She made horrible decisions in her personal life (jerkwad of a boyfriend,) and she got into personal trouble at work (sleeping around with management.)

This does not mean that the same will be true of everyone though. Everyone is different and reacts differently.

Which is why taking the long way to watch a comedic movie, making yourself available to just listen, is often the best thing you can do. Most people can figure their life out for themselves, sometimes they just need to verbalize it, or bounce it off a friend, etc.
Damn.. I'm positively spamming this topic.

What you say here never helps. I dare you to prove me wrong, and I'm not shitting you. It never helps.

Ignoring it's happening doesn't help at all. In fact, as far as I know, that sort of behaviour often makes 'cutting' lethal. If it's something serious ( not saying it is), then being up-front about it is the first & foremost thing you need to do. Anything beyond that is play-by-ear. But ALWAYS confront it. Depending on whether the cuts looks dangerous (we humans can take a fairly impressive punishment), one should consider how serious one needs to be about it. Like already stated, I have quite a few friends who used to cut themselves to shreads. I had a friend who killed herself 'cos Another of our mutoal friends confronted her about it, and pretty much forced her to take it up wityh her school, which resulted in medication.

If there's any advice at all in this world, then it's NOT doing that.

Wiser words are not often posted in these forums.
Indeed. It's downright scary

when I was doing it, there was such major stuff going on in my life that I had to basically be numb to deal with it, the pain of cutting actually felt good, it felt like I was me again, I felt alive. It is a great feeling in a sick kinda way. *snip*

I've found that if you take a scalding hot shower/bath you can achieve the same effect. The only thing is that if one takes too hot of a shower it can result in burns or passing out. It works, though if done right. Even though my counselor didn't agree, I think it's a lot better than slashing the skin to ribbons.

Oh please. How well can this person be hiding it if her friend knows? I'm not saying that all people who cut are making an overt and conscious effort to draw attention to themselves. What I am saying is that the cutting is an outward representation of something inside that person that is needing an outlet. I'm not saying that people who cut themselves are bad people or should be looked on with disdain. What they are are people who have something serious going on that needs clearing up, and usually that serious thing requires more than just understanding and sympathy.

One of my greatest friends in the world used to cut herself, but that was merely a sign of some rather serious self-image problems she had. She got help, and it helped her immensely.

She too complained that anti-depression medication she took made her feel horrible, and yet she was so much (outwardly at least) happier with herself and her life, and much much much more in control when she was taking her meds. When she'd go off them, it was immediately apparent. She abused herself in various ways. Her self esteem crumbled. She made horrible decisions in her personal life (jerkwad of a boyfriend,) and she got into personal trouble at work (sleeping around with management.)

This does not mean that the same will be true of everyone though. Everyone is different and reacts differently.

As I posted before, the girl cutting herself let her friend know once her friend had gained that trust. It's not something that was readily known about the cutter as the OP didnt know for quite some time and has "just found out." This means that it's not a public thing, it's something this girl does in private and she's begun to trust the OP enough to confide in her in hopes of finding the "cutting buddy" Smunkeeville was describing.

Ahhh, but in this case, the friend has been hiding it from pretty much everybody. It's a cry for help, but not so much one for lavish attention.

If it was overt, it would be obvious. By keeping it within a tight circle of friends, one insures that the response will be sympathetic.

Undersatand that my heart really goes out to this person. I am NOT saying that I look down on people who cut. I merely strongly worry about them (based on personal experience with friends who have been cutters,) and hope that they work things out.

I've also found (again based on personal experience,) that the subject of cutting always seemed to come up when my friend and I were having a disagreement, and it usually managed to deflect the discussion away from what we were arguing about.

That's what I've been saying...why do people never read my posts / listen to what I tell them?
I've been reading everything you've posted, and mostly agreeing too. :p

As I posted before, the girl cutting herself let her friend know once her friend had gained that trust. It's not something that was readily known about the cutter as the OP didnt know for quite some time and has "just found out." This means that it's not a public thing, it's something this girl does in private and she's begun to trust the OP enough to confide in her in hopes of finding the "cutting buddy" Smunkeeville was describing.

If it were obvious, people who didn't know or care about the cutter would react negatively. I'm not saying it's a mechanism to get attention from strangers, but it does seem to me a way to insure the sympathy of intimates.

But, this is based on anecdotal experience, not on psychological training, so I very well could be horribly wrong.

Damn.. I'm positively spamming this topic.

What you say here never helps. I dare you to prove me wrong, and I'm not shitting you. It never helps.

Ignoring it's happening doesn't help at all. In fact, as far as I know, that sort of behaviour often makes 'cutting' lethal. If it's something serious ( not saying it is), then being up-front about it is the first & foremost thing you need to do. Anything beyond that is play-by-ear. But ALWAYS confront it. Depending on whether the cuts looks dangerous (we humans can take a fairly impressive punishment), one should consider how serious one needs to be about it. Like already stated, I have quite a few friends who used to cut themselves to shreads. I had a friend who killed herself 'cos Another of our mutoal friends confronted her about it, and pretty much forced her to take it up wityh her school, which resulted in medication.

If there's any advice at all in this world, then it's NOT doing that.

I didnt say avoid it...openness is always a prerequisite for being the friend she needs. Chances are, though, that talking about it (the cutting and what's going on that's causing it) can help. Taking a long drive is a good way to do that - gets away from everything else going on - no TV, no phones, no family, no homework, etc. However, pushing her to talk when she's not ready to talk about it can be detrimental. Ask leading questions, but dont outright push her to talk about her problems.

If it were obvious, people who didn't know or care about the cutter would react negatively. I'm not saying it's a mechanism to get attention from strangers, but it does seem to me a way to insure the sympathy of intimates.

But, this is based on anecdotal experience, not on psychological training, so I very well could be horribly wrong.

The fact that she hides it from her family and probably all her friends shows that it's most likely stress relief. Most private cutters dont do it for attention - even from intimates. They can get that same attention without being so secretive, and are more likely to get more intimate attention by cutting publicly (appears more serious).

Staying silent is the worst thing you could do.

If you care for her, you will let somebody know. She needs help, and she ain't gonna get by herself.

If it was overt, it would be obvious. By keeping it within a tight circle of friends, one insures that the response will be sympathetic.

Undersatand that my heart really goes out to this person. I am NOT saying that I look down on people who cut. I merely strongly worry about them (based on personal experience with friends who have been cutters,) and hope that they work things out.

I've also found (again based on personal experience,) that the subject of cutting always seemed to come up when my friend and I were having a disagreement, and it usually managed to deflect the discussion away from what we were arguing about.

And by letting your friend use the cutting threat to deflect the argument lets your friend win. Sometimes you have to be tough and tell them that whether they cut themselves or not, they'll still be wrong instead of letting them use that as a trump card to win by default...

While I cannot always advocate using such extreme reverse psychology, sometimes it's needed. Continuing to let your friend threaten to cut herself/himself as a way to avoid something unpleasant means they know it gives them power over you and are more likely to go back to it. Rather, treating cutting as a normal method of stress relief is more likely to produce positive results.

The fact that she hides it from her family and probably all her friends shows that it's most likely stress relief. Most private cutters dont do it for attention - even from intimates. They can get that same attention without being so secretive, and are more likely to get more intimate attention by cutting publicly (appears more serious).

Of course they can get attention in less self-destructive ways....just as you could have relieved stress in a less self-destructive way.

Please please please understand I'm not trying to knock you or anyone else. It's just that my friend (who was a very private cutter as well,) sometimes used that as a club to keep me from criticizing her (not that I nagged at her or we fought often at all...but all friends have theor disagreements) If I made a comment criticizing her, she'd bring up the cutting (not always or even often, of course.) It was like a trump card she played to redirect justifiable disagreements. On the other hand, I'm confident that she wasn't doing it on purpose.

Of course they can get attention in less self-destructive ways....just as you could have relieved stress in a less self-destructive way.

Please please please understand I'm not trying to knock you or anyone else. It's just that my friend (who was a very private cutter as well,) sometimes used that as a club to keep me from criticizing her (not that I nagged at her or we fought often at all...but all friends have theor disagreements) If I made a comment criticizing her, she'd bring up the cutting (not always or even often, of course.) It was like a trump card she played to redirect justifiable disagreements. On the other hand, I'm confident that she wasn't doing it on purpose.

LOL...read my post just prior to this one (and I apologize if it sounds harsh / judgemental)

in fact everyone needs that friend and everyone needs to be that friend.
Good advice, nice lady. Even us cantakerous old veterans need a friend now and then. :)

And by letting your friend use the cutting threat to deflect the argument lets your friend win. Sometimes you have to be tough and tell them that whether they cut themselves or not, they'll still be wrong instead of letting them use that as a trump card to win by default...

While I cannot always advocate using such extreme reverse psychology, sometimes it's needed. Continuing to let your friend threaten to cut herself/himself as a way to avoid something unpleasant means they know it gives them power over you and are more likely to go back to it. Rather, treating cutting as a normal method of stress relief is more likely to produce positive results.

Oh, I let her know I wasn't going to go for it, but of course I cared about her and I couldn't always control my sympathetic reaction and my desire to protect her, even from herself.

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.

I am a school counselor, we exist to help in issues such as these. Tell your friend to please talk with either this principal or one of the counselors she feels most comfortable around.

The fact that she hides it from her family and probably all her friends shows that it's most likely stress relief. Most private cutters dont do it for attention - even from intimates. They can get that same attention without being so secretive, and are more likely to get more intimate attention by cutting publicly (appears more serious).

There's a dichotomy involved sometimes. A cutter doesn't necescarily want to openly display their wounds because he/she fears negative judgement. Nobody wants to be called a freak or anything like that.

However, I think that deep down a cutter wants somebody to recognize the fact that he or she is hurting and needs some form of comfort. If a person truly wanted to keep it hidden, it wouldn't be too hard to do. Often, a trusted friend who finds out by "accident" was given some kind of intentional clue.

LOL...read my post just prior to this one (and I apologize if it sounds harsh / judgemental)

No worries. It's a sensitive subject for anyone that has had experience with it in themselves or in friends.

But also realize that, as in any habitual behavior, what may work for you may not work for everyone. Some alcoholics have to go cold turkey and never touch the stuff again. Some alcoholics recognize what they're doing (no matter what the more reactionary "experts" say,) and stop the addiction, but are still able to enjoy an occasional drink.

In other words, both our experiences are anecdotal, yours from the inside and mine as an outsider, and we could both be mistaken in this instance.

(heh, I just noticed our identical phrasing...great minds and all that.)

There's a dichotomy involved sometimes. A cutter doesn't necescarily want to openly display their wounds because he/she fears negative judgement. Nobody wants to be called a freak or anything like that.

However, I think that deep down a cutter wants somebody to recognize the fact that he or she is hurting and needs some form of comfort. If a person truly wanted to keep it hidden, it wouldn't be too hard to do. Often, a trusted friend who finds out by "accident" was given some kind of intentional clue.

There is a difference between saying someone cuts for attention, or letting someone know about the cutting in the hope they can help, at least it reliefs a bit of the stress carrying such a secret brings.

There's a dichotomy involved sometimes. A cutter doesn't necescarily want to openly display their wounds because he/she fears negative judgement. Nobody wants to be called a freak or anything like that.

However, I think that deep down a cutter wants somebody to recognize the fact that he or she is hurting and needs some form of comfort. If a person truly wanted to keep it hidden, it wouldn't be too hard to do. Often, a trusted friend who finds out by "accident" was given some kind of intentional clue.

Right, it's a cry for help. And until that person cutting themself is ready to go to an authority figure, the best a friend can do is be the best damn friend possible. Sending someone to the school counselor before they're ready can return negative results - and the stress causing the cutting isnt always that extreme, often it's the only way the person knows how to deal with it.

Or, just suggest getting tattoos. Dont just let her get them spur of the moment, make her pick them out when she's not feeling depressed or self-loathing (if there are such times), and then go with her to make sure she doesnt make on-the-spot tattoo decisions. While she'll still have to live with them the rest of her life, at least they might not be as ugly as the scars.

Neut, there is a problem with that. That could become a replacement/substitute for cutting. The person I mentioned got a tattoo, and they're addicted. They're smart enough to know that it'd be stupid to act on the addiction formed from that needle, so they don't. But, they're also trying to stop cutting. However, they plan on getting "Strength" and "Perseverance" on their wrists, as a reminder to never cut again. Which I think is a damned wonderful idea.

Excellent, excellent post! [ cheers loudly ]

Thank you, very much, Eut. I just hope the original poster's able to use it. I'm getting a wee bit worried/frustrated with the sarcastic/uninformed psych answers, and hoping the best advice isn't buried.

Also..Neut, if I'm ever in your area, I'll happily buy you a drink. I'm really, really glad to see someone else really taking the time to respond in depth and as often as you have to a subject as serious as this one, especially given the fact that you seem rather informed.

Neut, there is a problem with that. That could become a replacement/substitute for cutting. The person I mentioned got a tattoo, and they're addicted. They're smart enough to know that it'd be stupid to act on the addiction formed from that needle, so they don't. But, they're also trying to stop cutting. However, they plan on getting "Strength" and "Perseverance" on their wrists, as a reminder to never cut again. Which I think is a damned wonderful idea.



Thank you, very much, Eut. I just hope the original poster's able to use it. I'm getting a wee bit worried/frustrated with the sarcastic/uninformed psych answers, and hoping the best advice isn't buried.

Also..Neut, if I'm ever in your area, I'll happily buy you a drink. I'm really, really glad to see someone else really taking the time to respond in depth and as often as you have to a subject as serious as this one, especially given the fact that you seem rather informed.


This is why I suggested having the friend decide on the tattoos he or she would like when she's not feeling depressed / self-loathing. While tattoos are addicting, at least they're somewhat removable nowadays (and more likely to be even more removable in the future) and arent spur of the moment decisions (decided on beforehand) so are more likely to be approved of when she's not depressed / self-loathing.

And while I dont drink beer, I'll be more than willing to meet at the local bar and have a shot or two.

Just for the record, I'm not a cutter and never was. I do have self-destructive tendencies when I get stressed. As for my posts in this thread, I'm simply a student of the human psyche who sometimes cares too much about other people for his own good.

This is why I suggested having the friend decide on the tattoos he or she would like when she's not feeling depressed / self-loathing. While tattoos are addicting, at least they're somewhat removable nowadays (and more likely to be even more removable in the future) and arent spur of the moment decisions (decided on beforehand) so are more likely to be approved of when she's not depressed / self-loathing.

And while I dont drink beer, I'll be more than willing to meet at the local bar and have a shot or two.

Just for the record, I'm not a cutter and never was. I do have self-destructive tendencies when I get stressed. As for my posts in this thread, I'm simply a student of the human psyche who sometimes cares too much about other people for his own good.
I know, but it's quite easy to have a relapse or temptation thereof, especially if you've recently quit. Hence my caveat. If going for the tattoo, I'd wait a few months, at least, after having finally quit, and getting something really meaningful to commemorate the moment.

Fine by me..I hate beer..I much prefer the hard stuff.

Oh, I figured you hadn't ever cut, but I could tell that you've had some experience in either helping resolve such, or have learned extensively about it. Believe me, I know how it is to be a student of the human mind, and caring a bit too much at times.

I know, but it's quite easy to have a relapse or temptation thereof, especially if you've recently quit. Hence my caveat. If going for the tattoo, I'd wait a few months, at least, after having finally quit, and getting something really meaningful to commemorate the moment.

Fine by me..I hate beer..I much prefer the hard stuff.

Oh, I figured you hadn't ever cut, but I could tell that you've had some experience in either helping resolve such, or have learned extensively about it. Believe me, I know how it is to be a student of the human mind, and caring a bit too much at times.
Blah.

Did any of you louts ever ask yourselves what the fuck the problem is? Is it even a problem?

Some people like scars. Some like pain. Some like doing something that unequivocably sets them a million miles apart from you.

Neut S. Sent you a TG

For some real advice, all I can say is, don't do what I did.

That being, having someone you really love, learning they cut, not being able to get them to stop, then give them the cold shoulder until they stop.

They just lie to you eventually, and keep doing it. I learned that after a long while, though I knew subconsciously.

Blah.

Did any of you louts ever ask yourselves what the fuck the problem is? Is it even a problem?

Some people like scars. Some like pain. Some like doing something that unequivocably sets them a million miles apart from you.

Neut S. Sent you a TG

and some fucking don't like scars and pain and do have a problem and would like to stop.

Blah.

Did any of you louts ever ask yourselves what the fuck the problem is? Is it even a problem?

Some people like scars. Some like pain. Some like doing something that unequivocably sets them a million miles apart from you.

Neut S. Sent you a TG

Replied.

I'm going to have to agree with everyone who is saying that being there for her as a friend is far better than forcing her into professional help.

If you force her it's likely that it will be very harmful. Firstly, she'll lose trust in you and this could have horrible effects, not something you want at a time when she may be suicidal. You can also do a lot more to help if you're there to trust, there for her to talk to, there to accept and love her. Secondly, you may put her off getting help for the rest of her life. She'll resent it and have bad memories about it. Also, if she doesn't want help than she won't work at it and it may not help at all. It's better for her to be able to get professional help, if that's what she needs, in her own time when she decides she actually wants help.

Self-harming doesn't necessarily mean she is necessarily at risk of commiting suicide. In fact, stopping cutting could put her at greater risk. While cutting isn't the best coping method, it is her coping method and if you take that away she has nothing. She should not stop until she has replacement methods, partly to stop the immediate addiction (e.g. holding icecubes, snapping elastic bands, punching pillows, ripping paper, simply keeping busy until urges pass) but mainly to deal with the underlying problems. Self-harming is her way of coping with life, not a way of ending it. Take her way of coping with life away and she may well end it.

I'm sure I saw an article somewhere that describes this much better but I have to go in a second so I'll be brief.

Professional help isn't a miracle cure and isn't always the best cure. It's only something which can aid recovery, to larger or lesser degrees. For some people it is useless. (Also, another point, not all professionals are miracle workers. Many don't understand selfharm and can be useless with help). The main factor is whether they are willing to fight and change their ways. If they aren't willing, it's pointless. If your friend is hinting about getting help or seems interested but scared then by all means gently try and persuade her. But if she is adamantly opposed to it, be very gentle indeed. She needs to know she can talk to you without judgement or pressure.

Read up about depression and selfharm to understand it some more and perhaps offer her suggestions on how to cope.

If she knows she has a friend that supports her and is there for her and accepts her, that's much much more likely to stop her killing herself than seeing a therapist is.

Another thing, having a friend who selfharms/is depressive/is suicidal can be very stressful so make sure you take time to look after yourself and make sure that you have a way of coping if it gets hard for you.

Take care and good luck with it all :)

(This is all coming from someone who has selfharmed, has two close friends who selfharmed - one who put me in the same situation as you-, has various friends on the internet who selfharm and who has done research all over the web into these issues. Professionals do support my view, especially those who have researched into selfharm especcialy or those who have selfharmed themselves.)

Oh, and my amateur, under-construction website on depression is here (www.freewebs.com/understandingdepression).

I'd appreciate it if we could keep this to serious comments. This is my life, after all.
Some would feel you have come to the wrong place darling.

Slap some sense into her.

OK, I've been dating a cutter for the last 3 years.. and I have things figured out! Really I do, be supportive, cutters hate that. If you're understanding about it, and treat it like no big deal, they'll eventually slow down, and stop. I know a lot of people who have cut (I haven't) and I don't know too many people who cut into their late 20's. But honestly, people tend to cut because they feel that's the only control they have in their lives, to cause pain. There's those who do it for pleasure, but eventually it doesn't solve thier problems anymore. It's much like a minor drug, it's fun/addictive for awhile and just slowly peels away. I'm guessing you friend is between 13-20. Trust me, as long as she's not doing deep slits across her wrists or throat.. let her do it. Encourage her to be creative about it.. like ask her to do a star the next time she feels like doing it, and little by little you'll notice her doing it less. I've gotten it to my gf hasn't cut for over a year, she does slip up occasionaly, but I'd rather her do it once a year when she feels really stressed, than continually.

Be a good friend, and be understanding. If she's not trying to kill herself she won't. People who really commit suicide tend to get it in the first try. Except that one guy who jumped off a 10 story building, landed on his neck, lived, and is now in jail for trying to commit suicide. That sucks..

Some would feel you have come to the wrong place darling.

Slap some sense into her.
Why don't you ever slap some sense into me?

.. I feel so ignored :(

Edit: Just thougth I'd say thanks Neut S. Still thinking (and dunno whether ti insert the :cool or :headbang gif)

Why don't you ever slap some sense into me?

.. I feel so ignored :(

Edit: Just thougth I'd say thanks Neut S. Still thinking (and dunno whether ti insert the :cool or :headbang gif)
Do you want me to slap some sense into you?

Do you want me to slap some sense into you?
As long as it's not nuclear armed hogs, you can slap just about anything into me ;)

As long as it's not nuclear armed hogs, you can slap just about anything into me ;)
http://www.andrew.cmu.edu/user/eychen/ECSC-hotel2%20paddle.jpg

http://www.andrew.cmu.edu/user/eychen/ECSC-hotel2%20paddle.jpg
If you'd actually done that, I think I would've died of shame.

Note to self: Don't make suggestive comments to Harlesburg, you might never get it up again.

If you'd actually done that, I think I would've died of shame.

Note to self: Don't make suggestive comments to Harlesburg, you might never get it up again.
http://aswgt.com/P050%20Handy%20Paddle.jpg
mwhahahahahaha

mwhahahahahaha
What disturbs me the most is that you actually have these pictures handy.. Especially the former. I guess the latter would have been fine if I'd never seen the first one.

What disturbs me the most is that you actually have these pictures handy.. Especially the former. I guess the latter would have been fine if I'd never seen the first one.
I googled Paddles.;)

I googled Paddles.;)
MArk my words: Google is a sick, twisted, heathen peice of search engine. It should be rated pg-60, if public accessible at all

I'd still like access though.

MArk my words: Google is a sick, twisted, heathen peice of search engine. It should be rated pg-60, if public accessible at all

I'd still like access though.
Yep from what i have seen yep.

yeah, google's great:

http://images.animanga.nu/fanart/1285/offtopic.png

I've found that if you take a scalding hot shower/bath you can achieve the same effect. The only thing is that if one takes too hot of a shower it can result in burns or passing out. It works, though if done right. Even though my counselor didn't agree, I think it's a lot better than slashing the skin to ribbons.
yeah, my new thing this week is doing dishes in really hot water (not hot enough to scald) but it feels similar, I think though that I should probably stop before I get back into a bigger problem.

Self-harming doesn't necessarily mean she is necessarily at risk of commiting suicide. In fact, stopping cutting could put her at greater risk. While cutting isn't the best coping method, it is her coping method and if you take that away she has nothing. She should not stop until she has replacement methods, partly to stop the immediate addiction (e.g. holding icecubes, snapping elastic bands, punching pillows, ripping paper, simply keeping busy until urges pass) but mainly to deal with the underlying problems. Self-harming is her way of coping with life, not a way of ending it. Take her way of coping with life away and she may well end it.


Rather than promote violent ways of handling her stress when it's built up to the point of explosion, promote "healthier" ways of handling stress before it builds up. Treat the problem (build-up of stress / frustration) rather than the symptoms (self-destructive explosions from the build-up). By helping a cutter realize when they're starting to stress and providing ways for them to deal with the stress as it's beginning to build, they're less prone to violent episodes or cutting.

Cutting is not the problem, cutting is the symptoms of a larger problem. The larger problem being a buildup of stress and frustration resulting in the feeling of drowning / futility leading to cutting. Take away the first block and the rest will fall away as well.

I have a friend and I recently found out that she cuts herself. I told her I wouldn't tell anyone, but now I'm having second thoughts. I'm torn between being a good friend and a trust-worthy friend. Plus, I have a lot of friends from being friends with her. If she hates me, they'll hate me. Another bad thing is that her dad seems very weird. He might be the violent type. One good thing is that we have a very cool understanding principal (who I have met many times for similar issues). Advice and support are welcome.
Unfortunately, there is not much you can do. From my experince, things only help for a short while, and then get worse. And my experince is quite large in dealing with this sort of thing. Two of my best freinds in the world are cutters. I'm a cutter. But like I said this is only my experince. I do support you trying to do what you can though.

Rather than promote violent ways of handling her stress when it's built up to the point of explosion, promote "healthier" ways of handling stress before it builds up. Treat the problem (build-up of stress / frustration) rather than the symptoms (self-destructive explosions from the build-up). By helping a cutter realize when they're starting to stress and providing ways for them to deal with the stress as it's beginning to build, they're less prone to violent episodes or cutting.

Cutting is not the problem, cutting is the symptoms of a larger problem. The larger problem being a buildup of stress and frustration resulting in the feeling of drowning / futility leading to cutting. Take away the first block and the rest will fall away as well.
Oh I definitly agree which is why I put that the main focus should be on tackling the underlying problems. I still think that methods of coping with the stress when it reaches that point can be useful, at least at first to try and stop the cycle of selfharm and so that there's something incase it reaches that point.

But yes, the larger problems which lead to cutting are priority.

At the risk of being shot, I'll say that cutters are hot, but then I always enjoyed the scent of self-loathing and desperation.
At the risk of standing next to you in front of the firing squad I'll agree that cutters are hot, but mainly because I find blood kind of sexy.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9899203&postcount=49
Kill her then yourself

(why are you asking an internet message board for advice )
Congratulations, you've just received an Official Warning
Why not ask for advice? Isn't that what General sometimes is for? Your first part of the post in this thread reflects exactly why you posted the second part of your message, because certain people just shouldn't post in these sort of threads at all.


http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9899383&postcount=63
You can go piss yourself man! Maybe some people need help and this is one place to get it. Why must you be so blind to issues at hand that are poisoning the youth of today? (By the way this is coming from a "youth") Maybe you should wise up and act like an adult (If you are) or grow up and get a life.
Responding to Axis Nova in this manner does absolutely nothing. I strongly suggest that you not let others upset you into retaliating, because you will receive just as bad of a punishment as them. Don't do that again.


At the risk of standing next to you in front of the firing squad I'll agree that cutters are hot, but mainly because I find blood kind of sexy.

Not necessary at all.

And to the rest of you who've given bad advice, and made this into a joke. You should be damn ashamed of yourselves. This is a serious topic.


Anyways, I've seen more than enough helpful advice, especially from Eutrusca, Neutered Sputniks, and Lord-General Drache. I'm locking this because I think that it's more than enough to help you figure things out. Good luck with your friend.

On second thought, I'm going to unlock this and let the debate continue, just as long as everyone keeps civil and serious.

Rather than promote violent ways of handling her stress when it's built up to the point of explosion, promote "healthier" ways of handling stress before it builds up. Treat the problem (build-up of stress / frustration) rather than the symptoms (self-destructive explosions from the build-up). By helping a cutter realize when they're starting to stress and providing ways for them to deal with the stress as it's beginning to build, they're less prone to violent episodes or cutting.

Cutting is not the problem, cutting is the symptoms of a larger problem. The larger problem being a buildup of stress and frustration resulting in the feeling of drowning / futility leading to cutting. Take away the first block and the rest will fall away as well.

and sometimes the real problem of it all sits even deeper. it's sometimes hard to find the root, sometimes people don't even know what it is themselves, or don't admit it. and there is the problem that every person is different, what could help one, could end up bad for another.

get one of these

http://www-scf.usc.edu/~arho/itp204/bandaid.gif

and sometimes the real problem of it all sits even deeper. it's sometimes hard to find the root, sometimes people don't even know what it is themselves, or don't admit it. and there is the problem that every person is different, what could help one, could end up bad for another.

Indeed, and I offer only suggestions for what might work. I dont know your friends, only you can know what would work to help them.

In the end, my advice is simply to be the best shoulder for them to cry on that you can be. Help them work through their problems and be completely open and honest with them.

get one of these

http://www-scf.usc.edu/~arho/itp204/bandaid.gif

That was a bit unneeded, especially following Euro's post.

Don't break her trust, try to help her in whatever way you can, but keep her secret.

That was a bit unneeded, especially following Euro's post.
What? Don't you want to stop the bleeding? Don't you want to make her feel loved so perhaps she wouldn't want to cut herself?

What? Don't you want to stop the bleeding? Don't you want to make her feel loved so perhaps she wouldn't want to cut herself?

Its never that simple, trust me.:(

Its never that simple, trust me.:(
Hey, I know that. But you have to start somewhere.

A bandaid and some love is a very good start IMHO