NationStates Jolt Archive

So, I thought of this one while talking in another thread, and figured it probably deserved its own thread, rather than pollute that other one with these ideas. Here's the posts:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gargantua City State
Take a look at the Conservative Party next time Question Period is on. Lots of old people. They're stuck in the past.
Mind you, there's lots of old people in all the parties...
Why is it that old people are decided to be more fit to govern? A question for another thread, probably. :P

You should create such a thread, I'm sure it would be popular.

It indeed is a concern. I suppose it has to do with how our society judges respectability and competence. While age may bring experience, there are a lot of old morons in position of power. And young persons are by no means incompetent solely because of their age.

What we're left with is voting for old people who are young at heart. Once again, Jack Layton comes to mind.

So, why DO older people run the countries?
I don't remember a young Prime Minister or President... then again, I'm not old... there may have been some.
I mean, in a more and more technologically advanced society, with rapidly changing ideals of freedom, why are the OLD people telling us how to think and what to do with these new innovations they often don't understand so well? I think the whole same sex issue would have been much less debated if left up to the younger generation. Most people my age and younger know people who are gay, and say, "Meh. That's their call." The only people I've heard who hotly contest such things are... old and set in their ways.
Is it time to maybe think about changing voting patterns? Do we need more young blood in government to keep up with the rapid changes of the modern world? Might we actually get young people to VOTE if they had people they could really identify with!? You ALWAYS hear politicians saying, "Oh, we had hoped to get more young supporters out to the polls" and then they wonder why they didn't show up. Maybe it has something to do with old men in suits who debate stupid things that the young generation thinks is pretty cut and dry, and doesn't matter so much?
This sort of thing always makes me want to run for politics, but then I remember the negative connotation of the title "politician" and I don't want to get wrapped into THAT. :P There's no place for honest opinion, and admitting you're fallible and sometimes (often) wrong in politics. :P

So, I thought of this one while talking in another thread, and figured it probably deserved its own thread, rather than pollute that other one with these ideas. Here's the posts:



So, why DO older people run the countries?
I don't remember a young Prime Minister or President... then again, I'm not old... there may have been some.
I mean, in a more and more technologically advanced society, with rapidly changing ideals of freedom, why are the OLD people telling us how to think and what to do with these new innovations they often don't understand so well? I think the whole same sex issue would have been much less debated if left up to the younger generation. Most people my age and younger know people who are gay, and say, "Meh. That's their call." The only people I've heard who hotly contest such things are... old and set in their ways.
Is it time to maybe think about changing voting patterns? Do we need more young blood in government to keep up with the rapid changes of the modern world? Might we actually get young people to VOTE if they had people they could really identify with!? You ALWAYS hear politicians saying, "Oh, we had hoped to get more young supporters out to the polls" and then they wonder why they didn't show up. Maybe it has something to do with old men in suits who debate stupid things that the young generation thinks is pretty cut and dry, and doesn't matter so much?
This sort of thing always makes me want to run for politics, but then I remember the negative connotation of the title "politician" and I don't want to get wrapped into THAT. :P There's no place for honest opinion, and admitting you're fallible and sometimes (often) wrong in politics. :P

Just a few thoughts off the top of my head:

Older people tend to vote more than young people, and tend to think that young people do not have the benefit of wisdom and experience, and thus don't vote for anyone who seems too young. Older people have had the opportunity to build up support networks and favours - most beneficial if you're trying to become party leader or leader of a country. It costs a lot of money to run for office, older people tend to have more cash than young folks. Younger politicians usually have to work their way up the food chain: college politics, municipal politics, provincial/state politics before getting to the big big leagues.

Equus has good points. Also, the US constitution sets age limitations.

Additionally, part of this question depends on your perception of old. Many national level politicians in the US are in their 40s. For example, 8 of the 43 presidents (18%) were under 50 at inaguration. (cite (http://www.factmonster.com/ipka/A0194030.html))

(I am guessing you are either in your teens and assume that people in their 40s
are old, or you simply precieve that national level politicians tend to be older than they actually are. At 37, I tend not to precieve someone in their 40s, or even 50s, as old.)

Equus has good points. Also, the US constitution sets age limitations.

Additionally, part of this question depends on your perception of old. Many national level politicians in the US are in their 40s. For example, 8 of the 43 presidents (18%) were under 50 at inaguration. (cite (http://www.factmonster.com/ipka/A0194030.html))

(I am guessing you are either in your teens and assume that people in their 40s
are old, or you simply precieve that national level politicians tend to be older than they actually are. At 37, I tend not to precieve someone in their 40s, or even 50s, as old.)

Interestingly enough, in the leadership course of the Bloc Quebecois(separatist party of Quebec) the question of age has arisen.

One of the candidates is sometimes lookat at like he's a little too young to be running for leadership. Know how old he is? 41.

While 39 may not seem old to you, maybe you'll agree that 41 isn't young either. It's middle aged.

How many MPs in their twenties do you see? In their thirties, even? Far too few for their respective proportions of the population. The young and not-so-young have the same proplem as women in politics: underrepresentation. It's widespread, it sucks, and there's no valid reason for it to be so.

Let's face it: old fossils have taken over the power of politics, and they're guarding it jealously. It's understandable, but it still sucks. I don't think I've ever heard of a person in their twenties being a Minister or first Minister. Almost systematically, the important posts are being given to men at least over 40, and most of the times over 50 and 60 years old.

Side note: we really need some stats on this, but I'm too lazy to search for them. A cookie for who gets on the job.

How many MPs in their twenties do you see? In their thirties, even? Far too few for their respective proportions of the population. The young and not-so-young have the same proplem as women in politics: underrepresentation. It's widespread, it sucks, and there's no valid reason for it to be so.
Its the same for women as it is for young people. You can’t get elected if you don’t run.

Interestingly enough, in the leadership course of the Bloc Quebecois(separatist party of Quebec) the question of age has arisen.

One of the candidates is sometimes lookat at like he's a little too young to be running for leadership. Know how old he is? 41.

While 39 may not seem old to you, maybe you'll agree that 41 isn't young either. It's middle aged.

How many MPs in their twenties do you see? In their thirties, even? Far too few for their respective proportions of the population. The young and not-so-young have the same proplem as women in politics: underrepresentation. It's widespread, it sucks, and there's no valid reason for it to be so.

Let's face it: old fossils have taken over the power of politics, and they're guarding it jealously. It's understandable, but it still sucks. I don't think I've ever heard of a person in their twenties being a Minister or first Minister. Almost systematically, the important posts are being given to men at least over 40, and most of the times over 50 and 60 years old.

Side note: we really need some stats on this, but I'm too lazy to search for them. A cookie for who gets on the job.

Like I said - it's a matter of perception. You see 39 as old. I don't.

IMO this question is rather meaningless, unless a common definition of old is first established. Then we can look at the statistics and see if the question is valid.

IMO this question is rather meaningless, unless a common definition of old is first established.
OLD
http://www.thecorrection.org/blog3/archives/byrd.jpg

OLD
http://www.thecorrection.org/blog3/archives/byrd.jpg

LOL

Good to see the old sense of humor is alive and well.

Everyone's favourite Ku Klux Klown

Just a few thoughts off the top of my head:

Older people tend to vote more than young people, and tend to think that young people do not have the benefit of wisdom and experience, and thus don't vote for anyone who seems too young. Older people have had the opportunity to build up support networks and favours - most beneficial if you're trying to become party leader or leader of a country. It costs a lot of money to run for office, older people tend to have more cash than young folks. Younger politicians usually have to work their way up the food chain: college politics, municipal politics, provincial/state politics before getting to the big big leagues.

Those are some very good points. It's much easier to get into power if you've got a broader base of friends to throw money at your campaign and vote for you.

As for a definition of old, asked for by Daistallia 2104, grey haired comes to mind as a quick way to identify old people. Not 100%, but it's good enough. And I'm 26. Might as well be a teen as far as the politicians are concerned, because the level of representation for my age bracket is almost nil. I find it hard to believe that some old fossil has any interest in what younger people in the country need. In Canada, there's been talk about raising/getting rid of mandatory retirement age. That is GREAT as far as the gov't is concerned... who are THEY going to get more money out of? An old person making $30/hour, or a green worker making $10/hour? You BET they want to keep the old people working. Not only do they make more, they don't have to pay that person pension! Raise the age to 70? Statistically, that person now only has a couple years left to live! Meanwhile, all the young people are being kept out of the higher paying, good union jobs, and being forced to work in crappy union jobs, or non-union even crappier jobs and have to go to school because "that's where the jobs are." Meanwhile, someone actually realized that they are going to be short MILLIONS of jobs in the tradesperson sector, because young people have been told for so long that they have to get a university education to get a good job. So, now they may HAVE to raise retirement age, because there aren't enough young people who even THINK about those sorts of jobs, which could have been prevented entirely with a little foresight. That's just an example of lack of representation from the 40+ crowd of politicians, who've likely had good jobs in the past.

Gonna be late for a meeting at this rate! :P Better get going. I'll get back to this thread later! :)

So, why DO older people run the countries?
I don't remember a young Prime Minister or President... then again, I'm not old... there may have been some.
I mean, in a more and more technologically advanced society, with rapidly changing ideals of freedom, why are the OLD people telling us how to think and what to do with these new innovations they often don't understand so well? I think the whole same sex issue would have been much less debated if left up to the younger generation. Most people my age and younger know people who are gay, and say, "Meh. That's their call." The only people I've heard who hotly contest such things are... old and set in their ways.
Is it time to maybe think about changing voting patterns? Do we need more young blood in government to keep up with the rapid changes of the modern world? Might we actually get young people to VOTE if they had people they could really identify with!? You ALWAYS hear politicians saying, "Oh, we had hoped to get more young supporters out to the polls" and then they wonder why they didn't show up. Maybe it has something to do with old men in suits who debate stupid things that the young generation thinks is pretty cut and dry, and doesn't matter so much?
This sort of thing always makes me want to run for politics, but then I remember the negative connotation of the title "politician" and I don't want to get wrapped into THAT. :P There's no place for honest opinion, and admitting you're fallible and sometimes (often) wrong in politics. :P
Oh boy. :(

Where to begin? Since I was young once ( believe it or not! ), I can still identify with some of what you must feel. You have to remember that not everyone who is "older" resists any and all change in a knee-jerk fashion. To use your example of how people feel about those who are gay, I have no problem with that whatsoever, even though by your standards I am "old."

One reason why some older people seem to be rather set in their ways is because they forget how to be "young" in their hearts and minds. I have a great advantage in that my children and grandchildren keep me young. I am of the opinion that the best approach to growing older is to make a real effort to retain the best of what each age has to offer. It's when us "olders" forget how to be playful and allow our sense of humor to atrophy that we become stodgy.

Just one "older's" opinion. :D

One position of power old people concern me in is behind the wheel of a car. They need a cane or walker to walk, handicapped parking spot, but they'll have you believe they can still see good enough and still have reflexes enough to drive safely. Or even be aware they are in a car, half the time.

I'll say that they have experience and wisdom in life, but GET THE HELL OUT OF THE CARS!!!

One position of power old people concern me in is behind the wheel of a car. They need a cane or walker to walk, handicapped parking spot, but they'll have you believe they can still see good enough and still have reflexes enough to drive safely. Or even be aware they are in a car, half the time.

I'll say that they have experience and wisdom in life, but GET THE HELL OUT OF THE CARS!!!
Pick your weapon ... uh, I mean car, and I'll race ya ... and WIN too! :D

IMO this question is rather meaningless, unless a common definition of old is first established. Then we can look at the statistics and see if the question is valid.
IMHO, "old" is more a state of mind than anything else. What earthly significance to anything does the fact that the earth has made howevermany circuits of its star since you were born have? None! :p

I don't remember a young Prime Minister or President... then again, I'm not old... there may have been some.

I wouldn't really term Clinton (46 when President) or Tony Blair (44 when PM) as young, but I certainly wouldn't put them in the 'old' category either.

Pick your weapon ... uh, I mean car, and I'll race ya ... and WIN too! :D

No disrespect to you, Eutrusca. You're well aware of people that no longer belong on the road and are just a fatality or two away from losing their license for that reason.
Racing me, though? I've got some experience there. It wouldnt be as easy as you may think.

Oh boy. :(

Where to begin? Since I was young once ( believe it or not! ), I can still identify with some of what you must feel. You have to remember that not everyone who is "older" resists any and all change in a knee-jerk fashion. To use your example of how people feel about those who are gay, I have no problem with that whatsoever, even though by your standards I am "old."

One reason why some older people seem to be rather set in their ways is because they forget how to be "young" in their hearts and minds. I have a great advantage in that my children and grandchildren keep me young. I am of the opinion that the best approach to growing older is to make a real effort to retain the best of what each age has to offer. It's when us "olders" forget how to be playful and allow our sense of humor to atrophy that we become stodgy.

Just one "older's" opinion. :D

Awesome post. :) I enjoyed it immensely.
You're right of course, I was stereotyping. And I like the way you split it between those who are young at heart and those who are "stodgy." (I love that word!)
Alas, the number of "young at heart" politicians is rather low... the ONLY one that jumps to mind is Layton, out of the leaders we have now. Even Harper, who may be younger, is stodgy. :P

As for older drivers, I'm doing research in that field. :) There's a group of us at Lakehead University who are using a new driving simulator to spawn research on making our roads safer. I'm looking at differences between older and younger drivers (the two most dangerous groups), and trying to figure out what we can do to make driving safer for everyone. Another woman in the program is looking to potentially overhaul the driver's testing system for older drivers, so it's no longer just a written test... because then you get people like my grandmother who are mentally still sharp, but are TERRIFYING drivers still driving around! :P So... we're working on it. :P I can't say the driving climate is going to change quickly, especially with the sheer number of baby boomers reaching senior age and being used to driving... but hopefully we can make the roads safer, while helping people to keep their licenses. :)

I don't care how old you are - if you've got cataracts and you can barely see - DO NOT DRIVE YOUR DAMN CAR.

That is all.

You should have seen Hastings Banda. He ruled Malawi until well into his 90's.

Racing me, though? I've got some experience there. It wouldnt be as easy as you may think.
Didn't say it would be easy, but I've had quite a bit of experience racing as well, both Le Mans style and "street racing." Pick yer car! :D

Awesome post. :) I enjoyed it immensely.
You're right of course, I was stereotyping. And I like the way you split it between those who are young at heart and those who are "stodgy." (I love that word!)
Alas, the number of "young at heart" politicians is rather low... the ONLY one that jumps to mind is Layton, out of the leaders we have now. Even Harper, who may be younger, is stodgy. :P

As for older drivers, I'm doing research in that field. :) There's a group of us at Lakehead University who are using a new driving simulator to spawn research on making our roads safer. I'm looking at differences between older and younger drivers (the two most dangerous groups), and trying to figure out what we can do to make driving safer for everyone. Another woman in the program is looking to potentially overhaul the driver's testing system for older drivers, so it's no longer just a written test... because then you get people like my grandmother who are mentally still sharp, but are TERRIFYING drivers still driving around! :P So... we're working on it. :P I can't say the driving climate is going to change quickly, especially with the sheer number of baby boomers reaching senior age and being used to driving... but hopefully we can make the roads safer, while helping people to keep their licenses. :)
Thanks. I'd love to know what you discover in your research. Sounds interesting. :)

Didn't say it would be easy, but I've had quite a bit of experience racing as well, both Le Mans style and "street racing." Pick yer car! :D
Who said street racing ... I choose http://www.leadfootindustries.com/jared%20trx450r.jpg

Firstly do we class old as Looking old? because politics'll do that to ya. Secondly if you mean old as in above 25 or 30, most political parties only back someone with experiance and (Sadly) a degree
Ergo you need to be at least 21 to start a serious campaign
with about 4 years of being a lackey
your 25
then your a Serious mp for 4 years
29
then you need to be (Often) a cabinet minister for 4 years at least
33
this is assuming that the MOMENT you come out of uni you have an election going on and that the government wont clutch for a 5 year term.
the only alternative in my opinion is to start your own revolutionary party!
(incendently, vote Intellectual Socialist party 2018) ;)
or for a coup de tat :sniper: :sniper: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5: :mp5:

Who said street racing ... I choose http://www.leadfootindustries.com/jared%20trx450r.jpg
Nawp. Cain't do dat. I'd need lots of practice first, plus I'm still trying to recover from dat operation. Might not be the best thing for me to ride just now, don'tchasee. :(

Nawp. Cain't do dat. I'd need lots of practice first, plus I'm still trying to recover from dat operation. Might not be the best thing for me to ride just now, don'tchasee. :(


HEY! You had the surgery? How did it go?

HEY! You had the surgery? How did it go?
Apparently pretty well. They took out the staples and that double-damned catheter last Monday. The doctor told me that the PSA test taken that same day showed that my PSA level had dropped almost to zero, which was a radical drop and very fast. They seem to think they got it all, but only time will tell. I have to go back on the 22nd of Nov. to have my PSA checked again.

Thanks for asking! :)