NationStates Jolt Archive

okay, I homeschool my kids so I don't have any problems with it, but I do get a whole lot of critisism from people about it.

Top 5 (in some kind of order but not perfect)
1 your kids aren't going to get socialized
2 because you aren't a certified teacher your kids won't get a good education
3 homeschooled kids are always behind thier peers
4 because they are at home all day then they end up watching TV instead of learning
5 the only reason you are homeschooling is so you can indoctrinate your kids

okay I found a study here (http://epaa.asu.edu/epaa/v7n8/) that adresses most of this but I will go through and try to address them my self too.

first the major findings of the study



Summary of Major Findings
Major findings: Demographics

* Home school parents have more formal education than parents in the general population; 88% continued their education beyond high school compared to 50% for the nation as a whole.
* The median income for home school families ($52,000) is significantly higher than that of all families with children ($36,000) in the United States.
* Almost all home school students (98%) are in married couple families. Most home school mothers (77%) do not participate in the labor force; almost all home school fathers (98%) do work.
* Home school students watch much less television than students nationwide; 65% of home school students watch one hour or less per day compared to 25% nationally.
* The median amount of money spent annually on educational materials is about $400 per home school student.
* The distribution of home school students by grade in grades 1-6 is consistent with that of all school children. Proportionally fewer home school students are enrolled at the high school level.

Major findings: Achievement

* Almost 25% of home school students are enrolled one or more grades above their age-level peers in public and private schools.
* Home school student achievement test scores are exceptionally high. The median scores for every subtest at every grade (typically in the 70th to 80th percentile) are well above those of public and Catholic/Private school students.
* On average, home school students in grades 1 to 4 perform one grade level above their age-level public/private school peers on achievement tests.
* The achievement test score gap between home school students and public/private school students starts to widen in grade 5.
* Students who have been home schooled their entire academic life have higher scholastic achievement test scores than students who have also attended other educational programs.
* There are no meaningful differences in achievement by gender, whether the student is enrolled in a full-service curriculum, or whether a parent holds a state issued teaching certificate.
* There are significant achievement differences among home school students when classified by amount of money spent on education, family income, parent education, and television viewing.

and now for me

1 my kids are not locked up in the house all day, and probably get more interaction with other kids then most kids thier age that are in school, or daycare
2 yes, I am not a certified teacher, but I am not their only teacher, this summer they will be going to a co-op that is full of certified teachers, and most of what I am teaching them is basic math,science, history, ect. Things that my education has taught me, if I ever get into a subject that I feel I can't effectivley teach, I pass my kids on to someone who can
3 my kids are years ahead of their peers (meaning kids the same age) my 4 year old tests like an 8 year old, and my 2 year old is way ahead of most kindergardeners
4 my kids only get 6 hours of TV a week, they are responsible for how they split it up, but no more than 6 (except for special occasions like this saturday which is movie day where we will have a movie marathon but that only happens like 2 times a year)
5 I am not trying to "indoctrinate" my kids, I want them to learn to think for themselves, the public and private schools around here do not suit our needs, they won't skip kids up because of 'social reasons'. I think it is stupid, I mean I have a kid who does 2nd grade work, with an 8 year old vocab. do they really think that putting her in with kids who don't talk and can't count past 5 is going to help her any? mostly it is teaching her how to "dumb down" to fit in and that is a BIG no-no for me. You should be who you are, not who everyone else is most comfortable with you being.

so what are your veiws on the situation?

is homeschool ever okay?

when is it benificial?

should everyone have the option?

if not, why not, and when should the government step in?

I don't think that there's anything necessarily wrong with homeschooling provided that the students learn the publicly approved curriculum.

I don't think that there's anything necessarily wrong with homeschooling provided that the students learn the publicly approved curriculum.
publicly approved? explain please.

publicly approved? explain please.
Well, for example, if the curriculum in the public schools includes evolution, and a homeschool parent decides to skip it because they're creationists then I think they're cheating their kids out of an important part of their education.

Well, for example, if the curriculum in the public schools includes evolution, and a homeschool parent decides to skip it because they're creationists then I think they're cheating their kids out of an important part of their education.
oh that. I am trying to give my kids the best education they can get, part of that includes evolution.

I worry about parents who homeschool that don't teach at the very least what the public schools are teaching, I wonder about thier motives, I mean do you want your kids to get an education or do you want to teach them to be just like you?

oh that. I am trying to give my kids the best education they can get, part of that includes evolution.

I worry about parents who homeschool that don't teach at the very least what the public schools are teaching, I wonder about thier motives, I mean do you want your kids to get an education or do you want to teach them to be just like you?
My understanding of the way it works in my area is that the homeschooling parents have the responsibility of passing curriculum with the school district where their children would have been attending school. One of my close friends was homeschooled his entire life (minus three hours a week at the district's International Center to learn Japanese, that is) but they had to pass certain requirements of the Shanwee Mission District before he could move on to other courses. This lead to his mother having to teach him some things she thought rather superfluous, but it's an overall benefit if your children have a chance to learn that crap. Otherwise they'll be just like you. And just imagine the terror, Smunkee.....just.....like.....YOU...... :eek:

Then again, I realize that my district is far different than anything else in the Midwest, but good luck anyway.

so what are your veiws on the situation?

I couldn't care less so long as they escape at the end with the necessary grades and qualifications. They're your kids. I do notice that it seems to be more prevalent for 'normal' kids in the United States to be home schooled, which makes me wonder how much part tradition and religion has, and how crap the schools are over there.

is homeschool ever okay?

Sure. Rough areas where it's dangerous to walk to school. Crap schooling within reasonable traveling distance. Excessive bullying. When your child requires attention for mental or physical disabilities which could hinder his/her ability to learn in a normal school environment. And when you want to force a religion on your child there's no better way of doing it than homeschooling.

when is it benificial?

See above. Also, when the parent maintains a neutral viewpoint when teaching such things as history, politics and religion. Let the child make his/her own mind up and it will all be OK.

should everyone have the option?

In my opinion, you should have the same qualifications as a teacher before being allowed to home school a child. Otherwise you may end up with idiots teaching their children to be just as stupid.

okay, I homeschool my kids so I don't have any problems with it, but I do get a whole lot of critisism from people about it.

Top 5 (in some kind of order but not perfect)
1 your kids aren't going to get socialized
2 because you aren't a certified teacher your kids won't get a good education
3 homeschooled kids are always behind thier peers
4 because they are at home all day then they end up watching TV instead of learning
5 the only reason you are homeschooling is so you can indoctrinate your kids

okay I found a study here (http://epaa.asu.edu/epaa/v7n8/) that adresses most of this but I will go through and try to address them my self too.

first the major findings of the study




and now for me

1 my kids are not locked up in the house all day, and probably get more interaction with other kids then most kids thier age that are in school, or daycare
2 yes, I am not a certified teacher, but I am not their only teacher, they go to a co-op that is full of certified teachers, and most of what I am teaching them is basic math,science, history, ect. Things that my education has taught me, if I ever get into a subject that I feel I can't effectivley teach, I pass my kids on to someone who can
3 my kids are years ahead of their peers (meaning kids the same age) my 4 year old tests like an 8 year old, and my 2 year old is way ahead of most kindergardeners
4 my kids only get 6 hours of TV a week, they are responsible for how they split it up, but no more than 6 (except for special occasions like this saturday which is movie day where we will have a movie marathon but that only happens like 2 times a year)
5 I am not trying to "indoctrinate" my kids, I want them to learn to think for themselves, the public and private schools around here do not suit our needs, they won't skip kids up because of 'social reasons'. I think it is stupid, I mean I have a kid who does 2nd grade work, with an 8 year old vocab. do they really think that putting her in with kids who don't talk and can't count past 5 is going to help her any? mostly it is teaching her how to "dumb down" to fit in and that is a BIG no-no for me. You should be who you are, not who everyone else is most comfortable with you being.

so what are your veiws on the situation?

is homeschool ever okay?

when is it benificial?

should everyone have the option?

if not, why not, and when should the government step in?

well first of all, when you kids are 4 and 2 they SHOULD be homeschooled. pre-school, 4 year old kindergarten and all-day kindergarten are all bad ideas. they are only for families where children are going to be in daycare anyway.

in the elementary years especially, there is no real downside to homeschooling as long as you are reasonably good at it. (which i have no doubt you will be)

i think there are benefits to a child having to conform to a new group situation with new rules. this is what school provides. your child has to learn how to get along in a whole new situation. she has to learn when to "go along to get along" and when to just say NO.

the bigger question for you is how are you going to ensure that your very bright children get the education they deserve when they get to the point where they are working on things that you dont know much about? what about when they get to course work that is too hard for you??

i didnt homeschool my own son because i wanted to have some time to myself. hands on 24/7 for 18 years can kinda burn you out. sending your kids to school gives you the chance to do something as an adult while not having to worry too too much about whats going on every minute with your kids. it can save your sanity.

Simonist']My understanding of the way it works in my area is that the homeschooling parents have the responsibility of passing curriculum with the school district where their children would have been attending school. One of my close friends was homeschooled his entire life (minus three hours a week at the district's International Center to learn Japanese, that is) but they had to pass certain requirements of the Shanwee Mission District before he could move on to other courses. This lead to his mother having to teach him some things she thought rather superfluous, but it's an overall benefit if your children have a chance to learn that crap. Otherwise they'll be just like you. And just imagine the terror, Smunkee.....just.....like.....YOU...... :eek:

Then again, I realize that my district is far different than anything else in the Midwest, but good luck anyway.
where I live there are absolutly no regulations at all, I think that is a huge mistake, I think that kids should be tested to make sure that they aren't sitting around playing video games all day long, but yeah I have my kids tested to make sure that they are learning, independently tested, it costs money but, hey what is a little extra money if it helps me to better educate my kids.
I don't want my kids to be just like me, well except for the part where I can think for myself, but you know if they can think for themselves they will not ever be just like me and that is a good thing :D

well first of all, when you kids are 4 and 2 they SHOULD be homeschooled. pre-school, 4 year old kindergarten and all-day kindergarten are all bad ideas. they are only for families where children are going to be in daycare anyway.
My main problem is that just because they are 2 and 4 people try to lump them in with the rest of the 2 and 4 year olds, I was approached to put the 4 year old in preK because "if you don't she won't get socialized" I did, and it is turning out quite badly, she complains that she has to 'act dumb' and that the other kids have behavior problems (like hitting, biting, cussing at the teacher) and she doesn't like her teacher because she talks to her like she is stupid, I am leaving her in through the rest of the year because I think it is important for her to learn to be herself and still deal with people who frustrate her. I plan to have a better situation for her next year.



the bigger question for you is how are you going to ensure that your very bright children get the education they deserve when they get to the point where they are working on things that you dont know much about? what about when they get to course work that is too hard for you??

i didnt homeschool my own son because i wanted to have some time to myself. hands on 24/7 for 18 years can kinda burn you out. sending your kids to school gives you the chance to do something as an adult while not having to worry too too much about whats going on every minute with your kids. it can save your sanity.

I have resources that a lot of people don't realize, I have friends who are certified teachers who will work with my kids, I have friends who are college professors who have multiple doctorates who will tutor my kids, I am a memeber of 2 different co-ops where my kids can take classes in a classroom setting. If there is something that is over my head (which I suspect will actually happen) I have many people that can teach it to me and my kids. My kids do not recieve all thier education from me, they take classes, and this summer they are going to the community college to do more stuff. I would go crazy if I had them with me 24/7 I don't suggest 24/7 scheduleing to anyone.

The certificate to be a certified teacher is handed out to those who best show they can bribe other people's children who rather be playing video games to learn.

Obviously unnecessary at homeschool level.

My main problem is that just because they are 2 and 4 people try to lump them in with the rest of the 2 and 4 year olds, I was approached to put the 4 year old in preK because "if you don't she won't get socialized" I did, and it is turning out quite badly, she complains that she has to 'act dumb' and that the other kids have behavior problems (like hitting, biting, cussing at the teacher) and she doesn't like her teacher because she talks to her like she is stupid, I am leaving her in through the rest of the year because I think it is important for her to learn to be herself and still deal with people who frustrate her. I plan to have a better situation for her next year.


how many hours a day is pre-k?

so what are your veiws on the situation?

1. is homeschool ever okay?

2. when is it benificial?

3. should everyone have the option?

4. if not, why not, and when should the government step in?
1. Homeschool is fine, and in fact preferable in some cases. If a parent can stay home and school their children, that's great. Where I live, there is a lot of support for homeschooling. Children must learn the provincial curriculum, and funding is provided to parents to help offset the cost of supplies (text books and such) as long as they can prove that the necessary outcomes are being met. After all...your property taxes go towards public schools, and if you opt to teach your children yourself, why SHOULDN'T some of that money come back to you?

2. It is beneficial if your children have special needs, and your local schools lack the funding to adequately address this. By special needs, I mean learning disabilities, physical disabilities, and students who are gifted, or have social reasons why they don't want to be in the classroom. It's as flexible as you need it to be, which works well for many rural families.

3. There does need to be a bit more oversight to make sure kids are actually learning anything. Most homeschooling is legit...but some parents just use it as an excuse to keep their kids home as farm hands:(

4. N/A

I plan on homeschooling my kids, at least in part, so they can learn Spanish and Cree as well as French and English. THis would not be possible otherwise.

how many hours a day is pre-k?
Back in the day when I was doing pre-K at the Catholic school (in which we coloured Bible stories and played with Play-Doh and napped all day long) it was like, four hours.

how many hours a day is pre-k?
4 and she hates every second of it, well except yesterday she had a pretty good day, they had a doctor come visit and she got 15 min of one on one time with her, so she got some good information. (she wants to be a doctor) She said even though this doctor has a different specailty then what Kathryn is interested in she found out a lot about residency. :)

I plan on homeschooling my kids, at least in part, so they can learn Spanish and Cree as well as French and English. THis would not be possible otherwise.
You can always just speak Spanish or whatever at home and let them learn English at school.

I plan on homeschooling my kids, at least in part, so they can learn Spanish and Cree as well as French and English. THis would not be possible otherwise.
I think that is a great idea. If more parents took an active role in thier kids education think how much better the public schools would be. You can send your kids to school and still teach them great stuff at home. I think that could be a good compromise for people who want thier kids to get a great education, but have reservations about public schools and homeschooling.

You can always just speak Spanish or whatever at home and let them learn English at school.
My folks spoke mainly Italian at home. I learned almost all of my English at school. I got teased in Kindergarten because of the funny way I pronounced some words. So there's a drawback to your plan.

While I defiantly think you could get an awesome education being home schooled I would not give up my high school years for anything.

Not only did it expose me to my current friends that are invaluable but it also brought me on contact with something I would not have at home … networked computers with a great computer teacher

Being there to learn was integral to me finding quickly my passion in life

You can always just speak Spanish or whatever at home and let them learn English at school.
Not if I actually want them to develop their literacy skills at the same pace. Children who learn a second (or third) language just in the home tend to have good oral skills, but terrible grammar, tonnes of slang, and poor reading and writing skills. I want my kids to be fluent. And how would I address the need to pass on Cree to my kids? If our language is going to survive, people need to be able to do more than count to four in it.

The certificate to be a certified teacher is handed out to those who best show they can bribe other people's children who rather be playing video games to learn.

Obviously unnecessary at homeschool level.
Actually, a teaching certificate is handed out to a person who has completed a Bachelor of Education, and who has a job offer as a teacher. And then there is a probationary period (usually of 2 years) before a permanent certificate is issued, based on the recommendations of the school board.

However, teaching is also very much an intuitive skill. University education does not guarantee it, and lack of such education does not preclude one from possessing it.

A parent not trained as a teacher can still be a wondeful teacher, and never know the theory behind what they do. But they still may need help to interpret the curriculum, and access resources. Homeschooling is becoming more and more accessed by parents, and community links are flourishing to support them. If you think you have to operate in isolation as a homeschool, you are probably mistaken.

homeschooling is probably the best thing that ever happened to me. I shudder at the thought of myself if I stayed in public school in the 5th grade. I wouldn't be even a 16th as intelligent, self confident, or have pretty good social habits. It makes me intensely upset when people who have no qualifications to make any sort of valid opinion on the subject dismiss homeschooled people as if they were unintelligent fools.

While I defiantly think you could get an awesome education being home schooled I would not give up my high school years for anything.

Not only did it expose me to my current friends that are invaluable but it also brought me on contact with something I would not have at home … networked computers with a great computer teacher

Being there to learn was integral to me finding quickly my passion in life
I think at a certain point you need to let your kids decide if they want to continue homeschooling, or go to the local school...and they can't make an informed decision unless they at least try the school. There are many ways you can create a blend...the Phys Ed program sucks? Pull your kid, check the curriculum, and go hunting for credit. The English prof is brilliant but the Math teacher got stuck with the job, and has no background? So let them take English, and get the Math covered somewhere else. It's even MORE flexible in junior high and high school than elementary school if you prefer a blend...and want your kid to go through all the highschool angsty crap you did:eek:

oh that. I am trying to give my kids the best education they can get, part of that includes evolution.

I worry about parents who homeschool that don't teach at the very least what the public schools are teaching, I wonder about thier motives, I mean do you want your kids to get an education or do you want to teach them to be just like you?

There's a couple two houses down from me that teach the publicly approved curriculum - BUT - they tell their children only to memorize the correct answers about evolution for "outsider tests". They teach creationism as the truth.

It's obvious why they're doing it.

For me, if I could stay home, I would homeschool - but only because I feel that I can do a much better job at instruction than most teachers.

My niece and nephew are homeschooled. My niece is 10, and my nephew is 6. Both get an extraordinary education, and learn things that public schools do not teach. I, myself prefer public school to homeschooling, because you have more resources at your disposal, so that if you want to learn the things the school does not teach, you can teach yourself. Of course, I am under the classification of having a gifted mind, as are my niece and nephew. (A gifted person is someone who is not necessarily a intellectual, but their minds function differently than the average person's, motivating them to be more intellectual). This is of course not to say that the average person is an idiot, but just that gifted people think differently than the average human.

Anyway, I think that gifted children are better homeschooled because their needs and wants are catered to when it comes to learning. They should not lack in education, but they should be catered to in the form of what they want to learn, and what interests them. Public school does not do that, the closest thing that happens in public school is the gifted and talented program, which does nothing for gifted children. Most G&T students in school are just artistic, not gifted. I know from experience as I am a gifted person who is a intellectual, and was reading college material by the fifth grade, yet I was never chosen for G&T, and actually did not gain acceptence into G&T my sixth grade year.

I know my incoherent ramblings may not seem structured and on-topic, but in some strange twisted way they are. That's my two-cents.

Short Version:

If you want to homeschool your kids, do it. If not, public school is still a great place to learn.

For me, if I could stay home, I would homeschool - but only because I feel that I can do a much better job at instruction than most teachers.
Of course you could. For one, you would not have to deal with the classroom management issues that any large group of people are going to create. Much of our time is spent just keeping things flowing. Most teachers, if they had the opportunity to work one on one, or in small groups, would find that their students were able to achieve much higher success than they could otherwise, regardless of their 'abilities'.

I was in gifted class. It consisted of pointless activities and lots of computer games. I believe I got a highscore in Dome Wars and Oregon Trail. Oh well, it got me out of my crappy, redneck school for a hour or two.

Of course you could. For one, you would not have to deal with the classroom management issues that any large group of people are going to create. Much of our time is spent just keeping things flowing. Most teachers, if they had the opportunity to work one on one, or in small groups, would find that their students were able to achieve much higher success than they could otherwise, regardless of their 'abilities'.

Probably why some military schools have an easier time running a classroom.

publicly approved? explain please.

I don't think the publicly approved curriculum is always the bet either. I am not for home schooling, personally, but I also don't see a better alternative to public schooling.

With private schools in my area being mostly Catholic schools or so expensive you can't afford it, and public schools ditching competition for feelings, and home schooling making kids socially awkward (regardless of how you look at it, the are either viewed as elitists or retarded by other children), I don't know what good education option is.

But i still don't think home schooling is the answer. Some people down the street from me home schooled their kids through elementary and middle school (for the record I think Mid. School is a waste of money, resources and time, I went k-8 then HS) and when they changed their minds and sent them to High School publicly. Point is, they couldn't hack the number of people, the course load was too much and they couldn't handle it. Now one of them is repeating freshman year and the other is begging to be home schooled again. Makes me wonder

Okay, I rambled a bit there...but I've been very sick. I'm sure I could fish out a point in there somewhere...sorry....

Probably why some military schools have an easier time running a classroom.
Well, school is about so much more than the content of the courses...it's about the kinds of behaviours you want as well. I'd say that's the main focus, really. Do you want kids who can memorise and respond, do you want free thinkers, do you need obedience, do you want silent and fearful students...do you want to strip them of their culture and assimilate them...damn...Residential School rants keep sneaking in!

I don't think the publicly approved curriculum is always the bet either. I am not for home schooling, personally, but I also don't see a better alternative to public schooling.

With private schools in my area being mostly Catholic schools or so expensive you can't afford it, and public schools ditching competition for feelings, and home schooling making kids socially awkward (regardless of how you look at it, the are either viewed as elitists or retarded by other children), I don't know what good education option is.

But i still don't think home schooling is the answer. Some people down the street from me home schooled their kids through elementary and middle school (for the record I think Mid. School is a waste of money, resources and time, I went k-8 then HS) and when they changed their minds and sent them to High School publicly. Point is, they couldn't hack the number of people, the course load was too much and they couldn't handle it. Now one of them is repeating freshman year and the other is begging to be home schooled again. Makes me wonder

Okay, I rambled a bit there...but I've been very sick. I'm sure I could fish out a point in there somewhere...sorry....
Once again, I'm sure this all depends largely on the schools and the area as well. Half the kids I used to do a regional theatre group with were homeschooled, and that was their major social priority and how they learned to really interact with others their age. A great deal of the younger bunch (usually the younger siblings of my friends) actually started pressing to be allowed to go to a public high school, and in almost every single case they did far better than their peers because they were already so focused from years of homeschooling, but they also suddenly had so many more friends to hang out with. It was amazing to see the turnaround from "I'll do my homework after rehearsal, I've got nothing else going on" to "Let me know when my scene comes up, I'll be doing my English homework so I can go out after rehearsal". They all turned into almost annoyingly diligent students.

how many hours a day is pre-k?

My son was in pre-k for 2.5 hours a day M-F. He needed to develop some gross motor skills (which now in K he has fallen behind on). I know other places where there is no Pre-K or Pre-K only for kids that are "smarter" or more advanced.

Well, school is about so much more than the content of the courses...it's about the kinds of behaviours you want as well. I'd say that's the main focus, really. Do you want kids who can memorise and respond, do you want free thinkers, do you need obedience, do you want silent and fearful students...do you want to strip them of their culture and assimilate them...damn...Residential School rants keep sneaking in!
I'll take 'free thinking' for 200, Alex.

*bing*

And Dobbsworld has the first Daily Double of our game...

I don't think the publicly approved curriculum is always the bet either. I am not for home schooling, personally, but I also don't see a better alternative to public schooling.

With private schools in my area being mostly Catholic schools or so expensive you can't afford it, and public schools ditching competition for feelings, and home schooling making kids socially awkward (regardless of how you look at it, the are either viewed as elitists or retarded by other children), I don't know what good education option is.

But i still don't think home schooling is the answer. Some people down the street from me home schooled their kids through elementary and middle school (for the record I think Mid. School is a waste of money, resources and time, I went k-8 then HS) and when they changed their minds and sent them to High School publicly. Point is, they couldn't hack the number of people, the course load was too much and they couldn't handle it. Now one of them is repeating freshman year and the other is begging to be home schooled again. Makes me wonder

Okay, I rambled a bit there...but I've been very sick. I'm sure I could fish out a point in there somewhere...sorry....

sure the very best option would be a school where my kids could work at their own pace, if they need to be doing harder work then they could and it wouldn't matter if they were in a class with people who were older then they were. everyone would do what they were ready to do, and we wouldn't have the case of one class with kids in various different levels (some behind, some ahead, some inbetween) but that isn't an option so homeschool is the best solution I have. Private school here is $27,000 a year, per kid not including books, that is more expensive than state college, and I promise you I know kids who go to the private school, they aren't getting a better education than the public school kids all they really have is chapel time (which most don't go to because it isn't thier religion) and cuter uniforms. My kids are not socially akward when they are not forced to try to fit in with kids that they have nothing in common with, although I am trying to work with them on that, I mean I have to deal with fitting in with all types of people, it is a skill, but an important skill.

4 and she hates every second of it, well except yesterday she had a pretty good day, they had a doctor come visit and she got 15 min of one on one time with her, so she got some good information. (she wants to be a doctor) She said even though this doctor has a different specailty then what Kathryn is interested in she found out a lot about residency. :)
4 is alot of hours when you hate it. the 2.5 that balipo's son had would be much better.

if you really dont want to take her out of school, perhaps you could look around for a better placement for her. no montesorri schools in your area? no way to rationalize that stopping after half a year is giving it enough of a try?

sure the very best option would be a school where my kids could work at their own pace, if they need to be doing harder work then they could and it wouldn't matter if they were in a class with people who were older then they were. everyone would do what they were ready to do, and we wouldn't have the case of one class with kids in various different levels (some behind, some ahead, some inbetween) but that isn't an option so homeschool is the best solution I have. Private school here is $27,000 a year, per kid not including books, that is more expensive than state college, and I promise you I know kids who go to the private school, they aren't getting a better education than the public school kids all they really have is chapel time (which most don't go to because it isn't thier religion) and cuter uniforms. My kids are not socially akward when they are not forced to try to fit in with kids that they have nothing in common with, although I am trying to work with them on that, I mean I have to deal with fitting in with all types of people, it is a skill, but an important skill.

Thanks, Smunkee...I knew if anyone could figure out what I was trying to say you would.

Private schools are just organizations. I remember when I started high school there were 12 kids that came from the "Big" private schools in the area I live in (mostly Catholic). They couldn't compete, after being told they had completed Math Course III all of them were dropped to Course I as they couldn't compelte the RCT (Regents Competency Test) required to leave 8th grade math. Now I know my HS was special and unlike others (only 100 students start, in my class only 30 finished), but still.

Bring competition back. And involve the home school kids. Then can go to school at home...but they have to sit exams with the public school kids, who are also sitting with the private school kids. And they levels are let known shortly after so the comparison can be made (not personally, but in brackets (age, school type, etc).

That's my lucid thought of the moment.

4 is alot of hours when you hate it. the 2.5 that balipo's son had would be much better.

if you really dont want to take her out of school, perhaps you could look around for a better placement for her. no montesorri schools in your area? no way to rationalize that stopping after half a year is giving it enough of a try?

Montesorri schools are the best. Exactly what Smunkee was saying with the "move in your own direction at your own pace without falling behind idea".

4 is alot of hours when you hate it. the 2.5 that balipo's son had would be much better.

if you really dont want to take her out of school, perhaps you could look around for a better placement for her. no montesorri schools in your area? no way to rationalize that stopping after half a year is giving it enough of a try?
she is in the best preK in the area (next best is a 3 hour commute) There is a really great Montesorri school here but it has a 6 year waiting list (yeah you have to pre-enroll 2 years before you get pregnant it's ridiculous)

I talked to her principal about pulling her out but he gave me some crap line about having me arrested for promoting truancy, so I called the school board and unless she has been of victim of violence of bully-ing he won't sign off on the homeschooling but if I just decide over the summer to homeschool her that is okay. There is a whole load of buracracy about getting your child into homeschooling but basically no regulation after the fact. It is very frustrating.
I am still trying to get around it though, I have a meeting on Monday with a college professor that may be able to help me (he happens to have a lot more pull than I do, seeing as he is somewhat of a public figure around here)

she is in the best preK in the area (next best is a 3 hour commute) There is a really great Montesorri school here but it has a 6 year waiting list (yeah you have to pre-enroll 2 years before you get pregnant it's ridiculous)

I talked to her principal about pulling her out but he gave me some crap line about having me arrested for promoting truancy, so I called the school board and unless she has been of victim of violence of bully-ing he won't sign off on the homeschooling but if I just decide over the summer to homeschool her that is okay. There is a whole load of buracracy about getting your child into homeschooling but basically no regulation after the fact. It is very frustrating.
I am still trying to get around it though, I have a meeting on Monday with a college professor that may be able to help me (he happens to have a lot more pull than I do, seeing as he is somewhat of a public figure around here)
there isnt even a legal requirement for a 4 year old to attend school. talk to a school board member and a lawyer if you can afford one.

there isnt even a legal requirement for a 4 year old to attend school. talk to a school board member and a lawyer if you can afford one.
oh I can afford one, I think my money is better spent on my kid and letting this college professor throw a big huge fit. ;)

yeah like I said it was a crap line he gave me about how once they are enrolled they have to go or they will be truant.... blah, blah, blah..... I recorded the whole meeting I am quite sure if my "free way" of getting this dealt with doesn't work then my lawyer will have fun with this one. :D

she is in the best preK in the area (next best is a 3 hour commute) There is a really great Montesorri school here but it has a 6 year waiting list (yeah you have to pre-enroll 2 years before you get pregnant it's ridiculous)

I talked to her principal about pulling her out but he gave me some crap line about having me arrested for promoting truancy, so I called the school board and unless she has been of victim of violence of bully-ing he won't sign off on the homeschooling but if I just decide over the summer to homeschool her that is okay. There is a whole load of buracracy about getting your child into homeschooling but basically no regulation after the fact. It is very frustrating.
I am still trying to get around it though, I have a meeting on Monday with a college professor that may be able to help me (he happens to have a lot more pull than I do, seeing as he is somewhat of a public figure around here)

Smunkee...did you ever think that part of your problem is location. I mean, I live in a lousy suburb with one middle school and one high school. I grew up in a city that is 5 minutes from my driveway where I had 27 choices for high school.

I think we need more public schools in order to make them compete. Why compete if you have a "educational monopoly"?

Smunkee...did you ever think that part of your problem is location. I mean, I live in a lousy suburb with one middle school and one high school. I grew up in a city that is 5 minutes from my driveway where I had 27 choices for high school.

I think we need more public schools in order to make them compete. Why compete if you have a "educational monopoly"?
I live in a pretty elite neighborhood the problem is that we are not our own town, we have our own police force, and our own water treatment, but for some reason we have to use the city schools. I could move out of state, but that isn't really all that practical right now. The further we get from the city the worse the schools become, I had originally planned on homeschooling anyway, but let myself get talked into enrolling her to "socialize"

oh well, I made a crappy decision now I have to find a way out of it.

I think the problem with homeschooling is the parents. For every parent who's got a child with special needs or who doesn't think the schools in the area are up to scratch, there's a lot of kooks who've decided that they don't want their precious children corrupted by evolution, liberal schoolteachers, sex education, mingling with negros, the homosexual agenda, or whatever the hell else it is about mainstream American society that they're busy feeling morally superior to. The market in textbooks and teaching guides for homeschooling is dominated by conservative evangelical publishing houses with cirriculums that preach biblical creation, teach abstinence-only sex ed, or take a less than enthusiastic attitude towards homosexuals, single parents, and other people living in sin. And the handful of folks I know who've homeschooled their children all have horror stories about finding out that their local clubs and support groups for homeschooling all seem to be dominated by fundamentalist evangelicals who spend all day talking about how great it is to be able to give kids a decent education away from the horrible influences of secular humanism and evolutionism. And of course there's the poor guy who thought he'd finally found another family with a fairly sane view on homeschooling (the other father was talking about how you have to shop around for companies that have a fairly solid science cirriculum) until he found out that the other family were white supremacists who'd opted for homeschooling so their kids wouldn't be taught any 'liberal bullshit' that might make them soft on race-mingling.

As a teacher, I personally think home schooling is the best for some students just as some students are far better in public schools. I'd suggest that any parent interested in home schooling to get themselves educated as to what that means BEFORE yanking their kid(s) out of school though.

I'd also highly suggest that if you do have a learning disabled child, or any student actually, to consult reguarly with in service teachers.

The only thing I'd worry about for home school kids is more towards the secondary level when they might miss out on various educational and social experiences (most parents don't wander around with a full chemistry lab for example, I hope), but if you plan ahead, it should be possible to overcome those things.

Home schooling is great, provided it's done for the right reasons. In Gwinnett County, Georgia, we have highstakes tests -- fail and you're retained. There are parents that will pull their kids from the grades where these tests are given and home school that year. They they put them back into public schools.

The right reason is because you can give you child a better education than the public schools.

I think the problem with homeschooling is the parents. For every parent who's got a child with special needs or who doesn't think the schools in the area are up to scratch, there's a lot of kooks who've decided that they don't want their precious children corrupted by evolution, liberal schoolteachers, sex education, mingling with negros, the homosexual agenda, or whatever the hell else it is about mainstream American society that they're busy feeling morally superior to. The market in textbooks and teaching guides for homeschooling is dominated by conservative evangelical publishing houses with cirriculums that preach biblical creation, teach abstinence-only sex ed, or take a less than enthusiastic attitude towards homosexuals, single parents, and other people living in sin. And the handful of folks I know who've homeschooled their children all have horror stories about finding out that their local clubs and support groups for homeschooling all seem to be dominated by fundamentalist evangelicals who spend all day talking about how great it is to be able to give kids a decent education away from the horrible influences of secular humanism and evolutionism. And of course there's the poor guy who thought he'd finally found another family with a fairly sane view on homeschooling (the other father was talking about how you have to shop around for companies that have a fairly solid science cirriculum) until he found out that the other family were white supremacists who'd opted for homeschooling so their kids wouldn't be taught any 'liberal bullshit' that might make them soft on race-mingling.


I know quite a few kids and at least one adult who were home schooled for religious reasons. That doesn't change the fact that they recieved (or are recieving) an excellent education. You may not like the idea that kids cant be indoctrinated with PC beliefs if they dont go to school, but it has nothing to do with the quality of the education.

so what are your veiws on the situation?

is homeschool ever okay?

when is it benificial?

should everyone have the option?

if not, why not, and when should the government step in?I personally view home schooling with suspicion. It has a lot of potential for indoctrination or teaching false information.
There are, however, certain circumstances under which I find homeschooling a better alternative to public or private schools:
Isolation: This is less common in Europe, where most everything is densely settled, but I'm aware that some families in other countries live far away from their nearest neighbors and it could be a better use of time to keep the children at home instead of sending them to a school many miles away.
An inadequate schooling system: This situation usually occurs in 3rd world countries. Some schools just aren't going to provide what is necessary. I'd probably even consider a couple German or American schools on that list, since they just don't meet the requirements for a satisfactory education.

...even consider a couple German or American schools on that list, since they just don't meet the requirements for a satisfactory education.

ROFLMAO, hit the mark from a thousand meters :p

I think at a certain point you need to let your kids decide if they want to continue homeschooling, or go to the local school...and they can't make an informed decision unless they at least try the school. There are many ways you can create a blend...the Phys Ed program sucks? Pull your kid, check the curriculum, and go hunting for credit. The English prof is brilliant but the Math teacher got stuck with the job, and has no background? So let them take English, and get the Math covered somewhere else. It's even MORE flexible in junior high and high school than elementary school if you prefer a blend...and want your kid to go through all the highschool angsty crap you did:eek:
Yeah I understand school can be a pain … But for me its one that has left a lasting good impression on me

I would rather ADD to the schools education then completely pull my kid out of that environment and do it all myself … something a bit more balanced

I find out it’s a bad math teacher … me and my kid do some math work … bad language teacher the same (sorta like you were saying)

I know quite a few kids and at least one adult who were home schooled for religious reasons. That doesn't change the fact that they recieved (or are recieving) an excellent education. You may not like the idea that kids cant be indoctrinated with PC beliefs if they dont go to school, but it has nothing to do with the quality of the education.
Depends n your standards I guess … I would not call the bastardized science they probably get fed a “good” education. Not to mention a few other points.

I think the problem with homeschooling is the parents. For every parent who's got a child with special needs or who doesn't think the schools in the area are up to scratch, there's a lot of kooks who've decided that they don't want their precious children corrupted by evolution, liberal schoolteachers, sex education, mingling with negros, the homosexual agenda, or whatever the hell else it is about mainstream American society that they're busy feeling morally superior to. The market in textbooks and teaching guides for homeschooling is dominated by conservative evangelical publishing houses with cirriculums that preach biblical creation, teach abstinence-only sex ed, or take a less than enthusiastic attitude towards homosexuals, single parents, and other people living in sin. And the handful of folks I know who've homeschooled their children all have horror stories about finding out that their local clubs and support groups for homeschooling all seem to be dominated by fundamentalist evangelicals who spend all day talking about how great it is to be able to give kids a decent education away from the horrible influences of secular humanism and evolutionism. And of course there's the poor guy who thought he'd finally found another family with a fairly sane view on homeschooling (the other father was talking about how you have to shop around for companies that have a fairly solid science cirriculum) until he found out that the other family were white supremacists who'd opted for homeschooling so their kids wouldn't be taught any 'liberal bullshit' that might make them soft on race-mingling.

yeah, but people are going to do that one way or the other, wouldn't you rather them pull thier kids out and teach it at home, then to lobby to get it taught in schools?

Depends n your standards I guess … I would not call the bastardized science they probably get fed a “good” education. Not to mention a few other points.

They get the same science. Physics is no different for Christians, or Chemistry, or Biology, or any other science. Geology may be a problem for young Earth Christians but Geology is not an elementary or high school level science. The only difference is that they will not study evolution. This is not that big a deal, there are many students who dont get to study evolution in public school because of the controversy. I went to public school in California and was not taught evolution. That section is at most a one week section anyway. The core of high school biology (mitosis, meiosis, cellular respiration, genetics, DNA, etc.) remains the same.

I couldn't care less so long as they escape at the end with the necessary grades and qualifications. They're your kids. I do notice that it seems to be more prevalent for 'normal' kids in the United States to be home schooled, which makes me wonder how much part tradition and religion has, and how crap the schools are over there.



Sure. Rough areas where it's dangerous to walk to school. Crap schooling within reasonable traveling distance. Excessive bullying. When your child requires attention for mental or physical disabilities which could hinder his/her ability to learn in a normal school environment. And when you want to force a religion on your child there's no better way of doing it than homeschooling.



See above. Also, when the parent maintains a neutral viewpoint when teaching such things as history, politics and religion. Let the child make his/her own mind up and it will all be OK.



In my opinion, you should have the same qualifications as a teacher before being allowed to home school a child. Otherwise you may end up with idiots teaching their children to be just as stupid.


I was homeschooled from 5th grade up until highschool....never could figure out where so much of the anti-homeschooling nonesense came from. I'm in college right now working on my degree in Criminal justice.

I would heavily stress though that homeschooling parents should be able to choose whatever curriculum they want. Preferrably non-state approved, because for most of us that's the reason we didn't go to public school in the first place. Oh, and all that crap they put...sorry, no hijacking....

I personally view home schooling with suspicion. It has a lot of potential for indoctrination or teaching false information.

I don't really know why you would say that. Public schools are more indoctrination centers than anything!

There are, however, certain circumstances under which I find homeschooling a better alternative to public or private schools:
Isolation: This is less common in Europe, where most everything is densely settled, but I'm aware that some families in other countries live far away from their nearest neighbors and it could be a better use of time to keep the children at home instead of sending them to a school many miles away.
An inadequate schooling system: This situation usually occurs in 3rd world countries. Some schools just aren't going to provide what is necessary. I'd probably even consider a couple German or American schools on that list, since they just don't meet the requirements for a satisfactory education.

Very few American public are actually capable of passing the requirements-it's not an isolated problem, it's a national issue.

I can say though I got the finest education available :D

The certificate to be a certified teacher is handed out to those who best show they can bribe other people's children who rather be playing video games to learn.

That is a pretty unjustified and ignorant remark, thank you very much. I am quite sure that eight years of education classes and ten years experience gives me a little more than the ability to bribe children.

Then again, given the attitude, is it any wonder that children prefer to vegetate in front of the TV when there is so little respect for my profession from the adults?

I have to admire Smunkeeville for taking on the job of homeschooling her children. It is a tough job and a big responsibility, as she obviously knows. I did a brief stint in an early childhood program, and fitting together all the subjects, relating them to one another and still making it fun for the kids to discover is no small task.

Homeschooling is appropriate in a situation which I don't believe has been raised yet: there are some people who really do not do well in the school environment. This might be for health problems, because they are very shy, because for whatever reason they don't interact particularly well with others -- or because they are either far advanced or far behind their agemates.

Kudos for being interested enough in your child's education to be involved in it. There are plenty of people who send their kids to school just to get them out of their hair for six hours a day.

sure the very best option would be a school where my kids could work at their own pace, if they need to be doing harder work then they could and it wouldn't matter if they were in a class with people who were older then they were. everyone would do what they were ready to do, and we wouldn't have the case of one class with kids in various different levels (some behind, some ahead, some inbetween) but that isn't an option so homeschool is the best solution I have.

A Montessori school is very much what you have described here.

That is a pretty unjustified and ignorant remark, thank you very much. I am quite sure that eight years of education classes and ten years experience gives me a little more than the ability to bribe children.

*nodds sagely* Yup, I had to learn which stickers were popular before I could bribe my students with them.

Wait, I wasn't supposed to say that, right. :p

Kidding aside, Katganistan is right, Teh_pantless_hero, motovating my students is one of the hardest parts of my job as a teacher and one where bribery doesn't really work they way you'd think it would. There's an awful lot that goes into classroom management, so much in fact that I actually envy home schooling parents. They have a much more easier time controling ONE child home they can send to bed without supper (or whatever the punishment is) then a teacher does in controling over 30 kids. Not to mention that the lesson can be tailored to ONE child and his or her interest.

*nodds sagely* Yup, I had to learn which stickers were popular before I could bribe my students with them.

Wait, I wasn't supposed to say that, right. :p

Anything Holographic usually goes over well. ;)