NationStates Jolt Archive

AlphaGeek and I caught this show on PBS last night called Secrets of the Dead. Sort of a combination of CSI and archeaology. Last night's episode focused on the findings of a dig done in the Russian steppes. The findings were very interesting...there is a good possibility that the Amazon Nation actually existed. Maybe not in the legendary form the name has come to mean today, but it seems there was warrior women back in the day.

Check out the link for yourself:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/secrets/case_amazon/

That is interesting. Especially the Mongolian girl.

However, I think you can find warrior women in many places. The Foreign Legion once reported going up against a regiment of African warror women in a fight against a tribe. It was commented they were pretty nasty in hand to hand. They were pretty much wiped out.....

Apparently some tombs of Scythian noblewomen have been found near Ordzhonikidze which have yielded examples of war-gear for women warriors. It's possible that Amazonian myths come from these fighters.

But female dominated or female only military societies? No.

The Amazonians SOOOOOOOOO are real. Maybe just in my wet dreams... but they are. :D

Apparently some tombs of Scythian noblewomen have been found near Ordzhonikidze which have yielded examples of war-gear for women warriors. It's possible that Amazonian myths come from these fighters.

But female dominated or female only military societies? No.


yeah, it's not particularly practical...in terms of propagating the tribe. I would think pregnancy is contraindicated in horseback riding, and you can't have a particularly effective force if a portion of your fighters are unable to fight. It seems like you'd have to pick one; pregnancy or war.

I think the coolest part, was that a lot of the Mongolian traditional dress was very similar to the pot paintings the doctor in this episode saw in a museum in Greece.

yeah, it's not particularly practical...in terms of propagating the tribe. I would think pregnancy is contraindicated in horseback riding, and you can't have a particularly effective force if a portion of your fighters are unable to fight. It seems like you'd have to pick one; pregnancy or war.
There's a cultural assumption there that all societies will automatically elect to make reproduction a primary function of women. In ancient times, there were religions and social groups that required self-mutilation including male castration, vows of celibacy, homosexuality, and other types of redirection, suppression, or sublimation of sexuality. Also, in some parts of the world, war was a seasonal activity, leaving many months free for reproduction and other parts of life. Also, ancient times were not without means of birth control. Finally, gender roles were not as strictly defined in many ancient cultures as they were among the Greeks. So there really is no practical bar against women as full-time warriors. This isn't proof that these ancient tribes were dominated by women warriors, just a caveat that they might have been for a little while. And anyway, there's not enough archeological evidence, imo, to suggest more than that there were women warriors among these people.

EDIT: I just remembered another Discovery documentary about human genome research in which researchers discovered a young girl living today in that region who is the direct blood descendant of one of those Mongolian female warriors. So apparently, it isn't an either-or choice since that female warrior had at least one kid.

The Amazonians SOOOOOOOOO are real. Maybe just in my wet dreams... but they are. :D
ROFLMAO! I love warrior-women, but not the Amazons of legend. They supposedly cut off their right breast so it wouldn't interfere with drawing and releasing a bowstring! Can you frakking IMAGINE?? Jeeze! :eek:

The Amazonians SOOOOOOOOO are real. Maybe just in my wet dreams... but they are. :D
Yeah, but think what they could (and likely would) DO to you. Is that wet dream worthy?

I'd like to hang out with 'em, y'know, just be like "Hey man, don't screw with me, my Amazons will kick your ass", but I'm neither willing to cut off my right breast nor take the chance that it would damage my dating scene.....

The Amazonians SOOOOOOOOO are real. Maybe just in my wet dreams... but they are. :D
TMI

There's a cultural assumption there that all societies will automatically elect to make reproduction a primary function of women. In ancient times, there were religions and social groups that required self-mutilation including male castration, vows of celibacy, homosexuality, and other types of redirection, suppression, or sublimation of sexuality. Also, in some parts of the world, war was a seasonal activity, leaving many months free for reproduction and other parts of life. Also, ancient times were not without means of birth control. Finally, gender roles were not as strictly defined in many ancient cultures as they were among the Greeks. So there really is no practical bar against women as full-time warriors. This isn't proof that these ancient tribes were dominated by women warriors, just a caveat that they might have been for a little while. And anyway, there's not enough archeological evidence, imo, to suggest more than that there were women warriors among these people.


I'm sure you are correct, but my comment was mainly to do with someone else's argument that they doubted that the society was female dominant/exclusive.

I've read "Reign of the Phallus", and I did see the documentary on ancient Sparta, so I'm aware of most of what you are saying. Having been pregnant, I can tell you that you don't just take off part of a year to pop out a kid...I would think that IS a practical bar against women being full-time warriors.

And you are also correct that there isn't enough evidence to know what exactly the cultural roles were for these bodies that were discovered.

I'm sure you are correct, but my comment was mainly to do with someone else's argument that they doubted that the society was female dominant/exclusive.

I've read "Reign of the Phallus", and I did see the documentary on ancient Sparta, so I'm aware of most of what you are saying. Having been pregnant, I can tell you that you don't just take off part of a year to pop out a kid...I would think that IS a practical bar against women being full-time warriors.

And you are also correct that there isn't enough evidence to know what exactly the cultural roles were for these bodies that were discovered.

The amazons could still have had children later in their lives, only fighting when young. That would slow down population growth a little, but for Mongols living on very limited resources that may have been a good thing.

Simonist']Yeah, but think what they could (and likely would) DO to you. Is that wet dream worthy?

I'd like to hang out with 'em, y'know, just be like "Hey man, don't screw with me, my Amazons will kick your ass", but I'm neither willing to cut off my right breast nor take the chance that it would damage my dating scene.....
Ha, you see, that's why you won't be as successful as, say, ...uh... *tries to think of a volunteer for the Amazonian side* ...well anyway.... look behind you! *runs*

The amazons could still have had children later in their lives, only fighting when young. That would slow down population growth a little, but for Mongols living on very limited resources that may have been a good thing.


You could very well be right...I'm not a PhD in this subject, I'm merely offering an opinion since I've been pregnant twice and I know it's not a cakewalk!:)

This whole thing definitely raises some interesting questions.

I also find it hilarious that some people claim here that Amazons are their wet dream! HA HA! It reminds me of an episode of Xena (yes, I will cop to watching it) where she and Gabrielle are trying to figure out why this guy seems to be crushing on Xena, and Gabrielle says "maybe you should try chainmail armour instead of leather" and Xena says "nah, it just brings in a kinkier crowd". :p