NationStates Jolt Archive

As an American, I can understand the need for more than one superpower. In a system of democracy, one power is balanced out by another which is balanced out by another which is balanced out by the first. This allows for political and economic stability, and prevents corruption. I am therefore willing to accept the idea that this same concept ought to be applied to the international community, and would welcome it's implementation.

There is, however, the matter of who the other superpower is going to be... To be perfectly frank, I'm not exactly tickled pink with the notion of the People's Republic of China becoming the second largest economic and military might in the next 25 years, bested only by the United States. We all know what happens when a very large, very militaristically muscular communist country begins to realize it has even a little bit of power...

Thus, I put before European nations (though more specifically the United Kingdom) this plea: Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean. Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)? And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)? Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own.... Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?

Think of the PRC, guys. In 25 years they will have economically bested the European Union. They'll be bigger, stronger and more agressive than the USSR was. So please... For the sake of the world...get better economies. Become superpowers again. There was a time when you people would go to war with anyone who looked at one of your governments the wrong way. There was a time when you would slaughter hundreds of thousands of people for five hundred square feet of some uninhabitable tract of territory in some God forsaken continent. I'm not saying you should return to those days, of course... but maybe the idea that was "Europe" (and again, more specifically the idea that still is "Britain") might care to show a shadow of it's former spirit in light of the looming threat from the East.

Should it ever (God forbid) come to war with the People's Republic of China and the United States of America... Well, think about it. No one would win. They're the PRC... we're the USA... Nothing would be standing after that. However, if it was the USA and the EU in a war against the PRC, it could be a different story. In fact, it could be that war may be averted all together... At any rate, European values are (in general) noble, and it would be good if you were given the means to spread them more effectivley.

JC, finally! Get back to RPing the conflict. Anyway, don't be so pessimistic about China. I'm Asian, and while I believe that the USA is the lesser of the two evils, if you play your diplomatic cards right, then the world may be a lot more stable.

What a bunch of crock.

What a bunch of crock.

And why do you say that, exactly?

And why do you say that, exactly?

Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean. Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)? And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)? Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own.... Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?

:rolleyes:

For starters, French productivity is very high -- in fact, recent OECD figures put the G.D.P. per hour worked on par with the US. Of course they need to work on unemployment, though. Also, the Spanish election was about more than Islamofacism -- look at the ruling government's baseless blame of the ETA and the distrust it created among the people. The BBC is one of the most reputable news outlets in the world, leagues ahead of most US counterparts. As for buying-power, the EU is the US' largest trading partnet -- two-way trade was like nearly 600 billion dollars in 2003 -- and that was with only 15 member states. An estimated 3.3 million US jobs were supported by EU15 investment in the US in 2002 -- EU15 direct investment was 850 billion dollars.

As for China....yes, it's up and coming. But remember how everyone was scared the Japanese were taking over like twenty years ago? Why would China even want to war with the US? I'm pretty sure we're its largest trading partner (like 300 billion dollars a year) -- we import more to them than we export, we invest in their companies, we give them a huge market for their growing economy. The only major point of contention I can think of is oil (See Unocal takeover attempt), but even that wouldn't be enough to make us go to war.

Oh? And why is that crock?

What a bunch of crock.
He's right, ya know. Everyone bitches about America and our power and how we abuse it. If more people either 1) got off their lazy asses and worked harder or 2) quit the petty squabbling and fighting amongst themselves, Europe would be much more powerful and prosperous than they currently are.
I mean, for christ's sake, 30 HOURS A WEEK? Can you say LAZY?

For starters, French productivity is very high -- in fact, recent OECD figures put the G.D.P. per hour worked on par with the US. Of course they need to work on unemployment, though. Also, the Spanish election was about more than Islamofacism -- look at the ruling government's baseless blame of the ETA and the distrust it created among the people. The BBC is one of the most reputable news outlets in the world, leagues ahead of most US counterparts. As for buying-power, the EU is the US' largest trading partnet -- two-way trade was like nearly 600 billion dollars in 2003 -- and that was with only 15 member states. An estimated 3.3 million US jobs were supported by EU15 investment in the US in 2002 -- EU15 direct investment was 850 billion dollars.

As for China....yes, it's up and coming. But remember how everyone was scared the Japanese were taking over like twenty years ago? Why would China even want to war with the US? I'm pretty sure we're its largest trading partner (like 300 billion dollars a year) -- we import more to them than we export, we invest in their companies, we give them a huge market for their growing economy. The only major point of contention I can think of is oil (See Unocal takeover attempt), but even that wouldn't be enough to make us go to war.

That makes a lot of sense, and I completely agree. :)

See how much more productive a counterargument is compared to rolled eyes, Fass? ;)

Oh? And why is that crock?

Oh, I'm not even gonna bother. It's such a superficial "analysis," and I use that term as loosely as humanly possible, that it's really a matter of time before you get someone who bites and is willing to dispute its feebleness. The comment about the church, though, is a hoot in its stupidity.

Thus, I put before European nations (though more specifically the United Kingdom) this plea: Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean. Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)?

Could it be that you're just jealous?

Edit : Btw, France has 35 hours a week, as a reference point. It's not compulsory. Most of Europe has between 38-40 hours.

And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)?

Personally, I agree a whole lot more with the mature and rational way the Spanish and the British dealt with those attacks than the over-emotionalised American way... we can't all go round bombing Arab nations "back to the Stone Age". There simply aren't enough Arab nations for that.


Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own....

Justify your wasting of resources by wasting them ourselves? And that makes sense how?


Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?

We have social decay? Oh, yes, we should send our kids to school. Like that, they may eventually run amok and shoot their classmates... wouldn't it be great if our kids followed the shining American example?

Personally, I have no interest whatsoever in spreading our values. If somebody likes them and wants to adopt them, fine. If not, why try and convince or force him?

Very offensive post - guaranteed to result in flaming.

...I am therefore willing to accept the idea that this same concept ought to be applied to the international community, and would welcome it's implementation.
Good. The more the merrier.

There is, however, the matter of who the other superpower is going to be...We all know what happens when a very large, very militaristically muscular communist country begins to realize it has even a little bit of power...
a) I don't have a problem with the Chinese. All Chinese people I have spoken to were very informed, sensible and nice people. I'm afraid I can't say the same about a number of Americans I've had the pleasure of talking to.
b) China is everything but Communist.
c) Does it make a difference whether we have a "democratic", yet (at least culturally) imperialistic and very dominating country which happens to realise it has a little bit of power?

Thus, I put before European nations (though more specifically the United Kingdom) this plea: Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean.
What do you mean by socialism?

Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)? And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)?
Sorry, people in Europe have principles.
a) What in heck's name is it to you how long French people spend working?
b) Spain running in fear because they voted off a government 70% of people disagreed with?
The Spanish people didn't want to be in Iraq in the first place. Then they were bombed for it - and their government told them it was ETA! They lied to their own people about terrorism!
I'm afraid that was more important to the Spanish people than not to appear weak in front of the US and their wannabe coalition.
c) "Terrorist" hasn't been properly defined. It's being used against everyone and everything these days - understandably you need to make sure such an allegation is justified. It's called "journalistic integrity" - something that may have been a little lost in the days of Fox News-tainment.

Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own....
What? You cannot possibly even begin to fathom what's going on in Europe right now. You lack perspective.

Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?
:rolleyes:

Think of the PRC, guys. In 25 years they will have economically bested the European Union. They'll be bigger, stronger and more agressive than the USSR was.
Prove it.

So please... For the sake of the world...get better economies. Become superpowers again....care to show a shadow of it's former spirit in light of the looming threat from the East.
Sorry mate, but after a war that apparently you haven't even begun to understand, war is out of the question. Forever.

Should it ever (God forbid) come to war with the People's Republic of China and the United States of America... Well, think about it. No one would win. They're the PRC... we're the USA... Nothing would be standing after that. However, if it was the USA and the EU in a war against the PRC, it could be a different story.
Sure...we launch nukes, they launch nukes. We're all dead - either way. Don't corner someone though, then you don't have to be scared of nukes.
And besides..why do you assume the PRC is going to be aggressive? If I remember correctly, the US was the number one war-maker and interventionist on the planet for the past century.

In fact, it could be that war may be averted all together... At any rate, European values are (in general) noble, and it would be good if you were given the means to spread them more effectivley.
By going against them? Forget it.

Personally, I agree a whole lot more with the mature and rational way the Spanish and the British dealt with those attacks than the over-emotionalised American way... we can't all go round bombing Arab nations "back to the Stone Age".
Actually, we can and we do. At least when they misbehave anyways :mp5:

Oh, I'm not even gonna bother. It's such a superficial "analysis," and I use that term as loosely as humanly possible, that it's really a matter of time before you get someone who bites and is willing to dispute its feebleness. The comment about the church, though, is a hoot in its stupidity.

I am afraid I have no other option but to dismiss you as hot-headed and ignorant since you have (a) been apparently unable to back your remarks and (b) dismissed the the Church as "a hoot," as silly and generally asinine as that is.

JC, how about the RP? You've gotta take care of that, remember?

I am afraid I have no other option but to dismiss you as hot-headed and ignorant since you have (a) been apparently unable to back your remarks and (b) dismissed the the Church as "a hoot," as silly and generally asinine as that is.

No biggie. I dismissed you as soon as I read your silly post, so no sweat off my back. And, as you see, you've had a few biters already, just like I told you. Have fun!

Actually, we can and we do. At least when they misbehave anyways :mp5:

Yes, you can. But a simple "because I can" has never been a justification for anything in my book.

Yes, you can. But a simple "because I can" has never been a justification for anything in my book.
Didn't say it was a justification. Just said we can and we do. Not really anything anyone can or will do about it, so it's a moot point.
(sorry, Im in a "whatcha gonna do about it?" mood)

Didn't say it was a justification. Just said we can and we do. Not really anything anyone can or will do about it, so it's a moot point.
(sorry, Im in a "whatcha gonna do about it?" mood)

*waits for the next delivery of high explosives to some American interest.*

Payback's a bitch isn't it? You hit me, I hit you, etc, etc, etc.

Ok, let's be honest here. The only Europeans with the will to become a superpower is the Germans. And maybe the Russians, but they're kaput.

Unfortunately, the world has guilted that will out of the Germans. Oh, you're evil! Oh, you killed Jews! Oh, some Austrian dude tried to take over the world, so you should be snivelling cowards for the rest of eternity!

*waits for the next delivery of high explosives to some American interest.*

Payback's a bitch isn't it? You hit me, I hit you, etc, etc, etc.
*Watches the USS Ronald Reagan leave port* Yes, it is. An eye for an eye leaves the world blind. Thats why when you get poked in the eye, you cut the son of a bitches head off.

Ok, let's be honest here. The only Europeans with the will to become a superpower is the Germans. And maybe the Russians, but they're kaput.

Unfortunately, the world has guilted that will out of the Germans. Oh, you're evil! Oh, you killed Jews! Oh, some Austrian dude tried to take over the world, so you should be snivelling cowards for the rest of eternity!

To be honest, I don't think the world "guilted" it out of Germany. Once the illness that was Nazism was recognised for what it was, the next generation (who I don't believe have a damn thing to feel guilty about) decided that rather than having a burning Dresden, they would rather have a pretty cool country to live in. Not that complicated.

Well I, for one, would just like to say how much I welcome our new chinese overlords, and take this opportunity to point out that the whole opium dealy was entirely europe. As were the unequal treaties.

To be honest, I don't think the world "guilted" it out of Germany. Once the illness that was Nazism was recognised for what it was, the next generation (who I don't believe have a damn thing to feel guilty about) decided that rather than having a burning Dresden, they would rather have a pretty cool country to live in. Not that complicated.

Yeah, but now they're ****ing pussies. If the Germans got invaded, they'd be looking for a way to justify being conquered. "Well, that country was pretty poor, I guess they had the right to invade."

Ok, let's be honest here. The only Europeans with the will to become a superpower is the Germans. And maybe the Russians, but they're kaput.

Unfortunately, the world has guilted that will out of the Germans. Oh, you're evil! Oh, you killed Jews! Oh, some Austrian dude tried to take over the world, so you should be snivelling cowards for the rest of eternity!

Buddy, I AM German, and believe me, they have no interest whatsoever in becoming a superpower ever again. It's got nothing to do with guilt, it's more of a growing up thing. Once you're grown enough to realise the cost and the responsibility you would have to carry, you just stay away from it. You no longer have to prove that you're the bigger one to anybody.

Buddy, I AM German, and believe me, they have no interest whatsoever in becoming a superpower ever again. It's got nothing to do with guilt, it's more of a growing up thing. Once you're grown enough to realise the cost and the responsibility you would have to carry, you just stay away from it. You no longer have to prove that you're the bigger one to anybody.

Ditto for Britain.

Buddy, I AM German, and believe me, they have no interest whatsoever in becoming a superpower ever again. It's got nothing to do with guilt, it's more of a growing up thing. Once you're grown enough to realise the cost and the responsibility you would have to carry, you just stay away from it. You no longer have to prove that you're the bigger one to anybody.

I've noticed that about the younger nations, this urge to be "significant." All it brings is misery really, because it doesn't last.

Buddy, I AM German, and believe me, they have no interest whatsoever in becoming a superpower ever again. It's got nothing to do with guilt, it's more of a growing up thing. Once you're grown enough to realise the cost and the responsibility you would have to carry, you just stay away from it. You no longer have to prove that you're the bigger one to anybody.

Well, so am I, and I'm pretty pissed off about my country sucking for all eternity because some people blame us for all of the world's problems.

Yeah, but now they're ****ing pussies. If the Germans got invaded, they'd be looking for a way to justify being conquered. "Well, that country was pretty poor, I guess they had the right to invade."

So, what's it to you?

Well, so am I, and I'm pretty pissed off about my country sucking for all eternity because some people blame us for all of the world's problems.

I never was under the impression they did. On the contrary.

Well, so am I, and I'm pretty pissed off about my country sucking for all eternity because some people blame us for all of the world's problems.

No offense, but I think you've got the issue here, not "some people". The British Empire wasn't entirely a glorious venture you know, but we've mostly got over it. As for Hitler and the Holocaust, not just Germans participated, and if you believe some versions of the history of that time, Britain, USA and USSR were all politically complicit in the slaughter, particularly in Poland.

Personally, I feel no guilt for Indian partition, the Allenby plan, the slaughter of the Maoris, the Corn laws or anything else that went on in my country's past. For, you see, I wasn't there. I'd concentrate on getting over it mate.

I've noticed that about the younger nations, this urge to be "significant." All it brings is misery really, because it doesn't last.

China is hardly a younger nation, but it does have the urge to be significant. India too.

Well, so am I, and I'm pretty pissed off about my country sucking for all eternity because some people blame us for all of the world's problems.
Well, maybe I of all people are the wrong one to ask this, but when did you leave Germany? How old are you?
I agree it can sometimes be difficult to see the Aussies be all patriotic and stuff, yet being unable to listen to one sentence about Germany without being confronted with the war and the propaganda from then.
It's of no matter though - going out and provlaiming the superpower is not only unrealistic, but it will also not change our history.

China is hardly a younger nation, but it does have the urge to be significant. India too.

I mean in the sense that they haven't been "significant" lately in this "world power" sense. They all want their chance in the Sun. It seems to go in waves. They'll fall and someone else will take their place. It's so pointless.

I mean in the sense that they haven't been "significant" lately in this "world power" sense. They all want their chance in the Sun. It seems to go in waves. They'll fall and someone else will take their place. It's so pointless.

Don't you ever worry that it's about more than just a place in the sun. I mean after all, when Europe finally got the whip hand, the first thing it did was run around the globe settling old scores and putting a new world order into place. Likewise when the US gained hegemony over the west it tried its damndest to impose its world order. I am sure that in a similar fashion, a China of a billion plus people with a forty-trillion dollar economy would have its own demands to make.

Well, maybe I of all people are the wrong one to ask this, but when did you leave Germany? How old are you?
I agree it can sometimes be difficult to see the Aussies be all patriotic and stuff, yet being unable to listen to one sentence about Germany without being confronted with the war and the propaganda from then.
It's of no matter though - going out and provlaiming the superpower is not only unrealistic, but it will also not change our history.

I was born here, my parents came from Europe. Before you say anything, yes, I'm a reactionary to the lack of patriotism from my parents.

Don't you ever worry that it's about more than just a place in the sun. I mean after all, when Europe finally got the whip hand, the first thing it did was run around the globe settling old scores and putting a new world order into place. Likewise when the US gained hegemony over the west it tried its damndest to impose its world order. I am sure that in a similar fashion, a China of a billion plus people with a forty-trillion dollar economy would have its own demands to make.

I don't worry, since that's probably what will happen. But China seems to be slowly moving towards more freedoms, and, who knows, all that affluence might make the populace have time to thirst for real freedoms and have them seize it. I hope so, anyway. But there's no point in worrying - all civilisations crumble sooner or later. The Western one will not last indefinitely.

I was born here, my parents came from Europe. Before you say anything, yes, I'm a reactionary to the lack of patriotism from my parents.

Which makes you effectively Australian, not German. And it would explain your distorted views of Germany on the whole...

Which makes you effectively Australian, not German. And it would explain your distorted views of Germany on the whole...

No, I'm not ****ing Australian. These people are nothing like me. They're idiots. I follow Germany, the Emperor and Odin, not Australia and it's weak Queen and Christian "god".

No, I'm not ****ing Australian. These people are nothing like me. They're idiots. I follow Germany, the Emperor and Odin, not Australia and it's weak Queen and Christian "god".

Hahaha. Odin is Scandinavia, and nobody, not even here, believes in that crap any more.

No, I'm not ****ing Australian. These people are nothing like me. They're idiots. I follow Germany, the Emperor and Odin, not Australia and it's weak Queen and Christian "god".

*lol What "Emperor" are you talking about? And Germany is predominantly Christian as well. Don't know if you noticed, but the new pope is German...

And they just elected Merkel as chancellor. Not much difference between her and the queen, except maybe that the queen has style...

No, I'm not ****ing Australian. These people are nothing like me. They're idiots. I follow Germany, the Emperor and Odin, not Australia and it's weak Queen and Christian "god".

That never pans out particularly well. I really would advocate against it as a lifestyle choice. Have you considered taking up a hobby like metalworking instead?

Hahaha. Odin is Scandinavia, and nobody, not even here, believes in that crap any more.

We worshipped the Norse gods too. My tribe called Odin "Wuodan".

*lol What "Emperor" are you talking about? And Germany is predominantly Christian as well. Don't know if you noticed, but the new pope is German...

I support the restoration of the Hohenzollern dynasty. And I think it's disgraceful how quickly Europe threw away it's heritage. Although I'll tolerate Christians in the fight against the greater evils.

As an American, I can understand the need for more than one superpower. >snip>

Thus, I put before European nations (though more specifically the United Kingdom) this plea: Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean. Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)? And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)? Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own.... Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?



As a european...was this satirical in intent? Otherwise I have to second Fass and most other contributors...this is a whole bunch of half-information, semi-knowledge and religious beliefs (why for heavens sake you had to put that in) lumped together in some pasty thread? In a more narrow state of mind I would see this as flame-baiting...but today I´m generous. So good advice: Back to base and go study some history, general education and foreign relations...for a start :rolleyes:

As an American, I can understand the need for more than one superpower. >snip>

Thus, I put before European nations (though more specifically the United Kingdom) this plea: Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean. Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)? And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)? Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own.... Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?



As a european...was this satirical in intent? Otherwise I have to second Fass and most other contributors...this is a whole bunch of half-information, semi-knowledge and religious beliefs (why for heavens sake you had to put that in) lumped together in some pasty thread? In a more narrow state of mind I would see this as flame-baiting...but today I´m generous. So good advice: Back to base and go study some history, general education and foreign relations...for a start :rolleyes:

I support the restoration of the Hohenzollern dynasty. And I think it's disgraceful how quickly Europe threw away it's heritage. Although I'll tolerate Christians in the fight against the greater evils.

Your "tribe"??? *roflmao

Sure, we all live in tribes in Germany. And we hunt the wooly mamooth for our rituals...

Just FYI, the Hohenzollern were kings of Prussia. The only time in German history they became an imperial family was for those 47 years between the foundation of the Reich and the establishment of the Weimar Republic.

Your parents were from Swabia, I think you said? If you knew about German tradition and honoured it, you would be forced to hate the Prussians... as does the whole south of Germany.

We worshipped the Norse gods too. My tribe called Odin "Wuodan".

Yeah, "norse." And your "tribe?" Haha. That's just silly.

Sure, we all live in tribes in Germany. And we hunt the wooly mamooth for our rituals...

Yes, yes...want some piece of my mamooth pie? Extra tasty, and for you at a special price...jaja, die Schwaben :D

Yes, yes...want some piece of my mamooth pie? Extra tasty, and for you at a special price...jaja, die Schwaben :D

Special price? Von einem Schwaben? Ich glaub nicht, dass ich mir das leisten kann ;)

As an American, I can understand the need for more than one superpower. In a system of democracy, one power is balanced out by another which is balanced out by another which is balanced out by the first. This allows for political and economic stability, and prevents corruption. I am therefore willing to accept the idea that this same concept ought to be applied to the international community, and would welcome it's implementation.

There is, however, the matter of who the other superpower is going to be... To be perfectly frank, I'm not exactly tickled pink with the notion of the People's Republic of China becoming the second largest economic and military might in the next 25 years, bested only by the United States. We all know what happens when a very large, very militaristically muscular communist country begins to realize it has even a little bit of power...

Thus, I put before European nations (though more specifically the United Kingdom) this plea: Could you maybe, like, cut it out? With Socialism, I mean. Do you think you could start working more than 30 hours a week (I'm lookin' at you, France)? And perhaps, the next time a terrorist bombs your train station, could you please not run in fear (Spain) or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)? Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing? Then, you wouldn't have to constantly complain that the US consumes so many resources, despite the fact that you demonstrate no desire to generate buying-power of your own.... Oh, and this is just a side thought, but perhaps you wouldn't have the rampant social decay that you have if you, oh I don't know, brought you and your kids to Church once and a while...?

Think of the PRC, guys. In 25 years they will have economically bested the European Union. They'll be bigger, stronger and more agressive than the USSR was. So please... For the sake of the world...get better economies. Become superpowers again. There was a time when you people would go to war with anyone who looked at one of your governments the wrong way. There was a time when you would slaughter hundreds of thousands of people for five hundred square feet of some uninhabitable tract of territory in some God forsaken continent. I'm not saying you should return to those days, of course... but maybe the idea that was "Europe" (and again, more specifically the idea that still is "Britain") might care to show a shadow of it's former spirit in light of the looming threat from the East.

Should it ever (God forbid) come to war with the People's Republic of China and the United States of America... Well, think about it. No one would win. They're the PRC... we're the USA... Nothing would be standing after that. However, if it was the USA and the EU in a war against the PRC, it could be a different story. In fact, it could be that war may be averted all together... At any rate, European values are (in general) noble, and it would be good if you were given the means to spread them more effectivley.
this is a joke, right?

Special price? Von einem Schwaben? Ich glaub nicht, dass ich mir das leisten kann ;)

If you mich nochmal Schwaben schimpfst, then I come over to old Ireland...Schwabe, igitt!

Got some mammoth stew, too...dish-of-the-day ;)

this is a joke, right?

I fear it is not, there has been no reply from the infamous JC to that... :eek:

Your "tribe"??? *roflmao

Sure, we all live in tribes in Germany. And we hunt the wooly mamooth for our rituals...

Just FYI, the Hohenzollern were kings of Prussia. The only time in German history they became an imperial family was for those 47 years between the foundation of the Reich and the establishment of the Weimar Republic.

Your parents were from Swabia, I think you said? If you knew about German tradition and honoured it, you would be forced to hate the Prussians... as does the whole south of Germany.

The Hohenzollerns have the right to the Imperial throne. They were the last ones who occupied it.

And I'm Alemannisch. And I have nothing against the Prussians, at least they fought.

And I have nothing against the Prussians, at least they fought.

And lost. You seem to overlook that little detail. The new germany is much better. They make nice cars.

Special price? Von einem Schwaben? Ich glaub nicht, dass ich mir das leisten kann ;)

What, poor?

The Hohenzollerns have the right to the Imperial throne. They were the last ones who occupied it.

And I'm Alemannisch. And I have nothing against the Prussians, at least they fought.

Germany doesn't HAVE an imperial throne. Never had. Never will have.
It did have emperors, but those were elected for life by an assembly of aristocrats from all nations of the German Reich. Wittelsbach and Habsburg would have about the same claim to the crown as any Hohenzollern brat...

What, poor?

Well, there is this German legend that the Schwaben were originally from Scotland, but were exiled for being to greedy and obsessed with money...

And lost. You seem to overlook that little detail. The new germany is much better. They make nice cars.

The old Germany was better. They were the most powerful country in the world for a short period. Finest army in the world, at least.

And Prussia lost wars because they were surrounded by white flag toting jerks.

The old Germany was better. They were the most powerful country in the world for a short period. Finest army in the world, at least.

And Prussia lost wars because they were surrounded by white flag toting jerks.

And what time would that have been?

And let me guess... you're one of those people who still buy the Dolchstosslegende?

Germany doesn't HAVE an imperial throne. Never had. Never will have.
It did have emperors, but those were elected for life by an assembly of aristocrats from all nations of the German Reich. Wittelsbach and Habsburg would have about the same claim to the crown as any Hohenzollern brat...

You're thinking of the Holy Roman Empire. The German Empire was created when Bismarck led Prussia in wars of conquest. A lot like the Warring States period in China.

No, I'm not ****ing Australian. These people are nothing like me. They're idiots. I follow Germany, the Emperor and Odin, not Australia and it's weak Queen and Christian "god".

Well, well, well. A racist. And one that hates Australians. We don't get many of those, y'know. I seriously doubt you are Australian, considering the fact the Queen doesn't rule Australia, she has no influence, however, Australia was a British colony, and old habits die hard. After all, if it ain't broke, why fix it? What does having the Queen as our nominal ruler do to us? I've never sworn allegiance to the Queen, nor am I a Christian.

In fact, only the older Australians are generally Christian, if my (rural) school is taken to be the norm, maybe 1 in 100 kids would admit they're Christian, and ignoramuses like you would be ridiculed out of school. Maybe you already were, and that's why you're so bitter....

Maybe, just maybe, the next time you make a statement, could you cut the idiocy, blatant discrimination, and ignorance? It'd make you sound a helluva lot better...

Well, there is this German legend that the Schwaben were originally from Scotland, but were exiled for being to greedy and obsessed with money...
In that case I gladly give you all mamooth pieces for free ;) is this guy serious are we being set up?

No, I'm not ****ing Australian. These people are nothing like me. They're idiots. I follow Germany, the Emperor and Odin, not Australia and it's weak Queen and Christian "god".
this guy is also a joke, too, right?

What is all this hostility about? Can't you see that in this time of globalisation we have to work together? US, Europa and Asia don't have to compete. Why not support each other intead?

And what time would that have been?

Pre-WWI.

And let me guess... you're one of those people who still buy the Dolchstosslegende?

It's at least partly true, both sides were equally exhausted. Some people didn't have the stomach for war.

You're thinking of the Holy Roman Empire. The German Empire was created when Bismarck led Prussia in wars of conquest. A lot like the Warring States period in China.

1871 - 1918. 47 years... Even the German Republic has existed longer than that by now... :rolleyes:

What is all this hostility about? Can't you see that in this time of globalisation we have to work together? US, Europa and Asia don't have to compete. Why not support each other intead?

I just don't like Australians telling me what religion Germany should have, is all... ;)

*Watches the USS Ronald Reagan leave port* Yes, it is. An eye for an eye leaves the world blind. Thats why when you get poked in the eye, you cut the son of a bitches head off.

If you really believe that, I'm surprised you haven't landed in jail yet. In fact, if that was US and Soviet policy back in the 70s, we wouldn't be talking. We'd be dead. Escalation is never pretty, and you often lose more than you want to spend.

The question remains then. "Is it worth it?"

The old Germany was better. They were the most powerful country in the world for a short period. Finest army in the world, at least.

And Prussia lost wars because they were surrounded by white flag toting jerks.

When was that then? 1914-1917? Even then, it's arguable, and it is hardly the sort of legacy you want now, is it?

this guy is also a joke, too, right?

Has to be... but he's kinda fun to tease. I wonder when he'll explode.

Well, well, well. A racist. And one that hates Australians. We don't get many of those, y'know. I seriously doubt you are Australian, considering the fact the Queen doesn't rule Australia, she has no influence, however, Australia was a British colony, and old habits die hard. After all, if it ain't broke, why fix it? What does having the Queen as our nominal ruler do to us? I've never sworn allegiance to the Queen, nor am I a Christian.

In fact, only the older Australians are generally Christian, if my (rural) school is taken to be the norm, maybe 1 in 100 kids would admit they're Christian, and ignoramuses like you would be ridiculed out of school. Maybe you already were, and that's why you're so bitter....

Maybe, just maybe, the next time you make a statement, could you cut the idiocy, blatant discrimination, and ignorance? It'd make you sound a helluva lot better...

Australia isn't a race. And younger Australians don't seem Christian, but they get into the mood quickly enough when you challenge their beliefs.

1871 - 1918. 47 years... Even the German Republic has existed longer than that by now... :rolleyes:

But the Emperor of Germany was never elected. Always the Hohenzollern dynasty. Wilhelm I, Friedrich III, Wilhelm II.

Well, there is this German legend that the Schwaben were originally from Scotland, but were exiled for being to greedy and obsessed with money...

The Scots exiled people for being greedy and obsessed with money? Stop now. If that was the case there would be no-one left in scotland.

But the Emperor of Germany was never elected. Always the Hohenzollern dynasty. Wilhelm I, Friedrich III, Wilhelm II.


Becoming Emperor required becoming King of the Romans (Rex romanorum/römischer König) first. German kings had been elected since time immemorial; in the 9th century by the leaders of the five most important tribes (the Franks, Saxons, Bavarians, Swabians and Thuringians), later by the main lay and clerical dukes of the kingdom, finally only by the so-called Kurfürsten (electing dukes, electors). This college was formally established by a 1356 decree known as the Golden Bull. Initially, there were seven electors; this number varied slightly over the following centuries (see prince-elector for details).

Until 1508, the newly elected king then travelled to Rome to be crowned Emperor by the Pope. In many cases, this took several years when the King was held up by other tasks: frequently he first had to resolve conflicts in rebellious northern Italy or was in quarrel with the Pope himself.

At no time could the Emperor simply decree rulings and govern autonomously over the Empire. His power was severely restricted by the various local leaders; after the late 15th century, the Reichstag established itself as the legislative body of the Empire, a complicated assembly that convened irregularly at the request of the Emperor at varying locations. Only after 1663 would the Reichstag become a permanent assembly; see Reichstag (institution) for details.

He was elected. Bismark established the first imperial dynasty ever in Germany, and it didn't even outlive half a century.

this guy is also a joke, too, right?

For his sake, I hope he is.

The Scots exiled people for being greedy and obsessed with money? Stop now. If that was the case there would be no-one left in scotland.

I see you've never been to Swabia, then ;) The Scots really are moderate compared to those people...

I see you've never been to Swabia, then ;) The Scots really are moderate compared to those people...

The mind boggles.

He was elected. Bismark established the first imperial dynasty ever in Germany, and it didn't even outlive half a century.

Yeah, that's the Holy Roman Empire. The Hohenzollern dynasty came after the Holy Roman Empire. After the HRE, there was the Confederation, then the German Empire.

Yeah, that's the Holy Roman Empire. The Hohenzollern dynasty came after the Holy Roman Empire. After the HRE, there was the Confederation, then the German Empire.
Bismark = holy roman empire? well you learn something every day i suppose :p

@ cabra west *bows his head in respect*

Quick trick, but when will he explode

Yeah, that's the Holy Roman Empire. The Hohenzollern dynasty came after the Holy Roman Empire. After the HRE, there was the Confederation, then the German Empire.

The German empire lasted for 47 years. No more, no less. ever before that, emperors were elected. After that, there were no more emperors. Don't know how to further simplify this for you.

The Scots exiled people for being greedy and obsessed with money? Stop now. If that was the case there would be no-one left in scotland.

I'll bite, you English swine. Just because we're smart enough to do you out of your tax pounds, that doesn't make us mean, just smart :p

Bismark = holy roman empire? well you learn something every day i suppose :p

*sigh*

Ok, there's the HRE. Rules central Europe for 1000 years. Then gets weak and collapses and leaves over 100 German states. Then Prussia moves west and conquers many of them and Bismarck devises a way to defeat Denmark, Austria and France and then unite all the German states into an empire ruled by the Prussian king. He succeeds, end of story.

Yeah, that's the Holy Roman Empire. The Hohenzollern dynasty came after the Holy Roman Empire. After the HRE, there was the Confederation, then the German Empire.

Guess I missed that part in my history book...was that when germany discovered america and conquered the moon? :rolleyes:

The German empire lasted for 47 years. No more, no less. ever before that, emperors were elected. After that, there were no more emperors. Don't know how to further simplify this for you.

What part of "The HRE and the German Empire were two totally different entities" do you not understand? There were 64 years of political limbo between the two.

I'll bite, you English swine. Just because we're smart enough to do you out of your tax pounds, that doesn't make us mean, just smart :p

Oh no you don't. You might fool the shandy drinkers with your kilts and bagpipes, but I hail from the borders. I've observed your lickpenny ways first-hand. (Most notably your refusal to put a proper "entering scotland" sign north of kielder in tynedale). ;)

*sigh*

Ok, there's the HRE. Rules central Europe for 1000 years. Then gets weak and collapses and leaves over 100 German states. Then Prussia moves west and conquers many of them and Bismarck devises a way to defeat Denmark, Austria and France and then unite all the German states into an empire ruled by the Prussian king. He succeeds, end of story.

*roflmao....
You've got NO clue whatsoever, have you??

The HRE existed for a little over 1000 years, it was ended by Napoleon, who set up the German Confederation, leaving most of the old structures in place, but dissolving a vast number of smaller states into the larger ones.
That lasted until 1871, when Bismark forced the foundation of the German Reich after a war with France over the Spanish succession to the throne. He did fight with Denmark over Schlesweig-Holstein, but he never conquered any of the German nations by force.

Guess I missed that part in my history book...was that when germany discovered america and conquered the moon? :rolleyes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Confederation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Empire

What part of "The HRE and the German Empire were two totally different entities" do you not understand? There were 64 years of political limbo between the two.

Ok:
HRE 772 - 1814
German Confederation 1814 - 1871
German Reich 1871 - 1918
Weimar Republic 1918 - 1933
Third Reich 1933 - 1945
Occupation 1945 - 1947
GDR and FDR 1947 - 1990
German Republic 1990 - present day.

All clear now? I don't see any limbo anywhere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Confederation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Empire

Thank you so much for enlightenment...as you see, I´m german and graduated in history, so no need for that, thank you. Either you´re pure satire (or a puppet of Eutrusca :D ) or you are just clueless in down under. Perhaps you should read your own sources and understand them :rolleyes:

*roflmao....
You've got NO clue whatsoever, have you??

The HRE existed for a little over 1000 years, it was ended by Napoleon, who set up the German Confederation, leaving most of the old structures in place, but dissolving a vast number of smaller states into the larger ones.
That lasted until 1871, when Bismark forced the foundation of the German Reich after a war with France over the Spanish succession to the throne. He did fight with Denmark over Schlesweig-Holstein, but he never conquered any of the German nations by force.

Napoleon didn't set up the German Confederation, he set up the Confederation of the Rhine. After that collapsed in 1815, the GC was set up. This ended in 1866 when Prussia defeated Austria. "Conquered" was a bad word to use on my part, but after Austria was defeated, they really had no choice. The Empire was created when France was defeated in 1871.

Oh no you don't. You might fool the shandy drinkers with your kilts and bagpipes, but I hail from the borders. I've observed your lickpenny ways first-hand. (Most notably your refusal to put a proper "entering scotland" sign north of kielder in tynedale). ;)

:D That way it's easier to sneak over and nick your cattle.

Ok:
HRE 772 - 1814
German Confederation 1814 - 1871
German Reich 1871 - 1918
Weimar Republic 1918 - 1933
Third Reich 1933 - 1945
Occupation 1945 - 1947
GDR and FDR 1947 - 1990
German Republic 1990 - present day.

All clear now? I don't see any limbo anywhere.

Nope.

HRE 772 - 1814
Conf. of the Rhine - 1813 - 1815
German Confederation 1815 - 1866
Prussia bullying everyone around - 1866 - 1871
German Empire - 1871 - 1918
Weimar Republic 1918 - 1933
Third Reich 1933 - 1945
Occupation 1945 - 1947
GDR and FDR 1947 - 1990
German Republic 1990 - present day.

Napoleon didn't set up the German Confederation, he set up the Confederation of the Rhine. After that collapsed in 1815, the GC was set up. This ended in 1866 when Prussia defeated Austria. "Conquered" was a bad word to use on my part, but after Austria was defeated, they really had no choice. The Empire was created when France was defeated in 1871.

As the German Confederation in essence didn't differ much politically from the structure Napoleon had introduced, I did leave it out of the timeline. Especially as it only existed for 8 years, between 1806 and 1814.

Nope.

HRE 772 - 1814
Conf. of the Rhine - 1813 - 1815
German Confederation 1815 - 1866
Prussia bullying everyone around - 1866 - 1871
German Empire - 1871 - 1918
Weimar Republic 1918 - 1933
Third Reich 1933 - 1945
Occupation 1945 - 1947
GDR and FDR 1947 - 1990
German Republic 1990 - present day.

The congress of Vienna and the restauration took place in 1814, not 1815.
And the German Confederation existed until 1871.

Anyway, in all of this I don't see any claim that Hohensollern could possibly have to the German crown... apart from the fact that nobody would want them back in Germany, anyway.

Sorry, I switched the dates of the Rhine Conf.'s founding and Napoleon's defeat in Russia. Yeah, 1806 to 1913.

But from what I've seen, earlier you were arguing that the Hohenzollerns were elected and then seized power with Bismarck or... I don't know what the hell you're talking about. But the German Empire was all Hohenzollern. No elections or nothing.

The congress of Vienna and the restauration took place in 1814, not 1815.
And the German Confederation existed until 1871.

Actually, the German Conf. fell in 1866, then was replace the Prussian puppet, North German Confederation. Until that was absorbed into the Empire.

Sorry, I switched the dates of the Rhine Conf.'s founding and Napoleon's defeat in Russia. Yeah, 1806 to 1913.

But from what I've seen, earlier you were arguing that the Hohenzollerns were elected and then seized power with Bismarck or... I don't know what the hell you're talking about. But the German Empire was all Hohenzollern. No elections or nothing.

I never argued that. But the German empire, as you posted yourself, only lasted for 47 years. Compared to the 1100 years of the HGE and the Confederation, during which the emperor was elected.
If Germany were ever to go back to being an empire, the Reichstag and the election of the emperor would have to be the way to go. Now, Hohenzollern were elected a number of times, but then so were Wittelsbacher, Habsburger, and many others. There is no imperial German dynasty, the way the Bourbones were a dynasty in France, or the Tudors and Stuarts were in England.

Actually, the German Conf. fell in 1866, then was replace the Prussian puppet, North German Confederation. Until that was absorbed into the Empire.

Ok, so that adds another five years to the Hohenzollern reign... not enough for a viable claim, compared to 1100 years of electoral tradition.

Wow...what a hijack! :eek: :p

Wow...what a hijack! :eek: :p

Oops... you're right. Sorry, I got carried away... :(

Meh...the original post was kinda silly anyways. ;)

Thank you so much for enlightenment...as you see, I´m german and graduated in history, so no need for that, thank you. Either you´re pure satire (or a puppet of Eutrusca :D ) or you are just clueless in down under. Perhaps you should read your own sources and understand them :rolleyes:Hey, don't blame us. I don't know where this guy is getting all this from.

A lot of Australians may be drooling morons (witness voting in Howard again and again) but we really aren't very patriotic or religious.

In Australia patriotism takes the form of obsessing over sport and yelling:
"Aussie! Aussie! Aussie! Oi! Oi! Oi!"
The average Australian is kinda gross, but basically a nice guy.

His idea of a strongly anti German thing is a little strange. To be honest we bitch about our 3 best friends the most: the Poms; the Yanks; and the Kiwis (they have sex with sheep).

I'm not saying this is what I believe; this is just my general opinion of what my countrymen are like.

The Liberated Ones']I'm not saying this is what I believe; this is just my general opinion of what my countrymen are like.
And you're probably right. :p

Anyways, this gets us back to Cabra's thread about what is nationality anyways.
Our Australo-Germanic friend here was born to German parents (no idea whether they still held German citizenship at the time) in a foreign country, which grants citizenship to any child born on its soil.
Does anyone here know the exact rules for whether and when Germany would acknowledge his claim to citizenship?
I hope [the new German government] cracks down on immigration a bit...
But this is just my mind wandering about...

The Liberated Ones']"Aussie! Aussie! Aussie! Oi! Oi! Oi!"

I didn't know all Aussies did that! I thought it was just exchange students! :p

All countries seem to have their own thing, Aussies being that, Canadians always pointing out how their Canadian (not American), and Americans generally avoiding the topic of them being American. :p

Actually, I would like to see someone in the American Government crack down on our immigration issues as well.

And you're probably right. :p

Anyways, this gets us back to Cabra's thread about what is nationality anyways.
Our Australo-Germanic friend here was born to German parents (no idea whether they still held German citizenship at the time) in a foreign country, which grants citizenship to any child born on its soil.
Does anyone here know the exact rules for whether and when Germany would acknowledge his claim to citizenship?

But this is just my mind wandering about...

Seeing that people from Russia and Eastern Europe only need to claim that their ancestor had a German shepard dog about 400 years ago to be able to get instant citizenship, I'm afraid they'd offer him the same the moment he decided to come "heim ins Reich"

If you really believe that, I'm surprised you haven't landed in jail yet. In fact, if that was US and Soviet policy back in the 70s, we wouldn't be talking. We'd be dead. Escalation is never pretty, and you often lose more than you want to spend.

The question remains then. "Is it worth it?"
Why would I land in jail? Everyone I've ever known or met knows that taking my eye would be a bad idea. As for your question, "is it worth it?" Yes, it's very much worth it. I'm a very kind and generous person, as anyone who knows me well will tell you. But I don't like being fucked with, and I don't take it very well. I had to learn to take care of myself growing up, and I did that by making sure people knew it was in their best interest to not fuck with me.

Seeing that people from Russia and Eastern Europe only need to claim that their ancestor had a German shepard dog about 400 years ago to be able to get instant citizenship, I'm afraid they'd offer him the same the moment he decided to come "heim ins Reich"
But isn't that a special deal made with Russia and the Ukraine specifically?

I just know they're being very picky when I ask for a dual citizenship...and until they give it to me, and I remain only German, I have to pay heaps more for university.
Which sucks.

But isn't that a special deal made with Russia and the Ukraine specifically?

I just know they're being very picky when I ask for a dual citizenship...and until they give it to me, and I remain only German, I have to pay heaps more for university.
Which sucks.

Dual citizenship only works outside of Germany. If you're living somewhere else and get citizenship there, you can keep the German citizenship. But as soon as you get back to Germany, you have to decide which one you want to keep.

I don't think there are any special deals... the German government really considers that to be some sort of historical thing. If your ancestors were German, you can become German, too. Braindead and stupid in my eyes, but then again, I don't need to complain. I left the place in time...

Why would I land in jail? Everyone I've ever known or met knows that taking my eye would be a bad idea. As for your question, "is it worth it?" Yes, it's very much worth it. I'm a very kind and generous person, as anyone who knows me well will tell you. But I don't like being fucked with, and I don't take it very well. I had to learn to take care of myself growing up, and I did that by making sure people knew it was in their best interest to not fuck with me.He Sneers at you,
You tell him to get fucked,
He spits in your face,
You push him to the ground,
He cuts you with a knife,
You put a bullet in his brain... you go to jail.
Both your families grieve.
What has this got you?

I think the politics of escalation and revenge are even more pointless; more innocents get caught in the crossfire.

Should it ever (God forbid) come to war with the People's Republic of China and the United States of America... Well, think about it. No one would win. They're the PRC... we're the USA... Nothing would be standing after that. However, if it was the USA and the EU in a war against the PRC, it could be a different story. In fact, it could be that war may be averted all together... At any rate, European values are (in general) noble, and it would be good if you were given the means to spread them more effectivley.Washington should not take Europe for granted...

Europe will not side with the US...unless the US is true about Justice and Freedom.

The Liberated Ones']He Sneers at you,
You tell him to get fucked,
He spits in your face,
You push him to the ground,
He cuts you with a knife,
You put a bullet in his brain... you go to jail.
Both your families grieve.
What has this got you?

I think the politics of escalation and revenge are even more pointless; more innocents get caught in the crossfire.
Nope, ya got it all wrong, with typical generilizations. Thats what happens when you judge people you don't know.

He snears at me
I keep walking, because it ain't worth it.

He spits in my face.
I break his jaw

He cut's me with a knife.
I put a bullet in his chest. (never aim for the head, bigger chance of missing)
I don't get charged, because
1)My gun is registered
2)Self defense

His family greives
I greive, but I'm alive

I never said I'd kill someone for sneering at me. Stop assuming.

If America wants to be afraid of the Peoples Republic, then let them be afraid. Europe does things in her own way - we are a superpower, just one that needs time to pull themselves back together. We are, in many ways, the biggest player on the field. We have a much lower infant mortality rate than the USA. We have - either as the EU or as the Eurozone, the largest economy on the planet. We are working with China, not against. Our health care system means that our workers are much healthier and far more empowered than American workers.

Europe has been around a hell of a longer time than the USA, and she is in a much better position internationally thanks to careful diplomacy. America is sunk - black and white diplomacy Bush style will finish off the dying American juggernaut. Capitalism will destroy America, because America has corrupted Capitalism.


P.S. China is heading for a revolution.

Nope, ya got it all wrong, with typical generilizations. Thats what happens when you judge people you don't know.

He snears at me
I keep walking, because it ain't worth it.

He spits in my face.
I break his jaw

He cut's me with a knife.
I put a bullet in his chest. (never aim for the head, bigger chance of missing)
I don't get charged, because
1)My gun is registered
2)Self defense

His family greives
I greive, but I'm alive

I never said I'd kill someone for sneering at me. Stop assuming.

It's self defense killing a person for spitting at you???

Seeing that people from Russia and Eastern Europe only need to claim that their ancestor had a German shepard dog about 400 years ago to be able to get instant citizenship, I'm afraid they'd offer him the same the moment he decided to come "heim ins Reich"The Russland-Deutsche are actually descendants of immigrants that came on invitation of the German Czarine Catherine the Great. Then they got persecuted and shoved off wherever by the Czars and Commissars.

Dual citizenship only works outside of Germany. If you're living somewhere else and get citizenship there, you can keep the German citizenship. But as soon as you get back to Germany, you have to decide which one you want to keep.

I don't think there are any special deals... the German government really considers that to be some sort of historical thing. If your ancestors were German, you can become German, too. Braindead and stupid in my eyes, but then again, I don't need to complain. I left the place in time...I've heard that there was a big fuss about how Americans weren't subject to the same laws as other dual citizens. Regardless, if you were born with both, you usually get to keep both. It's getting another citizenship if you already have the German one that's definitely illegal.

Dang. I just finished reading the thread... I really missed out on some fun there...:(

If the US and China were to annihilate each other and the EU were to stay out of the conflict, as you suggest, it would seem that we would inherit the world. Again. Thus I have no problem with letting you geys get on with your p---- sizing contest. :p

I've heard that there was a big fuss about how Americans weren't subject to the same laws as other dual citizens. Regardless, if you were born with both, you usually get to keep both. It's getting another citizenship if you already have the German one that's definitely illegal.

Well, I plan on getting the Irish citizenship in a few years. As far as I know, having both citizenships isn't a problem, as long as I don't decide to take residence in Germany, in which case I would then have to give one of them up again...

If America wants to be afraid of the Peoples Republic, then let them be afraid. Europe does things in her own way - we are a superpower, just one that needs time to pull themselves back together. We are, in many ways, the biggest player on the field. We have a much lower infant mortality rate than the USA. We have - either as the EU or as the Eurozone, the largest economy on the planet. We are working with China, not against. Our health care system means that our workers are much healthier and far more empowered than American workers.

Europe has been around a hell of a longer time than the USA, and she is in a much better position internationally thanks to careful diplomacy. America is sunk - black and white diplomacy Bush style will finish off the dying American juggernaut. Capitalism will destroy America, because America has corrupted Capitalism.


P.S. China is heading for a revolution.
Good points. I don't understand my own country's policies at all. The US is dismantling itself piece by piece, not least is the fact that China now holds almost 30% of our foreign debt as well as proprietary interest in infrastructures and technologies vital to US security. They don't have to go to war with us. In a very short time, they'll be able practically to shut us down economically. And frankly, if Europe, which also owns a lot of our stuff and our debt, decided to think things over before intervening on our behalf, I, as an American, wouldn't be pissed off at you. It may be the only way to stop the US from starting WW3 on a jingoistic whim. We'll see how the next elections go.

As for China, yeah, I think they will eventually become a free society, but they're not that now, and I wouldn't want them in charge of my fate. So, depending on how the next US elections go, I may be looking at moving to one of my ancestral European countries.

I mean, for christ's sake, 30 HOURS A WEEK? Can you say LAZY?
LAZY!!! I'm in school friggin 35 hrs a week, not counting clubs and sports

I do not know of an EU country where the 30 hour week is the legal maximum. Where did this figure come from? I have a 40 hour week. In France, I believe the legal maximum is 38 hours. These are more realistic numbers.

It's self defense killing a person for spitting at you???
No, I meant it in different scenarios. It's self defense if someone cuts me with a knife. I highly doubt anyone would try cutting me after they get their jaw broken.

LAZY!!! I'm in school friggin 35 hrs a week, not counting clubs and sports
I didn't say anything about school. Dont get your panties in a bunch. And for gods sake, quit pretending school, clubs, and sports are the same thing as having a real job.

No, I meant it in different scenarios. It's self defense if someone cuts me with a knife. I highly doubt anyone would try cutting me after they get their jaw broken.

So breaking somebody's jaw for spitting is what? Here, it would be assault.

I didn't say anything about school. Dont get your panties in a bunch. And for gods sake, quit pretending school, clubs, and sports are the same thing as having a real job.

Funny how you never commented the fact that the French general work hours per week is 35, not 30. And that there is no maximum...

So breaking somebody's jaw for spitting is what? Here, it would be assault.
It's assault here too. But I personally don't care. If someone chooses to disrespect me to that point, they get a broken jaw.

Funny how you never commented the fact that the French general work hours per week is 35, not 30. And that there is no maximum...
Well, frankly I don't care what Frances minumum or maximum is. If you look at their unemployment rate, and their GDP per capita, it would seem that niether do they.


BTW here are the numbers

France Per capita GDP $28,700
Unemployment rate: 10.1% (2004 est.)

USA per capita GDP $40,100
Unemployment rate: 5.5% (2004 est.)

Well, frankly I don't care what Frances minumum or maximum is. If you look at their unemployment rate, and their GDP per capita, it would seem that niether do they.I heartily doubt that the minimum and maximum work hours have that much more of an effect on France's economy than the economic hegemonial position the US held after WW2 still does today...

French work hours have almost nothing to do with current economic problems & massive unemployment. Poor economic management, lack of effective integration policies & a government that lets corporations ass-rape the economy is what's to blame. Incidentially, that's the exact opposite of socialism. Call it the American Way if you want. It's a much more accurate description.

By the way, if I ever spit in your face, and you somehow manage to break my jaw, I'd do a whole lot worse than cut you with a knife. I do not reccomend you practise what you preach, unless you want to spend your life as a cripple/vegetable.

or be concerned that the word "terrorist" might not be politically correct (BBC)?

Rubbish, the BBC have traditionally tried to stay away from the word "terrorist" as they see it as uselessly emotive. And btw, this wasn't a policy that was created just for Muslim terrorists, they refered to organisations such as the IRA as "dissidents" IIRC.

Also, that is not socialism.

Maybe, just maybe, you could stop rioting and start producing?

Because nothing get produced in Europe right?

And rioting is fun, helps passed the time during our extensive holidays since we don't all see it as nessasery to be chained to our desk so we can produce wealth for the big boss man.




I mean, for christ's sake, 30 HOURS A WEEK? Can you say LAZY?

Can you say, there is more to life than working?

And France works more than that.