NationStates Jolt Archive

Washington, 10 oct 05.

Robertson has accused Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez of giving Osama bin Laden $US1.2 million after the September 11 attacks and of trying to obtain nuclear material from Iran.

Mr Robertson caused uproar in August when he called during his televised religious program for the US Government to assassinate Chavez. He later was forced to apologise to the leftist leader.

But the conservative preacher issued a new denunciation of Chavez yesterday, local time, in an interview with CNN.

"The truth is, this man is setting up a Marxist-type dictatorship in Venezuela, he's trying to spread Marxism throughout South America, he's negotiating with the Iranians to get nuclear material and he also sent $US1.2 million in cash to Osama bin Laden right after 9/11," Mr Robertson said.

"I apologised and I said I will be praying for him, but one day we will be staring nuclear weapons and it won't be (Hurricane) Katrina facing New Orleans, it's going to be a Venezuelan nuke," Mr Robertson said.

"So my suggestion was, isn't it a lot cheaper sometimes to deal with these problems before you have to have a big war," he added.

Asked how he had obtained information on Chavez giving money to bin Laden, Robertson said: "Sources that came to me. That's what I was told."

"And I know he sent a warm congratulatory letter to Carlos the Jackal, he's a friend of Muammar Gaddafi," he said. "He's made common cause with these people that are considered terrorists."
______________________________________________
Robertson, IS an American Christian televangelist, entrepreneur, and Christian right political activist. He is the founder of numerous organizations and corporations including: the American Center for Law and Justice, Christian Broadcasting Network (CBN), the Christian Coalition, the Flying Hospital, International Family Entertainment, Operation Blessing International Relief and Development Corporation, and Regent University...He launched a bid to be the Republican party's candidate in the 1988 presidential election. He is a Southern Baptist and was an ordained minister.
© Herald, Weekly Times and other sources.

Hey, he didn't mention North Korea and Saddam in the same line! You gotta have mention them.

Eh, Robertson's struggling with the bad press he earned himself by essentially calling for Chavez's assassination. But he's an asshole and an idiot. He has earned every bit of pain he's gotten so far and more besides.

Pay no attention to him.

Because Marxism and a religious caliphate mix so well...

Hey, he didn't mention North Korea and Saddam in the same line! You gotta have mention them.
....Ghengis Khan, Ronald McDonald, Hitler , Walmart...

:D :D :cool: :D

Asked how he had obtained information on Chavez giving money to bin Laden, Robertson said: "Sources that came to me. That's what I was told."

Uh-huh. Secret informants. Yeah, right. Everyone's going to blindly trust you on that one, Pat. Sure we are. After all, the Tooth Fairy told me just last night that you're a trustworthy kind of guy.

Too bad your friend in the White House is fresh out of political capital, or he could use this as a justification for invading Venezuela.

:rolleyes:

I can't find a link to this news anywhere...can someone provide?

I can't find a link to this news anywhere...can someone provide?http://www.iranmania.com/News/ArticleView/Default.asp?NewsCode=36506&NewsKind=Current%20Affairs

the website name is IranMANIA. :cool:

As a Christian I must wholeheartedly apologise for this man... He is NOT reflective of our religion...

As a Christian I must wholeheartedly apologise for this man... He is NOT reflective of our religion...Most people with-a-brain shall figure that 1 Christian(or a group of Christians) Do not speak for the whole religion.

same thing for all other religions.

If Pat Robertson were to be struck one day by multiple bolts of lightning, would it be bad for me to laugh?

Most people with-a-brain shall figure that 1 Christian(or a group of Christians) Do not speak for the whole religion.

same thing for all other religions.What I mean is...you dont really need to apologize for him.

What you could try to do is...counter his actions... and limit his influence.

If Pat Robertson were to be struck one day by multiple bolts of lightning, would it be bad for me to laugh?

If I ran him over with a steamroller, would it be bad for me to reverse?

Most people with-a-brain shall figure that 1 Christian(or a group of Christians) Do not speak for the whole religion.

same thing for all other religions.
you would be surprised how many don't though. It does seem necessary to say that as a Christian I think he is an idiot. He does not represent us, he makes the world a very very bad place for Christians in general. (and no I don't mean just NS general, but it does suck for us around here sometimes thanks to Pat and people like Fred Phelps)

As a Christian I must wholeheartedly apologise for this man... He is NOT reflective of our religion...

He may not be reflective of your religion but he is certainly reflective of the christian right, the republican party and those who voted the current Bush into the presidency.

is there any complaint mechanism like we have this side of the pond?

if he went onto a European tv station with those allegations and couldnt back them up, he and the station would be heavily fined.

And Robertson's credibility has reached yet new lows.

He really IS disproving my theory that human stupidity has its limits.

He may not be reflective of your religion but he is certainly reflective of the christian right, the republican party and those who voted the current Bush into the presidency.
as a Christian and a Republican he isn't reflective of me, nor is he reflective of the majority of other Christian Republicans that I know, he is the minority, the really really loud, stupid minority. :rolleyes:

is there any complaint mechanism like we have this side of the pond?

if he went onto a European tv station with those allegations and couldnt back them up, he and the station would be heavily fined.

Probably not. But it would be amusing to see Hugo Chavez sue Robertson for libel. Even better yet, Chavez winning the lawsuit.

*Sigh*

Honestly, does anyone take Mr. Robinson seriously anymore?

Did we ever take him seriously?

And Robertson's credibility has reached yet new lows.

He really IS disproving my theory that human stupidity has its limits.

Well first off I agree with you. He always lessens my faith in humanity. Not that there is much left after the failure of communism, the re-election of george Bush and the recent study that shows 1/5 Americans think the sun revolves around the earth(an idea disproved in the 17th century), but he's like icing on the cake.

But secondly, that's a really crappy theory anyways. As Einstein put it - Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the former.

If Pat Robertson were to be struck one day by multiple bolts of lightning, would it be bad for me to laugh?
It would be wrong for you not to laugh.

*snip* the recent study that shows 1/5 Americans think the sun revolves around the earth(an idea disproved in the 17th century), *snip*


:eek:


As Einstein put it - Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the former.

Well, at least my crappy theory gets undone by Einstein. I humbly bow down to his superior genius ;)

Probably not. But it would be amusing to see Hugo Chavez sue Robertson for libel. Even better yet, Chavez winning the lawsuit.

i should clarify, any viewer can object on certain grounds:

racism, sexism etc.

so you could lift the phone and say 'i bleieve roberts to be full of shit and if he cant back it up, he should be fined'. makes the tv stations far more inquisitive of a guests allegations

as a Christian and a Republican he isn't reflective of me, nor is he reflective of the majority of other Christian Republicans that I know, he is the minority, the really really loud, stupid minority. :rolleyes:

Well, I guess I know a different set of Christian Republicans than you do. And I don't make the mistake of thinking they're stupid; delussional, dogmatic zealots maybe..but not stupid.
:rolleyes:

as a Christian and a Republican he isn't reflective of me, nor is he reflective of the majority of other Christian Republicans that I know, he is the minority, the really really loud, stupid minority. :rolleyes:

Well, I guess I know a different set of Christian Republicans than you do. And I don't make the mistake of thinking they're stupid; delussional, ruthless, dogmatic zealots maybe..but not stupid.
:rolleyes:

For a start, Chavez is a socialist, not a Marxist.

Marxism hasn't been seen since the early 20th century.

If he is referring to communism, last time that ideology collided with the (predecessors of) al Quaeda, the Soviet Union invaded Afghanistan and the US backed the Islamic extremists.

So, erm, he's full of shit.

Well, I guess I know a different set of Christian Republicans than you do. And I don't make the mistake of thinking they're stupid; delussional, dogmatic zealots maybe..but not stupid.
:rolleyes:
do you actually know any or do you say you know because of what you see on tv?

Wow, here's hoping Robertson secures the GOP nomination in '08.

Heh.

Just the sorta flipper-waving, drooling imbecile the Democrats apparently need as an opponent in order to win.

That, or an inanimate carbon rod. Though the rod might give them more of a run for their money.

Uh-huh. Secret informants. Yeah, right. Everyone's going to blindly trust you on that one, Pat. Sure we are. After all, the Tooth Fairy told me just last night that you're a trustworthy kind of guy.
:

That's not what Santa told me.

He may not be reflective of your religion but he is certainly reflective of the christian right, the republican party and those who voted the current Bush into the presidency.

Although I am a bit far away from the republican party, I would say that you are over-generalizing there. The majority of the republican party can be divided into three categories:
1) Neo-conservatives: Have no clue what the heck they are talking about, but can always be trusted to give you a catchy tag-line about the latest republican party dealings. Most seem to want to not pay taxes, yet they will ardently defend every administration budget increase. Living in North Carolina I've met my fair share of these, best to give up on them.
2) Evangelicals-Christian Right: Somewhat self-explanatory, affiliated with the republican party because of it's strict biblical interpretation of morality. Many neo-cons also fall into this category.
3) Standard conservative views: Lower taxes, less government, and minding our own business; what the party has been advocating for the last hundred years. Although I disagree on principle with these guys, I respect their opinions and they are generally well-founded. Honestly, it comes down to a choice between individualism and collectivism and these guys chose inidividualism.

Robertson is one of those hovering between #1 and #2; he doesn't have any facts, he thinks we should be an entirely Christian state, and applies this philosophy to politics. It's a dangerous mix, but it keeps John Stuart in his job.

By the way, I think we can all agree that praying for the death of Supreme
Court justices wasn't a very Christian thing to do.

By the way, I think we can all agree that praying for the death of Supreme
Court justices wasn't a very Christian thing to do.How'bout praying for the death of Iraqi insurgents...

would that be the "Christian" thing to do?

Probably not. But it would be amusing to see Hugo Chavez sue Robertson for libel. Even better yet, Chavez winning the lawsuit.You are talking only Civil charges...

But this Christian Rigth Minister belongs in Jail...on Criminal and Terrorism Charges.

How'bout praying for the death of Iraqi insurgents...

would that be the "Christian" thing to do?anyone has a comment?

You are talking only Civil charges...

But this Christian Rigth Minister belongs in Jail...on Criminal and Terrorism Charges.
Roberts hasn't broken any laws as far as I know.

How'bout praying for the death of Iraqi insurgents...

would that be the "Christian" thing to do?
I wouldn't know. I'm not Christian, but I would be if it worked.

I wouldn't know. I'm not Christian...what are you?

what are you?
Church of El Duce. Want a link to it?

Church of El Duce. Want a link to it? :confused: meh...

and I always tough it was Church of Euthanasia.

No I do not need a link...My question is do you (and your kind) pray for the death of other peoples?

Roberts hasn't broken any laws as far as I know.

Maybe not, but he's left himself wide open to a libel suit if Chavez wants to take it up. Let's see how Robertson deals with a court order to pay a 7-8 digit figure for libel.

do you actually know any or do you say you know because of what you see on tv?
Know any christian republicans? Er....I'm almost smack-dab in the middle of Red-State,Biblebelt-have faith--don't question the bible, the Iraq war or GWB U.S.A. !

We might all agree that Pat is a dumb twat but you can guarantee millions in the bible belt are now fearing the mad, evil commie dictator that is Hugo Chavez and they'll be voting republican again :mp5:

Who needs god botherers? They are either kiddie fiddlers, corrupt, or murderous.

Just the sorta flipper-waving, drooling imbecile the Democrats apparently need as an opponent in order to win.

That, or an inanimate carbon rod. Though the rod might give them more of a run for their money.
Lol. That comment struck me as way more funny than it probably should have. I was probably thinking Kerry vs. Rod '08! Basically an even match. Imagine the bumper stickers!!

Who needs god botherers? They are either kiddie fiddlers, corrupt, or murderous.
Lol?

as a Christian and a Republican he isn't reflective of me, nor is he reflective of the majority of other Christian Republicans that I know, he is the minority, the really really loud, stupid minority. :rolleyes:

So I would be correct in assuming you're not part of the group who think that same sex marriage would 'shake the very foundations on which the Chrisitian nation of the United States was founded"? or are you part of the nutty Regan group who still thinks that the United States has some sort of 'divine purpose' in the world as a 'shining city on the hill'?

Don't mind me, I better run off to the toilet to quickly vomit as that sentence just made me queezy.

ps. just a side issue, can the US please change the anthem; the whole idea of an anthem is to rile up the masses and get them patriotic; want to pick up a gun and beat the crap out of something or someone - sorry, the current US anthem results in violent stomach spasms.

How'bout praying for the death of Iraqi insurgents...

would that be the "Christian" thing to do?

That is for those who are christians to decide, but it will not do any good. People only pray when they feel powerless and wish to give themselves an illusion of control.

That is for those who are christians to decide....Only the INACBs(Im not a Christian...but..) have answered my question... I just wish a Christian-Right-Bush-Supporter type of person would answer the call.

Hellooooo.....HellooooOOooOOOoo.......Any ProBush-Christian klansMen out there?

Did somebody know that in the beginning of the jewish mithology their/your God had a wife snake-shaped?

:confused: meh...

and I always tough it was Church of Euthanasia.

No I do not need a link...My question is do you (and your kind) pray for the death of other peoples?
What would be the use? Better to go out and get laid instead. It's more productive.

Only the INACBs(Im not a Christian...but..) have answered my question... I just wish a Christian-Right-Bush-Supporter type of person would answer the call.

Hellooooo.....HellooooOOooOOOoo.......Any ProBush-Christian klansMen out there?

I suspect if your question was more polite that it would actually be considered by people who don't feel like making fun of you.

I didn't vote for Bush, but I am a Christian, and I know of very few Christians that would ever pray for the death of anyone, with the rare exception of the case of mercy. Personally, I don't believe in asking for things in prayer so I would never bother even if I thought wishing for the death of people was appropriate.

Mathew 6 7And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.

I didn't vote for Bush....and who did you vote for?

Know any christian republicans? Er....I'm almost smack-dab in the middle of Red-State,Biblebelt-have faith--don't question the bible, the Iraq war or GWB U.S.A. !
really? where do you live?

and who did you vote for?
Which time? I've voted in four presidential elections, one while I was in boot camp. I voted for Perot, that's right, Perot in 1992. Harry Browne in 1996 and 2000. Michael Badnarik in 2004. I have never voted for a democrat or a repulican in a federal election.

EDIT: What I meant to say was I was gonna vote in the last election but I was busy getting a sandwich. (10 bucks for anyone who gets that joke)

Does anyone really care what Pat Robertson says? It's not like he speaks for all Christians.

I suspect if your question was more polite ....more Polite?
You want me to talk in a more polite way?

and if I dont?... you are going to run-and-complain to the mods again?:D

I post the way I want to post.
Not polite enough for your taste? get over it.

My question is there...For the Christian-Right-Bush-Supporters...If you are one of them...You are free to answer it or not...

more Polite?

and if not you are going to run-andn-complain to the mods again?

I post the way I want to post.
Not polite enough for your taste? get over it.

My question is there...For the Christian-Right-Bush-Supporters...If you are one of them...You are free to answer it or not...

I find it interesting that you believe that every Christian believes what Pat Robertson says, and you believe that every Christian is a Bush supporter.

Hell, not even all Republicans are Bush supporters.

I find it interesting that you believe that every Christian believes what Pat Robertson says, and you believe that every Christian is a Bush supporter.

Hell, not even all Republicans are Bush supporters.dude :gundge:
...

Get a clue!!...Kerry is Christian.

If you are not a Bush Suporter my question is not directed at you...

Being this the Internet...-the true land of the free-...I canNOT stop you from saying stupid things like:

"I am almost a Bush supporter...but I am not really a Bush supporter"

or

"I am against the war in Iraq...kinda of..."

more Polite?
You want me to talk in a more polite way?

and if I dont?... you are going to run-and-complain to the mods again?:D

I post the way I want to post.
Not polite enough for your taste? get over it.

My question is there...For the Christian-Right-Bush-Supporters...If you are one of them...You are free to answer it or not...

I think comparing them to Klanists was what I was referring to. When you use terms like that you're not really asking for a reply, are you? Do you actually think someone is going to say, "hello, I'm a member of the Klan, I voted for Bush, and I pray for the death of all niggers!"? If you would like to foster a discussion rather than stand up on your soapbox and say dumb things then you could try pretending like you actually want to hear the opinions of those that don't agree with you. If you're trying to discourage discussion than carry on as you have.

And I don't complain to the mods because you're impolite. I inform the mods when I think you've violated their rules. Don't get upset simply because they've happened to agree on several occasions.

dude :gundge:
...

Get a clue!!...Kerry is Christian.

If you are not a Bush Suporter my question is not directed at you...

Being this the Internet...-the true land of the free-...you can still post your coments.

Well, I'm a Christian, and in the last election I voted for Bush. Does that make me a Bush supporter, or am I free to disagree with any particular policy?

Pat Robertson does not speak for all Christians, nor is he a "Bush supporter" that Bush would like to be associated with.

He's an idiot who happens to have a bunch of senior citizens who watch his television program. Get a clue. Pat isn't a political figure with any real clout.

So who cares what accusations or stupid things Pat Robertson says?

I think comparing them to Klanists was what I was referring to. When you use terms like that you're not really asking for a reply, are you? Do you actually think someone is going to say, "hello, I'm a member of the Klan, I voted for Bush, and I pray for the death of all niggers!"? If you would like to foster a discussion rather than stand up on your soapbox and say dumb things then you could try pretending like you actually want to hear the opinions of those that don't agree with you. If you're trying to discourage discussion than carry on as you have.

And I don't complain to the mods because you're impolite. I inform the mods when I think you've violated their rules. Don't get upset simply because they've happened to agree on several occasions.

The world is rather black and white for Ocean. He seems to think that you either are a "Bush supporter" or you side with Ocean.

So I would be correct in assuming you're not part of the group who think that same sex marriage would 'shake the very foundations on which the Chrisitian nation of the United States was founded"? or are you part of the nutty Regan group who still thinks that the United States has some sort of 'divine purpose' in the world as a 'shining city on the hill'?

I am not really sure what type of answer you are looking for here.

I think that marriage has pretty much already gone down the tubes, without homosexuals being allowed to marry.

While I do not agree with the homosexual lifestyle, I would support civil unions or marriage (as long as the church doesn't have to accept it) because as American's they deserve the same rights everyone else has.

As far as the nutty Regan group, I am not real sure what you are trying to get at. if you could explain I would try to answer.

I do believe in the separation of church and state, I don't believe in trying to legislate beliefs, and I know that part of living in America and being free is that others are free also, and if I don't want them to mess with my freedom, than it is hypocritical of me to mess with thiers.

that help any?

Well, I'm a Christian, and in the last election I voted for Bush. Does that make me a Bush supporter, or am I free to disagree with any particular policy?

Pat Robertson does not speak for all Christians, nor is he a "Bush supporter" that Bush would like to be associated with.

He's an idiot who happens to have a bunch of senior citizens who watch his television program. Get a clue. Pat isn't a political figure with any real clout.

So who cares what accusations or stupid things Pat Robertson says?

He isn't even a Christian figure. He's a character on a TV show and the only people I've ever actually met that watch him, watch for the same reason people watch Howard Stern. They want to see what ridiculous thing he's going to say or do next.

I am not really sure what type of answer you are looking for here.

I think that marriage has pretty much already gone down the tubes, without homosexuals being allowed to marry.

While I do not agree with the homosexual lifestyle, I would support civil unions or marriage (as long as the church doesn't have to accept it) because as American's they deserve the same rights everyone else has.

As far as the nutty Regan group, I am not real sure what you are trying to get at. if you could explain I would try to answer.

I do believe in the separation of church and state, I don't believe in trying to legislate beliefs, and I know that part of living in America and being free is that others are free also, and if I don't want them to mess with my freedom, than it is hypocritical of me to mess with thiers.

that help any?

*Applauds*

(Except I don't actually believe there is such a thing as a 'homosexual lifestyle')

He isn't even a Christian figure. He's a character on a TV show and the only people I've ever actually met that watch him, watch for the same reason people watch Howard Stern. They want to see what ridiculous thing he's going to say or do next.

Ocean obviously believes that all "Bush supporters" are mindless automatons who all march in lockstep with Pat Robertson.

Here is an example of the kind of person Ocean believes you have to act like in order to not be considered a "Bush supporter"
http://www.indiadaily.com/breaking_news/48293.asp

Well, I'm a Christian, and in the last election I voted for Bush. there you you go...

Finally someone stands up.
(BTW yes all are free to disagree with any particular policy)

so you are...so far...the closest person to "the Christian Right"...

The question was:

Would you pray for the Death of Iraqi insurgents?

Chavez is a legend. I don't see what is Christian about capatilism either. I ain't posted here in ages, but you may remeber me as a radical left winger. I'm also Catholic. I think capatlism is immoral. Chavez was elected democraticly, and is more democratic than the Americans. They are the ones that are on a constant crusade of over throwing people (Chile, Gutemala etc.) and instilling faux democracies, were you choose from a neo conservative, a Bush Banger or a facist, but forget to tell people that they are all the same more or less.

there you you go...

Finally someone stands up.
(BTW yes all are free to disagree with any particular policy)

so you are...so far...the closest person to "the Christian Right"...

The question was:

Would you pray for the Death of Iraqi insurgents?

But I'm not the Christian Right. Nor am I a suitable strawman.

Ask Smunkeeville if a man who regularly invites multiple men over to his house for all of them to have sex with his wife is representative of the Christian Right.

In any case, no, I don't "pray" for anyone's death.

And I give a rat's ass what Pat Robertson says or does. I wonder why you actually care what he says.

But I'm not the Christian Right. Nor am I a suitable strawman..
Gawd Damnit !!!

Will the real Christian-Right please stand up.

I repeat...

Will the real Christian-Right please stand up.
please stand up...

*eminem tune*

Ocean's implication that all Christians are Bush supporters, or mindless slaves to Pat Robertson, or that somehow Christians are the cause of capitalism, or are the source of all bad things, makes about as much sense as me saying that the following is a classic example of Islamic militant behavior:


http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=19798

"20 years ago, this past Saturday (October 8), Leon Klinghoffer -- a helpless 69-year-old in a wheelchair on a cruise ship -- was cruelly murdered for the dual crimes of being a Jew and an American. After hijacking the ship, cowardly Palestinian terrorists assassinated Klinghoffer by gunshot and threw his body overboard, a plot masterminded by Abu Abbas."


Now, I know that most Islamic militants would have cut Klinghoffer's head off with a large knife and shown the video on al-Jazeera, and would have thrown the head overboard, but I'm not the one to stereotype Islamic militants on the basis of Abu Abbas' example.

After all, it's not like every Muslim in the world is a follower of Abu Abbas (and besides, he's dead now).

got to go work...Ill be back.:mp5: :sniper: :mp5:

Gawd Damnit !!!

Will the real Christian-Right please stand up.

I repeat...

Will the real Christian-Right please stand up.
please stand up...

*eminem tune*

Keep looking for that strawman, will ya?

Gawd Damnit !!!

Will the real Christian-Right please stand up.

I repeat...

Will the real Christian-Right please stand up.
please stand up...

*eminem tune*
okay I give up. I think you are looking for someone like me.
No, it is not okay to pray for someone's death, no it is not Christian, no I don't know of any Christians who regularly pray for that kind of thing either.

The people you see on TV don't represent the Christian-Right anymore than the all the nutjobs I see on TV represent the left.

I mean think about it really, it doesn't make much sense that they really would does it?

okay I give up. I think you are looking for someone like me.
No, it is not okay to pray for someone's death, no it is not Christian, no I don't know of any Christians who regularly pray for that kind of thing either. someone finally did stand up...

good...
...even if I kinda wonder why he wrote "regularly"

someone finally did stand up...

good...
...even if I kinda wonder why he wrote "regularly"

I'd give you a link to our blog, Ocean, but it would be a violation of NS General rules to do so.

But I'm not the Christian Right. Nor am I a suitable strawman.

Ask Smunkeeville if a man who regularly invites multiple men over to his house for all of them to have sex with his wife is representative of the Christian Right.WTF ??? :confused:

You very well know I am NOT going to ask that.

I'd give you a link to our blog, Ocean, but it would be a violation of NS General rules to do so.Dont worry....You will find a way to deliver...

Jesus Works in Mysterious Ways ;)

someone finally did stand up...

good...
...even if I kinda wonder why he wrote "regularly"
okay I am a female, just for FYI I know I my spelling isn't very feminine. ;)

I was under the impression that earlier you had stated that people were "regularly praying for the death of others" is why I put that but I could be mistaken (I have been before )

Dont worry....You will find a way to deliver...

Jesus Works in Mysterious Ways ;)

For all I know, Ocean, you're not old enough to look at our blog.

I think people like to link psychos like Pat Robertson to the right like people like to link nutjobs like Cindy Sheehan to the left. They like to set up the strawman that these people represent the general public and then point out their most asinine points so they can knock them down. Do you know why it's called the 700 club? Because that's how many people in the entire US agree with Pat Robertson. And that's almost how many people agree with Sheehan once she started complaining about the occupied city of New Orleans. There are nutjobs on both sides and they are not representative, so attacking them says nothing about either side. How about talking about issues that anyone, ANYONE actually supports.

Actually, if I was a member of the radical right I would pretend to be a member of the other side get a whole bunch of support and then act like a complete loon just so the right would have something to shoot at. In fact, I think that's what CS is doing. She's a puppet of Pat Robertson just trying to take some of the heat off him.

Actually, if I was a member of the radical right I would pretend to be a member of the other side get a whole bunch of support and then act like a complete loon just so the right would have something to shoot at. In fact, I think that's what CS is doing. She's a puppet of Pat Robertson just trying to take some of the heat off him.Cindy Sheehan a puppet of Pat Robertson???
:D :headbang: :D :D

You are kidding ...rite?

Cindy Sheehan a puppet of Pat Robertson???
:D :headbang: :D :D

You are kidding ...rite?

What better way to discredit the the left then to get them to back a lunatic like Sheehan?

What better way to discredit the the left then to get them to back a lunatic like Sheehan?

Ok...so you are not kidding...

:(

I think everyone knows Robertson's full of shit. Alright. Chavez is not sending money to Al-Qaeda. And it's doubtful he's working on a nuke.

Where Chavez concerns me is elsewhere, most notably his demagougery. He is constantly dithering on about how the US is planning to invade Venezuela, perhaps one of the most fucked up charges ever. Anybody ought to be able to see that it isn't the case. But, unfortuneately many Venezuelans believe him.

You've got to prepare, the President says so, he's telling the truth. If the President says something, then it's true. -Jose Gutierrez, 42

Now, besides the sheer bizarre attitude and logic you get from this quote, the fact that people believe him that the US is going to invade is disturbing. The article cites reports in the Venezuelan press that American warships are off the coast preparing for a pre-invasion bombardment. WTF?

Beyond this, you've gotta love what Venezuelan state television is doing. They're broadcasting video of American officials, and playing the Imperial March from Star Wars. If that isn't agitprop, I don't know what is. I love state run media.

But yeah, I don't like Robertson, I don't like Chavez. They are both fucking nuts.

Beyond this, you've gotta love what Venezuelan state television is doing. They're broadcasting video of American officials, and playing the Imperial March from Star Wars. If that isn't agitprop, I don't know what is. I love state run media.

LOL!

Lets go smoke 'em out!

:D

They're broadcasting video of American officials, and playing the Imperial March from Star Wars. Darth Vader: Lets go smoke 'em out!
:DHAHAHAHAHAHA...awww

Good one...

I am not really sure what type of answer you are looking for here.

I think that marriage has pretty much already gone down the tubes, without homosexuals being allowed to marry.

With that being said, maybe someone in the religious right can actually tell us why marriage is falling to pieces, instead of using homosexuals as scape goats for all their failed teachings of "wives must be submissive" and "man knows best" etc. etc.

While I do not agree with the homosexual lifestyle, I would support civil unions or marriage (as long as the church doesn't have to accept it) because as American's they deserve the same rights everyone else has.

Pray tell, what is the 'homosexual lifestyle'? anything like the heterosexual lifestyle? when did you choose to be part of the heterosexual lifestyle? who recruited you? didn't you mum give you enough attention, hence the avoidance of female company anything beyond f*cking and procreating?

As far as the nutty Regan group, I am not real sure what you are trying to get at. if you could explain I would try to answer.

Look up Strassian teachings, which form the basis of the neo-conservative agenda of using religion and the lie that the United States is a unique nation and that it has some sort of destiny.

The same sort of crap that the Soviet leaders used to force feed to their populace about the Soviet Union being a beacon to all the workers around the world and how they can incite a global revolution to throw off the shackles of oppression in favour of a world soviet of the worker.

Creepy, yes and frighteningly similar to the rantings of the neoconservatives in the whitehouse at this current moment in time.

I do believe in the separation of church and state, I don't believe in trying to legislate beliefs, and I know that part of living in America and being free is that others are free also, and if I don't want them to mess with my freedom, than it is hypocritical of me to mess with thiers. that help any?

True; but at the same time neither side really respects that; whilst the Republicans seem to be hell bent on using Christian dogma to further their cause, the left is no better, with their neo-trosky like ideology of state intevention at every possible moment to ensure that people are doing the right thing, according to what a group of politicians think.

I don't know about you, but both parties wreek of social engineering equalling that of the Soviet Union and North Korea combined.

With that being said, maybe someone in the religious right can actually tell us why marriage is falling to pieces, instead of using homosexuals as scape goats for all their failed teachings of "wives must be submissive" and "man knows best" etc. etc.
people don't take marriage seriously anymore. The teaching of wives submiting to husbands have only failed because wives are not submiting and husbands are not living up to thier end of the bargain either.
I submit to my husband, he doesn't rule over me, he is the leader of the family, but he leads with wisdom and love.
Too many people these days don't take marriage for what it really is and that is two people becoming one person. They look at it more like a "joint venture" and when "business" is down, they look elsewhere for a "better investment"
Pray tell, what is the 'homosexual lifestyle'? anything like the heterosexual lifestyle? when did you choose to be part of the heterosexual lifestyle? who recruited you? didn't you mum give you enough attention, hence the avoidance of female company anything beyond f*cking and procreating?
I probably used the wrong words. How should I refer to homosexuals?
I am not going to go into what I think "causes" homosexuality, because my veiws are very complicated, and in the end, I would upset people on both sides of the debate, and the truth is it doesn't really matter what I think about it anyway.
I will always speak up against people who spread hate, homosexuals are people, they deserve the same rights as everyone else, whether you like them or not, they deserve to be treated with respect, just like anyone else.

Look up Strassian teachings, which form the basis of the neo-conservative agenda of using religion and the lie that the United States is a unique nation and that it has some sort of destiny.

The same sort of crap that the Soviet leaders used to force feed to their populace about the Soviet Union being a beacon to all the workers around the world and how they can incite a global revolution to throw off the shackles of oppression in favour of a world soviet of the worker.
That is an interesting jump you made there.
Okay, does the US have some sort of divine purpose? I am not sure. I will pray about it and get back to you.


True; but at the same time neither side really respects that; whilst the Republicans seem to be hell bent on using Christian dogma to further their cause, the left is no better, with their neo-trosky like ideology of state intevention at every possible moment to ensure that people are doing the right thing, according to what a group of politicians think.

I don't know about you, but both parties wreek of social engineering equalling that of the Soviet Union and North Korea combined.

I can agree that both sides have problems. They are almost always on the outer fringes of the rest of the group. (far left, far right)
There are many many people that are hanging out around the middle though, that don't deserve to be lumped in with all the extremists.
I am a Christian. I am not a Republican because I am a Christian. I just really really don't like "big government" and that has nothing to do with my religion.

....think that same sex marriage would 'shake the very foundations on which .....#1) Usually i try to ignore HiJacks of my threads...

#2) Unlike others from the Christian-Right ...Smunkeeville did stand up to answer the call...

#3) Sierra & Co....This Thread is fundamentally about politics...not about all Christian ism...(I usually stay away from Heavy Religion threads...or same sex marriage issues)


BOTTOM LINE:
"Same Sex Marriage" is a powerful Issue...It deserves its own Thread.

#1) Usually i try to ignore HiJacks of my threads...

#2) Unlike others from the Christian-Right ...Smunkeeville did stand up to answer the call...

#3) Sierra & Co....This Thread is fundamentally about politics...not about all Christian ism...(I usually stay away from Heavy Religion threads...or same sex marriage issues)


BOTTOM LINE:
"Same Sex Marriage" is a powerful Issue...It deserves its own Thread.

I am a Christian. I am not a Republican because I am a Christian. I just really really don't like "big government" and that has nothing to do with my religion.

....and that has nothing to do with my religion.It does NOT have to....

people don't take marriage seriously anymore. The teaching of wives submiting to husbands have only failed because wives are not submiting and husbands are not living up to thier end of the bargain either.
I submit to my husband, he doesn't rule over me, he is the leader of the family, but he leads with wisdom and love.
Too many people these days don't take marriage for what it really is and that is two people becoming one person. They look at it more like a "joint venture" and when "business" is down, they look elsewhere for a "better investment"

I would disagree about the submission; my parents have a equal relationship; when a decision is made, they come to a compromise; there isn't a "well, I make the decision, and bugger you if you don't like it".

Yes, my father earns the largest side of the money, but at the same time he also realises that the world doesn't just revolve around him - there is another person involve in the decision making as the decision he makes affect more than just him.

Marriages fail because BOTH sides fail to live up to the purpose of marriage; if they're thinking of themselves FIRST when they make a decision; that marriage will instantly fail. The FIRST person they should ALWAYS think about is the other person; when ever the make a decision, they should think BEFORE how that decision could afffect the other person in the relationship both positive AND negative.

I probably used the wrong words. How should I refer to homosexuals?
I am not going to go into what I think "causes" homosexuality, because my veiws are very complicated, and in the end, I would upset people on both sides of the debate, and the truth is it doesn't really matter what I think about it anyway.
I will always speak up against people who spread hate, homosexuals are people, they deserve the same rights as everyone else, whether you like them or not, they deserve to be treated with respect, just like anyone else.


For me, as a gay male, I don't care what, who or how I was made gay; for my friends, they don't care either; I'm Matt first, and somewhere down the list is my homosexuality - yes, it is a dimension of my life, just as a heterosexual has heterosexuality as part of his or her life, but at the same time, it isn't the dominating, overwhelming force that makes decisions in my life.


That is an interesting jump you made there.
Okay, does the US have some sort of divine purpose? I am not sure. I will pray about it and get back to you.

No nations have special purposes; I'm from NZ, we have 65million sheep, we sell alot of dairy goods - nothing special; lord knows why people get all wrapped up in their nationality and country when they have little choice over where they were born.

I can agree that both sides have problems. They are almost always on the outer fringes of the rest of the group. (far left, far right)
There are many many people that are hanging out around the middle though, that don't deserve to be lumped in with all the extremists.
I am a Christian. I am not a Republican because I am a Christian. I just really really don't like "big government" and that has nothing to do with my religion.

Too bad they didn't have the back bone and head down to the voting booth and made their voice heard; even if they voted for a third party; if a decent amount turned out, it would have atleast sent a message to both sides that the middle are unhappy with both parties.

I would disagree about the submission; my parents have a equal relationship; when a decision is made, they come to a compromise; there isn't a "well, I make the decision, and bugger you if you don't like it".

Yes, my father earns the largest side of the money, but at the same time he also realises that the world doesn't just revolve around him - there is another person involve in the decision making as the decision he makes affect more than just him.


I think you misunderstand what I mean by submiting to my husband. My opinion in descisions is just as valid as his, in the end I submit to what he decides though. He doesn't ever 'just think of himself', as the leader of the family, it is his responsibility to think about what would be best for the family as a whole, most of the time that means compromise. It would adversely affect the family if I was resenting him, and even worse if I was just really mad, therefore he figures out what is best for the family, not just what is best for him. He knows that I will always submit to him, but he doesn't abuse his position.

I think you misunderstand what I mean by submiting to my husband. My opinion in descisions is just as valid as his, in the end I submit to what he decides though. He doesn't ever 'just think of himself', as the leader of the family, it is his responsibility to think about what would be best for the family as a whole, most of the time that means compromise. It would adversely affect the family if I was resenting him, and even worse if I was just really mad, therefore he figures out what is best for the family, not just what is best for him. He knows that I will always submit to him, but he doesn't abuse his position.

Then again, if you were to come up with an idea, and wish to run it past your husband, just as he runs an idea past you, then you could say that your relationship is one of a equal partnership, not one of someone being dominant and another being submissive.

I think the biggest thing you did raise was the importance of communication with in a relationship, which is where I think relationships fall down today; people thinking that they're the only ones affected in the relationship when they should realise that a relationship is about two people, not just one; it isn't about one aways caving into another, be in the man caving into the wife, or vicea versa.

Then again, its part of the bigger issue of people being alot more headonistic and selfish in this day and age of materialistic aspirations - its like I heard one person say, "well, why should you care whether I have unprotected sex; I'm the only one risking contracting aids/HIV" - thats the kinda of logic that causes societies problems; peoples actions don't occur in some sort of vacuum; that individual may contract HIV/AIDS, and sure, they'll have to suffer, but what about the friends, family and the lover they could have infected - all it seems to me is that there is alot of people out there who think that if it only directly affects them, the bugger the people indirectly affected by those decisions.

Then again, if you were to come up with an idea, and wish to run it past your husband, just as he runs an idea past you, then you could say that your relationship is one of a equal partnership, not one of someone being dominant and another being submissive.
I can run ideas past him, and he can submit solutions for problems to me, he doesn't choose everything I do or anything, I am free to do what I want, I submit to him out of love, and am not even "required" to. I can do whatever I want, I am an adult, I choose to submit to his judgement because that is what is best for my marriage. (we are on the same page on like 99.9% of issues anyway so it really isn't a huge deal)

I can run ideas past him, and he can submit solutions for problems to me, he doesn't choose everything I do or anything, I am free to do what I want, I submit to him out of love, and am not even "required" to. I can do whatever I want, I am an adult, I choose to submit to his judgement because that is what is best for my marriage. (we are on the same page on like 99.9% of issues anyway so it really isn't a huge deal)

True, but then again, it kinda creeps me out, the whole 'submission term' which seems to have a nasty negative conotation over it; I'd prefer to call it 'mutual agreement" :D