NationStates Jolt Archive

ok so we all know Britain is a voilent place overun with binge drinking... but not all violence and anti social behaviour is down to drink, so do you think drink should be banned, or do you reckon we should just shoot whoever is the problem creators, e.g. NEDS/CHAVS. MOSHER'S, GOTH'S... who do you think is to blame, and why?

(Having chosen other)

I blame carrots!

The newspapers.

Y'see, it's not any worse than it ever has been. But that don't sell, does it?

Also, the government.

If we're not in fear of our lives, we don't need the government's puppets to look after us. We don't need ever-increasing draconian legislation. But that doesn't keep us in our place, does it?

It is the fault of society becoming polarised and crude through over-simplification (in the Media, in schools, in popular culture - mainstream popular culture, as I don't think teenage groups reflect something that would be cut-off and necessarily violent).

popular/youth culture is to blame

I blame the Bars and clubs for the drinking problem. They have there prices ridiculously low...and have way too many happy hours. This all leads to people getting very drunk, very fast...thus leading to anti-social behaviour on the city and town streets come to the time of closing. Whats worse is that many young people see this as acceptable and began to immitate their peers.

I blame Democracy!
We wouldnt have this problem if Hitler had one!

Bloody sicko Liberal Chavist Parlimentarain Puritant Salami

How about Nannystate-ism that rewards and encourages criminal behavior by prosecuting people trying to defend themselves or their property.

Teh 'lizard people'.

I directly blame chavs/neds/ abominations, however, they aremerly endemic of the inherent flaws in liberalism, political corerectness and relativism, and we accordingly ought to revert to traditional, consrvative politics, and get Thatcher out of retirement, to serve as an intermittent minister until we ressurect Churchill or Wellington.

I directly blame chavs/neds/ abominations, however, they aremerly endemic of the inherent flaws in liberalism, political corerectness and relativism, and we accordingly ought to revert to traditional, consrvative politics, and get Thatcher out of retirement, to serve as an intermittent minister until we ressurect Churchill or Wellington.
completely the opposite: they are the result of thatcher's & the conservative's cutting back of public education spending in the 80s and early 90's.

Well I really chose chavs because they're generally pants, but the main problem is COMMUNISTS. THEY'RE UNDER YOUR BED.

completely the opposite: they are the result of thatcher's & the conservative's cutting back of public education spending in the 80s and early 90's.

Not in the slightest, most chavs are youths,and educated in Labour funded and administered secondary schools. Moreover, did the conservatives implement political correctness, no. Did Thatcher concede to the miners, no. Accept it Labour boy, Tony Blair, and Blair alone, is responsible for modern culture, he has had 8 years to alter, influence and rectify it, he has not. He has advocated, accepted and welcomed "modern, multicultural society", and it is upon him that culpability is apportioned.

Not in the slightest, most chavs are youths,and educated in Labour funded and administered secondary schools. Moreover, did the conservatives implement political correctness, no. Did Thatcher concede to the miners, no. Accept it Labour boy, Tony Blair, and Blair alone, is responsible for modern culture, he has had 8 years to alter, influence and rectify it, he has not. He has advocated, accepted and welcomed "modern, multicultural society", and it is upon him that culpability is apportioned.

Well, Tory boy, perhaps you can explain why the 14 preceding years "strong hand and discipline" have melted like snow off a dyke? Either Thatcher was the savious (Saints preserve us) or she wasn't. You can't have it both ways. Consumerism has resulted in children who will stab each other for a phone or pair of Reeboks. That's your marvelous Mrs T, that is.

Blessed Chris, you must be too young to remember Thatcher :D

She was awful, awful, awful. A total disaster.

Well, Tory boy, perhaps you can explain why the 14 preceding years "strong hand and discipline" have melted like snow off a dyke? Either Thatcher was the savious (Saints preserve us) or she wasn't. You can't have it both ways. Consumerism has resulted in children who will stab each other for a phone or pair of Reeboks. That's your marvelous Mrs T, that is.

She advocated capitalism, and furthermore, Labour's reforms in education were immense, since in questing for the "auream mediocram", universal mediocrity, he has negated all possibility of those who lack intellect, generally chavs, being reprimanded, since they are compelled to achieve only what the SATs dictate, not what excellence necessitates.

I like thatcher she cured the britain economy and got many people in jobs

I like thatcher she cured the britain economy and got many people in jobs

http://www.tutor2u.net/economics/content/diagrams/unemployment1.gif

Uh-huh.

http://www.tutor2u.net/economics/content/diagrams/unemployment1.gif

Uh-huh.

people who matter :p

Well, Tory boy, perhaps you can explain why the 14 preceding years "strong hand and discipline" have melted like snow off a dyke?

...or possibly 'off a dike', unless you are referring to Clause/Section 28.

ok so we all know Britain is a voilent place overun with binge drinking... but not all violence and anti social behaviour is down to drink, so do you think drink should be banned, or do you reckon we should just shoot whoever is the problem creators, e.g. NEDS/CHAVS. MOSHER'S, GOTH'S... who do you think is to blame, and why?

I'll not post the intial reaction to this posting, because I will probably, at best, get an official warning, so here is the more reasoned reply.

Firstly I would like to see what proof you have to back up your statement that Britain is a voilent place overun with binge drinking
Because as far as I am concerned that is a load of claptrap.

Secondly, there is no-one to blame for anything that happens in this country good or bad, other than OURSELVES!

We are the ones who cause the problems we are the ones who go off getting so out of our heads that we can't even walk home and we are the ones who behave so badly that it effects us.
Equally, we are the ones who put an end to the problems and the ones who stop anti-social behaviour.

Yes, the goverment, the schools, our parents, our employers, all have their parts to play in this, often there is little that we can say or do to stop some of the things that affect our lives, but there is a hell of a lot that can be done.

I am really REALLY sick of everyone blaming everyone else and turning round and saying it's not me and it's someone elses fault.
The day that we all start taking responcibility for our own actions will be the day things will change.

I like thatcher she cured the britain economy and got many people in jobs

Well the figures have spoken, so not much to say on that one is there?
I remeber the days well........full employment for all.....the miners relocated by bikes provided by dear Mr Tebit, who pedalled their way to those wonderful pasture new along with the ship yard workers, the gas workers, steal workers, civil servants......yes I remember her 'golden' era so well........

And of course there was no racism, no Broadwater farm or Brixton riots..... everyone loved each other, the Police were fantastic towards everyone, (they used to hand out chocolates you know?) .......oh yes....the 'golden days'.........

http://www.tutor2u.net/economics/content/diagrams/unemployment1.gif

Uh-huh.

You do realize that the dip in the middle is the GOOD part, right?

"If you make it criminal to have guns,
then only criminals will have guns."

Your cops don't even carry, and you wonder why you have crime?

"If you make it criminal to have guns,
then only criminals will have guns."

Your cops don't even carry, and you wonder why you have crime?

I assume that you are American?

Your cops do carry guns, I wonder why you still have crime?

"If you make it criminal to have guns,
then only criminals will have guns."

Your cops don't even carry, and you wonder why you have crime?

The crime rate is still less than that in the USA, try again :)

Not in the slightest, most chavs are youths,and educated in Labour funded and administered secondary schools. Moreover, did the conservatives implement political correctness, no. Did Thatcher concede to the miners, no. Accept it Labour boy, Tony Blair, and Blair alone, is responsible for modern culture, he has had 8 years to alter, influence and rectify it, he has not. He has advocated, accepted and welcomed "modern, multicultural society", and it is upon him that culpability is apportioned.
where do children learn most of their behaviour and view of the world from? their parents.

their parents, generally speaking, were "generation x"

...who were educated in the public-funding starved schools of the thatcherite era, also in the 'me first' culture. the chavs' parents have since passed this view - enhanced by half a lifetime of problems resulting from their shitty education - and lack of respect for others and education itself onto their children, thus creating the problem geneation we see today.


and please don't tell me "multicultural society" is bad :rolleyes:

I'm suprised none of my esteemed colleges have hit on the truth yet.

It is obvious to everyone with half a brain that this is all George W. Bush's fault. Now don't all agree at once - I have proof. You see, Bush has been undermining Britain from the beginning. He got you to tag along to Iraq, and a bloodly mess that whole thing is. Which most likely led to the London bombings, another bloody mess. It's obvious that he forsaw all of that and exactingly plotted to have it happen to your fair island.

Now if he could do something like that, what is to say he isn't behind Chavism, drunkeness, and the whole lot of Britain's problems? He's been using the CIA to import 'gansta' culture to the UK, and he's deliberately made American beer so bad that you have to drown out the taste of it with so much of your fabulous brew that you get drunk. You see, it's all beginning to come together now.

It's not like he doesn't have a motive. He's 12,000th or so in line for the British throne. His devious plan is to have Britain descend into such anarchy and lawlessness that all those 12,000 will be killed, and he can assume the throne as King George the... oh hell I don't know how many George's you've had... whatever. King George.

And that is why behaviour in Britain is so bad. I trust you all realize the truth and the urgent need to vote Democratic in '08. Thank you for your time. :p

The crime rate is still less than that in the USA, try again :)

Not according to the UN..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/

England has worst crime rate in world
By David Bamber, Home Affairs Correspondent

England and Wales have the highest crime rate among the world's leading economies, according to a new report by the United Nations.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1786945,00.html


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/content_objectid=13175111_method=full_siteid=50143_headline=-UK-VIOLENT-CRIME-RATE-SOARING-name_page.html

And firearm offenses have increased:

http://www.murderuk.com/misc/stats.htm

Try again.

where do children learn most of their behaviour and view of the world from? their parents.

their parents, generally speaking, were "generation x"

...who were educated in the public-funding starved schools of the thatcherite era, also in the 'me first' culture. the chavs' parents have since passed this view - enhanced by half a lifetime of problems resulting from their shitty education - and lack of respect for others and education itself onto their children, thus creating the problem geneation we see today.


and please don't tell me "multicultural society" is bad :rolleyes:

Yep, it started in thatcherism. Odd how all of Britain's problems are pinned on her...

But I. Hate. Chavs. With a passion. We should solve the energy crisis by killing them all and using the bodies to rot and make methane. Simple.

The crime rate is still less than that in the USA, try again :)

But you still have crime.

Your armed police are not so effective after all.

Ever try Social Welfare?


Thatcher is to blame for today's Britain. She introduced the 'No such thing as society' where it encouraged people to become cutthroat, and be a 'I'm alright Jack', people f*****g each other over for their own selfish ends, people not giving a f*** about each other.

That introduced Thatcher's Children, the Yuppies...what you have now is Thatcher's Grandchildren, the children of Thatcher's Children.

Blair is The Son Of Thatcher in Political terms, Thatcher herself said her proudest achievement was Blair.

Thatcher destroyed Britain, destroyed the coal mines, the industry, selling it off to her corporate pals.

She even tried to get homeless people sterilised.

The wost thing to hit Britain since the Luftwaffe. The worst person to rule Britain since Cromwell or Henry 8th or any other nutter.

Seeing a similar thinking woman gain power in Germany, one can only say, 'God Help Germany.'

You do realize that the dip in the middle is the GOOD part, right?
which is both after thatcher's time (she went out in 1990 i believe) and was also nothing more than the politically-engineered economic boom to grab more votes in the 1992 election, akin to the tories usual self-serving 'boom & bust' economic idoicy
thank god chancellor brown handed over control of interest rates to the MPC

You do realize that the dip in the middle is the GOOD part, right?

Margaret Thatcher was Primeminister from 1979 to 1990.
Unemployment figures decreased in the latter years of her time in power, because the new system of benefits that was introduced, the way in which the statistics for school leavers were collected and how long term unemployed were viewed.

This lead to a complete and utter statistical farce which made it look like umeployment was finally under control.
Fortunately it didn't really fool those at the "grass roots".

When the Labour party came in, they stripped away all the different 'titles' that had been given to the unemployed so that they could see the real problem, that and ongoing problems dragged along from the Conservative time in power caused the seemingly huge increase in unemployment again.

As you can see, from 1993 onwards, unemployment has made a very slow and steady decline.

You do realize that the dip in the middle is the GOOD part, right?

Yes, which just so happened to coincide with Thatcher leaving office. However, the dip in the middle is still higher than when she came to power. Similarly, the largest peak on the chart was whilst she was in power. The second highest point on the chart was also reached whilst the Tories were in power...

Not according to the UN..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/

England has worst crime rate in world
By David Bamber, Home Affairs Correspondent

England and Wales have the highest crime rate among the world's leading economies, according to a new report by the United Nations.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1786945,00.html


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/content_objectid=13175111_method=full_siteid=50143_headline=-UK-VIOLENT-CRIME-RATE-SOARING-name_page.html

And firearm offenses have increased:

http://www.murderuk.com/misc/stats.htm

Try again.

At least read your own sources. In fact England and Wales are second after Scotland. In a telephone poll fercrissakes. :p

And as for the firearms rate increasing, do you have any figures on coutries where gun crime is decreasing, regardless of the stance on legalisation or otherwise of gun culture?

ok so we all know Britain is a voilent place overun with binge drinking... but not all violence and anti social behaviour is down to drink, so do you think drink should be banned, or do you reckon we should just shoot whoever is the problem creators, e.g. NEDS/CHAVS. MOSHER'S, GOTH'S... who do you think is to blame, and why?

Seems to me Britain is a place full of people who can't spell and can't form a proper sentence.

I'm not aware that Britain is a violent place overrun with binge drinking. The media might want you to believe that, but the reality is quite different.

Your cops don't even carry, and you wonder why you have crime?

Hey, our cops carry guns as a matter of course here in Northern Ireland, and we still have crime. Seems to me like we can draw no correlation between armed police and crime rates.

Yep, it started in thatcherism. Odd how all of Britain's problems are pinned on her...
she reformed the country beyond all recognition. whether or not you think that was a bad thing depends on how well - or badly - you personally did from those changes. like how many refer to 'black wednesday' as 'gold-' or 'white-wednesday'...
with 11 million unemployed, and a rise in the rich-poor divide, its not suprising that many, many people think she was evil; while those relative few who did well under her rule, love her.

:) ...or possibly 'off a dike', unless you are referring to Clause/Section 28.

You can use either spelling, but nice gag anyway......

Margaret Thatcher was Primeminister from 1979 to 1990.
Unemployment figures decreased in the latter years of her time in power, because the new system of benefits that was introduced, the way in which the statistics for school leavers were collected and how long term unemployed were viewed.

This lead to a complete and utter statistical farce which made it look like umeployment was finally under control.
Fortunately it didn't really fool those at the "grass roots".

thatcher and the tories changed the statistical definition of 'unemployment' no less than 63 times in their term(s) of office

At least read your own sources. In fact England and Wales are second after Scotland. In a telephone poll fercrissakes. :p ?

Ok, how about these:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/07/07/ncrime07.xml

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1734202,00.html

While the murder rate for young men has almost doubled since 1981, that for women has fallen by more than 10% because of a sharp decline in the numbers being killed by their husbands or partners

And as for the firearms rate increasing, do you have any figures on coutries where gun crime is decreasing, regardless of the stance on legalisation or otherwise of gun culture?

Sure, the US is one.

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/ucr.htm#cius

I'm finding it hilarious that PM is being called a Labour Boy when he hates Blair. Though in comparison to the she-devil herself, Thatcher, Blair does look like a saviour from God. (Actually, he's only minutely better because he's no more than a torie himself and actually the poor-rich divide has become bigger under him- yay "new labour").Thatcher utterly screwed up this country in so many ways: the police, education, welfare, council housing... she did it all wrong and we're still suffering the repercussions.

Back to the point, I think it's people like YOU, Cheese penguins, who create the violence in this country by saying the answer to problems is to shoot huge groups of people based on a ridiculous stereotype.

I also think binge-drinking and teen cultures of violence are really overhyped in the media. They are problems but nowhere near as big as they're made out to be.

Ok, how about these:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/07/07/ncrime07.xml

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1734202,00.html

While the murder rate for young men has almost doubled since 1981, that for women has fallen by more than 10% because of a sharp decline in the numbers being killed by their husbands or partners



Sure, the US is one.

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/ucr.htm#cius

Well, it might be but that link simply shows that violent crime is down, not necessarily gun related crime.

The UK may be bad, but it is not as bad as the US, yet. I'm surprised that anybody from the US would quote the UN. The "bogeyman of the new world order" aren't they?? ;) . The Mirror is hardly the definitive source for social commentary is it ?? It is a sensationalist red top. As our Police are so fond of saying it is the way crime is recorded that has changed. ;) Blairs policies are not really helping either.. he is a reactionary politician. The majority of the British public are not stupid, but they are turning their own frustrations against themselves, becoming more self destructive. You could say that this low level civil disobediance will lead to true violence on the streets and rioting. I have no doubt that it will again. It is just a question of time, or giving the people a common enemy.. now thats an idea! Dubya's social glue! :sniper:

The global capitalist system is always to blame.

Well, it might be but that link simply shows that violent crime is down, not necessarily gun related crime.

IF you dig into it, it goes into more details. I wasn't making a point specifically about firearms though, just that stupid gov't attempts to "curb crime" ussually don't work.

Not according to the UN..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/

England has worst crime rate in world
By David Bamber, Home Affairs Correspondent

England and Wales have the highest crime rate among the world's leading economies, according to a new report by the United Nations.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-1786945,00.html


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/allnews/content_objectid=13175111_method=full_siteid=50143_headline=-UK-VIOLENT-CRIME-RATE-SOARING-name_page.html

And firearm offenses have increased:

http://www.murderuk.com/misc/stats.htm

Try again.


The UN report is flawed and has been widely discredit. The last two are very much relative (y>x =/ y>z) and I can't get on your first one.

But you still have crime.

Your armed police are not so effective after all.

Ever try Social Welfare?


Thatcher is to blame for today's Britain. She introduced the 'No such thing as society' where it encouraged people to become cutthroat, and be a 'I'm alright Jack', people f*****g each other over for their own selfish ends, people not giving a f*** about each other.

That introduced Thatcher's Children, the Yuppies...what you have now is Thatcher's Grandchildren, the children of Thatcher's Children.

Blair is The Son Of Thatcher in Political terms, Thatcher herself said her proudest achievement was Blair.

Thatcher destroyed Britain, destroyed the coal mines, the industry, selling it off to her corporate pals.

She even tried to get homeless people sterilised.

The wost thing to hit Britain since the Luftwaffe. The worst person to rule Britain since Cromwell or Henry 8th or any other nutter.

Seeing a similar thinking woman gain power in Germany, one can only say, 'God Help Germany.'


Umm, obviously you weren't following my line of argument :confused: We don't have armed police here in the UK, I assume you've got confused somewhere.

IF you dig into it, it goes into more details. I wasn't making a point specifically about firearms though, just that stupid gov't attempts to "curb crime" ussually don't work.

It doesn't change the fact that despite jailing 3 times as many people per capita in the US than the UK, the murder rate per capita is still 3 times higher in the US than the UK.

It doesn't change the fact that despite jailing 3 times as many people per capita in the US than the UK, the murder rate per capita is still 3 times higher in the US than the UK.

Now go back and read what I wrote. I said Gov't, not UK or US.

Seems to me Britain is a place full of people who can't spell and can't form a proper sentence.

I'm not aware that Britain is a violent place overrun with binge drinking. The media might want you to believe that, but the reality is quite different.

Well, it depends where you are.

I've been assaulted twice, for no reason at all, by someone I don't even know.

Now go back and read what I wrote. I said Gov't, not UK or US.

I know :) I was just pointing out another stupid government method of reducing crime that doesn't work.

Does anyone think that we have less crime and violence than in the supposedly civilized Victorian times?

Umm, obviously you weren't following my line of argument :confused: We don't have armed police here in the UK, I assume you've got confused somewhere.

Not all our police are routinely armed but some are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Police

"the British police are not routinely armed, except in Northern Ireland, at airports, nuclear facilities, and on some protection duties."

"arms could be issued by a sergeant if there was a good reason, and if the officer had been trained."

"around 7 per cent of officers in London are trained in the use of firearms. Firearms are also only issued to an officer under strict guidelines"

"In order to allow armed officers to rapidly attend an incident, weapons are now frequently carried in the secure armoury of patrolling Armed Response Vehicles (ARVs)."

"the routine carrying of firearms on normal police patrols was re-introduced in Nottingham in February 2000, in response to a number of gang related shootings"

Not all our police are routinely armed but some are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Police

"the British police are not routinely armed, except in Northern Ireland, at airports, nuclear facilities, and on some protection duties."

"arms could be issued by a sergeant if there was a good reason, and if the officer had been trained."

"around 7 per cent of officers in London are trained in the use of firearms. Firearms are also only issued to an officer under strict guidelines"

"In order to allow armed officers to rapidly attend an incident, weapons are now frequently carried in the secure armoury of patrolling Armed Response Vehicles (ARVs)."

"the routine carrying of firearms on normal police patrols was re-introduced in Nottingham in February 2000, in response to a number of gang related shootings"


A little pedantic, no?

A little pedantic, no?

Sorry- it wasn't a criticism or me just trying to be picky; I was simply pointing it out. Up until recently I thought our policemen weren't armed and then the whole shooting thing happened with the Brazilian guy and I realised I was wrong. It seems to be a common misconception so I thought I'd mention it.

The binge drinking problem is nothing new. In fact its always been with us, since man discovered alcohol. Look at Londons gin houses of the early 18th century etc. I think the problem is the media. We are oversaturated with media coverage of its chosen "crusade" of the week. One week its kids school meals, next week its binge drinking. People will drink. And a few will be violent. It has always been this way. And there is nothing you or I can do about it. Do not let the actions of the few, affect the socialising of the many. :fluffle:

its not suprising that many, many people think she was evil; while those relative few who did well under her rule, love her.I have never understood hatred of her from some individuals (most people I know in RL actually don't mind her, though), yet I am far from one of the "relative few who did well under her rule". I lost nothing from her, but never gained anything from her either.

I think chavs (or spides as we call them here) are a result of parents not giving a fuck what their brats are doing (as a general rule). There is a distinct lack of discipline in this day and age, from both familial and educational sources, so how are they meant to know that everyone else thinks they're a twat who needs a bullet in the head / up the arse?

Having said all that, I think bars and clubs have a lot to answer for with their ludicrously cheap drinks promotions and whatnot. But having said that as well, while I think the problem is bad, I do think the media have blown it out of all proportion. Lots of people go out and binge, which no doubt is bad for them, but each to their own as long as it doesn't affect me. When it does, or when people become insulting or violent as a result, they need to accept personal responsibility for that. The clubs shouldn't be making booze so cheaply available, and the papers shouldn't be going so insane; but at the end of the day, the individuals involved just shouldn't be infringing on the lives of others.

Well, I think things are looking up. After all, the UK has "dogging".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/4288038.stm

I have never understood hatred of her from some individuals (most people I know in RL actually don't mind her, though), yet I am far from one of the "relative few who did well under her rule".

What age are you, again? If you're doing an MA at the moment you're probably about 22/23

I lost nothing from her, but never gained anything from her either.

Apart from the milk, obviously?

ok so we have come up with the fact that no matter what when alcohol is around there will be violence cause by it, but now the issue i am raising is if we left pubs adn clubs open selling alcohol 24 hours a day then there would be no mass turnouts on the street this could stop rivals from having fights as they leave at different times, but also means you could have drunks spilling out at any time, so would it be worth having them open all day or not, your views please.

I blame the Bars and clubs for the drinking problem. They have there prices ridiculously low...and have way too many happy hours. This all leads to people getting very drunk, very fast...thus leading to anti-social behaviour on the city and town streets come to the time of closing. Whats worse is that many young people see this as acceptable and began to immitate their peers.

What the hell bars do YOU go to? I don't call £3 for a pint "ridiculously low" priced!!!

apparently theres gonna be a big increase in the price of alcohol towards the end of november, here in the north its about 2.40 for a stella, 1.80 for a bitter, both gonna be goin up about 60p +.
Cocaine will seem even cheaper then, an it will create more trouble, nobheads thinking they are invincible, probably more murders.

A solution that woud help the drink problem would have been just to lower the price of soft drinks, they cost a fortune in pubs, when ive ever gone to the pub just to socialise rather than drink, i end up gettin a beer anyway because its not worth paying out for a soft drink

pubs clubs should be alot more stricter on age, they never check.

doormen ... i know this has recently changed, now they have to have clean records, they need watching more carefully. another new system is rewarding pubs/clubs with the least trouble...also naming and shaming

public transport should be policed better at night,m less people wandering round if the transport is safe!

if say, musicians, comedians, theatres, where promoted more NOT JUST THE BIG ONES, people might realise they have better things to do of a night than go out just to get totally drunk!

It seems this thread has collapsed into slagging off Maggie. Let's all stop it and get back to the task in hand. Despite her faults, Mrs. Thatcher was not responsible for the creation of Chavdom. This is the fault of the liberal elite who eroded all values of discipline in Britain. The inner-city schools are a joke. Feral youths stalk city streets, assaulting old ladies. And when shopping centres ban hooded tops and baseball caps, they are accused of "fascism."
Britain has no values for the same reason that it has no culture, a socialist-sponserred ditching of morality in favour of "understanding." I've understood just about all I can take. I leave all of you who depise Thatcher so to teach these children your way and see how ruinous your ideals actually are. Why don't you all try teaching in an inner-city comprehensive? You'll find that Labour currently has no interest in imposing discipline upon anyone.

The inner-city schools are a joke.
...because of thatcher :p

Britain has no values for the same reason that it has no culture, a socialist-sponserred ditching of morality in favour of "understanding."
hmm the rest of europe on the continent doesn't seem to have such problems with binge drinking, truancy and chavs... and yet they tend to be yet more socialist than britian. nope, i don't think that arguement stacks up...
as for 'understanding', its not a lack of discipline that causes the problem, but a lack of respect and understanding on the chavs' part.

Do any of you participate in dogging?

The point about soft drinks really is a good one, it only costs just under 10pence for the softdrink you purchase to be produced so even at 40pence -70pence range i would say is nearly reasonable, here it is 120pence for a coke.

Blessed Chris, you must be too young to remember Thatcher :D

She was awful, awful, awful. A total disaster.



Does that mean you are too young to remember the 70s and the Winter of Discontent. She would have never have got into power if the Unions hadn't pissed of everyone else in the country with their strikes that cripled our economy and got Britian the nickname "the sick man of Europe".