NationStates Jolt Archive

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

because they didn’t die out through variation we started spending more time outside the forest It doesn’t just work for survival you know

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

Evolution isn't snap, crackle and pop process. It refers to a gradual change over time. Some species adapt, but also some organisms adapt. Monkeys haven't been shut out of their ecological footholds, so there is no reason for them to become extinct. The development of certain species entirely independently of others shouldn't proclude separate development of different species.

They are different genus and, if not species, than race. It is likely humanity developed from a nigh on unique, tremulous genetic mutation, that proffered us the capacity to be sentient, and we developed accordingly, whereas Monkeys merely remained monkeys. Moroever, how many monkeys reside in Europe, the grasslands if Africa and the other principal domains of humanity's development? None whatsoever, and we may accordingly surmise their absence to be implicit of our evolution from them.

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
Magic.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?Hey Ffc2... long time no see.

as for your question, it's simple. the smart ones stayed in the trees. :D

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now

It is an irrelevancy, we evolved from primeapes, since the principal regions of human evolution are bereft of monkeys, they endure in those regions wherin their natural attributes are of more use to those of humanity, and the mutation that facilitates humanity is made extinct due to survival of the fittest.

lol how u been

.

as for your question, it's simple. the smart ones stayed in the trees. :D

:p

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now

...that isn't a valid assumption. Evolution isn't the complete transformation of one species into another new species: it's the development of new species from others over time as a result of adaptation from genetic mutations. As such, there's in fact only a small number of organisms that 'evolve', or at least are the product of evolutionary change. Hence the preponderence of single-celled organisms. The appearance of a new species doesn't automatically destroy the old species. (I'm talking in pseudo-scientific, not pseudo-ecological, terms here.)

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
Because there are monkeys that don't level up enough to evolve.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

Because evolution generally causes splits and at least two diverging ancestral lines. The ancestor species only dies out if the new species completely outcompetes the original in the same habitat.

Also, we didn't "come from monkeys." We descended from a common ancestor of ourselves and today's apes. One branch left the trees and became bipedal. Others, involving different genetic lines influenced by different survival pressures, evolved eventually into Gorillas, Orangutans, Chimps and Bonobos.

For another example, we KNOW dogs descended from wolves. Are wolves still around? Yup.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
They didn't change into us. That's not the theory. We and them come from a common ancestor wayyyy long time ago.

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now
Well, that's the whole thing about randomness ...it's random. Some change in one way, some don't. Some change in another way, some don't.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
We covered this before, no?

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now
They have. The monkeys that were around when we evolved from an ape-like primate weren't the same as the monkeys we have today. They evolved in different directions.

I suppose a simillarly sensible question would be since it's been shown that doctors and lawyers make more money than ditchdiggers, why are there still ditchdiggers left in the world?

For another example, we KNOW dogs descended from wolves. Are wolves still around? Yup.actually, dogs were wolves domesticated by man and then the breeding program started. people started breeding dogs for different purposes. think the Dauchand evolved naturally?

The different types of dogs are the results of people breeding dogs for specific reasons. Cats too.

I suppose a simillarly sensible question would be since it's been shown that doctors and lawyers make more money than ditchdiggers, why are there still ditchdiggers left in the world?
Good point. I no longer beleive in ditch diggers.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
Umm, evolution doesn't say humans came from monkeys, it says humans and monkeys came from the same previous species (the "missing link"), which is no longer around, oddly enough fitting your question.

We didnt come from monkeys anymore than monkeys came from us, we merely share a common genetic ancestor which branched out into seperate evolutionary paths.

Umm, evolution doesn't say humans came from monkeys, it says humans and monkeys came from the same previous species (the "missing link"), which is no longer around, oddly enough fitting your question.did they ever find the "Missing Link" I though they did find it in Asia.

a professor once told me evolution is not going to create the perfect species as some would say humans are but rather only trying to get a passing grade just living long enough to reproduce

actually, dogs were wolves domesticated by man and then the breeding program started. people started breeding dogs for different purposes. think the Dauchand evolved naturally?

The different types of dogs are the results of people breeding dogs for specific reasons. Cats too.

I know that, but it has nothing to do with my point. My point is that the passing on of genetic material, (whether by natural pressures or by the work of man,) does not cause all that came before to cease to exist.

The genetic mechanism (other than genetic engineering,) of a man breeding for favorable characteristics and nature doing itself is the same. Man is just able to accelerate it by forcing certain combinations together, inbreeding and making sure that the animal with the characteristics he is looking for survives long enough to breed.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

First off, we didn't come from monkeys, we came from the "missing link". According to Tenacious D, this link is the Sasquatch. Maybe they're right.

Second off, we actually are genetically closer to chimps than monkeys I'm told.

Edit: Looks like I may be right about the DNA thing. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimpanzee#Taxonomic_relationships)

...they have about 95 to 98 percent of their DNA in common with humans.

First off, we didn't come from monkeys, we came from the "missing link". According to Tenacious D, this link is the Sasquatch. Maybe they're right.

Second off, we actually are genetically closer to chimps than monkeys I'm told.
do you really take everything Jack Black says that seriously

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's?

We didn't come from monkeys. Monkeys are a modern primate species. Both humans and monkeys evolved from an earlier common primate ancestor, which was different from both.

We are thus related to monkeys... like you are related to a distant cousin, only with a much greater degree of seperation.

If we did change why are they still here?

They aren't "still" here, they're just here... for the same reason we are. Their ancestors survived and reproduced and here they are.

do you really take everything Jack Black says that seriously

Not really, but he has made some correct statements:

"You don't always have to fuck her hard..."
"This is not The Greatest Song in the World..."

Et cetera.

I know that, but it has nothing to do with my point. My point is that the passing on of genetic material, (whether by natural pressures or by the work of man,) does not cause all that came before to cease to exist.

The genetic mechanism (other than genetic engineering,) of a man breeding for favorable characteristics and nature doing itself is the same. Man is just able to accelerate it by forcing certain combinations together, inbreeding and making sure that the animal with the characteristics he is looking for survives long enough to breed.except that Nature breeds for survivability, man breeds animals for looks and function.

but point taken. :D

Not really, but he has made some correct statements:

"You don't always have to fuck her hard..."
"This is not The Greatest Song in the World..."

Et cetera.You can't trust him though, he's Young Nasty Man.

You can't trust him though, he's Young Nasty Man.

No, he's Wonderboy. KG is Young Nasty Man. Watch the video, it's obvious he's Wonderboy.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
I'm forced to point out that evolution does not claim we 'came from monkeys,' and if one honestly believes this to be the case, one might make a fortune by charging spelunkers to explore the cavernous, largely empty contents of one's mind.

Evolution holds that man and modren apes share a common ancestor. Primitive man and modern apes may not have actually lived side by side; the primates we see today are likely the product of an evolutionary process themselves. This isn't tantamount to the belief that "man came form monkeys" whether you believe in evolution or not. Just thought I'd clear that up.

Because there are monkeys that don't level up enough to evolve.
Yep, Life is a game, and every game has its nubs.

I'm forced to point out that evolution does not claim we 'came from monkeys,' and if one honestly believes this to be the case, one might make a fortune by charging spelunkers to explore the cavernous, largely empty contents of one's mind.

Evolution holds that man and modren apes share a common ancestor. Primitive man and modern apes may not have actually lived side by side; the primates we see today are likely the product of an evolutionary process themselves. This isn't tantamount to the belief that "man came form monkeys" whether you believe in evolution or not. Just thought I'd clear that up.

In fact, evolution hold that man and EVERYTHING has a common ancestor somewhen. We are not descended from any modern population of anything though.

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now
Eh, you're trolling, but why not.


Not much more then a few hundred thousand years. Hardly a blink of the eye in the evolutionary time scale, and it isn't something we'd notice. Far too (relatively) gradual for that.

In fact, evolution hold that man and EVERYTHING has a common oncestor somewhen. We are not descended from any modern population of anything though.
Yeah. Just as a followup, I'm forced to point out that the Catholic Church has had a history of updating it's 'canon' in accordance with science. Anyone else happen to remember them perpetuating the belief that the world was flat and later that the universe revolved around the Earth?

In fact, any archaeological evidence of man older than 10,000 years or so pretty much contradicts the bible absolutely, and they do certainly exist. Whether you choose to belive them or not is another issue, as one of the annoying parts about having free will is that we can and all to often do choose to ignore the realities we interact with every day.

Eh, you're trolling, but why not.


Not much more then a few hundred thousand years. Hardly a blink of the eye in the evolutionary time scale, and it isn't something we'd notice. Far too (relatively) gradual for that.
Technically, we have been evolving since the beginning of life, if there was such a thing.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

Information like that is cleverly hidden in books! READ THEM!

(That is the most inane and clueless question ever!)

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

Because ealier species are often are very good at what they do - they are evolutionary speaking, "entrenched". Your question can even be taken into a larger context, such as, why are fish still around?, or reptiles? etc....

Obviously, monkeys are still around, because one, they are well established biologically/ecologically and, two well adapted and suited to there particular lifestyle or ecological niche. In other words, they are good at what they do.

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now
There are no monkeys of the kind from which we evolved. There are many species that has evolved from them, and we call some of these species monkeys or apes, but the monkeys that live now are no more related to our monkey-ancestors than we are.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?


we didnt come form monkeys we came from creatures who had a close resemblance to monkeys. only a two year old would possibly think we came from actual monkeys

Righto. I think we have established that humans and modern monkeys share a common ancestor.

we didnt come form monkeys we came from creatures who had a close resemblance to monkeys. only a two year old would possibly think we came from actual monkeys

I dont think that was entirely necessary.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?
We need them to type in pointless and asinine questions on the internet.


Also, without them, where would have all of Shakespeare's work come from?

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here? OMG! WE DID NOT COME FROM MONKEYS! OKAY?

I know a couple of guys who I am sure devolved into jackass'.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

We didn't come from monkeys.

We do however share a common ancestor with all the other great apes.

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's? If we did change why are they still here?

1) Are closest relatives are chimps
2) We didn't come from chimps, we have a common ancestor with them: For instance you and your cousins have a common ancestor (your grandparents)

Okay, we have established a few things here:

1. Man did not come from monkeys, we merely share a common ancestor.
2. We are more closely related to chimps than monkeys.
3. Ffc2 is an uninformed idiot/troll. Most likely both.

As the common ancestor thing and the chimp/monkey thing has been done to death, I'll put it into less technical terms for him.

If you came from your parents, why are your parents still around?

Okay, we have established a few things here:

1. Man did not come from monkeys, we merely share a common ancestor.
2. We are more closely related to chimps than monkeys.
3. Ffc2 is an uninformed idiot/troll. Most likely both.

Thats a little harsh, maybe he comes from the American school system. A lot of schools here don't teach evolution or just gloss over it so they don't have to deal with the whole ID vs evolution thing.

Okay, we have established a few things here:

1. Man did not come from monkeys, we merely share a common ancestor.
2. We are more closely related to chimps than monkeys.
3. Ffc2 is an uninformed idiot/troll. Most likely both.

We established #3 months ago, I think. #2 and #1 are both correct.

We don't come from monkeys. We and Monkeys, apes, Lemurs etc are all evolved from a proto simian ancestor. Which in turn is descended from a proto mammalian ancestor, which in turn comes from a proto reptilian ancestor etc.......You get the idea?

:headbang:

Almost all questions attacking evolution seem to come from extreme ignorance.

Although I don't visit the forums often, I seem to remember Ffc2 making absolutely insane posts about 6 months ago. Vetalia is right.

Okay, we have established a few things here:

1. Man did not come from monkeys, we merely share a common ancestor.
2. We are more closely related to chimps than monkeys.
3. Ffc2 is an uninformed idiot/troll. Most likely both.i see how it goes i ask a honest question and you insult me. lopsided weasel molester :eek:

Having read merely the first and last pages of this thread, I feel a mighty need to point out that some wolves and dogs can interbreed.

In other news, to likely recap what I imagine someone has already said, the primate order over time it seems underwent punctuated evolution as opposed to gradual.

Also; you'll note that many other old primates didn't survive/have surviving descendants. See any other Homos around? Hmm, I should probably have worded that differently.

Better question. How come species can remain nearly unchanged for millions of years, only to disapear and be replaced over night, geologicaly speaking?

If we come from monkeys why are there still monkey's?

We didn't evolve from monkeys, we share common ancestors with them. But even if we did evolve from monkeys, nothing about evolution implies that they could not still be around.

That would be like saying, "If (most) modern Americans are descended from Europeans, why are there still Europeans?"

But how long have we been evolving you would think they would all be changed by now

Nothing about evolution implies that change "must" happen over time. Evolution explains how and why change does happen. Some species last a relatively long time without change; others (especially microscopic organisms) can evolve in a matter of years, or less.

i see how it goes i ask a honest question and you insult me. lopsided weasel molester :eek:

So why reply to an insult? Why not reply to the several posters who have presented reasonable and informed responses to your question?

I count quite a few answers to your question on this thread. Look into some of them.

I've only read the last few pages so this may be a repeat.

Look at the branches on a tree. There is a main trunk and many side branches. They all grow and change over time. The side branches don't stop the other side branches, but they all come from a common branch or trunk. Some of the side branches put out many side branches of their own. Others don't. Some side branches die naturally, others are cut off. Those that get the most sun and aren't killed by an outside force continue into the future.

This doesn't totally tell the story, because some plants and animals develop so closely that they need each other to survive. They give up all other food sources or pollination sources except their favored one. Others, like humans, become "weedy" because they learn to survive on many food sources. This allows them to invade other environments than the one where they developed.

Why don't we have every "missing link"? Because each change happened in a single individual. Only a few individuals can be found. If you would dig up most cemeteries today you would find few individuals that died 100 years ago. A change happened in one but we can only find one in billions. The change in that one would also be to subtle to notice. It is only when many changes over many generations build up, that one can see a change has taken place. In other words, there is not ONE "missing link", There are millions of "missing links". Each with a slight change from his parents.

When or if the Avian Flu Virus adapts to "human to human" spreading, it will be ONE virus that will make the change. Do you think it will be possible to find that one "missing link"? No, but we will know it's children because they will find another food source (people) that will allow it to live and spread better than the virus that live today. When that happens, evolution will have taken place in our life time. Of course, every new cold or flu virus is evolution in our lifetime. We can see it because virus have so many generations in our lifetime. A human would be lucky to see 10 generations of his family. 5 older and 5 younger.

If you are serious about understanding this, I suggest reading up about genetic drift. A good example is the Amish of America. Are they human? No question. However, they have genetically isolated themselves from the general population, and now, due to a limited gene pool and reduced genetic drift (an isolated population, reproductivly speaking), they now have a high occurance of polydactyly, particularly post-axial (having an extra finger attached off of the thumb. It is known as the Founders Effect, where a typically recessive gene becomes prevelant among a small select group. Over time, it would be possible that either polydactyly would become dominant (unlikely) or that normal hands would be fully bred out of their collective gene pool (so if normal hands are PP, and polydactyly is pp [assuming polydactyly is a simple dominance and that normal hands are dominant], all amish would have a genotype of pp).

Under this same idea, lets say Rhode Island (chosen because it is small) closed its borders and continuously interbred with only people from RI, then concieveably within several hundred or thousand years, they would display characteristics rarly or never seen within the larger human population.

What this all leads to is that the ancestor of apes and humans once had its population divided. Lets say half migrated over a mountain or across a large lake or river, the two populations would develop along individual paths.

The other option is that seen in New World monkeys. Most likely, one species of monkeys arrived in South America, where there were no competing species. These monkeys rapidly evolved to fit several different niches (this explains why most new world monkeys have prehensile tails, while no old world monkeys do)

Yet another example of this is a type of fly (I cant think of the name right now and dont feel like looking it up) feeds on apples. It has been found that some of the species now mostly feed on red apples, others on green. Currently, they are mostly genetically similar, and therefore are still one species. However, if the red flies only mate with reds, and greens with greens, then fairly soon, they could divide into different species. One does not have to die out for the other to exist as they do not compete directly for resources or mates.

and since it is 3:39 and I had to think for this, I'm going to sleep.

Here's a cool article about how biological evolutionary theory helps out other areas of science:

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa003&articleID=00074F10-365F-1333-B65F83414B7F0000

and here's a welcome bit of news...hopefully we won't be so stupid in the future. :D

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa003&articleID=00055AA8-F6B0-1321-B6B083414B7F0000

After reading all this, I do suspect that Ffc2 never really wanted an answer in the first place..

After reading all this, I do suspect that Ffc2 never really wanted an answer in the first place..

It seems to be a popular theme amongst the anti-evolutionists...

He never does. He's just a troll, using... what appears to be supernatural ignorance as a tool to stir up trouble. If he really cared, he's asked the same questions often enough, so he should have our answers. But no, he just loves seeing his threads get seven-page replies, while the rest of us rack up our post counts while attempting to educate the ignorant at the same time.

This is an explanation I saw on Discovery...

Once upon a time 10,000 years ago a special race of primate apeared in Africa (north africa I think).
They where capable of making thier own tools and had an "advanced" communication. This enabled them to hunt more succesful which led to food abundancy. That gave them time to ponder and thier brain evolved/mutated.
In time this evolution led to Homo Sapiens...

You should probably have seen the episode yourself.

This is an explanation I saw on Discovery...

Once upon a time 10,000 years ago a special race of primate apeared in Africa (north africa I think).
They where capable of making thier own tools and had an "advanced" communication. This enabled them to hunt more succesful which led to food abundancy. That gave them time to ponder and thier brain evolved/mutated.
In time this evolution led to Homo Sapiens...

You should probably have seen the episode yourself.

...is that actually Lamarckian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inheritance_of_acquired_traits) heredity it's proposing?! Jesus, Discovery, I thought you were respectable! I feel all disillusioned :( I mean, it's like using Pokemon as supporting evidence for evolutionism. Fuckers.

This is an explanation I saw on Discovery...

Once upon a time 10,000 years ago a special race of primate apeared in Africa (north africa I think).
They where capable of making thier own tools and had an "advanced" communication. This enabled them to hunt more succesful which led to food abundancy. That gave them time to ponder and thier brain evolved/mutated.
In time this evolution led to Homo Sapiens...

You should probably have seen the episode yourself.

Time scale is a bit out there. Homo Erectus, one of the earliest (but not the earliest) true members of the Homo family, evolved about 1.8 million years ago. He may have been the first tool user, he was certainly the first tool shaper.

He originated in East Africa but spread out to inhabit most of Africa and Asia - finally dying out about 300,000 years ago.

Hope this helps.

Better question. How come species can remain nearly unchanged for millions of years, only to disapear and be replaced over night, geologicaly speaking?

Simple, something changed in their environment that they were unable to cope with.