NationStates Jolt Archive

The NationStates Classic Liberal party needs to fill a seat for parliament, so if you are interested in a seat, check out the manifesto, and see if the party suits you.

Constitutional Principles
Defining the nature of society and its duty to the citizen

Knowing that the fundamental goal of a society should be the preservation of the individual's right to free action and thought, the NationStates Classic Liberal Party sets down these guidelines and abilities of government.

- All government policy should be minimalized, only policies that are deemed necessary for the maintenance of a free society shall be legislated.

- Government shall be maintained at the most local level commensurate with the fulfillment of its duties towards the citizens.

- The exclusion of rights from this manifesto must not be construed to deny or disparage others held by the people.

- The policies and actions of government shall be undertaken in a way that grants equal utility and equal freedom for all citizens of the society. If ever a conflict arises between these two concepts, priority is given to freedom.

- All rights shall be allowed equally to all individuals dependent on the level of competency in understanding the responsibilities that are bound to these rights.

- Government must respect all individual rights to free expression and free information. Government must respect the individual rights to peacefully assemble.

- The individual shall be in control of his own labor, thus will be both responsible and rewarded for his own product.

- Economic regulations shall be maintained by the natural competitive forces of the free market. Government shall make no legislation impeding the free market.

- Government shall have the power of eminent domain only to provide necessary universally-utilizable public works. It must never be used to the benefit of private entities.

- Taxes shall be gathered at a set percentage of a person's consumption of the national product. As with other policies, taxation should be minimalized, with the goal being elimination.

- If a necessary industry cannot be sustained by the free market, then government may intervene to protect the economic freedom of the individual.

- Government may provide services that are available on the free market, but these must not recieve any subsidies or funding from taxation.

- The government shall maintain a monopoly on violence. All armed defense of the rights of the individual shall remain the full and sole jurisdiction of the government, unless there is eminent necessity.

One demoralized bump.

Can I sit for both the Liberals and the ESP?

Can I sit for both the Liberals and the ESP?

I believe that isn't allowed.

Do you particularly agree with these principles anyway?

Can I sit for both the Liberals and the ESP?

No, sorry. Nobody can hold more than one seat in Parliament.

Let's form a single file line here, I can only address one person at a time.

I wish I could do it, but I don't deserve it. Why not give it to Santa Barbara?

I wish I could do it, but I don't deserve it. Why not give it to Santa Barbara?

I would like to give it to him or Eichen, as I think they share these ideals very closely and have been involved, but neither of them are around.

I would like to give it to him or Eichen, as I think they share these ideals very closely and have been involved, but neither of them are around.
Then what about Super-Power?

Then what about Super-Power?

I'm not sure how involved he wants to be, but he would be welcome to it, as well.

I had forgotten about him, you know the posters on here far too well. I bet you could name 20 socialists and 20 libertarians easily.

I'm not sure how involved he wants to be, but he would be welcome to it, as well.

I had forgotten about him, you know the posters on here far too well. I bet you could name 20 socialists and 20 libertarians easily.
Heh, I suppose I do. I could name more socialists than libertarians though.
Vetalia, perhaps he could do it.

Heh, I suppose I do. I could name more socialists than libertarians though.
Vetalia, perhaps he could do it.

Vetalia would also work.

And I know you are online Vetalia, how about it?

I'd love to, if I may. Heck, I voted for ya. ;)

I'd love to, if I may. Heck, I voted for ya. ;)
Isn't that what you said on the Reason Party thread? :confused:

Isn't that what you said on the Reason Party thread? :confused:
Wha? I don't think so...

As far as I know I only commented on the Reason Party, amoung others.

I can't find any evidence I did in my last hundred posts. I'm not denying I've forgotten things I've said on NS before. But I'm sure I didn't do that.

I'd love to, if I may. Heck, I voted for ya. ;)

We would certainly appeal to a lot of demographics.

If I can reach any of the old party members, you are welcome to it.

We would certainly appeal to a lot of demographics.

If I can reach any of the old party members, you are welcome to it.
Texaspundistan
Wegason
Liberty Arbitre(sp?)

Those were the big ones. I think the rest have ceased to exist.

We would certainly appeal to a lot of demographics.

If I can reach any of the old party members, you are welcome to it.
Well I'm a black, atheist, catholic, with jewish grandparents, born in south africa, live in australia & travel on US Passport. I don't think I can cover all more bases for you. ;)

I did not notice this...
{this regards me wanting to be a CL rep}
I am Secretary of World Affairs of ACCEL.
I am actually on the CL's forum (I came for ACCEL and for this sovereign senate thing...b/c I liked a parliament idea).
I am apart of the National Sovereignty Organization.
I am relatively well known Diplomat in general to such places on Texas, Gatesville, the Rejected Realms, the West Pacific and many others.

I have dealt with Santa Barbara and others with the Capitalist Economic Organization and Conservative Defense Alliance prior to the formation of Alliance of Capitalists, Conservatives, and Economic Libertarians.

I enjoy the CATO institute (www.cato.org)...I like free markets...uhh that's I guess is a reasonable concise overview.

As for policy, I believe in a hands off international gov't that is for the purpose of improving the game not creating a one-size-fits-all government. Thus I will not pursue an activist agenda for any cause and hope to fend off attacks by socialists and general do-gooder whom wish to have everyone be as cool as they are by making everyone into a carbon copy of each other...NationStates can improve but red-tape and solar paneling are not part of a sound policy to accomplish the task. I think the marketplace of ideas is truly stagnant in NS at times, and I think the Clibs can lead the cause of liberal amounts of good debate not bad proposals.

Texaspundistan
Wegason
Liberty Arbitre(sp?)

Those were the big ones. I think the rest have ceased to exist.

Hey, I haven't ceased to exist. And I'm BIG!

But I did join the Reason Party.

Still, I agree with CL enough to make a good MP if you guys are into wife-swapping, as I am.

I am sorry Sarcondia, but if Santa Barbara wants it, it is his.

I would ask to be considered, but I am too new to this forum. Also, although my views are mostly objectivist libertarian, I am not what one would call a party-line guy. However, I would like to be considered for your party membership, as long as your party doesn't act like the U.S. LP and try to burn out the "witches" who are not party-line purists.

I am sorry Sarcondia, but if Santa Barbara wants it, it is his.

Well, I'm just offering my name up is no one else qualifies, really. I did vote for Reason, and I'm not sure if someone can be a member of one party, and a Member of Parliament representing a different party? Even very similar ones. I suppose I could look it up in the constitution or what-have-you but I'm too lazy. ;)

Yeah, heh. Santa Barbara was my first pick when I thought about the seats right after the election but I think that by the time I got around to producing the list I had smoked away the brain cell that had reccommended Santa Barbara to me not but 76 hours before. Apparently, this brain cell was replaced with one who reccommended Stephistan. I hope everyone is second-guessing that move as much as I am, but I do remember something being said about party Whips last time around. Besides, I think I know how to make her listen to me, which isn't something I found often in my final choices. If SB gets to sit as in Parliament, this will end up being win-win. Steph ought to make for a good liason to the Left, and I'll need one of those to pass some of my social policies.

I would ask to be considered, but I am too new to this forum. Also, although my views are mostly objectivist libertarian, I am not what one would call a party-line guy. However, I would like to be considered for your party membership, as long as your party doesn't act like the U.S. LP and try to burn out the "witches" who are not party-line purists.

I am not a libertarian either. At least not strictly.

I am glad to have all members who want to join. We had some pretty good discussions back when we started.

I am not a libertarian either. At least not strictly.

I am glad to have all members who want to join. We had some pretty good discussions back when we started.


I don't know your req's though. The nation I have now in NS is kinda a joke, just to be evil. I was on the forum for about a year as my former nation, Har Akir, but went into the hospital for the better part of the last year, so obviously, my nation went the way of the do-do...lol.

I would ask to be considered, but I am too new to this forum. Also, although my views are mostly objectivist libertarian...
You're an Objectivist? :eek:

Well, I'm just offering my name up is no one else qualifies, really. I did vote for Reason, and I'm not sure if someone can be a member of one party, and a Member of Parliament representing a different party? Even very similar ones. I suppose I could look it up in the constitution or what-have-you but I'm too lazy. ;)

This is a formal offer. If you are available to take the seat, it is yours. I don't foresee any future clashes with the Reason Party, so there shouldn't be a problem.

Arridia might put the kabash to this though, I don't know. This party was much better when Alien Born was around to take care of all this stuff.

You're an Objectivist? :eek:


Yeah, sorry. :rolleyes:

Hard to tell through my hard line pro-Israel rhetoric, huh?

I'll go over my views on the CL views.

- All government policy should be minimalized, only policies that are deemed necessary for the maintenance of a free society shall be legislated. I fully agree. The only thing necessary to pursue in the realm of NS Parliament is basic inalienable human rights along with ideas to increase the game's playability and realm of debate.
- Government shall be maintained at the most local level commensurate with the fulfillment of its duties towards the citizens. I also believe in most things being local in education. I do think this applies in NS to the idea of letting each nation decide policy on the vast majority of policy.
- The exclusion of rights from this manifesto must not be construed to deny or disparage others held by the people. Indeed.
- The policies and actions of government shall be undertaken in a way that grants equal utility and equal freedom for all citizens of the society. If ever a conflict arises between these two concepts, priority is given to freedom. I agree, and I might even take it a step further. Good ideas and products will be brought if the gov't stays away. There is no need to try to prop up 'proper' views unless in a situation were it is of the utmost necessity.
- All rights shall be allowed equally to all individuals dependent on the level of competency in understanding the responsibilities that are bound to these rights. I fully agree. I have a 'World Benchmark' in Political Freedoms and always open up the rights of Sarcodina's people when it comes to ideas.
- Government must respect all individual rights to free expression and free information. Government must respect the individual rights to peacefully assemble. Agreed.
- The individual shall be in control of his own labor, thus will be both responsible and rewarded for his own product. Agreed.
- Economic regulations shall be maintained by the natural competitive forces of the free market. Government shall make no legislation impeding the free market. Agreed.
- Government shall have the power of eminent domain only to provide necessary universally-utilizable public works. It must never be used to the benefit of private entities. I think that the situation in the US is too expansive. People's homes must be treated with the utmost of respect and only used in truly impressive situations of public good and w/ just compensation.
- Taxes shall be gathered at a set percentage of a person's consumption of the national product. As with other policies, taxation should be minimalized, with the goal being elimination. Agreed. Go Flat Tax!
- If a necessary industry cannot be sustained by the free market, then government may intervene to protect the economic freedom of the individual. I do believe that there must be a reasonable fall back for pursuing economic capital. If the market is not one of set rules and worthwhile prospects (be it with minimal regulation), then the market will become stagnant.
- Government may provide services that are available on the free market, but these must not recieve any subsidies or funding from taxation. Agreed.
- The government shall maintain a monopoly on violence. All armed defense of the rights of the individual shall remain the full and sole jurisdiction of the government, unless there is eminent necessity. You can't have a monopoly of violence. The right to bear arms is a necessity in providing the people the ultimate check on the gov't. Its importance is seen in the early Greek city-states until now. You can't have true freedom if the gov't is the only one to protect you. I will not look to increase weaponry and let each nation decide its arm's policy...but I won't pursue regulations.

I don't know your req's though. The nation I have now in NS is kinda a joke, just to be evil. I was on the forum for about a year as my former nation, Har Akir, but went into the hospital for the better part of the last year, so obviously, my nation went the way of the do-do...lol.

I haven't answered an issue in about 3 weeks, and I have never role played, so the status of your nation does not matter.

Really there are no qualifications for joining. Hopefully we can spark some good discussion and it won't die out like last time around.

Maybe Neo K could start up another forum, and we CLs can join discussion in a Reason party forum.

Yeah, sorry. :rolleyes:

Hard to tell through my hard line pro-Israel rhetoric, huh?
No, actually I haven't seen your posts, I'm just surprised to see another one of us at all. I've noticed something of an outgrowth in recent weeks, it's been interesting to say the least.

This is a formal offer. If you are available to take the seat, it is yours. I don't foresee any future clashes with the Reason Party, so there shouldn't be a problem.

Arridia might put the kabash to this though, I don't know. This party was much better when Alien Born was around to take care of all this stuff.

Hmm well I'll go for it then.

Since there's no party registering, nor was the vote public, there's really no way to prove I voted for Reason anyway! Nor is there a way to prove I didn't use a puppet nation to vote for both Reason AND Classic Liberals! So really, I can just deny that I'm a "member of the Reason Party" or that I voted Reason, and unless one can prove I'm lying now (and not earlier), there's really nothing anyone can do about it, no?

Makes sense to me. All I know for sure is a MP can't hold more than one seat, so as long as I'm not plunking my fat ass down in a RP and a NSCL seat half-a-cheek to each, there should be no problems!

Steph ought to make for a good liason to the Left, and I'll need one of those to pass some of my social policies.

Oh, I agree. I was surprised she came out for Reason at first, but it makes sense. She's somewhat leftist at times but quite reasonable in most of her posts, not at all like the average "SMASH CAPITALISM" types.

snip

This looks good, and did you say that you were on the CL forum? Because I think I remember you now.

If SB cannot assume the seat, then I feel comfortable with you filling it. If SB does assume the seat, I would imagine that there will be other positions to fill, as I want to have this party grow and get back to where it was.

We need to get our region active again, and another forum started up.

Hmm well I'll go for it then.

Since there's no party registering, nor was the vote public, there's really no way to prove I voted for Reason anyway! Nor is there a way to prove I didn't use a puppet nation to vote for both Reason AND Classic Liberals! So really, I can just deny that I'm a "member of the Reason Party" or that I voted Reason, and unless one can prove I'm lying now (and not earlier), there's really nothing anyone can do about it, no?

Makes sense to me. All I know for sure is a MP can't hold more than one seat, so as long as I'm not plunking my fat ass down in a RP and a NSCL seat half-a-cheek to each, there should be no problems!

Fantastic, I knew you were lying the instant you said you joined the Reason Party.

I will announce that we have our seats filled.

Its amazing what can happen while you edit a post ;)
If SB wants the job, then I have no right to it. I do feel CL-RP and CP need to get together with the independents. This parliament must prove that right-leaning gov't is good because its ruling stands in stark contrast w/ most NS governances.

I feel social policy must be treated as every nation being one person. Each person has the right to be who they want unless in extreme situations, and thus I don't feel it is right to pursue an activist social agenda. The need to open markets between people is a good idea along with debate etc. I think a libertarian-leaning parliament would be most excellent! I also feel we should try to use to push the UN into reforming...

Its amazing what can happen while you edit a post ;)
If SB wants the job, then I have no right to it. I do feel CL-RP and CP need to get together with the independents. This parliament must prove that right-leaning gov't is good because its ruling stands in stark contrast w/ most NS governances.

I feel social policy must be treated as every nation being one person. Each person has the right to be who they want unless in extreme situations, and thus I don't feel it is right to pursue an activist social agenda. The need to open markets between people is a good idea along with debate etc. I think a libertarian-leaning parliament would be most excellent! I also feel we should try to use to push the UN into reforming...

I am hesitant to declare any explicit alliances, as I don't want trouble if there is ever disagreement. I also don't even think that there is any need to declare an alliance with the Reason Pary, as it was apparent way back during the first election.

I agree on social issues, but I believe the CP may actively pursue a social agenda, even though they won't get far.

I think, as a conservative, that I would be happy for the NS Parliament to tell me to follow my own personal views on social issues. The best thing any conservative on NS in their right mind could expect is a NS Parliament social agenda that doesn't exist. NSCP has 5 votes that are likely the only socially conservative amongst parliament. If you tell them that you (RP-CL) won't push an activist agenda and push similar economic policy, then I can't see why they wouldn't oblige. The CL might not feel any abortion should be banned yet is open to a fair debate on the subject, but DSP likely considers abortion akin to the right to vote and its protaganizers akin to fascists. As a Conservative, I'd like the former in charge as opposed to the latter.

In other words, I feel that the RP-CL can control a large alliance with the Conservatives and Independents...and everyone can go home happy.

Melkor, how do I gain control of the Classic Liberal region? I need to update it.

I'm not sure you can unless you get elected to the Delegacy. Telegram me the changes you want to make. If they're strictly limited to the WFE entry, I can probably make the changes myself. In the meantime, see if you can get another UN nation to endorse you for future control of the region. I can turn the Delegate regional controls on once you get it, if AB left it off when he ceased.

It's a goddamn shame he's gone, I liked that guy a lot; I'd have loved to find something significant enough to disagree with him over as he would have made a most excellent adversary. Still, I suppose he's doing bigger and better things now.

I think, as a conservative, that I would be happy for the NS Parliament to tell me to follow my own personal views on social issues. The best thing any conservative on NS in their right mind could expect is a NS Parliament social agenda that doesn't exist. NSCP has 5 votes that are likely the only socially conservative amongst parliament. If you tell them that you (RP-CL) won't push an activist agenda and push similar economic policy, then I can't see why they wouldn't oblige. The CL might not feel any abortion should be banned yet is open to a fair debate on the subject, but DSP likely considers abortion akin to the right to vote and its protaganizers akin to fascists. As a Conservative, I'd like the former in charge as opposed to the latter.

In other words, I feel that the RP-CL can control a large alliance with the Conservatives and Independents...and everyone can go home happy.

I will not push a social agenda, however, I have no doubt that some parties will. I actually recieved a TG from the DSP (I think) stating that we should put our differences aside and work against the CP. I told them no, but I don't really hold the CP in any higher regard, at least until we get into some discussion and voting.

Hmm. I think all this talk of alliance and whatnot should occur on the NSCL forum (http://s2.phpbbforfree.com/forums/classicliberal.html) or at least, at a different time and place than this thread.

I'm not sure you can unless you get elected to the Delegacy. Telegram me the changes you want to make. If they're strictly limited to the WFE entry, I can probably make the changes myself. In the meantime, see if you can get another UN nation to endorse you for future control of the region. I can turn the Delegate regional controls on once you get it, if AB left it off when he ceased.

I know there are no other UN members there, I don't even think that there are any active members there, besides AlltheCoolNamesareTaken who just joined.

I would just like to be able to edit the Factbook entry, if I could.

It's a goddamn shame he's gone, I liked that guy a lot; I'd have loved to find something significant enough to disagree with him over as he would have made a most excellent adversary. Still, I suppose he's doing bigger and better things now.

I know, he is largely responsible for much of my views, and he actually kept the Classic Liberals going, him and NK.

Hmm. I think all this talk of alliance and whatnot should occur on the NSCL forum (http://s2.phpbbforfree.com/forums/classicliberal.html) or at least, at a different time and place than this thread.

I thought that thing was dead.

I thought that thing was dead.

It seemed to be for a while. Changed servers or something. But there it is, even auto-logged me in. No one's posted there for months... and didn't AB or someone create that? If so it may be good to have a new forum, since absentee administration is usually not that good for a forum.

It seemed to be for a while. Changed servers or something. But there it is, even auto-logged me in. No one's posted there for months... and didn't AB or someone create that? If so it may be good to have a new forum, since absentee administration is usually not that good for a forum.

I will see if I can get one going, even though I have no clue how to do it.

Hmmm it appears Kervoskia was the first one to join, so he may be the admin there. In which case a new forum would not be necessary.

If one is though, invisionfree is pretty reliable and idiot-proof.

Hmmm it appears Kervoskia was the first one to join, so he may be the admin there. In which case a new forum would not be necessary.

If one is though, invisionfree is pretty reliable and idiot-proof.

I'm putting one up with the same host.

Here we go:

http://s2.phpbbforfree.com/forums/nscl.html