NationStates Jolt Archive

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(
I’m the same way. I have realized it’s my hatred for arbitrary authority.

I’m the same way. I have realized it’s my hatred for arbitrary authority.

*nods*

Just remember: Catholic fundies aren't nearly as bad as Protestant fundies. Except for the whole anti-birth control part.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(Catholicism? not Christianity itself? interesting.

any idea when this started?

The hell? Have you SEEN the Popemobile?
http://j-walkblog.com/old/images/popemobile.jpg

Do you have anything against the Pope?

Just remember: Catholic fundies aren't nearly as bad as Protestant fundies. Except for the whole anti-birth control part.all fundies are equally bad.

Catholicism? not Christianity itself? interesting.

any idea when this started?
It's been growing for about a year. Ironically I almost became Catholic once.

Don't feel bad. Catholicism deserves your burning hatred.

all fundies are equally bad.

*nods*

I wish to contain it, and I don't know how it began.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(


Perhaps it's a sign from God.

All hate is is love that doesn't live up to one's expectations. I would say actually that you love Catholics but they have somehow dissapointed you.

all fundies are equally bad.
I'm bad? :( why am I bad?


oh and I have some problems with the Catholic church too, but I wouldn't say I hate them or anything, the Catholic church just really annoys me sometimes.

Perhaps Catholics are not the problem?

And while we're at it, perhaps 1 + 1 = 9

I don't hate religions. I just think they're pointless, but whatever. What I hate, though, are the evil policies of the Catholic church.

I wish to contain it, and I don't know how it began.
Don't contain it. it will only fester. examine it and find out what caused it and come to terms with it.

All hate is is love that doesn't live up to one's expectations.

For some reason i really like that saying, though it isnt entirely right. I too hate catholicism. But i know when and why it happened. I guess you could say i "loved" catholicism before (well...i was a member of it), but in 9th grade or so i had a class called "Fundamentals of Catholicism", which revealed to me all the falsehoods of the religion. I started hating it because it had been lying to me all my life before. Now I rebuke all teachings of Catholicism with its stand of god and creation, but i still retain many of the moral teachings it has.

All hate is is love that doesn't live up to one's expectations. I would say actually that you love Catholics but they have somehow dissapointed you.

Oh yes. If someone launches their foot between my thighs and hits a particularly vulnerable target, it's love, baby. Right after I regain consciousness.

Hate doesn't always originate from love. ;)

Does the Pope know about this?

Don't contain it. it will only fester. examine it and find out what caused it and come to terms with it.I vehemently disagree with their teachings. I see it as an archaic institution that has been outgrown. There is too much pride in the Church.
My fear is that it will grow, and I have no wish to be the anti-catholic Wagner.

Why did you almost become Catholic? What made you change your mind?

That might have something to do with it.

Non-Demonational Fundie here. :p

Why did you almost become Catholic? What made you change your mind?

That might have something to do with it.
I had a mild attraction for it because I heard glowingly of it. I then studied it on my own, I was a Christian at the time, so I attended the services. I began to have study other subjects such as philosophy and soon left Christianity altogether. Then this hatred began to boil.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(
You have a deamon! :eek:

Actually, you may have been turned against Catholics at a very young age, but have blocked it out.

Or you may have simply heard older people derriding Caltholicism.

Or ... you may simply have "reformation genes!" ;)

Eh...Catholicism is a great business, nothing more. I hate it because I hate all religions (thats gonna piss someone off). Relegions all have one problem- they never leave in room for other's judgement; they're always right. Ask a Catholic who's right, they say Catholics. Ask a muslim, they say the islamic faith. Only exception I can think of is buddhism, but they have an anti-intoxication law, so I dislike them too.

What I most dislike the most is the politics of it, which is probably at the root of it.

"Want to get a drink?"
"Nein, danke. Ve're almost there."
"This is such a drag, though."
"Can't be helped. It's for the Vatican's sake."
"I gotta wonder. Why is there always someone else against us? :confused: We don't even use force to get people to believe, the way we used to. No matter where you look, you won't find another religion overflowing with so much love, glorious and perfect. So what's the deal?"
"There's ein problem which has never quite died out. Beliefs come in warious forms."
"I wonder if there are any Buddhists like us two?"
"I really haf no idea. Vell, guess this is it."

...
"You still cling to God and religion today?! You parasitic cancers live off the world's nations and peoples!! And you still believe in Christ! Lunatics!!"
"Even today you don't believe in God?! Heh! You still believe in Communism! Putrid revolutionary fanatics!!"
"Shut up!!"
"Shimabara battou iai Ryuu! Ten-Zan!"
[fwap]
"AAggghhh!!"
[click]
"Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled. 2 Corinthians!"

"Aggh! Aggh!"
Amen!"
[bang] :sniper:
"Khleb za khleb, krov' za krov'. Go proclaim your communism in Hell!""

The Folowing Day, The Vatican
"A massacre?! Outrageous!!"
"yes, thjat is the order I gave. Section XIII should be a more aggressive group. When someone weilds violence against the Vatican...it should be prepared to react, weilding even greater violence back."
"Th-that's absurd! Then what of the Vatican's humanitarian image...?!"
"But anti-Christs and heathens...are not even human. They are instruments of Satan, hindering the Kingdom of God. These things must be handled quietly, so even if they must dirty their hands...that is why those two, and we, were created. "For dogma we would kill even our Founder." It is that fanaticism that is the foundation of Iscariot, which bears the name of Judas himself. We are earthly agents of the Vatican's divine punishment. It is what Section XIII Iscariot was created to do!!"
-Crossfire, Kohta Hirano
Note: this was just meant to be funny, don't take this seriously :D

I feel the same way, neo, except switch catholicism with idiocy. With one area, that I should need not say, in particular.

I feel the same way, neo, except switch catholicism with idiocy. With one area, that I should need not say, in particular.
This hatred seems irrational because I don't know the root of it, though I have an idea.

What I most dislike the most is the politics of it, which is probably at the root of it.

One of the roughest things for me to reconcile with was the fact that it had its own nation, flag, and anthem.

But, what can I say, Catholicism has a history of hierarchy. It's like in the Acts of the Apostles (if you read my posting in that question for Catholics thing around here, then you've already heard my ranting on it).

Other churches, other religions have councils. They aren't as prominent, and they don't receive as much attention in the media (with the possible exception of recent Episcopal activity).

The fact of the matter is, though, if you don't have some sort of authority on which the system is based, then anyone can come in and change what it means. That works fine if you don't believe you have any sort of truth, but it's dangerous otherwise. Politics are everywhere, but that's why we rely on faith to carry us through it all, past the abuses and the red tape.

I had a mild attraction for it because I heard glowingly of it. I then studied it on my own, I was a Christian at the time, so I attended the services. I began to have study other subjects such as philosophy and soon left Christianity altogether. Then this hatred began to boil.

Maybe, since you left Christianity when you were looking into Catholicism, you really hate Christianity in general but think Catholicism is the most legitimate version of it. ;)

And I'm not JUST trying to be a smart alec. Movies/books like The Da Vinci Code, Dogma, and a few others focus on the "criticise-Christianity-by-criticizing-Catholicism" model.

Being hated gives me this warm feeling inside.... really. Especially since there are so many well thought-out arguments expressed on this thread explaining just why and how Catholics are worthy of such sentiments, certainly no band-wagon jumpers-on here.

To the original poster: If nothing else, stop expending energy maintaining an emotion that hurts you a heck of a lot more than it hurts the object of your ire, Neo Kervoskia. It's really not worth stressing yourself over. That feeling raises your blood pressure and really is not healthy for you. Agree to disagree, and move on.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(
You need to understand Catholicism better. You won't hate it if you understand it.

I'm the same way...
But I know exactly why I can't stand the idea of Catholicism.
So I don't worry about it.
Don't worry, your sentiments are shared. ;)

You need to understand Catholicism better. You won't hate it if you understand it.
I wouldn’t put money on that. Personally, the more I have learned about it, the more I have grown to dislike. It.

All hate is is love that doesn't live up to one's expectations. I would say actually that you love Catholics but they have somehow dissapointed you.

Hollow platitudes? "...hate is... love that doesn't live up to one's expectations"? Please...

Love and hate may be similar emotions - both involve a passionate response, perhaps. That doesn't make the one the failed version of the other.

Is love just hatred that got confused? Did the Kurds 'hate' Saddam's regime because they secretly loved them?

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(


Go talk to a therapist?

Being born Catholic and having attended Catholic school for twelve years, I can say your hate is well founded. Nothing but a bunch of selfrightious assholes who never practice what they preach. Sure there are exceptions, there always are. But I found that it was often those who proclaimed their faith the loudest that practiced it the least.

I realized they were full of crap early in 7th grade, but stuck with it for another two years, hoping to find some saving grace. But the hypocracy was so prevalent that I simply couldn't stand it anymore. I was Atheist all through highschool, and everyone wanted to convert me. It was the greatest feeling to talk them into disproving their own arguments, watching their faith crumble under logic. :D It was also pathetic that I, and some of my Protestant friends, knew more about Catholocism than most of the religion teachers.

I guess my beef with the Church boils down to their "do as I say, not as I do" combined with "because I/God said so" attitude. Whether or not that's how they are supposed to act is beside the point, they do it anyway. The only Catholic people I've actually seen practice what they preach are my grandparents, and even they agree my argument has merit.

I guess my advice to you would be to see whether or not the person your talking to actually follows what they say. If they do, then be glad, you've found a rare gem indeed. If not, simply think of them as the sad little ball of hypocracy they are and try to pity them instead.

Oh, and I'm currently a Militant Agnostic: I don't know, and YOU DONT EITHER! :)

I wish to contain it, and I don't know how it began. It's the Illuminati. Either that or you've somehow fallen prey to the general hatred of Catholicism that permeats a lot of society.

And yes, I AM full of crap but that has nothing to do with my religion. :p

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(

It's not an STD? *whew*

I feel the same way, neo, except switch catholicism with idiocy. With one area, that I should need not say, in particular. Who doesn't hate idiocy?

Neo, try not to hate Catholicism, you'd be too conformist.

Who doesn't hate idiocy?

Neo, try not to hate Catholicism, you'd be too conformist.

It's a centuries old tradition beginning with Martin Luther dissing the greedy and scuzzy Pope Leo X. Don't let tradition die. :)

It's a centuries old tradition beginning with Martin Luther dissing the greedy and scuzzy Pope Leo X. Don't let tradition die. :) I will carry on tradition by shaking a stick and spaking "heretic". :) Good old days.

Fair enough. Many catholics... obviously not all...dont actually agree with all church teaching. My family have been catholic since *God knows when* (see what I did...) and I was quite prepared to change. But I've found, having tried numerous forms of Christianity, that I prefer it. Maybe you could all go to a Catholic church and maybe see what you think... maybe you find it that bad after all. Of course the church has done evil things in the past but thats because its run by human beings and they have a tendency to be evil... the story of the Catholic Church is the story of mankind ... we've made our mistakes and still make them but each time we do I like to think we learn something at least.

It's been growing for about a year. Ironically I almost became Catholic once.

It's guilt. You feel guilty because you didn't become a Catholic so you become angry when discussing Catholicism to justify why you didn't become one. :eek:

Originally Posted by Willamena
You need to understand Catholicism better. You won't hate it if you understand it.
I wouldn’t put money on that. Personally, the more I have learned about it, the more I have grown to dislike. It.
That's the whole point. Learning about it, and wondering, why the heck do they do THAT? or some such, and then feeling dislike. That is lack of understanding.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(
i hate to be the old atheist who has to break the news to you, neo, but thats god calling you.

just like paul on the road to damascus. remember how he hated christians?

you need to go to actual conversion classes taught by the church. learn all there is to know about catholicism then decide if you were called to be a catholic or to denounce the catholic church.

i hate to be the old atheist who has to break the news to you, neo, but thats god calling you.

just like paul on the road to damascus. remember how he hated christians?

you need to go to actual conversion classes taught by the church. learn all there is to know about catholicism then decide if you were called to be a catholic or to denounce the catholic church.
It can't be god, he lost my number.

I know how you feel. I have an immense hatred of Japan (which I have kept suppressed here mostly) but there are a slew of good reasons for it, so it isn't really irrational.

Of course, I really don't see how a beef with the Catholic Church is irrational. They do have a lot of problems, after all.

It can't be god, he lost my number.
its not gonna go away until you deal with it

do you know why jonah was swallowed by the whale?

its not gonna go away until you deal with it

do you know why jonah was swallowed by the whale?

Because the whale didn't want to be picking pieces of Jonah out from between its teeth all day?:D

I have, sometimes, the same feeling when people Bash other things that people do, or live their lives as, or choose such and such Religion. I'm deeply Spiritual, and for some reason I want to get offended when people bash Christianity. I have no idea why, but it just is that way. I don't like to consider myself Christian, though my beliefs would qualify as such.

I just don't like the way the extreme Christians make images of people whom want to believe in a Lord Jesus Christ. I, myself, believe in such an entity, whom is one in the same in God. I try to distance myself from the word Christianity because of the negative images of it currently. However, its just a burning feeling inside me to feel offended, yet it goes away quickly.

Why? I wouldn't know. I should ask why I get offended when people Bash Christianity, or other things.

I have my beliefs, others have theirs. I have my opinions, as do other people. I can understand where your coming from with hatred for a specific entity and the like, meaning Catholic's and the like. But, after years of hating Homosexuals, I realized this:

Homosexuals are Humans like me. They bleed the same blood, they do some of the same things. To condemn them because of their choices iin their life is, in my opinion, wrong. Just because they have a different view of life, doesn't mean you need to hate them.

"Judge not, least ye be judged."

I try my best to go by that, sometimes I slip up, its normal. But in the end, we still bleed red blood. We still cry when hurt. We still seek comfort of our fellow man. We still love those closest to us.

We still can come together, shake hands, and have a good conversation about life.

Anywho, that's all of what I have to say.

its not gonna go away until you deal with it

do you know why jonah was swallowed by the whale?
Because he was running away from what God had told him to do. :p

its not gonna go away until you deal with it

do you know why jonah was swallowed by the whale?
I assume to learn some lesson, once you've read one story you can see the pattern in the rest.

I assume to learn some lesson, once you've read one story you can see the pattern in the rest.
read what eutrusca said above.

one refuses the call of god at their own risk.

read what eutrusca said above.

one refuses the call of god at their own risk.
God seems like a jerk, but I see your point.

God seems like a jerk, but I see your point.
that was a whole nother thread.

Don't feel bad. Catholicism deserves your burning hatred.

Rather than just promoting hatred for Catholicism, how about you contribute to the debate in a proper manner, explaining why you don't like it? It takes a little more effort, but its what seperates trolling a disagreeing statement.

You (and everyone else who dislikes catholics) are just jealous because even as an old man the Pope is so much more awesomer than you can hope to be.
Does your car have a massive bullet proof bubble? No.
Is their an entire religion out there for the exclusive purpose of providing you with bling-bling? No.
Are you allowed to just wander wherever you want wearing a load of phallic symbolism on the top of your head? No.
Did people announce the fact that you were getting your next job by setting stuff on fire? No.
Could you get away with saying, in essence, "1 0WNZ3D Y0UR 50UL!" constantly? Probably not, and even if you started doing so, would other people pay you to do so? No.

Lets face it, the Pope won the cosmic throw of the dice, and none of the rest of us were even allowed at the Roulette table (Whee! Mixed Metaphors!).

On another topic:
But in the end, we still bleed red blood.
Maybe you bleed red blood. I have Blood V3.14 with 256 color functionality.
*Bleeds a ranbow of hues*
We still love those closest to us.
*Looks at the man two stations over*
No, I'm not loving that.

I'm a Catholic, and I think that Vatican 1 was better then Vatican 2. Maybe you just disagree with some of the views the Church has. I do too, but that's what's great about Christianity. So I think it is evident that you can disagree with Cetholics, but that doesn't mean you gotta hate em. There are many different aspects of Catholicism, many people in it, etc. Protestants have been trying to ruin Catholic for years. They broke away from Catholics because they wanted the Bible to be open to their interpretation. And if they grow to hate us, then that is the opposite of what God wanted us to be like.

Maybe the Pope deserves a bullet proof bubble! John Paul 2 was shot before! He's at more risk then the President of the US.

its not gonna go away until you deal with it

do you know why jonah was swallowed by the whale?

Because he was covered in peanut butter?

Anyway - it wasn't a whale.

And, apart from that one rather dubious 'account', it seems like an unlikely and unsupported sort of story, anyhow....

I'm a Catholic, and I think that Vatican 1 was better then Vatican 2.


I don't remember, which one was the one with the shark that explodes?


Maybe you just disagree with some of the views the Church has. I do too, but that's what's great about Christianity. So I think it is evident that you can disagree with Cetholics, but that doesn't mean you gotta hate em. There are many different aspects of Catholicism, many people in it, etc. Protestants have been trying to ruin Catholic for years. They broke away from Catholics because they wanted the Bible to be open to their interpretation. And if they grow to hate us, then that is the opposite of what God wanted us to be like.

Actually - Protestantism broke away from Catholicism because they disliked all that they considered 'non-scriptural' about Catholic worship... like a temporal representative of god on earth, dogmatic law, and the veneration of saints.

Rather than just promoting hatred for Catholicism, how about you contribute to the debate in a proper manner, explaining why you don't like it? It takes a little more effort, but its what seperates trolling a disagreeing statement.

I think this is wise advice. It is hard to discuss your hatred for the Catholic Church if you are unable to articulate the exact reasons why you despise it so much. Right now it appears you are merely ranting, and neither offering anything productive nor intelligent.

I know you are capable of more than a simple emotional response.

I think this is wise advice. It is hard to discuss your hatred for the Catholic Church if you are unable to articulate the exact reasons why you despise it so much. Right now it appears you are merely ranting, and neither offering anything productive nor intelligent.

I know you are capable of more than a simple emotional response. Why do so many people hate Catholicism, though? I mean, really? It's very fishy, and inexplicable.

Ah, well, the Lord did say that his closest followers would be hated. :p ;)

[EDIT/] Kervoskia, maybe it is God calling you. I know tha before I converted, my hatred for not just the Church but for God was growing a great deal. You Have Been Warned.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(

I have similair symptoms. Perhaps we should start a support group, or a free clinic.

I have, sometimes, the same feeling when people Bash other things that people do, or live their lives as, or choose such and such Religion. I'm deeply Spiritual, and for some reason I want to get offended when people bash Christianity. I have no idea why, but it just is that way. I don't like to consider myself Christian, though my beliefs would qualify as such.

I just don't like the way the extreme Christians make images of people whom want to believe in a Lord Jesus Christ. I, myself, believe in such an entity, whom is one in the same in God. I try to distance myself from the word Christianity because of the negative images of it currently. However, its just a burning feeling inside me to feel offended, yet it goes away quickly.

Why? I wouldn't know. I should ask why I get offended when people Bash Christianity, or other things.

I have my beliefs, others have theirs. I have my opinions, as do other people. I can understand where your coming from with hatred for a specific entity and the like, meaning Catholic's and the like. But, after years of hating Homosexuals, I realized this:

Homosexuals are Humans like me. They bleed the same blood, they do some of the same things. To condemn them because of their choices iin their life is, in my opinion, wrong. Just because they have a different view of life, doesn't mean you need to hate them.

"Judge not, least ye be judged."

I try my best to go by that, sometimes I slip up, its normal. But in the end, we still bleed red blood. We still cry when hurt. We still seek comfort of our fellow man. We still love those closest to us.

We still can come together, shake hands, and have a good conversation about life.

Anywho, that's all of what I have to say.

I agree. Hatred is never beneficial. We can't agree with everybody all of the time.

In theory I'd say all opinions and beliefs should be respected, but the reality of the world makes this difficult for me - how can I respect, for example, the belief of someone who thinks that other people are inferior because of their race, or someone who thinks that women are just there for men's use... I dunno, the world makes me sad sometimes.

I do think you've got the right idea though, hatred = bad and unneccessary :)

:sniper: :sniper: Evryone has to hate something, or risk not fitting in.

Ah, well, the Lord did say that his closest followers would be hated.

Indeed.

I have similair symptoms. Perhaps we should start a support group, or a free clinic.

Care to elaborate on your hatred towards Catholicism, or remain silent like the rest? Honestly, if you have problems with the Catholic Church, by all means voice them. Right now all I hear is complaining.

For some reason I have a hatred for Catholicism. It's irrational and I don't know why I feel this way. Whenever I debate Catholicism, I have this burning feeling, it's not an STD because I checked. What is wrong with me? :(
Nothing's wrong with you. It's perfectly rational to hate seething, festering pits of hypocrisy.

Nothing's wrong with you. It's perfectly rational to hate seething, festering pits of hypocrisy. See, everyone? The plague strikes again!

I must ask my priest to look into this strange outbreak.

as long as we maintain the freedom to hate what/who we want when/ were we want to then i think the world is a better place for our children to sleep at night.

Nothing's wrong with you. It's perfectly rational to hate seething, festering pits of hypocrisy.

I'm starting to think most the people on this thread do not know how to properly debate. See, usually you have to provide facts to support your claim! Weird, huh?

[EDIT/] Kervoskia, maybe it is God calling you. I know tha before I converted, my hatred for not just the Church but for God was growing a great deal. You Have Been Warned.I've been a Christian and a Muslim, I did not independent when I was in them. I felt chained and I restricted myself, this is case specific mind you. When I de-converted I felt released in a way.

Care to elaborate on your hatred towards Catholicism, or remain silent like the rest? Honestly, if you have problems with the Catholic Church, by all means voice them. Right now all I hear is complaining.

Nay, I shan't remain silent. That would be entirely against my nature. First off, I believe that the teachings of all religious organisations supress free speach, thought, and belief and undermine human potential. Secondly, I find it very passive for someone to, under duress, call upon God to fix the situation. God isn't going to fix anything; he doesn't exist. Thirdly, I don't agree with the idea of confession. If we're going to judge people, it's not fair that one can kill and steal, etc but be seen as "good" because he confesses his sins to some randy old priest, while a person who barely harmed anyone is "evil" because she doesn't believe in God. Fourthly, I'm upset with the way the bible portrays women. We are viewed as "weak" and "easily-led", because of this fictional Eve character. Finally (for now), I disagree with the idea that sex, eating, being gay, and enjoying life are bad. If someone wants to be a fat slut, let her!
There are more points, but I'd be here all day.

It sounds like half of you don't know any Catholics or have never been to a Catholic church so you have no real reasons to hate us.

Nay, I shan't remain silent. That would be entirely against my nature. First off, I believe that the teachings of all religious organisations supress free speach, thought, and belief and undermine human potential. Secondly, I find it very passive for someone to, under duress, call upon God to fix the situation. God isn't going to fix anything; he doesn't exist. Thirdly, I don't agree with the idea of confession. If we're going to judge people, it's not fair that one can kill and steal, etc but be seen as "good" because he confesses his sins to some randy old priest, while a person who barely harmed anyone is "evil" because she doesn't believe in God. Fourthly, I'm upset with the way the bible portrays women. We are viewed as "weak" and "easily-led", because of this fictional Eve character. Finally (for now), I disagree with the idea that sex, eating, being gay, and enjoying life are bad. If someone wants to be a fat slut, let her!
There are more points, but I'd be here all day.
1] Religions are not meant to be freethinking. You submit to God like the Muslims - "Islam" means "submit". As Ratzinger said: "The truth is not determined by a majority vote."

2] How do you know God doesn't exist? I believe he does, for reasons that only I can know. You can't prove a negative (bloody hard to prove positives as well).

3] Yeah, I don't go to confession. My sins are between me and God alone.

4] As I remember, Adam was weak and easily led by Eve. So we're all weak and easily led… it's true, have a look at history.

5] Sex is indeed bad, eating is bad in excess, gayness is not bad unless you act on it (for reasons that have to do with defiling sexuality or something), and enjoying life is not bad. The best life is one conjoined with God. "For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life". See? Enjoying life.

Secondly, I find it very passive for someone to, under duress, call upon God to fix the situation. God isn't going to fix anything; he doesn't exist.

<Opens book of agnositc sayings> Prove it <Closes book>

Dont be scared

1] Religions are not meant to be freethinking. You submit to God like the Muslims - "Islam" means "submit". As Ratzinger said: "The truth is not determined by a majority vote."

2] How do you know God doesn't exist? I believe he does, for reasons that only I can know. You can't prove a negative (bloody hard to prove positives as well).

3] Yeah, I don't go to confession. My sins are between me and God alone.

4] As I remember, Adam was weak and easily led by Eve. So we're all weak and easily led… it's true, have a look at history.

5] Sex is indeed bad, eating is bad in excess, gayness is not bad unless you act on it (for reasons that have to do with defiling sexuality or something), and enjoying life is not bad. The best life is one conjoined with God. "For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life". See? Enjoying life.

1) You just affirmed my statement. I submit to no one!
2)Obviously I can't prove that God doesn't exist, but no one is capable of proving that he does exist, either, unless he finally pops down to earth to have a press conference.
3) Nothing more to say.
4) I'm neither weak, nor easily led. I don't think one little fairy tale is a testement to the nature of all humans.
5) Since when is sex bad? It's very natural*, and so is eating. As long as sex is consentual, it doesn't hurt anyone. Same goes for acting on homosexuality. And for me, life would be boring and painful if I were to waste it all trying to prove myself to a possibly non-existent entity. I'd rather just live.

*Pretending that God does exist for certain, I'm sure that if he thought sex was a bad thing, he'd find another way to make babies. He could just conjure them, or something. Sex is how we keep our species alive. In the grand scheme of things, sex is real, and marriage is a ridiculous human custom. In many ways, humans are the stupidest animals to walk this earth.

It sounds like half of you don't know any Catholics or have never been to a Catholic church so you have no real reasons to hate us.

I never said that I hate catholics. Just Catholicism.

Nay, I shan't remain silent. That would be entirely against my nature. First off, I believe that the teachings of all religious organisations supress free speach, thought, and belief and undermine human potential. Secondly, I find it very passive for someone to, under duress, call upon God to fix the situation. God isn't going to fix anything; he doesn't exist. Thirdly, I don't agree with the idea of confession. If we're going to judge people, it's not fair that one can kill and steal, etc but be seen as "good" because he confesses his sins to some randy old priest, while a person who barely harmed anyone is "evil" because she doesn't believe in God. Fourthly, I'm upset with the way the bible portrays women. We are viewed as "weak" and "easily-led", because of this fictional Eve character. Finally (for now), I disagree with the idea that sex, eating, being gay, and enjoying life are bad. If someone wants to be a fat slut, let her!

First of all, thanks for giving some reasoning for your beliefs, it'll actually make for a productive debate.

1. If one follows a religion and its dogma and doctrine, it is not viewed as a restriction of free speech, rather simply "right living". I don't force you to believe what I believe. You'll find that most of the beliefs are intended to make someone a more moral and virtuous person, capable of being free from sin and evil. So in a sense it is highly liberating.

2. I'm a bit confused about what you mean about asking God to "fix" things. If you mean prayer, I believe it is about communicating and having a relationship with God. Furthermore, it is a way to ask for forgiveness. I don't see what's wrong with asking for grace to be a moral person. Obviously I believe God exists, but I also believe that He doesn't always intervene because of free will. I would be glad to explain my views on free will, if you haven't heard them on another thread.

3. As Christians we are not called to judge other people, and I strive to live a humble life. Jesus himself said when a woman was going to be stoned for adultery, "let he who is without sin, cast the first stone", meaning we are all sinners and therefore should not unduly judge others. Secondly, Catholics don't believe people are evil because they don't believe in God. That is an absolute fallacy, and any Christian who says otherwise is unorthdox. The point of seeing a priest for confession is much like how one goes to a teacher for help in school. I find that priests give excellent advice on how to grapple with different issues and problems, and as Catholics, we believe it is God working through the priest, not the priest on his own merits, that makes confession work. Again, Jesus disproves your point because he helps DEFEND a woman who was unjustly condemned, by telling the people that they too are sinners and therefore should not judge her for her actions.

4. You have to realize, the time period in which Bible was written, was still a very patriarchal society. However, again, I ask you to consider Jesus. He was always associating himself with women, (Mary Magdelene who was a prostitute, the Samaritan woman at the well, etc.). The New Testament especially is filled with parables about Jesus treating women as not only equal, but often times even more virtuous than men. The reason why men were chosen for the more "leadership" roles is again, due to the time period. Again, Catholics do not believe women are somehow inferior in any way.

5. Your final issues, which I will address in order. Catholics do not believe sex is bad. Again, another common fallacy. Sex is a gift from God and allows for a man and woman to grow closer together and become one person. Furthermore, it is how we reproduce, which is a miracle in it of itself. We think extra-marital sex is immoral because we believe sex is more than simply pleasure. Gluttony is immoral because it treats food as more important than God. Anything in excess is unhealthy. Being gay is also not a sin, but only when one acts on it. Don't agree? I understand if you don't, however, homosexual acts do not just violate Catholicism, but many other religions and time periods as well. Also, I would also direct you towards the tenets of Natural Law. Homosexual acts violate nature, in that it does not yield offspring. There are more reasons, but to clarify. We don't hate gay people. We hate the sin of gay acts, not the person. What do you mean by enjoying life? Hell, I'm a Catholic and I enjoy life! :p

Sorry for the length, but I hope this helps clear some things up. Thanks for the response!

What I most dislike the most is the politics of it, which is probably at the root of it.
As you mentioned catholic politics, I'm telling you something that will probably make you hate catholicism even more (or perhaps you won't be surprised...): For almost half a century, Portugal was ruled by a right-wing conservative dictatorship strongly supported by the Roman Catholic Church. A married woman couldn't pass the border without her husband's approval, and divorce was not allowed. Not to mention abortion :eek:
Some say the catholic church is compassionate, but what they really are is a bunch of wealthy regressive evildoers (I'm not talking about the catholic people, it's just their leaders :fluffle: )

5. Your final issues, which I will address in order. Catholics do not believe sex is bad. Again, another common fallacy. Sex is a gift from God and allows for a man and woman to grow closer together and become one person. Furthermore, it is how we reproduce, which is a miracle in it of itself. We think extra-marital sex is immoral because we believe sex is more than simply pleasure. Gluttony is immoral because it treats food as more important than God. Anything in excess is unhealthy. Being gay is also not a sin, but only when one acts on it. Don't agree? I understand if you don't, however, homosexual acts do not just violate Catholicism, but many other religions and time periods as well. Also, I would also direct you towards the tenets of Natural Law. Homosexual acts violate nature, in that it does not yield offspring. There are more reasons, but to clarify. We don't hate gay people. We hate the sin of gay acts, not the person. What do you mean by enjoying life? Hell, I'm a Catholic and I enjoy life! :p

Sorry for the length, but I hope this helps clear some things up. Thanks for the response!

Food is more important than God. Come on, it keeps us alive!
I adressed the idea being gay already.
Enjoying life= Cardinal pleasures (too lazy to name them all).
"God 'Fixing Things'"= People praying, asking God to help them win the Amazing Race, or cure cancer, or one of those things.

<Opens book of agnositc sayings> Prove it <Closes book>

Can't prove it today. Hopefully before I die, I will.

<Opens book of agnositc sayings> Prove it <Closes book>
*Snatches book away and skims through it*
Hey, wait a second. This isn't a book! Someone just printed out "Prove it" about 5,000 times and bound it together with duct tape and Chinese Take-out Receipts!

1) You just affirmed my statement. I submit to no one!
2)Obviously I can't prove that God doesn't exist, but no one is capable of proving that he does exist, either, unless he finally pops down to earth to have a press conference.
3) Nothing more to say.
4) I'm neither weak, nor easily led. I don't think one little fairy tale is a testement to the nature of all humans.
5) Since when is sex bad? It's very natural*, and so is eating. As long as sex is consentual, it doesn't hurt anyone. Same goes for acting on homosexuality. And for me, life would be boring and painful if I were to waste it all trying to prove myself to a possibly non-existent entity. I'd rather just live.

*Pretending that God does exist for certain, I'm sure that if he thought sex was a bad thing, he'd find another way to make babies. He could just conjure them, or something. Sex is how we keep our species alive. In the grand scheme of things, sex is real, and marriage is a ridiculous human custom. In many ways, humans are the stupidest animals to walk this earth.

wiser words have yet to be spoken, at least on this thread!

Christians aye? its been around 2000 years and they are still persistant as hell about their messiah coming... contraversial.
Hey if u hate catholics alot read the da vinci code, its a good book and the whole thing undermines the catholic church and its foundations, if your as ignorant to the truth as me you might also believe it...

Also, I would also direct you towards the tenets of Natural Law. Homosexual acts violate nature, in that it does not yield offspring.

Sorry - this is BS reasoning.

Show me this 'natural law' you invoke?

Homosexual acts do not violate nature - since they exist IN nature... thus, they must be 'natural'.

And, as for yielding offspring.... flawed on several levels:

1) Just because a person has homosexual sex, doesn't mean they cannot ALSO have heterosexual sex - which does make babies, yes?

2) Being the father or mother of an infant is NOT the only way to yield offspring to the next generation. In fact, homosexuality INCREASES the prospects for a child - because it has less sibling level competition for resources and security, and because it has greater access to non-parental security.

3) Not all heterosexual sex yields offspring. Fully a third of ALL conceived 'offspring' drop straight through without implanting. If there is a natural law that prevents sex-that-yields-no-offspring, should it not automatically prevent such actions as non-productive sex, coitus interruptus, sex between sterile partners, and homosexuality?

I’m the same way. I have realized it’s my hatred for arbitrary authority.
Agreed

BTW does any one else know the catholic stance on non CATHOLIC's reciving communion

Was just in a weading sat ... and the priest made it VERY clear that non CATHOLICS were NOT to recive communion (and I do mean CATHOLICS ... as in other christians in the weading party were not to recive communion)

That and he had confession AFTER the weading

for everyone

I grew up catholic and I never seen confession being offered like as people were still leaving the church

I don't remember, which one was the one with the shark that explodes?

I wish Adam West were mayor of *my* city.

Actually - Protestantism broke away from Catholicism because they disliked all that they considered 'non-scriptural' about Catholic worship... like a temporal representative of god on earth, dogmatic law, and the veneration of saints.

Whoa, Hoss. Someone may have said this already, but this really depends on which Protestant group you look at. Luther had problems with the temporal representative of God on earth, but I'm pretty sure he was okay with dogmatic law, and I'm positive he was all for veneration of saints. But I have digressed.

First of all . . . snip

Here, Here!

Was just in a weading sat ... and the priest made it VERY clear that non CATHOLICS were NOT to recive communion (and I do mean CATHOLICS ... as in other christians in the weading party were not to recive communion)

We allow those who recognize it as Christ's body and blood to receive it, which includes Eastern Orthodox Christians as well as Catholics. Biblical foundations:

For anyone who eats and drinks ((the Lord's Supper)) without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself.

We're just looking out for everyone. :D

Here, Here!



We allow those who recognize it as Christ's body and blood to receive it, which includes Eastern Orthodox Christians as well as Catholics. Biblical foundations:



We're just looking out for everyone. :D
Well he informed us that ALL non Catholics in the wedding party were to only receive a blessing not partake in receiving communion