Avalon II
16-09-2005, 16:23
This point I stated at the begining of the Coldplay thread but I thought it would be good to discuss it of itself. When commenting on music, I believe that it is perfectly OK to say "I dont like it because its not really my scene" or something to that effect if the genere of said music is outside your taste. However what isn't fair is to say "They're rubbish" and not provide any reasons for why you think that. The reason being is that there is very little music in the world which is objectively bad. Conversely there is very little music that is objectively good. Thus my point is (and I want to see with this how many people agree) is that its wrong (or just stupid) to say about any music "Thats rubbish" or "thats brilliant" without offering any reason.
The reason being is that there is very little music in the world which is objectively bad.
I beg to differ ;)
a music thread cannot be classyfied as such unless it mentions Pink Floyd at least once, oh and agreed....
Pure Metal
16-09-2005, 17:31
i think its relatively justified to objectively state if a particular band is 'rubbish' if you are into the "scene" that the band occupies. ie if you're a metalhead you can objectively argue that, say, marilyn manson's music is rubbish compared to, say, steve vai's or metallica's because you're in the scene and you are providing a basis for why you think its rubbish.
but i agree blanket statements of "its crap" without any backing up is stupid, and even more stupid is saying a type of music you're not into, or know nothing about, is crap.
Hemingsoft
16-09-2005, 17:37
But all must admit, there are a lot of bands in the popular scene who suck when it comes to creating music.
I V Stalin
16-09-2005, 18:24
This point I stated at the begining of the Coldplay thread but I thought it would be good to discuss it of itself. When commenting on music, I believe that it is perfectly OK to say "I dont like it because its not really my scene" or something to that effect if the genere of said music is outside your taste. However what isn't fair is to say "They're rubbish" and not provide any reasons for why you think that. The reason being is that there is very little music in the world which is objectively bad. Conversely there is very little music that is objectively good. Thus my point is (and I want to see with this how many people agree) is that its wrong (or just stupid) to say about any music "Thats rubbish" or "thats brilliant" without offering any reason.
This is indeed true. However, the majority of people who dislike 'popular' music (by which I mean chart pop) cannot justify 'it's crap' as a reason for disliking it on a purely technical level. Technically, most chart pop is good - the singers can, for the most part, sing fairly well, and the music isn't just performed by some busker the recording studio found on the street. The problem lies in the fact that the music is bland, with no real emotional value at all. Likening music to art (and music is an artform), good music is the same as a good painting. I could do a picture of a chair, and it would have the same artistic resonance as whatever #1 is at the moment (and a quick check reveals it's the Pussycat Dolls ft Busta Rhymes) ie. none. There's no meaning behind my hypothetical picture of a chair, and likewise there is no meaning behind 'Don't Cha' (that's the song). Therefore, it is rubbish. Manufactured, disposable crap. Just like my chair.
On the other hand, properly good music, like a properly good painting, does have meaning beyond just a series of notes with lyrics. Music is designed to converse and react with the human mind. If it doesn't do that, then in my eyes, it's not music, it's just crap. Take a look (or listen) at some albums regularly cited as classic - Dark Side of the Moon, Exile on Main Street, Led Zeppelin's fourth, Sgt. Pepper's... - their contents aren't just notes strung together. Each song on those albums, or in DSOTM's case, the whole thing, should affect you. If not, you're not listening properly.
Rubbish music from a technical viewpoint is widespread - there's a reason there's a lot of unsigned bands out there. It's because they can't play/sing/write for shit. But there's also a lot of rubbish music that is rubbish because it doesn't convey any meaning or emotion in either the music or the lyrics.