NationStates Jolt Archive


Next Stop: Syria (Neocons aren't through - not by a long-shot)

Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:18
NEXT STOP: SYRIA
NEOCONS AREN'T THROUGH - NOT BY A LONG-SHOT

By: Justin Raimondo


The pressure on Syria is being increased, and I wouldn't be (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j050703.html) at all surprised (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j091903.html) to see a "border incident (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&rls=GGLG%2CGGLG%3A2005-22%2CGGLG%3Aen&q=border%2Bincident%2Bsyria%2Biraq)" involving a shoot-out between Syrian and American troops. We may be in for a new Tonkin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_of_Tonkin_Resolution) Gulf (http://www.luminet.net/~tgort/tonkin.htm), leading to an extension of our "liberatory (http://tinyrevolution.com/mt-static/images/opportunity2.jpg)" efforts in the Middle East.

We already have U.S. Ambassador (i.e., Imperial Viceroy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viceroy)) Zalmay Khalilzad (http://rightweb.irc-online.org/ind/khalilzad/khalilzad.php) making threats (http://www.manoramaonline.com/servlet/ContentServer?pagename=manorama/MmArticle/CommonFullStory&cid=1126496427600&c=MmArticle&p=1002194839100&count=10&colid=1002258272837&channel=News), and this, coupled with the ongoing frame-up (http://www.antiwar.com/blog/comments.php?id=1885_0_1_0_C) of Syria over the assassination (http://antiwar.com/article.php?articleid=5093) of Rafik Hariri (http://www.rhariri.com/), will soon put Damascus in the spotlight. Readers of the "Clean Break (http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article1438.htm)" scenario co-authored by Richard Perle (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50704-2004Aug31.html) and his gang (http://www.counterpunch.org/nimmo02232004.html) in Washington will be familiar with the strategic rationale advanced by the (http://rightweb.irc-online.org/ind/abrams/abrams.php) Likudniks (http://rightweb.irc-online.org/ind/hadley/hadley.php) now in positions (http://rightweb.irc-online.org/ind/libby/libby.php) of power in the Bush administration: the road to Damascus (http://www.amconmag.com/03_24_03/cover.html), always considered by Israel the front line (http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Threats_to_Israel/Syria.html) in their battle against the Arab world, runs through Baghdad (http://www.globalpolicy.org/empire/intervention/2004/0308damascus.htm), and this latest propaganda campaign is similar to the one (http://www.antiwar.com/orig/zeese.php?articleid=6409) preceding the invasion of Iraq. Israeli pressure on the U.S. to restore their lost hegemony in Lebanon, disarm Hezbollah, and overthrow (http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1424833,00.html) Syrian strongman Bashar Assad has been unrelenting, and the Amen Corner (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j012403.html) in the U.S. – yes, that's Michael Young (http://www.reason.com/myoung/myoungbio.shtml) of Reason magazine, among others – is barking and yelping with its usual lack of restraint. Speaking of Young, you have only to peruse his most recent screed (http://www.techcentralstation.com/083005C.html) for Tech Central Station – a favored watering hole of liberventionists (http://www.lewrockwell.com/gregory/gregory51.html) – to get a sense of just how murky and unconvincing the case targeting Syria as Hariri's assassin is. Speculating on the contents of a secret preliminary report issued by the UN investigator on the death of Hariri, Young avers:

"The preliminary report did not address the substance of what [UN chief investigator Detlev] Mehlis and his team had found, though it did offer details allowing for some educated guesses."

The anti-libertarian Young is "educated (http://www.antiwar.com/blog/index.php?id=P1850)" by his enthusiasm (http://www.reason.com/links/links022405.shtml) for U.S. military power as a "liberating (http://www.reason.com/0501/cr.my.imperial.shtml)" force in the world, and his "guesses (http://www.slate.com/id/2113565/)" have consistently served his own agenda: one commenter (http://highclearing.com/index.php/archives/2005/09/07/4612) on Jim Henley's blog trenchantly described Young as "a kinder gentler Aounist. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Patriotic_Movement)"

Ignoring the repeated (http://www.mmorning.com/articleC.asp?Article=2822&CategoryID=2) statements (http://www.boston.com/news/world/middleeast/articles/2005/09/13/syria_agrees_to_allow_questions_in_un_probe/) by Mehlis that no Syrian is on his list of suspects, Young speculates that Assad himself is implicated – again, based on nothing but vague "rumors" and "press reports" (from the notoriously unreliable government-controlled Kuwaiti media).

Young's piece is filled with brazen rumor-mongering and embarrassing phrases – or, at least, they would be embarrassing if Young bothered to hide his propagandistic take on events in Lebanon, which he doesn't.

"While one must await the final report, the latest rumors in Beirut suggest…"

"Yet another rumor difficult to corroborate, published without attribution in Internet and press reports…"

Another "rumor" (i.e., lie) pushed by Young (http://www.reason.com/hitandrun/2005/02/did_you_say_no.shtml), and subsequently (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4103374.stm) abandoned, was the assertion that the bomb that killed Hariri was planted in the middle of the road, and that this (somehow) proved that Syrian intelligence was behind the plot, because, you see, Syria had absolute hegemony over the streets of Beirut, and, in any case, no assassination could have taken place without Syria's assent. When this "why don't we do it in the road?" theory was debunked (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=4958), Young never acknowledged (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=4861) that the evidence had destroyed (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:KRfEp6nU0j0J:www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=4933%2Bhariri%2B%22michael%2Byoung%22%2Bsite:antiwar.com&hl=en) his neat little theory – and that his sources (http://www.antiwar.com/blog/comments.php?id=P1841_0_1_0_C) were somewhat dubious. He merely moved on to another talking point. A typical neocon, he; that Young has found a home at Reason magazine, once a libertarian periodical and now the plaything of heedless hedonists (http://www.antiwar.com/blog/comments.php?id=P2314_0_1_45), is just more evidence that we have entered a Bizarro World (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j021302.html) universe, where "libertarians" act like they're employed by the Office of Strategic Influence (http://archives.cnn.com/2002/US/02/19/gen.strategic.influence/), frolic (http://www.reason.com/hitandrun/2005/09/reason_vega_fun.shtml) with a "former" Trotskyite (http://hurryupharry.bloghouse.net/archives/2005/05/17/galloway_and_hitchens_exchange_views.php) in Vegas while playing the slot machines, and hope for yet another big windfall (http://www.mediatransparency.com/recipientgrants.php?recipientID=286) from some neocon foundation.

I might add that the equally clueless Hooman Majd (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hooman-majd/our-man-in-baghdad_b_7257.html), over at the Huffington Post, doesn't believe the threats from the U.S. represent anything more substantial than hot air. Like so many at Huffpuff, his heart is in the right place, but his head isn't screwed on right. In response to Khalilzad's ominous remark to the effect that "all options are on the table" with regard to dealing with Syria, Mr. Majd has this to say:

"Sorry Mr. Ambassador, I don't think the line works anymore. There may have been a time when U.S. threats were meaningful, but they sure aren't now. The Iranian response to the same threat issued by President Bush some months ago was to laugh it off, or more recently in the wake of 'not all options are on the table' Katrina, to threaten (http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3667) right back. Perhaps the administration may want to start engaging in some diplomacy (what one assumes is an ambassador's actual job). If we want Syria's help (or even Iran's help) in pacifying Iraq, then berating them in public and issuing threats is hardly the way to bring them around, particularly since most of the world, if not most Americans, have seen that the emperor (along with many of his subjects on the Gulf Coast) has no clothes."

Sorry, Mr. Majd, but you just don't get it, do you? This administration will stop at nothing – nothing! (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=6734) – to advance its Middle Eastern agenda, and that agenda consists of a single simple word: conquest (http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf) [.pdf]. Anyone who really believes that Hurricane Katrina (http://news.google.com/news?q=Hurricane%20Katrina&hl=en&lr=&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2005-22,GGLG:en&sa=N&tab=wn) will divert this administration and the neocon cabal (http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?030512fa_fact) that has seized control of our foreign policy from pursuing their dreams of Empire is a fool (http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/7896BBD4-28AB-48BA-A949-2096A02F864D.htm). A new conflict will divert attention away from the incompetence (http://www.antiwar.com/blog/comments.php?id=P2355_0_1_0) surrounding the response to Katrina: the devastation and Bush's clueless (http://www.blah3.com/article.php?story=20050903214041794) efforts to ameliorate it will only encourage the White House to leave us with a lasting legacy of fresh horrors in the Middle East.

Why are we in Iraq? (http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=7034) All the better to go after Syria, then Iran. Saudi Arabia (http://www.antiwar.com/justin/j080702.html), too, is "on the table" – and the feast has just begun.

Source (http://www.etherzone.com/2005/raim091405.shtml)

So, what do you think? Will there be a war with Syria?

Discuss.
Keruvalia
14-09-2005, 18:19
So, what do you think? Will there be a war with Syria?


Is there oil there?
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:21
Is there oil there?

I don't think so, but what does that have to do with anything? There's no oil in Afghanistan, either- at least, not to my knowledge. The goal of the neocons is not oil, my friend, but empire.
Drunk commies deleted
14-09-2005, 18:21
No, there won't be a war with Syria. Bush's got his hands full with Afghanistan and Iraq.
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:23
No, there won't be a war with Syria. Bush's got his hands full with Afghanistan and Iraq.

Don't get your hopes up. :(
The Black Forrest
14-09-2005, 18:26
I don't think so, but what does that have to do with anything? There's no oil in Afghanistan, either- at least, not to my knowledge. The goal of the neocons is not oil, my friend, but empire.

Actually there is the possibility of the pipeline through Afghanistan which makes it profitable. But they have to deal with those pesky Talibaners......
The Black Forrest
14-09-2005, 18:28
Don't get your hopes up. :(

Problem with manpower.

Now if it was shown that all the fighting was from Jihadis and they were coming over from Syria then it might be worth it to attack simply because the jihadis would start fighting there and it would take the pressure of Iraq.

However, the Jihadi numbers are not that big.
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:28
Actually there is the possibility of the pipeline through Afghanistan which makes it profitable. But they have to deal with those pesky Talibaners......

Again, neocons aren't interested in profit, but empire.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:29
Problem with manpower.

Who knows, maybe there'll be a new draft. That might sound absurd now, but you never know...
Drunk commies deleted
14-09-2005, 18:35
Don't get your hopes up. :(
Don't beleive everything you read.

Bush can't just pull more soldiers out of his ass. The troops are busy right now. Even if bush had the soldiers he'd have a hell of a time getting the congress to go along with him right now. Syria's safe for several years.
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:36
Don't beleive everything you read.

Bush can't just pull more soldiers out of his ass. The troops are busy right now. Even if bush had the soldiers he'd have a hell of a time getting the congress to go along with him right now. Syria's safe for several years.

Since when the hell has Bush cared what Congress thinks?
The Black Forrest
14-09-2005, 18:42
Again, neocons aren't interested in profit, but empire.

http://www.newamericancentury.org/

Ahh buy you over look the fact that they go hand in hand. Having an empire means having wealth.....
The Black Forrest
14-09-2005, 18:43
Since when the hell has Bush cared what Congress thinks?

Since Congress has that nasty ability to say "NO" to extra money requests for the troops.....
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:44
Ahh buy you over look the fact that they go hand in hand. Having an empire means having wealth.....

True enough, but that doesn't mean a geologically poor country would be safe from colonization.
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:45
Since Congress has that nasty ability to say "NO" to extra money requests for the troops.....

Congress is full of sissies. They wouldn't say no to him. If Bush told them to bend over and lick the dog crap off his boots, they'd do it without blinking or hesitating.
Eutrusca
14-09-2005, 18:48
NEXT STOP: SYRIA
NEOCONS AREN'T THROUGH - NOT BY A LONG-SHOT

By: Justin Raimondo

Source (http://www.etherzone.com/2005/raim091405.shtml)

So, what do you think? Will there be a war with Syria?

Discuss.
YOU discuss it. I refuse to accept as an unbiased source anything labelled "AntiWar.com: your best source for antiwar news, viewpoints and activities."
Drunk commies deleted
14-09-2005, 18:50
Since when the hell has Bush cared what Congress thinks?
Congress has to vote to authorize military action and votes on the money that can be spent. Bush does care alot about congress. They hold the purse strings.
Drunk commies deleted
14-09-2005, 18:52
True enough, but that doesn't mean a geologically poor country would be safe from colonization.
Sure, because what's more fun than owning a barren shithole with no money and people who like to blow their cars up near you.
Anti-Che Heroes
14-09-2005, 18:52
YOU discuss it. I refuse to accept as an unbiased source anything labelled "AntiWar.com: your best source for antiwar news, viewpoints and activities."

All sources are biased. I have never in my entire life come across a source that wasn't biased.
Melkor Unchained
14-09-2005, 18:52
I think if Bush's plan to get the troops out of Iraq by 2006 actually comes to fruition, that gives him enough time to get ankle deep in Syria [or Iran], facilitating the need for another warhound-type pseudo-fascist "Republican" president.

It is not, however, "for oil" like the liberals love to claim. If it was, there's be a lot more of it in this country by now. If we did blag any, it went into our tanks, not our reserves. I come dangerously close to losing my mind when liberal ignoramuses run around crying about 'blood for oil' and all that stupid shit: the Iraq war wasn't about oil, it was about Israel. They might hate us, but Iraq has never been a major player in international terrorism [that may be about to change, though], and it's painfully ovbious that Israel--not the US-- would have been Saddam's first target.

That said, I can't say for sure whether Syria or Iran will be the next target.

And no, the goal isn't 'empire,' if it was, we'd occupy the land indefinately. While we may be building a few permanent bases there, it's a common practice. We have permanent bases in Iceland, Germany, South Korea, Cuba, the Philippenes, and a host of other countries. That doesn't mean we control any of them.

Regardless of what the motive is, this entire situation is an enormous waste of everyone's time and money. The governments we're trying to save will just descend back into chaos as they have been doing for years before there even was a United States.
Ollieland
14-09-2005, 19:19
YOU discuss it. I refuse to accept as an unbiased source anything labelled "AntiWar.com: your best source for antiwar news, viewpoints and activities."

See your own thread. I refuse to accept as an unbiased source anything labelled "I got sent this by e-mail".