NationStates Jolt Archive

Both the Australian Federal Police and ASIO have repeatedly rejected the use of torture for gaining information from suspects. The Chief of the Federal Police citing the information was "unreliable"[1] and "...I just don't believe any democratic nation should resort to that"[2].

Australian High Court Judges have stated that thought there is a lack of an Australian Bill of Rights and no mention of specific rights in Commonwealth Constitution, that the implied rights of a democratic nation indicate that torture could not be legalised or allowed under any circumstances.[3]

One former Justice went as far as to state "...whilst the loss of Australian live is a great tragedy, the loss of our freedom is an even greater crime".[4]

Not only have Australian Courts and Law Enforcement Agencies rejected torture on legal grounds, ASIO has found evidence presented to it from torture or unconventional means used at Git mo to be unreliable or entirely fabricated.[5]

Given that a nation with no Bill of Rights, no specific right in it's Constitution finds torture and unconventional interrogation unacceptable and information gathered unreliable, I have to wonder the logic of those using it in the US...

[1] www.justice4jack.com/jackbroadsheetv2_p4.PDF
[2]http://www.ag.gov.au/agd/WWW/ministerruddockhome.nsf/Page/RWP7546CD03855E60ABCA2570640080F973
Repeated on "Hypotheticals" I am currently looking for a transcript.
[3]www.gtcentre.unsw.edu.au/ News/docs/2005_ASIOReviewSubmission.doc
www.smh.com.au/specials/security/
[4]Again from "Hypotheticals"
[5]www.australianreview.net/
Suggested further reading: www.thewhitlaminstitute.org.au

One former Justice went as far as to state "...whilst the loos of Australian live is a great tragedy, the loss of our freedom is an even greater crime".[4]

Yes, the toilets (loos) must be quite filthy, especially the public ones. Death to the toilets! ;p

Beside, torture is never useful as a means of getting the truth. All it's really meant to do is to get the kind of reactions and behaviours you want. And that doesn't include information gathering since torture tends to result in the subject telling the torturer whatever they want to hear, whether it has any relation to the truth or not.

Yes, the toilets (loos) must be quite filthy, especially the public ones. Death to the toilets! ;p.
Cheers, I forgot to check my spelling. It should be ok now.

you see, we do not have a bill of rights because we are (generally) sensible enough not to need one.

you see, we do not have a bill of rights because we are (generally) sensible enough not to need one.

well in the states it turns out that we not only need one, we actually should probably mandate that new specific rights and protected bits of freedom be thought up and and written down every five years just to make sure we don't miss anything. and they'd have to be pretty damn specific too.

the public here isn't exactly fond of freedom, except in the realm of meaningless abstractions. they fear and despise actual free people and look forward to the day when the state is an all-powerful leviathan that cares nothing for anyone.

The Australian Security and Intelligence Organisation (ASIO) today arrested, detained and intend to deport an American that is a legal visiter in Australia. His crime: A series of street theater proformances that cast asperations on the motivations for the Iraq war. Our government at work.

Now, the Australian government holds children in detention and have started deporting Americans because of the security risk they pose, so it begs the question; does the Australian government actually know what a terrorist is?

The Australian Security and Intelligence Organisation (ASIO) today arrested, detained and intend to deport an American that is a legal visiter in Australia. His crime: A series of street theater proformances that cast asperations on the motivations for the Iraq war. Our government at work.

Now, the Australian government holds children in detention and have started deporting Americans because of the security risk they pose, so it begs the question; does the Australian government actually know what a terrorist is?

So much for speech in Australia. Why is he being deported for doing street theater that wasn't a threat to anyone?

You mean to tell me that Australia only recntly banned torture? WTF? Isn't that at least 50 years behind the rest of the western world?

So much for speech in Australia. Why is he being deported for doing street theater that wasn't a threat to anyone?

Because in Australia you can be deported for no particular reason other than the government doesn't like you.

3 points for Australia. :)

You mean to tell me that Australia only recntly banned torture? WTF? Isn't that at least 50 years behind the rest of the western world?

You forgot America.

Because in Australia you can be deported for no particular reason other than the government doesn't like you.

No more democracy in Australia. Howard's government just shunted through the Telstra sale bill in one week, a sign they are going to abuse every bit of power they now have.

The Australian Security and Intelligence Organisation (ASIO) today arrested, detained and intend to deport an American that is a legal visiter in Australia. His crime: A series of street theater proformances that cast asperations on the motivations for the Iraq war. Our government at work.

Now, the Australian government holds children in detention and have started deporting Americans because of the security risk they pose, so it begs the question; does the Australian government actually know what a terrorist is?
I'm trying to remember if you stole this from Rove Live or The Glass House

Egh, the "no torture of terrorists" thing is a good thing. But it's a drop of water in a sea of sewage, unfortunately. Australia (my country) is moving closer and closer to becoming a police state.

A series of small choics that seem perfectly reasonable at the time, and before you know it, your reading habits are being monitored for possible 'terrorist' literature and people are being detained without charge for weeks because their disgruntled neighbour decided to get back at them for having a loud party one night by reporting 'suspicious behaviour' to the authorities.

It's a sad time for this nation. I hope the Australian people wake up realise what they're allowing to happen before it's too late.

I hate to be cliche, but seriously, if we keep giving up our freedom for this kind of dubious security, the "terrorists are winning."

Because in Australia you can be deported for no particular reason other than the government doesn't like you.

Why aren't I being given a free holiday, then? :mad:

people are being detained without charge for weeks because their disgruntled neighbour decided to get back at them for having a loud party one night by reporting 'suspicious behaviour' to the authorities.


There's something wrong with that? (not very fond of my neighbors :D )

If the targeted terrorist is part of a cell, torture or any other interogation method will yield only very little to no info. It's clever denouncing torture when it's to your advantage since it isn't worth the effort anyway.

Though it does my heart good to hear their suffering.

Why aren't I being given a free holiday, then? :mad:

I'm sure they'll sort something out eventually, comrade.

I'm sure they'll sort something out eventually, comrade.

Cool. I wonder if they'll give me a choice of location? Hm. Then again, I bet I don't, and it'll be somewhere like North Korea. :(

There's something wrong with that? (not very fond of my neighbors :D )

Heh. Neither am I. One of my neighbours once called me a dirty pagan. I wasn't really offended, being a pagan and having been working in the garden for a while when he said it, so I was, literally, a dirty pagan. But should I have had him arrested as a suspected terrorist?

Heh. Neither am I. One of my neighbours once called me a dirty pagan. I wasn't really offended, being a pagan and having been working in the garden for a while when he said it, so I was, literally, a dirty pagan. But should I have had him arrested as a suspected terrorist?
Yes. I was thinking about reporting whoever keeps leaving their dog droppings on my lawn.