NationStates Jolt Archive

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?

Today's "Yesterday's News/Bush flame" brought to you by Kejott.

Today's "Yesterday's News/Bush flame" brought to you by Kejott.

Actually this isn't a flame, I'm truly trying to understand why he did what he did. Honestly, I am. It would truly appreciate it if someone told me. No sarcasm what so ever.

That's why I wrote "Yesterday's News/Bush flame" and not "Bush flame/Yesterday's news"

First off, there's no way this thread doesn't turn into an anti-Bush thing. Or at the very least, anti-Bush versus pro-Bush. Especially when you start off with such an anti-Bush pretense (certain excuses you won't accept, etc).

Second off, it happened 4 years ago, and that was one of the least significant events of September 11th.

Stupification? Expectation? No one knows but the big Dubya himself.

I like to think he was just caught by surprise. I mean, who in their right mind attacks the U.S? Suicide by Superpower...
But if he knew about the attacks, that seven minutes could have been how long it took him to concoct his plan to make the American people believe a war in Iraq was necessary.
But that can't be true, because no person is that cold blooded.......right?

I'm not trying to defend him or anything, but I'm sure that some portion of that time accounts for dumbfounded shock. I mean, here's the guy who controls the most powerful nation in the world, and last he checked (let's not get into the details now; this is a generalized statement), everything was a-ok and he's sitting in the middle of one of the most non-hostile places on Earth (a school with little kids), and suddenly he hears that, hey, guess what? We just got bitch-slapped by someone.

This whole thread is 4 years too late.

That's why I wrote "Yesterday's News/Bush flame" and not "Bush flame/Yesterday's news"

First off, there's no way this thread doesn't turn into an anti-Bush thing. Or at the very least, anti-Bush versus pro-Bush. Especially when you start off with such an anti-Bush pretense (certain excuses you won't accept, etc).

Second off, it happened 4 years ago, and that was one of the least significant events of September 11th.

Then maybe I should have wrote it in a different manner. I'm just attempting to get people's opinions about why he sat there. That's all. So what if it's yesterday's news? It still happened and it most certainly isn't the least significant event. I didn't want to turn this into an anti-bush thread but I don't trust anyone to lead a country who sits in a chair for 7 minutes while any number of things can be happening to the country. I used to support bush before he did that and before he invaded Iraq. Those two actions turned me off COMPLETELY. I'm just trying to understand why someone in a position of such responsibility would sit by while the country is under attack. It could have been ANYTHING.

This whole thread is 4 years too late.

Your point being? Nobody can discuss things that have happened previously anymore? That's news to me.

Picture this. You are the secret service. You are in charge of protecting the most powerful man on the planet. The nation gets attacked. Do you let him run out the door and head back to the place one of the planes just crashed? Do you even let him walk outside without making damn sure its clear? How long does that take? Grow up people. I would NEVER assume I am better at security than the secret service.

Picture this. You are the secret service. You are in charge of protecting the most powerful man on the planet. The nation gets attacked. Do you let him run out the door and head back to the place one of the planes just crashed? Do you even let him walk outside without making damn sure its clear? How long does that take? Grow up people. I would NEVER assume I am better at security than the secret service.

See! That's what I'm talking about, opinions like this are why I started the thread. *applauds* Take note from Sick Dreams.

Picture this. You are the secret service. You are in charge of protecting the most powerful man on the planet. The nation gets attacked. Do you let him run out the door and head back to the place one of the planes just crashed? Do you even let him walk outside without making damn sure its clear? How long does that take? Grow up people. I would NEVER assume I am better at security than the secret service.

I fail to see how you could connect the Secret Service (SS), to a 7 minute silence. Unless they were also responsible for gagging the president.

Just didn't know what to do I guess...

Like when you're a 7 year old and you find out Santa isn't real (oops, did I just say that?)...what do you do...you're just in shock for a while...then you cry...a lot...

No, I don't think it's wrong to compare Bush to a 7 yr old.

i agree i mean. shouldn't he had said something.

Shock, probably followed by who/why, then what-am-I-going-to-do-about-it, followed by what-am-I-going-to-say-about-it. I mean come on, no one can honestly say they weren't shocked.

And does it really matter? Would any lives have been saved if Bush had leapt into action and issued a statement immediately? Nope.

Exactly. Absolutely none. But we only know that now...Bush couldn't possibly have known that at the time, could he.

No, I don't think it's wrong to compare Bush to a 7 yr old.

A 7 yr old might get offended by that statement.

This whole thread is 4 years too late.

And a dollar short.

Foir the love of God, GIVE IT A REST ALREADY. :headbang: :headbang:

What exactly was he told? Did he hear the words "we've been attacked"? Or was it, "plane crash in New York"? Something along those lines.

The Secret Service issue was brought up about not moving him around.

He was also waiting for more info. You can't make a rational desicion based on one sentence.

And, the big point, what should he have done?

And, no, "Something" or "anything" are not acceptable answers.

Like when you're a 7 year old and you find out Santa isn't real
What?! He isn't? :(



Ahaahaha gotcha!

I was under the impression that he kept reading, which I have no problem with - it would have been much worse to run out of a room filled with kids in a panic about something that you could not fix. The only reason to leave would have been to avoid being the next target. Just my two cents.

Maybe the reason he didnt do anything is that he is just a puppet of the secret service and the oil companies, and unless they tell him exactly what to do and say he doesnt know what to do.

i agree i mean. shouldn't he had said something.

He did say something. I saw the speech at the school. That's right. He gave a speech at the school then he high tailed it outta there and flew to Barksdale then to Offut and back to DC (over his Secret Service objections I might add)

As for the 7 minute wait, you can't go running out the door in a middle of a crisis. That is not how a leader acts. A leader acts calmly. Also, he was with a bunch of children. If they see the president running out the door.....what would you think at that age?

What exactly was he told? Did he hear the words "we've been attacked"? Or was it, "plane crash in New York"? Something along those lines.

From my understanding, all thathe was told was that a plane crashed in NYC at the World Trade Center. Then he got word of the 2nd hit.

The Secret Service issue was brought up about not moving him around.

He was also waiting for more info. You can't make a rational desicion based on one sentence.

And, the big point, what should he have done?

And, no, "Something" or "anything" are not acceptable answers.

I think he did the right thing by staying. He was actually safer there than he was in DC!

From my understanding, all thathe was told was that a plane crashed in NYC at the World Trade Center. Then he got word of the 2nd hit.



I think he did the right thing by staying. He was actually safer there than he was in DC!


My understanding, is that (particularly the footage of Bush sitting stock-still) is at that moment, he was told what had happened to both towers, and that indeed, the nation was under attack.


So....while I think Bush is the absolute worst presidnt of the past 100 years...

I cant say anything about the 7 minute thing..

It probably consisted of this:

"Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?"

I cant say I wouldnt have either.

Picture this. You are the secret service. You are in charge of protecting the most powerful man on the planet. The nation gets attacked. Do you let him run out the door and head back to the place one of the planes just crashed? Do you even let him walk outside without making damn sure its clear? How long does that take? Grow up people. I would NEVER assume I am better at security than the secret service.

No I wouldnt just let him 'run out the door'. I would throw a Kevlar blanket over the top of him and whisk him away. I mean, the school was a well-publicized presidential stop that day. I would at least take him out of the school so that if he WERE a target for the terrorists, the kids wouldn't all die, too.

In a situation like that, the President is NOT in charge of his own safety, but the Secret Service IS. So the explanations I see are as follows:

1. The Secret Service and Rumsfeld, Ashcroft, Cheney, and other NeoCons were behind the plot and knew that Bush wasn't a target. For the plan to fully evolve, they needed that few extra minutes, so they made him sit there (and he was hanging around the school for over a half hour, not just that seven minutes in front of the kids.)

2. With the military exercises planned for that morning simulating a plane being crashed into the Pentagon, there was truly confusion about whether the 'attacks' were part of the drill or not.

3. The entire Secret Service, CIA, DoD, FBI, NORAD, the USAF and all supporting staff went brain dead at the same time.

If anyone has read the Northwoods project papers, scenario #1 seems rather plausible.

If you haven't, then go to http://www.aztlan.net/northwoods.htm

Maybe the reason he didnt do anything is that he is just a puppet of the secret service and the oil companies, and unless they tell him exactly what to do and say he doesnt know what to do.


Yeah, add that option to my post.

This whole thread is 4 years too late.
well, it's better discussed now than when the event happened. when it happened there was more important things to worry about. now we can pick on the details :p

My understanding, is that (particularly the footage of Bush sitting stock-still) is at that moment, he was told what had happened to both towers, and that indeed, the nation was under attack.

That was when the 2nd plane hit. WHen the first one happened, no one knew what was going on. Everyone thought it was an accident until the 2nd plane slammed into the South Tower.

So....while I think Bush is the absolute worst presidnt of the past 100 years...

You forgot about Carter. He was much worse than Bush.

I cant say anything about the 7 minute thing..

Then why are you commenting on it?

No I wouldnt just let him 'run out the door'. I would throw a Kevlar blanket over the top of him and whisk him away. I mean, the school was a well-publicized presidential stop that day. I would at least take him out of the school so that if he WERE a target for the terrorists, the kids wouldn't all die, too.

Well that wouldn't do the kids anygood seeing that occur. Rule of thumb in regards to kids. Don't cause them panic. IF the Secret Service did that, then you would've paniced the kids. Anyone can tell you that. As for the school, he was safer there than he was in DC. They weren't interested in killing the President. If they were, they would've hit the school where he was at. Their targets were economic and military in nature. That was why they hit the WTC and the Pentagon.

In a situation like that, the President is NOT in charge of his own safety, but the Secret Service IS. So the explanations I see are as follows:

True. They wanted him out of there but they wanted to make sure the pathway was safe. That was why it took him so long to leave the school in general. Yes, he spent 7 minutes in a Classroom but he spent abit more time than that at the school in general. The Secret Service had to secure the quickest route to the Airport and that took a few minutes to do.

1. The Secret Service and Rumsfeld, Ashcroft, Cheney, and other NeoCons were behind the plot and knew that Bush wasn't a target. For the plan to fully evolve, they needed that few extra minutes, so they made him sit there (and he was hanging around the school for over a half hour, not just that seven minutes in front of the kids.)

Nice conspiracy theory that has no facts in them.

2. With the military exercises planned for that morning simulating a plane being crashed into the Pentagon, there was truly confusion about whether the 'attacks' were part of the drill or not.

I doubt an exercise like this would be "live fire"! Can I see proof of this exercise please.

3. The entire Secret Service, CIA, DoD, FBI, NORAD, the USAF and all supporting staff went brain dead at the same time.

Interesting theory. One I can actually believe minus the Secret Service.

If anyone has read the Northwoods project papers, scenario #1 seems rather plausible.

If you haven't, then go to http://www.aztlan.net/northwoods.htm


Sorry. It isn't plausible. For one, it would've came out long before now. Secrets like that don't stay secret for long.

Sorry. It isn't plausible. For one, it would've came out long before now. Secrets like that don't stay secret for long.
You mean like who Deep Throat is?
The location of Osama?

Secrets stay secret just fine if people are actually trying to keep it secret. Most things that are "exposed" aren't secrets so much as somebody with the right knowledge set coming across documents that have been seen by plenty of people before who just didn't make the connection.

Picture this. You are the secret service. You are in charge of protecting the most powerful man on the planet. The nation gets attacked. Do you let him run out the door and head back to the place one of the planes just crashed? Do you even let him walk outside without making damn sure its clear? How long does that take? Grow up people. I would NEVER assume I am better at security than the secret service.
And entirely wrong. He would have been far safer up in the air then down on the ground.

On 9/11 I was working with a contractor that owned a resturaunt and a cafe that were next to each other. We were putting a secong story deck on a developemnet just south of his shop. Mark was consistantly late for work so when I showed up and he was'nt at the shop I thought nothing of it. I grabbed a cup of coffe lit a smoke and asked Keith the barrista what was up. Deadpan he said, " The twin towers are blown up and someone drove a plane into the pentagon." In my defence I have to say that a)Keith is kind of a flake. b) It was the fiorst cup of coffe c) Keith also plays a lot of RPGs so it seemed more likely that he was talking about a game than real life.
By cup three Mark STILL had'nt shown up for work. I ask Keith if he'd seem Mark. He says he's in the resturaunt. So I go across and opened the door and there on the big screen by the bar was the towers falling down. I stand there and gaped like an idiot for at least 5 minutes. I think something like that was what happened to the pResident....

You mean like who Deep Throat is?
The location of Osama?

Secrets stay secret just fine if people are actually trying to keep it secret. Most things that are "exposed" aren't secrets so much as somebody with the right knowledge set coming across documents that have been seen by plenty of people before who just didn't make the connection.


Err... I think they found out who Deep Throat was. I'll see if I can find a link.

I can't say exactly what was going through his mind. I can only imagine what I would do in that situation. He is told of the first plane crash. OK this could have been an accident. First reports I heard of it on the radio reported that it was probably a private plane. Then he gets a report of the second crash into the other tower. It is now obvious that this is an attack. As president he has major considerations and plans to make. If he steps out of that classroom he is going to be hammered from all sides with questions and suggestions. By staying there and reading to the children (an exercise that most adults can do without much conscious thought) in peace, he was allowed to control his shock and rage, formulate ideas and plans, and then walk out with a grip on the situation. I'm impressed he was able to collect himself in only 7 minutes. I was a walking zombie for weeks afterwards and became physically ill with shock. Earlier today, watching a mini-documentary of news video in chronological order made me nauseated, grief stricken, and enraged all over again.

Tropical Montana If your conspiracy theory that Bush and others plotted the attacks of 9/11 to eventually lead to a convoluted excuse overthrow Saddam, rubbish!! Since when is the attempt by one national leader to assasinate another nation's leader not justification in itself for the declaration of war and the overthrow of the assassin's government? If Bush had had Iraq in mind, he didn't need to kill thousands of people to make his move.

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?
Im guessing at first he thought it wasnt serious enough to stop learning how to read.

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?


Who the fuck cares ?

Who the fuck cares ?
Because he's our president and he has more important things to do when we're 'under attack' then sit around talking to kids.

Ummm Like what ?

Im guessing at first he thought it wasnt serious enough to stop learning how to read.

This person reminds me of a quieter version of Caribel...

What could he have done in those seven minutes ...or even twenty minutes...or even an hour ..that would have made even the most minute bit of a difference ? Especially to you !

Ummm Like what ?
How about planning? How about doing some moral boosting?

So those people he was reading to were not important enough ? And being calm during a crisis is not setting an example ? And those 15 minutes of planning and moral boosting would have helped who exactly ?
At any rate who the fuck cares ..if it bothered anyone he wouldnt have gotten elected after it .

Im guessing at first he thought it wasnt serious enough to stop learning how to read :)

So those people he was reading to were not important enough ? And being calm during a crisis is not setting an example ? And those 15 minutes of planning and moral boosting would have helped who exactly ?
At any rate who the fuck cares ..if it bothered anyone he wouldnt have gotten elected after it .

He had other places to be. For all he knew, the terrorists might have had another plane heading right towards him. His position is a leadership one, not to sit around in a photo op all day.

Well that wouldn't do the kids anygood seeing that occur. Rule of thumb in regards to kids. Don't cause them panic. IF the Secret Service did that, then you would've paniced the kids. Anyone can tell you that. As for the school, he was safer there than he was in DC. They weren't interested in killing the President. If they were, they would've hit the school where he was at. Their targets were economic and military in nature. That was why they hit the WTC and the Pentagon.

How did they KNOW that the president wasn't a target? If they knew what the targets were, then why didnt they do anything? At the time, they couldn't have known the president wasnt a target, unless it WAS a conspiracy.



Nice conspiracy theory that has no facts in them.

there are plenty of facts. How about the complete LIE that the NORAD timeline was? How about the Bush/Bath/BinLaden connection? How about the connections between the flight schools that taught the terrorists how to fly, the houses that lodged them, and the funds they received to the CIA and other NeoCons? Any single item by itself does not constitute PROOF, but when you start stacking up the facts, the pile is quite impressive. Do a quick Google search on 9/11 truth movement. Do some reading. Just because you dont know the facts does not mean they do not exist.



I doubt an exercise like this would be "live fire"! Can I see proof of this exercise please.

happily. "On September 11, 2001, the Air Force was in its second day of annual wargame drills, titled VIGILANT GUARDIAN, designed to test national air response systems, which incidentally involved hijacking scenarios. In addition the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO) which is staffed by military and CIA personnel, and is in charge of most American spy satellites, was running a drill for the scenario of an errant aircraft crashing into its headquarters." source: http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=387



Sorry. It [Northwoods Project] isn't plausible. For one, it would've came out long before now. Secrets like that don't stay secret for long.


Did you look at the link? They are images of the actual verified documents. The mainstream press has been complicit in the burying of this information. People who actively try to find out the truth know about it, but the spoon-fed masses don't. It is nonetheless authentic and real. Read it.

Imagine if you are a teacher in a school and you just learned your neigbor's house blew up. You would calmly stand up in front of the class, say "Children something has come up," buzz the office until someone replaced you and then leave to see if there is neigbor's house all over your yard.
There was no reason for him to just sit there. It's safer for him to be in a classroom full of children? Good idea. Put Target Number 1 in the same room with a bunch of school children during an attack on US ground. Brilliant! Terrorists would never harm children!

Bush knew about the first plane flying into the WTC BEFORE he went into the classroom. He was informed about the second airplane while he was in the classroom. He should have left at that time but he decided to stay.

When your country is under attack and you are the Commander in Chief, then you have a responsibility to your country first. By staying in the class, he exposes himself and the students to being a sitting (pardon the pun) duck.

Totally irresponsible in my mind and very well captured in Fahrenheit 911.

An Interesting Day:

President Bush's Movements and Actions on 9/11 (http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/main/essayaninterestingday.html)

The above is certainly an interesting read.

How did they KNOW that the president wasn't a target? If they knew what the targets were, then why didnt they do anything? At the time, they couldn't have known the president wasnt a target, unless it WAS a conspiracy.





there are plenty of facts. How about the complete LIE that the NORAD timeline was? How about the Bush/Bath/BinLaden connection? How about the connections between the flight schools that taught the terrorists how to fly, the houses that lodged them, and the funds they received to the CIA and other NeoCons? Any single item by itself does not constitute PROOF, but when you start stacking up the facts, the pile is quite impressive. Do a quick Google search on 9/11 truth movement. Do some reading. Just because you dont know the facts does not mean they do not exist.





happily. "On September 11, 2001, the Air Force was in its second day of annual wargame drills, titled VIGILANT GUARDIAN, designed to test national air response systems, which incidentally involved hijacking scenarios. In addition the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO) which is staffed by military and CIA personnel, and is in charge of most American spy satellites, was running a drill for the scenario of an errant aircraft crashing into its headquarters." source: http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=387






Did you look at the link? They are images of the actual verified documents. The mainstream press has been complicit in the burying of this information. People who actively try to find out the truth know about it, but the spoon-fed masses don't. It is nonetheless authentic and real. Read it.
This is true. It's been widely reported.

Tropical Montana If your conspiracy theory that Bush and others plotted the attacks of 9/11 to eventually lead to a convoluted excuse overthrow Saddam, rubbish!! Since when is the attempt by one national leader to assasinate another nation's leader not justification in itself for the declaration of war and the overthrow of the assassin's government? If Bush had had Iraq in mind, he didn't need to kill thousands of people to make his move.

What about the PNAC calling for a "New Pearl Harbor"? As horrifying as the thought is that our own (s)elected leaders could do this to us, consider the BILLIONS of dollars that have been made by companies like Bush's brother's security company, Halliburton, KBR, and the folks that sold airline stocks short? Don't think for a minute the Bushies would hesistate to sacrifice thousands of lives for their goals. How many are dead in Iraq?

And i'm sorry, but an assassination attempt that took place ten years ago does not justify the lies of WMD and the blame for 9/11 to be heaped on Iraq. And before you go saying something about how rotten Saddam was and how he gassed people...remember there are photos of Rumsfeld shaking hands with Saddam the day he went to visit and say that the US wouldn't interfere with his using the chemicals AMERICA SOLD HIM.

I know it sucks to find out that Santa isn't real, or the Easter Bunny, or the Benevolent Politician. But open your eyes, it won't kill you, and it may even help save us from further atrocities perpetrated by the American government.

READ THE NORTHWOOD PROJECT PAPERS!!!

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there?

Rule #1 for any leader; "Never panic or show signs of panic in a crisis." If Bush had immediately jumped up, ran out the door and scrambled up the steps of Air Force One, you would now be accusing him of panicking.

Why don't you get a life?

Rule #1 for any leader; "Never panic or show signs of panic in a crisis"
No, no... that is what he did during Katrina. We are talking about something different.

Like when you're a 7 year old and you find out Santa isn't real (oops, did I just say that?)...what do you do...you're just in shock for a while...then you cry...a lot...

I'm 62 and you are telling me Santa isn't real? ...sits there in shock while fighting the tears...:eek:

1. The most shocking thing happened just now. Are you going to be wondering what the hell was going on or will you immediately know who did it and have sevreal years worth of planning done in 3 seconds?

2. I don't think FDR or Wilson would have started screaming and panicing if the same thing happened in their time.

3. If you are a leader, you are the one who has to remain calm during a crisis. You're basicly the brains. It's not time for immediate action. It's time to raise morale and figure out what the hell happened so that you don't make the crisis worse. The leader is the thinker, the commander.

4. Maybe Bush needed time for it to sink in that several suicide bombers flew planes into buildings and thousands might end up dead. Huge events usually don't sink in right away. It wasn't like 9-11 happened every hour on the hour. It was one event that changed the world and the US together and seperately forever. When 9-11 happened, did you remain calm and collected? I did, but I was asleep when the towers were hit and I was listening to the radio on my way to school when I learned that the towers collapsed. I live in Nevada, which in in the Pacific Time Zone. All I heard at the time was that some building collapsed. I didn't know where or why. I didn't know about 9-11 until my classmates started talking about it in school.

How did they KNOW that the president wasn't a target? If they knew what the targets were, then why didnt they do anything? At the time, they couldn't have known the president wasnt a target, unless it WAS a conspiracy.

Because anyone who watches the news knows where the President is going from one day to the next. It is a matter of public record.

there are plenty of facts. How about the complete LIE that the NORAD timeline was? How about the Bush/Bath/BinLaden connection? How about the connections between the flight schools that taught the terrorists how to fly, the houses that lodged them, and the funds they received to the CIA and other NeoCons? Any single item by itself does not constitute PROOF, but when you start stacking up the facts, the pile is quite impressive. Do a quick Google search on 9/11 truth movement. Do some reading. Just because you dont know the facts does not mean they do not exist.

So anyone getting flight training is automatically a terrorist in training? How about the fact that this was planned under the Clinton Administration? They knew about atta and did nothing. We could play this all day but I'm in no mood to play it because it sickens me to see dumbasses actually believe something that has no basis in reality.

happily. "On September 11, 2001, the Air Force was in its second day of annual wargame drills, titled VIGILANT GUARDIAN, designed to test national air response systems, which incidentally involved hijacking scenarios. In addition the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO) which is staffed by military and CIA personnel, and is in charge of most American spy satellites, was running a drill for the scenario of an errant aircraft crashing into its headquarters." source: http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=387

Thanks for the link but I sincerely doubt it involved live fire exercises. Most exercises that are situational, like this one your describing are done on a play board. No live fire involved.

Did you look at the link? They are images of the actual verified documents. The mainstream press has been complicit in the burying of this information. People who actively try to find out the truth know about it, but the spoon-fed masses don't. It is nonetheless authentic and real. Read it.

I'm sorry but I go with actual news worthy links! Since this is nothing more than a conspiracy theory, i'm not going to give it another thought. If you excuse me, I'm going to pray for the families of those that have lost their lives in this terrorist attack.

No, no... that is what he did during Katrina. We are talking about something different.

No no. He didn't panick on 9/11 either. Get a life.

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?

It's because he doesn't want to start a panic/ riot. Plus, there were little children there. Imagine if this is what Bush does:

"The United States of America has been hit with terrorism. I'm afraid to say that the Pentagon and the World Trade Center was hit. Both towers collasped and part of the Pentagon collasped too. Not to mention that several thousands of Americans have died."

"OH NO MOMMY! WHATS GOING TO HAPPEN TO US! ARE WE GOING TO DIE! WE'RE GOING TO WAR!"

"HOLY SH1T!"

Exactly, you don't want to cause a commotion with a bunch of little kids in a room. And it's seven mintues, SEVEN MINTUES! As far as he was concerned, the attacks were done. He didn't know they had two other planes and were about to crash it into the Pentagon and into a field in PA. Even if he was going to do anything, what was going to do? He had to get out of their and into a safe location. I mean seriously, the Pentagon got hit. And possibily other Washington targets were next.

The last thing you want to do is start a panic. That is why he sat there. To make sure he didn't start a panic, or scare anyone.

No no. He didn't panick on 9/11 either. Get a life.
That's what I'm saying. Then again, he didn't do much.

How did they KNOW that the president wasn't a target? If they knew what the targets were, then why didnt they do anything? At the time, they couldn't have known the president wasnt a target, unless it WAS a conspiracy.
This possibility is addressed in the link that I posted at Post # 47 (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9623015&postcount=47)

It details what was happening in Bush's life up to, during, and after the attacks.

That's what I'm saying. Then again, he didn't do much.

That's because everything went into action. The FAA shut down the Airways on their own. The military launched thier aircraft to defend American shores (nothing to do there either).

The military was placed on Alert, they were upgraded to Force Protection Delta.

Alot of things were done without Bush having to say a word.

This possibility is addressed in the link that I posted at Post # 47 (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9623015&postcount=47)

It details what was happening in Bush's life up to, during, and after the attacks.

And it all matters not a one single little fly shit speck...HE GOT RE-ELECTED !!!!

Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahaha ! Get over it ! Its OVER and done He's the president ! Bwaahahahahahaaha
Learn to live with it .

http://www.boomspeed.com/sushigal/bushdisaster9kr.jpg

Exactly, you don't want to cause a commotion with a bunch of little kids in a room.
How would his leaving cause a commotion?

And it's seven mintues, SEVEN MINTUES!
An awful lot can happen in 7 minutes, and if you don't believe me, ask the people of Hiroshima or try holding your breath that long.

As far as he was concerned, the attacks were done.
And you know this how?

He didn't know they had two other planes and were about to crash it into the Pentagon and into a field in PA.
As Commander in Chief he should have acted immediately.

Even if he was going to do anything, what was going to do?
Get out of harms way, and take the target if any off the school?

He had to get out of their and into a safe location.
Corresct, except quicker than he did.

I mean seriously, the Pentagon got hit. And possibily other Washington targets were next.
All the more reason for him to get to work?

The last thing you want to do is start a panic.
How would his leaving create a panic?

That is why he sat there.
Duhhhhmmmm move!!

To make sure he didn't start a panic, or scare anyone.
His movements scare people?

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?

Would he have been able to take his time tunnah and undo the attacks? No.
Would anyone have been any less dead? No.

Would leaving immediately have changed anything? No.

Was he probably just as shocked as the rest of us were? Yes.

Did he have access to any details at the time? No.

Would any useful purpose have been served by racing out of there and scaring the kids any more than they were once they understood what was happening? No.

Is it likely the Secret Service was, at the time, trying to get him a safe path out of there? Yes. And seven minutes is damned fast.

Is it likely they were also scrambling to get the Vice President to safety at the same time? Yes.

Is it likely that there was, if not panic, at least confusion as there had been devastating attacks in New York against civilians, and Washington against the Pentagon? Yes.

Might they have wanted to make sure all planes other than military jets were grounded or at least no where near the President's flightpath before getting him in the air? Yes.

Are these not the most obvious reasons on the face of the Earth? Yes.

Is there any earthly reason to bring this up on the fourth anniversary of September 11th? Not any that I can see particularly.

Rule #1 for any leader; "Never panic or show signs of panic in a crisis." If Bush had immediately jumped up, ran out the door and scrambled up the steps of Air Force One, you would now be accusing him of panicking.

Why don't you get a life?

And why don't you use your brain? If I were president this is how it would have happened:

Aide: Sir, America is under attack.

Me: *stands up* I must apologize, I am needed elsewhere. *walks out and finds out what is actually happening because at the time I am not fully aware of what's going on, all I know is that my country is under attack, I don't know any specifics, all I know is that someone is attacking us, so I'm going to get as well informed as possible and actually try to do something, even if there's little I can do.*

No I wouldn't accuse him of panicking I'd accuse him of doing his job correctly. Also, if this occured during Clinton's term, you KNOW you'd be saying the same exact shit that I'm saying. There's no way in hell you'd defend Clinton.

And why don't you use your brain? If I were president this is how it would have happened:

Aide: Sir, America is under attack.

Me: *stands up* I must apologize, I am needed elsewhere. *walks out and finds out what is actually happening because at the time I am not fully aware of what's going on, all I know is that my country is under attack, I don't know any specifics, all I know is that someone is attacking us, so I'm going to get as well informed as possible and actually try to do something, even if there's little I can do.*

And yet, the only information available, evento him at that moment, was 2 towers on fire, thousands dead and missing, and a possibility of new attacks. There was nothing he could do. The secret Service had to clear a path for him and that takes some time, especially on short notice as that was what it was.

No I wouldn't accuse him of panicking I'd accuse him of doing his job correctly. Also, if this occured during Clinton's term, you KNOW you'd be saying the same exact shit that I'm saying. There's no way in hell you'd defend Clinton.

Actually, if Clinton had done the samething in exactly the same scenerio with the same responses, your damn well straight I would've supported Clinton.

That was when the 2nd plane hit. WHen the first one happened, no one knew what was going on. Everyone thought it was an accident until the 2nd plane slammed into the South Tower.

Precisely.

The footage I am speaking of, is the one that Mr. Moore made so famous in the his film wich gives so many Conservatives gut cramps.
At that point, Bush is fully aware of the situation, and most likely wondering what to do.



You forgot about Carter. He was much worse than Bush.

Not in my book.
Much of Carter's failings as President were to due to an uncooperative Congress and Senate.
On a more personal note, I believe Carters intentions and motives were, and are, much more "pure" than Bush's ever were.

No one can convince me that Bush's motivations are not centered around making his "base" more and more money.

I believe that even though Carters results may have been lackluster, his motives were noble in the undertaking.
Bush's are anything but noble, and in fact, descend quickly into the opposite, when you hear him lie so many times.

However, this is not a Carter debate....

so...




Then why are you commenting on it?

Becuase I felt the need for one of the forums Liberals to stand up and say outright, that Bush sitting in the classroom wondering what to do, is the LEAST of the reasons for wich I condemn his actions as President.

I wanted to say that out of all he has done, this is such small potatoes, that it is truly beneath notice.

Yes folks, this is one Liberal that doesnt hold Bushs actions in that classroom against him.

He was shitting bricks, wondering what in the hell he should do, and for that seven minutes....I cannot fault his actions.

Take a good look kids, this will likely be the only time I ever defend Bush in any form.

That's because everything went into action. The FAA shut down the Airways on their own. The military launched thier aircraft to defend American shores (nothing to do there either).

The military was placed on Alert, they were upgraded to Force Protection Delta.

Alot of things were done without Bush having to say a word.
You're confusing my points about Katrina with my points about 9/11. It's actually confusing me, now.
Basically, Bush does not know how to respond and when he does it is usually improperly. This is beside all of the government fuck ups occuring in his administration. We can't blame a figurehead for everything, can we?

You're confusing my points about Katrina with my points about 9/11. It's actually confusing me, now.
Basically, Bush does not know how to respond and when he does it is usually improperly.

Improperly? Seems he responded appropriately enough on 9/11 and was outraged at the slowness with Katrina. Its rather moot anyway in regards to 9/11 since that was 4 years ago.

This is beside all of the government fuck ups occuring in his administration. We can't blame a figurehead for everything, can we?

no you can't and bush is hardly a figurehead.

no you can't and bush is hardly a figurehead.
If he's more than a figurehead, you're not allowing me to cut him some slack. 4 years ago or two weeks ago, he has shown weakness in the face of adversity. He is closed off to the public and hides behind yes men. He and Nixon are going to be considered the low points during the past 30 years of the American Presidency in the future to come. He has done more to strengthen terrorists than if he had done nothing at all. My contempt for this man grows with each passing day I learn of what he is doing to the environment, in the war on terror, with foreign relations, with the economy... I actually search for good news from this president and I am faced with smug corruptness. He plays guitar while New Orleans floods and reads children books when towers fall.
Maybe it's because it's 9/11 that I feel so strongly. Maybe it's because I'm in New York. Maybe it's because I know that I supported Giullani when he stepped forward and did a presidents job when I hate that man as well. Maybe the reason why I'm so pissed off is because I do try to be open minded but I can't see past Bush's smoke screens

If anyone has read the Northwoods project papers, scenario #1 seems rather plausible.

The leaders of this country plotting to destroy the World Trade Center and kill 3,000 Americans is about as plausible as me and my roommates conspiring to cut the plumbing and electricity to our own dorm.

Is it likely the Secret Service was, at the time, trying to get him a safe path out of there? Yes. And seven minutes is damned fast.

...

Might they have wanted to make sure all planes other than military jets were grounded or at least no where near the President's flightpath before getting him in the air? Yes.

I'd say these are the two most compelling explanations for the vastly overblown "seven-minute wait." I know that if I'd been planning 9/11 (which admittedly is difficult to imagine) and knew where Bush was, I'd have had someone waiting outside the school with a high-powered rifle. Rushing him out of there was not the best course of action.

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?


What would he have done if he left?....while he was there the generals and staff were taking care if everything.

I'd like to chime in on this for one reason. No details, but I know someone who kind of knows someone who is familiar with white house security and the secret service. In that situation, bush couldn't have left if he wanted to....the very first thing the secret service does is lock down the area that they are in until they have more details, THEY WILL NOT MOVE THE PRESIDENT DURING THIS TIME. It doesn't matter that the attacks were far away, they have to consider things such as someone trying to distract them so they can do something to the president during the commotion. Actually, I'm surprised it was only seven minutes and not more like 10-15. Now, the other side to this is the why bush didn't say much. First off, as president you are unfortunately judged on every single word you utter.....so you can't say things spur of the moment like normal people because people like the guy who started this thread will come back to monday morning quarterback the situation, also....he wasn't equipped to make any kind of large broadcast from the location he was at, it just wouldn't have done anything more than waste time.....stuff was happening and he needed to:

1. allow the secret service enough time to finalize security and transportation concerns.
2. Actually GET all the information!
3. Decide what to do to hanlde the situation.
4. Finally, make some kind of a statement to the public

I don't know about everyone else, but if we are under attack.....I want my president working the situation FIRST, and then worrying about making a speech.

I'd like to chime in on this for one reason. No details, but I know someone who kind of knows someone who is familiar with white house security and the secret service. In that situation, bush couldn't have left if he wanted to....the very first thing the secret service does is lock down the area that they are in until they have more details, THEY WILL NOT MOVE THE PRESIDENT DURING THIS TIME. It doesn't matter that the attacks were far away, they have to consider things such as someone trying to distract them so they can do something to the president during the commotion. Actually, I'm surprised it was only seven minutes and not more like 10-15. Now, the other side to this is the why bush didn't say much. First off, as president you are unfortunately judged on every single word you utter.....so you can't say things spur of the moment like normal people because people like the guy who started this thread will come back to monday morning quarterback the situation, also....he wasn't equipped to make any kind of large broadcast from the location he was at, it just wouldn't have done anything more than waste time.....stuff was happening and he needed to:

1. allow the secret service enough time to finalize security and transportation concerns.
2. Actually GET all the information!
3. Decide what to do to hanlde the situation.
4. Finally, make some kind of a statement to the public

I don't know about everyone else, but if we are under attack.....I want my president working the situation FIRST, and then worrying about making a speech.
You miss the point. Him running around aimlessly screaming about the end of the world is not what we wanted. A sincere reaction would have been nice.

You miss the point. Him running around aimlessly screaming about the end of the world is not what we wanted. A sincere reaction would have been nice.

His sincere reaction is exactly what you got!!!!! Stunned disbelief followed immediately by deep thought on the situation, I think he reacted incredibly well for the position he is in, especially when compared to the reaction of others around the country.

You miss the point. Him running around aimlessly screaming about the end of the world is not what we wanted. A sincere reaction would have been nice.

Where in the world did you get that he said it was the end of the world? In no way did he ever say that it was the end of the world.

You miss the point. Him running around aimlessly screaming about the end of the world is not what we wanted. A sincere reaction would have been nice.

Fine, I'll bite. What would you have considered "a sincere reaction" to the situation?

Fine, I'll bite. What would you have considered "a sincere reaction" to the situation?
I think that Desperate Measures raises a good point. While the Commander in Chief was planted in a schoolroom, the 2nd in command was making Presidential decisions, such as giving orders to shoot down commercial airliners. Bush should have quietly excused himself and assumed command.

Check out 9/11 Confusion (http://www.cbsnews.com/elements/2004/04/08/national/videoarchive610884_0_1_page.shtml).

The 7 minutes might have been his version of a WTF moment. Considering the situation, 7 minutes sounds about right.

You know, nobody has every explained to me or given me a good reason as to why Bush sat in that classroom for so long. What was he doing? What was he thinking? Can you provide me with what was the purpose of him sitting there? I'd really like to know. From the video I can tell that one of his aides came and whispered "Sir, the United States is under attack" and from that moment on, he just sat there for seven minutes.

Why did Bush do that? Can anyone offer me a good explanation other than "he didn't want to scare the children" or "there wasn't much he could have done". Please don't say the second one because the only information he was given was "The United States is under attack" that's it, it could have been anything yet he chose to sit there. I'm not trying to be overly critical of him, but I would like to know why he did that. Any answers?

if you're in a classroom and someone says "yo, there's been a horrible disaster" you can't just jump up from what you're doing and scare all of the kids you're reading to. after that they moved him to a safe place, so really it was courageous of him in a way.

if you're in a classroom and someone says "yo, there's been a horrible disaster" you can't just jump up from what you're doing and scare all of the kids you're reading to. after that they moved him to a safe place, so really it was courageous of him in a way.
However, if Bush was a target, and there has been some suggestion that the SS might have averted a Bush assassination attempt earlier in the day, then by Bush staying in the classroom, could have made the children targets as well?

I think that Desperate Measures raises a good point. While the Commander in Chief was planted in a schoolroom, the 2nd in command was making Presidential decisions, such as giving orders to shoot down commercial airliners. Bush should have quietly excused himself and assumed command.

Excused himself to where, though? It's more than reasonable to assume that, for those seven minutes, the Secret Service was not able to move him from the school securely.

Excused himself to where, though? It's more than reasonable to assume that, for those seven minutes, the Secret Service was not able to move him from the school securely.
Maybe not, but in those 7 minutes, much more could have been going on and he removed himself from the loop. Even if he went to a more secure part of the school and made contact with Cheney and/or others, to make the decisions that are required of the Commander in Chief.

My understanding, is that (particularly the footage of Bush sitting stock-still) is at that moment, he was told what had happened to both towers, and that indeed, the nation was under attack.


So....while I think Bush is the absolute worst presidnt of the past 100 years...

I cant say anything about the 7 minute thing..

It probably consisted of this:

"Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?
Oh Fuck, whaddo I do?"

I cant say I wouldnt have either.
exactamente

if you're in a classroom and someone says "yo, there's been a horrible disaster" you can't just jump up from what you're doing and scare all of the kids you're reading to. after that they moved him to a safe place, so really it was courageous of him in a way.


On a side note, he was told about the attacks on the 2nd plane crash, and *heres the important part* while the children were getting out a new book. There was a 30 second pause there for President Bush to stand up and excuse himself since he had matters to attend to. Personally, if I was a parent of any of those students. I would be horrified that the president was in the same room as my child while our country was under attack.

Oh and since nobodies dropped either of these links I'll add them in.

http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.htm#intro

And yes, this one is definately made for a specific audience and presented in an incredibly biased manor... but I feel it has a little merit to it if you can look past all the fancy fireworks and smoke in the flash presentation.

http://www.pentagonstrike.co.uk/




........oh and just for the hell of it, hehe
look closely
http://vismod.media.mit.edu/pub/elwin/bush_reading.jpg

Where in the world did you get that he said it was the end of the world? In no way did he ever say that it was the end of the world.
groans

Second off, it happened 4 years ago, and that was one of the least significant events of September 11th.

I don't know about that. I think this incident showed that Bush is actually lacking in the ability to make fast paced decisions like a leader. He was basically waiting for someone to tell him what he should do. Since he is not an actual leader this not entirely surprising.

Fine, I'll bite. What would you have considered "a sincere reaction" to the situation?
Maybe what I would consider a sincere reaction would have been words uttered the day of the disaster not written by speech writers.

I don't know about that. I think this incident showed that Bush is actually lacking in the ability to make fast paced decisions like a leader. He was basically waiting for someone to tell him what he should do. Since he is not an actual leader this not entirely surprising.

Actually, this here is rather pointless.

Maybe what I would consider a sincere reaction would have been words uttered the day of the disaster not written by speech writers.

That's neither here nor there. We're talking about the seven-minute wait, remember?

It's simple. The CIA told him the fake terror attack was going to be next week. He was just shocked that they had changed the date without telling him.

groans
I feel your pain.

That's neither here nor there. We're talking about the seven-minute wait, remember?
Step away from the kids. Look sad. Look real. Look angry. These are sincere reactions...

Reality of his job sank in. After coasting and taking vacations now he was facing a real crisis and he was scared. He should have got up immediately and dealt with the crisis. The feelings of a few children could be excused for dealing with the monumental tragedy that was taking place.