NationStates Jolt Archive

What do you think? Is getting together with a cousin really such a bad thing? Some would say absolutely...but clearly others don't have a problem with it! :D

There are usually few eyebrows raised if the cousin is a second or third cousin, because the relationship is a lot more tenuous. The problems occur when it's first cousins. Is there really any genetic reason for this aversion? I understand siblings (EWW!), but is there really a case to be made for birth defects/problems coming up in children born of first cousins?

Or what if the cousins never actually plan to have kids? I mean, think about it...most people grow up around cousins, and who are you more likely to have access to, and possibly your first kiss with than a cousin? And does that kind of contact really warrant the 'eww, incest' reaction? I don't see why.

Then again, that works for my Irish side, but my Cree side has a few more restrictions. Our kinship is a bit different. My mother's sister's children are my brothers and sisters, as are my father's brother's children. Literally, in our language, these cousins are brother and sister, not cousin. So for natives, it might be slightly okay to date your mother's brother's kids, or your father's sister's kids...but never ever the others, who are your siblings.

What are your thoughts on kissing cousins?

its just wrong

Well...seeing as my only female cousin is seven years old....

There isn't anything morally wrong, as far as I can see it. If it's love then it should override all barriers. Unfortunately, there are genetic implications, but if you're willing to live that then no-one else has the right to stop you.

Not sure whether it should count as incest. Hmm… really am not sure. It certainly doesn't produce the reaction in me that brother/sister does in me and pretty much everyone else.

I consider my cousins sort-of like secondary siblings. They are the closest comparable relations to your siblings, after all. Thus going around kissing them or... whatever... is just as repulsive to me as kissing your own brothers or sisters. It just isn't the done thing. Apart from anything else, if you marry your cousin and have kids (or just one kid with two heads), how the hell do you explain what you are to your kids?

"Hi son/nephew! I'm your dad/uncle! You can call me your Duncle!"

Sleeping with your cousin is fine. People in most of the world and in most of human history have done it.

Personally, I think you should be able to sleep with anyone you want to, as long as they are old enough and they consent.

its just wrong
Why?

"Well...seeing as my only female cousin is seven years old...."

now THAT would be wrong ...........

I consider my cousins sort-of like secondary siblings. They are the closest comparable relations to your siblings, after all. Thus going around kissing them or... whatever... is just as repulsive to me as kissing your own brothers or sisters. It just isn't the done thing. Apart from anything else, if you marry your cousin and have kids (or just one kid with two heads), how the hell do you explain what you are to your kids?

"Hi son/nephew! I'm your dad/uncle! You can call me your Duncle!" You wouldn't be their uncle, as an uncle is the sibling of the father/mother.
In fact, can anyone pin down what is wrong with incest of any type? Discounting genetics which may not effect anything if kids aren't involved.

I... I really don't know. I don't have an opinion on it. I mean, if doesn't affect me, so, if someone wants to, it's their choice.

I consider my cousins sort-of like secondary siblings. They are the closest comparable relations to your siblings, after all. Thus going around kissing them or... whatever... is just as repulsive to me as kissing your own brothers or sisters. It just isn't the done thing. Apart from anything else, if you marry your cousin and have kids (or just one kid with two heads), how the hell do you explain what you are to your kids?

"Hi son/nephew! I'm your dad/uncle! You can call me your Duncle!"
ROFLMAO!

A cousin of my husband's married his cousin (from the other side of his family, not my husband's), and they decided never to have children. But boy did that ever cause ripples in both families! I suspect a lot of people would just avoid causing that sort of gossip and so on.

But from what I've read, unless you become seriously inbred (marrying first cousins through many generations), you aren't really at that much risk for genetic problems being passed on down to your children.

I know what you mean about the closeness factor though. Then again...I was pretty damn close with friends too, and I wouldn't blink at shagging some of them! I think some of the aversion may have to do with power imbalance and a fear of sexual abuse by older cousins etc. But when the two are consenting adults...I don't really see the problem other than the stigma.

The problems occur when it's first cousins. Is there really any genetic reason for this aversion?

You should ask the hemophiliacs in the Royal families of Europe.

"Well...seeing as my only female cousin is seven years old...."

now THAT would be wrong ...........
Clearly.

We're talking about consenting adults, though I didn't make that as clear as I should. Not abuse.

You should ask the hemophiliacs in the Royal families of Europe. Are you suggesting something about my ancestors' marriage habits?

;)

Sinuhue, you usually post such interesting threads/post....this is just gross.
it advocates....incest is best, put your family to the test :( :eek: :headbang:

"Hi son/nephew! I'm your dad/uncle! You can call me your Duncle!"
Hahaha! I somewhat agree. Too much common genetic background.

But... Trying to decide who others can & cannot love is simply evil.

Besides, I fail to see any reasonable argument for thinking offspring would really be affected by this. They aren't sieblings after all. So.. Basically I think the people should try their damndest to avoid it, but I'm not gonna stop them.

You wouldn't be their uncle, as an uncle is the sibling of the father/mother.
In fact, can anyone pin down what is wrong with incest of any type? Discounting genetics which may not effect anything if kids aren't involved.
In terms of siblings, I think there is that power imbalance...that may follow you even into adulthood. Likely one is going to be older than the other, and the relationship is going to be coloured by their childhood interactions...so a bossy older brother sleeping with his (EWW!) younger sister kind of has a taint like a teacher sleeping with a student...

The EWW factor for siblings is one I may not be able to really rationalise, but it's a taboo I don't ever plan on testing. *runs off to take a shower a la Crying Game at the very thought!*

You wouldn't be their uncle, as an uncle is the sibling of the father/mother.
In fact, can anyone pin down what is wrong with incest of any type? Discounting genetics which may not effect anything if kids aren't involved.
The knee-jerk "ewwww" factor is an offshoot to animals, who (for the most part) only have sex for reproduction. Every animal releases certain pheremones which very depending on their personal genetic code. The closer another animals genetic code, the stronger they would smell it.

So basically, if 2 animals had very similar DNA they would instinctively know not to mate, as that would produce defective children which goes against the whole point.

So that's why it freaks us out.

You should ask the hemophiliacs in the Royal families of Europe.
But we're not necessarily talking about generations of inbreeding here.

But we're not necessarily talking about generations of inbreeding here.

We have history as a guide. This taboo is best left unbroken.

Sinuhue, you usually post such interesting threads/post....this is just gross.
it advocates....incest is best, put your family to the test :( :eek: :headbang:
No, it doesn't. I'm not advocating it, I'm questioning it.

The sibling taboo...I get that. Not rationally perhaps, but it's deeply ingrained in me. I don't quite get the cousin thing though. Not really. Aside from one's ingrained beliefs (eww or not), what is wrong with it? It may make you uncomfortable to examine that question...I certainly wouldn't bother debating the sibling taboo for that reason...I don't care WHY we have it. But I don't have such strong negative feelings about cousins.

The knee-jerk "ewwww" factor is an offshoot to animals, who (for the most part) only have sex for reproduction. Every animal releases certain pheremones which very depending on their personal genetic code. The closer another animals genetic code, the stronger they would smell it.

So basically, if 2 animals had very similar DNA they would instinctively know not to mate, as that would produce defective children which goes against the whole point.

So that's why it freaks us out.
I suspect this has much to do with it. But humans do not always mate to reproduce...and even a marriage of cousins does not have to result in offspring...or biological offspring (adoption always being an option)...so...why not?

What do you think? Is getting together with a cousin really such a bad thing? Some would say absolutely...but clearly others don't have a problem with it! :D

There are usually few eyebrows raised if the cousin is a second or third cousin, because the relationship is a lot more tenuous. The problems occur when it's first cousins. Is there really any genetic reason for this aversion? I understand siblings (EWW!), but is there really a case to be made for birth defects/problems coming up in children born of first cousins?

Or what if the cousins never actually plan to have kids? I mean, think about it...most people grow up around cousins, and who are you more likely to have access to, and possibly your first kiss with than a cousin? And does that kind of contact really warrant the 'eww, incest' reaction? I don't see why.

Then again, that works for my Irish side, but my Cree side has a few more restrictions. Our kinship is a bit different. My mother's sister's children are my brothers and sisters, as are my father's brother's children. Literally, in our language, these cousins are brother and sister, not cousin. So for natives, it might be slightly okay to date your mother's brother's kids, or your father's sister's kids...but never ever the others, who are your siblings.

What are your thoughts on kissing cousins?


There can be genetic side effects. Often in the case of cousins that get together, there is alot of hemophilia and down syndrome, as seen in cases of small populations where cousins have offspring.

We have history as a guide. This taboo is best left unbroken.
And yet it isn't.

There can be genetic side effects. Often in the case of cousins that get together, there is alot of hemophilia and down syndrome, as seen in cases of small populations where cousins have offspring.
Only if those genes exist in the individuals in the first place. Offspring of cousins do not automatically get hemophelia, or down syndrome.

But I'm not really debating the merit of having children with cousins. I think keeping our genes a bit more spread out is a good idea.

I'm just talking about shagging them.

And yet it isn't.

On a large scale, in Western society, it is.

On a large scale, in Western society, it is.
On a large scale, yes, but so what? That doesn't mean the taboo is not broken...it just means that humans like a bit more variety than what may be immediately available:) Breaking the taboo does not mean automatically marrying only cousins.

On a large scale, yes, but so what? That doesn't mean the taboo is not broken...it just means that humans like a bit more variety than what may be immediately available:) Breaking the taboo does not mean automatically marrying only cousins.

What it does mean is the accumulation of deletrius genes. The more people who do it, the bigger the risk of children inheriting them and getting ill. There is no denying that genetic variation is infinitely better than inbreeding.

Well...seeing as my only female cousin is seven years old....

There isn't anything morally wrong, as far as I can see it. If it's love then it should override all barriers. Unfortunately, there are genetic implications, but if you're willing to live that then no-one else has the right to stop you.
There aren't actually serious genetic problems with cousins. At least, not on a one-on-one level. Even when brothers and sisters have children together, the problems with incest and genetic abnormalities only become an issue after several generations of consistent incest.

While I know anecdotes != data, I have seen the results of close familial marriages, and the resulting children. In one case, the couple didn't even know they were related until the reception after the wedding - thrid cousins. Now, that's not real close, specifically, but they came from a geographic region that has seen hundreds of years of close-family marriages. While my friend is a big, solid, robust guy, his wife is pale, small, and washed-out. Their children are decidedly weedy and sickly, and the kids are prone unexpected nose bleeds for no obvious cause.

In the other case, however, second cousins married, but there was no history of close-family marriages on either side, and their children are very normal.

Take those for what they're worth.

its just wrong


yea... i think it just doesent sound right

What it does mean is the accumulation of deletrius genes. The more people who do it, the bigger the risk of children inheriting them and getting ill. There is no denying that genetic variation is infinitely better than inbreeding.
With populations as large and spread out as currently exist on this planet, I don't see that as a big worry.

With populations as large and spread out as currently exist on this planet, I don't see that as a big worry.

Ah, but that does not take into account that the people more prone to this will not exactly be jet-setters. And the more people who do this, the bigger the chance that the deletrious genes persist all over.

Part of the reason for not marrying siblings/cousins goes back to Jewish Law(which a lot of our customs and laws are based on) which states that a marriage cannot be between people who are within seven generations related. Which incidently is about as far apart as any two random people. It also lists several other people you should not have relationships with--Aunts, Uncles, Step-parents, Nieces, Nephews, Parents, Animals, etc.

Throughout history though many people in powerful positions married exclusively within there own families to produce heirs that were related two or three or eight times to the current monarch to solidfy claims of decendency. The Pharoahs of Egypt were big into sister/cousin/aunt marriage, as were the Tudors and Hapsburgs of Europe. Ancient Rome thrived on the practice.

Only if those genes exist in the individuals in the first place. Offspring of cousins do not automatically get hemophelia, or down syndrome.

But I'm not really debating the merit of having children with cousins. I think keeping our genes a bit more spread out is a good idea.

I'm just talking about shagging them.

I never really found my cousins attractive so I have no idea. I like shaggin other peoples cousins though. Who's up?

Ah, but that does not take into account that the people more prone to this will not exactly be jet-setters.
By this line of thinking: homosexuals doesn't contribute to the genepool at all. Should they be allowed to form relationships?

Ah, but that does not take into account that the people more prone to this will not exactly be jet-setters. And the more people who do this, the bigger the chance that the deletrious genes persist all over.
Yeah well, I'm not really into the idea of cousins spitting out lots of kids anyway. But just sleeping together...or not having kids...I don't see the problem.

Wow ... ummm ... errr ...

Where I come from, the term "kissing cousins" means a pair of cousins who are very close in age and act more like friends than family. "Thick as Thieves" is a term often used for them.

It has nothing to do with actual smooching. You Canadians are strange. :D

thats just wrong i mean ur cousin.....thats just wrong
like this :fluffle:

Yeah well, I'm not really into the idea of cousins spitting out lots of kids anyway. But just sleeping together...or not having kids...I don't see the problem.
But if the sex is the only thing, with no children, why should coupling of any two people be forbidden? Siblings, or parent/child even, so long as everyone's a consenting adult?

There are plenty of other sexual practices that people consider "icky" that aren't illegal.

kissing is a common greeting in peru :P i've kissed my cousins plenty of times

is anyone from south america around?

I have two very hot cousins.

I would "get with" both/either of them (they are both well beyond age of consent).

The sexual taboo came about mainly because of the risks of procreating with someone too close to you. With modern birth control that is not so much an issue. So the Kissing Cousins taboo is a social holdover from times when there was very good reason to have the taboo.

By this line of thinking: homosexuals doesn't contribute to the genepool at all. Should they be allowed to form relationships?

That is a flawed analogy, since non-contribution, which by the way, gay people actually do, is not contribution.

I never really found my cousins attractive so I have no idea. I like shaggin other peoples cousins though. Who's up?
I think we're all guilty of cousin shagging by that definition then ;)

Wow ... ummm ... errr ...

Where I come from, the term "kissing cousins" means a pair of cousins who are very close in age and act more like friends than family. "Thick as Thieves" is a term often used for them.

It has nothing to do with actual smooching. You Canadians are strange. :D
I'm taking the figurative term and using it literally :eek:

kissing is a common greeting in peru :P i've kissed my cousins plenty of times

is anyone from south america around?
Esa es una cosa diferente:)

Yeah well, I'm not really into the idea of cousins spitting out lots of kids anyway. But just sleeping together...or not having kids...I don't see the problem.

Hey, I'm not to judge. What people do is none of my business, as long as it's consensual. You asked for genetic counter-arguments, and I supplied. Sleeping with my cousin isn't exactly my cup of tea (although, I have to admit to having a fantasy about a hot cousin once or twice), but whatever floats other people's boats...

I believe I read somewhere that married cousins have a 6% chance of having a baby with a genetic defect, compared with 3% with those that marry outside of the family.

But if the sex is the only thing, with no children, why should coupling of any two people be forbidden? Siblings, or parent/child even, so long as everyone's a consenting adult?

There are plenty of other sexual practices that people consider "icky" that aren't illegal.

This is spot on, if it is only about sex then why not consenting parent/child adults?

Because we are animals and we have an inherent notion that it is wrong, there will be a scientific explanation as well and those who do it will be outside the norm (that is the majority), like homosexuals.
The sexual act is intended to bond people and provide children, we may have evovled to think outside this feeling but our bodies and reactions are very much in survival evolution mode.

I'm taking the figurative term and using it literally :eek:

Oh! *snicker* ... well then ...

Anyway, no. Consenting adults can do as they please. I am indifferent to it. Not something I'd necessarily practise, but I'm not one to judge. Besides, when doing the family tree, I found out my wife and I are 32nd cousins. :eek:

Of course ... go far enough back ... I suppose we're all cousins.

This thread is a serious discussion, so if you plan on replying, read the first post fully, as well as the majority of the thread. Do not turn this into some incest sexfest. I will be keeping an eye on this thread, so that none of these "I'd bang your cousin too" comments remain.

Feh. If there's no genetic evidence against it, then whatever.

Of course ... go far enough back ... I suppose we're all cousins.
Not that far back... I mean, there's that thing about 1 in 200 people alive today being related to Genghis Khan.

Not that far back... I mean, there's that thing about 1 in 200 people alive today being related to Genghis Khan.

In a population of less than 2000 people (approximately) everyone would be related within one generation, given a balanced population growth.

Therefore, yes, after 10 years, just about everyone would be cousins.

I believe I read somewhere that married cousins have a 6% chance of having a baby with a genetic defect, compared with 3% with those that marry outside of the family.

Which actually isn't that much higher than the chance of having a genetic defect when the mother is over 40.

Of course, this holds true as long as the two cousins are not already inbred. Genetic defects tend to crop up more in small, isolated populations where everybody is interrelated.

Before modern times, when population mobility was much more restricted, it was often the case that every potential mate was at least a fourth or fifth cousin, if not closer. In such a population, it is critical to mate with someone related to you as distantly as possible, to minimize the chance of genetic defects.

This is actually what caused the strain of hemophilia in the royal families of Europe: they genetically isolated themselves from the rest of the population, leaving themselves with too small a gene pool. The Habsburgs were particularly bad about this.

But in a population as diverse as modern America, the dangers of this are relatively small. And with adequate contraception, the danger falls to nil.

:p

ROFLMAO!

A cousin of my husband's married his cousin (from the other side of his family, not my husband's), and they decided never to have children. But boy did that ever cause ripples in both families! I suspect a lot of people would just avoid causing that sort of gossip and so on.

But from what I've read, unless you become seriously inbred (marrying first cousins through many generations), you aren't really at that much risk for genetic problems being passed on down to your children.

I know what you mean about the closeness factor though. Then again...I was pretty damn close with friends too, and I wouldn't blink at shagging some of them! I think some of the aversion may have to do with power imbalance and a fear of sexual abuse by older cousins etc. But when the two are consenting adults...I don't really see the problem other than the stigma.

The numbers I read where 2-4% chance of genetic birth defect with unrelated parents, 3-7% chance of genetic birth defect in first cousins. That's a significant increase in the likelihood of birth defect. Not worth it to me. However, I think there's nothing wrong with it if one or both of you are sterile.

Personally, these sorts of 'morality laws' I strongly disagree with. Provided they aren't actually reproducing (higher risk of genetic problems and all that), I don't think that it's anyone's business if cousins, or hell, siblings, want to get it on with each other. I think 'consenting adults' is really the only important rule there.

Yeah, it's kinda weird to think of first cousins, or siblings, engaging in sex with each other... but that's a social stigma. We're all brought up to think it's 'icky'. :)

Personally, these sorts of 'morality laws' I strongly disagree with. Provided they aren't actually reproducing (higher risk of genetic problems and all that), I don't think that it's anyone's business if cousins, or hell, siblings, want to get it on with each other. I think 'consenting adults' is really the only important rule there.

Yeah, it's kinda weird to think of first cousins, or siblings, engaging in sex with each other... but that's a social stigma. We're all brought up to think it's 'icky'. :)

I agree. But social stigma has a stronghold on our country.

Hell, I get yelled at for wearing a hat indoors although no one can tell me the reason why you aren't supposed to.

I'm not saying I would get involved sexually with a relative, but to each is own if there are no offspring involved. Just make sure there are no offspring involved.

Marrying cousins is not a taboo in many parts of the world.

Muslim men are allowed to marry their paternal uncle's daughter(s). I know of many such marriages when I was living in India. It still happens in close knit muslim rural communities. I know that it happens in Bangladesh and Pakistan too (in a larger scale, as per some reports).

It is strange, because we (hindu community) considers daughter's of paternal uncle as sisters and not even as cousins.

The funny part is, in certain hindu communities in the south peninsular India, marrying the maternal uncle's daughter is permitted and was the norm a few generations back. With increasing urbanisation and education and opportunities, this practice is rapidly decreasing and hopefully will become a thing of the past.

even tho ppl hardly respond to my posts...

1. If it's a cousin that is your mother/father('s) brother/sister('s) son/daughter. They ARE related to you by blood, and therefore shouldn't be allowed.

2. However, if your mother's sister married a guy who already had a hot daughter, then it's a wide open game :P

basically, if it's w/ a blood cousin, no, but cousin by marriage is ok w/ me.

I agree. But social stigma has a stronghold on our country.

Hell, I get yelled at for wearing a hat indoors although no one can tell me the reason why you aren't supposed to.

I'm not saying I would get involved sexually with a relative, but to each is own if there are no offspring involved. Just make sure there are no offspring involved.
I've never understood the hat thing, either. Not that I wear a hat (can't stand to), but still...

We North Americans really need to better learn how to relax and not worry about stupid meaningless things that other people are doing. I don't recall ever inviting the entire continent into my bedroom! :D

Besides... my sister is hot. :eek: :D

Sleeping with your cousin is fine. People in most of the world and in most of human history have done it.

Personally, I think you should be able to sleep with anyone you want to, as long as they are old enough and they consent.
Maybe that's why we're all so fucked up.

But seriously, cousin-cousin relationships may not seem to be all that dangerous initially, but as time wears on and you get a couple generations doing this (European monarchies, Hawiian Missionary Planter Families) Then you really do run into some serious problems.

What do you think? Is getting together with a cousin really such a bad thing? Some would say absolutely...but clearly others don't have a problem with it! :D

There are usually few eyebrows raised if the cousin is a second or third cousin, because the relationship is a lot more tenuous. The problems occur when it's first cousins. Is there really any genetic reason for this aversion? I understand siblings (EWW!), but is there really a case to be made for birth defects/problems coming up in children born of first cousins?

Or what if the cousins never actually plan to have kids? I mean, think about it...most people grow up around cousins, and who are you more likely to have access to, and possibly your first kiss with than a cousin? And does that kind of contact really warrant the 'eww, incest' reaction? I don't see why.

Then again, that works for my Irish side, but my Cree side has a few more restrictions. Our kinship is a bit different. My mother's sister's children are my brothers and sisters, as are my father's brother's children. Literally, in our language, these cousins are brother and sister, not cousin. So for natives, it might be slightly okay to date your mother's brother's kids, or your father's sister's kids...but never ever the others, who are your siblings.

What are your thoughts on kissing cousins?

Ihope the god allmighty keeps you from doing things with your cousin :p

I've never understood the hat thing, either. Not that I wear a hat (can't stand to), but still...

We North Americans really need to better learn how to relax and not worry about stupid meaningless things that other people are doing. I don't recall ever inviting the entire continent into my bedroom! :D

Besides... my sister is hot. :eek: :D

got any photos? >:P

Marrying your cousin is a lot like buying a Celine Dion album.

If thats what you really want to do and you know you will be happiest that way, do it. However, you need to consider how others around you will think and how this will deeply influence your life and that of your families. My advice is if you can avoid it, avoid it. Supress those urges as it will only lead to complications and embarrasment for your entire life.

I wouldn't advise marring your cousin either.

Joking aside, you need to consider YOURSELF the moral/ethical/genetic consequences for you and your family, and if you are happy with it then go ahead.
Personnally, I think its wrong in so many ways.

I don't have any cousins, so stop depressing me with your tales of incest already.

no, seriously, i think its sick.

At first i thought ewww.put after putting some thought into it the whole affair doesnt seem that awful.social taboo aside the only problems are an increased chance of genetic defects becoming dominant.and that isnt really that big of a problem.if the two cousins decided to have children(a fairly sizable if) couldnt they go to a doctor to get screened for genetic defects that could come out in their children?or did i dream hearing about something like that?

and i cant say i havent had some fantasies bout one of my cousins :eek:

What do you think? Is getting together with a cousin really such a bad thing? Some would say absolutely...but clearly others don't have a problem with it! :D

There are usually few eyebrows raised if the cousin is a second or third cousin, because the relationship is a lot more tenuous. The problems occur when it's first cousins. Is there really any genetic reason for this aversion? I understand siblings (EWW!), but is there really a case to be made for birth defects/problems coming up in children born of first cousins?

Or what if the cousins never actually plan to have kids? I mean, think about it...most people grow up around cousins, and who are you more likely to have access to, and possibly your first kiss with than a cousin? And does that kind of contact really warrant the 'eww, incest' reaction? I don't see why.

Then again, that works for my Irish side, but my Cree side has a few more restrictions. Our kinship is a bit different. My mother's sister's children are my brothers and sisters, as are my father's brother's children. Literally, in our language, these cousins are brother and sister, not cousin. So for natives, it might be slightly okay to date your mother's brother's kids, or your father's sister's kids...but never ever the others, who are your siblings.

What are your thoughts on kissing cousins?
There is a risk associated with inbreeding, but there is also a risk involved in having children past the age of 40. We forbid the one, but not the other...gotta love the irrational power of "tradition."

As far as I am concerned, relationships between consenting adults are their own business. I don't find any of my cousins remotely attractive, so I have a knee-jerk "ICKY" response to the idea of kissing cousins, but I don't know how I would feel if I were related to hotties.

There is a risk associated with inbreeding, but there is also a risk involved in having children past the age of 40. We forbid the one, but not the other...gotta love the irrational power of "tradition."

As far as I am concerned, relationships between consenting adults are their own business. I don't find any of my cousins remotely attractive, so I have a knee-jerk "ICKY" response to the idea of kissing cousins, but I don't know how I would feel if I were related to hotties.


that seems to be the general response.maybe ours will be the generation that smashes the taboo of marrying/shaggin your cousins

Here is a short article on the subject. It covers some of the social and genetic arguments that many use to justify their positions.

http://www.straightdope.com/columns/041001.html

Sinuhue, you usually post such interesting threads/post....this is just gross.
it advocates....incest is best, put your family to the test :( :eek: :headbang:

Incest is best. If you don't believe me, ask my brother.;)

Seriously, though, genetics aside, there is also a good sociological reason to avoid rendezvousing with your cousin: it doesn't expand the family's access to resources. In most of the world, people are married for economic reasons, not love, and marrying a cousin confers no new wealth upon the family. Funny thing about the incest taboo: the less neolocal a society is, the more stringent their definition of who you can't sleep with. America today is pretty neolocal, so we have a fairly relaxed standard of what constitutes incest. Nevertheless, 1st cousins isn't technically illegal, but it is more than a bit icky.

As far as I know, genetics problems pop up in the children that are born from brother/sister, father/daughter and mother/son sexual relations. I think the offspring of cousins are not affected by this.

Genetics aside, it's plain immoral! I mean, they're almost your direct family. Geez, I don't know how can you even consider this... :(

As far as I know, genetics problems pop up in the children that are born from brother/sister, father/daughter and mother/son sexual relations. I think the offspring of cousins are not affected by this.

Genetics aside, it's plain immoral! I mean, they're almost your direct family. Geez, I don't know how can you even consider this... :(
You haven't seen some of my cousins *wink wink, nudge nudge*...

No, but seriously, I don't think it's really that terrible, especially if kids are not going to be part of the picture.

As far as I know, genetics problems pop up in the children that are born from brother/sister, father/daughter and mother/son sexual relations. I think the offspring of cousins are not affected by this.

Genetics aside, it's plain immoral! I mean, they're almost your direct family. Geez, I don't know how can you even consider this... :(

almost means they aren't ;)

That is just wrong. Ok. Besides havn't you people heard of inbreading?

It varies enormously around the world. This, from www.answers.com/topic/incest -

"In many areas of the Arab world and southern India, it is estimated that as many as 50% of marriages are between first cousins. In southern India it is still practiced widely where a maternal uncle (mothers's brother) must marry the 1st daughter. This is considered abnormal in northern India, although historically it has had very few health consequences."

I personally have no interest in any of my cousins, but I have no problem with it for other people. The whole genetic argument is somewhat of a smokescreen to try to modernise prescriptions which are based on traditional, religion-based morality. If it's consensual and between people of closely similar ages then good on them.

I personally have no interest in any of my cousins, but I have no problem with it for other people. The whole genetic argument is somewhat of a smokescreen to try to modernise prescriptions which are based on traditional, religion-based morality. If it's consensual and between people of closely similar ages then good on them.
Exactly. This is a cultural norm. Nothing more.

Exactly. This is a cultural norm. Nothing more.

That isn't quite what I meant. Culture influences the incest taboo, but goats don't have any culture, yet they seem to have an aversion to having sex with their siblings. So there is definately an important biological component involved as well. That makes it immoral in any kind of natural law construct of morality.

That isn't quite what I meant. Culture influences the incest taboo, but goats don't have any culture, yet they seem to have an aversion to having sex with their siblings. So there is definately an important biological component involved as well. That makes it immoral in any kind of natural law construct of morality.
But clearly some cultures have done away with this taboo...and those cultures have no bred themselves into retardation.

Other forms of incest taboos are pretty well universal, with exceptional exceptions only:). This one is not universal.

Did you accidentally log on as Samsonica?

consenting adults should be allowed go at it at their discretion,regardless of relation.the possible risks of genitic defects is increased,but surely that's a matter for the couple in question to decide upon,not the government.although i dont see it being legalized in any western country in the near future.gay marraige is the current thing,we've beaten them to 'kissing cousins'

Well, the idea of kissing/shagging/marrying/etc. one of my own cousins is simultaneously terrifying and revolting to me. But the idea of some of my over-age cousins (who would be cousins to each other also) kissing/shagging/marrying is amusing and nothing else.

Honestly, I think all consenting adult relationships should be legal. Even siblings and parent-child, as long as consent is possible and given from both sides. Parent-child derives a somewhat "eww" response even from me, but I'm determined for relational freedom. The rest is fine by me; again, the idea of being in a relationship with my sister, even if she was near my age, is disgusting to me, but when it's other people, I don't care. I know in many Arabic (and probably other) cultures first cousins are EXPECTED to marry oftentimes. I see nothing wrong with it. Of course one has to keep an eye on past generations in order to avoid genetic defects if they want to have kids, but that's not too difficult to do, a little research and a visit to a doctor.

In summary: kissing cousins = just fine

But clearly some cultures have done away with this taboo...and those cultures have no bred themselves into retardation.

Other forms of incest taboos are pretty well universal, with exceptional exceptions only:). This one is not universal.

Did you accidentally log on as Samsonica?

. . .no. I intentionally logged on as Xenophobialand. I have no idea who Samsonica is.

*scrolls back over page*

Oh, I see. I was apparently under the mistaken impression that since I was the one who mentioned culture, you were referencing my post when you answered Samsonica. Apparently I was wrong.

*goes back to kicking dirt in the corner.*

Exactly. This is a cultural norm. Nothing more.

I know why you brought it up.


SINUHUE AND JOCABIA ARE COUSINS!!!

I know why you brought it up.


SINUHUE AND JOCABIA ARE COUSINS!!!
Kehehehee...and I'm just trying to get societal acceptance of our future shagging sessions?

Kehehehee...and I'm just trying to get societal acceptance of our future shagging sessions?

Man, I almost said something really dirty. I had to stop myself lest this thread get closed again. You're lucky, little girl.

Man, I almost said something really dirty. I had to stop myself lest this thread get closed again. You're lucky, little girl.
You could always TG it to me...the hubby's not coming home today after all, and that means another two weeks with nothing to do but enjoy whatever material you send my way...

You could always TG it to me...the hubby's not coming home today after all, and that means another two weeks with nothing to do but enjoy whatever material you send my way...

You never answer my TG's, Sin. Oh, you put up a good show, but when it gets too hot, Sin gets uncomfortable. :p

You never answer my TG's, Sin. Oh, you put up a good show, but when it gets too hot, Sin gets uncomfortable. :p
That sounds like a challenge. Meet you in TG land!

Who cares? Is it really my decision as to what other people do? I mean, seriously!

Being from the Southern States.....its kind of expected down there.

*plays dualing banjos*

First cousins, I'd say no. Second cousins, maybe. Third cousins, hell they can marry. My family is all screwed up. Some of my first cousins are over 40. I have once removeds younger than me :confused:

You haven't seen some of my cousins *wink wink, nudge nudge*...
That's irrelevant. I can kiss or mate with your cousins since I'm not related to them. :D j/k

Thing is, YOU shouldn't as I shouldn't do the same with mine. Anyway, there's been something not entirely certain from the beginning of this discussion: what kind of kissing? For example, here in Argentina we greet each other with kisses on the cheek. That's fine with cousins, but I'm strongly against standard-kissing them on the lips or french-kissing them.

I see nothing wrong with cousins kissing. I even see nothing wrong with SIBLINGS kissing. Really, people should just butt out of what happens in other families, cuz quite frankly, it's none of your business.

Siblings have married before, and guess what?! THE WORLD NEVER ENDED!

I don't think there's anything wrong with it. Then again, I'm attracted to my first cousin, so I might be biased. ;) Still, there's no rational reason to be against such a relationship, except that there's a somewhat higher chance of birth defects. And a relationship needn't be about having kids. The only argument the anti- side has is "EWW, IT'S LIEK, GROSS, LOLZ."

I don't see what the problem is with cousins falling in love, or marrying, for that matter. Heck, I wouldn't even care if a brother and sister did.
I'm not sure how I feel about them having kids though.
On the one hand, I want to think "Oh, reproductive freedom!"
But on the other hand, I want to think "But it's condemning their children to higher likelihood of genetic disorders, and their children after that, and their children after that..."

The way I see it, the love and sex bit iis really a non-issue, it's the having kids bit that's the problem.

humans need a population of about 500 people to avoid genetiv problems long term, and within 500 people the furthest away cousin is only probably twentieth, if the population has been going continiously.