NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/30/national/30baby.html?hp&ex=1125374400&en=dd9622f86877cdc1&ei=5094&partner=homepage

From the New York Times:

FALLS CITY, Neb., Aug. 29 - On Sunday evening, Matthew Koso tipped three ounces of formula into his 5-day-old daughter's mouth, then hoisted her atop his shoulder in hope of a burp. On Tuesday morning, he is scheduled to be arraigned on charges for which the newborn is the state's prime piece of evidence.

Mr. Koso is 22. The baby's mother, Crystal, is 14. He is charged with statutory rape, even though they were wed with their parents' blessing in May, crossing into Kansas because their own state prohibits marriages of people under 17.

The Nebraska attorney general accuses Mr. Koso of being a pedophile; they say it is true love.

"We don't want grown men having sex with young girls," said Jon Bruning, the attorney general. "We make a lot of choices for our children: we don't allow them to vote; we don't allow them to drink; we don't allow them to drive cars; we don't allow them to serve in wars at age 13, whether they want to or not; and we don't allow them to have sex with grown men."

But Mr. Koso's mother, Peggy, said she and her husband of 25 years were proud that their son did not disappear like so many deadbeat dads.

"He's not always lived up to his responsibilities, but this time he will," Ms. Koso said. "He could have left, but he didn't. He said, 'Mom, I love Crystal; I love this child.' "

Outrage over the case has rippled through this town of 4,800 about 100 miles from both Omaha and Kansas City, and to two state capitals. The governor of Kansas, Kathleen Sebelius, embarrassed by her state's status as one of the few allowing children as young as 12 to marry, has said she will propose a raise in the minimum age when the Legislature reconvenes in January.

Meanwhile, Mr. Bruning's office has been deluged with letters, the vast majority angrily urging that he leave the couple alone. One, from a woman named Patricia, said, "I'm sure your time can be better spent putting away real criminals."

Studies show that one in five teenagers have sex before they turn 15, and about 150,000 babies are born each year to a minor parent. In Nebraska, there were 25 births to mothers under 15 in 2002, the latest year for which statistics are available. In Kansas, five girls under 15 were married in 2003, three in 2002 and six in 2001.

In Nebraska, as in many other states, intercourse between someone who is 19 and someone younger than 16 is classified as statutory rape. It is illegal here even if the couple is married at the time.

But experts said it was extremely rare for a man to be prosecuted for statutory rape when he has married his minor partner.

A judge in Syracuse last September delayed a one-and-a-half-to-three-year prison sentence until this summer so that a 38-year-old defendant could marry a pregnant 16-year-old; in Florida in 2001, charges were reduced to a misdemeanor when a 17-year-old married the 13-year-old girl expecting their second child, and he received six months' probation.

"It's odd that the state would be prosecuting someone who did not leave the girl pregnant and unwed," said Rigel C. Oliveri, a law professor at the University of Missouri who has studied laws on statutory rape since 1998. "I guess they're just trying to send a message to other men who are contemplating doing this type of thing."

Mr. Koso faces up to 50 years in prison, and Mr. Bruning said he was considering additional charges based on complaints that Mr. Koso had sex with other young girls in the past. Mr. Koso's lawyer would not allow him to discuss that, but his mother said he told her that he had dated only one other girl under 16 and that they did not have sex.

For now, Mr. Koso, out on $5,000 bond, sits in the basement of his parents' home, where the walls are papered with the pink-and-purple, heart-filled love notes that his wife, a ninth-grader, scribbled on notebook paper in class. A crib crammed next to the bed has Winnie the Pooh sheets to match the keychain dangling from her schoolgirl purse.

The couple named their 7-pound, 1-ounce baby girl, born Wednesday morning, Samara Ann Koso, after a character in the horror movie "The Ring."

As Mr. Koso changed Samara's diaper three times in 30 minutes on Sunday, Crystal worked on a homework assignment for her world history class.

"I couldn't be any happier than I am right now," Mr. Koso said, adding of Mr. Bruning: "He's a home wrecker. He's trying to rip a father away from a child, and rip a husband away from a wife."

Matthew and Crystal met when she was 8, and he played video games with her half-brother. Mr. Koso, who was in special education classes for attention deficit disorder and other learning problems, graduated from high school in 2001 and joined the Marine Corps, but left after four months on a medical discharge. When Crystal's mother had no car, Mr. Koso drove her to the doctor and the grocery store.

"He's always been friends with people that were younger," said Peggy Koso, recalling her son at age 5 or 6 passing hours with building blocks and racing cars with a neighbor of 3 or 4. "His own peers never accepted him."

The two became a couple, according to Crystal's "Happy Anniversary" drawing on the wall, on Sept. 17, 2003. She was 12 and he 20. Exactly a year later, Crystal's mother, Cecilia Guyer, who is divorced from her father, filed for a restraining order against Mr. Koso, writing of him: "He's too old for early teens. He needs to stay away."

Despite the court order, both mothers now say, Crystal continued to go to the Kosos' home after school and stay through supper, sleeping over in Mr. Koso's basement room on weekends. Ms. Koso said she spoke to her son about the risks of pregnancy and prison and made excuses to check on the couple frequently when they were alone. Ms. Guyer said that she asked Crystal why she seemed to be using fewer tampons, but that she denied being sexually active.

Then one afternoon when Ms. Guyer and her daughter were shopping at a second-hand store for a dress for an eighth grade dance, Ms. Guyer noticed that Crystal had stretch marks. The couple confessed, but said they were not interested in adoption. On May 3, after consulting with a lawyer, they were married in a judge's chambers 18 miles away in Hiawatha, Kan., both in jeans, she carrying pink carnations, he with a matching boutonniere.

The local police came the next day to question Crystal and her mother, but no charges were filed until Mr. Bruning's office, which frequently prosecutes crimes in rural counties, got involved in late July.

"This was not a close call," the attorney general said in an interview. "We weren't talking about a 19-year-old-and-one-day senior in high school and his 15-year-old-and-364-day sophomore girlfriend. We were talking about a grown man and a child."

Mr. Bruning said he was shocked that more than 80 percent of the 250 people - most from outside Nebraska - who had contacted his office opposed the prosecution. Similar sentiment abounds here in Falls City, where people say putting Mr. Koso in jail would most likely land his wife and child on welfare, an unnecessary double-burden for taxpayers.

"They are trying to make a right out of a wrong," Mardell Rehrs, 67, said of the couple on Monday morning. "Give them a chance."

Residents here said Mr. Koso was being unfairly singled out. One 1995 graduate of Falls City High said seven girls in his class of 60 had babies before graduation, including one who was pregnant, like Crystal, in the eighth grade.

Ron Prichard, who works at the railroad and has a 12-year-old daughter, said Matthew and Crystal would not be parents today "if her parents were being parents."

"Yeah, the kid did wrong, but the parents allowed it to happen," Mr. Prichard said.

Mr. Koso's mother spent the last three nights sleeping on the living room couch, next to the baby's bassinet, to handle the nightly feedings. She and Ms. Guyer, who each receive Supplemental Security Income for disabilities, say they will take care of Samara during the day, once Crystal returns to school after Labor Day.

The families hope that Mr. Koso is placed on probation instead of being sentenced to prison so he can keep his $9.27 an hour job loading trucks.

Maybe a year from now, the couple says, they will be able to afford their own place. Crystal, who is good at math, said that she had no interest in college, but that she would finish high school and perhaps become a nurse. They plan to have two more children.

"But later on," said Crystal, who says her favorite part of motherhood thus far is when Samara is asleep. "Much later on."

I don't see who the Attorney General is protecting with this. All this is doing is costing a child her father, and possibly ruining the lives of the people involved. Don't forget the tax dollars being spent. This is complete bullshit.

Whew....

Well, what can i say.... the guy is actually answering for his acts, and trying to fix things, might as well let him. Besides, i thought that marriage in a state must be respected by the other states...

The law is clear. He knew what he was doing when he banged a child. Prosecute him.

This is a very muddled arena...no-win situation here.

The law is clear. He knew what he was doing when he banged a child. Prosecute him.
Yeah--how does anyone defend this shit? If a 20 year old guy had been sniffing around my 12 year old daughter, he'd have gotten one warning--a warning shot, to be specific--and the second one would have been in his crotch. No jury alive would convict me.

I wanna marry a twelve year old!!!

wait... I'm in Kansas now!!! :p :fluffle:

wait... I'm in Kansas now!!!

You poor soul.

I like how they named their kid after a character in the ring.

You poor soul.
But I can marry 12 year olds!

Yeah, take a guy who is married and helping to raise a child and put him in jail. Who exactly will this help? Sure it's pretty sick, but they are married, they have both families' blessing, and there's a chld to be taken care of. What a waste of taxpayer money.

he'd have gotten one warning--a warning shot, to be specific--and the second one would have been in his crotch. No jury alive would convict me.I would convict you.

But I can marry 12 year olds!

Exactly.

I'm in Kansas too! It sucks =(

The state laws permitting a 14 year old to get married should be changed.

Also, I may be mistaken, but I recall some sort of legal change, as a result of the attack on gay marriage, which means states need not respect marriage from other states anymore.

Assuming they married after he raped her, I assume he is not protected by the legal absurdities which shield 'spousal rapists.'

Cat-tribe may have more certainty here.

In other news, the first evidence of time travel is found as Kansas sinks deeper and deeper in the dark ages.

Disgusting.

I wanna get a marryin a 12 year old whilst teh marryin is good.


And kansas is awesome, aside from the fact that the nearest white castle is in mossouri. :(

Age is just a number. Why can't the state keep out of these purely personal affairs, both parties were willing and consenting?

Of course, the whole question is one of 'legal age' , their law deems someone under the age of 17 not 'mature' enough to legally marry. So strictly speaking they did break the law- is there a fault with this law?

IMHO, yes. Of course, such laws are generally generally drafted by elderly men probably decades (or even over a century ago). Hasn't times changed enough for these standards to be re-weighed?

FYI, I'm over 40 years old and I'm currently raising two girls in their late-teenage years.

Age is just a number. Why can't the state keep out of these purely personal affairs, both parties were willing and consenting?

Of course, the whole question is one of 'legal age' , their law deems someone under the age of 17 not 'mature' enough to legally marry. So strictly speaking they did break the law- is there a fault with this law?

IMHO, yes. Of course, such laws are generally generally drafted by elderly men probably decades (or even over a century ago). Hasn't times changed enough for these standards to be re-weighed?

FYI, I'm over 40 years old and I'm currently raising two girls in their late-teenage years.
Are you actually arguing that a 12 year old girl (when the relationship began, 13 when she became pregnant) is sufficiently mature to handle an adult relationship of that sort? That's ludicrous. We don't even let kids get learner's permits in most states until they're 15, and in some some, it's older.

I like how they named their kid after a character in the ring.

yeah thats funny. i think that the two should be left alone, they are married and love each other.

Yes. The age should be raised to at least 21 as most below that, hell alot ABOVE that, are too immature to do anything else.

The guy deserves to be punished. He should have tried dating his own age instead of hanging around at the corner by the local Junior High School.

This from a twenty-one year old.

Age is just a number. Why can't the state keep out of these purely personal affairs, both parties were willing and consenting?

Of course, the whole question is one of 'legal age' , their law deems someone under the age of 17 not 'mature' enough to legally marry. So strictly speaking they did break the law- is there a fault with this law?

IMHO, yes. Of course, such laws are generally generally drafted by elderly men probably decades (or even over a century ago). Hasn't times changed enough for these standards to be re-weighed?

FYI, I'm over 40 years old and I'm currently raising two girls in their late-teenage years.

If you're 40 then you should know that big decisions like having kids and marriage aren't just any simple matters. Some children (perhaps like the girl in the article) might be more mature than other their age but it's much smarter to have them wait with sex and marriage till they're older. It's impossible to have some kind of legal individual screenings to find the mature ones and let them marry and have kids etc. How come children are in such a hurry to get married and have kids anyway? Many of them are still kids THEMSELVES. A child raising another child is just tragic.

It is however extremely comforting that you, as a father of two, see nothing wrong with older guys 20+ having sex with little girls of age 12+. I bet you'd be ok with some 25 year old guy banging your dauther when she was just 13 (or even just 12!), right? And having kids with her? Consenting to something doesn't mean the person in question _understands_ it. The person can still be 100% ignorant.

.. is sufficiently mature to handle an adult relationship of that sort? That's ludicrous.
Yes. The age should be raised to at least 21 Men are not mature for marriage before 25.

I say we raise the age to 25...for the men.

The person can still be 100% ignorant.everybody knows that teens under 16 are 100% ignorant.

I would convict you.

Like you'd be selected.

There are some bizarre laws out there. I was reading a story the other day about a guy put in jail for performing oral sex on his wife. Which is still illegal in many states "because it is un-natural" or some such. (damn christian legal system)

I however don't think any of the age of consent laws are among those bizarre ones. I'm 26, and have been far to close to a relationship with someone younger than me recently. Ever been lied to about someones age, successfully, for a VERY long period of time? Yeah.. I almost got myself in alot of trouble. And I've come to realize something about the mentality of younger people, and the lack of wisdom in our thinking as youths. (No matter how much we wanna say we're adults and can make our own decisions)

Looking through my circle of friends and all the people I've met in 26 years, personally, I don't think most people really start hitting that "adult" stage until their nearing the mid-twenties. At 24 or so, up until then its all just a training period.

But anyway, subject at hand. I have to agree with the guy who said the girls parents wheren't doing their job. If the parents had been acting like parents this situation never would have occurred. I personally believe this to be the number one problem in our country and can't understand why the government doesn't want to do something about this. As to what they COULD do, or what any solutions to this problem are, I could talk all day but thats another subject.

As to the actual case against him.... thats a tough call. While I don't like the idea of letting a criminal (which is the appropriate term no matter how liberal you are or how you look at it) off just because he has a child. At the sametime I can't sit here and say prosecute him and take him to jail!

After all, he IS married to the girl he "raped" and is raising a child with her.

And no.... someone in middle school should not be able to decide that they want to have sex with someone thats long graduated high school. There's a different mentality on both parties, and personally, I think when this DOES happen theres a 99% chance that BOTH people involved need to be seeing a psychiatrist regularly. Especially if that 20 year old is honestly using the "We're in love" reasoning. By 20 you should at least have SOME understanding of how confusing the word "love" is to most people. Especially a 13 year old girl.

everybody knows that teens under 16 are 100% ignorant.

You might live in stupid-country where that IS the case. In the rest of the world some of the teenagers are smart/mature and some are not. Either way a kid of just 12 years is most probably not mature enough to have children and marry.

Stupid Nebraska. I never did see the purpose of acting like there's something wrong when there clearly isn't, and it's just common sense that when the only things that could be percieved to be wrong are based on social views then nothing is wrong.
If she's happy and he's taking respsonsibilty on his own then what's the purpose of interfering other than to be a giant asshole?

Stupid Nebraska. I never did see the purpose of acting like there's something wrong when there clearly isn't, and it's just common sense that when the only things that could be percieved to be wrong are based on social views then nothing is wrong.
If she's happy and he's taking respsonsibilty on his own then what's the purpose of interfering other than to be a giant asshole?

Because she's just a little child and most likely doesn't understand the scope of having a child (at age 12 right?) and marrying at age 13? Since marriage and kids are tough matters even for many of age 20+ don't you PERHAPS think it's a LITTLE tougher for a child?

I mean...a pedofile that is 35 (I know that I spelled that wrong) could very well convince a child of 10 to have sex with him, or at least let him touch her. Or to let him take some nude pictures of her. It's not an unreal scenario, cases like this pop up in the newspaper every now and then.. Is that ok? They are both consenting to it. I bet she's going to regret that decision a few years (days?) later. Think before you write.

"Crystal, who is good at math, said that she had no interest in college, but that she would finish high school and perhaps become a nurse."

Here we have an indicator of Crystal's level of intelligence.

... Besides, i thought that marriage in a state must be respected by the other states...


Oh, its legal for them to be married, but its illegal for them to have sex. So in truth there is nothing wrong here. They have every right to be married they just can have sex with eachother yet.



And on a side note,
I feel really weird about this situation, I mean "Yea he is doing the right thing, but...." I dunno. I'd just leave it alone. Thats why I'm glad I live in Washington. All the crazies move to Idaho. ;)

I'm too tired to remember (and too laxy to read the article again) but did the guy know he was commiting a crime? I'm not a law student but I know pretty well what I can and what I can't do where I live. Did he? If he didn't...well, not that I care that much. A crime is a crime. Just because I didn't know murdering someone is a crime doesn't mean I'm innocent, I still did it.

And oh...is it _really_ against the law in some states in the US to have oral sex? Are certain positions outlawed as well? I've heard rumors but it'd be nice if someone who actually knew could tell me.

Oh, its legal for them to be married, but its illegal for them to have sex. So in truth there is nothing wrong here. They have every right to be married they just can have sex with eachother yet.



And on a side note,
I feel really weird about this situation, I mean "Yea he is doing the right thing, but...." I dunno. I'd just leave it alone. Thats why I'm glad I live in Washington. All the crazies move to Idaho. ;)

Something's fishy when it's ok to be married but not to have sex. Both should be allowed at the same time. Preferably at a reasanable age and not 13.

Because she's just a little child and most likely doesn't understand the scope of having a child (at age 12 right?) and marrying at age 13? Since marriage and kids are tough matters even for many of age 20+ don't you PERHAPS think it's a LITTLE tougher for a child?

Well, whether she understood the scope of things before or after, she apparently does now, and if she's fine with it then I still fail to where the problem is. Personally, I think we should be glad it happened with a couple that is willing to take responsibility for what they did and punish the ones that don't instead.

Well, whether she understood the scope of things before or after, she apparently does now, and if she's fine with it then I still fail to where the problem is. Personally, I think we should be glad it happened with a couple that is willing to take responsibility for what they did and punish the ones that don't instead.


What, EXACTLY, makes you think she fathoms her choices? She can't even decide on wether she has no interest in college or if she's going to be a nurse...
She's 13. And got raped at age 12. This is indeed an optimal start in life.

*edit* Sleepy time, it's late as hell in Sweden. Either way I think he should be convicted. However that's noy up to jus tany citizen but legal powers. They'll decide so let's just wait and see.

What kind of state makes the wedding age below the age of consent? Surely they realized that this would come up eventually?

Wow, they're screwed... get it?!

What kind of state makes the wedding age below the age of consent? Surely they realized that this would come up eventually?

Thats why they left state and got married elsewhere. They COULDN'T marry in the state they live.

What, EXACTLY, makes you think she fathoms her choices? She can't even decide on wether she has no interest in college or if she's going to be a nurse...
She's 13. And got raped at age 12. This is indeed an optimal start in life.

What, EXACTLY, makes me think she fathoms her choices now, if not before, is that she's choosen to raise the kid and still manages to stay in school. And statuatory rape is described as sex with anyone underaged, it didn't say specifically she was raped. I imagine if she was raped she wouldn't have married him.

Either way, I'm done arguing. I don't stay involved in arguments with someone who's so excited to punish someone that they blow off the most important issues of a situation.

And oh...is it _really_ against the law in some states in the US to have oral sex? Are certain positions outlawed as well? I've heard rumors but it'd be nice if someone who actually knew could tell me.


I found this page of bizzare sex laws, not sure on validity of this stuff. But hell, some of its quite hilarious heh.

http://www.dribbleglass.com/subpages/strange/sexlaws.htm

And I actually found the page I was referring to from the oral sex law in a matter of minutes.

http://www.journalism.sfsu.edu/flux/gSpot/sexLaw.html




::edit:: They cite the case in mention on that first page as well.

Ugh... This reminds me of this spacy girl four years ago back in middle school... Ran away from home like three-four times inbetween the beginning of 7th and the beginning of 8th. And apparently the parents were just very ineffectual, as they actually tried to do something about it. Last I'd heard she'd gone to Charter somewhere between 2 and 3 times. Probably has had a kid, died of drug overdose, or is currently pregnant's my estimation.

It's mind boggling. The thought processes leading up to it alone, let alone the actual roots behind pedophilia.

Well, to throw in my two cents...

Yes, he broke a law. This is very true. But sentencing someone for a crime purely for the sake of punishing the person is a form of emotional sado-masochism. Punishing is meant to be a way to teach someone to do better. Most normal parents punish their children to socialize them, not because they are angry. So, punishment should be for reform.
But he has reformed on his own. This man clearly has cleaned up his act - he married her (as opposed to leaving her and screwing with every other 13 year old out there) and is taking responsibility for the child (or, more accurately, the children, since she's still one too!). Therefore, punishing him is wrong on our part, even if he initially did wrong - yes, it's a case of "two wrongs don't make a right." The least we can do is leave them alone to try to make things right themselves. Those with any ability to do so can also try to help the couple make things right again.

And yes, I also agree with the sentiment about "if her parents had..." but what about his parents, hmm? I say it sheds light onto the flaws of both sets.

Well yes I'm sure his parents screwed him up. I know his side of this from similar personal experience. But he's in his 20's, much harder for them to "parent" at this point.

But the thing that I keep thinking about.... other than the whole no college nursing thing that I did catch as well when reading it. Was the part about them planning on HAVING TWO MORE CHILDREN...... I can't help but give this pitiful laugh at this part.

Anybody else remember back in high school having a g/f (or yourself for you females) planning out the future marriage and kids... all of that. It was all completely delusional and unrealistic. But at that age.... it can become the dream for the future. Life goals so to speak. And he's supporting that...making less than $10 an hour with a wife who doesn't want to go to college. Even having the notion of having more children is the most irresponsible thing I've ever heard of in my life.

How is it that our society develops this mentality where having a kid is like getting another dog? You do your best not to have the first kid unless you can financially support yourself at least twice over. How could you even think of having more children, even years down the road, when you have no idea where your going to be financially next month?

Married or not. It was statutory rape. You can't expect a twelve year old to make a rational decision about sex. Now this article is written sympathizing with the statutory rapist--there's a clear bias. But I really don't see any reason for debate over this. I mean it is pretty much arguing for the case of a pedophile. And the fact this guy is a monogomous (borderline) pedophile, doesn't make any difference.

What kind of state makes the wedding age below the age of consent? Surely they realized that this would come up eventually?

A number of states have a three-year difference rule for those below the age of consent. In such a state, a pair of 14-year-olds could theoretically get married and have sex.

The penalty for masturbation in Indonesia is decapitation.

That'll show 'em.

Like you'd be selected.maybe..I dont know-I dont care.

If selected... I would send his ass to Jail...Its all he deserves for using his firearm...The standart charge in this case is Attempted Murder

Would you let him walk?

Whats the big deal anyways? Wheres there's grass, there's mowing to be done.

(Aieeee! I'm turning into redneck! help!)

Thats why they left state and got married elsewhere. They COULDN'T marry in the state they live.
oh...then yes...Trow his ass in Jail...

The Wife and specially the Husband ...they deserve all this mess...cos they are idiots...they should have stayed in Kansas.

Men are not mature for marriage before 25.

I say we raise the age to 25...for the men.
Heh. I know more women less mature than males of the same age than the other way around. Having it based on sex is, well, sexist. :)

How about a flat age of 25. Sounds good.

For those of you that say he messed up her life and should be punished cause he got her pregnant, would you also want another 12 year old boy castrated for it?

I mean the real issue here is ephebophila or possibly pedophilia. The word pedophilia is thrown around without most knowing that that's reserved for pre-pubescents. At 12 puberty could have begun, and since she got pregnant, I think that's a strong assumption. However, that's just a personal gripe of mine I guess, and has no sway over the arguement whatsoever.

Would you rather the guy go to jail and the baby have no father? I mean, I know that some people lately have been saying that fathers are not necessary or that fathers are replacable, but I just don't buy it.

If I was told that the person I had known as "dad" my whole life wasn't really my dad, and that my father was put in prison for being with my mom no matter what the age, I'd be mad as hell.

I really don't think it's our business to decide one's fate. Let the girl decide I say, but I know that won't happen. It'll be the courts.

This is a weird discussion as I recently found out a bit about this in my family. :(

My uncle married a 13 year and had been dating her for more than a year. I think such a thing is sick and I have lost respect, what little there was, for my uncle.

They are no longer married and their parting has been bitter. He had treated her as a child and was very domineering. In relationships where one person is still emotionally and intellectually immature, the less immature one takes control. It turned abusive and I doubt it won't happen in this relationship.

Throw the ebebophile in jail and find a new set of parents for the child. A 12 year old cannot raise a child and any child realizing that age difference will be forever screwed up.

Well, to throw in my two cents...

Yes, he broke a law. This is very true. But sentencing someone for a crime purely for the sake of punishing the person is a form of emotional sado-masochism. Punishing is meant to be a way to teach someone to do better. Most normal parents punish their children to socialize them, not because they are angry. So, punishment should be for reform.
But he has reformed on his own. This man clearly has cleaned up his act - he married her (as opposed to leaving her and screwing with every other 13 year old out there) and is taking responsibility for the child (or, more accurately, the children, since she's still one too!). Therefore, punishing him is wrong on our part, even if he initially did wrong - yes, it's a case of "two wrongs don't make a right." The least we can do is leave them alone to try to make things right themselves. Those with any ability to do so can also try to help the couple make things right again.

And yes, I also agree with the sentiment about "if her parents had..." but what about his parents, hmm? I say it sheds light onto the flaws of both sets.

My thoughts exactly.

Throw the ebebophile in jail and find a new set of parents for the child.

Yes mother.

The law is clear. He knew what he was doing when he banged a child. Prosecute him.
What he can Marry someone but not sex them?-Thats insane.

Because she's just a little child and most likely doesn't understand the scope of having a child (at age 12 right?) and marrying at age 13? Since marriage and kids are tough matters even for many of age 20+ don't you PERHAPS think it's a LITTLE tougher for a child?

I mean...a pedofile that is 35 (I know that I spelled that wrong) could very well convince a child of 10 to have sex with him, or at least let him touch her. Or to let him take some nude pictures of her. It's not an unreal scenario, cases like this pop up in the newspaper every now and then.. Is that ok? They are both consenting to it. I bet she's going to regret that decision a few years (days?) later. Think before you write.

The difference here is that the parents weren't just apathetic, they knew this guy and I'm sure they can tell that he really loves her. If he doesn't then he would have just skipped town and left her on her own.

Married or not. It was statutory rape. You can't expect a twelve year old to make a rational decision about sex. Now this article is written sympathizing with the statutory rapist--there's a clear bias. But I really don't see any reason for debate over this. I mean it is pretty much arguing for the case of a pedophile. And the fact this guy is a monogomous (borderline) pedophile, doesn't make any difference.

The thing is, no person who commited statutory rape, got the girl pregnant, but married her, has ever been prosecuted. Maybe because most Attorney Generals aren't dumbfucks. Calling our side "arguing for the case of a pedophile" is unfair because the word pedophile carries so much baggage. It makes one think of a 40 yo man and an 8 yo boy, but in this case it was a man in his early 20's and a 13(?) yo girl, while now it is a huge age difference in a few years it will hardly be anything, and the fact that he married her and is still there for her should be proof that he actually cares and that hes not just some dirty child molester.

If Kansas legalizes Gay Marriage, then Michael Jackson could move in with Toto and wed a 12 year old boy. Fairytale ending.

The thing is, no person who commited statutory rape, got the girl pregnant, but married her, has ever been prosecuted. Maybe because most Attorney Generals aren't dumbfucks. Calling our side "arguing for the case of a pedophile" is unfair because the word pedophile carries so much baggage. It makes one think of a 40 yo man and an 8 yo boy, but in this case it was a man in his early 20's and a 13(?) yo girl, while now it is a huge age difference in a few years it will hardly be anything, and the fact that he married her and is still there for her should be proof that he actually cares and that hes not just some dirty child molester.

Wow. Someone I agree with for the most part. I honestly think they should ask the girl what she wants. Some 13 year olds are smarter than the message board junkies here.

First off, you have to realise that the law exists for a reason. The couple, or at very least the man, knowingly broke the law by crossing state boundaries to engage in a marriage contract that was not legal within their home state. There are very good reasons for this. Gone are the days in most Western countries where people can legally marry children, which covers all persons under the age of minority, without parental consent. Even with parental consent, certain restrictions apply. Simply because the girl has entered menarche does not mean -- despite what some men might think -- she is prepared to have children. The law has been broken and he is duly subject to the repercussions of that act.

Second, the assumption that this is merely a difference in age is rather trite. If this was between a thirty year-old and, say, a sixteen year-old in certain jurisdictions, my mind might still rebel, but an average sixteen year-old is responsible for his or her actions and legally embark upon marriage, with parental consent where necessary. Besides, as someone noted, if one can't legally consent to sex, how can one be legally married, particularly in light of the prevailing views in the United States regarding marriage.

Second, the assumption that this is merely a difference in age is rather trite. If this was between a thirty year-old and, say, a sixteen year-old in certain jurisdictions, my mind might still rebel, but an average sixteen year-old is responsible for his or her actions and legally embark upon marriage, with parental consent where necessary. Besides, as someone noted, if one can't legally consent to sex, how can one be legally married, particularly in light of the prevailing views in the United States regarding marriage.

So you base whether someone is responsible based on age alone, instead of mental maturity?

Why?

I mean, I know some 22 year olds who I feel should not be able to make many decisions yet, and know some 14 year olds who I'd trust with my car or to do my college math work!

Also, some bodies mature faster than others. I didn't start shaving til I was 18 and I didn't start puberty until 15, whereas my best friend's voice changed when he was 11 and started shaving at 14.

It's not as simple as "I disagree with it, lock him up." You're looking at this from the angle of "he's an icky pedo." The law is what's the problem here. Two states have different ones.

Exactly, right now you have a loving father, loving grandparents, a loving mother and you're are about to tear the family apart, remove the only source of income, and wreck both the mother, the father, and the childs life.
I do not see the logic in persecuting someone simply because you can.

And while the difference in age might be quite significant now, in thirty years it will be a 40 yo and a 48 yo. That's nothing extreme...

Something about this whole situation bugs me. If the girl's parents were so upset about it, why did they wait so damn long?

Also, I may be mistaken, but I recall some sort of legal change, as a result of the attack on gay marriage, which means states need not respect marriage from other states anymore.


You are mistaken. Such a legal change would require a change to article 4 of the constitution and there hasnt been a change in the constitution at all since 1992.

Of course the man should be charged. Its not just about the gap in the age. Its about the fact that 12 year olds are children and adults should not be having sex with children. There is such a thing as deterent value, what is to stop abusive parents selling their children (who are too terrified to object and state they are being forced) to someone who can hop to another state, marry them, and then rape them legally for so long as the child is young enough to keep their attention?

Children should not be having sex, and adults who have sex with children should be held accountable. The girl's parents should also be answerable if they knew their daughter was being raped and didnt nothing to intervene.

Every case should of course be judged on its own merits. That means at the very least this man should be charged and the merits of the case presented to a jury of his peers. That way it is made clear (for the sake of deterence) that one could be in very serious trouble if they engage in statutory rape, and if the merits of this particular case indicate that the person should not be legally penalised, then his peers can give him a 'not-guilty' verdict.

At this point, they should be left alone. What is the point of putting a father away in prison when his child will need him.

This is an issue that needs to get the politicans and socialist out of the scenario. This age difference isn't offensive. In fact, it was quite common not to long ago.

Married or not an adult had sex with a child and should be castrated for it!!
12 year olds are easily manipulated by adults they are still learning their way in the world.

Fucking vermin is all he is, letting him off would be outrageous tantamou8nt to sending out a message that you can have sex with kids as long as they get pregnant or married, yay legal paedos...pathetic!
Does this mean that a parent can mess with their kids because they will take responsibility if anything goes wrong or because there is a loving bond there???
It is wrong and if you can't see that you are not a parent, know little about 12 year olds, are too young yourself or need to see a shrink!!

If the guy is gonna be charged so should the girls parents. It doesn't matter if he had the parents blessing-no 14 year old should be allowed to get married and be impregnated by a 22 year old. I'm sure that he loves her and while girls are more mature a 14 no matter who she is, should not be allowed to marry. It is also the states fault. They should have done something about it before she had a baby-the preist or whoever married of them is also a fault.

Statutory rape's an edgy concept anyway. A 14-year old is really not that different to a 16-year old, and can make decisions. Loads of fourteen year olds screw each other. I'm not totally comfortable with it, but it's certainly not rape.

everybody knows that teens under 16 are 100% ignorant. They zapped my mind with the Intelligiser on my birthday earlier this year. :) That's why I got good marks in Science.

Statutory rape is there to protect the child, simple as.

The man would have some defence if he was unaware that the girl was so young but he knew damn well he was having sex with a 12 year old!! A 12 YEAR OLD!

Too right the parents should be prosecuted. If they knew they should be charged with aiding a felony or something. They are obviouly unsuitable to be parents ffs.