NationStates Jolt Archive

the middle one

a levy has broken leaving the french quarter under waist high water -- 80% of the city is flooded

a water main broke meaning that the water is undrinkable unless boiled

most of the electricity is out

its freaking hot outside with 100% humidity

hundreds of thousands of people will be out of their homes (if they still exist) for weeks.

hundreds of people are looting stores all over the city

The media are running hours behind on reporting this. The situation is desperate. The pumps that are online (and no numbers reported yet) can't work until the two breaches are repaired. All the water must be pumped back into Lake Pontchartrain which will then run right back into the city.

The biggest breach is 300 feet long and the Lake is pouring in (many millions of gallons per hour), creating whitecaps in the streets. For those who don't know, Pontchartrain is 8 feet higher than the City, which in turn averages 5 feet below sea level. This is a huge lake, 400,000 acres, capable of turning NO into an Atlantis.

If the pumping stations flood the city is done. It's a race to repair the breaches. No other pumps exist in the world that can be brought in in time - during the last hurricane 6 dredges pumping 634,000 gallon per hour took 44 hours to lower the water 1/2 inch - we're talking up to 20 feet and rising.

If the pumps are flooded the only way to drain the city is to blow a half-mile breach in the ocean-side levee. This will leave New Orleans vulnerable to even a CAT-1 hurricane which is sure to hit this season. How lucky do you feel?

300 foot breach located here:

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Hammond+Hwy+%26+Orpheum+Ave,+Metairie,+LA&spn=0.031982,0.048353&t=h&hl=en

The major hospital will need to evacuate soon since the water is near the second floor where the generators are located.

The situation in the superdome is growing desperate with one suicide reported already. Heat, stench of overflowing toilets, and the last place to bring seriously injured people to. More refugees arriving by foot.

My sister is there, supposedly tried to leave at the last second, no way to know if she was able to leave the city or able to make it to shelters which were already full. We are very concerned.

Folks, this situation is far worse than the media are reporting. If you pray, now is a great time - and be prepared to keep it up until the levees are patched. If it isn't fixed there may be a discussion regarding whether to rebuild the city. Galveston was destroyed in 1900 and not rebuilt until the city had been raised 9 feet in elevation. This may happen here - years to rebuild a city - or maybe not rebuild at all, in the worst-case situation.

Here are some good links that have more info than CNN:

http://www.brendanloy.com/
http://www.nola.com/newslogs/breakingtp/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/2005_08.html#074994
http://www.nola.com/
http://www.nola.com/washingaway/thebigone_2.html
http://neworleans.metblogs.com/archives/2005/08/okay.phtml
http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:MmSM1LvWXBwJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans+topographic+map+new+orleans&hl=en&client=opera

My sister is there, supposedly tried to leave at the last second, no way to know if she was able to leave the city or able to make it to shelters which were already full. We are very concerned.
Thanks for the info, and I hope your sister is okay

Excellent resource, Katrina Wiki page:

http://katrinahelp.info/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

Meteorological data for Lake Pontchartrain:

http://waterdata.usgs.gov/nwis/uv/?site_no=073802330

Topographic map of City:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/30/AR2005083000689.html

Storm surge models:

http://hurricane.lsu.edu/floodprediction/katrina25/

They can't pump the City out until the levees are repaired, and even then pumping is hampered until the water level of the Lake goes down to normal levels - days away. My guess is that the water level will rise 8-10 more feet, possibly up to the level of the Lake.

The Army Corps of Engineers is trying to patch the breaches using huge rock and sand bags delivered by helicopter. This is not guaranteed to work. More importantly, there is concern of a third breach developing and concern for the safety of pumping station number 6. If this goes under the City may be done, since this carries most of the pumping capacity.

At full capacity the pumps can drop the water level only 1 inch per hour - and there's now over 20 feet in places, rising at the rate of a foot or two per hour. Water is reported coming up from the ground, probably from broken septic lines. Do the math.

Martial law declared in the City and possibly other parishes. I wonder if the National Guard will start shooting looters to slow things down a bit? There probably aren't jails left nor transportation for prisoners.

The flood waters are now contaminated with chemicals and sewage. There will be disease outbreaks - dysentery, yellow fever, etc. There is no potable water or functioning sewage.

Alligators, snakes, nutria - whatever flushed into the bowl - will remain until removed. It will be weeks if not months before they let people back in.

Is it possible to declare martial law in the US? If so, it should be declared for Jefferson Parish (where New Orleans is). The area is a disaster zone, and there is no way to give any looters due process. In addition, looting is incredibally repulsive. All looters in New Orleans should be shot until civilian control can be firmly reestablished.

P.S. The Louisianna governor, Kathleen Blanco, has ordered anyone remaining in New Orleans to be evacuated by any means necessary. Hopefully, this will stop the looters, though sadly, they may still come in.

Is it possible to declare martial law in the US? If so, it should be declared for Jefferson Parish (where New Orleans is). The area is a disaster zone, and there is no way to give any looters due process. In addition, looting is incredibally repulsive. All looters in New Orleans should be shot until civilian control can be firmly reestablished.

P.S. The Louisianna governor, Kathleen Blanco, has ordered anyone remaining in New Orleans to be evacuated by any means necessary. Hopefully, this will stop the looters, though sadly, they may still come in.

It's already happened. Many democrats and liberals are saying that these are the "oppressed people getting back out of society what society never gave to them". BS. Shoot on sight orders should have gone out waay before Katrina hit.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9131493/

It's already happened. Many democrats and liberals are saying that these are the "oppressed people getting back out of society what society never gave to them". BS. Shoot on sight orders should have gone out waay before Katrina hit.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9131493/
And yet law enforcement and national guardsmen are just standing buy, watching the looting. No one has any courage left in this world, and that is a shame.

hundreds of people are looting stores all over the city
That's the one that annoys me. There's a horrible disaster and some assholes immediately think "I know! I'll steal stuff!"

Dickheads.

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?

This event shows how thin the veneer of civilization is.

And yet law enforcement and national guardsmen are just standing buy, watching the looting. No one has any courage left in this world, and that is a shame.

Yup. Sad. Who is running LA? Not the goverment I suppose. The same thing happened in Los Angeles during the Rodney King Riots-except instead of arresting looters, the police arrested Korean Shop Owners who were defending their property from looters.

And yet law enforcement and national guardsmen are just standing buy, watching the looting. No one has any courage left in this world, and that is a shame.

Yup. Sad. Who is running LA? Not the goverment I suppose. The same thing happened in Los Angeles during the Rodney King Riots-except instead of arresting looters, the police arrested Korean Shop Owners who were defending their property from looters.

That's the one that annoys me. There's a horrible disaster and some assholes immediately think "I know! I'll steal stuff!"

Dickheads.
Well, that's why people shoot 'em.

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?
He doesn't exist.

That. Or he's punishing the homosexuals. I'm sure the televangelists will have a field day with this. :rolleyes:

This event shows how thin the veneer of civilization is.
Yep. It's not as if civilisation is a natural state of affairs, on the contrary, it is an artificial one, a very recent construct in human history. I forget who it was that said "Mankind is three meals away from barbarism", but it's true.

the middle one

a levy has broken leaving the french quarter under waist high water -- 80% of the city is flooded

a water main broke meaning that the water is undrinkable unless boiled

most of the electricity is out

its freaking hot outside with 100% humidity

hundreds of thousands of people will be out of their homes (if they still exist) for weeks.

hundreds of people are looting stores all over the city




yea this one is as bad as hugo except at -10 feet below sea level and tall structures near bridges. its as bad considering i belive hugo was a category 4 but in a whole diffrent enviroment

And yet law enforcement and national guardsmen are just standing buy, watching the looting. No one has any courage left in this world, and that is a shame.
its not a lack of courage

where are they going to PUT arrested looter? they cant get them to jail, the streets are flooded and resources are being used to rescue innocent people

we dont have a death penalty for stealing so its not really right to shoot them like rabid dogs no matter how angry it makes us.

but what i wonder is WHAT DO THEY THINK THEY ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO WITH THE STUFF THEY STEAL?

there is no place to take it. their homes, if they arent flooded out, have no electricity, no sewer, no drinkable water. are they going to drag their loot to the stadium? do they expect the national guard to help them remove their cool new stuff from the city when they are evacuated?

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?
god is busy dealing with the victims of the christmas tsunami. this one just slipped past him. cant be everywhere eh?

If there is any oppression they did it to themselves by their own damn choices. I saw them on TV looking like the fools they are. oNe idiot even stood by the reporter and talked to her. He said it was a good idea... jackoff!

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?
There is no God. This sort of thing happens almost every year to the people of Bangladesh.

It's already happened. Many democrats and liberals are saying that these are the "oppressed people getting back out of society what society never gave to them". BS. Shoot on sight orders should have gone out waay before Katrina hit.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9131493/

Do you really believe the BS that you spout?

here's what I read in the article you posted:

“To be honest with you, people who are oppressed all their lives, man, it’s an opportunity to get back at society,” he said.

A man walked down Canal Street with a pallet of food on his head. His wife, who refused to give her name, insisted they weren’t stealing from the nearby Winn-Dixie supermarket. “It’s about survival right now,” she said as she held a plastic bag full of purloined items. “We got to feed our children. I’ve got eight grandchildren to feed.”

Police commandeer pharmacy
At a drug store on Canal Street just outside the French Quarter, two police officers with pump shotguns stood guard as workers from the Ritz-Carlton Hotel across the street loaded large laundry bins full of medications, snack foods and bottled water.

“This is for the sick,” Officer Jeff Jacob said. “We can commandeer whatever we see fit, whatever is necessary to maintain law.”

Another officer, D.J. Butler, told the crowd standing around that they would be out of the way as soon as they got the necessities.

“I’m not saying you’re welcome to it,” the officer said. “This is the situation we’re in. We have to make the best of it.”

The looting was taking place in full view of passing National Guard trucks and police cruisers.

One man with an armload of clothes even asked a policeman, “Can I borrow your car?”


Now please show me where "many democrats and liberals" are saying that these are the "oppressed people getting back out of society what society never gave to them". I see ONE guy saying something stupid. We don't know his political affiliation or even if he has one. He sounds like just another pissed off poor guy to me. That doesn't make him a liberal or a democrat does it?

Many people are looting jewelry and clothing for future profit and that sucks big time for the store owners and I think they are morally bankrupt as people. Some people are taking food because they need to eat, and since the stores aren't open they gotta do what they gotta do to survive and I can not fault them for that. THey should have left the city when they were told to but maybe they didn't have anywhere to go. The police are stealing "large laundry bins full of medications, snack foods and bottled water" "for the sick" to "maintain law".

Am i supposed to feel pity for the residents of NO right now? Anybody that stayed in NO were just people asking for natural selection to take effect on them.

Personally though i wouldnt leave my home either....why? So you can be told you cant come back for several weeks? so by the time you come back every looter can have his pick of your stuff?

They should just blow the dikes of the city right now, theyd kill more criminals and trash then innocent people right now...

NOBODY IN NO RIGHT NOW IS INNOCENT. All the innocent people left already

I’m waiting patiently for the foreign aid to come poring in. :rolleyes:

Am i supposed to feel pity for the residents of NO right now? Anybody that stayed in NO were just people asking for natural selection to take effect on them.

Personally though i wouldnt leave my home either....why? So you can be told you cant come back for several weeks? so by the time you come back every looter can have his pick of your stuff?

They should just blow the dikes of the city right now, theyd kill more criminals and trash then innocent people right now...

NOBODY IN NO RIGHT NOW IS INNOCENT. All the innocent people left already


SO you admitted that you would stay to protect your stuff from looters but that would make you guilty and worthy of death by your own logic?

the middle one

a levy has broken leaving the french quarter under waist high water -- 80% of the city is flooded

a water main broke meaning that the water is undrinkable unless boiled

most of the electricity is out

its freaking hot outside with 100% humidity

hundreds of thousands of people will be out of their homes (if they still exist) for weeks.

hundreds of people are looting stores all over the city

Nawlins can go to hell, everybody bitches about what happened to New Orleans.

Biloxi Missisippi is under about 10 FEET of water right now, New Orleans is damn lucky in comparison.

EDIT: Biloxi was recently under 10 feet of water. It is no longer there.

Do you really believe the BS that you spout?

here's what I read in the article you posted:



Now please show me where "many democrats and liberals" are saying that these are the "oppressed people getting back out of society what society never gave to them".

Many people are looting jewelry and clothing for future profit and that sucks big time for the store owners and I think they are morally bankrupt as people. Some people are taking food because they need to eat, and since the stores aren't open they gotta do what they gotta do to survive and I can not fault them for that. THey should have left the city when they were told to but maybe they didn't have anywhere to go. The police are stealing "large laundry bins full of medications, snack foods and bottled water" "for the sick" to "maintain law".


Yeah i guess they needed the shelving with the food too huh? How about the mother and son wheeling the entire display case of cigs and boose?! im sure they just needed to eat too...N O was a trashy town to begin with, and i knew it was going to happen before the reports came in....Trashy people always act the same when disasters happen....this is a paradise for them and they make up the majority of the people that stayed in the town, they didnt stay in town because they had "no ride" like the bleedings hearts in the media discribe..they stayed in the city to gut it like a pig in the choas afterwards..

please blow the dikes now and kill the trash that is left behind in N O.

SO you admitted that you would stay to protect your stuff from looters but that would make you guilty and worthy of death by your own logic?


Im not dumb enough to live in an inner city...only garbage lives there.

Yeah i guess they needed the shelving with the food too huh? How about the mother and son wheeling the entire display case of cigs and boose?! im sure they just needed to eat too...N O was a trashy town to begin with, and i knew it was going to happen before the reports came in....Trashy people always act the same when disasters happen....this is a paradise for them and they make up the majority of the people that stayed in the town, they didnt stay in town because they had "no ride" like the bleedings hearts in the media discribe..they stayed in the city to gut it like a pig in the choas afterwards..

please blow the dikes now and kill the trash that is left behind in N O.

Uh try to keep up here. I said those taking food that they needed to survive were kuhl but those looting merchandise for future profit were scum. Just a personal opinion, but I think you are a horrible 'person'. :p

Nawlins can go to hell, everybody bitches about what happened to New Orleans.

Biloxi Missisippi is under about 10 FEET of water right now, New Orleans is damn lucky in comparison.

Hey, it's not a fight about who got it the worst. The entire zone got pounded, it's our Tsunami.

NO is getting the attention because they are being flooded with no way to get the water out - they're trapped in a bowl. The media will naturally focus on that.

I have family in Biloxi and NO. My heart goes out to all who have suffered. I intend to give to charities to help, I hope others do as well.

Im not dumb enough to live in an inner city...only garbage lives there.

*puts on ignore list and the world becomes a much brighter place to live in*

I’m waiting patiently for the foreign aid to come poring in. :rolleyes:
Saudi Arabia has already pledged to deliver a whimsical greeting card to "brighten the spirits of the infidel pigs and apes of New Orleans".

Hey, it's not a fight about who got it the worst. The entire zone got pounded, it's our Tsunami.

NO is getting the attention because they are being flooded with no way to get the water out - they're trapped in a bowl. The media will naturally focus on that.

I have family in Biloxi and NO. My heart goes out to all who have suffered. I intend to give to charities to help, I hope others do as well.

My brother was in a bunker on Keesler when Katrina hit, his wife had recently had a seizure and was having troube walking, they barely made it.

His apartment complex is GONE.

I’m waiting patiently for the foreign aid to come poring in. :rolleyes:
I hope you'e joking. The US is the richest, most technologically advanced country on Earth. It doesn't need foreign aid. No other country out there has anywhere near the same disaster-management capacity.

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?



its called Africa+Atlantic ocean+Summer into fall+winds+Floridas weird shape sticking out into the ocean not god

Regarding the looting: necessities for survival are one thing - but CNN was reporting widespread looting of consumer goods such as Nike shoes and electronics. I saw a clip of men sifting through tourist suitcases on the street.

It won't matter shortly, they are talking about evacuating the entire city - maybe 100,000 people still there. This will be difficult, only one road open and the airfield still closed. Takes a lot of trucks to move this many, and where to put them?

If they can't fix the breaches by tomorrow it may be too late for the city.

Nawlins can go to hell, everybody bitches about what happened to New Orleans.

Biloxi Missisippi is under about 10 FEET of water right now, New Orleans is damn lucky in comparison.

EDIT: Biloxi was recently under 10 feet of water. It is no longer there.


So is some parts of Nawlins it just has tall buildings

I hope you'e joking. The US is the richest, most technologically advanced country on Earth. It doesn't need foreign aid. No other country out there has anywhere near the same disaster-management capacity.
Doesn’t mean they shouldn’t at least acknowledge our recent hurricane troubles. Instead, they blame it on global warming, and they blame global warming on us, when most meteorologists think that the increased hurricane activity is part of a natural hurricane cycle that takes place over a few hundred years.

Doesn’t mean they shouldn’t at least acknowledge our recent hurricane troubles. Instead, they blame it on global warming, and they blame global warming on us, when most meteorologists think that the increased hurricane activity is part of a natural hurricane cycle that takes place over a few hundred years.


I have seen only condolences from those around the world hearing about our troubles here in the US with the hurricanes (on NS and elesewhere). WHere are you seeing people not acknowledging our troubles and just saying "Well they deserve it cuz they are the cause of global warming."?

So is some parts of Nawlins it just has tall buildings

Biloxi does not have that advantage, the point is, what's more important, a very old city, or Keesler AFB?

I posted this earlier. You can see how much of the city will be under water if it fills to lake-level as expected.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/30/AR2005083000689.html

The pumps will be under water soon, and the only other way to get rid of the water is to open a huge hole in the sea-wall. This would leave the city vulnerable to the next storm surge from even a CAT-1 hurricane. And there are more hurricanes coming...

Am i supposed to feel pity for the residents of NO right now? Anybody that stayed in NO were just people asking for natural selection to take effect on them.

Personally though i wouldnt leave my home either....why? So you can be told you cant come back for several weeks? so by the time you come back every looter can have his pick of your stuff?

They should just blow the dikes of the city right now, theyd kill more criminals and trash then innocent people right now...

NOBODY IN NO RIGHT NOW IS INNOCENT. All the innocent people left already

i'm trying to think what would happen if i was in new orleans when this happened.

first off, i don't have a car.
second off, i have about one hundred dollars in the bank.
third off, my visa is maxxed out at the moment as i'm still waiting for my student loan to come in.

so, i would not have the transportation to get out of town and i would not have the money to pay for transportation out of town.

i guess that means i'd be stuck in the superdome or in my apartment.

but, wait. i'm an honours student going into my last year of an honours degree in pure mathematics. would i die because i was less fit? no. i'm way more intelligent than the rich people that hopped in their caddies and drove out. very bad luck - a fucking hurricane - would have hit me when i was broke.

down with the concept of natural selection.

i'm trying to think what would happen if i was in new orleans when this happened.

first off, i don't have a car.
second off, i have about one hundred dollars in the bank.
third off, my visa is maxxed out at the moment as i'm still waiting for my student loan to come in.

so, i would not have the transportation to get out of town and i would not have the money to pay for transportation out of town.

i guess that means i'd be stuck in the superdome or in my apartment.

but, wait. i'm an honours student going into my last year of an honours degree in pure mathematics. would i die because i was less fit? no. i'm way more intelligent than the rich people that hopped in their caddies and drove out. very bad luck - a fucking hurricane - would have hit me when i was broke.

down with the concept of natural selection.

Well you gotta understand the mindset of people like Gulf Republics. If you are poor and live in the inner city you are just another lazy scumbag sucking from the govt. teat who steals for a living, jumps at any opportunity to do drugs, and would never move ahead in life given the opportunity. There are no other reasons you could be poor/struggling other than the fact that you are a piece of trash.

Well you gotta understand the mindset of people like Gulf Republics. If you are poor and live in the inner city you are just another lazy scumbag sucking from the govt. teat who steals for a living, jums at any opportunity to do drugs, and would never move ahead in life given the opportunity. There are no other reasons you could be poor/struggling other than the fact that you are a piece of trash.

I'm po' whie trash, and that's my opinmion too, if you're raised po, you usually stay po, if you're raisded trash, you're gonna be trash.

I'm po' whie trash, and that's my opinmion too, if you're raised po, you usually stay po, if you're raisded trash, you're gonna be trash.
Thank the Lord my grandfather didn’t accept that.

Thank the Lord my grandfather didn’t accept that.

Mine didn't either, we kind of regressed...

Well you gotta understand the mindset of people like Gulf Republics. If you are poor and live in the inner city you are just another lazy scumbag sucking from the govt. teat who steals for a living, jumps at any opportunity to do drugs, and would never move ahead in life given the opportunity. There are no other reasons you could be poor/struggling other than the fact that you are a piece of trash.

the irony is that the only justification he can possibly use for his comments is ignorance.

i guess i'm one of those liberal idiots that thinks that the only way to root out right wing ignorance is through education.

so i don't view myself as arguing with the guy or with his kind. i view myself as educating him and his like-minded cronies.

The point is, the statistical probability is that if you are born poor, you will die poor, I'm joinuig the Army, so I won't have that issue, my brother is already in the AF, and nobody really cares about my sister...

It is horrible what happened to Louisianna, Mississippi, and other place down south. I just hope that, at this point, they can get as many survivors out of there as possible and save New Orleans from becoming the next Atlantis. New Orleans is an old city and a part of American culture. It would be sad to say goodbye to it before I got to see it myself (That would be the second place destroyed, since 2001, that I never got to see). It definitly is never going to be the same down there.

And to the looters stealing diamonds and MP3 players, I hope they drown because they are too heavy with gold and electronics to swim.

the irony is that the only justification he can possibly use for his comments is ignorance.

i guess i'm one of those liberal idiots that thinks that the only way to root out right wing ignorance is through education.

so i don't view myself as arguing with the guy or with his kind. i view myself as educating him and his like-minded cronies.


True - I'm glad we have people like you who have the patience to try to educate people like him (and me). I just use my ignore cannon when people frustrate me so.

The point is, the statistical probability is that if you are born poor, you will die poor, I'm joinuig the Army, so I won't have that issue, my brother is already in the AF, and nobody really cares about my sister...


I agree that people who are raised with the "we are poor and we will always be poor" mindset will usually remain poor because of self-limiting beliefs, but I will disagree with the if you are poor you are trash thing. Not that you were saying that. I think. :confused:

Well, they're now evacuating the Superdome. When the storm initially hit, the covering on the roof flew off. Now there are holes in it. I don't know if it's still raining, but it if it is, there will be more problems. The stadium is getting filled too much with water. They must not have done such a good job boarding up the entrances. If anybody has been in the stadium and would like to clear up how tall it is and how the entrances are constructed, that would be great.

Hate to state the obvious, but this is why you don't build your city below sea level surrounded by water!

Out of curiosity, does anybody know if the huge bridge across the lake is still standing? Parts of it are right on the water. It is 24 miles long, which is the longest in the world.

To quote Led Zeppelin:
"If it keeps on raining, levee's gonna break
If it keeps on raining, levee's gonna break
When the levee breaks, have no place to stay"

Hate to state the obvious, but this is why you don't build your city below sea level surrounded by water!

Well, the French originally founded the city.... XD I'm sorry, but I couldn't resist. I'll be good now.

ive been to new orleans, there are (or were) a hell of alot of people with lots of money who had lots to protect. i think some of those were among the scum who stayed behind. maybe THEY are good enough to feel sorry for?

Well, the French originally founded the city.... XD I'm sorry, but I couldn't resist. I'll be good now.
Heh, they're not the only ones. The Netherlands should be 30 feet under the North Sea.

Well, they're now evacuating the Superdome. When the storm initially hit, the covering on the roof flew off. Now there are holes in it. I don't know if it's still raining, but it if it is, there will be more problems. The stadium is getting filled too much with water. They must not have done such a good job boarding up the entrances. If anybody has been in the stadium and would like to clear up how tall it is and how the entrances are constructed, that would be great.

Hate to state the obvious, but this is why you don't build your city below sea level surrounded by water!

Out of curiosity, does anybody know if the huge bridge across the lake is still standing? Parts of it are right on the water. It is 24 miles long, which is the longest in the world.

To quote Led Zeppelin:
"If it keeps on raining, levee's gonna break
If it keeps on raining, levee's gonna break
When the levee breaks, have no place to stay"
i think the bridge is out. its hard to tell on TV because they just show random clips. the us90 bridge over the bay in baystlouis is reduced to just its supports, the bridge surface is entirely gone

its not a lack of courage

where are they going to PUT arrested looter? they cant get them to jail, the streets are flooded and resources are being used to rescue innocent people

we dont have a death penalty for stealing so its not really right to shoot them like rabid dogs no matter how angry it makes us.

but what i wonder is WHAT DO THEY THINK THEY ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO DO WITH THE STUFF THEY STEAL?

there is no place to take it. their homes, if they arent flooded out, have no electricity, no sewer, no drinkable water. are they going to drag their loot to the stadium? do they expect the national guard to help them remove their cool new stuff from the city when they are evacuated?
It's martial law. Not only is there the absense of law and order, but it is impossible to establish law and order right now. I'd just shoot looters. If they are injured, leave them. It's extremely cruel, and I never thought I'd say this. But law and order is impossible to establish in New Orleans. The rules much change.
And btw, once the city is evacuated, have it patrolled by coast guard and any one else, and have them maintain law and order until civilian control can be reestablished, e.i. once the city is drained and there is a significant police presence.

Heh, they're not the only ones. The Netherlands should be 30 feet under the North Sea.Not to mention the parts that originally were 30 feet under the North Sea

I agree that people who are raised with the "we are poor and we will always be poor" mindset will usually remain poor because of self-limiting beliefs, but I will disagree with the if you are poor you are trash thing. Not that you were saying that. I think. :confused:


I was not saying that, you are correct, if I was I'd not be joining the army.

It's ok to be confused.

i think the bridge is out. its hard to tell on TV because they just show random clips. the us90 bridge over the bay in baystlouis is reduced to just its supports, the bridge surface is entirely gone

In MS, there's a casino blocking US 90, it's inconvenient.

Here are some good sources of local news, including a timeline:

http://www.wwltv.com/local/stories/WWLBLOG.ac3fcea.html
http://www.nola.com/hurricane/katrina/
http://www.brendanloy.com/

Blogs and local news really show their value in this case. CNN et. al. are great for visuals, but they contribute little to reporting events except in the very big-picture sense. Their knee-jerk need to score emotional and visual points makes them only moderately useful.

I have a friend of a friend in Biloxi, whom I do know. He chose not to evacuate, thinking that the hurricanes were no big deal. The last one, Ivan, wasn't much, at least to him. He got a lesson taught.
His house is okay. His neighbor's roof has blown off. There is no electricity, no running water, and no phone. There is water everywhere, as are snakes, and it is humid and smelly. He has a boat there, and I don't know what happened there, but if that casino boat that blew ashore is any indication, I know what happened to that boat.

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?

God works in mysterious ways. Maybe he wanted to take some of his children home? Who knows. You'll get to ask him that question some day though.

Why would God allow such a thing to happen to mostly innocent people? Was this God's plan for them? Did they all do something so horrible that God would allow them to suffer so? I'm confused... where is God in all this?
Well, he just became a bit confused. You see, he usually saves this kind of punishment for those horrible, monstrous sinners of Bangladesh. Except for the looting, nothing to loot in Bangladesh. For some reason, maybe the GPS ran out of batteries, he missed for a few thousand miles. All in all a small error considering everything he has to deal with.

Well, he just became a bit confused. You see, he usually saves this kind of punishment for those horrible, monstrous sinners of Bangladesh. Except for the looting, nothing to loot in Bangladesh. For some reason, maybe the GPS ran out of batteries, he missed for a few thousand miles. All in all a small error considering everything he has to deal with.


At least he gave Florida a good reaming in response to the Bush debaucle. :p

*only kidding folks* Relax

Hey, it's not a fight about who got it the worst. The entire zone got pounded, it's our Tsunami.

I do simpathize with the people in N.O. and the rest of the Gulf coast, many of whom have lost everything, some even their lives, but lets try to keep things in their correct perspective. It's not nearly as bad as the tsunami, however big the media tries to make it.

NO is getting the attention because they are being flooded with no way to get the water out - they're trapped in a bowl. The media will naturally focus on that.

On the other hand, if they can't get the water out, it will be one heck of an attraction. Think, Mardi Gras on boats!

Just got word that my sister is safe. Whew! She left at the last minute, thinking that she's weathered hurricanes before and could do it again. Stupid.

I'd have been the first guy out of town facing a CAT-5 and living in a bowl. Anyway, she's safe and in Tennessee. She isn't going to like hearing that the city won't be open for weeks or months, but at least she's alive - and her home is on higher ground and has a chance of surviving.

Just got word that my sister is safe. Whew! She left at the last minute, thinking that she's weathered hurricanes before and could do it again. Stupid.

I'd have been the first guy out of town facing a CAT-5 and living in a bowl. Anyway, she's safe and in Tennessee. She isn't going to like hearing that the city won't be open for weeks or months, but at least she's alive - and her home is on higher ground and has a chance of surviving.
Congrats! Glad she's fine. Hurricanes are a funny thing. You think one is like the other, but too many things affect what their impact is going to be. From the angle they touch land to the buildings around the area. There's just no way to tell.

Anyway, I'm glad she saw what was coming and did the sensible thing.

Just got word that my sister is safe. Whew! She left at the last minute, thinking that she's weathered hurricanes before and could do it again. Stupid.

I'd have been the first guy out of town facing a CAT-5 and living in a bowl. Anyway, she's safe and in Tennessee. She isn't going to like hearing that the city won't be open for weeks or months, but at least she's alive - and her home is on higher ground and has a chance of surviving.
i hope you thought to say some really mean things to her. if she's going to be homeless for months you dont want her moving in with YOU!

im glad she smartened up at the last minute, too many people died because they thought they could survive it.

Well, I found out that the Superdome population has grown from 10,000 to over 30,000. That's a small town, all in one building.They plan on evacuating that thing soon. They better. The Superdome may not survive as a sound structure for more than a few days.

Given my opinion of the jewelry and diamond industry, I can't say that I feel sorry for those store owners. Especially as they are insured for the most part.

Is anyone besides me afraid that there's more to come? We saw plenty of hurricanes last year... :(

I find it appauling to see people using the deaths of hundreds of people just to prove if there's a God or not, or to promote natural selection. Lets hear you talk about how it's natural selection when you get breast cancer at 35 or find out you have leukemia or if a new plague comes around and crawls up your ass.

If death is just a way to prove your point, then perhaps when you have kids, you won't mind if others come in shooting up the school. After all, it IS natural selection. Or maybe it's God's will?

Just caught a bit of Fox News. The evacuation message is being sent out, as the city is expected to be swamped. The effort to plug the levees has failed, and the pumps will soon fail themselves. Worse, the looting has escalated. Gun battles have begun, with at least one police officer shot dead. The situation will worsen tonight.

Well, I found out that the Superdome population has grown from 10,000 to over 30,000. That's a small town, all in one building.They plan on evacuating that thing soon. They better. The Superdome may not survive as a sound structure for more than a few days.

Tough logistics - about 100,000 people are left in the city, Superdome included, only one highway and no airports. How do you move those people? They have to be moved by boat to a staging area - only small boats can be used, so that's thousands of trips. A lot of trucks will need to be employed - it's a major operation, akin to moving ten army divisions but without the discipline. Then where do you put them a refugee tent camp? That's a small city's worth of people to feed and police.

I agree, the Superdome can't function much longer. Hot, leaky roof,overflowing toilets, no lights, water rising rapidly. Violence and other social issues will become a problem soon.

Tough logistics - about 100,000 people are left in the city, Superdome included, only one highway and no airports. How do you move those people? They have to be moved by boat to a staging area - only small boats can be used, so that's thousands of trips. A lot of trucks will need to be employed - it's a major operation, akin to moving ten army divisions but without the discipline. Then where do you put them a refugee tent camp? That's a small city's worth of people to feed and police.

I don't know how to get them out, or where to put them. Quite frankly, I don't want that problem. But they better find a way, or else they could never drain the city without looiting and such.
BTW, I'd think that a mutiple number of ways will be employed. There are probably several ferries around that could volunteer. I'd also get Chinooks to help move people. But we'll find a way. Humans always have. Right now, I think the most important thing is to simply move them out. Even dumping them in the Senora Desert is better than being trapped in that city.

Right now they need to get the people out any way possible and then focus on saving the city itself. They should be sending in ... I don't know, anything! We're supposed to have this huge military with helicopters and stuff. Forget about the looters, I'd rather have a looted city than something at the bottom of an enlarged lake. I'm starting to think New Orleans is done for.

The wind may have died down, but if the rain is still going tropical, helicopters may be a bad idea.

The wind may have died down, but if the rain is still going tropical, helicopters may be a bad idea.
Tommorow's forcast actually predicts a lot of dry air in the region. And btw, Coast Guard helicopters are making search and rescue missions in New Orleans all the time.

I gota aunt who most likely died in biloxi

Tommorow's forcast actually predicts a lot of dry air in the region. And btw, Coast Guard helicopters are making search and rescue missions in New Orleans all the time.
Cool. They'll have it all under control, then.

I gota aunt who most likely died in biloxi

I'm sorry to hear that. Maybe things will be ok - it will take a few days to get communications back up, maybe you'll hear from her. Hang in there.

I have been hearing all these reports... she lived like a block away from the ocean and had never left her home during a hurricane, survived camille. She lived in Bay St. Louis... thats were they dont have enough refrigirated trucks to carry all the corpses... I dont know...

It just seems the shit is hitting the fan in record numbers: now there's a report that the inmates at the local prison have rioted and taken several hostages (http://abcnews.go.com/US/HurricaneKatrina/story?id=1081633&page=1), including women and children.

I think a few police were shot in n'orleans

National Guard troops are now spreading throughout the city. They have ordered everyone off the streets, probably a prelude to looter shooting.

Things have gone lawless so fast they'll need to hit the looters hard. I predict shooting by tomorrow, there's been enough restraint shown.

In the worst news yet, the levee repairs seem to have failed. The official pronouncement is that the waters will rise an additional 15 feet. So it appears that the pumping stations are now underwater. The only parts of the city to be relatively untouched will be on the high ground along the Mississippi and maybe Gentilly Ridge. New Orleans will be Atlantis by morning.

Significant military assetts are being moved in. Some naval ships, including a hospital ship and the Iwo Jima. A C-5 and C-117 transport. Army assets are being moved down from Colorado.

On a side-note, they claim schools will open 2 months after Labor Day. I like optimists, they are so cheerful.

Am i supposed to feel pity for the residents of NO right now? Anybody that stayed in NO were just people asking for natural selection to take effect on them.

Personally though i wouldnt leave my home either....why? So you can be told you cant come back for several weeks? so by the time you come back every looter can have his pick of your stuff?

They should just blow the dikes of the city right now, theyd kill more criminals and trash then innocent people right now...

NOBODY IN NO RIGHT NOW IS INNOCENT. All the innocent people left already
You sir, are advocating a criminal action to kill criminals, and possibly some innocents. How ironic. :rolleyes:

I would like to think that you reflect a very small portion of the American populace.

It's martial law. Not only is there the absense of law and order, but it is impossible to establish law and order right now. I'd just shoot looters. If they are injured, leave them. It's extremely cruel, and I never thought I'd say this. But law and order is impossible to establish in New Orleans. The rules much change.
And btw, once the city is evacuated, have it patrolled by coast guard and any one else, and have them maintain law and order until civilian control can be reestablished, e.i. once the city is drained and there is a significant police presence.
Another one that would shoot looters. What is wrong with you people? :(

I'm not the most religious of people but the only thing I can say is may God go with them.
I sincerely hope your sister is ok.

Another one that would shoot looters. What is wrong with you people? :(
Nothing. But this is an uninhabitable disaster zone where civilian law is simply impossible. And I wouldn't discriminate to just looters. I'd shoot price gougers in the area, and anyone that is killing anyone. I know you love to refute me, and you can. But I won't reply. I've made my arguement.

Anyone know how many Americans are dead because of this storm. :D

Anyone know how many Americans are dead because of this storm. :D

Whoa. I can understand not agreeing with American policy. I can even understand not liking the country. But being HAPPY that innocent lives are lost? What kind of sick mind ... just ... argh.

FYI: boiling water doesn't remove a lot of nonliving contaminants, such as human waste and chemical byproducts of petroleum refinement.

Me, I'd loot a Brita and some iodine tablets.

Here's some very welcome news. The flood has stopped and levee repairs are virtually assured. The water will be gone in a month, and there has been no need to breach the ocean-side levee to drain the city. The pumps have survived.

The looting continues to be a huge problem, but 10,000 additional National Guard have been sent to Miss. and LA. They will are largely to augment local law enforcement. This is welcome news.

The 23,000 people in the Superdome are being evacuated to Houston. Great news, this will take the pressure off.

"Maj. Gen. Don Reily, head of the U.S. Corps of Engineers' storm recovery operation, said at midday Wednesday that Lake Pontchartrain water level has dropped and has “equalized” with flood-waters in the city. That means water has begun to recede, flowing back into the lake, at a rate of approximately a half-inch an hour.

The general said this should continue, except during a high tide “later in the evening.”

“As it (the water) recedes this will help” the attempt by the Corps and the New Orleans Sewerage and Water Board to temporarily plug the breach in the 17th Street Canal and drive sheet-pilings and also possibly rock into the junction of the canal at Lake Pontchartain,” the general said."

http://www.nola.com/newslogs/breakingtp/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/2005_08.html#075386

Another one that would shoot looters. What is wrong with you people? :(
What justification do you have for looting jewelry, clothing, and other goods?

From an article in my thread about shooting looters,

Around the corner on Canal Street, the main thoroughfare in the central business district, people sloshed headlong through hip-deep water as looters ripped open the steel gates on the fronts of several clothing and jewelry stores.

One man, who had about 10 pairs of jeans draped over his left arm, was asked whether he was salvaging things from his store. "No," he shouted, "that's everybody's store."

Looters filled industrial-size garbage cans with clothing and jewelry and floated them down the street on bits of plywood and insulation as the National Guard went by.

So don't tell me it's just food...

It seems like the situation has turned from being dire to being at least hopeful. Water levels are going down and it appears the Army Corp of Engineers deserve a hand for this one.

All looters should be shot and martial law should be declared. Looting is unacceptable.

Nothing. But this is an uninhabitable disaster zone where civilian law is simply impossible. And I wouldn't discriminate to just looters. I'd shoot price gougers in the area, and anyone that is killing anyone. I know you love to refute me, and you can. But I won't reply. I've made my arguement.

civilian law IS simply impossible....so they should just let it go. it will come back later. for now, how do the cops know who is stealing cd players and who is stealing bread? in these circumstances, grocery stores should be free-for-alls as far as i'm concerned. everything you own just got destroyed and you have to deal with a bunch of cops keeping you away from the only food for miles by gunpoint? fuck that.

who really cares about people stealing microwaves at this point, anyways? if they leave them in the store, they're going to get ruined by the 15-20 feet of water engulfing everything. it's just a complete loss for the store owners either way. so this is the very least of my concerns.

as far as stealing booze goes......consider what just happened. your city is quickly becoming a swampland and there is nothing you can possibly do about it. they should be DISTRIBUTING vodka to these people. getting fall down drunk is exactly what i'd be doing....probably for days....

of what value are the goods they are stealing if the city sinks? of what value are the shops? of what value is anything at this point besides stopping the flooding, and if you can't stop the flooding, besides drowning your sorrows? sometimes, there's just not much else you can really do....

i say let them run rampant and put every possible piece of manpower available into plugging the levees. the cops should be lifting sandbags, not stopping people from bagging sandwiches.

civilian SNIP sandwiches.Agreed.

It's already happened. Many democrats and liberals are saying that these are the "oppressed people getting back out of society what society never gave to them". BS. Shoot on sight orders should have gone out waay before Katrina hit.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9131493/

Typical conservative reaction. Property is more important than people.

Not that I'm defending the looters, they are sick, depraved people taking advantage of a horrible tragedy. but, at the same time...I sense the conservatives are more outraged at the looting...than they are at the fact that hundreds of thousands have lost everything they ever had, including their homes...lives have been shattered and may never be rebuilt...the amount of human tragedy and suffering is incredible...and here the conservatives go, outraged over PROPERTY CRIMES!!

Where's the outrage about the human suffering going on, both among refugees who managed to get out with their lives...and those who didn't manage to get out and are, if lucky, stuck...and if not, dead.

But what outrages the conservatives??? PROPERTY CRIMES!!! Why am I not surprised?

Am i supposed to feel pity for the residents of NO right now? Anybody that stayed in NO were just people asking for natural selection to take effect on them.

Personally though i wouldnt leave my home either....why? So you can be told you cant come back for several weeks? so by the time you come back every looter can have his pick of your stuff?

They should just blow the dikes of the city right now, theyd kill more criminals and trash then innocent people right now...

NOBODY IN NO RIGHT NOW IS INNOCENT. All the innocent people left already

Yeah. Tell that to the NS poster whose sister is stuck in the superdome right now! Many of those in the superdome are guilty of nothing other than being poor, and thus, not having the resources (a car) with which to evacuate. If it wouldn't be direct flaming, I'd tell you exactly what I think of you...and people who think like you do, too!!

Yeah, let's just give all those "trashy people" you referred to in a different post the death penalty for the crime of being poor and having nowhere else to go. I'm sorry if this is flaming, but I find your attitude to be extremely depraved...and extremely inhumane and heartless. Typical conservative.

Yeah i guess they needed the shelving with the food too huh? How about the mother and son wheeling the entire display case of cigs and boose?! im sure they just needed to eat too...N O was a trashy town to begin with, and i knew it was going to happen before the reports came in....Trashy people always act the same when disasters happen....this is a paradise for them and they make up the majority of the people that stayed in the town, they didnt stay in town because they had "no ride" like the bleedings hearts in the media discribe..they stayed in the city to gut it like a pig in the choas afterwards..

please blow the dikes now and kill the trash that is left behind in N O.

Mods, please do something about this guy before I blow my fucking top!! The level of heartlessness and depravity is sending my blood pressure into the stratosphere, and I don't know how much longer I can hold back what I REALLY want to say to this guy!!

Yeah. Tell that to the NS poster whose sister is stuck in the superdome right now! Many of those in the superdome are guilty of nothing other than being poor, and thus, not having the resources (a car) with which to evacuate. If it wouldn't be direct flaming, I'd tell you exactly what I think of you...and people who think like you do, too!!

Yeah, let's just give all those "trashy people" you referred to in a different post the death penalty for the crime of being poor and having nowhere else to go. I'm sorry if this is flaming, but I find your attitude to be extremely depraved...and extremely inhumane and heartless. Typical conservative.

:headbang:

Im not dumb enough to live in an inner city...only garbage lives there.

that does it!

Lyric just report the guy in moderation and be done with it.

Chill. The last thing you want to do is be at each other throats right now.. do something for the people right now.. make a donation or something along that lines. Keep fucking politics out of this. That includes Gulf Republics and Lyric. My family was personally effected by this. I'd deeply appreciate it.

Am i supposed to feel pity for the residents of NO right now? Anybody that stayed in NO were just people asking for natural selection to take effect on them.

Personally though i wouldnt leave my home either....why? So you can be told you cant come back for several weeks? so by the time you come back every looter can have his pick of your stuff?

They should just blow the dikes of the city right now, theyd kill more criminals and trash then innocent people right now...

NOBODY IN NO RIGHT NOW IS INNOCENT. All the innocent people left already

Take a 2-Day break. Come back when you've learned to respect the people left in that city, and the hundreds that have died.
Gulf Republics: 2-Day Forumban for Excessive Trolling

ive been to new orleans, there are (or were) a hell of alot of people with lots of money who had lots to protect. i think some of those were among the scum who stayed behind. maybe THEY are good enough to feel sorry for?

Of course THEY are good enough to feel sorry for...THEY vote Republican. (sarcasm off)

Of course THEY are good enough to feel sorry for...THEY vote Republican. (sarcasm off)

Don't you fucking dare talk like that.

C'mon lets leave political BS out of this .... hundreds if not thousands are dead and thats all you can find to say to each other ... GROW UP PEOPLE :headbang:

Of course THEY are good enough to feel sorry for...THEY vote Republican. (sarcasm off)
:gundge: Can we keep the political crap out of this thread and focus on the fact that there is a huge disaster going on.

Oh, and this is for Gulf Republics:

I guess all the oil companies that are now GOUGING us at the pumps in the wake of Katrina...they AREN'T taking advantage of a disaster to increase their bottom line, are they? They aren't LOOTING, are they? They aren't PROFITEERING, are they? No, you don't shoot them, but you do shoot poor "trash" (your word not mine) who are looting property that will probably otherwise go to waste, anyway.

At least we know where YOUR priorities lie.

I think Lyric should be temporarily banned for flaming too, to be consistent.

Right now they need to get the people out any way possible and then focus on saving the city itself. They should be sending in ... I don't know, anything! We're supposed to have this huge military with helicopters and stuff. Forget about the looters, I'd rather have a looted city than something at the bottom of an enlarged lake. I'm starting to think New Orleans is done for.

Ah, but you forget our "huge military" is all over in Iraq, doing the important stuff. Fuck the poor Americans, right Dubya?

Ah, but you forget our "huge military" is all over in Iraq, doing the important stuff. Fuck the poor Americans, right Dubya?

Fuck off please. Now is not the time for it.

I gota aunt who most likely died in biloxi
My condolences. I'll pray for your aunt. Please keep us posted.

No...I won't add what I was gonna add, even though I DEARLY want to.

Hey Lyric .... if you want to continue this discussion go start your own thread .... but cmon leave it off of here. :mad:

Chill. The last thing you want to do is be at each other throats right now.. do something for the people right now.. make a donation or something along that lines. Keep fucking politics out of this. That includes Gulf Republics and Lyric. My family was personally effected by this. I'd deeply appreciate it.

Much as we do not get along, Mesa...I would never wish ill on your or those you love and care about, so I hope your family is okay. Meanwhile, I'm not bringing politics into this, I'm merely asking gulf Republics a very famous question..."Have you not a shred of decency in you, sir?"

The absolute depravity, callousness and heartlessness on display by gulf Republics is simply beyond all fucking belief!

My prayers for your family, Mesa.

Much as we do not get along, Mesa...I would never wish ill on your or those you love and care about, so I hope your family is okay. Meanwhile, I'm not bringing politics into this, I'm merely asking gulf Republics a very famous question..."Have you not a shred of decency in you, sir?"

The absolute depravity, callousness and heartlessness on display by gulf Republics is simply beyond all fucking belief!

My prayers for your family, Mesa.

Look you made this political too.. right now is not a good time.. I'd personally appreciate if you refrain from attacking him. Lets just focus on the tragic circumstances of many hundreds of thousands. Gulf Republics has also been banned.. so need to continue this.

I think Lyric should be temporarily banned for flaming too, to be consistent.

Who died and made you a mod? In fact, I think that even publicly suggesting that sopmeone else be banned is a form of flaming.

In spite of all that, and the new level of pissed-off feeling I have for you, Mesa...I'll still pray for your family.

Anyone know how many Americans are dead because of this storm. :D
Wow. Can I shove my fist into your face now or later? Fucking idiot.

Who died and made you a mod? In fact, I think that even publicly suggesting that sopmeone else be banned is a form of flaming..

Grow up and take this elsewhere ... my two year old has better manners than some of you.

If you have any respect for the dead take this conversation elsewhere. ;)

Fair enough. i've made my point, and I'm walking away from this. but I just have to say the level of carelessness, inhumanity, and absolute depravity on display by some of the people here was just completely beyond my ability to tolerate...and I don't even KNOW anyone living in the affected areas!

I happen to care about them because they are human beings! And to have someone make suggestions that they are "trash" and that they are not worth saving, really burns me the hell up...and, mind you...I don't even KNOW anyone there.

Imagnie how people in this thread who have loved ones there must be feeling.

anyways, I'm walking away now, this is just pissing me off too much.

Dude just walk away from it and let it lie.

What justification do you have for looting jewelry, clothing, and other goods?

From an article in my thread about shooting looters,

So don't tell me it's just food...
Something tells me that your "material" instincts have overruled any sense of compassion that you might have for "these people"?

I am sorry but I don't think that there is any justification for murdering looters. It is just morally wrong. Pray for the people of New Orleans and say a little prayer for yourself while you are at it.

I've never tried to post anything before; I hope this goes in right...

I just want to add my $0.02 about people in New Orleans. Many people were able to evacuate, and that is great...except now they are homeless. Others had no where to go and no means (money, transportation etc) to take themselves out of the city. As a veterinarian, I'd like to point out that there are a lot of doctors, nurses, veterinarians, paramedics, and other health care workers that couldn't/wouldn't leave because they were needed there. I know a couple hours ago they were working on rescuing a veterinarian, vet tech, and 25 animals from a flooded animal hospital. I know there are people from the hospital at the Superdome.
Let's not condemn people who stayed. Yes, for some people there it was a poor decision. But for many, there were few reasonable alternatives.

My cousin, a doctor, stayed with a patient. No word on where she or her 12 year old son yet. I hope no one really meant to say that their lives aren't worth trying to save.

Does anybody know the estimated death toll? Grim, I know, but anyways.

Please let it lie.

How about starting a discussion on how NationStaters can band together and help the stricken?? :fluffle:

I am sorry but I don't think that there is any justification for murdering looters. It is just morally wrong. Pray for the people of New Orleans and say a little prayer for yourself while you are at it.

There is when their actions will lead to the deaths of many more people. There are bands of armed men roaming the streets now that they are able to loot guns from these stores, and people are already getting hurt. What happens when they decide to turn on other victims and begin robbing them, or even worse relief supplies?

Not all of these looters are stealing for self preservation; they are the ones taking water/food/potables and are allowed to do so. The others are stealing for profit, and that makes them as diabolical as any profiteer like the price gouging at gas stations or lumber stores.

Does anybody know the estimated death toll? Grim, I know, but anyways.

It's in the thousands, according to the mayor of NO.

It's in the thousands, according to the mayor of NO.
Wait for the disease to set in...

Please let it lie.

How about starting a discussion on how NationStaters can band together and help the stricken?? :fluffle:
You answering to me? I tried that already. The US gov't hasn't asked any help, so the UN nations won't give any. The nearest countries will, of course. I think Canada and Venezuela have offered already.

What pisses me off is that my Red Cross says American RC hasn't asked Int'l RC for help. I would donate in a heartbeat, but I don't want to give to no religious group. So what do I do?

On the subject of shooting looters, let me just say this:

It'd be a pointless and futile endeavour, and would just make more bodies in the water spreading disease. The hurricane and the flood have already killed enough people, do we really need any more dead?

It's a sad thing that people are looting, but shooting them would serve no purpose. Most of what they're stealing would probably be destroyed by the water eventually anyway (and I doubt wherever they're stashing their hoard will be entirely safe, either).

Nothing. But this is an uninhabitable disaster zone where civilian law is simply impossible.
And you would add to that disaster by shooting people instead of concentrating on saving lives. How sad.

And I wouldn't discriminate to just looters. I'd shoot price gougers in the area,
Price gouging is punishable by death? More sadness. :(


I know you love to refute me, and you can.
As far as I know, I have never debated with you before, unless this nation of yours is a puppet state?

But I won't reply.
Your reply is not important, but I do hope that you get over your hate.

I've made my arguement
Yes you have. Unfortunately, you believe that it is okay to murder looters and price gougers. Extremely sad argument. :(

That's the one that annoys me. There's a horrible disaster and some assholes immediately think "I know! I'll steal stuff!"

Dickheads.
they real arent thinking where and the hell are they going to take there new T.V. back to there flodded homes. the said thing is many bussiness wont rebuild offices there knowing that this may happen again it will be a major drain on there economy and on there population who would want to rebuild there i think every one will move to kansas then all they have to worry about is twisters

The others are stealing for profit, and that makes them as diabolical as any profiteer like the price gouging at gas stations or lumber stores.
The ones stealing for "profit" could be arrested and thrown in jail but I imagine that the concentration should be focused on those that are in need first and foremost. Deal with the crooks later.

As far as "price gougers" are concerned, while it may be diabolical for them to do so, it is not against the law, and certainly should not be shot?

When and if the businesses do resume in New Orleans, the people will remember those that took advantage of them and will boycott their businesses?

On the subject of shooting looters, let me just say this:

It'd be a pointless and futile endeavour, and would just make more bodies in the water spreading disease. The hurricane and the flood have already killed enough people, do we really need any more dead?

It's a sad thing that people are looting, but shooting them would serve no purpose. Most of what they're stealing would probably be destroyed by the water eventually anyway (and I doubt wherever they're stashing their hoard will be entirely safe, either).

I think it's just blood lust.

You answering to me? I tried that already. The US gov't hasn't asked any help, so the UN nations won't give any. The nearest countries will, of course. I think Canada and Venezuela have offered already.

What pisses me off is that my Red Cross says American RC hasn't asked Int'l RC for help. I would donate in a heartbeat, but I don't want to give to no religious group. So what do I do?
I can attest that the Canadian government has offered our countries services.

im not being funny here but this reminds me of the movie "28 days later" with crazy survivers and mass deaths. and desiese..

anyways.. anyone know how far flooding could spread? will this get worse? if desiese does spread, how fast and far? im so upset new orleans is fucked.. is the entire place flooded? ie: burbon street, french quarters. i hope not..

and such a depressing way to die. im not religious(sp? im quite tired..) but if there is a god i hope he makes this stop.. i use to think there was some form of god but this.. im just thinking there isnt now. sorry to those who lost family/friends

I can attest that the Canadian government has offered our countries services.
Of course they have. Like a good neighbour would. But some people here want more from the rest of the world. Give us spesifics then, for crying out loud! If it's money you want, open accounts. If it's material and skilled people... ...well come and get us!

Wow. Can I shove my fist into your face now or later? Fucking idiot.


I stand by my statement. I am exercising my right, the same right that you Americans hold so dear (and I am NOT trying to be sarcastic or flame-like).

Wow. Can I shove my fist into your face now or later? Fucking idiot.

Forumbanned one week. FLaming and threats.

Don't you fucking dare talk like that.

Knock it off.

Anyone know how many Americans are dead because of this storm. :D


This is not the first trolling you've done. Take a week's vacation too.
Forumbanned One Week