NationStates Jolt Archive


Fate? (warning, long post, lots of reading)

Ilkarzana
24-08-2005, 05:22
Okay the way I see it is that there must be fate. It is simple logic, but it hard to explain, but I will try my best in these 5 points.

Also, if you are going to yell at me about my spelling, then you obviously have little to say about my acctual post, and if that is the case then your only reason in the first place is to waste peoples time, so please don't. I as always am posting on short time, with alot to type.

Back on topic. The way I see it is that every thing in science happens for a mathmatical reason. It is usally impossiable to calculate EXACTLY what will happen because there are so many factors. Think about this. If you have a canon, and it is stable (it shoots a projectile, the same way for multiple times when you tell it to) then you can get extreamly close to guessing where that canon ball is going to land. And unless you miscalculated then it WILL land there, if it doesn't it is not because math ceased to work, it is because you did the problem wrong.(point 1)

If we apply this same thought processes that we applied in "point 1", to lets say, throwing the same ball, then non-stable factors are involved (for example, it is hard to give it the same amount of force every time) and it is less common for you to predict exactly where the ball will land. However, a ball does not fall where it does on random. The ball lands where it does due to many factors, but if you did in fact now all of them (and are really good at math) then you could pin point exactly where that ball would land. (point 2, i know very basic, but we need it to build on)

Now that person thorwing the ball, did so for certin reasons. Perhapse he threw it with an ounce less strangth that time then he did before, because he has less energy then he did (because he threw the ball, and burned energy) maybe he threw it a bit harder because he just saw a pretty girl and wanted to impress her. However (this is where things get sketchy) everything he does, is based on a mathmatical equation. He thinks one girl is prettier than the others because she might be a bit thinner or her hair a bit darker. He may find this attractive, because his first love had those characteristics. She had those characteristics because her parents had certin genes...ect. ect. This means that the amount of ppsi of pressure he put on that ball is based on how that girl's parent's genes are built. Now there are a billion (litteraly... if not more) factors going into this one eqation of how he throws that ball, and it is not fair to base it all on that one girl. However, all the factors are based on stuff the same way. Another Example: He might of pitched it less hard because he had less energy. He would have had more energy had he eaten more wheeties for brakefast. He didn't have more wheeties for brakefast because he was finishing of the box, and that is all that was left ect. ect. See? So everything has a bijillion factors, and all the factors are based on a billion more factors, but everything can be calculated to an exact piont, even with un-stable factors, you just need all the information.(point 3)

Using point 3's logic, you can take things back as far as you want to say why that kid did not throw it the same as he did before. With the girl example, you could say the true reason, he did not throw that ball the same as he did before, is because that girl's ancestors (3000 years ago) lived in some country where ever one had black hair. With the wheeties example, you could say the reason that box didn't have an ounce more wheeties in it is because the factory worker snuck some on his lunch brake. He did this because he didn't have more than a tuna sandwich for lunch. His family is poor, couldn't afford more than tuna. His family is poor because 3000 years ago his family lost all of their riches because they killed some one's cat. So today's events are based on every thing that has happened before we were even born. Even the things we think we have total control over, is completly predetermined, and we chose the things we chose, based on the past.(point 4)

This means, we can go back as far as we want with this. Meaning the reason, my favriot color is blue, and you are male, or female, all goes back to the very thing that first happened in the universe... weather it was god created everything, or the first atom moved left rather than right (which even that is based on something, but i can't think of any thing before that).(point 5)

I hope with these 5 points, I made my point clear. If you don't think I did, or want to protest what I am saying all together, I invite that with open arms, just try not to make a fool out of your selves, and acctaully post why you think i am a dumbass rather than just bluntly saying "you fag" or something gay like that. And please, no "yu fuking speeled compromise rong you dumb ass hole!!!!1111one" or I will be forced to ignor you even if you do have something worthwhile to say... which I doubt you would.
Xhadam
24-08-2005, 05:26
Yup, that's determinism. However, due to Heisenberg's uncertainty principle it doesn't do us much good for actually predicting the future. Since we can never know it it may as well not be planned out and thus we maintain a semblance of free will in a predetermined universe.
Nassit
24-08-2005, 05:30
Yes, in theory, if you managed to get a perfect snapshot of the entire universe at two points in time, you could derive everything that has been and everything that will be from that. But the knowledge of this in itself would change the future...
Doesn't modern quatum physics teach that the very mesh of the universe itself is unstable, chaotic, and "bumpy." So this may not hold true because that institues a purely random variable, that may cause the ball to be 1/10000 of a degree different, or open a wormhole that swallows the ball. So no, the future is not certain, embrace chaos theory!!!
Scandinaviopolis
24-08-2005, 05:40
Also, it is not possible, at this time, to account for every factor in the course of events as we know it, because we do not know for certain whether or not we know everything there is to know about the universe itself and everything in it, or if there are so-called 'parallel universes' that might occasionally fluctuate and cross into ours briefly.
Evil Arch Conservative
24-08-2005, 06:03
Many processes resulting from quantum mechanics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_mechanics) are completely random. The best example I can give is radioactive decay. A formula cannot be made that determines when an unstable nucleus will emit radiation. The best thing that you can do is determine what the most likely interval of time is that will occur between emissions.
Ilkarzana
25-08-2005, 00:16
I thought about most of this when I posted, it just makes me a more laid back guy. Since it was fate for some one to say, dent my car, why should i get pissed off at them?