NationStates Jolt Archive

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.

Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything?

No. See, what you're supposed to do is convince yourself that you felt something. Tell yourself over and over and over again that you felt something. Insta-religion!

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.

Just follow your feelings. If you feel you got an answer go with it. If you feel there was noone to hear your prayer then don't.

Don't let people tell you what to believe or what not to believe, it's a personal choice.

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.


Only those who sublimate themselves "feel" anything. It's like being a hypochondriac, always feeling sick because you "feel" you are sick.

For the record, you sound less like a "straight forward" agnostic then a zen buddhist. Searching for enlightenment in the here and now.

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.
It may not feel any different at first but keep it up. I mean the worst would be that you got some extra meditation in right? try to go to church maybe. worked for me :)

Every Christian is going to tell you that it's God's will as to what he does in your life, and that you are heading on the right path.

All the atheists will tell you that no, you will not feel anything because there is no God (not that I don't think there is a God).

Just follow your feelings. If you feel you got an answer go with it. If you feel there was noone to hear your prayer then don't.

Don't let people tell you what to believe or what not to believe, it's a personal choice.

Oh, of course I agree with you, but I am just saying from the stand point of being open minded. I can't say that I have had any real "spiritual experiences" and I just wanted to see if it did anything for me. So far the answer is no, but I thought I'd give it a shot.

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.

Having doubts is normal. Even pastors have doubts. There isn't (at least there hasn't been for me) any "bright light" or "sudden peaceful feeling" especially when I'm going through times of stress, but I pray anyway because I believe He is listening and in His own time things will work the way they're supposed to.

I'm still scared of death....regardless of how sure i am that there is a G-d.

Because i really do not want oblivion...oO

Probably why, i am gonna go for the first legitimate Immortality Serum that comes out. =)

Well. Keep searching. I'm sure you'll find God, or God will find you :p.

If not, at least you tried.

Well. Keep searching. I'm sure you'll find God, or God will find you :p.

If not, at least you tried.

I would like to ask out of curiosity, hhow did you supposedly find god? Did you find "him" for yourself? Was there someone who pointed him out for you? Was it during a time of stress? These are things that I would like to know and understand. Even if I don't believe it myself, it would be nice to know how other's did.

I would like to ask out of curiosity, hhow did you supposedly find god? Did you find "him" for yourself? Was there someone who pointed him out for you? Was it during a time of stress? These are things that I would like to know and understand. Even if I don't believe it myself, it would be nice to know how other's did.


I guess it would be like Buddha finding enlightenment.

You'd just be sitting there, and then suddenly, it all makes sense to you.

That's my guess anyways.

Probably why, i am gonna go for the first legitimate Immortality Serum that comes out. =)

There are two ways to live life:-

1) Live each day as if it is your last.

2) Live each day as if you are immortal.

I'm lazy, I take option 2.

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.
Every honest theist has doubts.

When it comes to religious beliefs I am someone who is straight forward agnostic, I honestly could not say if there is or isn't a god. So rather than try and live my life trying to find one that might not exist, I would usually rather just live for this life and for the power of the self. But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.
It took me a moment to get out of my usual mentality, but after a little while I god down on my knees and in the dark started praying by my bedside. I said something to the tune of,"I don't normally do this and I don't even know if you are out there, but if you are I would like to know and I would be willing to give faith a chance."
I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.

Prayer is useful when you need it to be... call it a placebo, call it psychosomatics, call it whatever the hell you want. Praying out of skepticism isn't likely to affect much of anything.

In a thread here about phobias I said that I had only really been physically terrified (cold sweat, trembling, stomach movement, heart pounding, that sort of thing) once in my entire life and that there was absolutely nothing to be afraid of. I was 14 at the time, on the second floor of a house my family was renovating, and I didn't want to move... I wasn't even alone. So, I prayed for the strength to face my fear, I told my brothers, I picked up a claw hammer and I went for a walk. I felt better, and I have never felt like that since.

Probably why, i am gonna go for the first legitimate Immortality Serum that comes out. =)

have you learned nothing from death becomes her?

Well. Keep searching. I'm sure you'll find God, or God will find you :p.

If not, at least you tried.

What if god doesn't find her? What if god shows up but she's out to dinner, or a movie? What if god makes an appointment but he's late?

Waiting for god to find you is like waiting for a bus that isn't going to show up. The only people that "god finds" are the suckers that let the Jehovah's Witnesses in and end up being converts.

What if god doesn't find her? What if god shows up but she's out to dinner, or a movie? What if god makes an appointment but he's late?

I'm a guy by the way the name is not from fiona, but from Fionn MacCumhail the legendary Irish hero of the Fennian Cycle of mythology. Not that it matters, but that seems to be happening a lot.

I would like to ask out of curiosity, hhow did you supposedly find god? Did you find "him" for yourself? Was there someone who pointed him out for you? Was it during a time of stress? These are things that I would like to know and understand. Even if I don't believe it myself, it would be nice to know how other's did.

As some kind of illustration I'll tell you my story.

I was brought up a Christian, spent much of my life in the church one way or another but I began to drift away about 4 years ago. I was going through a bad patch with school, generally losing interest in life. In 2003 I went to a Christian youth weekend called Crossfire, chilled out there with a bunch of other teenagers, some in a similar boat to me, others who were committed Christians. We chilled out, shared stories, talked about faith and the Bible, sang a few songs, played a few games had a good time.

On the Saturday evening (it started on Friday, ended Sunday afternoon) during a worship session I began to 'zone out' drifting outside the normal plane of feeling, I felt something calling to me and I started to feel weak. So I sat down in a corner, one of the leaders came over and talked to me about it and then the feeling hit me again, harder this time and I felt like I was touching some great source of calm and compassion. I can't say I 'talked' with it, no great philosophical conversation or anything but suddenly all my worries and problems seemed to evaporate, I knew God was taking care of it.

Since then I've felt that kind of presence again, never as strong but when I sit down to pray and meditate I can feel God out there listening to me.

If you want to find God then go to church, talk to christians about him, find less formal events where you can just talk about it, hear other's stories and learn more about your own faith. When you need Him, He'll be there.

Doubtless an atheist can find some psychological explanation for it all. To you I say, burn in hell you filthy heretics! *

I can't say I've never doubted since, because I have, no two ways about it. I've always felt that sceptical cynicism is the only healthy way to view the world but I've always come back in the end.

*If you couldn't tell, that was a joke, I pray for you guys.

God has had loads of chances. He screwed up. It's over.

but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god.

This experiment is not meant as a bash against mainstream religions (although I'm sure it will be taken that way by some).

Try this to test human nature.

Mix up a box of orange jello and add some smelling salts from a medical kit to it. After it sets up cut it into 1 inch cubes and display it atractively on a dessert plate.

Take this plate to as many "everyday respectable people" as you can find, offer it to them and say, "Here, smell this. It REALLY stinks."
Then, closely watch thier reactions.

In the U.S. we are almost 70% Christian. I am willing to bet that more than 70% of the people you offer stinky jello to will sniff it just because you suggested that they should.

The ones that you should be very wary of are the ones who want to sniff it after they have seen the sour faces of those who just have.

Also keep in mind that these people have not been raised in a household where they have been instructed to sniff jello at least once a week. Nor do they meet a community support group every Sunday where they are incouraged to sniff stinky jello.

They just follow along because you made a friendly suggestion that they should (even after you told them it really stinks). Some of them will even turn and offer it to thier friends to sniff.

Now throw in an "after-life".
Hold out the jello and a one dollar bill and say, "Smell this jello and give me your opinion of its aroma, then I will give you this dollar."

Trust me --- the reactions get really interesting from here.
Grimlin

If you would say that there is no evidence of the existance of a god, I would agree with you, but I don't think that means you shouldn't believe in God. Paul said that "Faith is the essence of things hoped for." I think that, if you allow yourself to have any optimism, belief in God is entirely good and natural. This doesn't mean that you have to be fundamentalist or even specifically Christian (Christianity is merely my outlet of faith.) Faith, I think can be a wonderful thing. I encourage you to give faith a chance, but I remind you that deciding to reject faith is a choice that works out perfectly well for many who take that path.

he isnt gonna come down or anything...

I'm not an expert on the christian religion even though I am a christian. But the feeling comes from relizing all that he has done for you. Some people may have it others may not. I'm almost always on a natraul high mainly becuase of religion.

Every honest theist has doubts.

Does every honest atheist have doubts? Just wondering.

Does every honest atheist have doubts? Just wondering.

I suppose. But those mostly come at the beginning for us (at least with me) and its because we are raised in a society where theism is the norm. I began doubting god when I was in elementary school, before i knew what atheism was or that i could reject god all together. I dont believe that it would have happened the other way around. I have a great imagination, just not that great.

On another side note, about the jello experiment, i have no idea what thats trying to prove. That we are an inquisitive people? Or that we are glutons for pain.

Fionn, the only advice I have as an atheist is to never go to a religion that prosthelytizes. Notice that as of this posting the only ones that really have (and have stated their religion) where Christian. With a name like Fionn (sorry for the stereotyping) it sounds like youre coming from a christian background anyway, but try to steer away from the annoying religions. If you can find a religion you truely believe in, go for it. Hell, youll live longer.

But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."
If you're basing it on other people, you should probably go for Hinduism instead, considering that's the single largest religion by population. (Islam and Christianity are larger only if you lump the various "sub-groups" together)

If you're basing it on other people, you should probably go for Hinduism instead, considering that's the single largest religion by population. (Islam and Christianity are larger only if you lump the various "sub-groups" together)

So are you claiming that two people have to have the exact same beliefs in order to be of the same religion?

Fionn, the only advice I have as an atheist is to never go to a religion that prosthelytizes. .


Question: how does a religion that doesn't prosthelyze grow, or even maintain its numbers, for that matter? Do you know of any?

Question: how does a religion that doesn't prosthelyze grow, or even maintain its numbers, for that matter? Do you know of any?

Judiasm has laws against it. Buddhism, for the most part, keeps to itself. I have never been in a place that has any siginificant population of hindus, so I dont know how bad they are. Same goes for Muslims in contemporary society, but historically theyre fairly leniant. I dont think that goes for today though. As far as Im aware Christianity is by far the worst in regards to its inability to allow for diversity or diverging opinions.

I believe in God, even though he's never shown himself to me in any way that couldn’t be explained as chance. I'm kind of a Christian (raised a Methodist but have seen the good points in other religions). You loose nothing by believing in God and having faith. If you don’t want to follow a religion you don’t have to. If you live a good life and have good morals then theres nothing to be scared of.

So are you claiming that two people have to have the exact same beliefs in order to be of the same religion?No, but given the extreme differences between various sects of Christianity you can't really lump them altogether and say "This is a coherent group". After all, Catholics say God won't talk to you directly, but you go through a priest. For Protestants, it's the reverse.

So, if he wants to base his religious choice on the one the most people are doing, it just seems to make sense to base it on the largest coherent group.

Just follow your heart.



Everything you could ever want or be, you already have and are. - From I heart Huckabee's

God is everywhere and nowhere.

No, but given the extreme differences between various sects of Christianity you can't really lump them altogether and say "This is a coherent group". After all, Catholics say God won't talk to you directly, but you go through a priest. For Protestants, it's the reverse.

So, if he wants to base his religious choice on the one the most people are doing, it just seems to make sense to base it on the largest coherent group.

A christian is just anyone who believes that Jesus was the son of god and the messiah and whatnot... Its a broad term for a large religion. I dont think God talking to you is an extreme difference. Youll have any even harder time with Muslims. They use the same books (give or take) just have different interpretations. By your standards Judiasm is at least 4 different groups, though most Jews wouldnt see it that way at all.

Doubt is entirely natural and normal. I've never had any kind of cloud-parting, voice-in-my-mind spiritual experience, and yet I believe that some kind of divinity exists.

If, as you'd said before, you're agnostic, I think you'd have trouble fitting into most organized religions.I'd recommend instead figuring out for yourself what makes sense and brings you comfort.

I recommand Wicca or any New Age stuff that is related to spirtuality. You shoudnt believe in everything a particuarly group preach, you should only believe in things you are comfortable with.

And you dont have to seek for God, he or she or it are already in you. You are connected to everything.

I have been touched personally by His Noodly Appendage.

I have been touched personally by His Noodly Appendage.

now thats just bragging...

now thats just bragging...
...or gross.

*snip* But then I thought to myself, "I really shouldn't be so close minded, I guess I'll give this a shot. I mean ALL these people can't be talking out there asses."So last night I gave it a shot.

*snip* I don't think I felt anything and I feel no different, but I figure that there may be some sense in this if all these everyday respectable people can say that they believe in the power of god. Basically what I am getting at is: should I be feeling anything or expecting anything? Because as far as I am concerned I am still doubtful.
You're not going to feel anything until you have a reason to. "All these other people" have their reasons, you have to find your own.

What do you want god for?

Re: giving God a chance.

You will never ever get a straight answer out of the forum asking any sort of a religious question. Christians are out numbered there by at least four to one and are very often shouted down when a point is trying to be made by them. The people who make the multiple posts are rarely espousing a Christian point of view. So take what you find here with a grain of salt. I used to be agnostic for most of my life. When I stated to pray in my life, I had the same questions you had, wondered many of the same things. Prayer for me a sort of process. Instantaneous results rarely happen, except the relief you may feel at having unburdened yourself to a close friend with a problem. But if you keep at it, gradual improvement will occur. And if you start reading the Bible (particularly the New Testament) and begin applying the necessary changes you find therein to your life bringing your life into line with a more Christ-centric philosophy, the positive effects of prayer in your life will increase, until it becomes very easy to see God at work in your life. No, my life is not perfect. You have to work at being a Christian every day for the rest of my life, and some of the changes are most definitely not easy ones to make. But as a result of prayer and the changes prayer has wrought in my life, I have hope, where before there was none, and a sense of purpose, when before I had no direction. Ignore the naysayers. Keep at it. They do not understand prayer any more than a fish can understand what life is like for an air breathing mammal. I'll pray for you in the hopes that you continue and see the benefits of having prayer work for you.

Judiasm has laws against it. Buddhism, for the most part, keeps to itself. I have never been in a place that has any siginificant population of hindus, so I dont know how bad they are. Same goes for Muslims in contemporary society, but historically theyre fairly leniant. I dont think that goes for today though. As far as Im aware Christianity is by far the worst in regards to its inability to allow for diversity or diverging opinions.

I don't know about the Hindus and Buddhists, but the Muslims proselyze quite a bit in the African-American community.

As for Jews, the dictionary definition of proselyte is :


Main Entry: 1pros·e·lyte
Pronunciation: 'prä-s&-"lIt
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English proselite, from Late Latin proselytus proselyte, alien resident, from Greek prosElytos, from pros near + -Elytos (akin to Elythe he went) -- more at PROS-, ELASTIC
: a new convert; specifically : a convert to Judaism

Jesus also mention Jewish proselization in Matthew 23:15 "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves." However, nowadays they rely more on Jewish ethnicity to maintain their numbers.

Among the Christian sects that do not proselyze are the Mennonites and the Amish. In fact, I don't think an outsider can join either of those groups even if he wanted. The Quakers don't proselyze to any extent, either, but an outsider can still join them.

Be that as it may, any group needs some proselization if it is to grow, be it a religion, the boy scouts, a chess club, PETA, civil rights groups, or whatever.

After all, Catholics say God won't talk to you directly, but you go through a priest.
p.

Not true, says this Catholic. :)

I don't know about the Hindus and Buddhists, but the Muslims proselyze quite a bit in the African-American community.

As for Jews, the dictionary definition of proselyte is :


Main Entry: 1pros·e·lyte
Pronunciation: 'prä-s&-"lIt
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English proselite, from Late Latin proselytus proselyte, alien resident, from Greek prosElytos, from pros near + -Elytos (akin to Elythe he went) -- more at PROS-, ELASTIC
: a new convert; specifically : a convert to Judaism

Jesus also mention Jewish proselization in Matthew 23:15 "Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves." However, nowadays they rely more on Jewish ethnicity to maintain their numbers.

Among the Christian sects that do not proselyze are the Mennonites and the Amish. In fact, I don't think an outsider can join either of those groups even if he wanted. The Quakers don't proselyze to any extent, either, but an outsider can still join them.

Be that as it may, any group needs some proselization if it is to grow, be it a religion, the boy scouts, a chess club, PETA, civil rights groups, or whatever.

Converts in Judiasm work differently then in Christianity, which may account for why there was originally a word for them. Judiasm is less a religion than an ethnicity. I am just as Jewish as I was when I was born, despite my strong atheistic beliefs. There is no contradiction there. You are also confusing having converts with courting them. Judiasm accepts converts, they do not seek them. And yes, I do realize there are small sects of Christianity that do not seek converts and I applaud them. But Quakers Mennonites and the Amish are an incredibly small part of the Christian world.

Do not take the Christian bible version of Judiasm as being accurate. Now, it may very well have been accurate back then. But Jesus was fighting against a corrupt jewish church. i.e. they were not obeying their own laws. Thats like saying that molesting boys isnt against the rules of Catholocism. It clearly is, and the fact that church leaders broke it does not make it otherwise.

Now, if you want to convert to Judiasm you are turned away two times, and only allowed to begin the process (and it is a process) on the third time. I have never seen an evangelical turn away someone.

Religion should not be concerned with growing. They should allow people to listen to their beliefs, but never force anyone to. Religion is a matter of personal decision. It is not something to badger someone into.

What do you want god for?

Honestly, I'm not sure if I necessarily have a reason for a god. Lately I've been moving towards the Nietzschian end of things(i.e. the power of humanity over the power of a god that may not exist), but I thought that before I take that big step over to the other end, I thought I'd give some sort of god a try. And even though I still feel as though I there may not be a god, it has been rather enlightening to see people who are more open minded, and not just preaching there views from the roof tops like I usually see.

Same goes for Muslims in contemporary society, but historically theyre fairly leniant. I dont think that goes for today though. As far as Im aware Christianity is by far the worst in regards to its inability to allow for diversity or diverging opinions.

In many countries throughout the Islamic world, it is illegal to convert Muslems to other faiths, Sharia law is practiced, and being a Pagan or Atheist is illegal (punishable in some instances by death). This clearing up this little misconception about the "historical leniency" of the Muslem world.

Amestria']In many countries throughout the Islamic world, it is illegal to convert Muslems to other faiths, Sharia law is practiced, and being a Pagan or Atheist is illegal (punishable in some instances by death). This clearing up this little misconception about the "historical leniency" of the Muslem world.

by historical, i meant in the past. and at least in the middle ages were much more lenient then many christian communities. for example, spain was a far nicer place to minorities under the Moors then it was under the Catholics. thats what i meant by historical leniency, and i stated that i didnt know if thats the case today.

and most places that i know about that have these death penalties rarely use them for people who just practice their faith in private.

Just follow your feelings. If you feel you got an answer go with it. If you feel there was noone to hear your prayer then don't.

Don't let people tell you what to believe or what not to believe, it's a personal choice.

"Draw close to God and he will draw close to you..." - JAMES 4:8

It took me 26 years to feel the divine presence in my life. He does listen, don't give up. :)

1. Now, if you want to convert to Judiasm you are turned away two times, and only allowed to begin the process (and it is a process) on the third time. I have never seen an evangelical turn away someone.

2. Religion should not be concerned with growing. They should allow people to listen to their beliefs, but never force anyone to. Religion is a matter of personal decision. It is not something to badger someone into.

1. So, evangelicalism seems friendlier, if nothing else. :)

2. I agree, it is not something to badger someone into. However, if you have strong reasons for believing that God a.) exists, and b.) exists in a specific form, and c.) has created all things and, d.) as creator, expects certain things from his creation, such as acknowledgment that he did, indeed, create them, then I think it is incumbent upon God's believers to spread his message. If people choose to reject that message, that's their business, and the evangelist's mission has been accomplished and further responsibility is no longer his.

What's with all the God threads today??

"Draw close to God and he will draw close to you..." - JAMES 4:8

It took me 26 years to feel the divine presence in my life. He does listen, don't give up. :)

How did you feel the divine presence? Dont answer if you feel its too personal a question. I'm just quite interested as someone who has been told not to give up hope that one day i'll feel the same thing. I've yet to feel it although I still try to research different religions in hope

I, too, have tried to give god a chance. I have prayed, to no gods in specific, to show me some kind of sign, some reason to believe. Even if I wanted to believe, I cant just throw a dart at a billboard with religions on it. I wish, strongly, that religion was a real, substantial thing, preferably with an afterlife. But I have no reason to believe in one.