NationStates Jolt Archive

Why I Hate the Chinese Government

A person with a Chinese name on here asked recently, "Why does everyone hate the Chinese government?"

I'll tell you why. They are a chapter out of George Orwell's book, 1984. From the global communist government, to the re-education, to the sexual prohibitions, to the propaganda.

According to current psychology, it is possible to control others' minds, and one major way is by framing and designing words to have a certain meaning. A famous Sociologist once put forth a theory (which is generally-accepted today), which is that reality does not just determine words. Sometimes, words can determine reality. This is also proven by psychology. George Orwell called it "duckspeak." It is when governments and organizations develop certain key phrases and terms, that they repeat over and over, and by repeating them, bombarding the mind with the phrase, eventually, it's fairly likely that humans will attach the connotation of the word, to the connotation of the object it's describing. (All governments use them to a certain extent, such as the Bush's, "PATRIOT Act," but very few use them to the extent that China does).

This is why China refers to itself as the People's Republic, run by the National People's Congress, with a Supreme People's Court, and protected by the People's Liberation army. Even though China's elections are an absolute sham, if you constantly flood people's perceptions with the "People's," eventually, they attach that connotation to the government, congress, the courts, and the army. So, even if it's outstandingly obvious, that it is not democratically-elected, people believe it anyway. China also banned Google (http://yahoo.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/sep2004/nf20040930_3318_db046.htm) until Google agreed to censor themselves. Microsoft also cut a deal with China (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=2&url=http%3A//www.theregister.co.uk/2005/06/13/ms_ban_freedom/&ei=IrMEQ_TkJ7S4YMPZjIsK), recently, to sell internet in China, as long as they censor the words, "freedom," and "democracy," from it. Microsoft agreed. Also, last year China banned Wikipedia (http://www.itworld.com/Tech/2987/040614wikipedia).

China seriously fears free-speech. Not because they're afraid of violence or anti-goverment rebels (they'll exist, regardless), but because they know how easily an anti-Communist movement would grow, as a result of people sharing opinions that don't agree with the government's.

The Chinese government's official news network (www.china.org.cn/english/) is also a serious joke. According to their "news," the economy is always doing good, the government is never corrupt, the quality-of-life in China is always good, and anyone who dissents islabeled a foreign terrorist. A few days ago, I saw an article on there about a famous general who died, who was said to be, "a role model," to us all for his devotion to the government, and that he died of "diseases relating to hardwork." When I read that last phrase, I particularly laughed, because it seems outrageous that anyone could ever accept such nonsense... But when that's all you see everyday, surprisingly, you would believe it too.

Furthermore, I am disturbed about child labor in China and forced abortions. In addition to the torture, I am fairly certain that the Chinese government has been doing Nazi-science, which is quite possibly a reason for why so many strange new diseases, such as SARS, came out of China (after all, China has a problem with population growth, and if they'll use forced abortions, why not biological weapons?). There was a high-ranking military doctor who alleged that China tried to cover-up the SARS virus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiang_Yanyong).

They are, in my opinion, the most tyrranical and terrifying government in the world. Most of all, because the western nations refuse to stand up to China, because of her powerful military. It's estimated that China has the largest military in the world (most number of soldiers), the second-most powerful military overall, and the most powerful air force in the world. With an evil regime having power like that, I certainly hope that the CIA and the SIS (aka MI-6) are working to initiate change within the government. Because I don't believe China is changing. They may be trading more, but they still usually have the upper-advantage, when it comes to being able to cut off nations from trade with them, and there has been no change in their civil rights. There is absolutely no reason to believe, whatsoever, that trading with China is not merely feeding the Communist beast.

And finally, the Chinese government's desire to invade Taiwan is sickening. Their anti-Japanese racism is disgusting. And the fact that their schools put forth lies about what happened at Tien'anmen Square is barbaric, inhuman, and as disgraceful as you could possibly get. That is why I hate the Chinese government, in case it isn't obvious. And to be quite honest, it would put a smile on my face, if every member of the Communist Party in China was rounded up by political dissidents, then lined up and shot. Or better yet, put those cowardly bureaucrats in labor camps to be tortured and "re-educated."

And they eat chickens feet. As well as Ducks feet!
ewww......

I agree with most of what you say. But when Deng Xiaoping liberalized the economy, he released forces far greater than what he could control. The government almost fell during Tianemen Square, but I just don't think that it had the support of most people. After all, they lived in isolated villages, often illiterate, and considered their survival as a way of life. That's all changing. In a generation or so, these peasants' kids will have kids, and they will all live in cities, most will own cars, and many will be well educated. Quite a few will have even traveled abroad. By this point, if the Chinese government does not collapse, it will reform. It remains to be seen how.

http://cagle.msnbc.com/news/Lane2002/Lane/lane%203.gif

I know that's regarding the sham elections that occurred in Saddam's Iraq, but that's the closest representation I could find of the Chinese elections. They have elections? Yeah and the DPRK is democratic... what a joke.

I could also do some serious picking at the Chinese economy. People on this forum know the issues I have with the Chinese government, and they know what I have said about the shitty state of employment in the country.

http://cagle.msnbc.com/news/Lane2002/Lane/lane%203.gif

I know that's regarding the sham elections that occurred in Saddam's Iraq, but that's the closest representation I could find of the Chinese elections. They have elections? Yeah and the DPRK is democratic... what a joke.

I could also do some serious picking at the Chinese economy. People on this forum know the issues I have with the Chinese government, and they know what I have said about the shitty state of employment in the country.
And the undervaluing of their currency, which basically allows them to tamper with the world market.

I couldn't agree with whoever started this thread more.

Sadly, unless things really start to change, and I mean NOW, China will become the dominant superpower and the U.S. will have to "Easternise" to be able to compete.

I like chicken feet. Duck feets are webby and not so good to eat.

Sadly, unless things really start to change, and I mean NOW, China will become the dominant superpower and the U.S. will have to "Easternise" to be able to compete.

Indeed, I am quite afraid of what will happen in the future because of China.

how just 40 years ago (that's not that long) just the suggestion that the U.S. government would be a major trading patrner with a Communist government, any Communist government, would be met with outright shock and derision. I'm not about to advocate McCarthyism, but aren't we supposed to be "defending freedom" in the world? That's what the people in charge here seem to want me to think. (Hmmm) Our getting into bed with China has everything to do with greed, and jacksquat to do with promoting democracy.

I'm no free trade zealot but I think that in the long term, trade with countries like China will do more to encourage democracy than isolation.

-snip-

Well said.

Sadly, unless things really start to change, and I mean NOW, China will become the dominant superpower and the U.S. will have to "Easternise" to be able to compete.

No it won't. China has serious economic problems hiding behind its veneer of strong growth, in addition to the population imbalance, total inexperience in managing inflation, lack of anticorruption regulations, and the gradual elimination of the unfair advantage China has with the yuan. It's a house of cards waiting to collapse.

Don't forget their utter inability to face up to the bizarre demographic problem trends that they're facing, ranging from an overpercentage of men, to waaaay too many old people.

A person with a Chinese name on here asked recently, "Why does everyone hate the Chinese government?"

I'll tell you why. They are a chapter out of George Orwell's book, 1984. From the (fictional, Dobb's edit) global communist government, to the re-education, to the sexual prohibitions, to the propaganda.

Which is course completely different from the US government, from the actual, nascent global capitalist government (G-8), to the curtailing of education (and limits on attendant intellectual freedoms), to the sexual inequities and prohibitions, to the (and you must admit to having stepped into the shit on this one) propaganda.

Pot. Kettle. Black.

*ducks*

This is a little bit long, but worth reading.

I watched a Chinese movie a while ago called "Happy Times". It was marketed as a comedy, but the Chinese apparently have a different perspective of what's funny because it was one of the most depressing movies I've watched in years. The story is about a middle aged man, never married (for the unarticulated reason that there are way too many men compared to women in China because they kill off so many of their little girls--women are inferior, afterall) who is attempting to court a woman by bragging about owning a hotel he doesn't have. The woman is hideous and abusive. In the woman's care is an 18 year old blind girl who was abandoned by her father years ago, and despite the emotional and physical abuse of the woman, fruitlessly clings to the hope that once her father has enough money, he'll come back for her.

The woman convinces the man to hire the girl at his non-existent hotel because the girl isn't pulling her weight (being blind and all). The man cooks up an elaborate scheme to convince the girl that she is working at a massage parlor in his hotel. In the end, the man is critically injured and in a coma in some crappy Chinese hospital room that looks like something out of a Turkish ER during world war one. Just before his injury, the woman he was courting decided to go for a guy who had more money anyway and told him the girl was now his responsibility alone. The girl, who knew all along that she was being hoodwinked but played along because she had no where else to go, runs away before learning of the injury because she hates the idea of continuing to be a burden to anyone. She's shown walking down the street in a strange city with no money, no friends, no contacts, and no hope. She tells us that, as her father said, no matter how horrible things are, you have to keep your chin up because this is as good as it gets, so just suck it up, baby.

But what really killed me about all this was a scene in which the man, his friend, and the girl were eating supper and they started to discuss the (false) possibility of the girl getting the proper medical treatment to restore her sight. The friend said that if they had the money, they would take her to the best doctor in Beijing. The man said that if they had the money, they would take her to the best doctor in all of China. The friend countered that if they had the money, they would take her to the best doctor in America! But then the man (via the communist propaganda machine of the People's Republic, no doubt) chimed in, "no no no! the best doctors are here in China, not in America!" I wanted to throw up. I wondered if the Chinese people could possibly believe that crap. The audacity of this statement was accentuated by the later scene where he was on the crudest life-support system I've seen that looked like a Turkist ER from the 1910s. I was just thinking "dang, this is their idea of medical care?"

Anyway, the moral of the story is that no matter how badly China sucks, they can't admit to it; and that's precisely why they suck so bad.

No it won't. China has serious economic problems hiding behind its veneer of strong growth, in addition to the population imbalance, total inexperience in managing inflation, lack of anticorruption regulations, and the gradual elimination of the unfair advantage China has with the yuan. It's a house of cards waiting to collapse.

They have enough manpower and bundles of spaer capacity for production - I think that their problems will not be enough to derail their relative progress. Also, being China, they'd be quite prepared to swap old age pensions for military hardware, so their ageing population won't be the same problem that it will be in Europe, for example.

Anyway, apparently the Chinese government puts people onto chat rooms to push a pro-Beijing line anonymously, to make it seem like ordinary people are on their side. I though they only did it in China, but perhaps we had one here too! I like the idea! :)

Which is course completely different from the US government, from the actual, nascent global capitalist government (G-8), to the curtailing of education (and limits on attendant intellectual freedoms), to the sexual inequities and prohibitions, to the (and you must admit to having stepped into the shit on this one) propaganda.

Pot. Kettle. Black.

*ducks*

"Actual nascent global capitalist government..."

We'll see what happens. The propaganda and globalization might be a bit at odds, though.

"to the curtailing of education"

What are you referring to, specifically?

"to sexual inequities and prohibitions"

The inequities have shrank in the last hundred years and I think that trend will continue in the long run. The western world gives women a lot more respect the China does. As for prohibitions, they're worth the paper they're written on and nothing more.

"to the propaganda."

That's like comparing a water faucet to a fire hose and you know it!

And the undervaluing of their currency, which basically allows them to tamper with the world market.
And they drink their children's blood! And conspire to enslave the world! :rolleyes:

You should understand that there is no perfect form of government. The only true freedom exists in death. And unless you've been to China or are an expert on the subject, then your words are rather doubtful.

You should understand that there is no perfect form of government. The only true freedom exists in death. And unless you've been to China or are an expert on the subject, then your words are rather doubtful.

How would you know there is freedom in "death", no one has ever experienced it. In my opinion nothing can truly be free, the universe has laws that everyone adheres to.

Because when you die, you are free from the constraints of society. When you die, you are no longer aware.

you can't say it doesn’t work though

besides the government is changing (slowly) due to the people voting for more liberal party's so when China does become a superpower it will hopefully be allot more democratic (though im sorry communism will be staying there for some time)

Because when you die, you are free from the constraints of society. When you die, you are no longer aware.

What is left of you is still bound to the laws of science. I'm no neurologist so I have no clue on how the "thought" process works exactly.

They have enough manpower and bundles of spaer capacity for production - I think that their problems will not be enough to derail their relative progress. Also, being China, they'd be quite prepared to swap old age pensions for military hardware, so their ageing population won't be the same problem that it will be in Europe, for example.

Anyway, apparently the Chinese government puts people onto chat rooms to push a pro-Beijing line anonymously, to make it seem like ordinary people are on their side. I though they only did it in China, but perhaps we had one here too! I like the idea! :)

Absolutely not. For one you have a country with 20-25% unemployment and considerable underemployment. These problems are not small and are actually getting larger. Secondly, China's population is aging abnormally fast. Developing countries aren't supposed to age this fast, but it has to do with the one child policy. China will have reductions in economic efficency as more of their population ages (30% will be over the age of 60 by 2040). This will cause severe problems. China is headed towards financial trouble and any growth right now is superficial. I predict capital flight to happen in several years as companies relocate, when the conditions in China get worse. Finally, there has been more and more cases of civil unrest reported throughout China. It is only a matter of time before this starts to spread.

first of all the chinese government arn't communists

they are state capitalists

and yes they are evil but so are all the governments of the world to a greater or lesser degree

I hate all governments in existance at the moment

just I hate some more (israel, china, America, etc) then others (luxemborg, norway, etc)

1984 is an amazing novel, thats pretty much all i had to say.

I agree with the originator of this thread, which is why when I went to China on holiday this past May, I haggled like hell in the flea markets.

Many Westerners easily get stressed out in such situations, but by the time I was finished doing business, it was the merchants who were stressed out. I made off with lots of stuff for dirt cheap, and I didn't feel one ounce of guilt. Furthermore, whenever I saw an American getting stressed out over a transaction, I'd approach them and let them know (in front of the merchants) that they could get that particular item for a tenth of the price at the stall around the corner. The American tourist ended up getting their items for cheap. Man, did these merchants get pissed!!!

As an American citizen, I have an obligation to mitigate the effects of overseas tourism upon our trade deficit. Which is not to say that I will not travel... I just spend as little as possible.

"to the propaganda."

That's like comparing a water faucet to a fire hose and you know it!

Bullshit. Western propoganda is just way more subtle. Instead of drilling the Peoples Whatever of Whatever into peoples heads until they believe it, we just have our pervasive media work under the assumption that our way of life is the only workable one, and demonize everything, anything else as extremism. Sometimes deservedly, often not.

first of all the chinese government arn't communists

they are state capitalists

and yes they are evil but so are all the governments of the world to a greater or lesser degree

I hate all governments in existance at the moment

just I hate some more (israel, china, America, etc) then others (luxemborg, norway, etc)

May I ask what makes luxemborg and norway so great, in your opinion? I'm genuinely curious.

Bullshit. Western propoganda is just way more subtle. Instead of drilling the Peoples Whatever of Whatever into peoples heads until they believe it, we just have our pervasive media work under the assumption that our way of life is the only workable one, and demonize everything, anything else as extremism. Sometimes deservedly, often not.

At present, our way is the only way that is workable. There has not been any other system that has worked better than ours on an equivalent scale.

At present, our way is the only way that is workable. There has not been any other system that has worked better than ours on an equivalent scale.

How many different ways have we tried it on this scale, exactly? How many different forms of government have you lived under?

How can you say what we've got is all that will work?

All of the reasons you stated are precisely why I love the Chinese government

The success of their policies can be seen by their economic power, their peoples loyalty and the recent Olympic performance. They'll take all the gold in Bejing 2008 for sure. Face it, China is the next superpower and they didn't need democracy to do it, though a good helping of capitalism was quiet effective. This new form of communism in China combines capitalism, socialism and confucianism into one highly effective system of government.

It's only a matter of time before they overtake the United States, which has been in decline ever since the Cold War ended.

Having lived under a declining socialist society in the 80s and a declining democratic/capitalist society in the 90s, I can assure you that we had more "practical" freedoms than any American could dream of. Sure, criticizing the government wasn't the best idea, but we could roam the streets of major cities at nights without danger, fear or being stopped by the police. Drug use, graffiti, rape, murder and various other crimes were unknown or extremely rare. And though our standard of living was subpar, we didn't achieve it through extortion of millions of underpaid children and workers around the world.

Bullshit. Western propoganda is just way more subtle. Instead of drilling the Peoples Whatever of Whatever into peoples heads until they believe it, we just have our pervasive media work under the assumption that our way of life is the only workable one, and demonize everything, anything else as extremism. Sometimes deservedly, often not.

Hell yeah. Democratic and totalitarian countries have very different propaganda. Back in the USSR they could just announce "food production doubled for the fifth consecutive year!" and have no objections, but Western propaganda has to be smarter. The fact that the media mindlessly referred to the war in Iraq as the "War on Terror" is a good example.

At present, our way is the only way that is workable. There has not been any other system that has worked better than ours on an equivalent scale.

I'm no expert on Singaporean history, but from what I've read it seems that Lee Kuan Yew did very well for Singapore while utterly ignoring Western assumptions about the importance of democracy. One point is that we haven't tried alternatives, especially to capitalism, and we are told that there is no such thing as an alternative.

The success of their policies can be seen by their economic power, their peoples loyalty and the recent Olympic performance. They'll take all the gold in Bejing 2008 for sure. Face it, China is the next superpower and they didn't need democracy to do it, though a good helping of capitalism was quiet effective. This new form of communism in China combines capitalism, socialism and confucianism into one highly effective system of government.

Sounds like the typical Chinese government talking point. What economic power? How is superficial building up economic power? China has huge unemployment and has a rapidly aging population. China won't be the next superpower. They don't have a strong central bank, they have weak infrastructure... their agricultural is nearly depleted... their is civil unrest throughout the country. And finally they can't afford oil prices. There have been fuel shortages reported throughout the country.

The US isn't declining at all. In fact during the 1990s, the economic power of the country grown substantially. The United States, Japan and European powers have been at the forefront.

China isn't likely to overtake the US. Not with the way it has been going.

It's only a matter of time before they overtake the United States, which has been in decline ever since the Cold War ended.


That's not precisely true. The US is still far and away the most powerful state that the world has ever known. It's decline is only relative, in that they aren't gaining strength as fast as they used to, rather than actually losing power.

How can you say what we've got is all that will work?

I don't. The one we have is the only one that will work when compared to those that have been attempted. Our system will inevitably be replaced by a better one in the future, but for now it's the best.

This new form of communism in China combines capitalism, socialism and confucianism into one highly effective system of government.
If you hadn't noticed...what you described is not a "new form of communism". Check some definitions and do a little reading.

"State capitalism" + "socialism" + "government-pushed religion" = fascism

China's government differs very little from Germany's government during WWII.

I'm no expert on Singaporean history, but from what I've read it seems that Lee Kuan Yew did very well for Singapore while utterly ignoring Western assumptions about the importance of democracy. One point is that we haven't tried alternatives, especially to capitalism, and we are told that there is no such thing as an alternative.

But Singapore is a very small country, with only 4,425,720 people in 2005; its system probably wouldn't work in a country with 10, 40, or 400 million.

We've tried alternatives, like Communism, but they've failed.

Democracy/capitalism is the only system to withstand the rapid change in technology that has increase peoples' awareness of their world and culture. However, there will be a system that will arise which will supplant capitalism, and from there another, and so on.

Hahahahah this forum is riddiculious
First of all I'm Taiwan/Chinese sooo I'm pretty unbias on that subject. The reason China wants Taiwan so much is because when the democrats left China ;) they were smart enough to take allllll the treasures and a nice chunk of money with them and they left China with nearly nothing except weapons. Personally I don't care really, China isn't a communism, if it was they would be starving due to the fact communism screws up farming really really badly. Second of all every nations bs look at England they act like gentlemen but if you read on their history they did horrible things to the indians and sold drugs to other nations..
And guys if your sooo upset that the chinese merchants charge things for soo cheap then tell them you want to buy it at American prices instead of whining about it
Third of all personally I went to school their for a year and trust me its not so bad their you guys still think China's a communism and I agree, China was brutal when the soviet union existed but that system collapsed the moment chairman Mao died, the newspapers aren't that bias either in fact the biggest newpaper source in China is currently making its name by dissing off politicial leaders
Fourth of all read up on Japanese brutallity before you question their bias, In ww2 they raped woman, used babies for target practice and held head chopping contests sooo please read and actually know a little on history before you complain about that or everyone is just going to laugh at you



hahahah And last but not least every government lies and is corrupt I mean look at us were stuck with BUSH!!!! and he sucks!!!

I don't. The one we have is the only one that will work when compared to those that have been attempted. Our system will inevitably be replaced by a better one in the future, but for now it's the best.

But there are other ideas out there that have never tried right now. Lots of them. There have been for a long time.

Look at democracy. It was concieved in Athens but wouldn't become the worldwide phenomenon that it has become until the 18th century.

We don't need to wait for the future for better ways to govern. They're out there right now. Hell, we don't even need to become undemocratic. I'm fond of democracy, really. But we can adapt it in new and better ways.

[Edit]And please stop trumpeting capitalism. Free market capitalism died in the 30's. Every successful economy in a democratic state since WWII has had a mixed economy. (Not aimed directly at the person I'm replying to, but anyone who does.)

But there are other ideas out there that have never tried right now. Lots of them. There have been for a long time.

Look at democracy. It was concieved in Athens but wouldn't become the worldwide phenomenon that it has become until the 18th century.

We don't need to wait for the future for better ways to govern. They're out there right now. Hell, we don't even need to become undemocratic. I'm fond of democracy, really. But we can adapt it in new and better ways.

But what are these ways?

hahahah And last but not least every government lies and is corrupt I mean look at us were stuck with BUSH!!!! and he sucks!!!

Bush only can stay around for two terms. You can vote for someone different every four years. In China it is always the same party.

I agree, Chomskyron. In addition, the Chinese government is the world's biggest executioner and biggest torturer. According to an official Chinie government source, 10,000 people are executed a year, and millions are held in prisons or mental institutions for political reasons.

Which is course completely different from the US government, from the actual, nascent global capitalist government (G-8), to the curtailing of education (and limits on attendant intellectual freedoms), to the sexual inequities and prohibitions, to the (and you must admit to having stepped into the shit on this one) propaganda.

Pot. Kettle. Black.

*ducks*
In fairness, Chomskyron admitted that all governments, including that of the USA, use Orwellian propaganda techniques. If you've seen his other posts, he's not some kind of right-wing "the west can do no wrong" type of person.

In that case China is smart I've watched wayyyy to many rape and murder cases on television, its sickening seeing how so many idiots get out of prison and are allowed to do it again

In fairness, Chomskyron admitted that all governments, including that of the USA, use Orwellian propaganda techniques. If you've seen his other posts, he's not some kind of right-wing "the west can do no wrong" type of person.

Yes, but in the US there is opposition to anything put out by the government. This opposition is allowed (typically political ads on TV these days). In China it is NOT.

Bush only can stay around for two terms. You can vote for someone different every four years. In China it is always the same party.

Doesn't matter. The Republican party is hardly lacking for people who would rule just like him. Even the Soviets changed leaders once in awhile, but they were still Soviet Russia.

Too be truthful I don't think this forum is too important I mean everyone here is talking about the Chinese government thats fine with me. I just hope that everyone here understands its the Chinese government were talking about and not the Chinese people as a whole

But Singapore is a very small country, with only 4,425,720 people in 2005; its system probably wouldn't work in a country with 10, 40, or 400 million.

We've tried alternatives, like Communism, but they've failed.

Democracy/capitalism is the only system to withstand the rapid change in technology that has increase peoples' awareness of their world and culture. However, there will be a system that will arise which will supplant capitalism, and from there another, and so on.

Heh, I'm from New Zealand so Singapore seems like the right kind of size to me... The main reason it's authoritarian system wouldn't work in a country like the US is differences in worldviews. Westerners are just not very willing to trade away their rights for stability, at least relative to some other cultures. I guess the point is that what works for us in the West isn't necessarily the best in other parts of the world.

Too be truthful I don't think this forum is too important I mean everyone here is talking about the Chinese government thats fine with me. I just hope that everyone here understands its the Chinese government were talking about and not the Chinese people as a whole

Always an important thing to remember, and it goes for the USA and Israel as well...

Okay also I want to comment of the capitilism comment
While I agree that Capitilism is in my mind the best government system to be fair its only because it has the least chance of corruption
Every system can work better or just as well if it has good leaders
Monarchy-Whenever thier was a good king in history you'll see that in that period the nation often goes into a golden age something that has not been done with the Capitilism system not only that but few Monarchy governments with good leaders were rarely in dept and actually had a surplus Capitilism despite them having great leaders here and there can never seem to get out of dept this is usually because since presidents have no reason to get out of dept after all they're only going to be there for a max of 8 years why should they try to save money instead of leaving it to someone after them. Governments are pretty much like this
Free-Crime runs rapid
Strict-Crime slowed
I mean look at our government while we defintely have more freedom we also have wayyyyyyyy more wierdos here. I mean US is like the capital of the porno industry lol lol lol and on TV their's way more crime shows and stuff
While I'm not saying China is perfect but I can't imagine them doing spring break stuff.......
Not only that but when I was in China my room mate...the idi@!# he was got made drunk and unfortunetely I didn't know where he was, we found him in jail the next day for underage drinking and we found out that he had gotten an older guy to get beer for him only to get caught by a cop 30 minutes later now I don't want to diss my friend or be happy that he got caught in any way but I was kind of impressed about how fast they caught him in the US you could get drunk on the street and fall asleep and no one would care or catch you. Uhhh my friend was only their for a day if your wondering
In the end its again an epic battle of more rights or more stability

But what are these ways?

Naturally, the views from only one perspective are unlikely to hold the answer to improving things for all, but I'll list a couple concepts that we could adapt that I personally believe would improve the lot of many people.

First thing, a coproration isn't a person, and shouldn't be entitled to human rights. Strike that law right out of the history books.

Or perhaps the concept of a worker-controlled corporation. Economic power is an incredible tool for political change, and right now it isn't centred in the hands of the general population. Money counts even more than votes.

And, I can't think of the word to encapsulate it, but we've got to stop supporting unacceptable working conditions in foreign states. Labour unions need to go international in order to compete with multinational conglomerates.

True, if a country is lucky enough to get a dictator/monarch who isn't corrupt they are far better at long-term lanning than a democratic system, since they're around for several decades... Unfortunately they are mostly corrupt.

Naturally, the views from only one perspective are unlikely to hold the answer to improving things for all, but I'll list a couple concepts that we could adapt that I personally believe would improve the lot of many people.

First thing, a coproration isn't a person, and shouldn't be entitled to human rights. Strike that law right out of the history books.

Or perhaps the concept of a worker-controlled corporation. Economic power is an incredible tool for political change, and right now it isn't centred in the hands of the general population. Money counts even more than votes.

And, I can't think of the word to encapsulate it, but we've got to stop supporting unacceptable working conditions in foreign states. Labour unions need to go international in order to compete with multinational conglomerates.
Well Said!!! But your a bit unrealistic....lets be truthful no one ever risks his neck for a bunch of strangers and when they do its to look good and for politicial advantages. Trust me labor unions aren't going to battle foreign goverments and risk losing work there just because workers have horrible conditions. Its just human nature to care about themselves more then anyone else, sad but true

Well Said!!! But your a bit unrealistic....lets be truthful no one ever risks his neck for a bunch of strangers and when they do its to look good and for politicial advantages. Trust me labor unions aren't going to battle foreign goverments and risk losing work there just because workers have horrible conditions. Its just human nature to care about themselves more then anyone else, sad but true

Well, I won't claim my ideas are perfect. Unimaginable amounts of paper and bandwidth are spent writing and debating about this stuff, and of course some guy on an internet forum who posts a few ideas is unlikely to have all the answers.

But in my defense, I think labour unions going international is exactly the opposite of sticking your neck out for a stranger. For instance, if North American unions were to join with say, a labour union in China (I'm getting hypothetical to illustrate a point. I'm sure there are more relevant examples of states that actually have unions, so don't crucify me, please) in order to improve the working conditions in China, that benefits American workers. If the Chinese were to be making comparable wages, corporations no longer have China to run to for cheap labour. Meaning that reason for shipping jobs there is killed.

True, if a country is lucky enough to get a dictator/monarch who isn't corrupt they are far better at long-term lanning than a democratic system, since they're around for several decades... Unfortunately they are mostly corrupt.

Yes,that's it exactly.The best form of government there is - dictatorship.But it has to be a wise,moral and comitted person.The trouble is the succession - how do you ensure your next leader is going to be all those things?

I could tell that the Topic Creator is an absolute idiot, when he started saying how they were engineering SARS, and they were Nazis, and the "most tyrannical government".

"Most Tyrannical" That's a laugh. Look at nearly everywhere in Africa, India, France, The Middle East, North Korea, that's a laugh.

And China being communist? A laugh as well.

China is socialist in name only.

Hell, they ran over those dudes in Tianemen Square, because they were protesting more Communism. They're really like us. W00t!

And China being communist? A laugh as well.

China is socialist in name only.

Hell, they ran over those dudes in Tianemen Square, because they were protesting more Communism. They're really like us. W00t!

*cough cough* Communism died in China after the death of Mao and the fall of the soviet Union, at that time Mao was still in power so that statement proves nothing

And second while its true China isn't a democracy because I mean they were looking at Russai that was pretty much dying after switching from communism to democracy, they did however slowly merge to socialism which wasn't as drastic a change but did allow wayyyy more freedom then communism

Hahahahah this forum is riddiculious
First of all I'm Taiwan/Chinese sooo I'm pretty unbias on that subject. The reason China wants Taiwan so much is because when the democrats left China ;) they were smart enough to take allllll the treasures and a nice chunk of money with them and they left China with nearly nothing except weapons. Personally I don't care really, China isn't a communism, if it was they would be starving due to the fact communism screws up farming really really badly. Second of all every nations bs look at England they act like gentlemen but if you read on their history they did horrible things to the indians and sold drugs to other nations..
And guys if your sooo upset that the chinese merchants charge things for soo cheap then tell them you want to buy it at American prices instead of whining about it
Third of all personally I went to school their for a year and trust me its not so bad their you guys still think China's a communism and I agree, China was brutal when the soviet union existed but that system collapsed the moment chairman Mao died, the newspapers aren't that bias either in fact the biggest newpaper source in China is currently making its name by dissing off politicial leaders
Fourth of all read up on Japanese brutallity before you question their bias, In ww2 they raped woman, used babies for target practice and held head chopping contests sooo please read and actually know a little on history before you complain about that or everyone is just going to laugh at you



hahahah And last but not least every government lies and is corrupt I mean look at us were stuck with BUSH!!!! and he sucks!!!

A) That's the beauty of democracy bud, Bush is gone from you guys in three years.

B) Do you see Britain committing those kinds of crimes now? No, so please, do shut up.

C) World War 2 attrocities were committed and Japan has lacked something about them in their textbooks, can't remember specifics. But, correct me if I'm wrong, hasn't Japan admitted to those attrocities and apologized or some shit like that?

D) Just...Christ learn to frikkin type. :headbang:

A) That's the beauty of democracy bud, Bush is gone from you guys in three years.

B) Do you see Britain committing those kinds of crimes now? No, so please, do shut up.

C) World War 2 attrocities were committed and Japan has lacked something about them in their textbooks, can't remember specifics. But, correct me if I'm wrong, hasn't Japan admitted to those attrocities and apologized or some shit like that?

D) Just...Christ learn to frikkin type. :headbang:

1) That was pretty much a joke I'm just saying that no nation is perfect
2) I'm not dissing Britian I'm just stating every nation has a dark history in it and Britian actually has a very clean history now so it made a great example
3) The difference is Japan just apologized and then turned around and printed these textbooks while America while we wronged the Indains we currently gave them a good deal on casino's and they don't have to pay taxes to us, we're actually trying to help the victims
4) I'm soo sorry I got my butt kicked in English class for that ;)

I apologize if I insulted you in any way I'm not trying to diss everyone off I'm just trying to make a point

<snip> And to be quite honest, it would put a smile on my face, if every member of the Communist Party in China was rounded up by political dissidents, then lined up and shot.
Well, if you really insist on a messacre of 63 million people - it'll already be a pain in the head before one comes to his senses, considering the sheer numbers.

Or better yet, put those cowardly bureaucrats in labor camps to be tortured and "re-educated."
Nothing is like "an eye for an eye", is there? Countering the PRC government's alleged record and history by torture and brutal suppression.

Well, I just have one thing to say to all you people who hate the chinese...


The world today seems absolutely crackers,
With nuclear bombs to blow us all sky high.
There's fools and idiots sitting on the trigger.
It's depressing and it's senseless, and that's why...
I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
They only come up to your knees,
Yet they're always friendly, and they're ready to please.

I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
There's nine hundred million of them in the world today.
You'd better learn to like them; that's what I say.

I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
They come from a long way overseas,
But they're cute and they're cuddly, and they're ready to please.

I like Chinese food.
The waiters never are rude.
Think of the many things they've done to impress.
There's Maoism, Taoism, I Ching, and Chess.

So I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
I like their tiny little trees,
Their Zen, their ping-pong, their yin, and yang-ese.

I like Chinese thought,
The wisdom that Confucious taught.
If Darwin is anything to shout about,
The Chinese will survive us all without any doubt.

So, I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
They only come up to your knees,
Yet they're wise and they're witty, and they're ready to please.

All together.

[verse in Chinese]
Wo ai zhongguo ren. (I like Chinese.)
Wo ai zhongguo ren. (I like Chinese.)
Wo ai zhongguo ren. (I like Chinese.)
Ni hao ma; ni hao ma; ni hao ma; zaijien! (How are you; how are you; how are you; goodbye!)

I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
Their food is guaranteed to please,
A fourteen, a seven, a nine, and lychees.

I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
I like their tiny little trees,
Their Zen, their ping-pong, their yin, and yang-ese.

I like Chinese.
I like Chinese.
They only come up to your knees...

:D

ROOARR! WHO IS SPREADING UGLY, BLATANT PROPAGANDA AGAINST CHINA? RAAAWWW!! :mad: