NationStates Jolt Archive

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/news/regionalnews/tm_objectid=15848469&method=full&siteid=50142&headline=our-binge-drinking-menace-name_page.html

I was just curious as to what you all thought about this idea...will making alcohol more expensive curb the amount of binge drinking? It doesn't seem (for Americans at least) that the rising gas prices are curbing conumers from buying gasoline or cars that get poor mileage (i.e.-a hummer)

So-what effect (if any) do you think that this proposed raise in price of spirits will have?

You'd get a lot more poor (drunk) people roaming the streets.

Pfft. I'll just taking up being a hitman to pay for the booze bills. ;)

Seriously, though, all it'd prolly do is encourage people to make their own.

Pfft. I'll just taking up being a hitman to pay for the booze bills. ;)

Seriously, though, all it'd prolly do is encourage people to make their own.

I agree with that...if it's anything i've learned in this life, it's that if someone wants something bad enough, they'll find a way to get it

Seriously, though, all it'd prolly do is encourage people to make their own.

Look at Prohibition; when people want something, and it's too expensive to buy (or illegal) but easy to make at home, they'll do it. Instead, you'd get still explosions and methanol blindess, and still have the same problems with binge drinking.

Funny you mention hitmen; organized crime's the pipeline for illegal liquor. ;)

Look at Prohibition; when people want something, and it's too expensive to buy (or illegal) but easy to make at home, they'll do it. Instead, you'd get still explosions and methanol blindess, and still have the same problems with binge drinking.

Funny you mention hitmen; organized crime's the pipeline for illegal liquor. ;)
lol, exactly. Though I cry every time I see a vid of prohibition and the bartender "flushes" the bottles of alcohol down a shoot, or the government destroys them. Waste!

I figure with my convenient lack of morals, I'd be very hand if there was another prohibition, or booze really increased in price. *grins* ;)

Funny you mention hitmen; organized crime's the pipeline for illegal liquor. ;)
Hah so work a contract with the mob to have some of your pay in booze.
But ya alot more moonshine and a huge drop in booze sales

Pfft. I'll just taking up being a hitman to pay for the booze bills. ;)

Seriously, though, all it'd prolly do is encourage people to make their own.
Either that or they will smuggle it from places that don't have this stupid law.

lol, exactly. Though I cry every time I see a vid of prohibition and the bartender "flushes" the bottles of alcohol down a shoot, or the government destroys them. Waste!

I figure with my convenient lack of morals, I'd be very hand if there was another prohibition, or booze really increased in price. *grins* ;)

Such waste, I agree.

I have a feeling that I'd be in the same business; I think there might end up being a war between us like Capone-Moran. I hope, of course, that I'm the winner. ;)

Either that or they will smuggle it from places that don't have this stupid law.

hehe...like Canada...hell, we smuggle weed and pharmacuticals from there...so why not booze?:p

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/news/regionalnews/tm_objectid=15848469&method=full&siteid=50142&headline=our-binge-drinking-menace-name_page.html

I was just curious as to what you all thought about this idea...will making alcohol more expensive curb the amount of binge drinking? It doesn't seem (for Americans at least) that the rising gas prices are curbing conumers from buying gasoline or cars that get poor mileage (i.e.-a hummer)

So-what effect (if any) do you think that this proposed raise in price of spirits will have?
No, it'll just make people more desperate to find the cash to pay for it.

No, it'll just make people more desperate to find the cash to pay for it.

where would the cash come from, most likely? working overtime? more jobs? harder at the one they have? selling drugs? prostitution? tell me what you think:D

where would the cash come from, most likely? working overtime? more jobs? harder at the one they have? selling drugs? prostitution? tell me what you think:D
Borrowing from friends.

all that tripling the price of alchol would do is make it like back in the 20's, with gangsters making and selling booze. It wouldnt work out.

That won't work. People will still drink themselves stupid, but it will just hurt the poor more.

As much as I'd like to stop binge drinking, we can't really save people from utter but legal stupidity.

The best solution is eductating people that binge drinking can kill you. We can only arm them with knowledge, whether they use it or not is up to them.

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/news/regionalnews/tm_objectid=15848469&method=full&siteid=50142&headline=our-binge-drinking-menace-name_page.html

So-what effect (if any) do you think that this proposed raise in price of spirits will have?

More people will make their own moonshine.

So for a gallon of Thunderbird would be what? 6 dollars then? ;)

Hmm...if that occured here, that would mean a night out on the town would cost me at least $150. Possibly up to $300.

And it would also mean the government in power losing the next election.

Raising prices doesn't work; problem drinkers usually get to the stage they buy less of other essential things (i.e. food, medicines, rent). If the drinker is part of a family with childern that can't support themselves, the childern suffer the worse.

Unless you live in Russia, yes. It's pretty much how they paid for the Crimean War, that.

I dont think it would lessen binge drinking, it would probably increase it instead. People would save up to go on a good binge instead of drinking a smaller amount regularly. Regular drinkers would become binge drinkers. Drinking would also become a high class activity rather than the low class one it is now. Having a beer every day would be a status symbol in the opposite way it is now.

Part of the problem with taking seriously anything the government says about binge drinking is that their definition of a binge is just plain crazy. In this country (Britain) you're officially a binge drinker if you have 4 pints within 24 hours. So technically if you have a pint at lunch, one at tea and a couple more in the evening, you're a menace to society!

I dont know wot its like in the south of england but up here in scotland its frezees for 90% of the year so apart from going to a pub there is little to do, if u gave ppl other things to do then they wouldnt drink cos theyd be away doing something else. And i dont know about the rest of the UK but up here ppl are going to the pub most nites even if its just for 1 or 2 or 3 pints u will find pub atleast the student ones are far from empty, its the culture and thats not gonna changes, atleast not quickly

That won't work. People will still drink themselves stupid, but it will just hurt the poor more.

As much as I'd like to stop binge drinking, we can't really save people from utter but legal stupidity.

The best solution is eductating people that binge drinking can kill you. We can only arm them with knowledge, whether they use it or not is up to them.

A good resourece fo this would be www.getmadd.com which is a site against the new prohibitioinism in America.

Raising the price and raising the drinking age and lowering the BAC laws have had little effect on alcohol consumption in America.

'Educating' people isn't the correct answer either. It hasn't worked for mostdrugs and premarital sex...

To address the problem we must look at the conditions which lead to binge drinking. Why do people do it?

Most reactionarles would say it is a form of escape or addiction. They would be incorrect; Binge drinking is substantiall more common in America than in other nations. American's are ethnically, genetically and culturally more diverse than any other nation. It could not be traced with any scientific regard to any of those influences.

Instead, I suspect it is caused by an artificial environment where freedom is limited. Look at WHEN, or what age, binge drinking peaks. It is not at 12, it is not at 32, it is between 18 and 21. What happens then??

Independance. That's what. People move out from home and live independantly at 18. They often comingle with people near their age - up to 21. The 21 yr olds have just discovered a 'new freedom' - the right to buy alcohol. As with any newly discovered freedom many seek out to explore it fully. Just as when you learned how to ride your bike or got your drivers license you want to do it often and for any reason.

That is the root of the problem. By restricting peoples rights we've created an artifical environment which induces binge behavior around the age of 21. This is why other nations don't have the same binging patterns as the US - no artificial limits.

To reduce binge drinking eliminate the age of consumption. Let parents decide when and introduce their children to alcohol. Take away the mystery beore their 2st birthday, remove the mystique, eliminate the event and binge drinking will shrink by dramatic proportions.

A good resourece fo this would be www.getmadd.com which is a site against the new prohibitioinism in America.

Raising the price and raising the drinking age and lowering the BAC laws have had little effect on alcohol consumption in America.

'Educating' people isn't the correct answer either. It hasn't worked for mostdrugs and premarital sex...

To address the problem we must look at the conditions which lead to binge drinking. Why do people do it?

Most reactionarles would say it is a form of escape or addiction. They would be incorrect; Binge drinking is substantiall more common in America than in other nations. American's are ethnically, genetically and culturally more diverse than any other nation. It could not be traced with any scientific regard to any of those influences.

Instead, I suspect it is caused by an artificial environment where freedom is limited. Look at WHEN, or what age, binge drinking peaks. It is not at 12, it is not at 32, it is between 18 and 21. What happens then??

Independance. That's what. People move out from home and live independantly at 18. They often comingle with people near their age - up to 21. The 21 yr olds have just discovered a 'new freedom' - the right to buy alcohol. As with any newly discovered freedom many seek out to explore it fully. Just as when you learned how to ride your bike or got your drivers license you want to do it often and for any reason.

That is the root of the problem. By restricting peoples rights we've created an artifical environment which induces binge behavior around the age of 21. This is why other nations don't have the same binging patterns as the US - no artificial limits.

To reduce binge drinking eliminate the age of consumption. Let parents decide when and introduce their children to alcohol. Take away the mystery beore their 2st birthday, remove the mystique, eliminate the event and binge drinking will shrink by dramatic proportions.


I agree with some of your points here, but I don't think its true that other countries don't have the problems with alcoholism or binge drinking that we do. The article that started this thread is from Wales, after all. I do think that we have a skewed definition of alcoholism and binge drinking though. According to several definitions that I have heard, someone who has 10 drinks a week is an alcoholic, and having more than 3 drinks in a sitting is binge drinking. These are the kinds of definitions put forth by the prohibition lobbies like MADD, similar to their definition of "alcohol-related" fatalities, where they count every death where either driver has any alcohol in their bloodstream, no matter how small or who is at fault.

http://icnorthwales.icnetwork.co.uk/news/regionalnews/tm_objectid=15848469&method=full&siteid=50142&headline=our-binge-drinking-menace-name_page.html

I was just curious as to what you all thought about this idea...will making alcohol more expensive curb the amount of binge drinking? It doesn't seem (for Americans at least) that the rising gas prices are curbing conumers from buying gasoline or cars that get poor mileage (i.e.-a hummer)

So-what effect (if any) do you think that this proposed raise in price of spirits will have?We recently introduced a tax on "Alcopops" in Germany. This was to prevent children from buying it so much and thereby drinking it. It worked. The amount of children drinking alcohol has gone down.

Beer taxes to lower drinking rates? Nonsense. We tried this in the USA already - by guess who.. AL CAPONE. Smuggled alcohol cost a lot more than legal booze did in the WWI era and people drank anyway.

Beer taxes to lower drinking rates? Nonsense. We tried this in the USA already - by guess who.. AL CAPONE. Smuggled alcohol cost a lot more than legal booze did in the WWI era and people drank anyway.That's not the same thing. Increasing the price isn't the same as banning it totally.
A higher tax may not change much in the consumption rate of the current generation, but in that of the younger generation, thus reducing the amount of people drinking in the future.

--snip--
Independance. That's what. People move out from home and live independantly at 18. They often comingle with people near their age - up to 21. The 21 yr olds have just discovered a 'new freedom' - the right to buy alcohol. As with any newly discovered freedom many seek out to explore it fully. Just as when you learned how to ride your bike or got your drivers license you want to do it often and for any reason.

That is the root of the problem. By restricting peoples rights we've created an artifical environment which induces binge behavior around the age of 21. This is why other nations don't have the same binging patterns as the US - no artificial limits.

To reduce binge drinking eliminate the age of consumption. Let parents decide when and introduce their children to alcohol. Take away the mystery beore their 2st birthday, remove the mystique, eliminate the event and binge drinking will shrink by dramatic proportions.

I have to agree with what you are saying...I've always wondered why in America, you can be 18 and old enough to vote for your president and die for your country in its military, but you aren't yet able to imbibe alcohol...it does seem like a reverse psychology thing...saying one can't drink fuels the person's interest in drinking...
But i'm not sure about letting the parents decide on when the child can drink...some parents aren't responsible whatsoever and don't care about thier offspring...perhaps lowering the legal drinking age is a more practical idea

That is the root of the problem. By restricting peoples rights we've created an artifical environment which induces binge behavior around the age of 21. This is why other nations don't have the same binging patterns as the US - no artificial limits.

To reduce binge drinking eliminate the age of consumption. Let parents decide when and introduce their children to alcohol. Take away the mystery beore their 2st birthday, remove the mystique, eliminate the event and binge drinking will shrink by dramatic proportions.Ah, makes me glad I live in a country that allows drinking at the age of 16 :D
That said, in Germany parents do decide when their youngsters first drink alcohol. 16 is the age you have to be before you can legally buy it.

Hmmm, anyone remember the smashing success of the American Prohibition? Just gave organized crime a hammerlock here as people bought booze illegally.

Mmm, and boosting the cigarette tax in NY so it's nearly $8 a pack has made people buy them illegally over the internet.

So, I predict raising the taxes on booze will have sales of illicit booze soaring.

We recently introduced a tax on "Alcopops" in Germany. This was to prevent children from buying it so much and thereby drinking it. It worked. The amount of children drinking alcohol has gone down.
Did it lower the amount of teenagers drinking? I doubt it as once you hit 12 or 13 if you really want to you can start making money. There isn't that big of a problem of pre-teens drinking in the US.