NationStates Jolt Archive

DISCLAIMER: I accept no responsibility for the idiot who drops pure or almost pure sodium into any body of water.

Note: I would likely not drop sodium into a swimming pool without going to great protection expenses.

Anyway, I'm not sure how this came about, but my friend and I were talking about sodium at our summer camp. I told him what happens if you drop the alkalis into water. Then the thought of dropping sodium into chlorinated water came into my head. I'm about 95% certain that sodium and chlorine reacts very violently. So I thought that dropping a sizeable chunk of sodium into a swimming pool would cause a...well huge explosion.

Question: Would the sodium react with oxygen and chlorine or just one? Would the explosion be larger than unchlorinated water?

This is hypothetically, please don't try it out.

I don't know, but dropping acid in a swimmingpool is a lot of fun. For about eight or nine hours. Then it gets kinda tiresome.

a 50kg block of sodium dropped in a pool would probably level new york city.

The chlorine in a swimming pool is usually hypochlorite ion. It's added as a sodium or calcium hypochlorite salt. Mainly the sodium you add will react with the water.

a 50kg block of sodium dropped in a pool would probably level new york city.
I doubt it would even level the house next to the pool.

a 50kg block of sodium dropped in a pool would probably level new york city.
Ooh thanks...lol

a 50kg block of sodium dropped in a pool would probably level new york city.

If sodium and water react that violently it would be an excellent process for terrorists to use, no?

http://theodoregray.com/PeriodicTable/Stories/011.2/

Some explosions here.

you can be sure there'd be a nice explosion...as to the damage area, i'm not sure...but whatever fumes come from the reaction, be sure to steer clear:D

If sodium and water react that violently it would be an excellent process for terrorists to use, no?


Nah... you just can't fit a swimming pool and 50kg of sodium in the boot of a car.... or under a jacket.

http://theodoregray.com/PeriodicTable/Stories/011.2/

Some explosions here.

That guy has the best element stuff on the internet.

Nah... you just can't fit a swimming pool and 50kg of sodium in the boot of a car.... or under a jacket.
I bet you could.

Nah... you just can't fit a swimming pool and 50kg of sodium in the boot of a car.... or under a jacket.

No no. They'd just need to find a house with a swimming pool in the back yard, buy some sodium and then break into the yard and chuck the sodium into the pool. They might also be able to use a public pool if they broke in at night.

I remember in Science Class last year our teacher took a block of pure sodium I believe, but once put into water it did explode after a few seconds, man it was cool, now we ask if we can borrow that stuff to throw into the toliets.

I doubt it would even level the house next to the pool.
Indeed.

2 Na + 2 H20 ---> 2 NaOH + H2 Enthalpy change = -279.6kJ/mol i.e. using 46.2g Na, water irrelevant

E 50kg Na = -279.6 * (50000/46.2) = ~ -302600kJ (I think - it's amazing how rusty I get without college work, even for basic calculations)

1 Tonne TNT = -4612070kJ

Hiroshima nuke = -1153017500000 kJ

Point made.

How about a 50kg block of francium?


hehehehe...

It is one of the cheapest metals. Search around. Just be very careful, it's better to use a remote control and video camera. People have made many mistakes with sodium. Visit the link shown above. (Theodore Gray)

How about a 50kg block of francium?


hehehehe...
Don't even...you'll be killed by the radiation before it even leaves your hand. Well again with the remote control, you could...

Sodium(Na (http://www.chemicalelements.com/elements/na.html))is highly reactive,so it would react with the chlorine in the pool.i don't know what affect the products would have on the resulting explosion.However there would be a large crater where the swimming pool used to be,depending on the size of the block of Na.

10g(i think)of Na in a bath is comprable to dropping a live hand grenade into it.obviously with the pin taken out.

EDIT:after consulting the Periodic Table of Elements (http://www.chemicalelements.com/) its actually Rubidium(Rb (http://www.chemicalelements.com/elements/rb.html)) that would be like a grenade in a bath.but i think my crater idea is still a pretty good one

How about a 50kg block of francium?


hehehehe...
I think this forum has collectively had this conversation repeatedly over the last 6 months - you try scraping together enough Francium (detected in tens of atoms after Hiroshima) for 50kilos of the stuff, then chucking it in a swimming pool before it decays into more stable elements (all francium isotopes are radioactive) without giving yourself radiation poisoning or being caught in the blast.

Just stick with caesium, dude. ;)

Indeed.

2 Na + 2 H20 ---> 2 NaOH + H2 Enthalpy change = -279.6kJ/mol i.e. using 46.2g Na, water irrelevant

E 50kg Na = -279.6 * (50000/46.2) = ~ -302600kJ
That's still a hefty "boom".

Don't even...you'll be killed by the radiation before it even leaves your hand. Well again with the remote control, you could...
Plus the fact that it would react with the sweat that is ever-present on skin...

In fact, caesium (which is theoretically less reactive than francium with water) has to be kept sealed in anhydrous inert atmosphere glass vials to stop it reacting with water vapour in the air.

That's still a hefty "boom".
Well yes, but I think l'il ole New York city is quite safe from "the horrors" of fifty kilos of sodium.

If sodium and water react that violently it would be an excellent process for terrorists to use, no?
Actually, a sodium explosion would not be strong enough to be a weapon choice for terrorists.

Plus the fact that it would react with the sweat that is ever-present on skin...

In fact, caesium (which is theoretically less reactive than francium with water) has to be kept sealed in anhydrous inert atmosphere glass vials to stop it reacting with water vapour in the air.


And all the othe alkali's have to be stored under oil.we've all seen freshly cus sodium turn dull as it Reacts with the air before our eyes.

Actually, a sodium explosion would not be strong enough to be a weapon choice for terrorists.
What s/he said. If they could get their hands on something like plutonium and on sodium, which one do you think they would use on a major U.S. city? ;)

And all the othe alkali's have to be stored under oil.we've all seen freshly cus sodium turn dull as it Reacts with the air before our eyes.
Yeah, but my point was that the guy couldn't carry his theoretical 50kg francium to the pool unless it was sealed before-hand, and definitely shouldn't carry it with naked hands.

Yeah, but my point was that the guy couldn't carry his theoretical 50kg francium to the pool unless it was sealed before-hand, and definitely shouldn't carry it with naked hands.


Well it could be stored in an argon atmosphere in a water soluble container.but that would.t guard against the radiation.something that would guard against the radiation however might not let the water in,unless you left it closed but unlocked.

Even getting the frickin francium would be difficult.what you should do is throw some sodium into a big jar of good old HCl,hydrochloric acid.that'll blow away some cobwebs.and whatever the cobwebs were attached to

Where the hell would you even get 50kg of Francium? I'm no expert, but isn't it ridiculously rare (like to the point that you would have to dig up a large state to get 50kg)?

Where the hell would you even get 50kg of Francium? I'm no expert, but isn't it ridiculously rare (like to the point that you would have to dig up a large state to get 50kg)?


Dig all you want friend,francium does not occur naturally in nature.

I thought of something.50kg of francium into a swimming pool full of HCl.


There goes the neighborhood............. :D

I believe the "explosion" is not an actual explosion. The chemical reaction results in an onslaught of gases being expelled from the solution. Now, if you were to put this into a bottle and shake it (which is how it is commonly done), the pressure will escalate to incredible amounts, resulting in your "explosion". Someone please verify.

I believe the "explosion" is not an actual explosion. The chemical reaction results in an onslaught of gases being expelled from the solution. Now, if you were to put this into a bottle and shake it (which is how it is commonly done), the pressure will escalate to incredible amounts, resulting in your "explosion". Someone please verify.


Gases, ehhhhhhh....?

*scraches imaginary beard*

I believe the "explosion" is not an actual explosion. The chemical reaction results in an onslaught of gases being expelled from the solution. Now, if you were to put this into a bottle and shake it (which is how it is commonly done), the pressure will escalate to incredible amounts, resulting in your "explosion". Someone please verify.

One of the gases produced is elemental hydrogen, which is ignited by the heat of the sodium-water reaction and burns in the atmosphere.

I believe the "explosion" is not an actual explosion. The chemical reaction results in an onslaught of gases being expelled from the solution. Now, if you were to put this into a bottle and shake it (which is how it is commonly done), the pressure will escalate to incredible amounts, resulting in your "explosion". Someone please verify.

There is the initial energy release from the water + sodium reaction.
That rxn. produces hydrogen gas and NaOH. The NaOH dissolves into the surronding water (another exothermic reaction), and the heat evolved from the first two reactions is enough to make the atmospheric oxygen react with the recently evolved hydrogen gas which produces the large explosion that you see. (I'm fairly certain about the first two steps, but the third is more of an educated guess - correct me if I'm wrong please).

Hope that helped. Chemistry Rules! :D

Pure sodium would quite likely cause an explosion. Bad freakin idea.

i like this idea.
Its a good idea.
try this idea.