NationStates Jolt Archive

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8870403/

3:24 a.m. ET Aug. 9, 2005

BAGHDAD, Iraq - Gunmen killed nine policemen in Baghdad Tuesday in a string of near simultaneous attacks, police said.

Assailants opened fire on a police patrol in eastern Baghdad, killing five officers, said Lt. Col. Ahmed Aboud. The policemen had been asleep in their vehicle when two carloads of gunmen fired on them around 8 a.m., he said.

The men had spent the night on patrol and fell asleep as they were waiting to be replaced by another patrol, he said. Their weapons were all in the back seat of their four-wheel drive, he said.

n another attack in the southern Dora neighborhood, armed gunmen assassinated police Capt. Haidir Mizhir Salih and another policeman as they were heading to work around 8 a.m., said 1st Lt. Mohammed Hanoun.

In a third drive-by shooting, unknown assailants fired on a police car at 8:15 am, killing two officers and wounding their driver, said Lt. Col. Guad Assad. The attack occurred in the eastern Zayouna neighborhood, he said.

Insurgents have frequently targeted Iraqi security forces in their bid to further destabilize the country.

The latest violence Tuesday follows by a day the postponement of marathon negotiations between Iraqi political leaders working to overcome obstacles blocking agreement on a new constitution because of a blinding sandstorm.

President Jalal Talabani hosted a first round of constitutional talks at his Baghdad home Sunday, but a second meeting, originally scheduled for Monday evening, was canceled as the storm reduced visibility in the capital to near zero. Kurdish leader Massoud Barzani had planned to attend, but was stranded in northern Iraq since the storm grounded aircraft.

Saddam Hussein's family, meanwhile, said it has dissolved his Jordan-based legal team and appointed Iraqi lawyer Khalil Dulaimi as the "one and sole legal counsel." The move was seen as reorganizing the defense ahead of Saddam's upcoming trial.

For some reason drive-by shootings on police officers sounds a lot more like a crime in a US ghetto than a terrorist attack... Any thoughts about why terrorists seem to be shooting at Iraqi police rather than foreign military soldiers (other than the obvious "it further destabilizes the country" comment)? This isn't the first time either...

Any thoughts about why terrorists seem to be shooting at Iraqi police rather than foreign military soldiers (other than the obvious "it further destabilizes the country" comment)? This isn't the first time either...
Uh...possibly because American soldiers tend to wear body armour and drive armoured vehicles when in the streets these days.

And they tend to return fire rather copiously.....

If terrorists are bent on suicide they just blow themselves and their targets up, not do it shooting ineffectively at well armed soldiers.

I hear reports Iraqi police and military recruits keep flooding in... even with this violence.

Uh...possibly because American soldiers tend to wear body armour and drive armoured vehicles when in the streets these days.

And they tend to return fire rather copiously.....

If terrorists are bent on suicide they just blow themselves and their targets up, not do it shooting ineffectively at well armed soldiers.

Yea, but Iraqi Police are native citizens. Shouldn't the insurgents be attacking the "evil foreigners" instead of their former "neighbors", so to speak?

No, you hit it on the head, it further destabilizes the country.

The Islamofascists have no interest in a stable Iraq, with their oil revenue they'll be rich and not beholden to any of the Islamic states in the region and with their close ties to the US (for the next generation at least) they'll be agressivly secular.

The Islamofascists want to provoke a civil war, which they figure they can either

1) win, in which case they win, or

2) lose, in which case they still win because death and misery will gain them plenty of recruits.

Gut feeling says Zarkawi (sp?) is being sponsored by Iran, who has no interest in seeing a stable Iraq (who has attacked them in the past while a US ally, and might do so again). No proof, just a feeling...

Yea, but Iraqi Police are native citizens. Shouldn't they be attacking the "evil foreigners"?If you can't get the "evil foreigners" the "treacherous collaborators" will do in a pinch...

2) lose, in which case they still win because death and misery will gain them plenty of recruits.

Gut feeling says Zarkawi (sp?) is being sponsored by Iran, who has no interest in seeing a stable Iraq (who has attacked them in the past while a US ally, and might do so again). No proof, just a feeling...

No.

In this case they will lose, because IRaqis will get pissed off at them and keep flooding in to be military recruits. That's what is happening. Iraqi citizens are pissed at Al Qaeda and other terrorists... and Zarqawi will end up dead soon.

Just another argument against the "Its all the evil occupiers fault, the terrorists are actually freedom fighters" reasoning!

Anybody else find the timezone difference amusing? I read this at around 3:40 AM EST, but the article refers to Tuesday as a completed day in Iraq.

No.

In this case they will lose, because IRaqis will get pissed off at them and keep flooding in to be military recruits. That's what is happening. Iraqi citizens are pissed at Al Qaeda and other terrorists... and Zarqawi will end up dead soon.

I hope you are right friend... but the j/o jihadis don't see it that way.

Yea, but Iraqi Police are native citizens. Shouldn't the insurgents be attacking the "evil foreigners" instead of their former "neighbors", so to speak?

Yes, the police are native citizens of Iraq. The 'insurgents'/terrorists generally are not. They are foreign Jihadi-Salafis, most of whom were originally from Egypt, Jordan or Saudi Arabia. A lot of them crossed over from Afghanistan via Iran (particularly Zarqawi's mob).

Zarqawi biography:
http://www.pwhce.org/zarqawi.html

Generally speaking, the jihadis were kept under control in Ba'athist Syria and Iraq - each of these states run/ran on a totalitarian model that ensures violence is only possible in support of the regime. From about 1992 Saddam Hussein started mobilising 'Islamism' in the service of the regime, developing quasi-Islamist groups such as the Fedayeen Saddam (devotees of Saddam). He also gave shelter to some Islamists, and in the lead up to the March 2003 invasion he let foreign Islamists into the country by the busloads (presumably using the same buses as the human shield demonstrators).

As noted above, attacking the coalition troops is an inefficient use of resources for the jihadists. Also, the jihadists don't really need to attack the Coalition troops as much as they need to attack the locals. Coalition troops will not establish a stable democracy in Iraq by themselves. They are there to protect the emerging democratic Iraqi society and government apparatus. The Coalition is the jelly* mould, not the gelatine. They are supposed to remain until Iraqi society is able to stand without direct support - something only the Iraqis can make happen.

This is the nightmare scenario for the jihadis - in order for them to build their version of an expansionist Islamic state, they must first make sure Iraqi democracy fails. The Jihadis are counting on the Coalition leaving. But they will have lost if the troops leave because they are simply no longer needed.

The entire Iraqi situation hinges on the ability of Iraqis to build and defend their own democratic institutions as one society. That is both why Iraqis are joining the police forces in droves, and why the jihadis are killing them in droves.

PS For the jihadis the only thing more evil than an infidel is an infidel that used to be a Muslim - and they are notoriously loose with their definition of infidelity.

*That's jello for Americans.

They don't like people they think are helping the Americans, and that includes the police force being trained by the us forces.


+ Everyone loves a badass driveby gangsta shootout, yo. They were probably pumping NWA out of their lowrider as they did it.

Given the porous nature of the Iraqi borders, more of these nutcases will keep on turning up.