NationStates Jolt Archive

If an insane person realizes and comprehends that they are insane, could they be considered sane? I belive they could because I belive, to be insane, you can't have any real sense of yourself, so as soon as they are aware that they are insane, they gain that comprehension of themselves to be considered sane. :mp5:

So like a guy who hears voices that tell him to kill people wearing yellow sweaters, but knows that the voices are in his head, is sane?

Ok, I'll buy that. I've been pretty high on LSD and mushrooms in the past, I wasn't in my right mind, but I knew that I was tripping and I dealt with it. I guess it's similar for an insane person who knows he's insane.

So like a guy who hears voices that tell him to kill people wearing yellow sweaters, but knows that the voices are in his head, is sane?

Ok, I'll buy that. I've been pretty high on LSD and mushrooms in the past, I wasn't in my right mind, but I knew that I was tripping and I dealt with it. I guess it's similar for an insane person who knows he's insane.

But, as soon as he realizes that the vocies are just in his head, he can fight them. He realizes that he is creating the vocies, and he can stop himself from creating those vocies. :mp5:

Well, "insane" isn't even a medical term. There isn't some threshold of mental illness past which you are declared "insane." The only real use of the term in our society is in the legal system, where it's basically used to mean "incapable of distinguishing reality from non-reality" or "incapable of telling right from wrong." Thus, someone who (for example) was aware that the voices in their head were not real and did not need to be obeyed would certainly never be judged legally insane.

In other words, yes. :)

But, as soon as he realizes that the vocies are just in his head, he can fight them. He realizes that he is creating the vocies, and he can stop himself from creating those vocies. :mp5:
Well, no. The voices are the product of chemical imbalances in his brain that are beyond his control. He's partly sane because he can choose to ignore them, but he's not "normal".

Anyone who questions there sanity is in fact sane, in most cases.

If an insane person realizes and comprehends that they are insane, could they be considered sane? I belive they could because I belive, to be insane, you can't have any real sense of yourself, so as soon as they are aware that they are insane, they gain that comprehension of themselves to be considered sane. :mp5:

Personally, I think that people who believe that --if they think they could be crazy it's proof that they aren't-- are just looking for reassurance, because they think that being crazy is a bad thing. But in our world these days, it's hard to tell who's crazy and who's just severely depressed.

Well, no. The voices are the product of chemical imbalances in his brain that are beyond his control. He's partly sane because he can choose to ignore them, but he's not "normal".

Did I ever say anything about normal? huh?DID I?! I am completly sane, but very, very far from normal. I would also consider many NSers to be the same. :mp5:

But, as soon as he realizes that the vocies are just in his head, he can fight them. He realizes that he is creating the vocies, and he can stop himself from creating those vocies. :mp5:

Um, no, probably not, unless you're a Christian Scientist or something. There's a reason people use medications and therapy rather than just willpower. Mental illnesses and disorders are, in fact, illnesses and disorders. Hallucinations, whether auditory or visual, are not consciously controlled (or at least not in most cases), and can't be cured just by mind-power any more than tumors can.

But, as soon as he realizes that the vocies are just in his head, he can fight them. He realizes that he is creating the vocies, and he can stop himself from creating those vocies. :mp5:

Not true. Skitzos, even if they realize that the voices in their head, which can often manifest as halisinations of human figures, they still cannot banish the voices and/or visions. True, you can ignore them, but the thought proceses that create the illusion still go on, and the person is, therefore, still insane.

Insanity, in most of its manifestatios, (I won't presume to make an all-encomassing statement) is not the result of a man thinking himself sane, although that can add to it. If a paranoid person knows he's paranoid, he will still check over his shoulder, still be searching for enemies that don't exist. The skisofrania case has already been presented, and there are quite a few others.

Even if someone with conveluded logic knows that they're insane, their logic process still derails itself somewhere along the line, and therefore, they are still insane.

Of course, someone out there will find a case where the insanity is a direct result of thinking the insane one is sane, so if someone can find me that case I would be most interest in it.

This is like asking if an addict is still an addict after admitting her/his addiction. He/she may have made the first step toward recovery, but he/she is still an addict.

Of course, there are some people with mental disorders whose very nature is to deny reality... and it sounds as if you may be defining "insane" (which is not, after all, a medical term) to include only such problems. In that case, your question answers itself: an "insane" person, by your own definition, cannot realize he or she is insane.

For the most part, however, people with truly severe mental problems tend to know that "something" is wrong with them. They often say so: "Something is wrong with me."

The voices tell me im perfectly fine.

[QUOTE=BrCru]Not true. Skitzos, even if they realize that the voices in their head, which can often manifest as halisinations of human figures, they still cannot banish the voices and/or visions. True, you can ignore them, but the thought proceses that create the illusion still go on, and the person is, therefore, still insane.QUOTE]
But, if the person does see the manifestation, s/he, after realizing that it is mearly a figment of their imagination, they can then ignore it as such, so the manifestation will not exist in that person's belief. So, the manifestation will efectively be banished by the persons subcocious, no matter what the concious mind thinks it sees. :mp5:

But, if the person does see the manifestation, s/he, after realizing that it is mearly a figment of their imagination, they can then ignore it as such, so the manifestation will not exist in that person's belief. So, the manifestation will efectively be banished by the persons subcocious, no matter what the concious mind thinks it sees. :mp5:
Couldn't the manifestations change over time as well? If they did(and they probably do considering that a mental illness could not be beaten that easily) then the person would still have problems determining right from wrong. Recognizing your mental illness may help you to compensate for its existence but it does not mean that you make yourself sane perhaps only mildly less insane. Brain chemistry if it is messed up to a certain degree is very hard to fix.

Czardas!

Okay, here goes.

Several doctors have told me I am schizophrenic, that the opinions I have told them I hold are nothing but delusions. In fact I hold far more 'extreme' opinions than the ones I have told them.

I am however a fully productive member of society despite my beliefs that the reality I perceive itself is but an illusion. I feel I am a traitor to my own beliefs yet I feel I am also an example of predictable subjective humanity.

To clarify, I have been told I am schizophrenic but I believe that I am being lied to and 'reality' is more than I can subjectively perceive.

Please tell me what I am.

To clarify, I have been told I am schizophrenic but I believe that I am being lied to and 'reality' is more than I can subjectively perceive.

Please tell me what I am.

perhaps a tad paranoid :p

People are not born insane. It is a lifestyle choice.

Okay, here goes.

Several doctors have told me I am schizophrenic, that the opinions I have told them I hold are nothing but delusions. In fact I hold far more 'extreme' opinions than the ones I have told them.

I am however a fully productive member of society despite my beliefs that the reality I perceive itself is but an illusion. I feel I am a traitor to my own beliefs yet I feel I am also an example of predictable subjective humanity.

To clarify, I have been told I am schizophrenic but I believe that I am being lied to and 'reality' is more than I can subjectively perceive.

Please tell me what I am.
Sounds to me like your a natural born Buddhist in the Mahayana tradition. Reality is, indeed, an illusion.
But allowing your mind to become frangmented (schizophrenic) won't help.
Bring who you are and what you believe together, and embrace the Oneness. ;)
Trick is,

Sounds to me like your a natural born Buddhist in the Mahayana tradition. Reality is, indeed, an illusion.
But allowing your mind to become frangmented (schizophrenic) won't help.
Bring who you are and what you believe together, and embrace the Oneness. ;)
Trick is,

Sssssssssssssssss.

Bang!

It really doesn't matter if you're insane or not. As long as you're not dangerous. If you are not a threat to yourself or others, you can be as demented as you want to be.

How do you think I'm still out? I've managed to dupe them into thinking I'm a harmless wacko. :)

It really doesn't matter if you're insane or not. As long as you're not dangerous. If you are not a threat to yourself or others, you can be as demented as you want to be.

How do you think I'm still out? I've managed to dupe them into thinking I'm a harmless wacko. :)

Under my beliefs 'reality' knows that I am attempting to dupe it and frustrates every knavish trick I play on it...

How do you deal with an omnipitent reality?

If you'd just go and visit your local psych ward and talk for just 5 minutes with any of the patients there you'd realize knowing you're insane can't and won't cure you of your insanity. All it means is you know what causes the symptoms. It doesn't cure of the cause or of the symptoms.

Under my beliefs 'reality' knows that I am attempting to dupe it and frustrates every knavish trick I play on it...

How do you deal with an omnipitent reality?

Well let me give you an example of my world and how I function in it. My purpose in this world is to entertain myself. I do this by entertaining others.

Have you ever watched a stand-up comedy routine on video by yourself? Then watched the same routine with other people? I have. Several times and I notice that I laugh much harder when other people are laughing too. I discovered quite young that the amusement of others greatly increased my own amusement.

So I entertain people. Sometimes at the expense of other people. Sometimes at the expense of myself. I can laugh at myself just as easily as anyone else because I'm amused most by amusement. To amuse others and therefore myself is my driving goal in life. Regardless of what other madnesses I develop, or quirks I exhibit, 'Reality' knows that I'm really just a clown.

SO it should be with you. Dedicate your life to something useful and valuable. DOn't fake it. Truly strive for your goal. SOme of the most successful and driven people in this world are no more or less crazy than us. They just focus their insanity toward constructive goals. No matter what other quirks you may have, that constructive goal will help to isolate you from the persecution of 'reality' and the people who try to force it upon us.

:)

I think Monty Python is Hilarious!

The fact that I'm aware that I'm schitzo doesn't make the talking dolphins go away.

If an insane person realizes and comprehends that they are insane, could they be considered sane? I belive they could because I belive, to be insane, you can't have any real sense of yourself, so as soon as they are aware that they are insane, they gain that comprehension of themselves to be considered sane. :mp5:The problem with that definition is that it only applies to psychoses. A neurosis is a state in which you know something's not right, but you can't do anything about it. Actually, everyone is insane to some degree. It really depends on what problem we have and how much it affects our daily life.
I have a neurosis for instance. I don't like eating cheese and I've convinced myself so hard of it that I gag and throw up when I do eat it. This does not count for pizza, since I like pizza. I can't really control it either, even though I know about it. But this doesn't inhibit my daily life in an intolerable way. Someone that has the neurotic urge to wash their hands all the time, even when it begins to scrub away their skin, would have bigger problems in daily life, and would thus be considered "insane".

Well I'm not insane, but I used to be "psychological disturbed." I actually knew that I was being odd, but was powerless to stop it. I knew that something was wrong but was incapable of putting it right. Therefore, I voted partial, as I was neither really...