NationStates Jolt Archive

So there seem to be different attitudes towards smart women from men. There are lots of men who seem to be horribly intimidated by a woman who is as smart, or smarter than they are, then there are men who find this to be a turn on.

There are also many men who seem to end up dating women my bf aptly describes as "a post" someone who is dumb as a post, and may or may not be beautiful.

Now what is the deal with this? Do some men feel that they need to be smarter to feel superior to a woman they date? Does it make it easy on the ego or something?

Stupidity make hulk angry, hulk smash!

I personally can't stand people who are as "dumb as a post" no matter their gender, and I certainly would not date a lady this dumb.

However, beyond that extreme...so long as we don't step into the other extreme of geeky/nerdy (which has little to do with actual intelligence), intelligence doesn't matter to me very much at all. What's it got anything to do with personality?

i dont know how common is it for a man to avoid smart women but really that kind of man isnt worth having so its good to not have to waste your time on him.

My theory is that a lot of men end up with stupid women because they are the easiest to attract, not because they are necessarily the intended targets.

As for the whole "are intelligent women intimidating?" thing, it seems to me to be the other way around. While there are plenty intelligent women who are not intimidating, most intimidating women are, at least in some weird way, intelligent.

Smart man + smart woman = relationship
smart man + stupid woman = affair
stupid man + smart woman = marriage
stupid man + stupid woman = pregnancy

I think that about sums it up ;)

Incidentally, stupid people annoy me, whether they be male or female.

My theory is that a lot of men end up with stupid women because they are the easiest to attract, not because they are necessarily the intended targets.

As for the whole "are intelligent women intimidating?" thing, it seems to me to be the other way around. While there are plenty intelligent women who are not intimidating, most intimidating women are, at least in some weird way, intelligent.
Makes sense. Who'd be intimidated by an easily manupulated moron?

All other factors being equal, I find more intelligent women to be more attractive.

--The Democratic States of Cogitation
"Think about it for a moment."

Ii agree with Vegas-Rex's theory.

I don't think intimidation is a factor. It's just an ego killer if your partner has more brains.

Dumb men can be great, though. Easy to push around ;)

This all depends on your definition of intelligence of course, but there is that group of heterosexual women who seem to have successful careers of their own and yet are largely anti-man, simply because they fear men will inhibit their individuality.

You know what, damnit, if you're in a relationship, it doesn't matter if you're male or female, your individuality has GOT TO BE inhibited...or else the relationship doesn't work. Granted, it doesn't have to be overwhelming inhibiting, but if you don't let your partner inhibit your individuality, then you're raping your partner out of his/her individuality...so it's no longer a relationship, but an extension of yourself...and that will just lead to an unhappy relationship or divorce....

If intelligence is the sole criteria to match one's self to someone of the opposite sex, then that in and of itself is stupid...don't ya think? It's but one of many things to look at. What kind of situation are we talking about? Romantic relationships? One night stands? Work relationship? Just friends? in general?

I'm not going to beat around the bush...I think smart women are sexy!

I feel most at home when I can hold an intelligent conversation. My happiest memory of this summer may well be a conversation with a couple of girls that covered everything from religion through philosiphy and on to psychology. By far the best chat I've had in a while and both of them were far smarter than me.

lol..which brings us to the discussion of what smart is and what dumb is...its a fact that everyone knows different things and frankly i dont believe there is anyone out there who is really dumb, i admit that there are people who dont have a lot of common sense but thats a whole different story, also there is a difference between emotional intelligence and "normal' intelligence, therefore i cant really give a good answer to your question,also i find the thesis presented in this topic to be incredibly stereotypical and biased :)
If i push aside my ego i have to say that most people tend to become friends with people they can either get along with very well with or people they feel slightly superior too..
If only we could stop comparing and judging we'd be a lot happier as a whole.
I mean stereotypes like "smart" and "dumb" are just a label which may or may not be correct. And i also believe that the so-called "dumb'' people are only pretending to be dumb so they can get attention, either way, the way you feel has a much larger impact on your life then how 'smart' you are.
To me being smart is about living your life the way you want to live and to remain in control of your circumstances and to take responsibility for your life instead of always playing 'the victim'.
But hey thats just how i see it, i may be wrong :)

Brains are a turn-on, but i see why some people dont care about it, it makes them feel superiour and able to push over their partner.

I wouldn't know, really, as I happen to be a moderately nerdy woman. I seem to be intimidating enough, though.

I don't mind people who are less intelligent or a bit slow as friends, but I wouldn't consider relationships with them, as I know they would drive me up the wall before long. For a relationship, I would need someone who is equally or more intelligent...

I feel most at home when I can hold an intelligent conversation. My happiest memory of this summer may well be a conversation with a couple of girls that covered everything from religion through philosiphy and on to psychology. By far the best chat I've had in a while and both of them were far smarter than me.

Lucky bastard!

Smart man + smart woman = relationship
smart man + stupid woman = affair
stupid man + smart woman = marriage
stupid man + stupid woman = pregnancy

I think that about sums it up ;)

LOL!

It strikes me that "Men are intimedated by smart women" is as much of a case of sour grapes as "Women only like jerks."

We never seem to be able to just go, "S/he wasn't into me. Not everyone is gonna be." It has to be the fault of a 'majority' of the other gender and some quirk in thier tastes.

Lucky bastard!

Nothing happend other than the chat, both were 'taken' so no :fluffle:

It strikes me that "Men are intimedated by smart women" is as much of a case of sour grapes as "Women only like jerks."

We never seem to be able to just go, "S/he wasn't into me. Not everyone is gonna be." It has to be the fault of a 'majority' of the other gender and some quirk in thier tastes.

The difference is that women, for generations, were told not to act smart - that men wouldn't like them if they acted smart. Now, whether that was simply a product of the times or an actual estimation of the typical man's tastes is certainly debateable, but women were told this. Even now, the typical Southern woman plays the "little wife" role in public, while actually being the one running the household. She lets the man and anyone else watching think he is making all the decisions, while actually making quite a few of them herself. It is simply the way many women were brought up.

So there seem to be different attitudes towards smart women from men. There are lots of men who seem to be horribly intimidated by a woman who is as smart, or smarter than they are, then there are men who find this to be a turn on.

There are also many men who seem to end up dating women my bf aptly describes as "a post" someone who is dumb as a post, and may or may not be beautiful.

Now what is the deal with this? Do some men feel that they need to be smarter to feel superior to a woman they date? Does it make it easy on the ego or something?
Well, I've dated both and I can safely say that the intelligent women win hands down with me. Usually the more intelligent a woman is, the more inventive and creative she is, which makes for highly interesting sex. But you can have sex only so long, and then what do you do? If the two of you can't hold an intelligent discussion, it's time to dress and go home. Heh!

It's been a long time since I felt intimidated by anyone, male or female, so that's not an issue for me. Besides ... I have yet to find a woman who's smarter than me. :D

This all depends on your definition of intelligence of course, but there is that group of heterosexual women who seem to have successful careers of their own and yet are largely anti-man, simply because they fear men will inhibit their individuality.

You know what, damnit, if you're in a relationship, it doesn't matter if you're male or female, your individuality has GOT TO BE inhibited...or else the relationship doesn't work. Granted, it doesn't have to be overwhelming inhibiting, but if you don't let your partner inhibit your individuality, then you're raping your partner out of his/her individuality...so it's no longer a relationship, but an extension of yourself...and that will just lead to an unhappy relationship or divorce....
amen, brotha!

Well, I've dated both and I can safely say that the intelligent women win hands down with me. Usually the more intelligent a woman is, the more inventive and creative she is, which makes for highly interesting sex. But you can have sex only so long, and then what do you do? If the two of you can't hold an intelligent discussion, it's time to dress and go home. Heh!

It's been a long time since I felt intimidated by anyone, male or female, so that's not an issue for me. Besides ... I have yet to find a woman who's smarter than me. :D

Kind of reminds me of the German proverb "Dumm fickt gut" - "Stupid fucks well", applicable to both sexes
;)

Kind of reminds me of the German proverb "Dumm fickt gut" - "Stupid fucks well", applicable to both sexes
;)
Aber wahr ist es nicht, egal wie oft man es wiederholt.

The difference is that women, for generations, were told not to act smart - that men wouldn't like them if they acted smart. Now, whether that was simply a product of the times or an actual estimation of the typical man's tastes is certainly debateable, but women were told this. Even now, the typical Southern woman plays the "little wife" role in public, while actually being the one running the household. She lets the man and anyone else watching think he is making all the decisions, while actually making quite a few of them herself. It is simply the way many women were brought up.
I have to grant that to a degree, mostly because it's true and if I denied it I'd be an idiot. It's demonstrably true and is exampled in our culture over and over again.

However, in practice I find that most often this is related to 'why don't pretty people like me?' Which is really the case. Lot's of women like all kinds of men-but that hot chick is with that dick, and that dick is hot but the chick he's with is a ditz. Because water finds its level and two shallow pools fit together well.

Most often I find these complaints to be related to that, but again do grant that the societal norm is to 'let the guy win,' let him feel like the smarty pants' and I think that this pressure did stem from an insecurity. That I'll grant.

Perhaps, as a caveat, I am basing my response on too much ancedotal evidence-the women I see say "Men are intimedated by my intellegence" are really just abrassive assholes and it sours the phrase. Women smarter then them have managed to be completely pleasent to be around without having to play anything....so, yeah...that....kinda wondered all over the place....

If I ever meet a woman as smart as me I will let you know how I feel :p

Aber wahr ist es nicht, egal wie oft man es wiederholt.

Keine Ahnung, ich hab's nie versucht ;)

Perhaps, as a caveat, I am basing my response on too much ancedotal evidence-the women I see say "Men are intimedated by my intellegence" are really just abrassive assholes and it sours the phrase. Women smarter then them have managed to be completely pleasent to be around without having to play anything....so, yeah...that....kinda wondered all over the place....

These days, I think those probably are most of the complaints. I just wanted to point out that some of them may still stem from actual stereotypes.

Most of the men I know, anyways, are completely turned off by ditzy women. At least in the past generation, far fewer women were raised with the "play it dumb" mentality. Even in my own case, my grandmother once told me that men would be intimidated by me because I was intelligent, and then immediately added, "But don't ever act like you're stupid to impress a man."

Keine Ahnung, ich hab's nie versucht ;)
Ich schon, egal wie schlau sie war. :D
Ne, ich habs einmal versucht und dann gelassen, ist nix für mich.

I think 'Men are intimidated by smart women' is one of the many white lies that people who can't get dates tell themselves in order to keep their egos from getting too small. Y'know, a white lie similar to, 'Women won't date men who are nice' and about 100 other generalities like that.

It's easy really... here's a template:

"(Insert your gender preference here) won't touch me with a ten foot pole because they don't like (Insert your gender here) who are (Insert a good quality you think you possess but actually may or may not here)"

Personally I think intelligence in a woman is hawt... I can't tolerate having dumb people around me for more than a few minutes at a time. But just because a woman is smart, that doesn't necessarily mean they have the personality or appearance that I'm looking for in a gf.

...so long as we don't step into the other extreme of geeky/nerdy...

Hey, what's wrong with geeks and nerds? Nerd pride! ;)

Speaking from experience, I've known some guys to be somewhat intimidated by intelligence, but they seem to be in the minority. I'm afraid some do exist, though - I once watched a guy spend a day sulking for no apparent reason other than that I beat him at Scrabble. I've found, though, that even with those guys, I can usually undo any "damage" that my nerdiness may have caused by suggesting we play a computer game or some sort of sport (depending on the guy), at which my ass will be duly kicked. Yes, it's sort of sad that I have to bother with that, but it's not a very big deal, especially considering that most guys are sane enough not to need that much ego-coddling.

Personally, I find intelligence terribly appealing and would be happy to be the stupidest person in the room.

The difference is that women, for generations, were told not to act smart - that men wouldn't like them if they acted smart.
Similarly, men were always told to act tough or else women wouldn't like them and other men wouldn't follow them or listen to them.

I think 'Men are intimidated by smart women' is one of the many white lies that people who can't get dates tell themselves in order to keep their egos from getting too small. Y'know, a white lie similar to, 'Women won't date men who are nice' and about 100 other generalities like that.

It's easy really... here's a template:

"(Insert your gender preference here) won't touch me with a ten foot pole because they don't like (Insert your gender here) who are (Insert a good quality you think you possess but actually may or may not here)"

Personally I think intelligence in a woman is hawt... I can't tolerate having dumb people around me for more than a few minutes at a time. But just cause a woman is smart, that doesn't necessarily mean they have the personality or appearance that I'm looking for in a gf.
Yeah, I think it's more like men don't like a woman who thinks she is the smartest thing on two legs and feels the need to prove it over and over again. Just like men think that they are disliked for being a "nice guy" when they are really "fragile, simpering wusses", a "smart" or "dominant" woman might actually just be a domineering loudmouth.

Similarly, men were always told to act tough or else women wouldn't like them and other men wouldn't follow them or listen to them.
the first part is more or less true and the second part is completely true. Of course, there are different kinds of tough and not all of them involve puffing out your chest and getting into people's faces.

I think 'Men are intimidated by smart women' is one of the many white lies that people who can't get dates tell themselves in order to keep their egos from getting too small. Y'know, a white lie similar to, 'Women won't date men who are nice' and about 100 other generalities like that.

I wouldnt call it a white lie so much as a "white exaggeration." I suspect both "guys don't like smart girls" and "women don't like nice guys" are based on truths about a small subset of men and women (I've certainly met a few for whom they seem to be true), and are then used incorrectly by lots of obnoxious people who think they're nice/smart to explain the behavior of all people instead of the relevant small subset.

So there seem to be different attitudes towards smart women from men. There are lots of men who seem to be horribly intimidated by a woman who is as smart, or smarter than they are, then there are men who find this to be a turn on.

There are also many men who seem to end up dating women my bf aptly describes as "a post" someone who is dumb as a post, and may or may not be beautiful.

Now what is the deal with this? Do some men feel that they need to be smarter to feel superior to a woman they date? Does it make it easy on the ego or something?
I love intelligence, and my girlfriend's bloody smart. I don't mind that at times, she is able to outclass me in that, but I also have areas where mine shines through more than her's. We all have our strong and weak points in the way we (can) use our intellect, but that doesn't make you any less bright. Anyways, I'd never date a woman who wasn't intelligent. I want..need..to have stimulating intellectual and philosphical discussions from time to time, and have my own beliefs challenged, and perhaps even changed.

I think 'Men are intimidated by smart women' is one of the many white lies that people who can't get dates tell themselves in order to keep their egos from getting too small. Y'know, a white lie similar to, 'Women won't date men who are nice' and about 100 other generalities like that.

It's easy really... here's a template:

"(Insert your gender preference here) won't touch me with a ten foot pole because they don't like (Insert your gender here) who are (Insert a good quality you think you possess but actually may or may not here)"

Personally I think intelligence in a woman is hawt... I can't tolerate having dumb people around me for more than a few minutes at a time. But just because a woman is smart, that doesn't necessarily mean they have the personality or appearance that I'm looking for in a gf.
There's a degree of truth to your "template," but there's also the matter of having to define "intelligence." There are people who consider those who disagree with them, for example about politics, to be severely lacking in intellect.

Yeah, I think it's more like men don't like a woman who thinks she is the smartest thing on two legs and feels the need to prove it over and over again. Just like men think that they are disliked for being a "nice guy" when they are really "fragile, simpering wusses", a "smart" or "dominant" woman might actually just be a domineering loudmouth.
The one thing that will turn me off faster than anything else, even stupidity, is arrogance. I can't abide that in anyone, male or female. And the really sad thing is, it's almost always people who are less than the sharpest knife in the drawer who look down on others.

Good points, E and Bootie... many of the women who make that complaint need to realize that 'opinionated and arrogant' doesn't equate to 'smart'. For that matter you can give that advice to a lot of unsuccessful men, too.

It strikes me that "Men are intimedated by smart women" is as much of a case of sour grapes as "Women only like jerks."

We never seem to be able to just go, "S/he wasn't into me. Not everyone is gonna be." It has to be the fault of a 'majority' of the other gender and some quirk in thier tastes.
My bf loves that I'm smart. One of the first big things that won him over was that I'm majoring in physics.

My bf loves that I'm smart. One of the first big things that won him over was that I'm majoring in physics.
Well, because that's hot.

Smart chicks are far more entertaining, dumb chicks are a burdon. (Like the chick who didn't know dogs where mammals or the other that thought Al Green was a white dude, that kinda dumb. Thinking that Chicken of the Sea was an actual type of chicken...that kinda dumb...)

Now, to undermine what I just said-

There is no universal. Mass grouping is often a result of sour grapes.

My bf loves that I'm smart. One of the first big things that won him over was that I'm majoring in physics.
How is your major a measure of your intelligence?

Mhhh, I consider myself quite intelligent and therefore met few people at all who were more intelligent than me (intelligent as being able to think in an abstract way).
I guess sometimes it would be difficult for me to admit that my gf is more intelligent than me. My last and only girlfriend maybe was a little less intelligent than me (as far as math and physics stuff etc. is concerned), but knew more about biology (which already pissed me off sometimes, if she told me something I did not understand).
This said, I could not imagine to have a serious relationship with a dumb girl, who would not understand/be interested in my philosophical thoughts about god and the world.

How is your major a measure of your intelligence?

If you do not have a high IQ you will fail in physics I guess.

I am for smart women. Trust me I've dated stupid women, and while they are attractive, they are incredibly boring. I mean they always want to talk about trival things that would just make you bang your head on the wall. I am now seeing a smart and beautiful woman, and she is a joy to have around.

So there seem to be different attitudes towards smart women from men. There are lots of men who seem to be horribly intimidated by a woman who is as smart, or smarter than they are, then there are men who find this to be a turn on.

There are also many men who seem to end up dating women my bf aptly describes as "a post" someone who is dumb as a post, and may or may not be beautiful.

Now what is the deal with this? Do some men feel that they need to be smarter to feel superior to a woman they date? Does it make it easy on the ego or something?
I find intelligence a turn on, hell my girlfriend is one of the top academics at my high school!

If you do not have a high IQ you will fail in physics I guess.
Yes. To major in it you must be VERY intelligent. Like 90+ average out of high school intelligent... (at least at U of T, I've been told)

How is your major a measure of your intelligence?
Physics isn't something you can just bullshit your way through, it does require a certain level of intelligence to get by in.

Yes. To major in it you must be VERY intelligent. Like 90+ average out of high school intelligent... (at least at U of T, I've been told)
I had an 88 out of highschool and I go to McMaster. Highschool grades didn't matter for specific majors here though, as you don't pick them until the end of first year, in which case your first year marks are what count.

Physics isn't something you can just bullshit your way through, it does require a certain level of intelligence to get by in.
Please, share with me some examples of majors you would consider as "something you can just bullshit your way through" if Physics is oh so much tougher than other majors...

Please, share with me some examples of majors you would consider as "something you can just bullshit your way through" if Physics is oh so much tougher than other majors...
Film. Trust me.

Please, share with me some examples of majors you would consider as "something you can just bullshit your way through" if Physics is oh so much tougher than other majors...

I don't think she was saying "non-physics majors are dumbo-heads" or something. There aren't any majors that are universally hard or easy, but it can't be denied that at any given school there are easier and harder majors. At Dakini's school, apparently, physics is one of the harder ones. Where I went to college, it was well known that if you wanted to slack off, you should major in economics, because that program simply wasn't up to the rest of the school's standards, and if you were a brilliant masochistic workaholic, you should major in biochemistry, because that program emphasized lots and lots of lab hours and extremely hard coursework. So, there, one could reasonably assume that the average biochem major was more intelligent and hard-working than the average econ major. At another school, it might be entirely reversed.

Please, share with me some examples of majors you would consider as "something you can just bullshit your way through" if Physics is oh so much tougher than other majors...
Well, I've successfully bullshitted my way through many philosophy classes. The philosophy majors were all bitching about how these were their hardest classes and they were my easiest.
I would imagine underwater basket weaving would be a sinch once you get the basics of weaving baskets and scuba diving.
Geology looked damn easy from what my roommate was bringing home.
I really can't imagine being an Art major being too difficult.

I don't think she was saying "non-physics majors are dumbo-heads" or something. There aren't any majors that are universally hard or easy, but it can't be denied that at any given school there are easier and harder majors. At Dakini's school, apparently, physics is one of the harder ones. Where I went to college, it was well known that if you wanted to slack off, you should major in economics, because that program simply wasn't up to the rest of the school's standards, and if you were a brilliant masochistic workaholic, you should major in biochemistry, because that program emphasized lots and lots of lab hours and extremely hard coursework. So, there, one could reasonably assume that the average biochem major was more intelligent and hard-working than the average econ major. At another school, it might be entirely reversed.
Yeah, I bet if I were to go to a school famous for its arts programme, then physics there would be a breeze.

lol..which brings us to the discussion of what smart is and what dumb is...its a fact that everyone knows different things and frankly i dont believe there is anyone out there who is really dumb, i admit that there are people who dont have a lot of common sense but thats a whole different story, also there is a difference between emotional intelligence and "normal' intelligence, therefore i cant really give a good answer to your question,also i find the thesis presented in this topic to be incredibly stereotypical and biased :)
If i push aside my ego i have to say that most people tend to become friends with people they can either get along with very well with or people they feel slightly superior too..
If only we could stop comparing and judging we'd be a lot happier as a whole.
I mean stereotypes like "smart" and "dumb" are just a label which may or may not be correct. And i also believe that the so-called "dumb'' people are only pretending to be dumb so they can get attention, either way, the way you feel has a much larger impact on your life then how 'smart' you are.
To me being smart is about living your life the way you want to live and to remain in control of your circumstances and to take responsibility for your life instead of always playing 'the victim'.
But hey thats just how i see it, i may be wrong :)

Having spent 5 years in the Air Force, I can assure you there are stupid people out there. I think brains are an incredible turn on. There's something about being able to carry on an intelligent, deep discussion with the woman I'm dating. I've dated so many idiots...most of whom I only went out with once or twice and then moved on.

A woman that can only stimulate my body is nice...but wont provide the same lasting relationship that a woman who can stimulate both my body and mind will provide.

Intelligence is very much of a turn on, just so long as I am not afraid for my ego :)

But seriously, I do not want to be with a woman who does not have some level of intelligence or drive.

Also, I have heard that physics is one of the toughest things to major in. I believe it too because physics is very math based and it is hard to guess on a math test if you do not know what is going on. Plus physics has its own little twists too because you have to analyze what is going on.

Yes, but there's book smarts and 'street' smarts.

I work in a highly technical field - one that requires both book smarts and intelligence. I have known many technicians that had incredible book smarts - could test well, knew the book inside and out...but they werent able to convert that to practical use. And I've known vice-versa - techs that were able to fix all kinds of things, but had no clue exactly why what they were doing worked. Every now and then you'll find people that have a strong mixture of both - can read the book, understand it, and then translate that into practical application.

It is possible to be a ditz and pass physics if one is book smart.

I much prefer a woman with a mix of both - and she happens to be more intelligent than me, then I'll just have to exercise my mind to reach her level in the interest of better conversation.

The woman I'm currently talking to is so much more attractive to me because she makes me think - and there's not been many women I've dated that have done that. I enjoy talking with her because we communicate on a higher level than just small-talk.

There's also a huge difference between plain knowledge and real intelligence.
I happen to have a good amount of knowledge on many different subjects, but I would estimate my intelligence to be very little above average, if above at all.
At the moment, I'm in a relation where I as the female am the one with more knowledge on a greater number of subjects (although I'll have to admit he knows a lot more about sports and celebrities), which earned me the nickname "Klugscheisser" - "Know-it-all" :D

Caveat: I love smart women. They're awsome.
It's not smart women that are a turn-off. It's women that have a chip on their shoulder about their IQ that generally get the cold shoulder from guys. And from my experience the ones that are the most defensive tend to be not nearly as bright as they think they are (hint errudition =/= intellegence).

Caveat: I love smart women. They're awsome.
It's not smart women that are a turn-off. It's women that have a chip on their shoulder about their IQ that generally get the cold shoulder from guys. And from my experience the ones that are the most defensive tend to be not nearly as bright as they think they are (hint errudition =/= intellegence).
Trying to hint something?

I'm no good at subtle. Let's just say that there is an abundance of educated people men and women in the world that are simply not that bright.

There are also many men who seem to end up dating women my bf aptly describes as "a post" someone who is dumb as a post, and may or may not be beautiful.

Now what is the deal with this? Do some men feel that they need to be smarter to feel superior to a woman they date? Does it make it easy on the ego or something?

God and Adam were walking through the Garden of Eden one day admiring God's wok when Adam exclaimed, "God! This garden and all the animals are nice, but you really out-did yourself with Eve. 'Woman' is Magnificent! Tell me God, why did you make her face soooo lovely?"
God repplied "So that you could look upon her and love her.
"And why God, did you make her skin so soft and warm?"
"So, Adam, that you could touch her and love her."
"And why God did you make her body so curvy and volumptuous?"
"So, Adam, that you could hold her and love her."
Adam considered this for a moment, then asked aprehensively, "So why then, Lord, did you make her so stupid?"
"Ah, Adam. That is so she could love YOU!"

I consider myself a highly intelligent women and I only feel attracted to those who are my equal (at least). I find it surprising, however, that no one has mentioned shaired interests/complomentry interests as a significant factor in a relationship. That after all goes hand in hand in a relationship, shaired interest more often then not means shaired intellect.

Amestria']I consider myself a highly intelligent women and I only feel attracted to those who are my equal (at least). I find it surprising, however, that no one has mentioned shaired interests/complomentry interests as a significant factor in a relationship. That after all goes hand in hand in a relationship, shaired interest more often then not means shaired intellect.

Not entirely true. Some of us prefer intelligent women with different interests. Nothing says we can't learn to share interests. To be honest, many of my interests have begun to bore me and it's refreshing to have a partner with different interests than what I'm knowledgeable on - gives me a good opportunity to broaden my horizons and pick up new subjects to study.

Amestria']I consider myself a highly intelligent women and I only feel attracted to those who are my equal (at least). I find it surprising, however, that no one has mentioned shaired interests/complomentry interests as a significant factor in a relationship. That after all goes hand in hand in a relationship, shaired interest more often then not means shaired intellect.

I'd say intellegent people disagree regularilly. Shared values (and I don't mean values in the Fallwel sence) are more important than interests/ opinions. That was my recent upgrade of what I catogorize as relationship material. Used to be intellegent+ beautiful now it's intellegent+beautiful+shared values. If I waited for a woman who agreed with me on most issues or interestts I'd be singlefor a very long time.....

Physics isn't something you can just bullshit your way through, it does require a certain level of intelligence to get by in.
Oh. So other topic areas, disciplines, and majors are just "bullshit?" Interesting.

What does college have to do with intelligence at all? All it indicates in many cases is your socio-economic class.

Now, having said that, there are some very, very intelligent people who go to college. But there are also some very, very intelligent people who don't.

Oh. So other topic areas, disciplines, and majors are just "bullshit?" Interesting.

She didn't say the other majors were bullshit, she said you could bullshit your way through them. That is really true of some majors, esp liberal arts.

She didn't say the other majors were bullshit, she said you could bullshit your way through them. That is really true of some majors, esp liberal arts.

No, it's not true of hardly any major. Someone who tries to BS their way through a college major will have it catch up to them before the end. The stereotype that liberal arts is something one can BS their way through is absurd and ridiculous, and perpetuated by those who do not take liberal arts degrees.

She didn't say the other majors were bullshit, she said you could bullshit your way through them. That is really true of some majors, esp liberal arts.

As I said before, that really depends on the school and the program. There are humanities courses that force you to work your butt off and hard science courses aimed at lazy morons. Heck, I've personally taken completely un-BS-able English courses and one highly BS-able astrophysics course. It really depends on the individual curcumstances of the school, the major, the course, the professor, and the person taking it.

No, it's not true of hardly any major. Someone who tries to BS their way through a college major will have it catch up to them before the end. The stereotype that liberal arts is something one can BS their way through is absurd and ridiculous, and perpetuated by those who do not take liberal arts degrees.
I have a liberal arts degree.

I bullshitted my way through it completely.

I graduated with honors.

What does college have to do with intelligence at all? All it indicates in many cases is your socio-economic class.

Now, having said that, there are some very, very intelligent people who go to college. But there are also some very, very intelligent people who don't.
Well, smart people are more likely to get into college and do well in college. There is actually a sizable amount of scholarship for those with need and for those with merit(such as intelligence often gives). I would actually say that there are many smart people that go to college and only a few that don't.

No, it's not true of hardly any major. Someone who tries to BS their way through a college major will have it catch up to them before the end. The stereotype that liberal arts is something one can BS their way through is absurd and ridiculous, and perpetuated by those who do not take liberal arts degrees.
Tell it, bro! :D

I have a liberal arts degree.

I bullshitted my way through it completely.

I graduated with honors.

Then you went to a shit college, or took a useless major, or something. There's no way you faked your entire way through a legitimate four year program at a respectable university.

Then you went to a shit college, or took a useless major, or something. There's no way you faked your entire way through a legitimate four year program at a respectable university.
I'm just very creative and write well. And liberal arts majors are basically useless are they not?

I'm not saying I didn't do any reading or anything, I'm just saying that hard science is a lot more demanding. When I wrote a paper for a liberal arts class, I started it the night before and managed to get an A, often while finishing my research at the same time. For a math or science course, if I wasn't up on everything from the beginning of class I was screwed.

Well, smart people are more likely to get into college and do well in college. There is actually a sizable amount of scholarship for those with need and for those with merit(such as intelligence often gives). I would actually say that there are many smart people that go to college and only a few that don't.

I'd agree with that in general, but there are enough exceptions to the rule that someone backing up the statement, 'I'm smart' with some description of their college background isn't really doing it for me. We've all known college grads who can't pour piss out of a boot.

However, I'll admit that maybe I'm just prejudiced though because my 'college' experience consisted of flip-flopping my way through 3 different majors at a community college until, after a year, I realized I was just wasting my time and decided to go make money as a programmer instead. Although I work side by side with people who mostly have four year degrees and I hold my own just fine.

Having said that though, do even the hard majors require mostly 'smarts' though, or mostly dedication? There's a big difference. Learning how to perform any skilled job, blue collar or white collar, at a high level requires work and dedication, but that alone wouldn't make you 'smarter' than someone who wasn't as dedicated.

There are a lot of people in prison who complete degrees while there... some of them become lawyers and so on, and I'm sure some would pursue the hard sciences if they had access to labs. But does that make them 'smart' per se or does it just mean they were dedicated because they had nothing else to do?

Some people have natural study skills. Excellent writers with excellent perception skills. There are people I know that are extremely intelligent. What they call "bull shitting" only showed their natural talents. They expended llittle effort because it was not hard for them to accomplish.

In some cases it is a below par school program.

In reality there are some majors which are easier and some that are very difficult. You can usually tell which ones are which by their drop out rates and how often the participants in that major are actually able to go out and party LOL.

Though the difficulty of a course does not always point to someone of greater intelligence just that they have some.

I myself prefer intelligence. Gives me hope for my progeny. :)

I'd agree with that in general, but there are enough exceptions to the rule that someone backing up the statement, 'I'm smart' with some description of their college background isn't really doing it for me. We've all known college grads who can't pour piss out of a boot.

Having said that though, do even the hard majors require mostly 'smarts' though, or mostly dedication? There's a big difference. Learning how to perform any skilled job, blue collar or white collar, at a high level requires work and dedication, but that alone wouldn't make you 'smarter' than someone who wasn't as dedicated.

There are a lot of people in prison who complete degrees while there... some of them become lawyers and so on, and I'm sure some would pursue the hard sciences if they had access to labs. But does that make them 'smart' per se or does it just mean they were dedicated because they had nothing else to do?
I am not saying that college means that a person is a genius or even incredibly smart. It just seems that most smart people are drawn to the idea of going to college. I know that smart people going to college and dumb people not doing so is not a rule(there are lots of exceptions) but instead I am merely stating that it seems more likely that if you are smart that you will go to college while if you are not as smart then you probably will not(unless you are rich).

The hard majors require both intelligence and dedication. Some people just can not understand advanced math or science and can not get a major in hard degrees such as engineering or physics or many other degrees that are considered hard. Learning in general requires some level of intelligence to understand what you are doing.

The prisoners who get those degrees probably do so because of their boredom. This does not detract from the fact that smart people are more likely to go to college than dumber people. It really is not often that you hear a smart person ever planning a life without going to college. Women often go to college partially to get their MRS degree along with other degrees of course :) There are exceptions to every rule but that does not mean that these exceptions make the rule bad or entirely untrue.

I am not saying that college means that a person is a genius or even incredibly smart. It just seems that most smart people are drawn to the idea of going to college. I know that smart people going to college and dumb people not doing so is not a rule(there are lots of exceptions) but instead I am merely stating that it seems more likely that if you are smart that you will go to college while if you are not as smart then you probably will not(unless you are rich).

The hard majors require both intelligence and dedication. Some people just can not understand advanced math or science and can not get a major in hard degrees such as engineering or physics or many other degrees that are considered hard. Learning in general requires some level of intelligence to understand what you are doing.

The prisoners who get those degrees probably do so because of their boredom. This does not detract from the fact that smart people are more likely to go to college than dumber people. It really is not often that you hear a smart person ever planning a life without going to college. Women often go to college partially to get their MRS degree along with other degrees of course :) There are exceptions to every rule but that does not mean that these exceptions make the rule bad or entirely untrue.

I would disagree entirely. Some of the most intelligent people are smart enough to not feel the need to "waste" money on a 4-year degree while some of the dumbest people I know are going to college because that's what's expected of high school graduates these days.

Personally, I'd like to think I'm above average intelligence and I dropped out of college after 1 1/2 semesters. Not because I couldnt hack it, but because I realized it wasnt for me at the time - even now, 5 years later, I'm not sure I want to go back to college. Does that make me less intelligent than the fool that spends years bouncing between majors and spending his / her time at greek parties because that's what's was expected of them?

I would disagree entirely. Some of the most intelligent people are smart enough to not feel the need to "waste" money on a 4-year degree while some of the dumbest people I know are going to college because that's what's expected of high school graduates these days.

Personally, I'd like to think I'm above average intelligence and I dropped out of college after 1 1/2 semesters. Not because I couldnt hack it, but because I realized it wasnt for me at the time - even now, 5 years later, I'm not sure I want to go back to college. Does that make me less intelligent than the fool that spends years bouncing between majors and spending his / her time at greek parties because that's what's was expected of them?
That is why the smartest of people do not spend very much of their own money going to college. Schools do offer full scholarships or close to that for students of high ability, students with good PSAT scores might not have to pay very much at all to go to college. With today's society and culture it is very much expected for students to get a degree if they are smart enough to go to college. Sure, many dumb people go to college but many dumb people also do not go to college.

I really do not know your situation at college to really judge about your intelligence or your choice. The fool that bounces between majors going to Greek parties is of course a fool but they obviously were smart enough to get into that college(unless they were obscenely rich). However, the average success of college students higher than the average success of students who do not go to college. If you pick a good major at college you can make a good amount of money.

If you pick a good major at college you can make a good amount of money.
Any major in college. Having higher and higher college degrees will make you more and more money, even if you don't need a degree to do the job in the first place. Unless you start your own business, the higher of a college degree you have in some random field, the more money you will make - unless you are a CEO, then all you have to be is incompetent.

Any major in college. Having higher and higher college degrees will make you more and more money, even if you don't need a degree to do the job in the first place. Unless you start your own business, the higher of a college degree you have in some random field, the more money you will make - unless you are a CEO, then all you have to be is incompetent.
You definitely need more experience. There are so many things wrong with this post that I have no idea where to begin.

You definitely need more experience. There are so many things wrong with this post that I have no idea where to begin.
Then let's move on

A PhD in philosophy qualifies you for nothing but teaching, and tenured jobs in areas like that are hard to come by.

All socialist propaganda aside, nobody becomes a CEO of a major corporation who is incompetent, unless he is the majority shareholder.

Not only do I prefer smart women, I will only date smart women. The one time I didn't, it was a disaster. Of course, wmart women won't go out with me, but that's a different rant. :headbang:

I really do not know your situation at college to really judge about your intelligence or your choice. The fool that bounces between majors going to Greek parties is of course a fool but they obviously were smart enough to get into that college(unless they were obscenely rich). However, the average success of college students higher than the average success of students who do not go to college. If you pick a good major at college you can make a good amount of money.

That depends, of course, on your definition of a 'good' major. It also depends on your grades, and on your ability to actually hunt down a job. Getting far in a career takes as much hard-work, dedication, political wheeling etc. as anything else. It also depends on how far you pursue your degree; I'm told that, while a bachelor's in philosophy leads to the hair-dressing salon, a master's in the same subject can be surprisingly lucrative.

Guess I'd like to touch on the idea that physics is harder than philosophy, too. Ceteris paribus, it depends on the individual. Some people take to maths really quickly, but couldn't critically analyse philosophy to save themselves; likewise, there are people who are masterly in philosophy, but can't add up a column of numbers. I don't see that either can be considered more intelligent than the other, except by means of inter-intellectual snobbery.

I'm a big advocate of the idea that the best major is the one that you enjoy the most. If you're having fun in studying, this'll reflect on your grades, and on your charisma. Happy people are more attractive than miserable wretches sweating and wondering why they're taking engineering when what they really want to be doing is writing poetry. Also, people who are taking what they're taking because they love it tend to be the stronger-willed people. If you don't know what you love, by all means, spend a few years working somewhere before going to college - if you can find a job. People who are priviliged enough to be at college and spit on the opportunity because it's not where they want to be are just irritating.

Which brings me to my final point: intelligence is a dubious quality. I'd sooner spend my time with an energetic and good-hearted fool than with an intelligent bastard. Nonetheless, I am yet to fall for a girl who's much less intelligent than me.

That aint to say it couldn't happen, though.

That is why the smartest of people do not spend very much of their own money going to college. Schools do offer full scholarships or close to that for students of high ability, students with good PSAT scores might not have to pay very much at all to go to college. With today's society and culture it is very much expected for students to get a degree if they are smart enough to go to college. Sure, many dumb people go to college but many dumb people also do not go to college.

I really do not know your situation at college to really judge about your intelligence or your choice. The fool that bounces between majors going to Greek parties is of course a fool but they obviously were smart enough to get into that college(unless they were obscenely rich). However, the average success of college students higher than the average success of students who do not go to college. If you pick a good major at college you can make a good amount of money.

You'd be surprised how few scholarships are awarded to your average white male just graduating high school with a 3.5gpa and a 32 on the ACT...see, the problem is that I wasnt low enough to qualify, and I wasnt high enough either...

Regardless of my exact situation, many intelligent people decline a college education for reasons other than money (in my case, money was the least important issue). A college degree does not necessarily denote intelligence. I know people with a master's in electrical engineering that couldnt do my job as well as I can (remember, it's a highly technical electronics field).

Judging a person's intelligence level based on their education is highly misleading. Just a word of caution...

However, the average success of college students higher than the average success of students who do not go to college. If you pick a good major at college you can make a good amount of money.

In my view though that isn't indicative of intelligence, its indicative of how screwed up the system is. Our collegiate system is killing us IMO.

Computer programming is what I know... so I'm gonna use that as an example of my point...

Say I'm a manager at an IT firm, and I need someone to write code for me in (insert whatever language here). I think most of us on this thread are at least reasonably intelligent people... as such I could almost certainly show you how to write code in that language and make you a productive employee in 3-6 months. Some of us simply wouldn't have aptitude as programmers, but an aptitude test during the hiring process would weed those people out. Sounds simple, right?

But the way things are now, hiring someone with aptitude and just showing them the ropes is almost completly unheard of. Instead I would comb lists of resumes from recent college IT grads, most of whom have never been trained in the language I'm asking them to write (in case you didn't know, there are many, many computer languages and the syntax of each of them changes over time. College can't possibly teach them all) and select one carefully. Sure, they would have aptitude and desire, but since they've finished 4 years of school and are often tens of thousands of dollars in debt, they have to ask me for 50k a year instead of 25-30k. Those debts are likely to make them more money-motivated and less loyal, so it becomes less likely that I would get my investment in training back before they bolted to make more money somewhere else. So our collegiate system hurts both businesses and students.

Now some fields like medicine do require that college work. But most other fields are getting bloated with higher and higher requirements for entry in terms of certifications and degrees, most of which do nothing to actually help the average employee who is doing some specialized task that will never touch on 90% of the shit they learned in formal education. It doesn't make them more intelligent or better at their job. It just makes the collegiate institutions and trade schools richer.

And don't even get me started on gut courses that cost $1000 apiece and do nothing whatsoever to advance a person in their chosen field, like sociology or something being put into a 4 year math program.

Anyway, I'll get off my soapbox now... sorry for going so far off topic. :(

Nice thread here with some good points being brought up both with intelligence as a whole and with its place in relationships ;)

I wouldn't like to date somebody who was either a complete moron or who made me look like a complete moron. Somebody roughly around my level.

Most guys don't really give a damn about intelligence, however it may be defined. Compatibility of personality is more important. As for whether she is a specialist in one narrow field and ignorant of all else, or has a broad understanding of the world, or the extent to which she is able to communicate her intelligence, or whether literary flair compensates for an inability to work out a tip...so many possible standards, who cares?