NationStates Jolt Archive

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4728261.stm

Is it just me or did Hilary Clinton start a chain of events in which the events just seem more and more stupider?

First she compares video games to alcohol and tobacco
Then she shames ESRB to rerating GTA:SA
GTA:SA gets rerated to AO
Major U.S. stores refuse to sell AO-games
Jack Thompson uses opportunity to call The Sims 2 a pedophille-game
House of Representatives votes to launch an investigation of GTA:SA
Australia bans GTA:SA

What's next? I beg to dream not.

Is it just me or did Hilary Clinton start a chain of events in which the events just seem more and more stupider?

yes

Australia seems more prone to banning things than other places. For example, it's the only place in the world to ban Salvia Divinorum, or 'Diviner's Sage', after people tried using it as a party drug with bad consequences.

I don't want my children to be corrupted by a sex scene! I mean, I don't want the wanton violence, picking up hookers, murder, drug use and the like to be interrupted by such smut!

c'mon Australia, it's not a game for kids.

Australia is now offical on my Axis of Evil list, under the Totalitarian section. ;)

Funny how here in the UK no-one appears to even have batted an eyelid.

Incidentally, I wonder if that Dutch programmer guy is now in danger of getting lynched...

It is the next step on the war on video games. Intrestingly they are using the same playbook as from the war on smoking.

You already have the class action lawsuit, the bannings, and the investigations, all we need now are more "scientific" studies on how its bad for us and why the government needs to control us...erm...i mean it..

here is the old link for the lawsuit that appeared after the AO rating just in case you missed it.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/TECH/fun.games/07/27/game.lawsuit.ap/index.html

Australia seems more prone to banning things than other places. For example, it's the only place in the world to ban Salvia Divinorum, or 'Diviner's Sage', after people tried using it as a party drug with bad consequences.

Apparently it's also banned in New York now and I think maybe California though I am not sure about that one.

on subject: This war on violence in video games is high retarded. Ther are problem in this world we should actually be paying attention to people. Gah! Hillary and anyone else who supports legislation like this really need a good hard slap across the face.

Apparently it's also banned in New York now and I think maybe California though I am not sure about that one.
:rolleyes:

We most certainly have not banned GTA:SA here in California.

2/3 of the game is based on California for crying out loud. :D We embrace it!

"Hey look! That's my grandmother's house!"
"The one with the Mexican shooting at me?"
"That would be my uncle"

Australia is now offical on my Axis of Evil list, under the Totalitarian section. ;)


Yeah I was actually considering going to Austrailia on my honeymoon next year. Now I'm boycotting it.

:rolleyes:

We most certainly have not banned GTA:SA here in California.

2/3 of the game is based on California for crying out loud. :D We embrace it!

"Hey look! That's my grandmother's house!"
"The one with the Mexican shooting at me?"
"That would be my uncle"

NO I'm talking about Salvia Divinorum in that particular sentence.

:rolleyes:

We most certainly have not banned GTA:SA here in California.

2/3 of the game is based on California for crying out loud. :D We embrace it!

"Hey look! That's my grandmother's house!"
"The one with the Mexican shooting at me?"
"That would be my uncle"

The poster would be refering to Salvia Divinorum.

What's next? I beg to dream not.


Next, ill download that game :D

GTA: SA is bad. This isn't: http://www.resistance.com/ethniccleansing/catalog.htm

GTA: SA is bad. This isn't: http://www.resistance.com/ethniccleansing/catalog.htm

holy shit that is fucking disgusting!

Congrats, Australia. GTA:SA warez has just quadrupled in your part of the world.

This Dutch guy will go down as the person that destroyed video gaming.

This Dutch guy will go down as the person that destroyed video gaming.
right after jack thompson.

though, maybe this will stop the gaming industry from trying to turn every god damn game into a life simulator. Just because you try to make it a sim does not mean females will start playing it you stupid bastards. if I wanted to play life or a life simulator I would go buy the Sims or go the fuck outside and get a life

All this noise over a crappy video game. :rolleyes: When will people realize that controversy SELLS these sorts of products!

The best thing they can do is let capitalism quietly work. Let the turds float to the surface to get skimmed away naturally. *sigh*

Send E-mail to Jack Thompson: www.stopkill.com (http://www.stopkill.com)

Send E-mail to Jack Thompson: www.stopkill.com (http://www.stopkill.com)

Thompson has an arrogent, pissed-off attitude for people who sent messages to his email account.... Be careful.

I think the absolute opposite of what these people want to happen will happen, and I hope it does.

Trying to ban a game with such a massive, worldwide fan base as Grand Theft Auto by upping the rating will in the long run not do much. The average gamer is a 25-year-old male, fully 7 years above the requirements to order the now AO game. Orders will not simply halt. Then there are the millions who have already purchased the game.

What this leads to is not the diluting of violent videogames, but rather an acceptance of excessively violent and sexual games, such as our own beloved GTA. If GTA:SA remains successful, which there are few reasons for it not to, then what is to stop them from making another AO game for the GTA franchise? It is likely that if this "videogames are evil!" idea continues, then it will either be labeled AO without much consideration or need to be watered down to a drastic degree.

With a major developer churning out successful AO games, what is to stop others from following suit?

I'm surprised they've banned it here, censorship for films & things like that is usually fairly relaxed.

Well the Aussies have previously banned GTA3, Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude, BMX XXX, and Manhunt. So I'm not surprised.

[rant]

It's called Grand Theft Auto!

What were these people expecting?! Pink bunnies and rainbows?!

[/end rant]

NOOOOO!!!!! what the fuck is my country doing??? jesus christ!!! mein gott im himmel!!! thanks god i haved owned it and finished it before this bullshit happened. Fuck this shit!

I think the absolute opposite of what these people want to happen will happen, and I hope it does.

Trying to ban a game with such a massive, worldwide fan base as Grand Theft Auto by upping the rating will in the long run not do much. The average gamer is a 25-year-old male, fully 7 years above the requirements to order the now AO game. Orders will not simply halt. Then there are the millions who have already purchased the game.

Plus, people under 18 can just buy an AO game off ebay with no trouble at all.

Jack Thompson uses opportunity to call The Sims 2 a pedophille-gameJack Thompson is human garbage

Well the Aussies have previously banned GTA3, Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude, BMX XXX, and Manhunt. So I'm not surprised.

I wasn't aware of that! It's idiotic censorship, just because you can no longer legally buy it in shops, doesn't mean people can't get hold of it.

...just because you can no longer legally buy it in shops, doesn't mean people can't get hold of it.
See marijuana.

Ha, Australia, a former penal colony, banning a game depicting crime.

If I were there I'd take up arms in protest, oops, no I couldn't.

Socialism at it's best.

Ha, Australia, a former penal colony, banning a game depicting crime.

If I were there I'd take up arms in protest, oops, no I couldn't.

Socialism at it's best.
Australia is socialist?
News to me.
Really, I wasn’t aware they were in a transition state between capitalism and communism.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Im proud of my country, former penal colony as you see it, it at least has the heart to ban products that are harmful to our children, things that depict smut, being legally sold to them will give the message that we think its OK too. Our government cares about its young, yours seems to only care about profits.

Ihatevacations']right after jack thompson.Jack Thomson...Bastard...pedophile acuser...

Im proud of my country, former penal colony as you see it, it at least has the heart to ban products that are harmful to our children, things that depict smut, being legally sold to them will give the message that we think its OK too. Our government cares about its young, yours seems to only care about profits.

Because nevermind letting, you know, PARENTS raise their kids, that would just be to much work for them. There's a rating system, use it. Also you can't get to the sex without a mod which most "children" souldn't be able to get a hold of.

Shitty. That's all I have to say.

Oh, and... Fuck Howard. And Bush.

Now THAT'S funny...because here in Australia, I've rented and PLAYED GTA 3 and GTA: VC AND GTA: SA, no problem. I'm16, so I AM old enough to play. Last time I checked, all those games and more violent games were ready and waiting to be rented...

So what's all this talk about censorship and what-have-you? :confused:

Im proud of my country, former penal colony as you see it, it at least has the heart to ban products that are harmful to our children, things that depict smut, being legally sold to them will give the message that we think its OK too. Our government cares about its young, yours seems to only care about profits.

Why must the government get involved at all? Since when does the banning of a commercial product (that now can only be obtained by 18+ year olds) help the problem? GTA is not the only violent videogame out there. What about movies? And music. Let's ban whatever our soccer moms and politicians do not see fit.

"But, this is the only way to be sure that our children are protected from filth and smut!" Yes. Definitely the only way. Except for proper parenting, maybe.

EDIT: Legally being sold to children? The ESRB rating of M for Mature is the equivalent of an R rated film, meaning only those of 17 years and older can purchase the game. Therefore, if children are buying it, then it is NOT legally. Once again, proper parenting > extremist censorship.

Ha, Australia, a former penal colony, banning a game depicting crime.

If I were there I'd take up arms in protest, oops, no I couldn't.

Socialism at it's best.

I wish we were socialist. The former penal colony part is true, but not really relevant to (or reflective of) today's society.

You could take up arms in protest. Guns aren't banned in Aus, just restricted. I don't think I'd want you to though.

Shitty. That's all I have to say.

Oh, and... Fuck Howard. And Bush.
Must you bring President Bush into this discussion? I have no doubt that that civil authoritarian would be for this. However, he hasn’t publicly stated such views, unlike Hillary Clinton and Al Gore, who have.

On a side note, I just made myself very sad thinking about the current state of American politics. :(

Must you bring President Bush into this discussion? I have no doubt that that civil authoritarian would be for this. However, he hasn’t publicly stated such views, unlike Hillary Clinton and Al Gore, who have.

On a side note, I just made myself very sad thinking about the current state of American politics. :(

Sorry about forgetting to put the Clintons on that list... I don't like them, either. Censor-happy people are no friends of mine.

Fuck off, Billary.

I don't want my children to be corrupted by a sex scene! I mean, I don't want the wanton violence, picking up hookers, murder, drug use and the like to be interrupted by such smut!

c'mon Australia, it's not a game for kids.


:D nice very nice.

Sorry about forgetting to put the Clintons on that list... I don't like them, either. Censor-happy people are no friends of mine.

Fuck off, Billary.

Billary, I like that! :D

Because nevermind letting, you know, PARENTS raise their kids, that would just be to much work for them. There's a rating system, use it. Also you can't get to the sex without a mod which most "children" souldn't be able to get a hold of.

Parents might have ahard time explaining to their kids, that something approved by the government is wrong for a start.

Billary, I like that! :D
Yes, it does have a nice ring to it.
rents might have ahard time explaining to their kids, that something approved by the government is wrong for a start.
So, are you in favor of banning anything that you personally think is morally wrong?

Parents might have ahard time explaining to their kids, that something approved by the government is wrong for a start.

Not if the parents taught their kids a healthy distrust of government from day one.

We aren't very lucky here....because here games are considered purely for children, and therefore we don't actually have an Adult rating level....anything over "MA15" that is a game instantly gets banned....

But the silly thing is that anyone who wanted to play GTA:SA, would have. It was out for a long time before this...bit late guys!

Well the Aussies have previously banned GTA3, Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude, BMX XXX, and Manhunt. So I'm not surprised.
But Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude, BMX XXX, and Manhunt sucked. Why do you care?

Haha, I love how we ban games here, we only actually ban shit once the initial selling frenzy has died down. By now, every man and his dog actually has a copy of GTA : SA. As for the other games, I remember Manhunt getting marketed like gangbusters and only banned once it had finished selling, awesome [shit game though].

The whole thing a moot point though, any parent who relies on government bans and censorship ratings is obviously so lax about their parenting duties that the kid is going to be able to go online and download the game and the Hot Coffee mod [for those who didn't realise what the hoo-haa was really about] or get it from a friend anyway. Also, why don't they apply to R rating for movies to games as well here?

Haha, I love how we ban games here, we only actually ban shit once the initial selling frenzy has died down. By now, every man and his dog actually has a copy of GTA : SA. As for the other games, I remember Manhunt getting marketed like gangbusters and only banned once it had finished selling, awesome [shit game though].

The whole thing a moot point though, any parent who relies on government bans and censorship ratings is obviously so lax about their parenting duties that the kid is going to be able to go online and download the game and the Hot Coffee mod [for those who didn't realise what the hoo-haa was really about] or get it from a friend anyway. Also, why don't they apply to R rating for movies to games as well here?

Couldn't agree more.

Not if the parents taught their kids a healthy distrust of government from day one.

There is nothing healthy about being paranoid about your own governments intentions.

There is nothing healthy about being paranoid about your own governments intentions.

True, but then, nobody should have to be. It's a sad thought.

True, but then, nobody should have to be. It's a sad thought.

That depends on how you view your governments actions.
If you live in a democracy, you have very little to fear compared to say communist ones or dictatorships.
Just being aloud to post on here about your distrust, more than proves this.
The government was right to ban these games, would you want your kid playing something filled with smut?
Maybe you can control what your kid watches, but he\she can easily play it at a friends place, where the parents dont want to know what their kids do.

Fuck the government! They're not getting their hands on my GTA:SA game!!!

[edit]When the fuck did the Australian government become a nanny-state BTW?

That depends on how you view your governments actions.
If you live in a democracy, you have very little to fear compared to say communist ones or dictatorships.
Just being aloud to post on here about your distrust, more than proves this.
The government was right to ban these games, would you want your kid playing something filled with smut?
Maybe you can control what your kid watches, but he\she can easily play it at a friends place, where the parents dont want to know what their kids do.

1: In the "Democracy" I live in, there's plenty to fear. Abuse of power is one thing, but a lot of dickheads wanna change our constitution to make it so they can pretty much tell us what we can and can't do. And, there's nothing to fear in an actual Communism. You're thinking of Totalitarian regimes like those of Stalin, Mao, and Kim.

2: How does it "prove" anything? And, the government was wrong to ban the games. Censorship shouldn't be the government's job. It should be the parents'. And, for your information, I would definitely let my kids play something filled with such violence, language, and "smut". My dad let me do that, and I'm fine.

3: So what? Kids need to get a break from overbearing parents once in a while. It's not like watching porn before you're 18 will fuck you up.

[edit]When the fuck did the Australian government become a nanny-state BTW?

When they started getting "closer" to America, perhaps? I'm not certain, but this sounds logical...

When they started getting "closer" to America, perhaps? I'm not certain, but this sounds logical...

America became Australia's #1 ally after the fall of Singapore in WWII, I don't think we were always this much of a nanny nation. How's this for rotten gas, in 2030 cigarettes will be illegal in Australia...

America became Australia's #1 ally after the fall of Singapore in WWII, I don't think we were always this much of a nanny nation. How's this for rotten gas, in 2030 cigarettes will be illegal in Australia...

I'm all for placing high standards on the quality of cigarettes (so they aren't manufactured with poisons), but banning them? Ugh.

Fucking hell, eh?

I'm all for placing high standards on the quality of cigarettes (so they aren't manufactured with poisons), but banning them? Ugh.

Fucking hell, eh?
I know! If ciggies are banned then how the hell am I going to legalise majuarna?

I know! If ciggies are banned then how the hell am I going to legalise majuarna?

I dunno about this "majuarna" you speak of, but I'm really interested in legalising marijuana.

:p

America became Australia's #1 ally after the fall of Singapore in WWII, I don't think we were always this much of a nanny nation. How's this for rotten gas, in 2030 cigarettes will be illegal in Australia...

I'm a non-smoker & really detest cigarettes, but prohibition just doesn't work.

I'm a non-smoker & really detest cigarettes, but prohibition just doesn't work.

I don't smoke either, but I think it should be up to the individual. If we banned everything that killed us we'd ban alcohol, salt, butter, MacDonalds and a good deal of othe things so why should tobacco be so diffrent? I suppose in 2030 we'll see the rise of the Australian 'speak easy.'

I dunno about this "majuarna" you speak of, but I'm really interested in legalising marijuana.

:p

:p Don't mind my spelling, I'll just call it pot from now on. It's a bit harder to misspell pot. ;)

Bloody South Australia, it's legal there but they keep changing the laws. It's something like 5 plants or an ounce on your person, I dunno. If there is one group of people you don't want to be changing the laws on all the time it's regular pot smokers!

I don't smoke either, but I think it should be up to the individual. If we banned everything that killed us we'd ban alcohol, salt, butter, MacDonalds and a good deal of othe things so why should tobacco be so diffrent? I suppose in 2030 we'll see the rise of the Australian 'speak easy.'



:p Don't mind my spelling, I'll just call it pot from now on. It's a bit harder to misspell pot. ;)

Bloody South Australia, it's legal there but they keep changing the laws. It's something like 5 plants or an ounce on your person, I dunno. If there is one group of people you don't want to be changing the laws on all the time it's regular pot smokers!

In Victoria, possession of small amounts is not prosecuted. It's been quasi-decriminalised. I'm not sure about growing it though. I've heard you can have up to 5 plants, but I'm not sure if that's just an urban myth.

In Victoria, possession of small amounts is not prosecuted. It's been quasi-decriminalised. I'm not sure about growing it though. I've heard you can have up to 5 plants, but I'm not sure if that's just an urban myth.

Queensland has some of the harshest drug laws in the nation, good luck getting something over unless you live in a rural area.

Queensland has some of the harshest drug laws in the nation, good luck getting something over unless you live in a rural area.

Yeah, a friend of mine went up to Qld in the late 90s for a holiday & stayed with some people up there. Their house got raided by the police & they got busted & charged for just having a bong in the house. They were very lucky, because they'd smoked all their dope. If they cops had raided them a couple of hours earlier, they would have been really in trouble.

The government was right to ban these games, would you want your kid playing something filled with smut?
Maybe you can control what your kid watches, but he\she can easily play it at a friends place, where the parents dont want to know what their kids do.

What you fail to understand is that these games are not meant for children. They are like an R rated film, which means they are only for people ages 17+. If the parent feels that their child is mature enough to play, then they can buy them the game. That is their choice, and they are free in every way to make it. If I had a child, I would not want them to be naive and overly sheltered - that will never help him or her in life. If I believe that they are mature enough to play, then they can. Maturity means making playing games secondary to responsibilities, such as school - not being able to play without hurting someone else. Any person who does the latter and blames it on the evil that is videogames does not know the difference between right and wrong, and as such are mentally sick and do not belong in society to begin with. And if a videogame will turn a person violent, why not movies? Why not gangster rap videos promoting sex, guns, and profanity? Why not cartoons of Fudd shooting a wide, gaping hole in Donald Duck’s chest with a double-barreled shotgun? Why not the daily news of bombings, car crashes, theft, rape, and murder?

So a child can play a violent game at a friend’s house. Does that mean it is now no longer the parent's responsibility to know what the child is doing while at the friend's house? That it is no longer their responsibility to talk to the other child's parents about such issues if they feel so strongly?

Government-enforced censorship should now and always be a last resort to deal with something that can be truly damaging. Not a movie, not a song, not a cartoon, not a news station, and not a game.

All I can say is I LOVE GTA SAN ANDREAS I CROSSED THE BRIDGES TODAY AFTER WORK =-=- Yes the ones in the game -=-=-** forth rail + road bridges from FIFE scotland **( I WORK ON TUGS MOVING SUB'S AND AIR CRAFT CARRIERS ABOUT) And it makes me feel proud to know the bridges where I grew up are in a compuer game, Fair enough I agree it does need a rating sticker because it does show violence ( doesnt promote it ) and sex scenes - but it does show normal folk taking care of smack dealers - the police dont seem to stop them much so as you do you kick their smelly arses out of town like they do in the game !!!!

We don't promote IT (heroin) its the dirty dirty stuff and I swear the last person I know that tried to sell it in a rougher part of town was Ooooused out of his home because its not right ..... AT ALLLL ... he is in jail because of us :)

Banning it is a bit crazy but its up to them - but the game is fun for older folks :D

Screw the spelling im drunk

ATTENTION AMERICA.

Please keep the opinions and beliefs of your christian-nazi's, irresponsible parents who can't watch over their own children and politicians who just want to win votes among said groups within your own country, and from interfering from my right as an adult to play this game if I want to.

That is all.

GTA: SA is bad. This isn't: http://www.resistance.com/ethniccleansing/catalog.htm
jesus

I'm just glad I got my copy of GTA: SA within the month it came out.

ATTENTION AMERICA.

Please keep the opinions and beliefs of your christian-nazi's, irresponsible parents who can't watch over their own children and politicians who just want to win votes among said groups within your own country, and from interfering from my right as an adult to play this game if I want to.

That is all.

No one in America went to Australia to promote this. You guys did it all on your own.

No one in America went to Australia to promote this. You guys did it all on your own.

I'm sorry, my bad. If our leaders weren't performing fellatio on yours all the time, maybe this wouldn't have happened in the first place. :(

(In seriousness, without the "scandal" over there, this wouldn't have happened over here.)

Well the Aussies have previously banned GTA3, Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude, BMX XXX, and Manhunt. So I'm not surprised.


i know the guy who got manhunt banned in our country, his name is eddie griffiths and because he said it was too violent on tv they banned it, but i got him expelled from our skool so alls good now, i never got to play manhunt :(

whether we take up arms against the censors or not, they win. if we do, then they were right, it has made us violent. if we dont, then they were right, it has made us better.

its like lisa claiming the rock kept lions away on the simpsons

blackhorn,

dont worry, manhunt was a really shitty plot with lame graphics. it wasnt worth the bandwidth i used to download it(and my excess bandwidth is free)

Actually, on the plus side, i've now got an excuse to just download this from emule or bittorrent or something.

It's ironic that the banning of GTA:SA got more of a public response than the over the top powers given to ASIO recently. There's so many more important battles for freedom to fight in this country, the removal of ratings of a game because of a root scene, although stupid, isn't really high on my list offences against liberty (I do think it's wrong though).

Australia is becoming too much like some country we know of.
Given the small well-controlled population, it's worse ...

Hang on, I live in Australia ...

:eek:

Now THAT'S funny...because here in Australia, I've rented and PLAYED GTA 3 and GTA: VC AND GTA: SA, no problem. I'm16, so I AM old enough to play. Last time I checked, all those games and more violent games were ready and waiting to be rented...

So what's all this talk about censorship and what-have-you? :confused:

Later that day...

OMG, my video rental confirmed the worst!

GTA:SA IS NOW NOT AVAILABLE FOR RENT OR PURCHASE!

AAAAAAAAAAAAAARGH! :headbang: :headbang:

I'm not a fan or advocate of video game piracy, but I guess that is now the only option for people that want GTA:SA in Austrlia.

I remember a few years back, the Postal games were banned over here. I had to buy an import version from the USA...

I guess it's just another example of the conservative, right-wing, moral crusader shift Australia is taking (thanks "honest" John). We kowtow to our USA "masters" in more ways than one. :(

I guess we have rename Australia now.
How about the United State of Australia.

What is with all the comparisons to the US? You guys banned it. We haven’t even come close to completely banning anything like that for the adult population.

And, there's nothing to fear in an actual Communism.


Sigh..makes me sad. Apparently GTA:SA takes precedence over reading.
-Digs out copy of Communist Manifesto from req'd freshman year at college-
Growing up in your very free society, you have plenty to fear from communism, that is unless you were born into it and never knew anything better.

You wouldn't even be able buy your own copy of GTA, for a few reasons:
1) most communist states are very corrupt and the money never trickles past the government.
1a) even if you had the money..don't you think buying food would be more important?
1b) where in the world would you have to room to put your 72" plasma screen anyway to hook the game up to? (just pointing that out to be satirical, just in case you missed it)
2) haha..forgot already, you don't own anything!
3)how long until you were arrested for having a copy of the game in your house?

By Marx's theoretical communism, or even the real-world as applied in recent times communism you have plenty to fear. At least then there would be no worries about banning of GTA:SA

I'm not against the game, I just fear people will spend too much time playing this game and games like it. I also noticed it seems to draw more attention now and the entire point was moot. I love politics! (more sarcasm). Eh, just as well that I've already beat the game.

[QUOTE=Le MagisValidus]What you fail to understand is that these games are not meant for children. They are like an R rated film, which means they are only for people ages 17+.

So whats stopping the 17 yr old from letting his younger brother play it, with todays irresponsible slack jawed want everything for nothing or I'll whine like a bitch 24/7 youth, not much.



If the parent feels that their child is mature enough to play, then they can buy them the game. That is their choice, and they are free in every way to make it.

So if you thought your 12 year old was mature enough you would let them view X rated porn, some parent you are.

If I had a child, I would not want them to be naive and overly sheltered - that will never help him or her in life.

Neither does exposing them to excessive porn or any porn in your house with your blessing.


Any person who does the latter and blames it on the evil that is videogames does not know the difference between right and wrong, and as such are mentally sick and do not belong in society to begin with. And if a videogame will turn a person violent, why not movies? Why not gangster rap videos promoting sex, guns, and profanity? Why not cartoons of Fudd shooting a wide, gaping hole in Donald Duck’s chest with a double-barreled shotgun? Why not the daily news of bombings, car crashes, theft, rape, and murder?

Games like this give the user control of whats happenning in them, they make the decisions, they get to kill people in a variety of ways, and are even congratulated by voice overs, one for instance I watched showed people being run over, any people not just crims, by game user, and getting points for doing so.
Is this what you call encouraging maturity?
Sick.


So a child can play a violent game at a friend’s house. Does that mean it is now no longer the parent's responsibility to know what the child is doing while at the friend's house? That it is no longer their responsibility to talk to the other child's parents about such issues if they feel so strongly?

Thats good, by all means tell little Johnny he cant go to so and so's house any more, because his parents don't give a shit about what their kids watch.

Government-enforced censorship should now and always be a last resort to deal with something that can be truly damaging.

Thats why their happenning.


Not a movie, not a song, not a cartoon, not a news station, and not a game.

What then?

I guess we have rename Australia now.
How about the United State of Australia.

How about the country that cares more about kids than profits.

What is with all the comparisons to the US? You guys banned it. We haven’t even come close to completely banning anything like that for the adult population.

Well, it wouldn't be banned if the US kicked up a fuss. Australia has this stupid habit of copying everything US including banning things and the debate on abortion. Our PM is "best buddies holding hands" with your President too.

America became Australia's #1 ally after the fall of Singapore in WWII, I don't think we were always this much of a nanny nation. How's this for rotten gas, in 2030 cigarettes will be illegal in Australia...

So you support companies that make huge profits from killing people slowly with their cancer giving poisons?

Whatever happened to freedom of choice?

Maybe we should ban cars, tobacco, alcohol, adult movies and anything kids might get their hands on, but is not intended for them...

I's rather live in an overly permissive society than an overly restrictive society any day...

How about the country that cares more about kids than profits.

I dunno about that. Look at some of our commercial TV, it's worse than some of these computer games.

[QUOTE=Potaria]1: In the "Democracy" I live in, there's plenty to fear.


Only if your a useless crim, trust me you have no idea how lucky you are to have been born in a democracy.


Abuse of power is one thing, but a lot of dickheads wanna change our constitution to make it so they can pretty much tell us what we can and can't do.


The constitution does that anyway, your getting new laws to combat terrorism, if being searched randomly for abomb bothers you alot, ask anyone who recently just escaped with their lives from the 7/7 bombings how they feel now about searches for bombs.

And, there's nothing to fear in an actual Communism. You're thinking of Totalitarian regimes like those of Stalin, Mao, and Kim.

Who were Communist, maybe not your dreamy Karl Marx, but thats what they considered themselves to be.
'Your Communism' is a pipe dream also, it will never happen.




2: How does it "prove" anything? And, the government was wrong to ban the games. Censorship shouldn't be the government's job. It should be the parents'.

The governments liable as it makes a profit from these games.
What profit do your parents make?


And, for your information, I would definitely let my kids play something filled with such violence, language, and "smut". My dad let me do that, and I'm fine.

Well by not caring what your children watch and absorb in your own house, or their friends houses, proves your far from fine.


3: So what? Kids need to get a break from overbearing parents once in a while. It's not like watching porn before you're 18 will fuck you up.

Responsible parents are not overbearing, heres a tip, take your couch potatos away from the screen, give their brains a break from being fried by endless hours of screen staring, and take them down the local park and play soccer or ball with them.
Guarentee if you show genuine interest, they will soon prefer this to endlessly watching a monotonous screen.

I dunno about that. Look at some of our commercial TV, it's worse than some of these computer games.

Agreed, I don't know about worse, but some of the shows, especially ones that encourage homosexuality as normal behaviour leave alot to be desired.

some of the shows, especially ones that encourage homosexuality as normal behaviour leave alot to be desired.

Oh, really...

:rolleyes:

Oh, really...
:rolleyes:

Yes...really.

It's about time someone banned this game. It corrupts the youth with it;s violent, pro anarchistic and anti-police overtly-sexual refences.

Their should be a strict censorsship board for all games.

It's about time someone banned this game. It corrupts the youth with it;s violent, pro anarchistic and anti-police overtly-sexual refences.

Their should be a strict censorsship board for all games.

Know what else corrupts "the youth"? Coddling them and making them think they're in a sugar-coated world where nothing is bad.

Know what else corrupts "the youth"? Coddling them and making them think they're in a sugar-coated world where nothing is bad.

I agree with that, as soon as they go out into the real world they find they've been protected from the harsh realities so much that they can't deal with the real world.

I agree with that, as soon as they go out into the real world they find they've been protected from the harsh realities so much that they can't deal with the real world.

My point exactly.

I agree with that, as soon as they go out into the real world they find they've been protected from the harsh realities so much that they can't deal with the real world.
http://plif.andkon.com/archive/wc161.gif
http://plif.andkon.com/archive/wc209.gif

[QUOTE]
So whats stopping the 17 yr old from letting his younger brother play it, with todays irresponsible slack jawed want everything for nothing or I'll whine like a bitch 24/7 youth, not much.

How about proper parenting? Just as you do not allow the younger child to play, you do not allow the older child to let him also. Duh? And maybe you see a lot of children that "want everything for nothing" or "whine 24/7", but I am a firm believer in the need for punishment and discipline, and in such cases there seems to be a dire need for it. But let me guess - now you're going to say that we shouldn't yell at kids, but instead calmly explain to them that what they did was wrong over and over as they thumb their noses at their parents. Right?

[QUOTE]
So if you thought your 12 year old was mature enough you would let them view X rated porn, some parent you are.
If the child is mature enough, then yes. Children need to learn about sex sometime. My mother was as coddled as what you advocate, and she literally believed until she was 17 that women get pregnant by sitting on public toilets. Why? Because her mother was so overprotective of her that education was second to innocence. When I asked around 4 or 5 years of age how babies were made, my parents had already discussed between themselves about how they would answer - with the truth. Their response was, "Through sex. It is something that older people do - yes that thing you keep hearing about on TV - usually when they are married, sometimes when they are not, and sometimes the result is a baby." They, growing up in the 50s and 60s, were too conservative to actually show me a magazine or anything (American Pie style), but what they told me was very much sufficient because they knew that lying to me about how the world really is will not help me in any way.

[QUOTE]
Neither does exposing them to excessive porn or any porn in your house with your blessing.
An excessive amount of anything is unhealthy. But guess what - regardless of what you say or do to your little angel, nowadays, porn is a few clicks on a mouse or channel changer away. Are you going to be one of those Nazi parents that regulates every aspect of your child's life, from what movies they see to what sites they go to? THEY WILL SEE PORN, no matter what you do to stop it. It is natural curiosity. And it is better that if they see it early, they see it with guidance as to not get the wrong idea about what a relationship is about.


[QUOTE]
Games like this give the user control of whats happenning in them, they make the decisions, they get to kill people in a variety of ways, and are even congratulated by voice overs, one for instance I watched showed people being run over, any people not just crims, by game user, and getting points for doing so.
Is this what you call encouraging maturity?
Sick.
I never stated anything about maturity having to do with this, because anyone who cannot handle a videogame and equates that to real life is mentally unstable and should be removed from society. I specified maturity as playing videogames second to true responsibilities.


[QUOTE]
Thats good, by all means tell little Johnny he cant go to so and so's house any more, because his parents don't give a shit about what their kids watch.
Never a right answer with you, huh? So then what would you do? Because according to you, they will go to a friend's house and play evil videogames. But then according to you, you can't stop him from doing it either. So, I suppose it would be best for you to just get off your moral high horse and let a kid play a game.

[QUOTE]
Thats why their happenning.
They AREN'T damaging. Would you like to know how I know? Because no one (except for the mentally unstable as mentioned above) would kill people in real life because it was justified in a videogame. Even a 12-year-old has a sense of right and wrong, and will not be swayed to do things because he saw it in a videogame. As though none of that appears in music, videos, and movies, anyway.

But since I know that answer won't be satisfactory for you, how about because in the past 5 years with an onslaught of more violent and more graphic videogames, the number of violent crimes have been becoming consecutively lower, in fact now being at the lowest point in the past 30 years?

[QUOTE]
What then?
Something that IS damaging. Heroin and crack come to mind. But unneeded censorship of media and consumer products is unwarranted.

I don't give a flying crap about the sexual situations or the concept of violence in the game per se - Even Mario Brothers contains violence and sexual situations are on tv and other media all the time. As a parent, I do believe it is my responsibility to moniter what my children see, listen to and/or play.

What IS objectionable about this game is the TYPE of violence and sexual habits it advocates. And let's be honest - sure there are plenty of over 18's who want to think themselves still young and hip but the FACT is that regardless of the "M" rating, this game and almost all video games are marketed for children, not adults. GTA-SA advocates lawlessness, rape, attacks on police officers and murder of innocent bystanders. Why make the game from this perspective? Why not have the playable character be the police officers trying to stop the criminal? The player would have the same gaming experience without all the negative messages.

I believe the designers are highly irresponsible and I APPLAUD all the countries and states who have banned it as well as all the stores who have refused to sell the game.

I don't give a flying crap about the sexual situations or the concept of violence in the game per se - Even Mario Brothers contains violence and sexual situations are on tv and other media all the time. As a parent, I do believe it is my responsibility to moniter what my children see, listen to and/or play.

What IS objectionable about this game is the TYPE of violence and sexual habits it advocates. And let's be honest - sure there are plenty of over 18's who want to think themselves still young and hip but the FACT is that regardless of the "M" rating, this game and almost all video games are marketed for children, not adults. GTA-SA advocates lawlessness, rape, attacks on police officers and murder of innocent bystanders. Why make the game from this perspective? Why not have the playable character be the police officers trying to stop the criminal? The player would have the same gaming experience without all the negative messages.

I believe the designers are highly irresponsible and I APPLAUD all the countries and states who have banned it as well as all the stores who have refused to sell the game.
There are million games out there where you play a law enforcement officer. Sometimes people want to see a story (or play a game) from a different perspective. The GTA series is popular for a reason.

I don't see why my freedoms as to what video games I can play should be impugned upon by the vocal moral minority. The game HAS an age rating. If parents are concerned, don't let your kids play it, it's that simple. I'm not a minor, and I should have the right to play the game if I choose to.

It's the same mentality behind this ban as those who blame music and movies for some kids antisocial behaviour...perhaps because some people use cars irresponsibly, all motor vehicles should be banned?

So.... Anyone else here think Gessler may be a troll?





Gessler, if you really cared, you'd know that you can't reach through to people on message boards. Come on. The way to get through to a person is not to act like a televangelist. Come on. Who in the world uses the word "smut" anymore. And people who use the word "homosexuality and taught" in the same sentence, just get people mad. You're on a board that is mostly culturally liberal. Your words aren't falling on deaf ears, but you ARE getting people to roll their eyes at you.

Ok, id like hilary clinton to be our next president, but if she launches something that bans video games outright because parents are concerned there might be secrets in them, IM BUYING ME A SNIPER RIFLE!

[QUOTE=Uginin]So.... Anyone else here think Gessler may be a troll?

I'm not a troll. :rolleyes:




Gessler, if you really cared, you'd know that you can't reach through to people on message boards.

I do care, and if I can get even one person to see how wrong left and libertarian views are, and how damaging they are to society, then I'll die a happy man.

Come on. Who in the world uses the word "smut" anymore.
Its what ever its called, new names dont change the subject.

And people who use the word "homosexuality and taught" in the same sentence, just get people mad. You're on a board that is mostly culturally liberal. Your words aren't falling on deaf ears, but you ARE getting people to roll their eyes at you.

So what, anyone who thinks my views are wrong, I roll my eyes at them, because I know they are healthy ones.

this game and almost all video games are marketed for children, not adults.


This is why I want to shoot whiny liberals in the head (irony!)

You get some stupid ****, Hillary Clinton, to be wasting YOUR tax paying dollars to investigate the source of a FICTIONAL 3D POLYGONS MACKING IT OTHER. And the best part is, you accept this.

The average gamer's age is 29. That means the biggest market isn't teens, but ADULTS.

Show me a sign where Rockstar games has marketed the GTA series for KIDS and NOT adults.

blackhorn,

dont worry, manhunt was a really shitty plot with lame graphics. it wasnt worth the bandwidth i used to download it(and my excess bandwidth is free)

Plotline, Manhunt was good.

The game and graphics sucked shit though.

[QUOTE]I do care, and if I can get even one person to see how wrong left and libertarian views are, and how damaging they are to society, then I'll die a happy man.


You are very twisted. If you dislike left and libertarianism, that means you like Right Populism, which is basically totalitarianism.

[QUOTE=Gessler]


You are very twisted. If you dislike left and libertarianism, that means you like Right Populism, which is basically totalitarianism.
Indeed. Totalitarianism and overgoverning has done far more harm to society than extreme liberalism ever has. Honestly, would people rather live in a Naziesque regime or a hippy commune with no rules? :p

[QUOTE=Gessler]
You are very twisted. If you dislike left and libertarianism, that means you like Right Populism, which is basically totalitarianism.

No, Im slightly right of centre in politics.

[QUOTE=Uginin]

No, Im slightly right of centre in politics.

No, George Bush is slightly right of center. I don't hear him saying we should ban video games or that he's trying to ban porn. He knows that the country was founded on freedom, and that our constitution protects freedom. We don't ban things that don't immediately harm people.

Heck, he's even okay with civil unions and I hear that Austin Powers is one of his favorite movies.

And this is coming from someone who doesn't even really like the guy. I mean, I respect the guy, but he didn't get my vote. I voted for Badnarik. The way you've been talking, I'd assume you voted for the Constitution Party, which is a scary party.

[QUOTE=Uginin]
Indeed. Totalitarianism and overgoverning has done far more harm to society than extreme liberalism ever has. Honestly, would people rather live in a Naziesque regime or a hippy commune with no rules? :p

Actually, I'm not a fan of liberalism. It's all restrictions and bans. Just doing it to different things than conservatives. Populism is all about giving the whining people what they want. I'm a moderate libertarian myself. Basically, I feel that people should leave me alone and go get a life.

[QUOTE=Uginin]
No, George Bush is slightly right of center. I don't hear him saying we should ban video games or that he's trying to ban porn.
Not yet anyway.

[QUOTE]
Not yet anyway.


Actually, I've never really heard Republicans wanting to ban games and movies. Those seem to mainly be Democrats that lean towards populism and special interest groups like the NAACP, Greenpeace, and PETA. And yes, PETA and Greenpeace have tried to stop movies from being filmed before. The NAACP has stopped Song of The South being released on video. That really makes me angry. It's a G rated movie for cryin' out loud!

I think Bush is more concerned with other things. Doesn't have time to worry about shredding people's rights like Hillary does.