NationStates Jolt Archive

Okay, you are about to have a fight with a rival/bully/drunken lout. It's NOT going to be a friendly fight. But it's not a fight for survival, either.

So, where do you draw the line? Do you fight honorably? Do you take your cue from your opponent? Do you take a 'whatever works' approach? How dirty do you fight? Low Blows? Eye gouging? Hair pulling? Kneecap kicking?

I've always fought rough and dirty. Even in friendly fights. But unless I am fighting for survival, I draw the line at things like eye gouging. ANd the knees. I don't kick or strike an opponent's knees. I'm odd that way. I'd kick my best friend in the nuts, but I wouldn't kick my bitterest rival in the knee.

Of course, if I thought my life was in danger, the rulebook goes right out the window.

Depending on how strong/well armed the oponent is, either wrestle him or her to the ground and pin him or her there, or kick the person in the crotch and run away, in the hopes that if it's a woman it'll hurt enough too...

Depending on how strong/well armed the oponent is, either wrestle him or her to the ground and pin him or her there, or kick the person in the crotch and run away, in the hopes that if it's a woman it'll hurt enough too...

It will hurt. QUite a bit. Enough... maybe, maybe not.

It will hurt. QUite a bit. Enough... maybe, maybe not.Read about it in a Bond novel. If you kick hard enough, she might be incapacitated long enough for you to make a break for it.

Drop them and run...

ANd the knees. I don't kick or strike an opponent's knees. I'm odd that way. I'd kick my best friend in the nuts, but I wouldn't kick my bitterest rival in the knee.

Yeah. Unless it's a matter of survival. Kicking someone in the knees can leave them unable to walk normally for the rest of their lives. Bad stuff that.

I haven't fought as an adult, so I can't say. And besides, it's not like a five-year old girl couldn't beat me, anyway.

Act like I'm going to walk away then sucker him with a backfist to the center of his face with all my weight behind it, sort of a spinning backfist a risky move but potentially a fight ender, or if its going to start with him shoving me lock his palms to my chest and jump back ...from that the LAPD choke until he's out. Eye gouge or ear rip only as a last resort (do you know how easy it is to pull an ear off? A quick yank and a spray of blood and *POP* ) Knees and nuts are fair game from the get go.


Okay, you are about to have a fight with a rival/bully/drunken lout. It's NOT going to be a friendly fight. But it's not a fight for survival, either.

So, where do you draw the line? Do you fight honorably? Do you take your cue from your opponent? Do you take a 'whatever works' approach? How dirty do you fight? Low Blows? Eye gouging? Hair pulling? Kneecap kicking?

I've always fought rough and dirty. Even in friendly fights. But unless I am fighting for survival, I draw the line at things like eye gouging. ANd the knees. I don't kick or strike an opponent's knees. I'm odd that way. I'd kick my best friend in the nuts, but I wouldn't kick my bitterest rival in the knee.

Of course, if I thought my life was in danger, the rulebook goes right out the window.

I don't think I'd try to go for the eyes in an ordinary fight, but I see no problem with kicking the knees out, kicking the groin, or breaking/dislocating limbs. Ya gotta do what ya gotta do, and that's the way I was trained to fight, so that's what's going to come out.

I've choked guys unconscious twice in street fights. That's pretty effective. If you know how to do it right they lose consciousness in less than a minute and you can let go of them and leave as soon as they go limp. If it's done right they're almost certainly going to regain consciousness.

This subject sort of came up after a friendly fight with the new guy at our rugby game. He seems to think we fight too dirty and too rough. Probably because he got his ass kicked. :p

I wouldnt rule out anything in a fight but i would only use groin strikes, kicks to the knee, etc if they were necessary to weaken the attacker before either throwing them or getting in a quick arm lock.

If the attacker was drunk I wouldnt attempt any pain submissions i.e. arm and leg locks, etc because they probably wont feel it as much as a sober person. In a drunks case a quick leg sweep would be the best I would hope for as after that they arent in any position to hurt you

every fight is a totally different set of circumstances, however being able to reckongise what the stages are before a fight will help you immensly.

The way I do it is thus, be aware of your surroundings and pay attention to what is happening. If anything develops you should be able to identify your options (such as being able to run away, motives, weapons, accomplaces etc).

If you cannot diffuse the situation by bluffing your way out, way up if you can run away unharmed or if violence is needed.

If violence is neccessary (rarely ime) then you need to be the vilest, loudest absolut animal there is, you need to go for this person so fucking hard that you appear to be a wild beast. The reason for this? if it has gotton to the stage that violence is needed, its pretty sure that the other person is used to fighting, they (possibly) are expecting you to have a fear response and to act like a victim. By being a bloodthirsty sickening madman you will put THEM on guard, they will (usually ime) not know how to handle you and you can get the vital first few blows in. It also will shock any potential accomplaces into not kicking the shit out of you whilst you are on the ground etc.

I train in diffusion and then hitting as fucking hard as I can to a one of a few selected spots (usually the side of the head), to a point now that I can bluff my way past experience fighters defenses when they are expecting to be hit by me (reality based training).

been training with various (fairly) well known peeps and picked up vital tips for fighting, such as Keep It Simple Stupid (KISS) and the pre-fight interview (Geoff Thompson).

All in all I've managed to avoid my potential violent conflicts, and resolved those precious few others within a split second.


Hope this doesn't come across as boasting, to keep this post within the bounds of the question:

if its a serious fight, rip his ears off (easy to do) and eat them, that usually stops it quickly ;)

I tend to wrap my cheap chunky wristwatch around my knuckles if I see one coming

This subject sort of came up after a friendly fight with the new guy at our rugby game. He seems to think we fight too dirty and too rough. Probably because he got his ass kicked. :p

Rugby fights are all about standing there throwing haymakers, until all your team mates get involved and try and break it up (or join in).

If somebody attacks me, I assume he's out to kill me. It's too dangerous to assume otherwise. This justifies the use of any force necessary to stop him. In a fight for my life, my only rule is to win. I don't stop to worry about what it might cost the other guy; he should have worried about that himself before attacking me. So I'll do whatever it takes to stop him. If I have to use crippling or deadly force to do that, too bad for him.

:p

I'm a biter.

I'm a biter.

If blood gets in your mouth, you could get a disease like AIDS.

If blood gets in your mouth, you could get a disease like AIDS.

A small price to pay for having a truly great collection of noses and ears.

Meh. The last time I got into a fight was middle school...most of my fights simply consisted of me throwing the other guy in a headlock...
If someone attacked me now, though, I'd be forced to pepper spray him or her and then break a few fingers.
Lacking such weaponry, or if the person is abnormally tall, a swift kick the nutsack is in ordder...and I don't feel sorry about it. :p

i'll fight one on one only fist to fist, fair fight, i miss the days when it was one on one instead of this gang shit

5 on to 1 is not fair!!

Fight to incapicate, escalate force as necessary.
I don't get in fights much though, so the only thing I have usually needed to do in the past is stand up.
This is due to the fact I'm 6'9" and ~140 kgs (205cm and ~310 pounds) though.

In such a situation, the only thing I personally would not do is eye-gouging.

Everything else is fair game.

I don't really have much fighting expereince, nothing but a couple of scrappy brawls in primary (grade) school. Personally though, I am for a clean fight, which means no groin area, no eye-gouging or hair pulling. As far as the knees are concerned, I'm all for it. Though, I must admit that if I am in a fight, it's for show and a kick to the knees will look like a skilled move and impress much of your audience. Also, if you're taking on more than one guy the eyes and groin is open game. Hair pulling is reserved for hottie cat fights only :)

A fight is a fight. But every fight is different. It's not very useful to try to establish rules like "I never gouge people's eyes," because sometimes you will have to (assuming you get into a lot of fights.) However, as something to try to avoid, well, I avoid anything with a high risk of permanent incapacitation. If you have only one opponent, then throws and locks will give you time to run for it. Otherwise, well, I've never faced more than one opponent in a serious fight.

Rules are useless, because you can never accurately predict a fight, but guidelines a good thing.

I hate fighting.
Absolutely hate it.
Consequently, I do everything I can to avoid them.
However, sometimes, even all the talking in the world cant get you out of a fight with some drunken asshole, or someone out to prove how tough he is.

So...If pushed into a fight, I have no compunctions about letting the person who has pushed me into a fight, the full course of my displeasure.

Ive been in a handful of scrapes, and everytime, I did everything I could do avoid them, however.....there are no rules when someone wants to do you harm.

Now that Ive given my philosophy on fighting...
The last fight I was at a party my friend threw, and a co-worker he had invited showed up and took an intsant dislike to me, and the drunker he got, the more he decided I sucked for some reason.
So, when he finally declared his intention to "whoop my ass", I told him that out of my respect for my friend, I wasnt going to fight him in my friends house, and I that I had no reason want to fight him anyway.
That wasnt good enough, and we went outside.
He went to punch me, and was pretty drunk, and ny this time, I was kinda pissed, so I threw him to the ground, and kicked him in the face, wich smashed his nose pretty good.
Lot of blood.

Blackened both his eyes as well.

It was over, just like that.

It didnt make me feel very good, and I regret that it happened.

But....if you try to hurt me....Im gonna do everything I can to do two things:

1. Make you regret your decision.
2. Ensure you dont ever want to try again.

Depending on how strong/well armed the oponent is, either wrestle him or her to the ground and pin him or her there, or kick the person in the crotch and run away, in the hopes that if it's a woman it'll hurt enough too...
*Nods*

If i can win ill fight fair if i am 75/25 ill break out Harlesburg rules
Rule Number One:Their are no rules.

To add to my last post:

"A fair fight, is one you could have avoided."

Fight to incapicate, escalate force as necessary.
I don't get in fights much though, so the only thing I have usually needed to do in the past is stand up.
This is due to the fact I'm 6'9" and ~140 kgs (205cm and ~310 pounds) though.Ooh! Intimidation is always useful for staying healthy!

Well I can't really say I have experience, but if I had no choice, like someone just started on me then I'd mainly try to push them away. If I had to fight, I wouldn't do anything like hair pulling, biting, kicking guys in the groin, gouging eyes, that stuff, unless it was a survival thing. Then, I wouldn't hold back from any of those things...

Well I can't really say I have experience, but if I had no choice, like someone just started on me then I'd mainly try to push them away. If I had to fight, I wouldn't do anything like hair pulling, biting, kicking guys in the groin, gouging eyes, that stuff, unless it was a survival thing. Then, I wouldn't hold back from any of those things...
Hey
*Waves*
You have been TGed!

Hey
*Waves*
You have been TGed!

Umm, no I haven't... :confused:

uh,...certainly an interesting thread topic. I don't like to fight and have not done so in a long time. :)

Umm, no I haven't... :confused:
Er sorry you are part of a School Class and canna recieve TG's :(

Wel thats a Kick in the teeth Lashie goes offline. :(

Wel thats a Kick in the teeth Lashie goes offline. :(

Aww, I'm sorry... if you want to TG me then you can at Sylli, cause that's my other nation

Gouging of the eyes is where I draw the line.

And, if some dolt tried to kick my kneecaps, well... I wouldn't be too moved by it, to say the least.

Fights are dangerous. They can escalate quickly into life/death situations. Keep control of the situation using distance, timing, verbage, and body language.

If a fight is unavoidable you need to size up your opponent and respond with appropriate force needed for the situation. If your opponent is twice your size, pull out all the stops and put them away as quickly and efficiently as possible.

It is your opponent and your situation determines your response.

Sometimes the best way to win a fight is to simply avoid being hit. It takes a lot of work, but it does effectively contain your problem, convincing them of the futility of conflict. Other times you need to damage your opponent in such a way as to prevent them from attacking you; joint locks, joint breaks, pressure points, and pain. Other times you're too evenly matched to try such methods; then you must fight to the best of your ability.

Fights are dangerous. They can escalate quickly into life/death situations. Keep control of the situation using distance, timing, verbage, and body language.

If a fight is unavoidable you need to size up your opponent and respond with appropriate force needed for the situation. If your opponent is twice your size, pull out all the stops and put them away as quickly and efficiently as possible.

It is your opponent and your situation determines your response.

Sometimes the best way to win a fight is to simply avoid being hit. It takes a lot of work, but it does effectively contain your problem, convincing them of the futility of conflict. Other times you need to damage your opponent in such a way as to prevent them from attacking you; joint locks, joint breaks, pressure points, and pain. Other times you're too evenly matched to try such methods; then you must fight to the best of your ability.

Forgive me, but that sounds like a very academic assessment of fighting, and not truly a practical one.

Forgive me, but that sounds like a very academic assessment of fighting, and not truly a practical one.

Why, yes it is an academic approach. However, I don't see any flaws in its practicality...Can you point them out for me?

Or is something wrong with taking science and applying it to a fight?

Why, yes it is an academic approach. However, I don't see any flaws in its practicality...Can you point them out for me?

Or is something wrong with taking science and applying it to a fight?

Oh No....theres nothing wrong at all with taking scientific assessments of fighting. The Chinese have ben doing it for 3000 years.

Well..most unarmed fights happen very quickly.
Too quickly in fact, to make such prolific assessments.

About 90% of fistfights end up on the ground.
So prolonged fisticuffs just arent usually the way things happen unless both men are skilled boxers.

Someone is going down..and the other guy usually jumps on top of him.
Or more likely..they start wrestling, and end up on the ground.

Thats why the armed forces these days instructs its soldiers, in Brazillian Ju-jitsu.

Royce Gracie style....

Fall down...wrap your legs, or arms around the guys neck...and choke him the hell out.

Now that Ive given my philosophy on fighting...
The last fight I was at a party my friend threw, and a co-worker he had invited showed up and took an intsant dislike to me, and the drunker he got, the more he decided I sucked for some reason.
So, when he finally declared his intention to "whoop my ass", I told him that out of my respect for my friend, I wasnt going to fight him in my friends house, and I that I had no reason want to fight him anyway.
That wasnt good enough, and we went outside.
He went to punch me, and was pretty drunk, and ny this time, I was kinda pissed, so I threw him to the ground, and kicked him in the face, wich smashed his nose pretty good.
Lot of blood.

Blackened both his eyes as well.

It was over, just like that.

It didnt make me feel very good, and I regret that it happened.

But....if you try to hurt me....Im gonna do everything I can to do two things:

1. Make you regret your decision.
2. Ensure you dont ever want to try again.

For an example, lets apply my stated theories to your practical experience:

You tried to avoid the fight, using verbal comments and warnings, and taking care to avoid starting the fight in the house.

"Keep control of the situation using distance, timing, verbage, and body language."

I'm fairly confident that you positioned your body in a non-aggressive manner and didn't get up in his face when he started to take exception to you, right? Thus you were in control of the situation; the drunk was obviously not.

"If a fight is unavoidable you need to size up your opponent and respond with appropriate force needed for the situation."

You said you dodged the punch and threw him to the ground, beliving that the damage you had done would not be enough to convince him to stop you proceeded to press further by hitting his nose, a non-vital area that causes moderate pain and bleeds profusely, distracting your opponent with cleaning up his mess instead of fighting you.

You only mention his one attempted strike against you, so is it safe to assume you quickly put him out of the fight before he could build up any momentum?

Drunks are notoriously capable of taking damage to fleshy parts of their bodies, the alcohol acts as an anesthetic. By hitting a nose and perhaps swelling shut his eyes, you put him out of the fight without breaking limbs or damaging internal organs.

You didn't let him beat on you, meaning that for whatever reason he was not a more skillful fighter than you. Thus you moved prudently to end the fight before you had to hurt him more, and ensured your own safety by making sure he was too busy bleeding to attack you again.

That's the acedemic way of looking at a drunk getting kicked in the face. It simply uses language more suited for the classroom or the dojo than for daily life.

I think what we have here is a difference in timing. Most of the processes I describe happen in quarters of seconds, information is relayed to the brain which wills your body to respond, the better the training the more effective the response.

By stretching out the way we describe the fight, we can analyze WHY we fight the way we fight, and discover better ways to train and defend ourselves. That's why I describe a minute long brawl with a page of descriptions and examinations.

Its simply putting to words the actions that have already occured.

Hmm...well, If it's soft and squishy, it's a good place to hit. Even more so if it isn't soft, but can be made squishy.

I dont get into street fights, Im done with middle school. The only type of fight I might get in is a professional one, but in that case the rules are already written for me.

For an example, lets apply my stated theories to your practical experience:

You tried to avoid the fight, using verbal comments and warnings, and taking care to avoid starting the fight in the house.

"Keep control of the situation using distance, timing, verbage, and body language."

I'm fairly confident that you positioned your body in a non-aggressive manner and didn't get up in his face when he started to take exception to you, right? Thus you were in control of the situation; the drunk was obviously not.

"If a fight is unavoidable you need to size up your opponent and respond with appropriate force needed for the situation."

You said you dodged the punch and threw him to the ground, beliving that the damage you had done would not be enough to convince him to stop you proceeded to press further by hitting his nose, a non-vital area that causes moderate pain and bleeds profusely, distracting your opponent with cleaning up his mess instead of fighting you.

You only mention his one attempted strike against you, so is it safe to assume you quickly put him out of the fight before he could build up any momentum?

Drunks are notoriously capable of taking damage to fleshy parts of their bodies, the alcohol acts as an anesthetic. By hitting a nose and perhaps swelling shut his eyes, you put him out of the fight without breaking limbs or damaging internal organs.

You didn't let him beat on you, meaning that for whatever reason he was not a more skillful fighter than you. Thus you moved prudently to end the fight before you had to hurt him more, and ensured your own safety by making sure he was too busy bleeding to attack you again.

That's the acedemic way of looking at a drunk getting kicked in the face. It simply uses language more suited for the classroom or the dojo than for daily life.


LOL

For some reason..that was funny...

Well..you make it sound like it was a cold, calculated strategy on my part.
It wasnt really..the whole thing unfolded in a few minutes.

The guy was drunk, yes..but not incapacitated.
He swung on me, but by the time his punch would have connected with me..i was already too close for it to do much of anything.
That wasnt stategy on my part..just reflex due to wanting to get ahold of him.

It was very quick, yes.
He didnt have time to build any momentum, no.
Thats probably because he was holding his face screaming.
I wear some heavy boots, you see...
There ws a soft *crunch* and lots of blood...he didnt want to fight anymore.

Again..not really skill on my part..just a deliberate intention to end it quickly.

Ive taken a smattering of some styles, and if I had wanted to restrain him, I may have been able to do so.
I didnt...so I broke his nose instead.
I felt like a shithead for a long time afterwards.

In retrospect, its safe to say that a scientific approach can be useful for staying in control of a fight situation, but only if your are proficient with a style, or capable of doing some real damage to another person.
Im not Jet Li..so I did what I could do.

Okay, you are about to have a fight with a rival/bully/drunken lout. It's NOT going to be a friendly fight. But it's not a fight for survival, either.

So, where do you draw the line? Do you fight honorably? Do you take your cue from your opponent? Do you take a 'whatever works' approach? How dirty do you fight? Low Blows? Eye gouging? Hair pulling? Kneecap kicking?

I've always fought rough and dirty. Even in friendly fights. But unless I am fighting for survival, I draw the line at things like eye gouging. ANd the knees. I don't kick or strike an opponent's knees. I'm odd that way. I'd kick my best friend in the nuts, but I wouldn't kick my bitterest rival in the knee.

Of course, if I thought my life was in danger, the rulebook goes right out the window.


As a gentleman i try to fight honourably at all times, any thing else just simply isn't cricket.

Gouging of the eyes is where I draw the line.

And, if some dolt tried to kick my kneecaps, well... I wouldn't be too moved by it, to say the least.
Youd go down like a sack of shit.

Aww, I'm sorry... if you want to TG me then you can at Sylli, cause that's my other nation
Ill do that.

I use the The Marquis of Queensberry Rules.



Oh... and we're not supposed to talk about fight club.

LOL

For some reason..that was funny...

Well..you make it sound like it was a cold, calculated strategy on my part.
It wasnt really..the whole thing unfolded in a few minutes.

-snip-

In retrospect, its safe to say that a scientific approach can be useful for staying in control of a fight situation, but only if your are proficient with a style, or capable of doing some real damage to another person.
Im not Jet Li..so I did what I could do.

Exactamundo. Its just a way of picking apart the fight into its component pieces, I don't actually think you saw the punch coming and stood around thinking, "How to best use this against him...Hmm....Ah! I'll throw him to the ground and stomp on him. That will ensure the fight concludes with a modicum of danger!"

Nah, you reacted as best you could. That's called self-defense. If you feel bad about how you performed you can try training in some martial art or another to prepare for the future. Otherwise, you probably did the best you could given your situation.

This about this; if you tried to restrain him and failed, he might have built up momentum. In a drunk, momentum is DANGEROUS. They can become impervious to pain as adrenaline and alchohol mix in their blood, you could have split his nose down the middle and he might not have noticed it. You would have been at an extreme disadvantage against an opponent with a 40 proof anesthetic running through his viens.

I'm train a couple of students in a practically useless combat style; swordsmanship. By itself, sword training does not make you very dangerous in a street brawl. But the underlying principles, tactics, and concepts that make swordfighting effective allows a person to take control of a fight.

Thus I push the fundementals of swordsmanship and combat in my training, not so much the specific techniques. For my students, that gives them the tools they need, and the respect for strategy that makes them avoid needless fights. So far, so good in the respect.

You know..I used to know a girl who's grandmother taught Tai Chi.
She once wanted to give me a demonstation of some basic principles.
She told me that, when I was ready, I could open-hand slap her, or attempt to...

I attempted..and she delicately brushed aside my wrist, and locked my arm rather like Pai Mei from "Kill Bill".

It hurt.

Re-direction of motion.

A riposte, of you will.

Rule #1: I don't fight.

Rule #2: If you wanna fight me, I will fight with the whole arsenal of dirty tricks and use every opportunity that bears an advantage. There are no friendly fights.

...

Rule #2030482: If nothing else works, smack your opponent over the head with this rule book (weighs about 10 pounds and always works :D)

1. :headbang: generally works in close quarters......

2. if not try and :fluffle: generally scares the fuckers off

3. or stick a :upyours: up their :eek:

Take-down. Back Choke.

If possible, I'll try not to give him too much bruises and all, just incompasitate him for a few minutes and walk away.

just Make a bullet enter them at high speed. does The trick.

You know..I used to know a girl who's grandmother taught Tai Chi.
She once wanted to give me a demonstation of some basic principles.
She told me that, when I was ready, I could open-hand slap her, or attempt to...

I attempted..and she delicately brushed aside my wrist, and locked my arm rather like Pai Mei from "Kill Bill".

It hurt.

Re-direction of motion.

A riposte, of you will.

A good example of a "soft" form of martial art. Tai Chi is many generations removed from combat, and has a much greater focus on health, but the style remains applicable...if not completely practical.

There are some moves in Tai Chi that look flowing and pretty, but they include wrist breaks, punches, chops, and throws. They're in there, but you have to look beneath the surface of the style.

Tai Chi works wonders for flexibility at the very least, I used it to help recover from a nasty sports injury back in high school. Shortened my projected recovery time by about 3 months. I was very pleased with the results. Unfortunately I don't live within 50 miles of an advertising Tai Chi teacher right now.

1. :headbang: generally works in close quarters......

2. if not try and :fluffle: generally scares the fuckers off

3. or stick a :upyours: up their :eek:
Some ones been to the School of John Hopoate....

A good example of a "soft" form of martial art. Tai Chi is many generations removed from combat, and has a much greater focus on health, but the style remains applicable...if not completely practical.

There are some moves in Tai Chi that look flowing and pretty, but they include wrist breaks, punches, chops, and throws. They're in there, but you have to look beneath the surface of the style.

Tai Chi works wonders for flexibility at the very least, I used it to help recover from a nasty sports injury back in high school. Shortened my projected recovery time by about 3 months. I was very pleased with the results. Unfortunately I don't live within 50 miles of an advertising Tai Chi teacher right now.

Good to see someone else who appreciates Tai Chi. What style did you learn? I've been learning Yang for a good three years now, although that's proper Yang style as opposed to the Khor style I learnt four years before that.

Some ones been to the School of John Hopoate....

hahaha. must admit though, would not want to be on the opposite team from him!

of the 3 only tried 1.

hahaha. must admit though, would not want to be on the opposite team from him!

of the 3 only tried 1.


I'm guessing the Hoppa one ?

Its surprising how often in brawls the deciding factor tends to be someone’s steel toe capped boots connecting with the other guys shin and then a quick elbow to the neck or head.

I'm guessing the Hoppa one ?

nah, only ever nuted someone. was one of those situations where someone was pressing up to me going "yeah? yea?". So i :headbang: the drunk twat.

Yeah. Unless it's a matter of survival. Kicking someone in the knees can leave them unable to walk normally for the rest of their lives. Bad stuff that.

I haven't fought as an adult, so I can't say. And besides, it's not like a five-year old girl couldn't beat me, anyway.

lol

Okay, you are about to have a fight with a rival/bully/drunken lout. It's NOT going to be a friendly fight. But it's not a fight for survival, either.

So, where do you draw the line? Do you fight honorably? Do you take your cue from your opponent? Do you take a 'whatever works' approach? How dirty do you fight? Low Blows? Eye gouging? Hair pulling? Kneecap kicking?

I've always fought rough and dirty. Even in friendly fights. But unless I am fighting for survival, I draw the line at things like eye gouging. ANd the knees. I don't kick or strike an opponent's knees. I'm odd that way. I'd kick my best friend in the nuts, but I wouldn't kick my bitterest rival in the knee.

Of course, if I thought my life was in danger, the rulebook goes right out the window.

Well I don't really draw a line... it depends who I'm fighting.... on Sunday I got my tooth knocked out fighting with a big guy so I grabbed Him and Knee'd him in the face a couple of times, burst his nose... then his two friends jumped in and I got a kicking, I've still got a fat lip and a black eye...lol
I hate it when that happens.

You know..I used to know a girl who's grandmother taught Tai Chi.
She once wanted to give me a demonstation of some basic principles.
She told me that, when I was ready, I could open-hand slap her, or attempt to...

I attempted..and she delicately brushed aside my wrist, and locked my arm rather like Pai Mei from "Kill Bill".

It hurt.

Re-direction of motion.

A riposte, of you will.
I had an old man who had bad knees and had recently recovered from cancer who had studied Tai Chi Chuan launch me (at the time 225 pounds) several feet backward without much effort on his part. That was cool.


EDIT: It was on the training mat before martial arts class. I don't want anyone thinking that I go around picking fights with old guys who've just recovered from cancer.

The irony level of this topic is off the charts, so please pardon my laughter.

Anyway, I think it depends on the ahh, 'level' of the fight. If its somebody you know, and theyre pissed 'cause you did this to so-and-so's girl, its safe to assume that unless theyre seven feet tall and foaming, that its going to be a 'friendly' fight, IE: Bloody the other guy up a bit until it gets broken up.
If its more serious, or a 'beating' I have no problems with causing some harm. I was kicked in the knee in the sixth grade because I splashed a kid, its not a pleasant experience and I STILL have a slight limp.

If you have a high pain threshold, the best way to avoid fights is to totaly ignore all the little punches that tend to get thrown in the days before a fight, if a kid 'accidentaly' trips and hits you, dont respond. It tends to make people nervous.
That and mastering the 'I will kill you if I get pissed' look. Not blinking very much is good as well.

That and mastering the 'I will kill you if I get pissed' look. Not blinking very much is good as well.
Snipped original post.

Reminding people that they don't want a piece of you works in some situations.. Once in Florida one of my obnoxious friends had gotten into a rapidly escalating verbal confrontation with some other drunk. I came over, and being drunk, didn't recognize the level to which the situation had escalated. I tried to calm things down, and the drunk said something threatening to me. My response wasn't anger, just surprise that this guy would try to pick a fight with me of all people. I calmly stated "Dude, I'd fucking kill you." He got the message and walked away.

Youd go down like a sack of shit.

I've been kicked in the kneecaps before (with boots, no less). I did stumble a bit, but it wasn't nearly as bad as getting kicked in the stomach.

If it's just a fight for the hell of it, I never actively try to maim my opponent(s). If I don't know how serious the fight is, I generally try to back down. If I can, then I know I'm not about to get knifed (so I might well decide to start round two, hehe).
If I can't get away or someone draws a weapon on me, I try to incapacitate my opponent. Doc's to the knees or mouth usually does the trick instantly. However, I advice to go for the knees. Trying to kick someone in the face can get you in deep shit if you don't have training.

I've never gone for someone's eyes. I don't really see how that would be usefull. I'm honestly not sure I've ever bitten someone, but it's hardly efficient unless you're the wolfman.

If you lot don't fight a lot, here's my advice:

See if you can possibly get away.
Find a weapon.
Go for the knees first.

Don't try to kick people in the sac. First of all, people almost always miss slightly. Secondly, you may end up severly maiming or even killing the dumbass if you don't miss. Also, try not to kneecap people unless you really mean it. Some never recover.

I've been kicked in the kneecaps before (with boots, no less). I did stumble a bit, but it wasn't nearly as bad as getting kicked in the stomach.
Depends where on the knee you get kicked and if your leg is bent or straight. If the kick comes in from the side, you could be in for some serious injury. If it comes straight on from the front, especially if the recieving knee is slightly bent, not straight, it probably won't do more than leave a bruise. Kneecaps are pretty solid. I've thrown knees into steel posts and brick walls when I was drunk before, and never suffered any serious injury. Then again, I've had my knee in a brace for weeks because of a single leg takedown that popped my knee from the side and caused it to try to bend the wrong way before.

Depends where on the knee you get kicked and if your leg is bent or straight. If the kick comes in from the side, you could be in for some serious injury. If it comes straight on from the front, especially if the recieving knee is slightly bent, not straight, it probably won't do more than leave a bruise. Kneecaps are pretty solid. I've thrown knees into steel posts and brick walls when I was drunk before, and never suffered any serious injury. Then again, I've had my knee in a brace for weeks because of a single leg takedown that popped my knee from the side and caused it to try to bend the wrong way before.

Well, being kicked from the side would definitely do some damage. However, kicking a kneecap doesn't do much at all, which is what I'm saying.

I have offset knees, so being kicked from the outside wouldn't do quite as much damage as it would to a normal person, though it would still be serious.

Hard Left hook to the throat. Works for me everytime.

Well, being kicked from the side would definitely do some damage. However, kicking a kneecap doesn't do much at all, which is what I'm saying.

I have offset knees, so being kicked from the outside wouldn't do quite as much damage as it would to a normal person, though it would still be serious.
If someone stomps your knee, you are down. And your kneecap is smashed. And all the sinues are torn over. At least when your leg's straight. The right way to do it is to either kick with your steelcaps on the side of the joint, or stomp right above the kneecap. Either way, the guy won't get up again.

I've had it happen to me. I was lucky, and only my only had a limp for a year.
People have tried to do it to me unsuccessfully, but that's been people who had no clue how to go about it.
Still, it's tought me to pay attention and raise my leg when people try. That's really the only way to avoid injury if it's done right.

Hard Left hook to the throat. Works for me everytime.

Yeah... but you could kill a muthafucker like tthat... better aim for the nose... makes there eyes water, better than a poke in the eye....

Hit them right below the temple for best results if you want eye watering.

Don't try to kick people in the sac. First of all, people almost always miss slightly. Secondly, you may end up severly maiming or even killing the dumbass if you don't miss. Also, try not to kneecap people unless you really mean it. Some never recover.

I think you'd be surprised how durable testicles are. I've heard rare stories of ruptures occurring with one strike, but these usually involve a unforgiving surface(like a boot) and an upward smash trapping them between boot and pelvis. It's not a very common occurrence. On the other hand, knee damage is very common and surprisingly little force is needed.

Good to see someone else who appreciates Tai Chi. What style did you learn? I've been learning Yang for a good three years now, although that's proper Yang style as opposed to the Khor style I learnt four years before that.

To say I learned it is a bit of an overstatement. I really only used books, as I had no teacher to study with. I later found a group of students of the form to practice with, but only for about 4 months. I studied the Ch'uan form with them, and studied forms for the Tai Chi "one sword dances" for about 2 years.

I think you'd be surprised how durable testicles are. I've heard rare stories of ruptures occurring with one strike, but these usually involve a unforgiving surface(like a boot) and an upward smash trapping them between boot and pelvis. It's not a very common occurrence. On the other hand, knee damage is very common and surprisingly little force is needed.
Hehe, reread what I wrote mate ;)

I wrote it almost never works. It's not a viable way to subdue an opponent, because it almost never works. And if you really manage to hit proper, you risk permanently maiming or outright killing the poor guy.
Not sorting. Not nice. And almost never successful anyway. I said to go for the knees if you're in such deep shit that you need to fight dirty.

"The Way of the Warrior is fulfilled in Death. When it comes to either/or, there is only the quick choice of death. It is not particularly difficult. Be determined and advance. To say that dying without reaching one's aim is to die a dog's death is the frivolous way of sophisticates. When pressed with the choice of life or death, it is not necessary to gain one's aim...."
-Hagakure by Yamamoto Tsunetomo

THIS thread certainly gained some interesting spin from tha local posta's!

:eek:

Hehe, reread what I wrote mate ;)

I wrote it almost never works. It's not a viable way to subdue an opponent, because it almost never works. And if you really manage to hit proper, you risk permanently maiming or outright killing the poor guy.
Not sorting. Not nice. And almost never successful anyway. I said to go for the knees if you're in such deep shit that you need to fight dirty.

Well, I disagree with the latter part of that. Maiming or killing someone with a strike to the testicles is very rare. I don't consider it a threat. But I'll agree with the former. A kick to the groin in hand-to-hand combat is not the best of ideas in most situations because it IS a small target. For some people, a very small target. :p

Punching or grabbing and squeezing the testicles is considerably more effective, however.

Okay, you are about to have a fight with a rival/bully/drunken lout. It's NOT going to be a friendly fight. But it's not a fight for survival, either.

So, where do you draw the line? Do you fight honorably? Do you take your cue from your opponent? Do you take a 'whatever works' approach? How dirty do you fight? Low Blows? Eye gouging? Hair pulling? Kneecap kicking?
<snip>
I am Aikidoka... to a point.

I will always begin with Aikido. I hope to end with Aikido, but if necessary I will progress to AikiJutsu - and so on on to Krav Maga. :eek:

99.9% of any hand to hand I need to do can be acomplished with Aikido. The .1% that enter into the world of Krav Maga I would rather finish with firearms.