NationStates Jolt Archive

I realise that this could be very well thought of as a hypocracy, but I'm going to say it anyway.

I am an Atheist. Unlike a lot of Atheists I know, I stay out of people's religious matters. If someone goes to church, more power to them. If someone prays in front of me, let them. They're not harming me, they're not doing any harm whatsoever.

I respect YOUR beliefs, whether you be a Muslim, Jew or Christian, or Vedic, Buddhist or anything else. You have a right to them. But, to the ones out there that try to convert me and change my fundamental beliefs, on an internet forum none the less, I ask you: Please stop.

I don't try to convert YOU. I don't try and change your beliefs about human existance, where the universe came from. I don't give you pamphlets on Atheism.

Is what I'm asking here too much?

Internet forums are known for that sort of thing. Sometimes I find it fun to jump into just such a debate. Sometimes I steer clear. Luckily you can usually tell which threads will turn into holy wars and you can choose to avoid them.

I realise that this could be very well thought of as a hypocracy, but I'm going to say it anyway.

I am an Atheist. Unlike a lot of Atheists I know, I stay out of people's religious matters. If someone goes to church, more power to them. If someone prays in front of me, let them. They're not harming me, they're not doing any harm whatsoever.

I respect YOUR beliefs, whether you be a Muslim, Jew or Christian, or Vedic, Buddhist or anything else. You have a right to them. But, to the ones out there that try to convert me and change my fundamental beliefs, on an internet forum none the less, I ask you: Please stop.

I don't try to convert YOU. I don't try and change your beliefs about human existance, where the universe came from. I don't give you pamphlets on Atheism.

Is what I'm asking here too much?

I agree with the basic point behind what you're saying but I dont agree with your implication that it is just theists who try to change fundamental beliefs. Plenty of atheists will try and do just the same. Both groups contain idiots who try to force their beliefs on others

I agree with the basic point behind what you're saying but I dont agree with your implication that it is just theists who try to change fundamental beliefs. Plenty of atheists will try and do just the same. Both groups contain idiots who try to force their beliefs on others

Of course. I know many Atheists that do that, and I don't support THEM either.

Guess I'm just making enemies all around, eh? :D

http://www.plex.nu/d/pictures/RETARDED.JPG

I don't try to convert YOU. I don't try and change your beliefs about human existance, where the universe came from. I don't give you pamphlets on Atheism.

Is what I'm asking here too much?
Not at all. Most religious and/or spiritually oriented people with half an ounce of sense will not try to convert you. This includes most Christians who have actually read the bible on their own rather than simply taking some fundamentalist preacher's word about it, and realize that it's a life well lived which has the most impact, not some sort of aggessive proselytizing.

I realise that this could be very well thought of as a hypocracy, but I'm going to say it anyway.

I am an Atheist. Unlike a lot of Atheists I know, I stay out of people's religious matters. If someone goes to church, more power to them. If someone prays in front of me, let them. They're not harming me, they're not doing any harm whatsoever.

I respect YOUR beliefs, whether you be a Muslim, Jew or Christian, or Vedic, Buddhist or anything else. You have a right to them. But, to the ones out there that try to convert me and change my fundamental beliefs, on an internet forum none the less, I ask you: Please stop.

I don't try to convert YOU. I don't try and change your beliefs about human existance, where the universe came from. I don't give you pamphlets on Atheism.

Is what I'm asking here too much?

I'm neither religious or athiest but from what I see there is far more athiests on the warpath than religious people. Maybe it's just these forums I don't know, but there is many times more crackpot athiests here than crackpot holy rollers.

Of course. I know many Atheists that do that, and I don't support THEM either.

Guess I'm just making enemies all around, eh? :D

It wouldnt be as fun any other way :p

Not at all. Most religious and/or spiritually oriented people with half an ounce of sense will not try to convert you. This includes most Christians who have actually read the bible on their own rather than simply taking some fundamentalist preacher's word about it, and realize that it's a life well lived which has the most impact, not some sort of aggessive proselytizing.Then again, it's hard to notice someone that doesn't try to get your attention, so those people are generally ignored ;)

http://www.plex.nu/d/pictures/RETARDED.JPG



Whoever made that is so evil :mad:

Then again, it's hard to notice someone that doesn't try to get your attention, so those people are generally ignored ;)
( shrug ) Better to be ignored than to be labeled as "stupid!" :D

Liverbreath']I'm neither religious or athiest but from what I see there is far more athiests on the warpath than religious people. Maybe it's just these forums I don't know, but there is many times more crackpot athiests here than crackpot holy rollers.

It's been my experience in real life that there are far more theists than atheists, but that's probably because I have a town that could be turned into a puritan catholic stronghold at the snap of a finger - incredibly religious town.

On the internet, I've seen it go about fifty fifty.

Whoever made that is so evil :mad:
I hate that poster. :mad: :mad: :mad:

Just a little point to make: I don't think that most people of any sect are trying to force their beliefs down anyones throats. I notice that most people on this forum sre actually quite respectful, but many times it is a case of the squeaky wheel getting the most oil(the loud idiot ends up representing the whole group).

This has to do with human nature, and while religious prosyletizing makes a good example here, there are lots of political viewpoints being aggressively forced on others by self-important and rude people.

Most Christians do not force their views - not that they won't tell you about them if you ask - but it's hard to prove how many because they never say anything about it. The majority is silent unless asked.

Not at all. Most religious and/or spiritually oriented people with half an ounce of sense will not try to convert you. This includes most Christians who have actually read the bible on their own rather than simply taking some fundamentalist preacher's word about it, and realize that it's a life well lived which has the most impact, not some sort of aggessive proselytizing.
Yes. And if they were socially 'mature' they would realise that they could change more minds through example and expressing their beliefs than they ever could through asking and demanding people to change.

( shrug ) Better to be ignored than to be labeled as "stupid!" :D
I think Abe Lincoln once said "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt."

Just a little point to make: I don't think that most people of any sect are trying to force their beliefs down anyones throats. I notice that most people on this forum sre actually quite respectful, but many times it is a case of the squeaky wheel getting the most oil(the loud idiot ends up representing the whole group).

I know that it's actually a very small group of the theists and, I'll admit, a significantly larger group of the Atheists, at least a majority, that try and shove their beliefs down other people's throats. I'm addressing all of these people - You're not going to change someone's thoughts on the nature of the universe and God through an internet forum.

And I wasn't talking about this forum out of all of the other ones. I've been on other forums (which are much less respectful, by the way, I have to congratulate you all, most respectful forum I've ever seen) and it's been brought up by both theists and atheists just as much, and has turned into a holy-flame-war.

Liverbreath']I'm neither religious or athiest but from what I see there is far more athiests on the warpath than religious people. Maybe it's just these forums I don't know, but there is many times more crackpot athiests here than crackpot holy rollers.

I'll go along with that. I formed the same impression, but I've been making allowances for the fact I've only been around here a few months.

Whoever made that is so evil :mad:

"The Internet - It's serious fucking business!"

:rolleyes:

I think Abe Lincoln once said "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt."
Yup. One of many things Abe said with which I am in full agreement. :)

I'll go along with that. I formed the same impression, but I've been making allowances for the fact I've only been around here a few months.
There are more atheists/agnostics on the forum than christians, I think. Anyway, in the past there have been almost as many Christians starting "holy wars" as atheists as far as I can tell.

There are more atheists/agnostics on the forum than christians, I think. Anyway, in the past there have been almost as many Christians starting "holy wars" as atheists as far as I can tell.

Indeed.

In my personal experience on these forums, there have only been two or three militant atheists attacking theist's beliefs. I can only think of one name at this point.

On the other hand, there have been at least twice that many people who will not only argue until they are blue in the face that atheists can't possibly be rational, but will also attack any theist with a view even slightly different from their own.

Indeed.

In my personal experience on these forums, there have only been two or three militant atheists attacking theist's beliefs. I can only think of one name at this point.

On the other hand, there have been at least twice that many people who will not only argue until they are blue in the face that atheists can't possibly be rational, but will also attack any theist with a view even slightly different from their own.
These are almost uniformly people who are insecure in their faith, largely "inherited" from their parents without questioning it. They are, either consciously or unconsciously, attempting to justify their beliefs by being extremely vociferous about it. The person who has taken out his or her beliefs and examined them in the light of reason and logic is almost always secure enough in them to not feel the need to self-justify.

In any event, I put it down to personality flaw whatever the topic, I don't think it applies to religion alone. Immaturity as well (nothing to do with chronological age).

I don't know to what degree the anonymous internet factors in - do these people talk like this in real life? Someone gets as belligerent with me to my face as they do on here and they're risking a problem. That goes for political matters as well as religious.

These are almost uniformly people who are insecure in their faith, largely "inherited" from their parents without questioning it. They are, either consciously or unconsciously, attempting to justify their beliefs by being extremely vociferous about it. The person who has taken out his or her beliefs and examined them in the light of reason and logic is almost always secure enough in them to not feel the need to self-justify.

You better be careful. Suggesting that has gotten me attacked more than once. =)

Seriously though, I enjoy a good religious discussion. It helps me to better understand my own position on things - as well as to form opinions on things I might not have thought about. Unfortunately, religious discussions often devolve into religious arguments - which don't really do much good to anyone. All too often, I would say that this is because those who are weak of faith fear anything remotely like questioning their own ideas.