NationStates Jolt Archive

As you all know, I'm a listener of almost exclusively classical music. Here's some of mine (in no particular order):

- Barber's Adagio for Strings
- Elgar's Serenade for Strings
- Dvorak's Serenade for Strings: Tempo di Valse
- Dvorak's Bohemian Suite: Polka
- Dvorak's Symphony No. 9: From the New World
- Pachebel's Canon in D minor
- Vivaldi's Four Seasons
- Holst's The Planets: Venus
- Rachmaninov' Piano Concerto No. 3: Allegro
- Albinoni's Adagio in G minor
- Bach Air on the G String
- Prokofiev's Montagues and Capulets
- Strauss I's Radetzky March
- Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto in B flat minor: Allegro
- Handel's Water Music suite
- Handel's Music for Royal Fireworks
- Mendelssohn's Violin Concerto
- Bach's Goldberg Variations
- Gluck's Dance of the Blessed Spirits
- Vaughan Williams' Fantasia on Greensleeves
- Vaughan Williams' The Lark Ascending
- Rachmaninov' Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini
- Elgar's 'Enigma' Variations: Nimrod
- Clarke's Trumpet Voluntary
- Handel's Sarabande
- Debussy's Clair de Lune
- Debussy's Arabesques
- Chopin's Piano Concerto No. 1
- Tchaikovsky's Waltz of the Wild Flowers
- Chopin's 'Minute Waltz'
- Berlioz's Symphonie Fantastique
- Myers' Cavatina
- Greig's Peer Gynt
- Massenet's Meditation
- Beethoven's Symphonies No. 5, 6, 9
- Mascagni's Cavallerina Rusticana: Intermezzo
- John Williams' Schindler's List Theme
- John Williams' Imperial March
- Tchaikovsy's Swan Lake
- Beethoven's Piano Sonata No. 14 'Moonlight'
- Mahler's Symphony No. 1 'Titan'
- Bizet's Carmen Suite
- Ravel's Bolero
- Ravel's Berceuse sur le nom de Gabriel Fauré
- Schubert's Symphony No. 5
- Bach's Brandenburg Concertoes
- Haydn symphony No. 7
- Mozart's Turkish March
- Beethoven's Fur Elise
- Mozart's Serenade No. 13 ('Eine Kleine Nachtmusik')
- Strauss' numerous waltzes
- Bach's Toccata and Fugue

Classical music? Isn't that, like, Britney Spears?

You're speaking to the ignorant, for the most part. ;)

On a serious note, I've heard quite a few classical pieces. I just don't know the names. I'd say my favorite classical pieces are 'good ones'. Something that isn't overly brooding or extremely slow an ponderous.

Classical music? Isn't that, like, Britney Spears?

You're speaking to the ignorant, for the most part. ;)

On a serious note, I've heard quite a few classical pieces. I just don't know the names. I'd say my favorite classical pieces are 'good ones'. Something that isn't overly brooding or extremely slow an ponderous.

I see what you mean by 'good' pieces. Those pieces are generally very popular with many listeners.

As for Britney Spears, I think her talentless popularity is long overdue. (I loathe pop music.)

That's a good list. I think some of the tunes on your list have been over-exploited, though. You know, they have been played over and over in comercials etc. ...which is a shame.

*snip*

You covered most of my favorites by Albinoni, Vivaldi, and Tchaikovsky, so the only one I can add is Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata.

Oh, and the Hungarian Rhapsodies by Liszt.

Edit: Oops, the Sonata was on there, too. Damn.

Classical music? Isn't that, like, Britney Spears?

You're speaking to the ignorant, for the most part. ;)

On a serious note, I've heard quite a few classical pieces. I just don't know the names. I'd say my favorite classical pieces are 'good ones'. Something that isn't overly brooding or extremely slow an ponderous.

yeah, I find it a bit strange when they have a "retro hour" on the radio and they keep playing spice girls etc. Gimme a break...

Oh, and the Hungarian Rhapsodies by Liszt.

I think I haven't heard Liszt a lot, despite having a box of over 100 CDs to some of the best and most popular pieces. LOL!

That's a good list. I think some of the tunes on your list have been over-exploited, though. You know, they have been played over and over in comercials etc. ...which is a shame.

A good piece deserves it love and place in repeated play. I can listen to some of the listed pieces for hours on end and never get tired.

yeah, I find it a bit strange when they have a "retro hour" on the radio and they keep playing spice girls etc. Gimme a break...

Damn pop music! Classical music should be considered as the music that represents the human race!

A good piece deserves it love and place in repeated play. I can listen to some of the listed pieces for hours on end and never get tired.

Sure. Only, if you start thinking about a shiny car every time you listen to a composition then it eventually starts to annoy you, doesn't it?

Hmm ive only got 40 CDs and the oldest would be Pink Floyds The Wall!LOL

However i do respect 'Classical Music' lots for instance ABBA-I kid.

No i like the stuff i know we have a few Tapes(What are they you ask) and a CD i canna' find the Tapes but yes i love Classical.

I see what you mean by 'good' pieces. Those pieces are generally very popular with many listeners.

When you say 'many listeners', do you mean those that aren't elitest jerks who loudly proclaim that they music they like is of a higher quality and more intellectual then the music the masses listen to? I tend to fall in to the elitest jerk category in my tastes, minus the jerk part.

Sure. Only, if you start thinking about a shiny car every time you listen to a composition then it eventually starts to annoy you, doesn't it?

Commercials never get to me. Being a compulsive saver, I am one of the few people that have a very high sales resistance. Door to door salesmen may have to go Gestapo for force me to buy. LOL! I'm rarely annoyed by classical music.

When you say 'many listeners', do you mean those that aren't elitest jerks who loudly proclaim that they music they like is of a higher quality and more intellectual then the music the masses listen to? I tend to fall in to the elitest jerk category in my tastes, minus the jerk part.

Not necessary elitist jerks. The pieces I've posted can be accepted by broad masses who themselves may not be exclusive listeners of the genre.

I was introduced to classical music when I was about 3 or 4. The first music in my memory was the pieces of Verdi's Gloria All'egitto and a march from Bizet's Carmen. Those sounds stayed in my mind ever since. Throughout my childhood, I was never musical nor listened to any music, but during my teens, after listening to many genres I've settled on classical and Chinese folk music.

Damn! How could I have forgotten Bach's Toccata and Fugue?!

I'm something of an ignoramus on the subject, but I'll add the following:

Schubert - Death and the Maiden (astonishing piece of theatre, too)
Holst - Saturn

I'm something of an ignoramus on the subject, but I'll add the following:

Schubert - Death and the Maiden (astonishing piece of theatre, too)
Holst - Saturn

Never got around to listening to Death and the Maiden, I had concerns about the title, but I'll look into it.

The whole Planets suite seemed too avant garde for classical, so I stuck to listening for Venus.

Wagner's Ride of the Valyries/Ring Cycle
Orff's O Fortuna/Carmina Burana
Mussorgsky's Night on a Bare Mountain
Strauss' Thus Spake Zarathustra

...I like many other's, but don't know them by name...

Wagner's Ride of the Valyries/Ring Cycle
Orff's O Fortuna/Carmina Burana
Mussorgsky's Night on a Bare Mountain
Strauss' Thus Spake Zarathustra

...I like many other's, but don't know them by name...

Ah! Why did I forget Orff's famous choral work too? I've listened to Mussorgsky but Night on a Bare Mountain or Pictures at an Exhibition had limited appeal to my ears.

The whole Planets suite seemed too avant garde for classical, so I stuck to listening for Venus.[/QUOTE]

Avant garde? Nah, Holst is one of the best. I was privaleged enough to see The Planets performed by the Minnesota Symphony Orchestra a few years back. Jupiter from the Planets is absolutly awsome, especially live. Being 17 at the time, I got some odd looks in the concert hall!

As to other preferences. I like a lot of the late 19th and early 20th century English composers: Holst, Elgar, Vaghn (sp?) Williams. And a lot of Russian works; Tchicovsky, Prokofiev, Borodine, Musorsky (spelled many of those wrong, I know). Can't get enough 1812 Overture.

Markuk']Can't get enough 1812 Overture.

I've listened to a free live performance of that, accompanied by my country's artillery pieces.

Hall of the Mountain King.

Hall of the Mountain King.

It's listed as part of the Peer Gynt suite.

It's listed as part of the Peer Gynt suite.

Oopsie. As you can tell, my knowledge of classical is pretty limited :p

I believe I like Peter and the Wolf!-Thats what ive been informed is the name of the tune i like.

Hall of the Mountain King.
Doom Dom DOm DOm

I believe I like Peter and the Wolf!-Thats what ive been informed is the name of the tune i like.

I have yet to find an unnarrated version of the piece. It is program music at it's best.

I have yet to find an unnarrated version of the piece. It is program music at it's best.
I heard it on the History Channel and i asked around and was told it was that.

But I wouldnt call them credible.

I personally havent heard Peter and the Wolf in a longtime so it could be different. :eek:

what About works of the (later) 20th Century, composers such as Cage, Stockhausen, Babbit and minimalist work? i'm Especially fond of Glass' Einstein on the beach, Adams' Nixon in china and Reichs Music for 18 musicians

what About works of the (later) 20th Century, composers such as Cage, Stockhausen, Babbit and minimalist work? i'm Especially fond of Glass' Einstein on the beach, Adams' Nixon in china and Reichs Music for 18 musicians

I've never heard of these names let alone their music. The only 20th Century classical I've heard are film/game scores.

Alessandro Marcello: Oboe Concerto in D minor

mmpurdy

As you all know, I'm a listener of almost exclusively classical music. Here's some of mine (in no particular order):

- Barber's Adagio for Strings
- Elgar's Serenade for Strings
- Dvorak's Serenade for Strings: Tempo di Valse
- Dvorak's Bohemian Suite: Polka
- Dvorak's Symphony No. 9: From the New World
- Pachebel's Canon in D minor
- Vivaldi's Four Seasons
- Holst's The Planets: Venus
- Rachmaninov' Piano Concerto No. 3: Allegro
- Albinoni's Adagio in G minor
- Bach Air on the G String
- Prokofiev's Montagues and Capulets
- Strauss I's Radetzky March
- Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto in B flat minor: Allegro
- Handel's Water Music suite
- Handel's Music for Royal Fireworks
- Mendelssohn's Violin Concerto
- Bach's Goldberg Variations
- Gluck's Dance of the Blessed Spirits
- Vaughan Williams' Fantasia on Greensleeves
- Vaughan Williams' The Lark Ascending
- Rachmaninov' Rhapsody on a Theme of Paganini
- Elgar's 'Enigma' Variations: Nimrod
- Clarke's Trumpet Voluntary
- Handel's Sarabande
- Debussy's Clair de Lune
- Debussy's Arabesques
- Chopin's Piano Concerto No. 1
- Tchaikovsky's Waltz of the Wild Flowers
- Chopin's 'Minute Waltz'
- Berlioz's Symphonie Fantastique
- Myers' Cavatina
- Greig's Peer Gynt
- Massenet's Meditation
- Beethoven's Symphonies No. 5, 6, 9
- Mascagni's Cavallerina Rusticana: Intermezzo
- John Williams' Schindler's List Theme
- John Williams' Imperial March
- Tchaikovsy's Swan Lake
- Beethoven's Piano Sonata No. 14 'Moonlight'
- Mahler's Symphony No. 1 'Titan'
- Bizet's Carmen Suite
- Ravel's Bolero
- Ravel's Berceuse sur le nom de Gabriel Fauré
- Schubert's Symphony No. 5
- Bach's Brandenburg Concertoes
- Haydn symphony No. 7
- Mozart's Turkish March
- Beethoven's Fur Elise
- Mozart's Serenade No. 13 ('Eine Kleine Nachtmusik')
- Strauss' numerous waltzes
- Bach's Toccata and Fugue

I am very partial to Beethhoven's "Fur Elise" now, as my son plays it flawlessly on the piano. He also has "Ode to Joy" mastered.
Two of my favorites. When your own son plays it after years of lessons, it gets me choked up.
I also like Beethoven's "Moonlight Sonata".

Johann Pachelbel's Canon in D major will make me feel good too

Not necessary elitist jerks. The pieces I've posted can be accepted by broad masses who themselves may not be exclusive listeners of the genre.

I was introduced to classical music when I was about 3 or 4. The first music in my memory was the pieces of Verdi's Gloria All'egitto and a march from Bizet's Carmen. Those sounds stayed in my mind ever since. Throughout my childhood, I was never musical nor listened to any music, but during my teens, after listening to many genres I've settled on classical and Chinese folk music.

Most children in the US listened to classical music without knowing it watching "Bugs Bunny" cartoons. Years later, they may still not be aware of how much classical music they have heard.

Favourite pieces, hm? Tricky....

Rimskij-Korsakov : Flight of the Bumble Bee
Modest Mussorgsgy : Night on the bare mountain
Mozart : A la Turka and almost everything from the Migic Flute
Beethoven : 6th Symphony
Tchaikovski : The Sleeping Beauty

... that's about it.

I admire your son's music ability. Pity I cannot recognize a note or a chord, yet I indulge in classical listening.

I prefer Jazz.

Most children in the US listened to classical music without knowing it watching "Bugs Bunny" cartoons. Years later, they may still not be aware of how much classical music they have heard.

I've watched those cartoons but with vision being more important, my ears switch off and I don't remember the music.

I admire your son's music ability. Pity I cannot recognize a note or a chord, yet I indulge in classical listening.


Thanks.
I cant read music either. We started his piano lessons when he was 5 yrs old and he took right to it. He does it for enjoyment-there are other kids his age that are astounding. I am not pushing him for concerts or anything, just his continued pleasure.

I've watched those cartoons but with vision being more important, my ears switch off and I don't remember the music.


You've probably heard Rossini's "Barber of Seville", Mozart's "Figaro" and Wagner's "Ride of the Valkries" a dozen times each before you were 5 yrs old.

You've probably heard Rossini's "Barber of Seville", Mozart's "Figaro" and Wagner's "Ride of the Valkries" a dozen times each before you were 5 yrs old.

I probably don't remembe these tunes significantly, apart from 'Valkyries'.

I probably don't remembe these tunes significantly, apart from 'Valkyries'.


Those are the main ones I recall. I'm sure there were many more that havent occured to me yet. Swan Lake is another.

Cartoons were a little more enriching at one time. Not totally moronic. I'm 38 yrs old, so I grew up with these cartoons. If your much younger than that, Bugs Bunny may not have been as popular and you may have gotten a smaller dose than me. My kids dont know Bugs Bunny now. They know Sponge Bob and Rug Rats and a load of other crap.

Your first post list of music is very impressive. In going back over it, I think you had already mentioned all those I had subsequently mentioned.
Are you just a fan of classical music, or are you a student?
Either way, I am impressed.

You've probably heard Rossini's "Barber of Seville", Mozart's "Figaro" and Wagner's "Ride of the Valkries" a dozen times each before you were 5 yrs old.
Absodoodle!

Absodoodle!

Harlesburg- your name sounds like a classical composer.

My favourite: "Spiegel im Spiegel" by Avro Part.

Favourite pieces, hm? Tricky....

Rimskij-Korsakov : Flight of the Bumble Bee
Modest Mussorgsgy : Night on the bare mountain
Mozart : A la Turka and almost everything from the Migic Flute
Beethoven : 6th Symphony
Tchaikovski : The Sleeping Beauty

... that's about it.

Wah! How could I forget Moussorgsky?! I love both Night on Bare Mountain and the entire Pictures at an Exhibition.

Damn! How could I have forgotten Bach's Toccata and Fugue?!

I have no Fu<k*ng idea.

p.s. Dvorak's Symphony No. 9: From the New World Pwns all you nÜbs! (Im lucky enough to have perfomed it :D )

I tend towards the Romantics, particularly the Germans, Austrians, and Russians, (and the French and Italian Romantics to a lesser extent); and certain modernists (I tend to really dislike other modernists). But I also quite enjoy music of the classical and neoclassical compossers. Finally I prefer orchestral and symphonic music, as well as opera and some chamber music. I never really had a taste for piano (which would explain what some may consider gaps below).

The total favorites who did no wrong:
Gustav Mahler: nearly everything, but especially Das Lied von der Erde
Richard Wagner: nearly everything (I'd come mighty close to claiming that evern his worst was pretty damned good.)
Ludwig van Beethoven: again everything, but especially the Ninth Symphony
Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky: once again, everything (even The Nutcracker)
Anton Bruckner: :D

Particular pieces I like include:
Louis Hector Berlioz's Symphonie Fantastique and La damnation de Faust (I also have a very special place in my heart for Harold en Italie - having played viola all through secondary school, even though I was one of those violist who give us a bad, bad name. ;))
Richard Strauss' Also sprach Zarathustra, Elektra, and Der Rosenkavalier
Igor Fyodorovitch Stravinsky's Le Sacre du printemps (of the notorious Paris premier) and L'oiseau de feu
Jacques Offenbach's Orphée aux enfers and Barbe-Bleue
Giacomo Puccini's La bohème, Tosca, and Madama Butterfly
Sir Edward William Elgar's Pomp and Circumstance Marches

Benjamin Britten's The Young Persons' Guide to the Orchestra and Sergei Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf are also favorites. (The later due as much to Prokofiev's probably having written it the way he did in order to spite Stalin, as with it's musical merits.)

Other favorites:
Franz Schubert, Felix Mendelssohn, Johann Strauss II, Camille Saint-Saëns, Modest Petrovich Mussorgsky, Antonín Dvořák, Edvard Grieg, Claude Debussy, Georges Bizet,

Can we count Philip Glass in? If not, put me down for all things Wagner, Holst and Mussorgsky.

And my favorite composser, deserving of a mention in and of himself, is a modernist by the name of Eric L. McIntyre (http://www.societyofcomposers.org/user/ericl.mcintyre.html). Some of his compositions (http://web.grinnell.edu/individuals/mcintyr2/composition/catalogue.html) are available as audio file downloads (http://web.grinnell.edu/individuals/mcintyr2/composition/audiofiles.html).

(Dat's mah little brother! :D)

Can we count Philip Glass in? If not, put me down for all things Wagner, Holst and Mussorgsky.

Sure, why not.

I like some of it. Eva used a lot of classical music. If only there were works by socialists.

I like some of it. Eva used a lot of classical music. If only there were works by socialists.

:eek: Get the to a socialist-realism composer, post haste!!!

The Planets: All are good, I like Jupiter the best.
Carnival of the Animals is pretty good, too.

My all-time favorite is The Hoedown movement from Rodeo. I can't eat a steak without thinking of it.

I like some of it. Eva used a lot of classical music. If only there were works by socialists.
Shostakovich, however he spelled it, was just a little communist.

Shostakovich, however he spelled it, was just a little communist.

Most of the Soviet composers got into trouble with the government because the subject of music does not mingle well with communism. Shostakovich was lucky to have survived as the NKVD officer who interrogated him was liquidated by his colleagues the next day.

:eek: Get the to a socialist-realism composer, post haste!!!

Communists called it socialist realism while the Nazis referred to their heroic art. Same sh*t, different asshole.

If only there were works by socialists.

http://www.digitalronin.f2s.com/politicalcompass/composers.php

Why not take a good read of that, ya wanker!

Perhaps the 'socialists' by your definition indulge in anarchist fantasies and lacked the talent to be called composers.

Damn! I've also forgotten to list Smetana's majestic Die Moldau (Vlata). That piece's opening even inspired that Israeli national anthem.

I put the question of socialist composers beyond the socialist-realism school to Dr. M. (that's my little bro, linked above). I'll post his answer in dull later, but the short and (not so) sweet version is there aren't any.

I lean on Germans' works throughout. With the exception of occasional Italian and semi-Italian composers (Albinoni-Italian and Mozart-“semi-Italian” due to his proximity in Vienna).

Beethoven: String Quartets nos. 130-135 (his "late" quartets--his best) and Hammerklavier
Brahms: Symphony no. 3 ("frei aber froh" all the way, man)
Wagner: Die Ring Des Nibelungen (particularly ‘Loge, Hör!’ from Die Walküre and the Vorspielen and Orchesterzwichenspielen from Die Walküre and Die Götterdamerung--I listen to 'Zurück vom Ring' almost daily)
Bruckner: 4th Symphony (1st movement especially)
Albinoni: Oboe Concerto in G minor Op. 9 no. 8 (I find his Oboe concerti to equal or surpass Vivaldi's violin concerti--especially when performed on trumpet;))
Bach: Suites for solo cello (Janos Starker > Yo-Yo Ma)
Mozart: Piano Concerto no. 21

I have love/hate relationship with The Rite of Spring, which I congratulate with orchestral genius, but loath the later composers who used it as a symbol of the breaking of tonality. Haha, you dastardly atonalists searching for work now that the fad is over: Who’s right, now!

I've never heard of these names let alone their music. The only 20th Century classical I've heard are film/game scores.
you Poor little pineapple.

you Poor little pineapple.

More like Banana (Yellow on the outside, White on the inside).

At the risk of sounding the like the classical version of a scenester:

Mozart's 4th always rung well with me. I also love Canon, though I don't know who wrote it originally or whether it is a true classical piece.

I put the question of socialist composers beyond the socialist-realism school to Dr. M. (that's my little bro, linked above). I'll post his answer in dull later, but the short and (not so) sweet version is there aren't any.

Here is his full answer (or dull, depending on your opinion of the above typo. :)).

They tried to get socialist music after the Prague
manifesto. They wanted music that celebrated the
ideals of communism and such. In a preface to a book
by serialist composer rene Leibowitz, Jean paul
Sartre, himself a serious communist, wrote about their
plan to celebrate communism and socialism by setting
texts that did the same. He was pointing out that
music could not carry significance and can only have
meaning, pointing out something about how the music
couls remain the same, and the text could be changed
to something celebrating any nation, capitalism, or
even the glories of the TVA!
So, some may have tried socialist music, but they
failed.

Damn! I've also forgotten to list Smetana's majestic Die Moldau (Vlata). That piece's opening even inspired that Israeli national anthem.
Sometimes it's easier to list works that you can't stand. There's a few modern pieces that I just can't bear to hear. I won't walk out, but I won't buy tickets to a concert that features them, either.

More like Banana (Yellow on the outside, White on the inside).
you Sir, are nothing but a fizzle!

Mozart's Requiem is particularly compelling for mine.

I enjoyed Bach's Brandenburg Concertos studying music at school, all those years ago. His Toccata & Fugue's a fave as well.

Instrumental, short form:

RESPIGHI -- Pines of Rome

Choral, short form:

MESSIAEN -- O Sacrum Convivium

Instrumental, long form:

GORECKI -- Symphony No. 2

Choral, long form:

BERLIOZ -- L'Enfance du Christ

I've never heard of these names let alone their music. The only 20th Century classical I've heard are film/game scores.

That's a pity. Respighi, Varese, Gorecki, Orff, Kodaly, Xenakis, Ligeti, Reich, Ives, Cage, Zwilich, Berg, Schoenbeg, Britten, Copland, and even Bernstein and Sondheim -- these and many more made or are still making very good modern symphonic/concert/choral music.

I like some of it. Eva used a lot of classical music. If only there were works by socialists.

Beethoven after he struck the dedication to Napoleon from one of his symphonies after the midget declared himself emperor? Face it, Beethoven's works are too good to let them be appropriated by the right wing.

Personal faves: Beethoven, Copeland, Ives, Grieg and miscellaneous 'medieval' classical/folk music where the lines become blurred.

Side note: am I the only one here that finds Mozart hideously schmaltzy?


Side note #2: Wagner's The Pilgrim's chorus. How can such a fucking moronic riff kick so much ass?

Shostakovich, however he spelled it, was just a little communist.

VERY little. Far too many people (at least, those with an opinion) seem to think Dmitry Shostakovich was a Party stooge who wrote pieces to glorify the Soviet empire. Nothing could be further from the truth. Listen to his Tenth Symphony -- listen for the folk-music influences and other subtle jabs at teh Communist authority. He was ordered to compose for the Rodina, and that's precisely what he did -- for the people's motherland, not the Party's.

http://www.digitalronin.f2s.com/politicalcompass/composers.php

Why not take a good read of that, ya wanker!

Beethoven and Bartok on the side of our fellow travellers? That's good enough for me. Bizarre that you call that a kind of victory.

--snip--
I have love/hate relationship with The Rite of Spring, which I congratulate with orchestral genius, but loath the later composers who used it as a symbol of the breaking of tonality. Haha, you dastardly atonalists searching for work now that the fad is over: Who’s right, now!


That hardly matters, does it? Atonalism was never meant to replace tonality. Tonality, for the most part, is something human ears are damn near born to hear and understand. Atonality takes more conditioning than tonality and is therefore infinitely less popular. It'll hang around in must corners of college music buildings, raising its head every so often in a senior recital or programmed into a modern works concert, but for the most part, it was about as much threat to tonality as aleatoric (chance) music was to form and rhythm -- not much.

Stravinsky kicked ass and took names with Le Sacre du Printemps -- I can't see how you could love and hate it. I got nothin' but love, especially for the 1919-Paris-riot-inducing "Dance of the Adolescents" section.

It's still amazing to me just how many people who are so snooty when it comes to "classical" will discount jazz.

Suit yourselves, man.

It's still amazing to me just how many people who are so snooty when it comes to "classical" will discount jazz.

Suit yourselves, man.

Uh...we ARE suiting ourselves. I saw nobody "discounting" jazz -- they're merely ignoring your post because this particular thread is ABOUT classical music. If you'd like to start your own jazz thread, I'll post there, too. Don't blame the shoe store for not having eggs on the shelves, brother.

Tonality, for the most part, is something human ears are damn near born to hear and understand. Atonality takes more conditioning than tonality and is therefore infinitely less popular.

Hmmmm. However, the 'natural'/'real' world is itself atonal, and so it seems that we as a species are somewhat trained in hearing and understanding that, although possibly only to the extent of isolating individual sources and acting in response to them, rather than letting the whole wash over us.

Hmmmm. However, the 'natural'/'real' world is itself atonal, and so it seems that we as a species are somewhat trained in hearing and understanding that, although possibly only to the extent of isolating individual sources and acting in response to them, rather than letting the whole wash over us.

"Natural" is, first of all, a subjective term. Secondly, if you're referring to the general ambient sound of an outdoor setting minus the overlay of humanity, then it's neither tonal nor atonal. Tonality is as natural an organizing system as could be devised for sound, given that it all stems from the vibration of a single string and the vibrations within those vibrations as the string sections itself up along the harmonic series.

Take one long string, call it an A @ 440Hz (cycles per second). Fulcrum that string in its dead center and you'll get another A, an octave higher (880Hz). Divide the string into thirds and you'll get an E (too tired for the math, someone else can do it). Into fourths, and you get another A (1760Hz). Into FIFTHS, and you get a C# -- not an even-tempered C#, but one that will sound like the third of an A major scale. Thus, tonality, expecially MAJOR tonality, is a physical -- acoustical -- and natural -- fact. That's why MINOR sounds fairly "sad" in most cases -- you don't get a C natural out of that A string until you're WAY up to partials that the vast majority of human ears can't pick up from a single fundamental string.

To see what I'm on about, for those who aren't music geeks/teachers like me, the next time you're at a real piano (strings, remember), hold down the sustain (loud) pedal (it's the pedal on the right) and play any fairly low single note reasonably hard. Now listen...as the note you've played begins to fade (decay, as they say in music), the overtones I've mentioned come ringing out. It may take a few strikes of the low note to hear those partials ring, but they will. The easiest one to hear is the E on the aforementioned A string...also known as the fifth, if A is the root (or "do" of a scale). The third rings next easiest, followed by the flat (or dominant) seventh.

Point is, tonality IS natural. Atonality had to break the shackes of acoustical harmonics. People got it, but got tired of it after a while. Unsatisfying harmonics can themselves be satisfying, but not for long.

"Natural" is, first of all, a subjective term.

Therefore it was employed in inverted commas.

Point is, tonality IS natural. Atonality had to break the shackes of acoustical harmonics. People got it, but got tired of it after a while. Unsatisfying harmonics can themselves be satisfying, but not for long.

This argument would hold if the 'natural' world had a tendecny to produce pure sine waves, which is far from the truth: unlike your example of a pure imaginary string stopped at different lengths, the things of the 'natural' world produce messy concatenations of undertones/overtones/harmonics/resonances with every sound they make.

The Planets, Toccata and Fugue in D Minor, Grieg's Piano Concerto in A minor, Carmina Burana's O Fortuna segment, and Die Walkure from Der Ring Des Nibelungen are all up there among my favourites.

This argument would hold if the 'natural' world had a tendecny to produce pure sine waves, which is far from the truth: unlike your example of a pure imaginary string stopped at different lengths, the things of the 'natural' world produce messy concatenations of undertones/overtones/harmonics/resonances with every sound they make.
Only because various objects producing sounds overlap. Sound waves from a single object or being tend to be mathematically related (ie. harmonically related). Consider birds. Each bird has a fairly singable, semi-tonal structure to its song. They have a structure and a form, as well as rules regarding content. Only when you lump twenty birds together does it become cacophony. You're right that on a whole there is no well-tempered system by which the natural world is governed. A piece of rock will just as likely resonate a perfect Db as it will an A + 11 cents. You're also right that put all together there's much more disharmony (tonally speaking) in the natural world than harmony. But, I don't think that means the natural world is atonal.

Remember, atonality is not the absence of rules in music, it's the use of different rules--specifically, different rules of perception. The perception is removed from the affected, frequency based world of harmony between two notes we get from tonality (frequency based in the sense that pleasing harmonies have simpler ratios; ie. 2:3 for a perfcect 5th) and placed in the more cerebral, mathematical realm in which the grotesque nature of a harmony is largely irrelevant to the symbolic content of the music. Atonality is not randomly organized or disorganized, it's just organized by a different rubric. Even total serialism is organized according to some pre-decided plan (even it that's just a tone/attribute row)

The natural world is not close to either human rubric of music: atonal or tonal. I believe it is closest to a sort of micro-tonal rubric, that is a rubric which both doesn't conform to the set twelve chromatic notes, but is still generally concerned with the pleasurability of its sounds. In animals anyway.

That hardly matters, does it? Atonalism was never meant to replace tonality. Tonality, for the most part, is something human ears are damn near born to hear and understand. Atonality takes more conditioning than tonality and is therefore infinitely less popular. It'll hang around in must corners of college music buildings, raising its head every so often in a senior recital or programmed into a modern works concert, but for the most part, it was about as much threat to tonality as aleatoric (chance) music was to form and rhythm -- not much.
Oh, I'm sure there were plenty of academics (mostly academics anyway) in the first part of the 20th centurey who felt atonality would replace tonality. That they were incorrect isn't really relevant. They thought they were right, quashed tonal achievement in the past century, and pointed to Stravinsky as a "gateway drug", so to speak, to atonality. I like certain parts and aspects of the piece, I just don't like what people made of it after the fact.

Most anything by Bach on harpsichord and organ. Especially his Toccata and Fugue in D minor, Barber's Adagio for strings, Vilvaldi's Four Seasons. Wagner's Ride of the Valkyries and for neo-classical/minimalist,Phillip Glass. Of course there are many other favorites...these just spring to mind first.

First off, I would like to say that I am only 15, yet exclusively listen to Classical Music (except for Korn, they are good too).

1. Lets see. Well, I like every single Chopin Piece there is to start off. I have almost everything he has ever written (124 out of 169 pieces in total). Favorite player of Chopin has to be Artur Rubinstein, then right below him comes Evgeny Kissin.

2. Rachmaninoff Comes second. While I do not have a lot of stuff by him, I do have his greatest hits, all of his preludes. All the piano concertos, and some various etudes and stuff by him. I like Rafael Orozco the best, but he doesnt do a lot of recordings. I am forced to listen to Vladmir Ashkenazy who I don't like very much.

3. BEETHOVEN!!!! One of the greatest without a doubt. I have the best of his symphonies (at least in my oppinion), Piano Sonatas 1-15, and his late sonatas (27-32) I have all of his piano concertos played by Rubinstein again, Missa Solemnis, and some other various...things...best player of Beethoven has to be Alfred Brendel.

4. Listz. The music is sooo fast and sooo complicated that listening to it just gets my heart racing. The best CD I have is Evgeny Kissin playing Liszt's etudes d'execution Transcendante.

5. Schumann. I don't have much by him, but the little I do have is wonderful. I have his Fantasia in C played by Kissin. Also, I have Rubinstein playing Fantasiestucke and Carnaval. Nobody plays Schumann better than Rubinstein.

6. Debussy. I broke the bank and spend like 80 bucks on the Entire Debussy collection played by Walter Gieseking. His playing is by far the best Debussy I have heard.

I like a bunch of other guys too, including Schubert, Tchaikovsky, Mozart, Bach, Dvorak, Scott Joplin (not so classical), Mendelssohn, C.M von Weber, prokofiev, and many others, but they do not make it onto my 'can't go on without it' list.
Oh yeah, and as you might see, I like piano the most. I don't have a lot of orchestra alone stuff. I myself have played piano for , almost 8 years now, and I play many of the songs I listen to. Right now I am working on Rachmaninoffs Prelude in C# minor Op3/2 (its pretty easy actually, ill be done soon)
Sorry for the long post guys, but I take my classical music seriously!

3. BEETHOVEN!!!! One of the greatest without a doubt. I have the best of his symphonies (at least in my oppinion)
I'm just curious, which symphonies are those? Do you mena the best of his symphonies as in the best performances of them, or the best of the nine? I personally like Kleiber for performance (though he sadly only recorded the fifth and the seventh). As far as my favorite of the nine, I've always had a strange attraction to the Eighth symphony for some reason.

mozarts symphony no. 25, and Bachs brandenburg concertos

hahah! you've listed almost all of my favourite composers and pieces. :p

i could add a few though
dvorak's fifth simphony(or which ever one is the opposite of the ninth, the one that people argue the ninth is actually the fifth and the fifth is something else)
shostakovich allegro non troppo
shostakovich festive overture
shostakovich symphony 10, allegro
mussorgsky night on bald mountain
borodin prince igor(all of them)
wagner flying dutchman overture
wagner tannenhouser overture
wagner lohengrin(all of them)
wagner die walkure(all of them)
wagner die meistersingers
wagner das rhinegold(all of them)
EDIT:
oh! and
holst mars
williams jurrasic park overture
williams star wars overture
williams yoda's theme

I meant favorite actual Symphonies. In my oppinion, those are 3-6, and 9.
Also, the best performances have are the London Philharmonic Orchestra ones.

This argument would hold if the 'natural' world had a tendecny to produce pure sine waves, which is far from the truth: unlike your example of a pure imaginary string stopped at different lengths, the things of the 'natural' world produce messy concatenations of undertones/overtones/harmonics/resonances with every sound they make.

First of all, the string I used in my example is not "imaginary". I specifically explained how to hear overtones on a REAL piano string.

Second of all, aw screw it -- your argument was refuted by the next poster already.