NationStates Jolt Archive

I wonder what Bush will say.
And weather he will form a proper english sentece :D ...Im sorry i shouldnt joke

there have been tererest attacks in britain for years its virtuly imposable to stop them, america thorght no body could attack them before 9/11 no country is safe no matter how good there security is in stopping tererists getting into the country any one could be a terrerist i wish people would stop blaming muslims. it ccould have been the I.R.A it could have been someone who who doesnt like the brittish. you carnt stop tererists getting guns and explosives into the country. Remember the bomb in that conservitive meeting in that hotal they probibly had good security. :mad: :confused:

Is farsi your first language, or something? It's Al-Qaeda, man. They've claimed responsibility.

I can only say this. What goes aroun comes around. Our government has been killing inocent people in Irak for 10 years....

My heart is crying for the inocent here in my own town London. But i have only Bush and Blair to blame for this...

If i see any of the two i will f...... smack them myself... Those F...... murderers.


Mr. Dillon

I can only say this. What goes aroun comes around. Our government has been killing inocent people in Irak for 10 years....
My heart is crying for the inocent here in my own town London. But i have only Bush and Blair to blame for this...
If i see any of the two i will f...... smack them myself... Those F...... murderers.
Mr. Dillon
This ain't the time. Keep the politics out, and let the dead and injured rest for a little while, goddamnit!

I suggest you look at the history of Terrorism on US Soil. I could list most of them by memory dating from 1993 :mad:
what terrorism in america some one told me that the americans set up the camps for the al-quda and that they gave they explosives. the englissh have had tererist attacks for a lot longer. clashes bettween the proterstant goverment and monarchy and catholics go back hundreds of years. because the goverment and monerchy arested and killed hundreds of catholics. we are not the french ally.

I can only say this. What goes aroun comes around.

:rolleyes:

Wondered how long that would take ...

what terrorism in america some one told me that the americans set up the camps for the al-quda and that they gave they explosives. the englissh have had tererist attacks for a lot longer. clashes bettween the proterstant goverment and monarchy and catholics go back hundreds of years. because the goverment and monerchy arested and killed hundreds of catholics.
Yes, I think back in 1970's the US did fund OBL

what terrorism in america some one told me that the americans set up the camps for the al-quda and that they gave they explosives. the englissh have had tererist attacks for a lot longer. clashes bettween the proterstant goverment and monarchy and catholics go back hundreds of years. because the goverment and monerchy arested and killed hundreds of catholics.

Is it really necessary to compare who's had it worst at a time like this? Grow the goddamned fuck up.

what terrorism in america some one told me that the americans set up the camps for the al-quda and that they gave they explosives. the englissh have had tererist attacks for a lot longer. clashes bettween the proterstant goverment and monarchy and catholics go back hundreds of years. because the goverment and monerchy arested and killed hundreds of catholics.
For example, the Oklahoma bombing... Also, the Weathermen. And there have beem hundreds more, but I don't know the half of them. Clashes between Protestants and Catholic, outside of Northern Ireland, haven't REALLY been a huge deal in Britain, as far as I know (I could be wrong... British history isn't my strong point).

I can only say this. What goes aroun comes around. Our government has been killing inocent people in Irak for 10 years....

My heart is crying for the inocent here in my own town London. But i have only Bush and Blair to blame for this...

If i see any of the two i will f...... smack them myself... Those F...... murderers.


Mr. Dillon

Good point! I suppose that we are to blame for these, too? :rolleyes:

(Note: you can find the original here: http://www.answers.com/topic/list-o...orist-incidents , I stripped out all the non-US related ones for a previous post. Now add in the attacks on the British, Spanish, Italians, Russians, Australians and others that have suffered.)

• 1983 April 18 U.S. Embassy Bombing in Beirut, Lebanon kills 63
• 1983 September 23 Gulf Air Flight 771 is bombed, killing all 117 people on board
• 1983 October 23 Marine Barracks Bombing in Beirut kills 241 U.S. Marines. 58 French troops from the multinational force are also killed in a separate attack.
• 1985 TWA Flight 847 hijacking
• 1985 October 7 - October 10 Achille Lauro cruise ship hijacking by Palestinian Liberation Front, during which passenger Leon Klinghoffer is shot dead.
• 1985 EgyptAir Flight 648 hijacked by Abu Nidal group, flown to Malta, where Egyptian commandos storm plane; 60 are killed by gunfire and explosions.
• 1986 TWA Flight 840 bombed on approach to Athens airport; 4 Americans, including an infant, are killed.
• 1986 April 6 the La Belle discotheque in Berlin, a known hangout for U.S. soldiers, was bombed, killing 3 and injuring 230 people, for which Libya is held responsible. In retaliation, the US bombs Libya in Operation El Dorado Canyon and tries to kill dictator Qaddafi.
• 1986 Pan Am Flight 73, an American civilian airliner, is hijacked; 22 people die when plane is stormed in Karachi, Pakistan.
• 1988 Pan Am Flight 103 bombing (Lockerbie). The worst act of terrorism against the United States prior to September 11, 2001.
• 1989 Avianca Flight 203 bombed over Colombia
• 1993 February 26 World Trade Center bombing kills 6 and injures over 1000 people
• 1993 Failed New York City landmark bomb plot
• 1993 Mir Aimal Kansi, a Pakistani, fires an AK-47 assault rifle into cars waiting at a stoplight in front of the Central Intelligence Agency headquarters. Two died.
• 1994 December 11 A small bomb explodes on board Philippine Airlines Flight 434, killing a Japanese businessman. Authorities found out that Ramzi Yousef planted the bomb to test it for his planned terrorist attack.
• 1995 Operation Bojinka is discovered on a laptop computer in a Manila, Philippines apartment by authorities after an apartment fire occurred in the apartment.
• 1995 Bombing of military compound in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia
• 1996 June 25 Khobar Towers bombing
• 1997 A terrorist opened fire on tourists at an observation deck atop the Empire State Building in New York City, killing a Danish national and wounding visitors from the United States, Argentina, Switzerland and France before turning the gun on himself. A handwritten note carried by the gunman claimed this was a punishment attack against the "enemies of Palestine".
• 1998 U.S. embassy bombings in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania and Nairobi, Kenya, killing 225 people and injuring more than 4,000.
• 1999 Ahmed Ressam is arrested on the United States-Canada border in Port Angeles, Washington; he confessed to planning to bomb the Los Angeles International Airport as part of the 2000 millennium attack plots
• 1999 Jordanian authorities foil a plot to bomb US and Israeli tourists in Jordan and pick up 28 suspects as part of the 2000 millennium attack plots
• 2000 The last of the 2000 millennium attack plots fails, as the boat meant to bomb USS The Sullivans sinks
• 2000 October 12 USS Cole bombing kills 17 US sailors
• 2001 September 11, 2001 attacks kill almost 3,000 in a series of hijacked airliner crashes into two landmarks: the World Trade Center in New York City, New York, and The Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia. A fourth plane crashes in Somerset County, Pennsylvania.
• 2001 Paris embassy attack plot foiled
• 2001 Richard Reid, attempting to destroy American Airlines Flight 63, is subdued by passengers and flight attendants before he could detonate his shoe bomb
• 2002 Singapore embassies attack plot foiled
• 2002 June 14 attack outside U.S. Consulate in Karachi
• 2002 Kidnapping and murder of journalist Daniel Pearl
• 2002 October 12 Bali car bombing of holidaymakers kills 202
• 2003 Riyadh Compound Bombings - bombings of United States expat housing compounds in Saudi Arabia kill 26 and injure 160. Al-Qaeda blamed
• 2003 Casablanca Attacks in Casablanca, Morocco leaves 41 dead. The attack involved 12 bombers and 5 targets. The targets were "Western and Jewish". Attack attributed to a Moroccan al-Qaeda-linked group
• 2003 Canal Hotel Bombing in Baghdad, Iraq kills 22 people including the top UN representative, Sergio Vieira de Mello
• 2003-2004 In response to the 2003 invasion of Iraq, the Iraqi insurgency in that country stage dozens of suicide bombings, kidnappings and several beheadings targeting Iraqi, Coalition and humanitarian targets. Attacks on some coalition forces may not be terrorist attacks under Protocol I to the Geneva Conventions which gives lawful combatant status to non-uniformed guerrillas resisting foreign occupation if they display arms openly. As neither the US or Iraq have signed this protocol it is not applicable to attacks on US forces.
• 2003 October 15 - A bomb is detonated by Palestinians against a US diplomatic convoy in the Gaza Strip killing three Americans
• 2004 May 29 Al-Khobar massacres--Islamic terrorists kill 22 people at an oil compound in Saudi Arabia.
• 2004 December 6 Suspected al Qaeda-linked group attacks U.S. consulate in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, killing 5 local employees.

How many times do you stand in the street and let the other guy hit you before you hit him back?

Get this into your head: These people WANT TO KILL YOU because you don't believe in what they believe. It's that simple. They've been at war with the West since the 60s at least.

http://www.mikelynaugh.com/SupportTheTroops/Thumbs/tn_IMG_3567.jpg

:rolleyes:

Wondered how long that would take ...
I know, listen mate, innocent people have died, not soildiers, not murderers, inncoents! What did they do wrong.

Is it really necessary to compare who's had it worst at a time like this? Grow the goddamned fuck up.

Yes, "worst" could scarcely matter to the people in London right now.

Yes, I think back in 1970's the US did fund OBL

In the 80's the CIA gave him training.

FUCKIN GET OFF IT PEOPLE!!!
I really don't give a shit about who's fault it is.
Start a thread to talk about the politics if you feel like it.

For example, the Oklahoma bombing... Also, the Weathermen. And there have beem hundreds more, but I don't know the half of them. Clashes between Protestants and Catholic, outside of Northern Ireland, haven't REALLY been a huge deal in Britain, as far as I know (I could be wrong... British history isn't my strong point).
In the 70's/80's there where a lot of IRA bombings.

Al Qaeda has just claimed responsibility for several blasts in London. What goings on? I just woke up.

I'm not talking about the IRA. What I meant was that al Queda's next headliner could come from Britain. Given that she's the dearest ally to America, even the British government would be worried.
Eh. We've known for about a year that Al Qaeda was planning attacks somewhere in London. (But not where exactly). I don't understand this. We got the info from some prisoners at Guantanamo. I'm sure it was passed on. How was this not prevented? I don't get it. I think the first report on the plot was about 6 months ago. This makes no sense. Its like 911.
They get information, but nothing is done with it. No, this makes no sense.

How was this not prevented? I don't get it. I think the first report on the plot was about 6 months ago. This makes no sense. Its like 911.
They get information, but nothing is done with it. No, this makes no sense.

Yes, because of course terrorist cells operate by telling everyone in the organization every detail, so that any one of them can give away the missions and the people involved.

And of course this information is also always very detailed, telling who, what, where, when and who.

Obviously, the governments of the UK and the US did nothing so they can justify invading more of the middle eastern countries... they simply allowed their citizens to be slaughtered wholesale to rally the war effort.

:rolleyes:

Perhaps, but they were a little too quick to jump all over this tragedy for all the political gain they could milk from it, don't you think?

Well, the BNP is not the master of the ancient Oriental art of Ty Ming.

al-quida want america destroyed not muslims most muslims are peaceful they think its wrong to kill apart from in a jihad a holy war its a lot like the cristian crusades they thorght the intire wold should be cristians and anyone who wasnt cristian were inferdels sound a lot like what al-quider think.

ah. Ok. They were expecting it and trying to stop it. Being reported by British govt. official on Fox. Just shows how clever Al Qaeda is. They've shown in the past their ability to circumvent efforts to stop them from carrying out their attacks.

ah. Ok. They were expecting it and trying to stop it. Being reported by British govt. official on Fox. Just shows how clever Al Qaeda is. They've shown in the past their ability to circumvent efforts to stop them from carrying out their attacks.
I won't trust that until I hear it from the Beeb.

they dont want us to all become muslims i just heared that it was the european al-quda people should stop being racist did you know that since 9/11 in america lots more americans have become muslims than they did before 9/11

Source, please.

So... the Kenyans were asking for it in 1998 because they let us have an embassy there? The Tunisians were, when 21 were left dead, including 14 German tourists in the synagogue?

Please read this: http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0884893.html

This has been going on before Bush. Before Clinton, really, since al-Qaeda isn't that old an organization.

http://www.mikelynaugh.com/SupportTheTroops/Thumbs/tn_IMG_3567.jpg
As you can see... Al-Qaeda is the problem and always has been. Al-Qaeda is what the might of the USA's military force should be concentrated on. Not Iraq.
However... despite my optimism I honestly doubt that the USA will change it's foreign policy to give up the billions that are to be made in Iraq, in exchange for the pursuit of a silly thing called justice for 9/11.

Yes, because of course terrorist cells operate by telling everyone in the organization every detail, so that any one of them can give away the missions and the people involved.

And of course this information is also always very detailed, telling who, what, where, when and who.

Obviously, the governments of the UK and the US did nothing so they can justify invading more of the middle eastern countries... they simply allowed their citizens to be slaughtered wholesale to rally the war effort.

:rolleyes:
actually, we do have some high level AQ imprisoned at Guantanamo. That is why the Bush administration is refusing to allow them to leave or give them access to courts.

In the name of God, the merciful, the compassionate, may peace be upon the cheerful one and undaunted fighter, Prophet Muhammad, God's peace be upon him.

Nation of Islam and Arab nation: Rejoice for it is time to take revenge against the British Zionist Crusader government in retaliation for the massacres Britain is committing in Iraq and Afghanistan. The heroic mujahideen have carried out a blessed raid in London. Britain is now burning with fear, terror and panic in its northern, southern, eastern, and western quarters.

We have repeatedly warned the British Government and people. We have fulfilled our promise and carried out our blessed military raid in Britain after our mujahideen exerted strenuous efforts over a long period of time to ensure the success of the raid.

We continue to warn the governments of Denmark and Italy and all the Crusader governments that they will be punished in the same way if they do not withdraw their troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. He who warns is excused.

God says: "You who believe: If ye will aid (the cause of) Allah, He will aid you, and plant your feet firmly


-------------
Full Al-Queda statement.
WTF? Italy has no troops in Iraq. They pulled them all out last year. And Al Qaeda is threatening to attack Italy. This isn't about Iraq, its a ruse to shift blame to the victims. I would hope that the British people would not give in to cowardice. Brits are not resposible in any way for the fact that Al Qaeda is a bloodthirsty group whose only goal is the death of innocents.
Neither the Brits nor any of the other Europeans have done anything to make themselves targets. In fact, if you look at the past year, since Iraq war began, a large number of British people have been opposed to the war in Iraq. If the cause was Iraq, AQ would have worked with those people to peacefully change British policy on Iraq. But they have not. They have attacked innocents, both those who supported the Iraq war and those who opposed it. There was no differentiation.

We're usually smart enough to identify assholes. It does have the salutary effect of defusing their anger - let them rant some in public, people tend to ignore them, and they can't remain angry enough after ranting to do anything really bad.
Like George Bush?

You just see this as another opportunity to peddle your bull, don't you? Newsflash: the September 11 attacks preceeded the Iraq War. In fact, the war immediately prior to Spetember 11 was the war in Yugoslavia against white Chrisian Serbs to help the non-white muslim Kosovars establish an autonomous state.

Al-Qaeda are carrying out these attacks because they hate us, not because they feel the Iraq War is unjust. Osama bin Laden volunteered to fight Hussein with his Mujahideen alongside the Saudi Arabian army before the outbreak of the Gulf War. The only reason it didn't happen is because the House of Saud decided it would be better to let the West do all the fighting for them.

And so falls your house of cards.
My "house of cards" as in the follwing phrase?
"Every single nation that bought into Bush's WMD fairy tale and sent troops to Iraq has made themselves a target for these awfull attacks."

Newsflash... That is the Al-Qaeda's official stance on this matter and they have been quoted many times with similar phrases.

I'm not here to argue what led them to attack us in the first place for simply no reason's whatsoever could possibly justify what they did on 9/11 and prior to that.

All I'm saying is that the focus should've been on Al-Qaeda all along and that the Iraqi mess just made matters worse ten fold.

But then again I'm not much of a card player... :rolleyes:

It's already cost us over $90 billion. It'll take a decade for Iraq to become a "profitable venture", if you want to look at it from those terms. And, as stated, the oil of Iraq belongs to the Iraqis and their new gov't. It's not like the US is turning the place into a colony. 100.000 men can't rule 28 million, nor are they seeking to.What many americans don't understand or refuse to believe is that Bush has acomplished a remarkable thing. He spends 90 billion of tax-payers money to invade a nation allowing several large american companies to make astounding profits. An example off the top of my head would be Haliburton and 20 billion in profits. I wasn't talking about oil... and I think it's rather naive to think that any business venture in Iraq will be for the good of the American people or to recover the 90$ spent.

Big-shots make fortunes, tax-payers finance the investment while Bin-Laden is left relatively unchecked.

It's already cost us over $90 billion. It'll take a decade for Iraq to become a "profitable venture", if you want to look at it from those terms. And, as stated, the oil of Iraq belongs to the Iraqis and their new gov't. It's not like the US is turning the place into a colony. 100.000 men can't rule 28 million, nor are they seeking to.

What many americans don't understand or refuse to believe is that Bush has acomplished a remarkable thing. He spends 90 billion of tax-payers money to invade a nation allowing several large american companies to make astounding profits. An example off the top of my head would be Haliburton and 20 billion in profits. I wasn't talking about oil... and I think it's rather naive to think that any business venture in Iraq will be for the good of the American people or to recover the 90$ spent.

Big-shots make fortunes, tax-payers finance the investment while Bin-Laden is left relatively unchecked.

Rhetoric. List them, and what they've made.

If anything, it's HURTING American companies, since the price of oil has caused everything to become more expensive to produce, and therefore make Chinese goods cheaper.

BTW: Haliburton's stock price is just now getting back to 45, where it was 5 YEARS AGO (July 2000), after falling below 15. As for THEIR profits:
Sales in the last 12 months were: $19.9 billion (9.3% growth over the last 5 years). They have a market capitalization of $24.43 Billion.

By way of comparison,
Wyeth (WYE) the drug company
Sales in the last 12 months were: $17.9 billion (5.6% growth over the last 5 years). They have a market capitalization of $58.67 Billion.

...so where are the big profits? If you take any number of like-sized companies, Haliburton's income hasn't grown out of step with the market. They're not overvalued.

Now, I do agree that the oil companies are making money hand over fist. But that's a MARKET issue, not a war one. Odds are that oil would have been just about (maybe slightly less) expensive because of China and India's growth. You can't have 2 nations with 40% of the planet's population become major economies without pain to the status quo. Recall that 13 years ago (Gulf War 1), oil went way DOWN after the war. That's because there wasn't as much demand from the rest of the world at that point other than Europe and America.
http://www.mikelynaugh.com/SupportTheTroops/Thumbs/tn_IMG_3567.jpg

You should see how the US has treated the majority of al-Qaeda people found overseas.

Very few of them went to Guantanamo.

Most were assassinated on the spot. That's payback. Sending them to a prison camp indefinitely, or even trying them before a court and sentencing them to a long term in prison is laughably light by comparison.

I did not suggest that they would be arrested. I sai that specialist teams would be sent to deal with those responsible. Comprende amigo?

Yep. We tried it right up until 10 September 2001.
This kind of put a damper on that:

http://www.mirrors.org/historical/2001-09-11-World-Trade_Center/wtc/wtc_005.jpg

Is posting this picture REALLY necessary? And does one tragedy count as more important than another?

You should see how the US has treated the majority of al-Qaeda people found overseas.

Very few of them went to Guantanamo.

Most were assassinated on the spot. That's payback. Sending them to a prison camp indefinitely, or even trying them before a court and sentencing them to a long term in prison is laughably light by comparison.
:rolleyes:
Gods above WL...don't you realise that many people and nations don't WANT to be like the US? Honestly don't? And that includes this type of murderous 'holy war in the name of democracy, freedom and the American way'? The British reaction to this will be based on their culture and their much more extensive experience of being the focus of terrorism. Trust me. They can be brutal bastards too...but they don't flaunt it as much.

Is posting this picture REALLY necessary?

Yes it is necessary.

Is posting this picture REALLY necessary? And does one tragedy count as more important than another?

Terrorism is terrorism. Some folks seem to forget that none of the dead did anything wrong, and that this is a war.

PS- I'll remove it if you like.

PPS- I work on Madison Ave.

Yes it is necessary.

Why?

Yep. We tried it right up until 10 September 2001.
This kind of put a damper on that:

http://www.mirrors.org/historical/2001-09-11-World-Trade_Center/wtc/wtc_005.jpg
just because an attack happened when we defended ourselves in accordance with the law isnt to say that if we had bombed everyone before then the attack would not have happened. do you really think that bombing a country, as punishment for the beliefs of an extremist minority, would be an effective solution to preventing sufficient disillusionment in the law abiding majority to triger an extremist majority? yours as ignorant as the people you would condemn.

Why?

To make sure that people don't ever forget that fateful day! To make sure that the people don't get complacent about terrorism. To make sure that the people remember just what we are fighting. We are fighting people that have no regards for the rules of war. THey will fight to the end. We should never forget that.

What, because your point was proven wrong and because it (what you implied was absurd) works?
I don't know, you're a loon, never mind.

It did? Tell that to the 3000 that died on 9/11. Tell that to the people who died in Madrid. Tell that to the people that just died today. Yea it worked alright. :rolleyes:

Terrorism is terrorism. I'll remove it if you like.
No, I am not censoring it. I would like to understand your reason for posting it, however. It's bound to generate very heated remarks about the US's being self-centered.

People on both sides of the argument tend to forget that while the WTC tragedy was on American soil, it was a strike that murdered nationals of many nations.

To make sure that people don't ever forget that fateful day! To make sure that the people don't get complacent about terrorism. To make sure that the people remember just what we are fighting. We are fighting people that have no regards for the rules of war. THey will fight to the end. We should never forget that.
:rolleyes:

Why is it that it is mostly USians on this board that are doing the flag-waving, speech making and warmongering, when they weren't even the targets? I haven't seen any of the Brits get this frothy yet...

...hmmm, were y'all disappointed in the Spanish response to the terrorist attacks in Madrid?

Argggh. Okay, look, I apologise for getting all anti-American...but it's awfully hard to stomach the kind of self-centered comments people are making here. This happened in London...not New York.

just because an attack happened when we defended ourselves in accordance with the law isnt to say that if we had bombed everyone before then the attack would not have happened. do you really think that bombing a country, as punishment for the beliefs of an extremist minority, would be an effective solution to preventing sufficient disillusionment in the law abiding majority to triger an extremist majority? yours as ignorant as the people you would condemn.

Nope. And you've completely mis-read the point. I responded to a point raised that we should chase these terrorists down and arrest them. That's simply not going to happen. What do you think, that we can walk up in blue uniforms and some "come along with us, Mr Bin Laden"?

Sheesh.

but the iq of a mod is the iq of its stupidest member divided by the number in the mod

Ouch. I'd cry if this were actually posted by someone who understood punctuation and standard spelling.

:rolleyes:

Why is it that it is mostly USians on this board that are doing the flag-waving, speech making and warmongering, when they weren't even the targets?

Hun, we have had a target on our backs for decades.

...hmmm, were y'all disappointed in the Spanish response to the terrorist attacks in Madrid? Or was that a non-issue because it couldn't be blamed on the A-rabs?

1: They pulled out after the attacks because that was what the terrorists wanted. :rolleyes: That was cowardly (and I will say that) and it gave the damn terrorists a victory.

2: They were still muslim extremists from North Africa that did that deed.

No, I am not censoring it. I would like to understand your reason for posting it, however. It's bound to generate very heated remarks about the US's being self-centered.

People on both sides of the argument tend to forget that while the WTC tragedy was on American soil, it was a strike that murdered nationals of many nations.

Hmm. I quoted the guy. He asked why the Allies were bombing/invading countries to catch the terrorists instead of just arresting them.

I posted the picture to illustrate that we're way, way beyond that now. Maybe after the 1993 attack on the WTC that might have worked. Maybe. Now that's like going to Hitler after he's already in the Sudetenland and asking him to give de-militarize the Rhur.

To make sure that people don't ever forget that fateful day! To make sure that the people don't get complacent about terrorism. To make sure that the people remember just what we are fighting. We are fighting people that have no regards for the rules of war. THey will fight to the end. We should never forget that.

Believe me, people will never forget it, especially when it is thrown up in their faces constantly. As remarked elsewhere time after time, the US is not the only country that has suffered from terror attacks, and to trot this out when London is reeling from its own tragedy strikes even ME as self-centered.

Will people remember the reason the terrorists feel they have to be terrorists do you think? Has anyone even bothered thinking about why people BECOME terrorists?? perhaps before we start wars with the terrorists, we should ask them why they are doing it.... ANYONE EVEN BOTHERED TO THINK ABOUT IT???
Their only goal is global conversion to islam. By any means necessary.

Halliburton...
quoting wikipedia...


There are many other companies operating in Iraq or even at home in the USA as you can imagine, that benefit from things such as no bid maneuvers.
Please don't tell me that everything is neatly tied up in this mumbo jumbo mess.

Right. Got anything besides Halliburton?
They're the main government military contractor for support, OF COURSE they're going to benefit with a war. Someone always does. And of course the no bid contracts were absurd. Where's the rest you mentioned?

We're also off topic. If you want to continue this, I recommend a new thread or telegrams.

Hun, we have had a target on our backs for decades. And the Brits have for centuries. Point being?

:rolleyes:

Why is it that it is mostly USians on this board that are doing the flag-waving, speech making and warmongering, when they weren't even the targets? I haven't seen any of the Brits get this frothy yet...

...hmmm, were y'all disappointed in the Spanish response to the terrorist attacks in Madrid?

Argggh. Okay, look, I apologise for getting all anti-American...but it's awfully hard to stomach the kind of self-centered comments people are making here. This happened in London...not New York.

Please quit with the anti-American shit. The reason some of us Americans are getting testy is because there are a couple jackasses in this thread who are trying to bait us into a flame war. Comments like, "Well, Britain will know what to do, we won't draw any quick or sloppy conclusions" and other comments about smoking the mother country of terrorists are clearly uncalled for. The attacks in London are no doubt a tragedy; I don't see why some feel necessary to subliminally slam America in times like these.

Believe me, people will never forget it, especially when it is thrown up in their faces constantly. As remarked elsewhere time after time, the US is not the only country that has suffered from terror attacks, and to trot this out when London is reeling from its own tragedy strikes even ME as self-centered.

I didn't trot it out though I was responding to a post that hunting down terrorists and arresting them is the plan of the past.

Please quit with the anti-American shit. The reason some of us Americans are getting testy is because there are a couple jackasses in this thread who are trying to bait us into a flame war. Comments like, "Well, Britain will know what to do, we won't draw any quick or sloppy conclusions" and other comments about smoking the mother country of terrorists are clearly uncalled for. The attacks in London are no doubt a tragedy; I don't see why some feel necessary to subliminally slam America in times like these.

Perhaps because of some of the remarks being made by my fellow Americans?
It's not about US. It's about the UK.

Please quit with the anti-American shit. The reason some of us Americans are getting testy is because there are a couple jackasses in this thread who are trying to bait us into a flame war. Comments like, "Well, Britain will know what to do, we won't draw any quick or sloppy conclusions" and other comments about smoking the mother country of terrorists are clearly uncalled for. The attacks in London are no doubt a tragedy; I don't see why some feel necessary to subliminally slam America in times like these.

If you are referring to my post, then say so. I was not slandering the Americans in any way. I was simply emphasising the very British, almost caricature British, way in which this will be handled. I will say that fi my comment about no conclusions being jumped to upset you, you should ask questions of your government, but it was not intended to upset anyone.

It's not about US. It's about the UK.

Well said. That's why I think some of the Brits in here need to quit with the baiting.

Their only goal is global conversion to islam. By any means necessary.
What an incredible insight. I'm sure that's all that needs to be said. :rolleyes:

Please quit with the anti-American shit. The reason some of us Americans are getting testy is because there are a couple jackasses in this thread who are trying to bait us into a flame war. Comments like, "Well, Britain will know what to do, we won't draw any quick or sloppy conclusions" and other comments about smoking the mother country of terrorists are clearly uncalled for. The attacks in London are no doubt a tragedy; I don't see why some feel necessary to subliminally slam America in times like these.
Maybe it's because some Americans think it necessary to 'teach the world how to fight terrorism'? How 'bout you ask your compatriotes to 'stop with the pro-American shit' and there won't be negative reactions to it? You can't have it all your way...flag waving and everyone nodding and agreeing with you.

Well said. That's why I think some of the Brits in here need to quit with the baiting.

What baiting? I've been in this thread for nearly four hours.

The vast majority are saying "We are going to take our time before we draw any conclusions", it is NOT equivalent to "The US is too hasty and caused this."

I'll also note there are non-Americans who told anti-Bush/Americans to take it elsewhere.

So, peace.

Well said. That's why I think some of the Brits in here need to quit with the baiting.
That goes both ways.

Christ, does anyone else find this incredibly, and inappropriately self-centered? "Oh no, people are bashing the US again...we haven't done anything to deserve it short of telling everyone how to run their lives and deal with terrorist the 'American' way...would people stop picking on us and just let us continue telling you what do do?"

Maybe it's because some Americans think it necessary to 'teach the world how to fight terrorism'? How 'bout you ask your compatriotes to 'stop with the pro-American shit' and there won't be negative reactions to it? You can't have it all your way...flag waving and everyone nodding and agreeing with you.

No, I wouldn't give the UK intel and military any lessons in how to do things.

They're the ones who taught us.

Anything from special forces techniques to interrogation techniques - they've done it all before - long experience in how to kick ass privately, quietly, and with a minimum of fuss. No need to observe legal niceties, either.

Just consider where we learned about "uncomfortable positions" and "the treatment".

:rolleyes:

Why is it that it is mostly USians on this board that are doing the flag-waving, speech making and warmongering, when they weren't even the targets? I haven't seen any of the Brits get this frothy yet...

...hmmm, were y'all disappointed in the Spanish response to the terrorist attacks in Madrid?

I remember back in 9/11 days it took you a few months to organize a "Blame-America-In-Place-Of-The-Murderers". Nowadays it only takes hours for the New-Left to act like the smarmy, sniping fifth-column gits we always knew they were.

I guess what happened in 2001 was just good PR practice to support the next wave of suicide fascists. Kudos to managing to use as a podium for bashing the Great Satan the victims of three seperate terrorist attacks in one post.

...The bodies aren't even cold yet, you disgusting ingrate.

Thanks.
Gotta disagree with you a bit on that point. Sometimes, you just can't work with the other side. Nazi Germany, Imperial Japan, Pinochet's Argentina, Libya until recently... and none of those were won by diplomacy.

If you're going to use examples, at least get them right. Pinochet was a Chilean dictator...and he was ousted by referendum. And the US was a great supporter of him...and with the Argentine dictatorships...so, huh?

For YOU. For YOUR country. Why must you continue assuming YOURS is the best way to handle terrorism?

Britain will do two things (based on the way they have reacted to IRA attacks), they will negotiate with those they can, and quitely (and bloodily) take out the people who directly organised it. You won't see it on the news, you won't hear about arrests, althogh there may be some smoke and mirros about trials, but the people on both sides who need to know will know. There will be memorials and the victims families will call for justice, but bodies will already be in ditches and forgotten.

I find it incredulous that some people are using this attack the US. To attack Bush. Bush has done nothing to provoke an attack on British territory. Al Qaeda declared war before Bush was even President (the embassy bombings in Africa, the USS Cole, Somalia).
If it was about Bush, Al Qaeda would have attacked the US or its holdings. But this is disproven by the fact that they attacked Britain, and its people.
This is about cold blooded terrorists who enjoy killing regardless of religion, ideology or nationality.
They don't care if you don't like Bush, they still want to kill you.
They don't care what your position on Iraq is. They want to kill you regardless.
In fact, look at Iraq, it should be clear there. The "insurgency" which is a branch of Al Qaeda, has been killing not Americans, but people from various nations as well as innocent Iraqi women and children.
If they were only going after people working or contracting with the US forces there, you could have a point that they were only trying to get the US out of Iraq. But the fact that the insurgents are targeting and killing Iraqi children proves otherwise.

And I heard we're next...... *hides*
Next? What country are you in?

...not all of us have the luxury of living in a small nation like Canada, that doesn't have to step up to non-popular issues like the US has to.

US, US, US... excuse me, the US didn't get the wind knocked out of it this AM. It was the UK. Not to single any one poster out, but is it wrong to point out that the focus of the world is on London, not Washington right now?

Honestly. Let's keep our own political point-scoring off-thread, or to ourselves for some minimum of time. Sound fair? All of us, full spectrum. Stop with the backbiting.

That not all of us have the luxury of living in a small nation like Canada, that doesn't have to step up to non-popular issues like the US has to.
Oh Christ. Enough. You say that the US has been a target for decades, as though that makes you an expert on terrorism, I point out the Brits have been targets for terrorism for centuries, and you somehow bring Canada into this? Get a point...because you seem to have lost yours.

Do you honestly believe that Al-Qaeda is the only terrorist network out there? Or that people with goals of their own aren't joining Al-Qaeda just to get the manpower and logistics to further their own gains? If you underestimate them so much, you are going to have problems. It is simply not possible that all these terrorists are backwards, religiously fanatic psychos...there are some very astute political minds involved in this too, and it is dangerous to forget that. You are talking about the pawns...do you REALLY think the hands controlling them are blinded by dogma to the exclusion of all else? As with all movements based on 'religion', those in the know are rarely as 'faithful' as the hordes they send to martyr themselves in the blood of innocents. Religion is a convenient way to merge divergent populations of people who would normally hate one another.
First off, you are twisting WL's words.
Second off, if you believe what you just typed, you do not know Al Qaeda. They are brilliant but they are still blinded by extremist religious dogma.

Right. Got anything besides Halliburton?
They're the main government military contractor for support, OF COURSE they're going to benefit with a war. Someone always does. And of course the no bid contracts were absurd. Where's the rest you mentioned?

We're also off topic. If you want to continue this, I recommend a new thread or telegrams.In the meantime try telling me why did the USA invade Iraq to begin with?

Oh Christ. Enough. You say that the US has been a target for decades, as though that makes you an expert on terrorism, I point out the Brits have been targets for terrorism for centuries, and you somehow bring Canada into this? Get a point...because you seem to have lost yours.

And you just lost yours. You've been dealing with the IRA who only want Northern Ireland Independence. Now your dealing with extremists who just want to destroy the Western World.

In the meantime try telling me why did the USA invade Iraq to begin with?

To get rid of a supporter of terrorism.

I remember back in 9/11 days it took you a few months to organize a "Blame-America-In-Place-Of-The-Murderers". Nowadays it only takes hours for the New-Left to act like the smarmy, sniping fifth-column gits we always knew they were.

I guess what happened in 2001 was just good PR practice to support the next wave of suicide fascists. Kudos to managing to use as a podium for bashing the Great Satan the victims of three seperate terrorist attacks in one post.

...The bodies aren't even cold yet, you disgusting ingrate.
Shut up. Seriously. Show me where I 'blamed America'. In fact, I'm asking you Americans that can't seem to shut up about yourself to take it elsewhere. As Kat has been trying to do. I can not understand how you manage to make everything about yourself this way.

Oh Christ. Enough. You say that the US has been a target for decades, as though that makes you an expert on terrorism, I point out the Brits have been targets for terrorism for centuries, and you somehow bring Canada into this? Get a point...because you seem to have lost yours.

Muhammad's ass-crack. Please don't blaspheme. :D

It seems so. Okay, here you go:

1) I didn't say the US was a target for decades, that was someone else. Please don't confuse me with other people.

2) My point was that you've consistantly railed against the US and UK's international policy, for as long as I've see you post on NS. Certainly the past year.
Yet I can't think of a SINGLE thing that Canada has ever done to make the world a better place. You come along when things might effect you (WW1, WW2, Korea), or when NATO goes somewhere.
At the end of the day, Canada itself doesn't even HAVE a foreign policy. Thus you seem to think you have some sort of "moral high ground" to lambast others.

That's my point. I'm working from a framwork of the Western World vs. the Islamist Radicals. I don't want to see the Middle East as a parking lot. I don't want to kill 'em all. But I DO want the world to come together and work to make terrorism not only morally reprehensible, but legally too. I want the world to rise up and slaughter all RADICAL TERRORIST groups.

If you don't kill the cancer all at once, you die.

That goes both ways.

Christ, does anyone else find this incredibly, and inappropriately self-centered? "Oh no, people are bashing the US again...we haven't done anything to deserve it short of telling everyone how to run their lives and deal with terrorist the 'American' way...would people stop picking on us and just let us continue telling you what do do?"


You're headed in the wrong direction. Just friendly advice.

In the meantime try telling me why did the USA invade Iraq to begin with?

My friend, if I knew that, I'd not only be elected into the Senate, I'd be raking in the dough on the book tour.

I'm asking you Americans that can't seem to shut up about yourself to take it elsewhere. As Kat has been trying to do. I can not understand how you manage to make everything about yourself this way.


I cant believe this is YOU saying this.

US, US, US... excuse me, the US didn't get the wind knocked out of it this AM. It was the UK. Not to single any one poster out, but is it wrong to point out that the focus of the world is on London, not Washington right now?

Honestly. Let's keep our own political point-scoring off-thread, or to ourselves for some minimum of time. Sound fair? All of us, full spectrum. Stop with the backbiting.

Please keep in mind that things drift after 40 pages (when I joined this thread).

http://www.mikelynaugh.com/SupportTheTroops/Thumbs/tn_IMG_3567.jpg

either way the bastards actually responsible should PAY THROUGH THE NOSE in a way that cant hold them up as martyrs to a next generation of bomb planters.

In the meantime try telling me why did the USA invade Iraq to begin with?
This was not about Iraq. It was not Bush. It's about hatred of all westerners be they Americans, Britains (spelling), Spaniards (my grandfather immigrated from Spain), Dutch, French, German, Danish, or even Canadian.
This is about Al Qaeda's quest to establish a global islamic caliphate based on fear and terror and the repeal of human rights.
Nay, this is not about conservatives versus liberals. This is about life versus death. This is about humanity versus inhumanity.
Those who blame the victims are doing exactly what Al Qaeda wants them to do. And by doing so, they are giving Al Qaeda the victory.
As far as I've known, (from history), the Brits have never surrendered to any one. Course that explains why Americans have never surrendered either. The US inherited that position from the UK of which it used to be a part.
The US will continue to stand with the UK on such matters, because they have always stood with us through good and through bad. They helped us when we needed it. And they supported us when the rest of the world seemed to be against us. Its time for Americans to return the favor.

Al Qaeda is very brilliant when it comes to strategizing and killing the innocent. They are brilliant when it comes to circumventing security measures. But they are blinded by a violent fanaticism that seeks the death of all innocents everywhere. A bloodthirsty fanaticism that does not discriminate on the basis of race, ideology, nationality, religion, gender, or age. And that blind fanaticism shall ultimately be their own undoing.

These people are willing to give their life for an absurd cause, willing to kill women and children and feel good about and they are trained and prepared. Now please explain to me how an average western government is going to stop them.

It cannot be done, and London proves just that.

Then why only Iraq?

We started in Afghanistan :rolleyes:

I was just answering a question in the simplest way possible that would allow me to get back to my work.

Then why only Iraq?


Humor is always the shortest distance between two people. :D
Why only Iraq? Have you forgotten Afghanistan?

Whatever.

Blinded? I doubt it. Made more hateful by? Able to count on more support because of? Assuredly. Blinded suggests that they can not see outside of their religious dogma to consider the political repercussions of their actions. This is clearly false. They've got people scared, they're shaking up the Islamic world and uniting against a 'common enemy' that they have managed to mostly create in carictature and who have unfortunately (and get this, I don't just mean the US, you following?) played into their hands somewhat and allowed more anti-Western sentiment to do their recruiting for them. Religion IS political. They can not hope to hold things together with religion alone...even if they destroyed the "Western Infidels" they would have to deal somehow with the dissenters within their ranks. Now how are they going to do that? What deals are being made with the Chechnyans? The Uzbeks? The Indonesians? The Saudis? The Palestinians? You can bet that there is some serious political movement in the background that has religious goals only as a thin veneer over a grab for more temporal power.

WL seems to think all you need to know about them is their religious goals. I say, no...that is not going to help you completely understand what is going on. I'm not twisting his words, I'm disagreeing with them.
ok, I never said they didn't know what they were doing. But that despite their cleverness, they are still blinded by hate. Hate which is their ultimate weakness.

This was not about Iraq. It was not Bush. I've never said that either. All i've stated is that the Iraq mess has made this matter worse.

We agree on this. Let it not also become ours.
Yes, we agree. Let us hope that this will serve as a wake up call and unite all peoples against the great evil that is terrorism, that is Al Qaeda.
As long as we remain divided, as long as we attack each other for polticical or whatever reason, Al Qaeda will continue to think they are winning. We must present a united international front regardless of who is attacked.

We started in Afghanistan :rolleyes:
Why only Iraq? Have you forgotten Afghanistan?
There was a reason for doing that. And I supported that war. Besides the american public would've never forgave them if they hadn't intervened in Afghanistan and you can't argue with that.

There was no reason for invading Iraq.

And on Fox, a US military official has just said they knew there was going to be an attack but they were not able to find out when or how, or what the targets would be.

If they can hit London, despite its cameras, its police, and the fact that British and American governments were doing what they could to prevent the attacks, is any place on earth safe?
No. Sadly no. And that is exactly what these sort of attacks accomplish...they make us feel utterly helpless. I can not fathom how ANYONE could justify to themselves the killing of innocents. This isn't about getting nations to 'pull out' of anything. It's deliberately focused on civilians, who the terrorists must realise don't have the political clout to change foreign policy. Christ...will this ever stop? Or is my historical perspective off? I guess there has always been terrorism, with civilians as the victims...am I wrong in thinking that has increased? Or is it about the same as it always has been, aside from the press these attacks get?

I could go on about this but out of respect for those that died today in a terrorist attack in London, I won't.Out of respect for those that died today... please do tell... England was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment Tony Blair got involved in Iraq. Spain was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment José Aznar got involved in Iraq.

It was Bush's pressure that convinced these nations of doing so...
Both were dispicably attacked in their capital cities.

Well, as a matter of fact the 9/11 terrorists were Muslims, and bin Laden and Al Quaeda consider themselves to be Muslims. Even if you consider them be no 'real' Muslims that doesn't change the fact that they do (note that this also does nowhere help to solve the problem).

Regarding Oklahoma City, no doubt that Christian fundamentalists can't be just as loony as Islamic ones.

dude, get off the other incident kick. This shit happened in LONDON, this thread is about LONDON. get your mind off other things (same goes for you Sinuhue)


as far as what has happened. I hope those who caused this attack gets what's coming to them. My condolences goes out to those in London and anyone who has been affected by these calous(sp) attacks.

Well, as a matter of fact the 9/11 terrorists were Muslims, and bin Laden and Al Quaeda consider themselves to be Muslims. Even if you consider them be no 'real' Muslims that doesn't change the fact that they do (note that this also does nowhere help to solve the problem).

Regarding Oklahoma City, no doubt that Christian fundamentalists can't be just as loony as Islamic ones.



I'm sorry, but you've confused Christian fundamentalist with Christian militants. I, as a strictly conservative Christian, take offense to that and demand an apology.

Out of respect for those that died today... please do tell... England was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment Tony Blair got involved in Iraq. Spain was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment José Aznar got involved in Iraq.

It was Bush's pressure that convinced these nations of doing so...
Both were dispicably attacked in their capital cities.

No out of real respect for those who died, drop it and argue somewhere else. Other people have been considerate enough to do so. Why cant you?

Out of respect for those that died today... please do tell... England was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment Tony Blair got involved in Iraq. Spain was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment José Aznar got involved in Iraq.

It was Bush's pressure that convinced these nations of doing so...
Both were dispicably attacked in their capital cities.
For the love God, get off it. Do you always use the massacre of innocents to score political points?

I'm sorry, but you've confused Christian fundamentalist with Christian militants. I, as a strictly conservative Christian, take offense to that and demand an apology.

33 People have been killed by bomb's in London - this is what this thread is about. All you've lost is some pride, which wont kill you. Please show more sense considering the situation. Thank you.

...And on Fox, a US military official has just said they knew there was going to be an attack but they were not able to find out when or how, or what the targets would be.
A ridiculous statement. Obviously there is going to be an attack... there's always going to be attack (unless this was the last terrorist attack ever on earth). To say, "we knew there was going to be an attack but not when or where or how" is to say absolutely nothing.
If they can hit London, despite its cameras, its police, and the fact that British and American governments were doing what they could to prevent the attacks, is any place on earth safe?
London isn't a police state. People move freely about the city. What's more, terrorist bombings in London are not a new event (though recently with things going relatively well in Ireland, it hasn't been what it was, say, in the 1980s when innocent people got killed all the time). There's really nothing that anyone can do to prevent detemined terrorists from successfully killing people. The fact that in the last few years there have been major attacks in the UK, Spain, the US, Japan, Indonesia, Russia, etc, etc, demonstrates this. "Is any place on earth safe?" Obviously not.

Well, as a matter of fact the 9/11 terrorists were Muslims, and bin Laden and Al Quaeda consider themselves to be Muslims. Even if you consider them be no 'real' Muslims that doesn't change the fact that they do (note that this also does nowhere help to solve the problem).

I don't care what they think. Frankly, neither should you. Qur'an, the Islamic holy text, the book that all Muslims are required to study, proves readily and easily that none of these people are Muslims.

Why would you take OBL's word for that which is Muslim rather than the Qur'an?

Regarding Oklahoma City, no doubt that Christian fundamentalists can't be just as loony as Islamic ones.

Not fundamentalists. I am a Muslim "fundamentalist". I believe Islam to its core and hold Qur'an as the immutable word of Allah. Oh, sure, some may think that - in and of itself - makes me nuts, but I suppose there are worse ways to be nuts.

Let's call them .... "false Christian extremists" or "false Muslim extremists".

No out of real respect for those who died, drop it and argue somewhere else. Other people have been considerate enough to do so. Why cant you?
For the love God, get off it. Do you always use the massacre of innocents to score political points?
I'm not argueing. Or trying to score points. I'm just trying to discuss some of the more unpleasant parts of this subject matter.
I apologise if I have been missinterpreted.

Out of respect for those that died today... please do tell... England was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment Tony Blair got involved in Iraq. Spain was never an Al-Qaeda target until the moment José Aznar got involved in Iraq.

It was Bush's pressure that convinced these nations of doing so...
Both were dispicably attacked in their capital cities.


This is the goal of terrorists- this is the reason they attacked London today- to start driving a wedge between the UK and the US.

Iraq is just being used by clever opportunists. trying to build momentum in the current wave of unpopularity.

I trust the US will do everything we can to assist our UK friends in identifying,tracking and annihilating those responsible for today's attacks.

No out of real respect for those who died, drop it and argue somewhere else. Other people have been considerate enough to do so. Why cant you?
Amen.

That guy is starting piss me off. I might actually have to walk away from these forums for a while to cool off.

Has anyone noticed that phone lines in the US are being coopted? I just tried to call a creditor to get some information about a bill, but got the Dallas Morning News instead.
I've always used that number to call the creditor. That's been there number for the last 2 years and it just changed to someone else this morning.

I'm sorry, but you've confused Christian fundamentalist with Christian militants. I, as a strictly conservative Christian, take offense to that and demand an apology.
What BS. The post equated muslim fundamentalists with christian fundamentalists... if you're offended at the conflation of fundamentalists with militants, you should be just as offended by the conflation of muslim fundamentalists with militants.

2 Come on, how many serious terrorist acts around the world are commited by christians? The correct answer is not nearly as many as are commited by muslims. Odds are that it's a jihadist organization.[/QUOTE]

And have you ever stopped to think about why that is? Its because of how America has treated those nations in the last few decades. You can't just say "they hate the west because they are evil muslims". You have to ask WHY.
Obviously though, this is a despicible and barbaric act, as was the attack on the towers. The terrorists accomplish nothing.

NONONONONONONO. america is making this about them.. america has no intelegence of a threat *NONE* yet they make us citizens worried.. im moving to canada.

I've spent all day on the phone to friends and family in london. Who the fuck cares about christian and islamic militants?

I'm just trying to discuss some of the more unpleasant parts of this subject matter.


Get off your high horse, you've barely mentioned the subject-matter-at-hand. Instead you've chosen to take it upon yourself to blithely discuss anything you feel is somehow relevant, most of which is clearly NOT.

And now dear friends, I'm off to my local pub.

Who the fuck cares about christian and islamic militants?

Other Christian and Islamic militants, presumably.

I trust the US will do everything we can to assist our UK friends in identifying,tracking and annihilating those responsible for today's attacks.I sure hope the US does exactly that. However until now there's been very little attention being paid to Al-Qaeda and that has troubled me for some time.

Other Christian and Islamic militants, presumably.

Well can't they milit somewhere else?

What BS. The post equated muslim fundamentalists with christian fundamentalists... if you're offended at the conflation of fundamentalists with militants, you should be just as offended by the conflation of muslim fundamentalists with militants.


Duh, as a Christian fundamentalist who doesn't advocate blowing people up, don't you think I would be offended when someone equates militants with fundamentalists? Same for Muslim fundamentalists who don't support Al-Qaeda.

Get off your high horse, you've barely mentioned the subject-matter-at-hand. Instead you've chosen to take it upon yourself to blithely discuss anything you feel is somehow relevant, most of which is clearly NOT.

And now dear friends, I'm off to my local pub.

AGREED, stop with the political wrangling, and get to the subject matter at hand, our condlences to the people involved in London. Who is responisble is irrevelent at present.

As for the pub thing...good on yeh!

Get off your high horse, you've barely mentioned the subject-matter-at-hand. Instead you've chosen to take it upon yourself to blithely discuss anything you feel is somehow relevant, most of which is clearly NOT.If you search back through the 70 odd pages you'll find my comments I'm sure.

The US are raising security. I bet that makes Americans feel more secure

No, I'm not about to even TRY doing that. You've heard this from Kat, and from myself and quite a few others so far - just drop it, or go to sinuhue's thread.

Your political opportunism is utterly revolting, and I don't mind saying so.

Now bugger off.I'm sorry that you feel that way.
All I've done was voice my opinion. I have nothing to gain from that, I'm not a politician and I'm not trying to score points of anykind.

Once again my most sincere apologies.