NationStates Jolt Archive

It occurred to me that certain information should be free. Yes, not charging money for it hinders its improvement, but in some cases, people are just taking public information (that's not always easy to access), copying it, putting it in a book, and then selling it. In my opinion, that's wrong.

I don't believe translations of the Bible, the Koran, or other religious texts should cost money, especially when the person did not do the translation, themselves. I 'm not a Christian, but I was seriously offended when I saw that Wal-Mart was selling a Bible for like $30 bucks. That's outrageous.

Being somewhat of a programmer, I also believe that the documentation for all programming languages should be required to be public-domain. Programming languages are designed so that people can use them. For whatever reason, organizations don't always release the documentation to the languages they create, or it's difficult to find. Guides to the documentations and so on, would not be free, but a government organization should create a substantial "online library of Congress", containing information that is to be public-domain only, including top translations of the Bible, programming documentation (only for languages, not actual source-code), and anything else people submit, and is approved. What do you think?

Not as long as I have the right to sell this dollar on the street for 20 dollars. Go capitalism. It gets ugly, but you gotta take the bad with the good.

They need to cost money For example, Bible translations take a lot of time and effort to make. Not to mention the cost of materials and manufacturing. The people who do this need to eat, which means they need to make a profit off the Bible, sadly. As long as they're not gouging or anything it's fine.

As for programming languages they again require effort and time to develop and these people need to eat. They need to be able to make a profit. As well, some people might want their language to be in company only or private for a variety of reasons. Forcing their language to be public domain may infringe on their privacy.

The Bible can be free as soon as one can publish it for free.

I'm pretty sure there is no copyright on the actual text. so I don't see why it's an issue.

any book sold should come with a price tag. There is the labor or machinery involved in the production, the relatively low cost of inks, paper, leather silks, iron etc.

However, we live in an age of information - i damn well guarantee you that you could find the entire bible on a website, free of charge.

there are also othe things that are already PD, such as old poetic works (you know, lord byron, that fellow that wrote "the rape of the lock" (god, why can't i remember his name?) and works by people that have been dead for a number of centuries) documentation of the assembly and repair of old cars and such...

Your options are...very limited, there. REligious texst are, pretty much laready pblic domain, as well as much information regarding the learning of programming languages and such.

c'ourse, it's perfectly acceptible for people to want to make profits on these things as well.
'tis a wonderful thing, capitalism. I figure, If people don't SELL bibles, how in the good lord's name are they going to continue producing them?
(yes, i know there are other means, but the fact is, they are so prolific here in america because of the fact that it's a good seller. there is a lot of money to be made from the production and distribution of bibles. if you don't wanna pay 30 bucks for a bible, dont' go to wal mart. Go to a christian store, and i bet they'll sell it for considerably less, all things considering....

They need to cost money For example, Bible translations take a lot of time and effort to make. Not to mention the cost of materials and manufacturing. The people who do this need to eat, which means they need to make a profit off the Bible, sadly. As long as they're not gouging or anything it's fine.

As for programming languages they again require effort and time to develop and these people need to eat. They need to be able to make a profit. As well, some people might want their language to be in company only or private for a variety of reasons. Forcing their language to be public domain may infringe on their privacy.
As I said, not all translations (very few, actually) are done by those that publish them. In some cases, someone just re-prints the King James' Version, with a new cover. And it would be one thing if they're selling the books for expenses, but they aren't. They're doing it clearly for profit. Obviously, religious people have a motivation to create such translations without profit, but publishers don't.. So, in order for it to work, a government-owned publishing company (online, offline, or either) would need to be created... Either that, or they could set regulations on how much profit is made from religious books.

As for programming languages--Like I said, people that design them want people to use them, which is why many of 'em release documentation. But not all. Plenty of documentation is found from third-sources, people who: #1) Did not write the language #2) Possibly just copied the documentation directly from the original source #3) Are making money off of something they neither created, nor researched.

There are sites on the internet that have the Bible for free. Such as Bible.com. E-Sword is downloadable for free and it has many different versions of the Bible as well as a bunch of other tools. I bet most of the cost of the Bible is due to printing costs and the like.

As I said, not all translations (very few, actually) are done by those that publish them. In some cases, someone just re-prints the King James' Version, with a new cover. And it would be one thing if they're selling the books for expenses, but they aren't. They're doing it clearly for profit. Obviously, religious people have a motivation to create such translations without profit, but publishers don't.. So, in order for it to work, a government-owned publishing company (online, offline, or either) would need to be created... Either that, or they could set regulations on how much profit is made from religious books.

As for programming languages--Like I said, people that design them want people to use them, which is why many of 'em release documentation. But not all. Plenty of documentation is found from third-sources, people who: #1) Did not write the language #2) Possibly just copied the documentation directly from the original source #3) Are making money off of something they neither created, nor researched.

No ones forcing you, or anyone else, to buy these. If you don't like what they're doing just don't buy them.

Just as an side note, making money off the scripture is forbidden in the Bible if I remember correctly.

that fellow that wrote "the rape of the lock" (god, why can't i remember his name?)

Alexander Pope. :)

I think the only free book should be one that's given to you. Just because a book many have common knowledge or the same ideas does not mean it didn't take effort and time to put together.

Do I think the Bible should be free? Often, you can get your hands on a free copy whether it be through some outlet like the Gideons or just by doing a search on the internet. If you want to pay for a special type of Bible, it took time and effort to put that together, and those that did so deserve something for that effort.

So, in order for it to work, a government-owned publishing company (online, offline, or either) would need to be created... Either that, or they could set regulations on how much profit is made from religious books.

why bother? once the stuff is freely available, why does it matter if people want to spend a bit of money to get a version with a fancy cover and binding?

and what is so special about religious books anyway?

Seriously, no one's going to give out Bibles for free. I mean, would you? And if the government was going to give out free Bibles, they'd also have to give out free copies of every single other religious text. And who knows how much that would cost?

It really shouldn't be shocking or anything that you have to pay for all that stuff. I mean, if you're sick you have to pay the doctor/hospital to cure you. If you're hungry you have to pay to eat. If you don't have the Bible you have to pay to have it. I mean, even if you want to read the Bible you have to pay someone to teach you how to read. (You essentially pay for education, etc. through taxes.)

So.. I mean.. as someone already said, I don't think this is really an issue.

Seriously, no one's going to give out Bibles for free.

are you kidding?

The Bible can be free as soon as one can publish it for free.

I'm pretty sure there is no copyright on the actual text. so I don't see why it's an issue.
Well, that's true, to some extent. But copyright laws pose a problem, and should be less restrictive for religious and humanitarian texts. The problem with the "fair use" law is that it says you can use any material for humanitarian purposes... But at the same time, does that mean you can plagiarize ANY book, which was INTENDED for a humanitarian purpose (religious texts, books on medicine, philosophy, etc)? Obviously not.

The website, sacred-texts.com (http://www.sacred-texts.com/) has done a very good job of compiling all of the public-domain religious books. But, on Judaism for example, they don't have the entire Talmud in English, because the only public-domain English Talmud only translated the first 10 volumes. And other than the Tanakh, they don't have ANY books on Judaism. Plenty are missing, but the problem is that they just don't have any public-domain material to be released.

Besides, as someone else sort of said (and comedians have joked about it), if the Gideons can swoop like ninjas into every hotel and hospital in America, handing out Bibles, there's no reason why all Bibles couldn't be free. At Georgetown University Hospital, they were rather controversial a while, because they'd decided to take their Bibles out of the hospital, because they didn't want to favor one religion, despite their extensive, Christian history.

are you kidding?
What, you're going to buy a bunch of Bibles with your own money and go hand them out on the street to random strangers?

What, you're going to buy a bunch of Bibles with your own money and go hand them out on the street to random strangers?
The Gideons did. I'm sure many Christians would.

What, you're going to buy a bunch of Bibles with your own money and go hand them out on the street to random strangers?

not me. but that's cause i'm an atheist.

you haven't ever been assaulted by rabid packs of gideons? according to their website, they average about one million copies per week.

What, you're going to buy a bunch of Bibles with your own money and go hand them out on the street to random strangers?
The Gideons do. You go to a hotel and you will likely find a Bible in one of the drawers, placed there by a the Gideons. I don't know if thios still occurs but when I was in Grade 6 the Gideons came to my class and gave everyone in the class a Bible.

Many churches will give you a Bible for free if you ask them for it. As well many Christians have multiple Bibles (for example my house has about 10 Bibles between six people) and would gladly give them away to someone who asks for them. There are online Bible sites like www.bible.com or E-Sword as I mentioned earlier. Many Christians try to make Bibles as easily accessible as possible.

That's not to say, that that should be the ONLY means of distribution.

I personally, would pay a good amount of money for a well made, fancy bible.
Even if profit is made form selling the bible, you have to take in consideration that not everyone in the country is a christian.

The Gideons did. I'm sure many Christians would.
Hm. I didn't know about the Gideons. But now I know where the hotel Bibles come from. (From the Gideons, not the Mommy and Daddy Bibles!) Thanks, guys.

So instead of going to the government about making Bibles free, you should go to the Christian community instead?

By the way, putting something on the Internet wouldn't exactly be making it public domain. Poor people (who wouldn't be able to buy $30 Bibles) wouldn't be able to pay for a computer, much less the Internet.

If possible, every book should be free.

But people got to eat.. especially writters. But I'll go with just religious texts. I think you can get them for free.. even bibles and stuff.. Maybe they should have an online bible/koran/etc website.. where you can read for free.

If possible, every book should be free.
The library?

The Bible can be free as soon as one can publish it for free.
It can be published (and accessed) freely. It's called the Internet.

What's that fuss about? Books already are free, libraries have been around for thousands of years now.
And there's a very interesting project putting books on the internet for free, it's called Project Gutenberg (http://www.gutenberg.org/)

The library?

Thats what I do :)

The library?
I don't know about foreign countries, but the libraries in America have to pay for all their books or get them donated. And they're horribly underfunded, with most of their books being 10 or 20 years old. The only library that's nice is the Library of Congress in Washington D.C., which required almost everyone to give them copies. But the library is so huge, that it literally takes an hour or two, to look at anything, and you usually can't take anything out.

So, actually, I agree that creating a bunch of "Libraries of Congress" would be too expensive, but we should create a few more Congressional Libraries and give them more staff and superior technology, to where they could more quickly distribute books (such as using RFID chips for each book and faster conveyer belts than what they use now), as well as giving our public libraries necessary funding, so they don't need book-drives and dedicated old-ladies to stay in business.