NationStates Jolt Archive

Hello everyone. I have been a member of Nationstates for some time now but haven't been too active. That aside, I occasionally pop in to read some interesting threads and your views. One topic of discussion I found particularly interesting was a thread titled "The Christian Left." Sadly, I had to leave my computer and wasn't able to find it again. If anyone can provide a link or desire to start up the discussion initiated by this thread, please do so. I would gladly like to meet the person who started that thread and talk with him/her. Thank you.

Members of the Canadian United Church (3 million members) are leaning to the left. A lot.
They even have 2 gay pastors.
And they shelter a few immigrants that might be deported to their country and tortured.
It's a long tradition.
During the American Civil War, the Canadian United Church has helped and sheltered a lot of black people fleeing slavery. They were really involved in the so-called "Underground Railway". Some of them went back to the US, some of them settled in the Niagara peninsula and in Nova Scotia.

Hello everyone. I have been a member of Nationstates for some time now but haven't been too active. That aside, I occasionally pop in to read some interesting threads and your views. One topic of discussion I found particularly interesting was a thread titled "The Christian Left." Sadly, I had to leave my computer and wasn't able to find it again. If anyone can provide a link or desire to start up the discussion initiated by this thread, please do so. I would gladly like to meet the person who started that thread and talk with him/her. Thank you.

By the way, this forum has a search function, so you can find a thread that way. Or you can use the Subscribe function when you find an interesting thread and keep it in your profile to find it easily.

I did not start that thread, however I am a Christian Socialist, by that I mean socially and moraly Conservative and fiscally liberal.

I belive that the Anglican church is left leaning at heart. they juts need a bit of a nudge thats all. We have women priests dont we?

I haven't seen the thread, but you might like to check these folks out: http://www.liberalslikechrist.org/index.htm

I'm liberal and Christian. The debate on gay priests is raging away in my church but I suspect the libs will win.

I'm a Christian socialist--however, I still believe that gay marriage and abortion are wrong.

I'm a Christian socialist--however, I still believe that gay marriage and abortion are wrong.
While I greatly respect your opinion, I think it underlines one of the biggest failures of the left -- the failure to unite.

Conservatives have it easy, since they "go with NO" and stick to values that were used for a very long time by humankind. The progressives/liberals are doing the hard work trying to look ahead and make difficult decisions, raise important ISSUES.

BUT... That's the whole problem. The left is unable to unite because it is so focused on ISSUES instead of VALUES. Think about the left, and you'll come up with a LIST OF ISSUES: abortion, gay whatever, anti-war, women rights, ...

While if you think about the conservatives, it's easy to say "family values" for example. Which is NOT an issue, but a MORAL SYSTEM.


I think the left should focus more on its VALUES, trying to define them, and unite under a common banner. Instead of what we usually get the constant bickering about "i'm pro this but anti that, what are you?" and internal fights between feminists, PETA, vegetarians, peaceniks, anarchists, ACLU, pro-gay, and all these lobbies trying to pull the blanket in their direction.

I think it's possible to define a strong, open Christian Left. But let's stop enumerating issues like if we can define ourselves with a "pro-anti" checklist. ;)

Members of the Canadian United Church (3 million members) are leaning to the left. A lot.
They even have 2 gay pastors.
And they shelter a few immigrants that might be deported to their country and tortured.
It's a long tradition.
During the American Civil War, the Canadian United Church has helped and sheltered a lot of black people fleeing slavery. They were really involved in the so-called "Underground Railway". Some of them went back to the US, some of them settled in the Niagara peninsula and in Nova Scotia.

Furthermore, the United Church was the first church In Canada to ordain a woman, all the way back in 1936. I think it's more than two pastors though, because my minister is lesbian, and I don't think there's only one more.

While I greatly respect your opinion, I think it underlines one of the biggest failures of the left -- the failure to unite.

Conservatives have it easy, since they "go with NO" and stick to values that were used for a very long time by humankind. The progressives/liberals are doing the hard work trying to look ahead and make difficult decisions, raise important ISSUES.

BUT... That's the whole problem. The left is unable to unite because it is so focused on ISSUES instead of VALUES. Think about the left, and you'll come up with a LIST OF ISSUES: abortion, gay whatever, anti-war, women rights, ...
Not at all. The left has its values and knows them: community spirit, respect and tolerance.

Not at all. The left has its values and knows them: community spirit, respect and tolerance.
Then, why is the left forced to form coalitions, that eventually fall apart because of internal dissent? I'm sorry to have to say that, since I'm in the moderate left, but we ought to increase our cohesion if we want to achieve anything.

Not at all. The left has its values and knows them: community spirit, respect and tolerance.

And compassion!

While if you think about the conservatives, it's easy to say "family values" for example.

Hate is not a family value. When I think of social conservatives I think of people who hate gay people, hate abortion doctors, hate anyone who doesn't think like them.

If there is a god and if the stories of Jesus turn out to be true, you know Jesus was a liberal, not a conservative. Because Jesus wouldn't of cared if you were gay or had an abortion, as long as you believed in "his father" "god" that's all he cared about. Jesus would not only of been a social liberal but a fiscal one as well. As the stories go, he didn't tell people "go get a fucking job" no, he fed them. I think a lot of people say they are Christians, but I think Jesus might of disagreed with them.

Anyway, just my take on it.

I did not start that thread, however I am a Christian Socialist, by that I mean socially and moraly Conservative and fiscally liberal.

For me the word "Christian" simply means a follower of Jesus. Could you provide evidence that supports the belief that Jesus was against premarital sex, abortion, homosexuality and drug use?

For me the word "Christian" simply means a follower of Jesus. Could you provide evidence that supports the belief that Jesus was against premarital sex, abortion, homosexuality and drug use?

That was exactly the point I just made, I thought. :)

I belive that the Anglican church is left leaning at heart. they juts need a bit of a nudge thats all. We have women priests dont we?

Wasn't the Anglican church started by a guy who wanted to chop of his wife's head because she didn't provide him a male heir?

That was exactly the point I just made, I thought. :)

It might have been the point you intended to make but the question was intended for a person whose opinions might be different from yours and I am curious to see why he believes in those specific values.

Hate is not a family value. When I think of social conservatives I think of people who hate gay people, hate abortion doctors, hate anyone who doesn't think like them.

If there is a god and if the stories of Jesus turn out to be true, you know Jesus was a liberal, not a conservative. Because Jesus wouldn't of cared if you were gay or had an abortion, as long as you believed in "his father" "god" that's all he cared about. Jesus would not only of been a social liberal but a fiscal one as well. As the stories go, he didn't tell people "go get a fucking job" no, he fed them. I think a lot of people say they are Christians, but I think Jesus might of disagreed with them.

Anyway, just my take on it.



No comment.

While I greatly respect your opinion, I think it underlines one of the biggest failures of the left -- the failure to unite.

Conservatives have it easy, since they "go with NO" and stick to values that were used for a very long time by humankind. The progressives/liberals are doing the hard work trying to look ahead and make difficult decisions, raise important ISSUES.

BUT... That's the whole problem. The left is unable to unite because it is so focused on ISSUES instead of VALUES. Think about the left, and you'll come up with a LIST OF ISSUES: abortion, gay whatever, anti-war, women rights, ...

While if you think about the conservatives, it's easy to say "family values" for example. Which is NOT an issue, but a MORAL SYSTEM.


I think the left should focus more on its VALUES, trying to define them, and unite under a common banner. Instead of what we usually get the constant bickering about "i'm pro this but anti that, what are you?" and internal fights between feminists, PETA, vegetarians, peaceniks, anarchists, ACLU, pro-gay, and all these lobbies trying to pull the blanket in their direction.

I think it's possible to define a strong, open Christian Left. But let's stop enumerating issues like if we can define ourselves with a "pro-anti" checklist. ;)

It is better to be a minority of one and believe in what you believe than to compromise to achieve power. I'm sure you could argue this point, but this is the way I feel about politics and why I respect some socialist leaders more than those politicians who will say and do anything in order to get into power.

With regards to your observation of "the right", conservatives and fascists are just as divided. Observe the current war on terror. Right winged Christians and Jews fighting against Right winged Muslims.

Well thank you all for your help. I will make sure to search for the thread and place it in my profile.

As for the discussion so far, I just have to say that this is exactly what I mean. I suppose it's an unending battle in separating religion/morals from a political system. However, that doesn't mean we shouldn't continue to try. I found it excellent that several of you claimed to view religion and morals in a certain light but politics in a completely different light. That is astounding, especially if you have been born and raised in the United States.

I have gone and will continue to go through a lot of questioning, concerning my religion. Despite what many believe, I think this is a natural process and can help a person grow. People need to experience life before they can make rock-solid views and beliefs. That's one reason why I am still a Christian. Jesus is an exemplar, even if you take away him being the Messiah and the King of Israel. Just look at his actions during the time he lived. All his teachings and actions speak volumes. However, man has corrupted his words and that is understandable. I just am very weary when religion dips its hand into politics and affairs of state. Too many times, has this been done and with disastrous consequences.

So please, any liberal Christians/Jews/Buddhists/Hinduists/Muslims, etc., please feel free to use this thread as a forum to peacefully talk to one another and share our views. That's the only way we can hope to make some sense of this non-sensible world we live in.