NationStates Jolt Archive

We all here know the May 9th Newsweek story, denouncing the desecracion of the koran in Gitmo, a story that generated rioting and death through the Middle East. Some days later, pressed by the Pentagon, Newsweek said the story might be false. Some days later, Newsweek apologised for the mistake.

The thing is, it wasnt just Newsweek that denounced the desecration of the book, some non goverment organizations had also denounced such events, and this month, the Pentagon admited 15 cases of disrespect, and one of defiling.

The problem, in my opinion, isnt the profanation itself (I disrespect Islam as much has a disrespect cristianity, and im a happy man! :D ), but that Newsweek DISMISSED A TRUE STORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Doesnt this make you Americans freak out? The truth was dismissed out of political convinience. Doesnt this establish a scary precedent?

Doesnt this make you Americans freak out? The truth was dismissed out of political convinience. Doesnt this establish a scary precedent?

Get used to it, neo-cons don't fear the truth because they'll bully and outshout anyone who brings it up.

Nixon only wished he could have this kind of media control.

Get used to it, neo-cons don't fear the truth because they'll bully and outshout anyone who brings it up.

Nixon only wished he could have this kind of media control.

they learned it from Bill Clinton.

Besides, the specific Story was a mistake, the later revelations probably had nothing to do with it. Some reporter jumped the gun is all, and went to press without his ducks in a row-a mistake of unprofessionalism that Newsweek got lucky in (but didn't know it.).

I think the bigger problem isnt that it established a scary precedent, but rather, it continued an already alarming one.

Soon, tomorrow I think, Bush will make an address to the nation that will basicaly consist of

"Yeah, I know that 62% of Americans do not approve of the war, and want to see a timetable for withdraw...but Im not going to listen to them, or anyone else. Im going to keep having our troops car-bombed, in a futile, costly, unwinable military occupation.
By, the way, were going to do it again in Syria, or Iran, very soon.

Facts dont matter anymore.
There is no "Integrity in the Media" anymore.
Not when Rupert Murdoch owns Fox News, or when your very own President lies to your face, and doesnt do what the overwhelming majority of people in his country want him to do.

"Yeah, I know that 62% of Americans do not approve of the war, and want to see a timetable for withdraw...but Im not going to listen to them, or anyone else. Im going to keep having our troops car-bombed, in a futile, costly, unwinable military occupation.
By, the way, were going to do it again in Syria, or Iran, very soon.


If there is a timetable for withdraw, all that will happen is that the terrorists in Iraq will attempt to hold out untill the Americans leave, so that they will make it much worse in Iraq. And its already been pointed out that while its true that most Americans disaprove of the war, most Iraqies are now much happier now than they were under Hussain.

I think the bigger problem isnt that it established a scary precedent, but rather, it continued an already alarming one.

Soon, tomorrow I think, Bush will make an address to the nation that will basicaly consist of

"Yeah, I know that 62% of Americans do not approve of the war, and want to see a timetable for withdraw...but Im not going to listen to them, or anyone else. Im going to keep having our troops car-bombed, in a futile, costly, unwinable military occupation.
By, the way, were going to do it again in Syria, or Iran, very soon.

Facts dont matter anymore.
There is no "Integrity in the Media" anymore.
Not when Rupert Murdoch owns Fox News, or when your very own President lies to your face, and doesnt do what the overwhelming majority of people in his country want him to do.


yah... Like I said, he learned it from a Master in Slick Willie-who did it first. Welcome to the other side of things. Our guys were getting shot at daily in Haiti and Somalia without being allowed to shoot back. Those were also unpopular deployments, as was Bosnia, Kosovo...
VIETNAM.

As for being "Unwinnable", well, if you have your way, you're right. it will be unwinnable.

funny how the Moro insurrection, which was materially the same, but in an even more difficult environment, failed to defeat the U.S. now, isn't it?

Of course, they didn't just know it was un-winnable, they didn't have your access to superior wisdom in the matters of warfare, did they? Maybe if they had your attitude, the U.S. would have found the Phillipine insurrection impossible to defeat...

Well Im British as you might guess and my theory is dont trust the American media lol. Never trusted American media, government or squirrels.

As for being "Unwinnable", well, if you have your way, you're right. it will be unwinnable.

funny how the Moro insurrection, which was materially the same, but in an even more difficult environment, failed to defeat the U.S. now, isn't it?

Of course, they didn't just know it was un-winnable, they didn't have your access to superior wisdom in the matters of warfare, did they? Maybe if they had your attitude, the U.S. would have found the Phillipine insurrection impossible to defeat...

Technically speaking, the war is actually labelled as "The War on Terror". As such, terror is a concept of fear, usually caused by externalities, or in some cases, internal mental processes. As a concept, terror lacks substantiality and a physical presence. Currently, the US method of handling this war appears to be with physical tools i.e. soldiers, bombs, bullets, etc. These are all physical tools designed to be used on physical objects, not concepts.

So yes, the war is unwinnable.

Have a nice day.

We all here know the May 9th Newsweek story, denouncing the desecracion of the koran in Gitmo, a story that generated rioting and death through the Middle East. Some days later, pressed by the Pentagon, Newsweek said the story might be false. Some days later, Newsweek apologised for the mistake.

The thing is, it wasnt just Newsweek that denounced the desecration of the book, some non goverment organizations had also denounced such events, and this month, the Pentagon admited 15 cases of disrespect, and one of defiling.

The problem, in my opinion, isnt the profanation itself (I disrespect Islam as much has a disrespect cristianity, and im a happy man! :D ), but that Newsweek DISMISSED A TRUE STORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Doesnt this make you Americans freak out? The truth was dismissed out of political convinience. Doesnt this establish a scary precedent?

The cases of disrespect do not include any "flushing" or "threatened flushing" of the Koran, as stated in the Newsweek story. According to Pentagon rules, if you pick up a person's Koran without first putting on rubber gloves, that's desecration, and the Pentagon counts those incidents (something that my Egyptian friend says is not desecration). So the Newsweek story is false.

It is noted in the Pentagon investigations and admissions that detainees are the only ones who have torn up their Koran and flushed pieces of it in an attempt to back up the toilet.

Please be specific when you claim what is true and what is not. Newsweek backed down because there wasn't any evidence from their source that anyone flushed a Koran, which is what they claimed. After an investigation, it was discovered that no US personnel EVER flushed or threatened to flush anything - and any flushing was done by detainees themselves.

Doesnt this make you Americans freak out? The truth was dismissed out of political convinience. Doesnt this establish a scary precedent?

Meh, this has been happening for ages

No, the truth was not dismissed. The usual socialist media lie was dismissed as is your post which is also a complete and total lie. In fact, it is this very reason most of us dismiss any form of socialism because everything you say and do is based on flat out utter bullshit. Your credibility is nil, which is something you should find alarming because it is the primary reason that people are flowing steadily from the left in America. Get a clue or get LEFT in the dust.

Liverbreath']No, the truth was not dismissed. The usual socialist media lie was dismissed as is your post which is also a complete and total lie. In fact, it is this very reason most of us dismiss any form of socialism because everything you say and do is based on flat out utter bullshit. Your credibility is nil, which is something you should find alarming because it is the primary reason that people are flowing steadily from the left in America. Get a clue or get LEFT in the dust.


Here is what happens to people that forget to take their prozac.

The cases of disrespect do not include any "flushing" or "threatened flushing" of the Koran, as stated in the Newsweek story. According to Pentagon rules, if you pick up a person's Koran without first putting on rubber gloves, that's desecration, and the Pentagon counts those incidents (something that my Egyptian friend says is not desecration). So the Newsweek story is false.

It is noted in the Pentagon investigations and admissions that detainees are the only ones who have torn up their Koran and flushed pieces of it in an attempt to back up the toilet.

Please be specific when you claim what is true and what is not. Newsweek backed down because there wasn't any evidence from their source that anyone flushed a Koran, which is what they claimed. After an investigation, it was discovered that no US personnel EVER flushed or threatened to flush anything - and any flushing was done by detainees themselves.

For you, Portu...

Portu Cale MK3, could you please check your telegrams? Thanks.

Doesnt this make you Americans freak out? The truth was dismissed out of political convinience. Doesnt this establish a scary precedent?
Cheney once said "For now on, we call the weather."
I think it pretty much explains it all.

they learned it from Bill Clinton.


Even were that so, that's the most frickin' lame-o excuse imaginable.


Unlearn.

For you, Portu...

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=8695349

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N16479546.htm


Newsweek reported the disrespect of the Koran; It withdrew the story that such disrespect had happened :

"Based on what we know now, we are retracting our original story that an internal military investigation had uncovered Koran abuse at Guantanamo Bay," Newsweek Editor Mark Whitaker said in a statement, a day after apologizing for the report.

.. and later such disrespect was confirmed; If it was confirmed, then the basis for the original story might have been true.

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=topNews&storyID=8695349

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N16479546.htm


Newsweek reported the disrespect of the Koran; It withdrew the story that such disrespect had happened :

"Based on what we know now, we are retracting our original story that an internal military investigation had uncovered Koran abuse at Guantanamo Bay," Newsweek Editor Mark Whitaker said in a statement, a day after apologizing for the report.

.. and later such disrespect was confirmed; If it was confirmed, then the basis for the original story might have been true.

They went over this on NPR in great detail. The Newsweek story explicitly said that the abuse was US interrogators flushing the Koran down a toilet.

The investigations found that it didn't happen. Nor could the Newsweek source say it happened.

The investigation DID find (as the ICRC also said) that the Koran was mishandled (per the Pentagon guidelines, mishandling mostly meant not wearing rubber gloves when touching a Koran). The investigation also found that the flushing incident was abuse by a detainee who was trying to back up his own toilet with his own Koran.

So there was no US flushing of a Koran, which is what Newsweek retracted.

Even were that so, that's the most frickin' lame-o excuse imaginable.


Unlearn.

In the current political climate? I'm sorry, but the Dems set the rules of engagement, the Republicans are just playing by the rules as the Democrats set them by example. Government is inherently going to seek the lowest-common-denominator, which is why you don't want an unethical and ruthless son-of-a-bitch in high office ("Character doesn't count" was a Democrat mantra through the 1990's) unless you're prepared for the impact of his behaviour on the culture. Clearly, your expectations for your opponent are higher than those you set for your allies, which begs the question of why you choose those allies if you truly expect your opponent to be more honourable and are upset when he, also, turns out to be a ruthless and unethical son of a bitch.

Get used to it, neo-cons don't fear the truth because they'll bully and outshout anyone who brings it up.

Nixon only wished he could have this kind of media control.

yeah, they really control the news media

lmao

what about ABC, NBC, CBS, and CNN?

surely you don't think that these write stories/report with a conservative bias...

They went over this on NPR in great detail. The Newsweek story explicitly said that the abuse was US interrogators flushing the Koran down a toilet.

The investigations found that it didn't happen. Nor could the Newsweek source say it happened.

The investigation DID find (as the ICRC also said) that the Koran was mishandled (per the Pentagon guidelines, mishandling mostly meant not wearing rubber gloves when touching a Koran). The investigation also found that the flushing incident was abuse by a detainee who was trying to back up his own toilet with his own Koran.

So there was no US flushing of a Koran, which is what Newsweek retracted.

WL

If it never happened, then what's all the whining about? Is it just the usual "daily rip-on-America-and-or-President Bush" discourse we've all come to love?