NationStates Jolt Archive

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.

I agree. But I also think that it should not be "undebatable" as long as both sides try and make it political. Even if it wasn't, I don't think it should be undebatable. if people don't want their beliefs challenged, they should think about their conviction in them. I do disagree about the harranguing way they are debated, though.

I agree.

All you people doing it are morons and give Atheists a bad name

Yes, you can point it out, and I agree with you, but it won't stop that many people.

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.
Are you kidding me? You're leaving out the possibility of agnosticism!

Well part of the fun is just arguing it. The arguments will probably change nothing on either side, but people still comment and that is a sign of happiness.

Are you kidding me? You're leaving out the possibility of agnosticism!
Not at all. In many ways, I'm agnostic myself. I just think it's a waste of time to debate that sort of thing, particularly here where there's much less give and take than in a face-to-face conversation.

BTW ... I'm not saying anyone "shouldn't" debate this type of topic here, only that doing so is a monumental waste of time and words. :)

Not at all. In many ways, I'm agnostic myself. I just think it's a waste of time to debate that sort of thing, particularly here where there's much less give and take than in a face-to-face conversation.

BTW ... I'm not saying anyone "shouldn't" debate this type of topic here, only that doing so is a monumental waste of time and words. :)
I hate to re-quote you, but you said:
Either you believe in God, or you don't.

I think its just trying to draw people into an argument, or a counter against some other thread like "why gay marriage is bad", personally I am an atheist but I don't evangelise it, and I hate peoplen who do evangelise their religon, thats one of the reasons why I like muslims and jews more than I do christians. I don't understand why people must adverstise all the time... FINE I get It!! I am going t hell your not stop smearing it in!!!

lol

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?


you mean compared to all the great ways we use our time like in the "who is the hottest actress", "who would win this fight?" and "what if cornflakes had never been invented?" threads??

I hate to re-quote you, but you said:
Read it in context. Perhaps I should have thrown a comment in there about agnostics, but I neglected to do so. My apologies.

you mean compared to all the great ways we use our time like in the "who is the hottest actress", "who would win this fight?" and "what if cornflakes had never been invented?" threads??
LOL! Well, since you put it that way ... ! :D

At least those threads are mildly entertaining and don't seem to be an attack on what people believe. Just have a bit of compassion for those who feel the need for their faith. K? :)

My

neglected agnostics



sorry to quote you but!

you mean compared to all the great ways we use our time like in the "who is the hottest actress", "who would win this fight?" and "what if cornflakes had never been invented?" threads??

Cameron Diaz, Lennox Lewis and I'd have nothing to eat on a Wednesday aftrenoon whilst watching Scrubs.

Seriously, I belive that a bit of good, non-flaming debate is good for the old belief muscles.

If we don't question ourselves, then we are blindly following a cause.

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.

*applauds*

If we don't question ourselves, then we are blindly following a cause.

ahh, please take no offense by this, but isn't religon about blindly following something?

sorry to quote you but!
Dweeb! :p

ahh, please take no offense by this, but isn't religon about blindly following something?
Only if that's how you choose to practice it. Some people are terrified of the very thought of having to make their own philosophy from whole cloth. They really do need someone to tell them what to do.

Dweeb! :p

South Korea?


*coughs* Goats*coughs*

I think its just trying to draw people into an argument, or a counter against some other thread like "why gay marriage is bad", personally I am an atheist but I don't evangelise it, and I hate peoplen who do evangelise their religon, thats one of the reasons why I like muslims and jews more than I do christians. I don't understand why people must adverstise all the time... FINE I get It!! I am going t hell your not stop smearing it in!!!

lol


Umm...Muslims are very evangelical....very very very VERY evangelical....trust me on that one ;)

Bravo!

We could use a little more civility in discussing deity(or lack thereof) related issues.

That being said, we shouldn't neccesarily stop discussing them. After all, a good counter to hostility and fear is sobering knowledge and enlightenment - something a few good people on each side may have to offer.

Umm...Muslims are very evangelical....very very very VERY evangelical....trust me on that one ;)
ahh no they are not, well if they are their going to hell, its against the koron, they are only allowed to show and teach you and if you ask to leave you alone they must.... unlike some christians i know...

Seriously, I belive that a bit of good, non-flaming debate is good for the old belief muscles.

If we don't question ourselves, then we are blindly following a cause.
I totally agree with your last statement. Unfortunately there are many who cannot, or will not question their faith. That is their perogative.

As to your first statement, unfortunately most ( if not all ) of those threads invariably degenerate into flaming at some point. Sad, but true.

*applauds*
Thank you!

Please observe the donations box on your way out. :D

I totally agree with your last statement. Unfortunately there are many who cannot, or will not question their faith. That is their perogative.

As to your first statement, unfortunately most ( if not all ) of those threads invariably degenerate into flaming at some point. Sad, but true.
yeah too true, I had many a thread degenerate into flame...., I try to keep it civil but some people won't accept logic!

South Korea?


*coughs* Goats*coughs*
ROFL! :p

yeah too true, I had many a thread degenerate into flame...., I try to keep it civil but some people won't accept logic!
True. And some are afraid of logic. And some don't know what logic is.

ROFL! :p

I try my best...

Thank you!

Please observe the donations box on your way out. :D


*tosses in a dollar* Don't spend that all in one place now.

True. And some are afraid of logic. And some don't know what logic is.

log--ic? what is that some kind of devil food? Heretic heretic!!! burn them!


(witch witch goody proctor is a witch!)

*tosses in a dollar* Don't spend that all in one place now.
:rolleyes:

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.


I applaud you. For all of you who say he's not considering angnostics, let me make this a little more pollitically correct for you. Either you believe in a (set of) God(s), or you don't.

But that wasn't his point. The point is to stop fighting about it.

I applaud you. For all of you who say he's not considering angnostics, let me make this a little more pollitically correct for you. Either you believe in a (set of) God(s), or you don't.

But that wasn't his point. The point is to stop fighting about it.

Hoo-rah! I agree. Civil dibates are yay. Flamethrowers are notyay.

...

Well, except when torching teenyboppers and rabid!fangirls... ;)

I applaud you. For all of you who say he's not considering angnostics, let me make this a little more pollitically correct for you. Either you believe in a (set of) God(s), or you don't.

But that wasn't his point. The point is to stop fighting about it.
AND ... have a bit of compassion for those who need their faith as a bulwark against a sometimes harsh reality. :)

Thank you. :)

Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe.

Yet when someone doesn't share the same beliefs as you, you tend to assault him as well. I noticed that on several occasions in several threads.

ahh no they are not, well if they are their going to hell, its against the koron, they are only allowed to show and teach you and if you ask to leave you alone they must.... unlike some christians i know...


Really? Gee, that would contradict everything Muhammad taught...

I have learned a lot of history from debating in these threads. For example, someone saying "the Israelites were there first" led me to actually do the research and find that actually they came from Iraq, and Palestine was already settled at that time. Just as an example.

I agree.

All you people doing it are morons and give Atheists a bad name

Thank you for that well thought out, reasoned and sensitive response.The wording put me completely at ease and didn't invoke the usual defensive and illogical ramblings of yesteryear.Plus, I love the color maroon. :D

Really? Gee, that would contradict everything Muhammad taught...

ahh read the koron, and research the religon... muhammad kinda had to teach like that considering that there were no muslims... but in islam your not allowed to force religon on people(that includes not leaving them alone when they ask), your supposed to accept god and see it for yourself because if it is forced your not really muslim... I am an atheist but I still find this a bit interesting only if some people *cough christians*cough* could learn it....

I never argue to convince the faithful that they are in error. I argue to convince them they're never going to convince me they're not in error.

I never argue to convince the faithful that they are in error. I argue to convince them they're never going to convince me they're not in error.
I argue only in hypotheicals, I.e. One of my last threads was United States of Britain vs EU, I find it more constructive. also I try to give morals in my threads too(like would send people to die to protect innocents) and just for shits and giggles lol....

I hate to re-quote you, but you said:

"Either you believe in God or you don't" includes agnostics.

Jocabia: You either have a computer or you don't.
You: You're leaving out the people who are shopping for a computer or want to.
Jocabia: Um, no I didn't. They fall under people who don't.

"Either you believe in God or you don't" includes agnostics.

Jocabia: You either have a computer or you don't.
You: You're leaving out the people who are shopping for a computer or want to.
Jocabia: Um, no I didn't. They fall under people who don't.
Agnostics do not all absolutely believe or disbelieve in god.

Hoo-rah! I agree. Civil dibates are yay. Flamethrowers are notyay.

...

Well, except when torching teenyboppers and rabid!fangirls... ;)


Aye debates are wicked fun when civil, but we all know that they don't stay that way long on Nationstates.

But God is PROVEN SCIENTIFICALLY!!!! (http://proof-of-god.freewebsitehosting.com/)

Agnostics do not all absolutely believe or disbelieve in god.

um, belief is a switch. It's on or off. Belief is faith and you either have it or not. You can be unsure of existence which is agnostic, but you either believe or not.

um, belief is a switch. It's on or off. Belief is faith and you either have it or not. You can be unsure of existence which is agnostic, but you either believe or not.


Straight to the point.

um, belief is a switch. It's on or off. Belief is faith and you either have it or not. You can be unsure of existence which is agnostic, but you either believe or not.
Not nessecarily. For example, I don't think that the Christian god exists, but I believe that it might. That is not absolutely believing or disbelieving.

Not nessecarily. For example, I don't think that the Christian god exists, but I believe that it might. That is not absolutely believing or disbelieving.

Fine, you believe that the Christian God might exist, but you don't believe the Christian God DOES exist. It's quite simple. That is absolutely believing or not believing.

But God is PROVEN SCIENTIFICALLY!!!! (http://proof-of-god.freewebsitehosting.com/)
.....Oh wow. He 'accidentally discovered the World's first proof'. That takes an amazing amount of unintentional talent, or you just have to be a fool.....

Eh. I don't have the time to read this on my own. Somebody, digest it for me and kick it back in about 1/5 the size.....? :D

Fine, you believe that the Christian God might exist, but you don't believe the Christian God DOES exist. It's quite simple. That is absolutely believing or not believing.
*Sigh.*

*Sigh.*

Yes, I know how the English language can be frustrating, especially when reprimanding someone for using it correctly (you to Eut).

Simonist'].....Oh wow. He 'accidentally discovered the World's first proof'. That takes an amazing amount of unintentional talent, or you just have to be a fool.....

Eh. I don't have the time to read this on my own. Somebody, digest it for me and kick it back in about 1/5 the size.....? :D
There's some pretty funny stuff in there.
The basic gist of the first section is this:

Humans have grown to be larger than they were in the past. Since humans could conceivably evolve to be larger still, then it must be that they are not fully grown because they will only be fully grown when as large as is physically possible through the process of evolution. This is also represented in brain size, causing a 'brain growth deficit'. Brain size is a major factor in intelligence. The size of the brain causes a relativistic time dilation and space dialation. This causes the world to look larger and slower to those who are not fully grown, as per the degree of their brain growth deficit. This difference between perceived reality and actaul reality is the cause of God.

It's brilliantly wacky stuff, some of the other bits are even better, such as the claim that psychology is caused by the Theory of Relativity.

Not nessecarily. For example, I don't think that the Christian god exists, but I believe that it might. That is not absolutely believing or disbelieving.You believe that it might, not that it does exist.
In other words, you neither believe or disbelieve. Failing to disbelieve does not mean the same thing as believing.

There's some pretty funny stuff in there.
The basic gist of the first section is this:

Humans have grown to be larger than they were in the past. Since humans could conceivably evolve to be larger still, then it must be that they are not fully grown because they will only be fully grown when as large as is physically possible through the process of evolution. This is also represented in brain size, causing a 'brain growth deficit'. Brain size is a major factor in intelligence. The size of the brain causes a relativistic time dilation and space dialation. This causes the world to look larger and slower to those who are not fully grown, as per the degree of their brain growth deficit. This difference between perceived reality than actaul reality is the cause of God.

It's brilliantly wacky stuff, some of the other bits are even better, such as the claim that psychology is caused by the Theory of Relativity.
:eek:

I.....I'm at a loss.....I was expecting to be called lazy and told to read it myself....I am always in your debt.

I'd offer you some Smarties or a Tootsie Roll Pop, but....... :eek: :eek:

You believe that it might, not that it does exist.
In other words, you neither believe or disbelieve. Failing to disbelieve does not mean the same thing as believing.

Exactly.

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.
In my humble opinion, this is perhaps the best post of yours that I have read, complete with humility. :)

you mean compared to all the great ways we use our time like in the "who is the hottest actress", "who would win this fight?" and "what if cornflakes had never been invented?" threads??

But religious threads are far more common, and far, far more boring.

In my humble opinion, this is perhaps the best post of yours that I have read, complete with humility. :)
Wow! I may faint! :D

In person, I almost always have some degree of humility. NS just seems to wipe that right out! :)

Wow! I may faint! :D

In person, I almost always have some degree of humility. NS just seems to wipe that right out! :)

That's just because you're so awesome.

and not at all because people like me purposefully keep feeding your ego

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.
Except nothing is that black and white. I don't believe in a God in the traditional sense--some higher power telling you what you can and can't do through some fictional story--but I am 100% sure there must be a higher power of some sort to create the universe or universes that created ours. So what do I believe in? It doesn't fit your logic but it is my beliefs. There must be a "God" that created the universe, but there isn't some guy telling you what to do and making sure you go to the right place after you die.

I disagree, I prefer endless trolling and namecalling. But that's just me :)

ahh, please take no offense by this, but isn't religon about blindly following something?

No. Some people (like me) actually read their Holy Books and make thier own interpratations. Unfortunatly we are few and far between. It's the ones who do follow blindly, mess up basic facts about their own religion, and refuse to listen to the other side that give us a bad name. There are people like that for every belief, though.

No. Some people (like me) actually read their Holy Books and make thier own interpratations. Unfortunatly we are few and far between. It's the ones who do follow blindly, mess up basic facts about their own religion, and refuse to listen to the other side that give us a bad name. There are people like that for every belief, though.
Very true. I have the utmost respect for those who actually practice their faith instead of prosyletizing to reassure themselves that their beliefs are the "real" ones.

Some bits of religious books are just not to be followed by the word. For example, in Matthew, Jesus teaches us to "cut off the hand we sin with". That is NOT *i repeat* NOT to be taken literally. Or else, you'd have no body part left....

Basically, the entire message of the New Testament was "Love the Lord your God with all your Heart and Soul and Mind" and "Love your neighbor as you love yourself." Now it's been corrupted to "Love your straight, white, middle to upper class Christian Neighbor less than yourself, but more then everyone else, because they're going to The Underworld(is H-E-Double-L censored?), and Hate everything that doesn't agree with your personal veiws. And that God guy to. Remember to call on his name to sound powerful.".

I agree.

All you people doing it are morons and give Atheists a bad name
Agreed. If you wish to believe, do it. That's not my buisness.

(I'm an Athiest, by the way.)

Yeah, God is a powerful tool in literature and speeches. After all if you mention his name you now have the "holy effect" and a strong appeal to pathos(I assume that God is more of a way to arouse emotion than to add expert authority). I even remember using God in my writing in high-school because of this powerful effect.

Yeah, God is a powerful tool in literature and speeches. After all if you mention his name you now have the "holy effect" and a strong appeal to pathos(I assume that God is more of a way to arouse emotion than to add expert authority). I even remember using God in my writing in high-school because of this powerful effect.

If you're refering to my post, I didn't mean it actually WAS powerfull. Just the crazy fundies think it is. And it is if you're talking to fundies.

Well the use of the word God, does make something more powerful to anyone who is familiar with and thinks well of your religion. After all God is God, but the effect is useless against those who are strongly agnostic or atheist.

Well the use of the word God, does make something more powerful to anyone who is familiar with and thinks well of your religion. After all God is God, but the effect is useless against those who are strongly agnostic or atheist.


Yep, thats how Bush got to hang out in the white house so long heh.

I disagree, I prefer endless trolling and namecalling. But that's just me :)

Thtas bcause ur a filthy excretement eating baby killing Satanist!

Religion is not the only thing we humans disagree on. We disagree on every other subject or topic anyone can think of, as well. So why even have this forum or debate anything? It will always lead to arguments. GOD bless!

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.
Those posts are easily ignored, on my part at least. What I find harder to ignore are posts that suggest that some questions about belief are "moronic" or "stupid", simply because the people asking cannot understand the alternative stance.

That's just because you're so awesome.

and not at all because people like me purposefully keep feeding your ego
ROFLMAO! Oh yeah? Well, if I'm so freakin' "awesome," whycome ah ain't rich? Huh? Huh? Huh? :D

(is H-E-Double-L censored?)
Hell no! :D

Those posts are easily ignored, on my part at least. What I find harder to ignore are posts that suggest that some questions about belief are "moronic" or "stupid", simply because the people asking cannot understand the alternative stance.
Usually it's not a matter of being able to "understand" the alternative. Especially for those raised in a fundamentalist Christian environment, the posited consequences for "unbelief" are so dire that they fear to even question things like "the earth is 10,000 years old" ... don't get me started on that one! ). Another aspect of being unable to "understand" is the fear of those who don't "believe." One of the central tenets of fundamentalism is that those who don't "believe" cannot be trusted.

Fundamentalist is a very closed and completely circular system. You use the Bible to "prove" the Bible. If you doubt, you're going to hell for all eternity. Not bad for "keeping the flock in line." :headbang:

May I humbly suggest that you're wasting your time by posting all these "God doesn't," "God can't," "Proof that God," etc.?

Either you believe in God, or you don't. No amount of logic is going to convince anyone either way. Faith is an intensely personal thing ( unless you simply adopted yours from your parents, in which case you really need to think about whether you truly have any faith at all or not ).

Either way, try to have a bit of compassion for those who choose to believe something other than what you believe. Sometimes the only thing between a person and total psychological disaster is what they believe. To assault that without good cause is definitely not compassionate.

Well put. I wish people would all shut up and stop trying to convert each other, whether it's to a different religion or a different political ideology. Only a moron would change their views just because of some posts by people on a forum.