NationStates Jolt Archive

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

Often, people, in the US at least, elect politicians on the bases that they are religious people themselves. They want politicians who reflect their beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Umm, Bush isn’t Catholic. I believe he is Methodist (I might be wrong). Therefore, the Pope has no authority over him.

You mention Bush, yet you fail to remember that Kennedy was Catholic. His election caused quite the turmoil. Many Americans did not want the Pope in the White House.

Religion and politics don't belong together. My reasoning is on the current gay marriage thread.

I'll write more on this thread if someone decides to support theocracy.

Hmm...I think it's known as seperation of church and state. I agree that atheism is sort of a form of religion, because it's just a certain set of beliefs, as all religions are, whether or not there is/are God(s).

It is impossible to separate church and state, for God is everywhere and politics is life.


I don't quite get what your saying, but the point is what you read and what you believe is how you probly will conduct yourself. Religion is broad and most of the religions carry around a philosophy and I don't think you can effectly ban a way of thinking in a free world.. well you can but then you couldn't really call yourself a democracy. If a politican wants to express his reasoning for what he does more power to him.

We should all live the way I claim Anubis wants us to.
Try and prove me wrong. ;)

Hmm...I think it's known as seperation of church and state. I agree that atheism is sort of a form of religion, because it's just a certain set of beliefs, as all religions are, whether or not there is/are God(s).

Atheism is not a set of beliefs. Its one belief. That there is no god, and that what is visible is what is real. Its only how we interpret them, as to how we come up with inconsistencies or mistakes. Call it a religion if you want to be picky, but it isnt a set of beliefs, as opposed to the commandments, etc.

Anyways, while I believe god and religion have no direct place in government, I also believe that any person in politics has the full right to express their religious beliefs, as long as it does not impeach on the first amendment(harm anybodys right to belief and worship a religion, or favor one religion over another). While a president or high-up politician might favor one, as long as none of his actions directly make one religion favorable, its fine. If that person pushes for the beliefs set out by the religion, its perfectly alright, even though I, and others, may disagree with those, or the reason for pushing those.

No.

No.

*hands you a cookie*

Here, here!

How do you intend to keep Him out if He shows up demanding entry?

How do you intend to keep Him out if He shows up demanding entry?

Simple: Slam the door in his face.

:D

How do you intend to keep Him out if He shows up demanding entry?

Lol, so true not even hell could keep GOD out, when he came to get those who died before Christ into heaven.

How do you intend to keep Him out if He shows up demanding entry?

Tell him to get citizenship and get elected. Its that simple. Unless the local laws forbid foreign born citizens from being elected.

If so, tell him to get born in host country. As an omnipotent being, that should be easy.

God or no god, you got to follow the rules if you want in on the system.

We should all live the way I claim Anubis wants us to.
Try and prove me wrong. ;)
Anubis tried to destroy the entire galaxy at the end of Stargate SG-1 Season 8. I don't want to live in HIS country.

Atheism is not a set of beliefs. Its one belief. That there is no god, and that what is visible is what is real.

Just a note - Atheism doesn't even imply the belief that "what is visible is real." It's merely the belief in lack of a God (OR Lack of belief in a god - many find a difference between those two statements). There's no more to it than that.

I think a good question is; Does God want to be involved in government?

If I were the almighty, I sure wouldn't. Pain in the ass, if you ask me.

Anubis tried to destroy the entire galaxy at the end of Stargate SG-1 Season 8. I don't want to live in HIS country.

Too bad, he rules. I say so, and if you disagree, you sin and go to hell. ;)

Anubis tried to destroy the entire galaxy at the end of Stargate SG-1 Season 8. I don't want to live in HIS country.


lmao! I love Stargate I need to download all the eps I've missed.. I've seen everyone up till season four then I started to miss a couple of them :(

How do you intend to keep Him out if He shows up demanding entry?

Break a few dozen of his legs, that oughta stop him.

Just a note - Atheism doesn't even imply the belief that "what is visible is real." It's merely the belief in lack of a God (OR Lack of belief in a god - many find a difference between those two statements). There's no more to it than that.

I realise this, but I was talking about mainstream atheism. And while I know many other things could be considered mainstream, I was just saying that its basically the only other viable thing to believing in gods, believing in the physical. But yes, atheism in its most strict form is simply not believing in religion.

Too bad, he rules. I say so, and if you disagree, you sin and go to hell. ;)
But Richard Dean Anderson can't go to hell! He's too clever.

lmao! I love Stargate I need to download all the eps I've missed.. I've seen everyone up till season four then I started to miss a couple of them :(
You're missing out. Such a great show.

But Richard Dean Anderson can't go to hell! He's too clever.

He can if I say... I mean Anubis says so.

I think a good question is; Does God want to be involved in government?

If I were the almighty, I sure wouldn't. Pain in the ass, if you ask me.

I wonder why all religions are so earth-oriented? I mean, if there is such a big universe, with so many other planets, surely there is other life to attend to, and other things for him to do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialist Autonomia
No.


*hands you a cookie*

Here, here!

*hands both of you cookies ^^

Just a note - Atheism doesn't even imply the belief that "what is visible is real."

i do so believe that "what is visible is what is real" is Empyracism...excuse the spelling, it is wayyy to early for this...

Break a few dozen of his legs, that oughta stop him.

I'm pretty sure HE is made out of pure energy. I do not think anything of HIS can be broken...

Sure. Unless we decide to base our legal system on Kant, Smith or Mill.. well hey. If you want to live in a philosopher's wankfest legal system feel free to start your own damned country.

Otherwise I don't see a reason why 'God', 'Religion', 'my personal belief' et all, should not be allowed in Government. God is simply a way of saying 'this is what I'm doing, cause God told me so'. The only difference between that statement and a 'godless' government is 'this is what I'm doing, cause I said so.'

He can if I say... I mean Anubis says so.


Bla, Anubis is probly just a fallen angel with no powers... hes probly just lucifers bitch.

Sure. Unless we decide to base our legal system on Kant, Smith or Mill.. well hey. If you want to live in a philosopher's wankfest legal system feel free to start your own damned country.

Otherwise I don't see a reason why 'God', 'Religion', 'my personal belief' et all, should not be allowed in Government. God is simply a way of saying 'this is what I'm doing, cause God told me so'. The only difference between that statement and a 'godless' government is 'this is what I'm doing, cause I said so.'

Thats not god in government. Thats god in people in government. The middleman is important.

Bla, Anubis is probly just a fallen angel with no powers... hes probly just lucifers bitch.

Prove it.
('sides, he's *my* bitch ;) )

He can if I say... I mean Anubis says so.
You don't know what that man can do with duct tape.

i have another random question, religiously orientated...so if Jesus had the power to save himself from being crusified, but he didn't, isn't that considered suicide and doesn't that mean he should have gone to hell??

You don't know what that man can do with duct tape.

None can stand in the way of Anubis' cute bottom!

None can stand in the way of Anubis' cute bottom!
Eurgh. *shudders*

Eurgh. *shudders*

See? See?! Anubis uber alles!

None can stand in the way of Anubis' cute bottom!
umm... >.>
i'm just going to ignore this >.<

See? See?! Anubis uber alles!
Just because I shudder doesn't mean the Holy Duct Tape can't save me.

i have another random question, religiously orientated...so if Jesus had the power to save himself from being crusified, but he didn't, isn't that considered suicide and doesn't that mean he should have gone to hell??

Jesus sacrificed HIMself, which the bible states is one of the most noblest things you can do. To give your life up for you friends to live, it’s like diving on a grenade to save your squad. sure, its kinda like suicide but it isn’t. Plus Jesus did goto hell, but only for three or four days I think. But I do not believe that suicide is a sin that will send you to hell… most of the other religions do not either.. sure suicide is a sin but it isn’t the major one.

Just because I shudder doesn't mean the Holy Duct Tape can't save me.

A combination of Holy Duct Tape and a couple of Holy Hand Grenades can work wonders.

Just because I shudder doesn't mean the Holy Duct Tape can't save me.

It is useless, discard your puny heathen relics and be saved.

It is useless, discard your puny heathen relics and be saved.
It is too late for you! The Hand Grenades have already come to my aid.

Jesus sacrificed HIMself, which the bible states is one of the most noblest things you can do. To give your life up for you friends to live, it’s like diving on a grenade to save your squad. sure, its kinda like suicide but it isn’t. Plus Jesus did goto hell, but only for three or four days I think. But I do not believe that suicide is a sin that will send you to hell… most of the other religions do not either.. sure suicide is a sin but it isn’t the major one.

that makes more sense...but why didn't he just use his awsomely holy pw=owers and pwn some nubs??? that always seems to work in Black and White (the game)

and why is "God" so vengeful anyways?

It is too late for you! The Hand Grenades have already come to my aid.

Dude, they only give a +3 to the munchkin's level. Face it, you're doomed.
*plays an 'I am your father' card on Anubis to be sure, giving him a +10 to his level*

Just because I shudder doesn't mean the Holy Duct Tape can't save me.

It is useless, discard your puny heathen relics and be saved.

Just do what everyone else does when coming to grips with the false god problem. Start a rebellion and when all else fails get a giant holy thermal nuclear device and blow up the god's temple\space ship thingy.

You mention Bush, yet you fail to remember that Kennedy was Catholic. His election caused quite the turmoil. Many Americans did not want the Pope in the White House.
LOL. The Pope isn't a "popeteer". I'm pretty sure Kennedy wasn't receiving special missions from the Vatican. :rolleyes:

Anyway. Elected leaders represent the majority of electors. So if electors want somebody who's religious, they will elect one. But one alternative approach would be to say: it's easier to represent the WHOLE country if you put religion aside.

So is goes like this: The government represents all his people (whatever their religious beliefs)... or the government represents the "tyranny of the majority"?

A country with an islamic constitution could have christian ministers. Example? In Saddam Hussein's Iraq, foreign minister Tariq Aziz was a christian.
And a country with a christian constitution could have a hinduist minister: Canada's minister of health Ujjal Dosanjh.


The fact that the American population reacted strongly to the election of Kennedy gives you a hint about how HARD it is to manage a multi-religions country such as Iraq or Lebanon, though.


But there's hope. For example: in Canada, 50% of the population is Protestant and 46% is Catholic. Well, we had Catholic and Protestant prime ministers over the years, and people didn't give a damn because these state leaders were discrete about their denomination. Sure, they go to public celebrations, but they always try to go to "non denominational celebrations" or oecumenic masses. And to which church or temple they go in their private life isn't of public interest.

Except if you're named Stephen Harper and people hate you.

Dude, they only give a +3 to the munchkin's level. Face it, you're doomed.
*plays an 'I am your father' card on Anubis to be sure, giving him a +10 to his level*
I know not of what you speak. But I have Faith in the Power. And Stuff.

and why is "God" so vengeful anyways?

Maybe he has a thorn stuck in his paw?

I'm pretty sure HE is made out of pure energy. I do not think anything of HIS can be broken...

e=mc^2...his pure energy can be in the form of matter. Preferably shaped like legs.

I know not of what you speak. But I have Faith in the Power. And Stuff.

Anubis still owns you.

Dude, they only give a +3 to the munchkin's level. Face it, you're doomed.
this has gotten out of cotrol @.@
*slaps Hakartopia and Deleuze*

Anubis still owns you.
Perhaps. But not the Stuff. I assume we can agree on that.

this has gotten out of cotrol @.@
*slaps Hakartopia and Deleuze*
Hey. It's clean, harmless fun.

that makes more sense...but why didn't he just use his awsomely holy pw=owers and pwn some nubs??? that always seems to work in Black and White (the game)

and why is "God" so vengeful anyways?

Well, HE kinda got tired of pwning everyone.. I mean destorying the world again just didn't seem like a good idea when the same problems came up.

HE isn't really vengeful anymore.. Well HE is holding it back and will let it pour out then the world goes luciferian in the end time. but that's why we have Jesus so we can be saved... the only way to have sin forgiven is with the sheding of blood... cause sin runs in the blood... in the old days they would sacrifice animals because they are free of sin, but Jesus having none is our way of not having to face GOD's vengeance...

this has gotten out of cotrol @.@
*slaps Hakartopia and Deleuze*

Iiieeee! *Scampers off*

Anubis still owns you. :sniper: <I just owned Anubis with a head shot >:P

Maybe he has a thorn stuck in his paw?
yes he probably, metaforically, has a thorn in his paw...or if he is a she, then she probably has sand in her vagina...


Hey. It's clean, harmless fun. Okay, fine.

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.
If your "faith" doesn't affect your behavior, whether you're elected or not, then it is no "faith" at all. I don't think anyone who is even passingly familiar with the US Constitution would even suggest that no one of "faith" be allowed to run for political office. People of "faith" in elected office is a fact of life, it's constitutional, and you need to get over it.

Yes. Some sort of higher power is needed to protect the most basic, inalienable rights from government. The founders of the US built this system on the belief that God gives humans the freedom to speak, write, and believe as they will. Since such rights come from God, only God can revoke those rights. It would be immoral for the government to try.

If your "faith" doesn't affect your behavior, whether you're elected or not, then it is no "faith" at all. I don't think anyone who is even passingly familiar with the US Constitution would even suggest that no one of "faith" be allowed to run for political office. People of "faith" in elected office is a fact of life, it's constitutional, and you need to get over it.

i am over it, it just bothers me when they try and hide their religion; because i do agree whith you, people cannot and should not try and hide who they are.

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.

I agree that religion has no place in politics, we are long past the days of theocracy. However, I have to correct you where you say that the absence of religion is a religion. It is not. Religion involves worship, belief, and spirituality. So to not have a religion, better said, to be agnostic or atheist, is...not a religion.

Anubis tried to destroy the entire galaxy at the end of Stargate SG-1 Season 8. I don't want to live in HIS country.

:confused:
I thought you were talking about the ancient Egyptian god.

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.

I believe the government needs to be unbiased and not get involved in anything with a religious preference. When addressing matters of religion, it must address them in the same manner as the first ammendment guarentees its citizens.

You know, there are more jedis in briatain than there are jews and bristol has the highest jedi population in britain. I thought that was cool. :)

We should all live the way I claim Anubis wants us to.
Try and prove me wrong. ;) Nothing wrong with that, if you can get a majority vote on that from the people. :)

Nothing wrong with that, if you can get a majority vote on that from the people. :)

Truth needs no democracy.

Truth needs no democracy.

Thus justifying the Spanish Inquisition against.... Jews.

...why Jews? I dunno, they were mostly trying to live peacefully...

Of course, because religions need to be respected so the word God is gonna pop up. "They should be free to worship."

Should god be considered whiles making decisions on civil rights, lifestyles...anything not to do directly with what goes on inside a church...no.

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.

Personally, I feel that if you cannot keep your own personal beliefs to yourself and honor the separation between church and state, you are not qualified to be president of the U.S.

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.
Wrong, absence of religion is NOT religion. However there ARE atheistic religions, which saying "No Christians, you can't do whatever you want everywhere" is not a religion, even an atheistic one

I think that "God" should not be allowed in our government...However when you become the supreme overlord (also known as president), I am sure it would be hard to just renounce your religious beliefs.

What always bothered me was that you could totaly tell how religious our presidents are and yet they are forced to clame no connections to figures such as the pope...I bet that if the pope asked Bush to do something outrageous he probably would >.>

Another thing you have to consider is that the absence of a religion is in fact a religion. So the whole law of not allowing religion to interfear is a bit arbitrary. Either they admit they are religious and get rid of the laws against it or they continue to live in denial about it and leave things as is.
Absence of religion is NOT a religion. (if you don’t understand look up the definition of religion)

You can have a BELIEF in no god but beliefs don’t make religions (I believe the sun will come up tomorrow … does that mean it is a religion just based on that one sole belief … no)

Ihatevacations']Wrong, absence of religion is NOT religion. However there ARE atheistic religions, which saying "No Christians, you can't do whatever you want everywhere" is not a religion, even an atheistic one

re·li·gion Audio pronunciation of "religion" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (r-ljn)
n.

1.
1. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe.
2. A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship.
2. The life or condition of a person in a religious order.
3. A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader.
4. A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion.

The ONLY possibility is 4 and thats not really correctly interpreting atheism ... there is scientism ... but thats different

Truth needs no democracy. No, no, no. It's "Truth is not determined by a majority vote." (Note that I am not pointing the finger at Ratzinger, I love the guy)

No, no, no. It's "Truth is not determined by a majority vote." (Note that I am not pointing the finger at Ratzinger, I love the guy)

Do not question Zim!

Does "God" have any place in the government?

No! Never!

No. Read "Salem Witch Trials".

Do not question Zim!

<3

Zim can be my president

<3

Zim can be my president

Bow down! Bow down!
Before the power of Santa!
Or be crushed! Be crushed!
By...
His jolly boots of Doom!

Many Americans did not want the Pope in the White House.

Quite clearly not more than those who did.

Quite clearly not more than those who did.
I don't think Kennedy was elected on the basis of being Catholic. Perhaps he would have gotten even more votes if he wasn't one.

Anyway, I think that God should only be allowed to break ties in Congress, maybe take the blame for some bad decision making and such. God would come an sit through a session in Congress looking all-mighty and bored, and then when someone asked his opinion he would just go "yeah, yeah, whatever."