NationStates Jolt Archive

The lies just keep coming and coming... at this point I'm finding it hard to believe anything coming out of the Bush administration these days foreign or domestic. I mean we sort of knew they were lying to us early on.. but in the last few months, between memo's and other various sources, I don't think we had any idea just how much we actually were lied to. History is not going to be kind to Bush and rightfully so it would appear.

Ooop's! We Lied Again! (http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/story.jsp?story=647397)

*Shakes Head*

The lies just keep coming and coming... at this point I'm finding it hard to believe anything coming out of the Bush administration these days foreign or domestic. I mean we sort of knew they were lying to us early on.. but in the last few months, between memo's and other various sources, I don't think we had any idea just how much we actually were lied to. History is not going to be kind to Bush and rightfully so it would appear.

Ooop's! We Lied Again! (http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/story.jsp?story=647397)

*Shakes Head*

This is disgusting. It changes nothing for me as my view of the American government was about as low as it could be anyway.

From the article:
"Mr Ingram said 30 MK77 firebombs were used by the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force in the invasion of Iraq between 31 March and 2 April 2003. They were used against military targets "away from civilian targets", he said. This avoids breaching the 1980 Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons (CCW), which permits their use only against military targets."

Not illegal under international law. They were used primarily against Iraqi defensive positions around bridge approaches.

Lying to UK officials is bad. But the act of using fire weapons against military targets is not illegal.

Yeah, it's pretty sad. Nothing to be proud of that's for sure. I mean I think at no time in modern history has the government in the US been so full of shit and corrupt and have so many follow it anyway. I mean what is wrong with people? Has the national IQ of the USA fallen so low that they just don't care anymore? Or is it because we are the last super power and feel a sense of entitlement? I'm not sure which it is, but it sure is messed up. Something needs to change and soon. Or I fear for the USA.. I fear for us all.

@Whispering Legs

What you think about the fact that at least in Gulf war soldiers were exposed to -(what's the word) uranium without telling them what they were handling?

From the article:
"Mr Ingram said 30 MK77 firebombs were used by the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force in the invasion of Iraq between 31 March and 2 April 2003. They were used against military targets "away from civilian targets", he said. This avoids breaching the 1980 Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons (CCW), which permits their use only against military targets."

Not illegal under international law. They were used primarily against Iraqi defensive positions around bridge approaches.

Lying to UK officials is bad. But the act of using fire weapons against military targets is not illegal.


Well, school is still out on whether we used it in Fallujah last year or not. We simply don't know. And it's not like we can trust a single word that comes from the Bush administration anymore. So who knows.. Besides that, it's not even really the point. If we are going to lie so much, shouldn't we at least be good at it? How many other administrations have been busted like this in your life? Nixon maybe, but Nixon didn't cause so much death & destruction as the lies of the Bush administration has. Makes me wish the EU or something would take over super power status or something, I think we've proved we can't handle it responsibly. Maybe no one can.

As an American I must say I agree with you. He is a wanton cowboy policing the world for his own purposes. He LIED to us too (not that i was fool enough to beleive him) and now we must suffer for his idiocy. We are not welcome anymore and all because he superceded our respect for his redneck agenda. It is pathetic, It is pitiful and I am deeply and humbly ashamed........

If it wasn't illegal then why would they lie to Britian about it? Was it just to keep Britians support for the war strong? If they lie to them about this does this mean they are nto above lying about other things? Possibly even about what they know to be true or not regarding intelligence of what Saddam was capable of militarily and what terrorists me may or may not have been corroborating with?

@Whispering Legs

What you think about the fact that at least in Gulf war soldiers were exposed to -(what's the word) uranium without telling them what they were handling?

Depleted uranium, I think you mean.

Depleted uranium, I think you mean.
I guess so. "unrichened" :D

I wonder why they didn't teach me any useful words in school... :)

If it wasn't illegal then why would they lie to Britian about it? Was it just to keep Britians support for the war strong? If they lie to them about this does this mean they are nto above lying about other things? Possibly even about what they know to be true or not regarding intelligence of what Saddam was capable of militarily and what terrorists me may or may not have been corroborating with?

I'd just like to point out that Britain's support for the war was never strong, if you're referring to the populace. It was, and still is, a very unpopular war waged against the wishes of the British people.

Damn Yankees!

I know I was speaking of British govt. support

Makes me wish the EU or something would take over super power status or something.

That would be awful!

At least it wouldn't manage to kill as many people as America though...

I'd just like to point out that Britain's support for the war was never strong, if you're referring to the populace. It was, and still is, a very unpopular war waged against the wishes of the British people.

Don't forget that it was waged against the wishes of the American people.

That would be awful!

At least it wouldn't manage to kill as many people as America though...

Well maybe no one country should ever be allowed to become too powerful, history has taught us this lesson over and over again, yet we still don't seem to get it. Whenever a country ends up with this type of power they abuse it. We Americans have become no exception.

That is why I hate Tony Blair! He lied to us to join the war. I think he just wants to feel needed, like Churchill. Come to think of it... No other Prime Minister has been this close to an American president but Churchill...leaves one to ponder his intensions. I am only upset because he won again! :headbang:

I can't say that I'm surprised that one group of corrupt evil bastards lied to another group of corrupt evil bastards.

Don't forget that it was waged against the wishes of the American people.

That could have been a believable statement before the 2004 elections. While the war was a great part in Labour's loss of over a hundered mandates in parliament, the Republicans and George W. Bush increased their support and power in the US.

I thought perhaps someone would enjoy this - I didn't want to start a whole thread over it.

http://www.gregpalast.com/images/card_IraqStratLarge.jpg

since this seems to be a good time for posting random pics...
http://www.oldamericancentury.org/freedom_march1.jpg

Actually, they didn't lie. Technically what they used wasn't napalm. Had a different chemical structure.

That could have been a believable statement before the 2004 elections. While the war was a great part in Labour's loss of over a hundered mandates in parliament, the Republicans and George W. Bush increased their support and power in the US.

It's kinda hard to judge the American public on this though, since they were fed lie after lie after lie and made to believe there were looming threats all around them. True, if the people had known the truth (odd that everyone else did) their government probably couldn't have gotten away with the things it did. But you have to actually go out of your way to find out what is going on in the world if you live in the US. The media down there just doesn't cover world events in anywhere near the same depth as in other countries.

i think this topic needs reworded to american hate fest.

Luckly the silent majority always wins.

It's kinda hard to judge the American public on this though, since they were fed lie after lie after lie and made to believe there were looming threats all around them. True, if the people had known the truth (odd that everyone else did) their government probably couldn't have gotten away with the things it did. But you have to actually go out of your way to find out what is going on in the world if you live in the US. The media down there just doesn't cover world events in anywhere near the same depth as in other countries.
Well at least someone understands! And it's refreshing to hear it from an outside source (not in the U.S.). Too bad we don't have the same realization here, but I guess your post pretty much explains why.

*offers Achtung 45 some smoked salmon and a bottle of maple syrup*

There are many worse administrations in US history... Lincoln, JFK, Nixon, and Clinton. Maybe you should actually study history before you open your mouth.

*offers Achtung 45 some smoked salmon and a bottle of maple syrup*
yay! something besdies a cookie! :D

As an American I must say I agree with you. He is a wanton cowboy policing the world for his own purposes. He LIED to us too (not that i was fool enough to beleive him) and now we must suffer for his idiocy. We are not welcome anymore and all because he superceded our respect for his redneck agenda. It is pathetic, It is pitiful and I am deeply and humbly ashamed........

Well there is one good thng to look forward to...2008....cya bush!!! Lets just hope we ge someone good...hopefully one of the best Presidents we've ever had :)

If we are going to lie so much, shouldn't we at least be good at it? How many other administrations have been busted like this in your life? Nixon maybe, but Nixon didn't cause so much death & destruction as the lies of the Bush administration has.
Now theres a point, you guys NEVER used to get busted lying,whats wrong?
Lost your best spin-doctor?

I'd just like to point out that Britain's support for the war was never strong, if you're referring to the populace. It was, and still is, a very unpopular war waged against the wishes of the British people.
It was un popular everywhere,but still managed to happen. This is the failure of democracy. Once a government is in power it controlls access to the truth.

There are many worse administrations in US history... Lincoln, JFK, Nixon, and Clinton. Maybe you should actually study history before you open your mouth.
Clinton was COOL and never waged Jihad on anyone, ;) And played an instrument.

EDIT oh yeah,Kosovo. forgot that. my bad.

Clinton was COOL and never waged Jihad on anyone, ;) And played an instrument.

Let me see, Clinton bombed Kosovo for crimes against humanity... Bush ousts a dictator that has done much worse than anyone in Kosovo and for THIRTY years! If Bush's war is a Jihad then so was Clinton's. Wake up and rejoin reality.

Let me see, Clinton bombed Kosovo for crimes against humanity... Bush ousts a dictator that has done much worse than anyone in Kosovo and for THIRTY years! If Bush's war is a Jihad then so was Clinton's. Wake up and rejoin reality.
lol! if only I lived in your world...

lol! if only I lived in your world...

You should really try out simple common sense... you may find that being part of the stupid majority isn't all that there is to the world... but then of course if there weren't people like you then I wouldn't have anyone to laugh at.

You should really try out simple common sense... you may find that being part of the stupid majority isn't all that there is to the world... but then of course if there weren't people like you then I wouldn't have anyone to laugh at.
lol, ditto to you too, pal! maybe if you knew half of what the Bush Administration was, you wouldn't be so arrogant...but then again what's teh use of argue? I'll just laugh! LOL!!!!1!111!!!!

You should really try out simple common sense... you may find that being part of the stupid majority isn't all that there is to the world... but then of course if there weren't people like you then I wouldn't have anyone to laugh at.
And we wouldnt have people like you to look down on.
Clinton being wrong doesnt make bush right.

Clinton being wrong doesnt make bush right.

Yes, I do so hate seeing death and destruction turned into a pissing contest.

From the article:
"Mr Ingram said 30 MK77 firebombs were used by the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force in the invasion of Iraq between 31 March and 2 April 2003. They were used against military targets "away from civilian targets", he said. This avoids breaching the 1980 Convention on Certain Conventional Weapons (CCW), which permits their use only against military targets."

Not illegal under international law. They were used primarily against Iraqi defensive positions around bridge approaches.

Lying to UK officials is bad. But the act of using fire weapons against military targets is not illegal.

Agree, people getting worked up over napalm. what the hell are they going to do when they use low yield nukes to take out bunkers in the next war.

Agree, people getting worked up over napalm. what the hell are they going to do when they use low yield nukes to take out bunkers in the next war.

Give their elected officials the boot?

The lies just keep coming and coming... at this point I'm finding it hard to believe anything coming out of the Bush administration these days foreign or domestic. I mean we sort of knew they were lying to us early on.. but in the last few months, between memo's and other various sources, I don't think we had any idea just how much we actually were lied to. History is not going to be kind to Bush and rightfully so it would appear.

Ooop's! We Lied Again! (http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/story.jsp?story=647397)

*Shakes Head*
Paying to read an article about how someone thinks your country lied to someone is like paying someone to beat you up.

No thanks.

The lies just keep coming and coming... at this point I'm finding it hard to believe anything coming out of the Bush administration these days foreign or domestic. I mean we sort of knew they were lying to us early on.. but in the last few months, between memo's and other various sources, I don't think we had any idea just how much we actually were lied to. History is not going to be kind to Bush and rightfully so it would appear.

Ooop's! We Lied Again! (http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/story.jsp?story=647397)

*Shakes Head*
Paying to read an article about how someone thinks your country lied to them is like paying a mugger to beat you up.

No thanks.

Paying to read an article about how someone thinks your country lied to them is like paying a mugger to beat you up.

No thanks.


LOL, nice...

Paying to read an article about how someone thinks your country lied to them is like paying a mugger to beat you up.

No thanks.
mmmmm duplicate post...you're confusing me here, i know what you're trying to say, but it's not making sense....must be cuz it's almost 12:30 or you're your logic doesn't quite work. Can you please explain how it works that way?

I'd just like to point out that Britain's support for the war was never strong, if you're referring to the populace. It was, and still is, a very unpopular war waged against the wishes of the British people.

an id like to point out that thats not totally true, i believe it was 60/40 for the war.... untill we all found out we had been lied too. Then it was too late and we have to stay to stabilise the dam place!

Here we go.....another was the war right thread. Will you people stop talking about the reasons why or who lied to whom, it doesn't matter anymore!! It is for history to decide whether the war was right or not, I'm for the war and I realize that history may decide against this cause. All that matters now is that Iraq become a stable and democratic government, but how many of you even care about what happens to Iraq? You may say you do but all you do is agrue about the reasons for war, you make it seem like we should have left Saddam in power. The death toll is....fuck what does it matter, I can say that Saddam is actually Hitler in disguise and you would still say that the war was wrong. I already know what people are going to say to this, they are going to say that I don't really understand the true reasons for war. Well, that doesn't really matter right now, all that matters is the fate of the Iraqi people and their new government. Thank whatever higher power there is that alot of you weren't around during ww2, or else most of us wouldn't be here right now.

Actually there are just as many now as in WW2 % wise. The only difference is the internet basically. Now there a soapbox for every moron who thinks they are a diplomatic major, scholar, warfare general, and that THEY alone know the truth in the world (ironicly from what i see the the ones that think they know the truth do nothing but quote arguements and opinions written from other people) and anybody else not supporting their viewpoint is stupid, all because they went looking for a article that fed to their viewpoint of the world.

fact is nobody in this forum has any damn idea what is going on in Iraq right now other the concentrated shit they hunt for online trying to find things that support their narrow minded viewpoints. *both sides do it*

Actually there are just as many now as in WW2 % wise. The only difference is the internet basically. Now there a soapbox for every moron who thinks they are a diplomatic major, scholar, warfare general, and that THEY alone know the truth in the world (ironicly from what i see the the ones that think they know the truth do nothing but quote arguements and opinions written from other people) and anybody else not supporting their viewpoint is stupid, all because they went looking for a article that fed to their viewpoint of the world.

fact is nobody in this forum has any damn idea what is going on in Iraq right now other the concentrated shit they hunt for online trying to find things that support their narrow minded viewpoints. *both sides do it*

I hope I'm not the only one that appreciates the irony of this post.

I have to say I strongly disagreed with our reasons for going into Iraq. Let's face facts, the official line was garbage. I know that many people bought it, and I'm not claiming I know what the real motives were, but it wasn't the liberation of the Iraqi people. If that were the case we would have been at war with China decades ago. That said, the US has made a mess in Iraq and walking away would be worse than trying to work it out.