NationStates Jolt Archive

Having seen people I would have said were caucasian saying they are black I am now quite confused.
What is race and how do you define it? How do you decide what race someone is?

EDIT: Poll added.

*sigh*
I am asking about race. Given that governments and media harp about it constantly I would like to clarify what it means. Claiming it doesn't exist is unrealistic.
And it is not nationality.

The only race worth mentioning is the human race, which is the Master Race. Together, humans of all colors, religions, genders, et. al. must work together to exterminate every cockroach from the face of this Earth!!!

Only one race.

I've never understood race distinctions.

Before College I never noticed a difference. Then I grew up and had to fill out forms asking about my race (Ithought I was a person) and I saw lots of people making a big deal over the fact that they were of a different pigmentation than myself.

I frankly could care less whether someone is more or less sunburnt than myself :D

I've had friends of all shades and will continue to.

I base "race" on nationality. If you are born in the US, you are American.
If you are born in Africa, you are African. My ancestors are from England, but that doesn't make me English any more than having African ancestry makes one African.

I don't care about race. Sometimes I feel like putting 'Other-human' on my cards.

A competition of speed, as in running or riding, or an extended competition in which participants struggle like runners to be the winner, eg. the presidential race, the space race.

Having seen people I would have said were caucasian saying they are black I am now quite confused.
What is race and how do you define it? How do you decide what race someone is?

EDIT: Poll added.

Race, as commonly used, is an essentially meaningless cultural construct without clear definition or dividing lines.

I go by the biological definition: a taxon below species, capable of interebreeding but which doesn't due to geographic isolation. By this definition the only existant races of H. sapien is H. sapien sapien. Both biologist and physical anthroplogist will tell you that race cannot be determined by apperance. Background is cultural. Ancestry is a mix, but cannot determine race, as it is so mixed.

One of the tradtitional definitions of the black race, which still has legal standing AFAIK in the US, is the 'one drop rule'. By this definition we are all black.

There's two races - the human race, and the Spice Girls.

There's two races - the human race, and the Spice Girls.


Hmmm... I might buy that! :D

"Inaccurate". There's no actual purpose to believing in races. Such beliefs are used only to attempt justifications of nationalism. Remember, to emphasise difference, however justifiably and honourably, is always turned into some form of discrimination by the unscrupulous.

Besides, the genetic differences between some members of different "races" (for example, myself and the black dude in the room next door to me) are far less than the genetic differences between some members of the same "race". Skin colour and some morphological/physiological features are little cause for comparison, as they reflect little genetically.

"Inaccurate". There's no actual purpose to believing in races. Such beliefs are used only to attempt justifications of nationalism. Remember, to emphasise difference, however justifiably and honourably, is always turned into some form of discrimination by the unscrupulous.

Besides, the genetic differences between some members of different "races" (for example, myself and the black dude in the room next door to me) are far less than the genetic differences between some members of the same "race". Skin colour and some morphological/physiological features are little cause for comparison, as they reflect little genetically.

DING DING!! No Race. At All.

"Inaccurate". There's no actual purpose to believing in races. Such beliefs are used only to attempt justifications of nationalism. Remember, to emphasise difference, however justifiably and honourably, is always turned into some form of discrimination by the unscrupulous.

Besides, the genetic differences between some members of different "races" (for example, myself and the black dude in the room next door to me) are far less than the genetic differences between some members of the same "race". Skin colour and some morphological/physiological features are little cause for comparison, as they reflect little genetically.

Furthermore, there isn't a clear dividing line re morphological differences. Human morphological differences are clinal variations. In laymans terms, they are a spectrum without a clear cut dividing line. There is no break on which one side is clearly black and the other side is not, without a middle.

The same is true for all morphological traits linked to "race".

Race is an idea; a human construct.

I base "race" on nationality. If you are born in the US, you are American.
If you are born in Africa, you are African. My ancestors are from England, but that doesn't make me English any more than having African ancestry makes one African.

The US is a country, whereas Africa is not. "African" is not a nationality.

Race: Any physical characteristic that can be used by a government, political organization or special interest group to create a perception of difference, in order to prevent common harmony, and focus of attention, on the real cause of conflict and discourse.

The US is a country, whereas Africa is not. "African" is not a nationality.

very true. :) but people tend to over generalize.


I agree, race is only a construct used to separate humans. If we spent less time thinking about race and more time thinking about people things would improve dramatically. Less cliques, less hate, less discrimination

I remember those stupid forms in highschool - and being a foreign student from Germany didn't help at all, then. 1st off, I don't have an American social security number. Apparently schools can't process anything without it. 2nd-ly I never knew what to put down for race. There is no such thing a "race" when it comes to human beings - at least that's what I have learned through history & biology lessons... Whenever I have to fill anything in like that I put down "Earthling".

The only race is the human race.

Liverbreath']Race: Any physical characteristic that can be used by a government, political organization or special interest group to create a perception of difference, in order to prevent common harmony, and focus of attention, on the real cause of conflict and discourse.

Ooh. Ooh, Liverbreath, you get this evening's Niels Award (The Watenhi Ministry of Culture's award for clarity in debating) for that. We like it. We like it a lot.

Physical features, NOT apperance. (Apperance could make you black by having a sunburn... :))

You are Black if you lack a nose bone on the bottom of your nose.
You are White if you do have a nose bone on the bottom of your nose.

(Asian is too hard to define, because there are no definite feature that define Asians. For example, the Inca Indians of Chile have elongated eyes, and look Asian, but they are not.)

Physical features, NOT apperance. (Apperance could make you black by having a sunburn... :))

You are Black if you lack a nose bone on the bottom of your nose.
You are White if you do have a nose bone on the bottom of your nose.

(Asian is too hard to define, because there are no definite feature that define Asians. For example, the Inca Indians of Chile have elongated eyes, and look Asian, but they are not.)

but why define them at all? what's the point?

but why define them at all? what's the point?

To ensure people have a bottom nose bone for jobs that require them? :p

Race is a social construct. I'm pleasantly surprised to see how many people have already let go of it.

We are all one race, the humans, an advanced civilization thats taking its first baby-steps into inhabiting the distant stars.

Also for the people that voted for appearence, may I remind them that it is possible to change skin color and that just because you're black one day and white the next doesn't make you a person of caucasion decent.

Ooh. Ooh, Liverbreath, you get this evening's Niels Award (The Watenhi Ministry of Culture's award for clarity in debating) for that. We like it. We like it a lot.

I thank you very much. Feel free to use it as you like, but above all believe it! Maybe some day our governments will encourage us to seek out things we have in common instead of finding differences and reporting them, but for now they would be in way too much trouble if they did! hahaha

I don't.

An intriguing "Race Sorting Activity" (http://www.pbs.org/race/002_SortingPeople/002_01-sort.htm)

Having seen people I would have said were caucasian saying they are black I am now quite confused.
What is race and how do you define it? How do you decide what race someone is?

EDIT: Poll added.

*sigh*
I am asking about race. Given that governments and media harp about it constantly I would like to clarify what it means. Claiming it doesn't exist is unrealistic.
And it is not nationality.
How do I define "race?" I don't. It's a meaningless way of categorizing people, since it's not based on anything even remotely scientific. The entire issue is specious.

A combonation of the three mentioned above. Race seems to have two parts, one is how the self is identified by others (Asian, White, Black, etc), but is also a product on how the self identifies itself. The two feed off of each other as well, being seen as Black tends to cause you to self identify more as Black, which leads to accepting or enhancing cultural differences, which leads back to more people seeing you as Black, which leads... so on and so forth.

The culutre on which you grow up, your appearences and how closely they 'fit' the norm, and your economic situation infulances how the 'norm' will view you.

Of course, as it's been pointed out, since the Human Genome (sp?) Projct was compleated and it was found that, genetically speaking, there is less than 20 billionth of a persentile difference between races, the whole issue is just a wee bit silly.

But the human mnd seems to be wired to pick out differences, perhaps as a survial tool (that isn't a ptch of grass, that's a lion about to eat me). Add in the human social need to be tribal and you got the use of race as a factor for exclusion, or inclusion.

race1 Audio pronunciation of "race" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rs)
n.

1. A local geographic or global human population distinguished as a more or less distinct group by genetically transmitted physical characteristics.
2. A group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic distribution: the German race.
3. A genealogical line; a lineage.
4. Humans considered as a group.
5. Biology.
1. An interbreeding, usually geographically isolated population of organisms differing from other populations of the same species in the frequency of hereditary traits. A race that has been given formal taxonomic recognition is known as a subspecies.
2. A breed or strain, as of domestic animals.
6. A distinguishing or characteristic quality, such as the flavor of a wine.

See, it wasn't that fucking hard people. :rolleyes:

See, it wasn't that fucking hard people. :rolleyes:
Heh! The question wasn't "what is the definition of race," the question was "how do you define race," meaning you, personally.

Actually, many in the Southern US define "race" as NASCAR! :D

Heh! The question wasn't "what is the definition of race," the question was "how do you define race," meaning you, personally.

Actually, many in the Southern US define "race" as NASCAR! :D


LOL! Their definition is a little lower on the page then the one I posted, but I assure you. It is there. :D

I really just posted that to *try* to counter the "there is no such thing as race" thing.

race n.
1. Sports.
1. A competition of speed, as in running or riding.
2. races A series of such competitions held at a specified time on a regular course: a fan of the dog races.
2. An extended competition in which participants struggle like runners to be the winner: the presidential race.
3. Steady or rapid onward movement: the race of time.
4.
1. A strong or swift current of water.
2. The channel of such a current.
3. An artificial channel built to transport water and use its energy. Also called raceway.
5. A groovelike part of a machine in which a moving part slides or rolls.
6. See slipstream.

Only one race.

i love when people say this , it sounds about as idiotic as a dog saying ( if dogs could talk ) there is only one breed of dog and thats canine.

Liverbreath']Race: Any physical characteristic that can be used by a government, political organization or special interest group to create a perception of difference, in order to prevent common harmony, and focus of attention, on the real cause of conflict and discourse.
Added to my list of fav quotes.

There's two races - the human race, and the Spice Girls.

I agree with that... :p

An intriguing "Race Sorting Activity" (http://www.pbs.org/race/002_SortingPeople/002_01-sort.htm)

Good one.