NationStates Jolt Archive

Proudly presenting an organization from my home county...

Anyone familiar with PABBIS???

http://www.pabbis.com/

God, don't get me started... :headbang:

Too bad countless books they have listed are some of my favorites. So much of the text they quote is taken completely out of context. These people have nothing better to do than to nit pick on tiny details.

I know.

I was looking at the list and was very surprised NOT to see the Bible on there. It's got plenty of violence and sex in it.

Oh right - paranoid Christian parents... :rolleyes:

At least two Nobel prizewinners on the list. I think it is safe to say that I have more faith in the Swedish institute than these bunch of over-cossetting prudes.

This shit is really getting old...

This shit is really getting old...A note of caution: It's best to make your posts clear. At first glance, I can't tell if you're agreeing with "Loana" or personally attacking "Loana".

Carry on.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Game Moderator

This shit is really getting old...
But it's probably the old school value freaks who are pushing it, so it is getting old ;)

A note of caution: It's best to make your posts clear. At first glance, I can't tell if you're agreeing with "Loana" or personally attacking "Loana".

Carry on.

--The Modified Democratic States of Cogitation
NationStates Game Moderator

Yeah, I was thinking as such. Next time, I'll quote the post!

This shit is really getting old...

Different list to the one that was posted a few weeks back and again today.

But it's probably the old school value freaks who are pushing it, so it is getting old ;)

Yeah, but their children will be up in arms over it. Wonderful. A never-ending cycle...

Different list to the one that was posted a few weeks back and again today.

I know that. I'm talking about parents being up in arms over "offensive" material that isn't the least bit offensive.

Proudly presenting an organization from my home county...

Anyone familiar with PABBIS???

http://www.pabbis.com/

God, don't get me started... :headbang:

Too bad countless books they have listed are some of my favorites. So much of the text they quote is taken completely out of context. These people have nothing better to do than to nit pick on tiny details.

Some of them I can see... but:

One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest?
The Clan of the Cave Bear?
The Color Purple?

"American Foreign Policy, Vol. II"

scared about the truth?

"Anne Frank: The Diary Of A Young Girl"

what. the. fuck?

"Canterbury Tales"

...eh?

"Charlotte's Web"

too scared about the hidden messages in the web?

"Animal Farm"

they dont agree with the message that the pigs eventualy turn into the humans, thus showing the bad side of a communist society?

and these take the piss:
"Dracula"
"Beowulf
"Harry Potter (Series)"
"Little Red Riding Hood"
"Little House on the Prairie"
"Little Women"
"The Hobbit"
"The Witches "
"Who Killed Kurt Cobain?"
"Where's Waldo?"

this is a joke, right?

Little women?

Why the hell is that on there?

"American Foreign Policy, Vol. II"

scared about the truth?

"Anne Frank: The Diary Of A Young Girl"

what. the. fuck?

"Canterbury Tales"

...eh?

"Charlotte's Web"

too scared about the hidden messages in the web?

"Animal Farm"

they dont agree with the message that the pigs eventualy turn into the humans, thus showing the bad side of a communist society?

and these take the piss:
"Dracula"
"Beowulf
"Harry Potter (Series)"
"Little Red Riding Hood"
"Little House on the Prairie"
"Little Women"
"The Hobbit"
"The Witches "
"Who Killed Kurt Cobain?"
"Where's Waldo?"

this is a joke, right?
Err, where did you see all those? The only list I could find was this:
http://63.220.28.231/

I know, imagine the folks who tried to ban Tom Sawyer just because it has a few offensive words in it like "niger". PABBIS is just a clearinghouse for info though, a nice info source, but don't blame them for any items on the lists.

There are several books not found on the lists that I think really deserve to at least be considered disclaimered reading for public schools. The Turner Diaries, as an example, should not just be left on the shelves for any 8 year old to pick up and confuse with reality or an objective analysis of the future. I think the bias might be due to the nature of the lists, because I've never seen The Turner Diaries in a public school library and I know a few oganizations in the '90s threatened a boycott of bookstores which were planning on carrying it (certainly qualifying it for a position on a list of banned books as large as this one).

The only "bad" book is one that deliberately distorts or conceals emperical data (history/science) for political purposes. Oh wait, I'm talking about Usian Textbooks again, aren't I... :headbang:

Err, where did you see all those? The only list I could find was this:
http://63.220.28.231/
http://www.pabbis.com/listoflistsbytitlerev1.htm

Err, where did you see all those? The only list I could find was this:
http://63.220.28.231/ go to this portion of the PABBIS site for the list of lists:
http://www.pabbis.com/listoflistsintro.html

Hamlet and The Merchant of Venice....

They want to ban the fucking CANTERBURY TALES! What in the blue hell? The Red Badge of Courage? James and the Giant Peach? Little Women? The Visual Dictionary of Military Forces? The Great Gatsby? The Complete Fairy Tales of the Brothers Grimm? The Autobiography of Malcolm X? Where's Waldo?

No, guys, here's a truly evil book that must be burned.
Jambo Means Hello: The Swahili Alphabet

Seriously, what the hell. Damn schools trying to teach our children about culture :rolleyes:


The Year They Burned the Books by Nancy Garden. Now that's ironic.


The Scarlet Letter by Nathaniel Hawthorne. Yes, let's destroy all evidence of Puritanical culture so when we bring it back nobody will know that it failed the first time!

Schindler's List (Film) SSssh! The Holocaust never happened!

Everything that Steven King ever wrote...

I just had to stop looking.

1984 Happiness is Mandatory... Are you happy, citizen? (I don't think that's from 1984, but still)

lol, I'm amazed that some of the older classics arn't on there...

lets send them a copy of Paradise lost and watch the heart attacks :D

on another note, I'm might use this as a reading list, a lot of good sounding stuff on there!

I hope everyone appreciates the irony that this group wants to ban 1984 for our own good.

They want to ban the fucking CANTERBURY TALES! What in the blue hell? The Red Badge of Courage? James and the Giant Peach? Little Women? The Visual Dictionary of Military Forces? The Great Gatsby? The Complete Fairy Tales of the Brothers Grimm? The Autobiography of Malcolm X? Where's Waldo?

No, guys, here's a truly evil book that must be burned.
Jambo Means Hello: The Swahili Alphabet

Seriously, what the hell. Damn schools trying to teach our children about culture :rolleyes:


The Year They Burned the Books by Nancy Garden. Now that's ironic.


The Scarlet Letter by Nathaniel Hawthorne. Yes, let's destroy all evidence of Puritanical culture so when we bring it back nobody will know that it failed the first time!

Schindler's List (Film) SSssh! The Holocaust never happened!

Everything that Steven King ever wrote...

I just had to stop looking.

1984 Happiness is Mandatory... Are you happy, citizen? (I don't think that's from 1984, but still)
Devil's Advocate:
"Books on lists from various sources are presented just as was done by that source. PABBIS has not read/reviewed most of these books. PABBIS does not understand why some of the books, on some of the lists, (e.g. Little House on the Prairie) would even be challenged. Other books may have been challenged because of age-inappropriate (too young) use and you might find them non-objectionable for your age child."

I know.

I was looking at the list and was very surprised NOT to see the Bible on there. It's got plenty of violence and sex in it.

Oh right - paranoid Christian parents... :rolleyes: Yeah, you're right - and this is coming from a zealous Catholic! - I opened the Bible at random once and it was about a man who had been killed for raping his sister.

I know that these used to be blacklisted as well:
The Catcher in the Rye
Satanic Verses

I was twitching over: Atwoods' "A Handmaid's Tale".

Sure it's a bad book, but NOT for the reasons listed; it's horrible because it's breaming with that horrible Canadian meaningless literary blither designed to fill 300 pages with descriptions that could've been condensed into 1 bloody chapter of 10 pages! Yeesh! (and mods, I am Canadian, I'll flame my own country if I wanna!)

If they are really keen on listing bad books, they also forgot Magaret Laurence's "The Stone Angel" - 500 pages of listening to a dried up old prunish hag whine abd bitch about how her life is so meaningless, only to end with the senile hag dying. Ugh! Terrible!

Oh, and anything by Stephan Leacock ought to qualify, just for being so damn DRY! There is nothing of substance to it. He just writes. That's it. Typical Canadian literature about one of those small hick towns in the middle of stinkin' nowhere Saskatchewan...

Oh, and let's NOT forget "Fifth Business" by Robertson Davies. This needed to be listed. The narrator is such a whiney ball-less twat!

These people don't know what makes a "bad book".

If they are so keen on banning books that are vulgar, containing sexual descriptions, violence etc...why not the Bible? It's racey enough!

Matilda and James and the Giant Peach. Aren't those grade-school classics?

Yeah, you're right - and this is coming from a zealous Catholic! - I opened the Bible at random once and it was about a man who had been killed for raping his sister.
Since you're religious, could you explain something to me...

You just acknowledged that the Bible is explicit in some areas. So, why do religious people, or rather particularly Christians who read this in turn complain about other literature and certain genres of Hollywood and indy movies, in your opinion?

Matilda and James and the Giant Peach. Aren't those grade-school classics?

Supposedly.

Devil's Advocate:
"Books on lists from various sources are presented just as was done by that source. PABBIS has not read/reviewed most of these books. PABBIS does not understand why some of the books, on some of the lists, (e.g. Little House on the Prairie) would even be challenged. Other books may have been challenged because of age-inappropriate (too young) use and you might find them non-objectionable for your age child."


Well, true, but come on... Jambo Means Hello?

I'm not sure why anyone except the Klu Klux Klan would find that offensive.


Edit: Answered my own question, didn't I.

I suspect most of the selections people find most offensive made their way onto the list by being age sensitive. If a book is considered innappropriate for 1st graders, it makes the list, even though the very same "censors" would consider it perfectly acceptable for 6th graders. I don't consider listing certain books as being age inappropiaite to be very offensive, although I consider outright banning of books based upon age to be so. I have noted that younger children have difficulty distingushing between fiction and reality and understanding appropriate behavior, without disclaimers these cna be fairly dangerous. Give a young child a copy of Huckleberry Finn without a disclaimer, and they might very well go arround calling people "niger" thinking there is nothing wrong with it.

I have a novel idea, no pun intended, sweet I created a pun! :eek: How about we just burn every book not government written or government endorsed? It will be exactly like another book, but once those are all burned, who will know!?

"Monday burn Millay, Wednesday Whitman, Friday Faulkner, burn 'em to ashes, then burn the ashes."

Matilda and James and the Giant Peach. Aren't those grade-school classics?
Sure...if you're not a nit-picking twit.

I have a novel idea, no pun intended, sweet I created a pun! :eek: How about we just burn every book not government written or government endorsed? It will be exactly like another book, but once those are all burned, who will know!?

"Monday burn Millay, Wednesday Whitman, Friday Faulkner, burn 'em to ashes, then burn the ashes."
So...basically become like Farenheit 451?!

I hope everyone appreciates the irony that this group wants to ban 1984 for our own good.
Between this, Fahrenheit 451 and The Year They Burned the Books I had quite a chuckle.

The Scarlet Letter was a pretty humorous one, too.

I have a novel idea, no pun intended, sweet I created a pun! :eek: How about we just burn every book not government written or government endorsed? It will be exactly like another book, but once those are all burned, who will know!?

"Monday burn Millay, Wednesday Whitman, Friday Faulkner, burn 'em to ashes, then burn the ashes."

YES!

And, while we're at it, let's put everyone who doesn't have white skin in concentration camps! BRILLIANT!!!

Between this, Fahrenheit 451 and The Year They Burned the Books I had quite a chuckle.

The Scarlet Letter was a pretty humorous one, too.

I wonder if they get it....

Since you're religious, could you explain something to me...

You just acknowledged that the Bible is explicit in some areas. So, why do religious people, or rather particularly Christians who read this in turn complain about other literature and certain genres of Hollywood and indy movies, in your opinion? As Einstein said: "Only two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity - and I'm not sure about the universe."

Why don't parents just get the hell off there asses and talk to there kids to see what they are reading. I FULLY plan and WILL ask my daughter what she is reading. If it isn't something age appropriate,then I will take it from her and let her read it when she is older.
Why make list, when the parent can just read the book themselves and judge for themselves.

I think I'll start an organization in response:

Teachers Against Bad Parents.

I wonder who'll have more members?

Why don't parents just get the hell off there asses and talk to there kids to see what they are reading. I FULLY plan and WILL ask my daughter what she is reading. If it isn't something age appropriate,then I will take it from her and let her read it when she is older.
Why make list, when the parent can just read the book themselves and judge for themselves.
Exactly. If you take it, explain why and not just because you can.

Sure you can't protect the child from everything but you can try and find a nice balance.

Matilda and James and the Giant Peach. Aren't those grade-school classics?


Ahh, but Matilda teaches children that supernatural powers are real. Furthermore, it teaches children, that if your parents are utter bastards, it's ok to get even.

James and the Giant Peach ofcourse, tells kids that it's ok to run away from home in a giant peach (again when your guardians are utter bastards).

And we can't have the children learning that, now can we :p

go to this portion of the PABBIS site for the list of lists:
http://www.pabbis.com/listoflistsintro.html

A Farewell to Arms?
A Wrinkle in Time?

"American Heritage Dictionary" ? :O
Animal Farm?
Are you There God, It's Me Margarete?
Beowulf?
Blubber?
Canturbury Tales?
Catcher In The Rye?
Charlotte's Web?
Death Of A Salesman?
Hamlet?
I, Claudius?
Little Red Riding Hood?
Little Women?
Of Mice And Men?
Schindler's List? (Film)
Tales of A Fourth Grade Nothing?
The Bible?
The Complete Fairy Tales of the Brothers Grimm?
The Grapes of Wrath?
The Great Gatsby?
The Hobbit?
The Merchant of Venice?
The Pearl?
The Red Badge of Courage?
The Scarlet Letter?
The Lord of The Rings?
To Kill A Mocking Bird?

Crap, if these people had their way, 11th and 12th grade english would not exist (American and English lit. respectively), along with most of 10th...

I think I'll start an organization in response:

Teachers Against Bad Parents.

I wonder who'll have more members?

I would join, but I caught a clue while I was student teaching and changed my major.

Why don't parents just get the hell off there asses and talk to there kids to see what they are reading. I FULLY plan and WILL ask my daughter what she is reading. If it isn't something age appropriate,then I will take it from her and let her read it when she is older.
Why make list, when the parent can just read the book themselves and judge for themselves. That would mean that they can (or want to) actually read.

"The last book I read was People Magazine..." (Patrick O Hern, Mix Up)

The Bible?



Woah woah wait a minute...
Do they actually want to ban the Bible? Maybe I'm going to start warming up to these people.

Exactly. If you take it, explain why and not just because you can.

Sure you can't protect the child from everything but you can try and find a nice balance.

Yep, sorry I didn't explain fully my intent, but that is the ticket

So...basically become like Farenheit 451?!

That's basically what I meant by "It will be exactly like another book, but once those are all burned, who will know!?"

And that's where I got the quote at the bottom.

1984 Happiness is Mandatory... Are you happy, citizen? (I don't think that's from 1984, but still)

Not from 1984, but it is basically an idea of the book.

War is Peace
Ignorance is Strength
Freedom is Slavery

Man...

"100 Questions and Answers About AIDS" "AIDS: Examining a Crisis"

Sorry for trying to stop AIDS. We won't do it again.

The people trying to ban the books, as obvious from the listed observations as to why "ban" in the first place; indicate they are more concerned with "how things are said" then what the actual novel's content is.

For example, "To Kill A Mocking Bird" was even under contention... Because it used words like "******" and the like.

Even though the story details around a southern white community, and covers a case of false acusation upon a young black boy, accused of rape; who is defended by a new "white lawyer" who is then ostrasized by the community while he attempts to show how the boy needs proper representation, and fights against the racism by the town in the case; and the fact it was written by a black woman, written to teach about racism, and educate the audience; It is banned because it "uses words which a 'offensive'"... It just shows me how blantantly illiterate the US is becomming... where people are more concerned about "Words" than the message.

The people trying to ban the books, as obvious from the listed observations as to why "ban" in the first place; indicate they are more concerned with "how things are said" then what the actual novel's content is.
Interesting since the master list contains the ALA lists of banned books, most of the books from thses lists were never banned. The ALA (American Library Association) has compiled lists of "banned books" which contain books which parents have complained about, which it reguarily distributes. I wonder how many of these "banned books" were ever banned anywhere? If to ban a book means to have a complaint about it on record, surely one can see how most of these books could have easily made it onto the list.


---edit--- for your information, this is what is considered "banning" a book from the offical ALA website http://www.ala.org/Template.cfm?Section=bbwlinks&Template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=40912:


Expression of Concern. An inquiry that has judgmental overtones.


Oral Complaint. An oral challenge to the presence and/or appropriateness of the material in question.


Written Complaint. A formal, written complaint filed with the institution (library, school, etc.), challenging the presence and/or appropriateness of specific material.


Public Attack. A publicly disseminated statement challenging the value of the material, presented to the media and/or others outside the institutional organization in order to gain public support for further action.


Censorship. A change in the access status of material, based on the content of the work and made by a governing authority or its representatives. Such changes include exclusion, restriction, removal, or age/grade level changes.

"The Handmaid’s Tale"
Atwood, Margaret
Copyright 1986, by O.W. Toad, Ltd.
- Story set in future where psychotic theocracy controls every aspect of everyone’s life

Well isn't that ironic? They sound like a pyschotic theocracy themselves! I've been meaning to read this for some time! I too ought to use this psychotic list as a reading list; such classics too! They can roll over and die. In fact...

In character: The people of Neo-Litaria would like to express their outrage over this list. Many of these books are standard in our public and private libraries; our schools carry these as well. We would prefer if, pardon the lack of professionalism in this quote, "...that they quit acting like pussies and try reading some of these books intelligently; a little "filth" in books never hurt anyone!" Our nation is not trying to tell this orginization how to run itself, but merely expressing our position. Good day.

OOC-Well that felt good! :p

"[SNIP]
Save yourself time - read my short review of it.

It's not worth the time. Unless you're into that kind of thing.

Proudly presenting an organization from my home county...

Anyone familiar with PABBIS???

http://www.pabbis.com/

God, don't get me started... :headbang:

Too bad countless books they have listed are some of my favorites. So much of the text they quote is taken completely out of context. These people have nothing better to do than to nit pick on tiny details.

This list is outrageous!

These people are evil.

I started to document the various awards -- Nobel Prizes, Pulitizer Prize, etc -- but ran out of steam.

Some of these are by the greatest novelists of our time. Some of them are the greatest novels of our time.

That these people would ban them is .... (I'm beyond words)


Beloved - Morrison, Toni (1988 Pulitzer Prize for Fiction, 1993 Nobel Laureate in Literature)
Exodus (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0553258478/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Uris, Leon
How the Garcia Girls Lost Their Accents (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0452268060/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Alvarez, Julia
I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0553279378/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Angelou, Maya
Like Water for Chocolate (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/038542017X/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Esquivel, Laura
Love in the Time of Cholera (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0140119906/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Garcia Marquez, Gabriel (1982 Nobel Laureate in Literature)
One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0451163966/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Kesey, Ken
One Hundred Years of Solitude (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0060929790/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Garcia Marquez, Gabriel (1982 Nobel Laureate in Literature, Oprah's Book Club (http://www.oprah.com/obc_classic/featbook/oyos/obc_featbook_oyos_main.jhtml))
Paula (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0060927216/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Allende, Isabel
Ragtime (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0452279070/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Doctorow, E.L.
Shogun - Clavell, James
Snow falling on cedars (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/067976402X/103-0345811-1703011) - Guterson, David (1995 PEN/Faulkner Award)
The Bluest Eye - Morrison, Toni (1993 Nobel Laureate in Literature, Oprah's Book Club (http://www.oprah.com/obc/pastbooks/toni_morrison/obc_pb_20000427.jhtml))
The Color Purple - Walker, Alice (1983 Pulitizer Prize for Fiction)
The Handmaid’s Tale - Atwood, Margaret (1986 Finalist for Man Booker Prize,
The House of Spirits - Allende, Isabel
The Joy Luck Club - Tan, Amy
The Name of the Rose - Eco, Umberto (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0156001314/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance)
The things they carried - O’Brien, Tim (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0767902890/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance)(finalist for both the 1990 Pulitzer Prize and the National Book Critics Circle Award)
Thousand Pieces of Gold - McCunn, Ruthanne Lum (http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=62-080708381x-0)


EDIT: I looked at PABBIS's own list - the one on the "adult" site. Not the "list of lists" for which they have a disclaimer. The above are all books that PABBIS itself has specific issues with. Many are biographies or semi-historical. Apparently youths should not learn about unpleasant facts of history.

My God...There must be hundreds in there! Many of them are classics!

Save yourself time - read my short review of it.

It's not worth the time. Unless you're into that kind of thing.


What 'sort of thing' do you mean? It's Sci-fi, it's a classic, critically acclaimed by readers and critics alike, what could be bad about it?

I didn't bother reading the list, but I say, lets form the PFSPCSITHWA. People for shooting pro-censorship scum in the head with AK-47s. (just kidding, I'm not quite that intolerant of morons)

I know.

I was looking at the list and was very surprised NOT to see the Bible on there. It's got plenty of violence and sex in it.

Oh right - paranoid Christian parents... :rolleyes:

At least "Exodus" made the list - oh wait...nevermind.

IF they wanted to really make an impact, they should have called themselves:

Parents Against Noxious Texts In Elementary Schools

or....

PANTIES

IF they wanted to really make an impact, they should have called themselves:

Parents Against Noxious Texts In Elementary Schools

or....

PANTIES

How about: Parents Against Noxious Scripts In Elementary Schools?

PANSIES!

No books should be banned.

How else would you know what stupid ranting was unless you read some? ;)

IF they wanted to really make an impact, they should have called themselves:

Parents Against Noxious Texts In Elementary Schools

or....

PANTIES
And you know what happens when they get all in a bunch.... :p

No books should be banned.

How else would you know what stupid ranting was unless you read some? ;)
Lol while trying to be funny you assume only stupid people like reading banned books lol

How about: Parents Against Noxious Scripts In Elementary Schools?

PANSIES!

yah

or

Fathers Against Gay Stuff

(j/k)

It seems that they advocate this list all the way through high school. I doubt anyone here is going to seriously advocate that om this forum.

However, if the Elementary Library where my kids go to school carried some of those books I would try to have them removed as well. There is a limited amount of room at most elementary libraries to begin with so though so I have a hard time believing that any of the really bad books on that list would be found there at all... The community hirers and fires the school superintendent, let them control their libraries that way. You know elections and PTA meetings etc.

Lol while trying to be funny you assume only stupid people like reading banned books lol

No, I'm assuming that if I was banning books, I would only be banning stupid ranting books like Mein Kampf and The Turner Diaries.

But if I did that, how would we know how stupid a person can be?

yah

or

Fathers Against Gay Stuff

(j/k)

Hahaha, the ultimate irony.

This list is outrageous!

These people are evil.

I started to document the various awards -- Nobel Prizes, Pulitizer Prize, etc -- but ran out of steam.

Some of these are by the greatest novelists of our time. Some of them are the greatest novels of our time.

That these people would ban them is .... (I'm beyond words)


Beloved - Morrison, Toni (1988 Pulitzer Prize for Fiction, 1993 Nobel Laureate in Literature)
Exodus (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0553258478/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Uris, Leon
How the Garcia Girls Lost Their Accents (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0452268060/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Alvarez, Julia
I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0553279378/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Angelou, Maya
Like Water for Chocolate (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/038542017X/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Esquivel, Laura
Love in the Time of Cholera (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/product-description/0140119906/ref=dp_proddesc_0/103-0345811-1703011?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=283155) - Garcia Marquez, Gabriel (1982 Nobel Laureate in Literature)
One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0451163966/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Kesey, Ken
One Hundred Years of Solitude (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0060929790/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Garcia Marquez, Gabriel (1982 Nobel Laureate in Literature, Oprah's Book Club (http://www.oprah.com/obc_classic/featbook/oyos/obc_featbook_oyos_main.jhtml))
Paula (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0060927216/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Allende, Isabel
Ragtime (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0452279070/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance) - Doctorow, E.L.
Shogun - Clavell, James
Snow falling on cedars (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/067976402X/103-0345811-1703011) - Guterson, David (1995 PEN/Faulkner Award)
The Bluest Eye - Morrison, Toni (1993 Nobel Laureate in Literature, Oprah's Book Club (http://www.oprah.com/obc/pastbooks/toni_morrison/obc_pb_20000427.jhtml))
The Color Purple - Walker, Alice (1983 Pulitizer Prize for Fiction)
The Handmaid’s Tale - Atwood, Margaret (1986 Finalist for Man Booker Prize,
The House of Spirits - Allende, Isabel
The Joy Luck Club - Tan, Amy
The Name of the Rose - Eco, Umberto (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0156001314/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance)
The things they carried - O’Brien, Tim (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0767902890/103-0345811-1703011?v=glance)(finalist for both the 1990 Pulitzer Prize and the National Book Critics Circle Award)
Thousand Pieces of Gold - McCunn, Ruthanne Lum (http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=62-080708381x-0)



...expanding my ever-burgeoning "must read" list...

At least two Nobel prizewinners on the list. I think it is safe to say that I have more faith in the Swedish institute than these bunch of over-cossetting prudes.
Yassir Arafat was a Nobel Peace Prize winner. Also, a Nobel Prize winning scientist (I can't remember her name offhand) stated that AIDS was a genocidal weapon created by the US to wipe out blacks. And those are not the only examples available of Nobel idiocy.

Sorry, but the Swedish institute's judgement is questionable at best.

The Color Purple Has No Educational Value?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
What ignorant idiots made these list of books.
The Name of the Rose No Value?!?!?!?!?!
Anyone who bans book ought to have their mouths stapled shut so they know what it's like to be silenced themselves. Esp the ones who don't have the nards to write themselves.

Yassir Arafat was a Nobel Peace Prize winner. Also, a Nobel Prize winning scientist (I can't remember her name offhand) stated that AIDS was a genocidal weapon created by the US to wipe out blacks. And those are not the only examples available of Nobel idiocy.

Sorry, but the Swedish institute's judgement is questionable at best.

You really do your best to incite flames, don't you?

Nobel Prizes in Literature

As for Arafat:

The 1994 Nobel Peace prize was awarded jointly to:

YASSER ARAFAT , Chairman of the Executive Committee of the PLO, President of the Palestinian National Authority.

SHIMON PERES , Foreign Minister of Israel.

YITZHAK RABIN , Prime Minister of Israel.

for their efforts to create peace in the Middle East.

:headbang:

Shocking.

I remember when I was in Junior High School, a bunch of the Christian mom's in my town got together and addressed the Schoolboard in protest of us reading Flower's for Algernon. To this day I still don't know what their grounds were for having the book banned, but we -did- read the book, which wasn't worth all the fuss.

But, as a kid if my parents, or anyone, had tried to make sure I didn't read a certain book, I would have made it my life's goal to get my hands on it and to read it repeatedly. Because if there is something in it that they don't want me to see, it could obviously be used against them, right?

"Beware he who would deny you information, for in his heart he dreams himself your master."

But, as a kid if my parents, or anyone, had tried to make sure I didn't read a certain book, I would have made it my life's goal to get my hands on it and to read it repeatedly.[/i]"


Yeah, me too. This would have been a sure-fire way to get me to read "A Tale of Two Cities," which I absolutely hated. My parents tried everything else, none of which worked (it was one of the assigned books in my 9th grade literature class, and for some reason it was sheer torment for me - go figure).

I hope everyone appreciates the irony that this group wants to ban 1984 for our own good.
Reminds me of when Fahrenheit 451 was censored.

But, as a kid if my parents, or anyone, had tried to make sure I didn't read a certain book, I would have made it my life's goal to get my hands on it and to read it repeatedly. Because if there is something in it that they don't want me to see, it could obviously be used against them, right?

Exactly what I did as a child. Though my parents were pretty good about that sort of thing (I read the Dragonlance series in fifth grade), my teachers would repeatedly complain to my parents about the 'advanced reading' I was submitting book reports about. It always took them a while to realize that my parents had given me these books. They were so very concerned that I'd be quite messed up by mature ideas. So I'd find something even more advanced, to annoy them. I think they just didn't want to think while they graded.

My my, I wonder what these people woud have thought or done if they'd realized I sat in on Dungeons and Dragons sessions with my parents and other family members as early as five? Probably contact Child Welfare. Oh well. At least now I have some suggestions for further reading matter. :rolleyes:

I know, imagine the folks who tried to ban Tom Sawyer just because it has a few offensive words in it like "niger". PABBIS is just a clearinghouse for info though, a nice info source, but don't blame them for any items on the lists.

Na. That was just an excuse. What they really didn't like about the book was that it potrayed an interracial friendship.

Exactly what I did as a child. Though my parents were pretty good about that sort of thing (I read the Dragonlance series in fifth grade), my teachers would repeatedly complain to my parents about the 'advanced reading' I was submitting book reports about. It always took them a while to realize that my parents had given me these books. They were so very concerned that I'd be quite messed up by mature ideas. So I'd find something even more advanced, to annoy them. I think they just didn't want to think while they graded.
Heh. I read Lew Wallace's "Ben Hur" (the real thing, not the adaptation) for a 5th grade paper... followed it up with "Pontius Pilate" with references to Tacitus & Seuitonius (sp).

Annoyed the hell out of my teachers, I did...

Na. That was just an excuse. What they really didn't like about the book was that it potrayed an interracial friendship.You could be right, the town that banned it is a college town with a large number of the parents who were for banning it of those ultra-conservative college types.

I am a freshmen in high school and some of the books on the ciriculum have some disterbing material that is really corrupting us(even though we dont admit it)... i mean there are some things that we dont need to know about. like in the book "the bluest eye"(it discribed a father molesting a daughter in detail what is the world coming too i am still psycologically distrubed by it). When you give us a inapropriate book we tend to enjoy it because its "rebelouse" and we have to be rebelouse because we are stupid teenagers. So please support baning these books so our generation wont be too corupt. ok bye

I am a freshmen in high school and some of the books on the ciriculum have some disterbing material that is really corrupting us(even though we dont admit it)... i mean there are some things that we dont need to know about. like in the book "the bluest eye"(it discribed a father molesting a daughter in detail what is the world coming too i am still psycologically distrubed by it). When you give us a inapropriate book we tend to enjoy it because its "rebelouse" and we have to be rebelouse because we are stupid teenagers. So please support baning these books so our generation wont be too corupt. ok bye


Yes, yes, let's shield our scions from all things real! That's a great idea! Which is more psychologically 'distrubing' (lol) and more corrupting... A generation in which the students can read whatever they want whenever they want so they can form their own opinions, or a generation where the students are sheltered until the magical year in which they go to college and all of the shackles are thrown open for that individual to do whatever they please? I know you haven't had college yet, but allow me to submit this to you: Are you going to be more likely to engage in 'immoral' activity if you've read about it and understand the nature of it? I presume not.

What if you were so sheltered that you never knew what 'rape' was until you ended up in the back of a van? Now you are corrupted and know about molestation first hand! That doesn't sound like a superior alternative to me, and I pray to Odin that you don't think that's the way it should be either.

Books like this do more than 'corrupt' like you say. Books which people are afraid of expose the realities of something for which they care not to discuss. Censorship? Racism? Sexism? All of these kinds of books are on the banlists because the people banning would rather have you learn what they think is right instead of letting you form your own opinions. That is a civil rights violation in every sense of the word, and it goes against the principles for which our glorious (yet often contradictory) nation was formed.

I'd rather be shocked now than be shocked by a hell of a lot of stuff when I get into the real world.

Pikachusruleall, you would have a FIT if you read The Lost Boy.

I can't stand this crap :sniper:

I go to a Jesuit school, and we actually read a lot of great stuff, being as we are immune to whiny parents (the school can do whatever it wants, if parents have problems the only thing they can do is withdraw their children). I recall that, just this year, we read Huckleberry Finn (and watched American History X as follow-up), read The World According to Garp (full of sexual material, including at least two transexuals and a vehicular castration-read the book for details), and also read (my personal favorite) Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, which would probably give most of these would-be censors massive heart attacks if they read it.

What I personally ironic- the people who complain that the gov't isn't doing enough to ban these books are usually the same ones who want to "bring the family back to the center of life," and "get the government out of our lives." Ah, the sweet smell of hypocrisy.

I would join, but I caught a clue while I was student teaching and changed my major.

Aw, you can't drop a tantalizing hint like that without provoking me to ask what changed your mind -- and your major!

So, what was it?

I am a freshmen in high school and some of the books on the ciriculum have some disterbing material that is really corrupting us(even though we dont admit it)... i mean there are some things that we dont need to know about. like in the book "the bluest eye"(it discribed a father molesting a daughter in detail what is the world coming too i am still psycologically distrubed by it). When you give us a inapropriate book we tend to enjoy it because its "rebelouse" and we have to be rebelouse because we are stupid teenagers. So please support baning these books so our generation wont be too corupt. ok bye

Sorry, lad-or-lassie, but it appears bluntly obvious that literature is the aspect of English about which you should be the least concerned.

I mean, nobody should be expected to be grammatically immaculate, but "rebelouse"? What is that? A name for one of a family of lice that refuses to dine on human scalps because it's not "cool"? I am hoping -- no, praying -- that you meant "rebellious".

Fathers molesting daughters happens, Pikachusruleall. I know it's uncomfortable to read, but think about what it must be like to have to live with it had it happened to you. Ignorance is only bliss until something rotten happens to you because of it. For all you know, you've got classmates or even friends who have been molested themselves. For them, seeing through literature that they're not freakish and alone is therapeutic. For you, it illuminates the fact that the world is not the fairy tale sold to you at a younger age. The sooner you come to grips with that, the sooner you'll be able to make important decisions about your life, how you want to live, what you will and won't tolerate, and many other issues.

As a freshman (singular, freshmen is plural), you're at an age where more of the innocence of your youth is challenged and often replaced by reality. You can choose to ignore it, deny it, tolerate it, rebel against it, or even try to change it. That's the great part about where you are. Books such as the one you describe arm you with information from perspectives you would normally never get to see.

What you do with that information is up to you. I wish you luck.

Clearly the time for empty words is over! We must bring about a counter-revolution against the right wing fools, we will form: Students Against Bad Parents At School Their rallying cry shal be: Stamping out ignorance begins at home! Ban Ignorant Parents!

Bridge to Terabithia by Katherine Paterson ???

Shit, I think they made me read that one...in 4th grade!

I'd also like to know what in the hell is objectionable about Watership Down :rolleyes:

"Challenged or Banned Mar 94 - Mar 95; ALA Newsletter on Intellectual Freedom" included...

... American Heritage Dictionary :confused:

As my own post, I'd like to add the persepctive of a high school choral music teacher.

I've received any number of complaints from both the Left and the Right (the Middle just seems to enjoy the music regardless of its subject matter) about the music I've chosen over the years. From the Left, I get complaints like:

Spirituals (which used to be called "Negro Spirituals") -- It's condescending and politically incorrect to pronounce the words as though were Jester Hairston's own singers from the 1910s, 20s and 30s. This despite that the vernacular was written and approved by the Black composers themselves and publlished that way with their explicit permission. It's also historically accurate.

Music for Theater -- In college, I was asked to sing some sea chanteys for a production of by English playwright Timberlake Wertenbaker's play about convicts bound for Australia called Our Country's Good. It was a lot of fun until the MD asked me to replace the word "******" with "bigger" in the line "and then I had a ****** girl / she nearly druv' me crazy" from the chantey "Haul Away Joe". So all the wretchedness and moral compromise in the actual play is okay, but Heaven forfend we use the word "******" in its actual context.

Religious music -- I get this one the most. Too much music using religious messages as their texts. I've got some news...no, history for those parents. Were it not for religion, Western music would have taken far longer to develop and much of it would have been lost to only the oral tradition. All those greats you clamor for? Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Brahms, and so forth? The vast amjority of their choral output was religious because that's what paid the rent! So I'm sorry if Mozart's Ave Verum Corpus smacks of papist theology, it's a moving image and landmark choral work. Your kid will sing the alto part, or she'll withdraw from my class.

From the Right, I get complaints like:

Objectionable lyrics -- I have a jazz choir (nothing at all like the sequined dancers of the midwest; the concept here is band jazz for vocals), and occasionally, some of the historic lyrics to classic standards raise a hackle or two. Cole Porter draws fire because he was gay, and "My Heart Belongs To Daddy" was too much for one parent. I was actually surprised this guy knew who Porter was, to be honest. Lyrics written for bebop and modern jazz tunes tend to have been written in the 60s and 70s and feature a decidedly anti-establishment tone. Tough. Jon Hendricks, Eddie Jefferson and many others are giants of vocal jazz and I'm not changing a lick.

You've omitted my [religion, ethnicity, hair color, etc.] -- I've got a finite number of tunes I can program for any one concert or even any one year. And dammit, there aren't really that many good Hanukah arrangements out there (and if there are any Jewish folks in my classes, nobody's made it clear to me they'd like us to sing the Hora). Point is, I choose music based mostly upon its --hello-- musical content. If there's a particularly relevant text, I'll choose it. Stuff like graduation or Veteran's Day get consideration (I arranged Billy Joel's "Goodnight Saigon" for choir which drew fire from the principal until the very veterans he'd asked to speak thanked me in tears for the rendition). In the end, Kwanzaa (for example) itself is not a good reason to choose a song -- I've LOOKED for good Kwanzaa music and it just isn't out there. Besides, not a single one of the numerous Black families in my choirs even celebrates the holiday (one of many things leading me to use Black with a capital B instead of African-American, in case you were curious).

So it doesn't surprise me at all to find a list of books that are recomended for banning or at least harped on about to parents. It seems the list of parental boogeymen is once again out of order with regard to its priorities. This is nothing new. I fully expect that I'll develop some kind of protective zeal when I become a father. I just hope it doesn't lead to lists.

Clearly the time for empty words is over! We must bring about a counter-revolution against the right wing fools, we will form: Students Against Bad Parents At School Their rallying cry shal be: Stamping out ignorance begins at home! Ban Ignorant Parents!


I'm already on it. Look back a few pages for Teachers Against Bad Parents. I see the idea is catching on!

While the presence of some books on that list is incromprehensible to me, I read some of the descriptions on the first page (in particular, 33 Snowfish) and I wouldn't let a child read that. So:
What exactly is a young adult?
Also, how does the grade system work? (What does it mean when you say 5/6/7/11 grade?)

What shocks me is the amount of Hispanic names on that list. I've got a pretty good idea who these people are

One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest - Kesey, Ken
"- On Fairfax County Public Schools Summer 2001 Suggested Reading List For Rising Eleventh and Twelfth Graders"

can someone tell me how old 12th grade usually is

Hmm... they wanted to ban three of the five books of required reading this year at school.

And there book that was rated top 100 worst book. Scary Stories. I have read most of that series, when I was younger (2nd grade probably), and there was nothing even scary about it. Definitely not the most inappropriate book made.

And they also don't want kids to learn about puberty. They aren't aloud to know what the hell is going on in their bodies.

And they also don't want kids to learn about puberty. They aren't aloud to know what the hell is going on in their bodies.

Definite agreement at the stupidity of this.

I don't get it.... what are these parents afraid of?

That their kids will come home and have learned about reality? Or that their kids should suddenly develop independent, critical thought?
What is it that scares them so that they are trying to decide for them what they should or shouldn't read? And why can't they trust the teachers who have, after all, a way better pedagogical knowledge and literary understanding than most parents?

Also another one I disagreed with was Night. Now this book can strike some pretty graphic scenes. And some hard to understand scenes for younger children. But once you are in your teens this is a book you need to read.

UPDATE: Gataway, 12th grade is usually 17-18 years of age. Occasionally (But rarely) 19.

One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest - Kesey, Ken
"- On Fairfax County Public Schools Summer 2001 Suggested Reading List For Rising Eleventh and Twelfth Graders"

can someone tell me how old 12th grade usually is

12th graders tend to be 17 going on 18; 11th 16 going on 17.

My God, political correctness gone mad (again). They've included James Clavell's "Shōgun" in the list, the bad language is necessary in that, it highlights the uncouthness of the Dutch sailors (rather like a modern day version of Act 1, scene 1 of Shakespeare's "The Tempest". Also the sexual content reveals the totally different cultures of East and West in the 17th Century. Also, the book does not set out with this stuff to offend people, not at all. I read "Shōgun" when I was 14, and it didn't warp me any. Don't wrap your children in cotton wool, they'll only resent you for it!!

Thanks Tekania & Refridgerator

Although I agree grudgingly that some material shouldn't be for everyone One flew over the Cuckoo's nest is a classic book that shows an excellent writing style. It outclasses the film which is also very good.
Expanding on this why should we stop kids reading? Kids don't seem to want to read anymore. If these book don't correspond to public taste then they will be forgotton about but at least let the individual decide

The one that amazes me the most: The Graphic Work of M.C. Escher.

The triangles are turning into birds? It must be sorcery! Goodman Escher is a witch!
His tesselations are corrupting our youth and must be banned!

Good to know the morality police are on the job! Working outside the 1st ammendment really helps them track down the nogoodnicks who are corrupting our children's minds! :rolleyes:


How ironic, 1984 was on the list. ;)

Matilda and James and the Giant Peach. Aren't those grade-school classics?
Ah yes, but those are books about children getting betrayed by adults, and we wouldn't want little kids to get the idea that adults might not kinow what they're talking about, now would we? Oh no, no, no, grown-ups know exactly what they're doing.

You know what's funny, those books are on the Fairfax County Public Schools recommended reading list -

and I live in Fairfax County
and my children go to Fairfax County Public Schools

and I find this parents' group and their objections to the reading list to be idiotic

There's nothing wrong with those books.

Anything Roald Dahl wrote should probably be on that list.

a) he's a good writer

b) he dislikes adults

c) he puts a bit of darkness into everything which makes kids like it more.

A book is a loaded gun in the house next door.

Burn it.

And they also don't want kids to learn about puberty. They aren't aloud to know what the hell is going on in their bodies.

Why the hell am I bleeding again and why is there hair on it??? :confused:

Why the hell am I bleeding again and why is there hair on it??? :confused:
Because you touch yourself at night.

Because you touch yourself at night.
And it makes baby Jesus cries! :p

And it makes baby Jesus cries! :p

*drops a brick on baby jesus*

Stop spamming.

To the point:

The Supreme Court of the United States of America, in BOARD OF EDUCATION v. PICO, in 1982, found that restrictions by the school board of the books entering the school library are a violation of the rights of the students under the 1st Amendment.

Choice quote:

"Local school boards may not remove books from school libraries simply because they dislike the ideas contained in those books and seek by their removal to 'prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion.'"

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=us&vol=457&invol=853

P.A.B.B.I.S. is S.C.R.E.W.E.D.

Yes, while that may be the case, the constitution also gives these parents the right to free speech, I hate to say, and if they wish to speak out against these books and makes asses of themselves... :D

The one that amazes me the most: The Graphic Work of M.C. Escher.

The triangles are turning into birds? It must be sorcery! Goodman Escher is a witch!
His tesselations are corrupting our youth and must be banned!

AAAAHHHHHHHHGGHHH!!! :eek: I practically WORSHIP Escher. I studied quite a bit of his art in an architecture class in college. I have an Escher on my wall.

That is sooooooooooo twisted! :(

If any book should be banned, possibly history books with a cleaned up version of the U.S. A little more reality in history books would be nice.

OK, the only book I think shouldn't be on that list is the "Joy Luck Club." So they made some references to sex here and there; big deal. Who cares? People do that all the time on TV and in movies. Does that mean we should ban TV and movies? "Joy Luck Club" should not be on that list, yo...

Did you know "Where's Waldo" is one of the Top 100 Books that are requested to be banned? Yes, the book where you search to find Waldo in the big pictures.

LOL
Those people would be funny if they weren't serious. I can see where you wouldn't want younger kids to get hold of some of the ones heavy on sex and violence, but even some of those have important social messages. And by time I was in high school, I could certainly handle it.
Some are on there just because they portray homosexuality in a less than negative light or Christianity in a less than positive light. And putting fantasy books on there because they have magic in them? That's just nuts.
I need to take this list to the library and check some of these out. My mom would probably love to also.
Some of my favorite authors are on there. I love Isabel Allende and Toni Morrison. Reminds me I need to renew my subscription to Ms.
Anybody notice that The American Heritage Dictionary was on the list of challenged books? That's too funny.

Anybody notice that The American Heritage Dictionary was on the list of challenged books? That's too funny.

Check post #86 :)

I suspect most of the selections people find most offensive made their way onto the list by being age sensitive. If a book is considered innappropriate for 1st graders, it makes the list, even though the very same "censors" would consider it perfectly acceptable for 6th graders. I don't consider listing certain books as being age inappropiaite to be very offensive, although I consider outright banning of books based upon age to be so. I have noted that younger children have difficulty distingushing between fiction and reality and understanding appropriate behavior, without disclaimers these cna be fairly dangerous. Give a young child a copy of Huckleberry Finn without a disclaimer, and they might very well go arround calling people "niger" thinking there is nothing wrong with it.

That's why my parents actually paid attention to what I read and discussed things with me.