NationStates Jolt Archive

Alright im a democrat and i think its reasonable to assume that we will lose the next election. Barack Obama is generally seen among the Democratic Party as almost certainly going win Presidency. so what do all you (non-libertarians) people think.

Alright im a democrat and i think its reasonable to assume that we will lose the next election. Barack Obama is generally seen among the Democratic Party as almost certainly going win Presidency. so what do all you (non-libertarians) people think.
i'm not libertarian and i think you people should vote in a fascist president instead. who needs elections anyways? referendums, yes, but elections? they cause too much trouble.

I think that the Republicans will run C. Rice against him so they aren't seen as an all white party once the Dems run a black guy. Do you think The Reps will run D. Cheney in 08?

cheney isnt healthy enough to be president. (thank god)

im thinking obama needs a few years in the senate before he runs for president. a black man needs excellent credentials. hmmm 2008 dem so 2012 is same dem.... if re-elected then..2016 is repub....so maybe 2020? how old will he be then?

I think that the Republicans will run C. Rice against him so they aren't seen as an all white party once the Dems run a black guy. Do you think The Reps will run D. Cheney in 08?
not a chance in hell. he'll never get elected... but thats kind of what we said about Bush :(

cheney isnt healthy enough to be president. (thank god)

im thinking obama needs a few years in the senate before he runs for president. a black man needs excellent credentials. hmmm 2008 dem so 2012 is same dem.... if re-elected then..2016 is repub....so maybe 2020? how old will he be then?
if George Bush can beat a dem then what makes you think the Republican party is lacking someone better than Bush.

I think that the Republicans will run C. Rice against him so they aren't seen as an all white party once the Dems run a black guy. Do you think The Reps will run D. Cheney in 08?
i would LOVE to have them run rice against hillary clinton.

Do you think The Reps will run D. Cheney in 08?

Cheney says he won't run for president. Some are even saying Laura Bush might run. (I hope not)

Since you don't want libertarian replies (dunno why the hell not) I won't answer your question.

I hate to say this...but the man is black.

It wont happen.

Sadly this country is not ready to elect an African-American, OR, a woman.

if George Bush can beat a dem then what makes you think the Republican party is lacking someone better than Bush.
oh i wasnt even thinking about WHO, just going with that flow of of the universe theory where we'll be so sick of republican policies that we'll go with the dem no matter who it is (PLEASE dont be kerry again) then MAYBE the dem could get re-elected and if he does, it will have to go back repub after that for that whole flow theory again......

I hate to say this...but the man is black.

It wont happen.

Sadly this country is not ready to elect an African-American, OR, a woman.

Unfortunately, I agree. I think we, as a nation, ought to shoot for a non-Christian rich white male before we get any crazy ideas about electing a black man. Baby steps, people, baby steps.

Okay, do I even need to point out why this guy wouldn't win? Or should I just skip to making up lyrics about Osama Obama?

i would LOVE to have them run rice against hillary clinton.Why do you hate America?

I hate to say this...but the man is black.

It wont happen.

Sadly this country is not ready to elect an African-American, OR, a woman.

Well. It doesn't mean much but some of my relatives are rednecks. :rolleyes:

A couple of them said they were rather impressed with him. :eek:

People might be tired of the status quo so who knows.

I would support him if he did.....

I'm a strong Illinois Republican, but I'd definitly vote Obama for Pres!

I hate to say this...but the man is black.

It wont happen.

Sadly this country is not ready to elect an African-American, OR, a woman.
Why not? Surely racists are a small enough minority?

Why not? Surely racists are a small enough minority?

Been to rural South Carolina lately?

Why not? Surely racists are a small enough minority?

This is the United States we're talking about. Some of the biggest counters used against racism in it even today are just another form of racism. It's amazing how many people think racism is the way to counter racism.

I think it will be McCain against Hillary or Kerry in '08. I also think he will give them a run for their money, because he is a pretty moderate Republican. Did you guys know that in 2000, Cheney was added to balance the ticket because he was more conservative than Bush? I thought that was weird myself, but it's true.

I haven't paid too much attention to Obama, tell me his beliefs.

Why not? Surely racists are a small enough minority?

A great deal of people are subconsciously racist. They may not act it out, or pronounce, or even think that they are for that matter, but a great deal of caucasians would have misgivings about voting for EITHER a Woman or an African American for President.

However, I think it'd be damn cool if he ran. Hell, I have a die-hard Republican who thinks Bush is God, and he said he'd vote for him.

Now, Obama has two things going for him:

A)He's young.
B)He's vibrant and energetic.

With the Republican party a great deal of times being related to rich old conceded bastards(They do have this image about them), Obama may very well win a race by carrying the younger vote, while still appealing to the older votes.

The guy has absolutely no political experience. Why in the world would anyone be talking about running him for head of state before they've even seen if hes anywhere near half decent?

The guy has absolutely no political experience. Why in the world would anyone be talking about running him for head of state before they've even seen if hes anywhere near half decent?

He's a likeable person. People like likeable people. Do you actually think that experience and how good you did in the Government in previous offices matters?

I mean, look at George Dubya Bush.

*Puts on flame retardant suit*

A great deal of people are subconsciously racist. They may not act it out, or pronounce, or even think that they are for that matter, but a great deal of caucasians would have misgivings about voting for EITHER a Woman or an African American for President.

However, I think it'd be damn cool if he ran. Hell, I have a die-hard Republican who thinks Bush is God, and he said he'd vote for him.

Now, Obama has two things going for him:

A)He's young.
B)He's vibrant and energetic.

With the Republican party a great deal of times being related to rich old conceded bastards(They do have this image about them), Obama may very well win a race by carrying the younger vote, while still appealing to the older votes.

I'm a Republican, and I might even vote for Obama, it simply depends on who runs against him. If it's someone like McCain, I'd probably vote Obama.

The guy has absolutely no political experience. Why in the world would anyone be talking about running him for head of state before they've even seen if hes anywhere near half decent?

Because he's black.

Honestly, people just want to feel good because they voted in the first black president. I have misconceptions about voting in Obama, or honestly, most democratic canidates. I only plan to do so when the republicans put someone too far from the center for me in line.

Because he's black.

Honestly, people just want to feel good because they voted in the first black president. I have misconceptions about voting in Obama, or honestly, most democratic canidates. I only plan to do so when the republicans put someone too far from the center for me in line.

:confused: I thought you were a democrat.....

Obama will be a has been by 2012. If he isnt then he surely wouldnt be electable. He doesnt have the power behind him for it. Honestly I dont see what the big deal is about the guy. Looks like the Great "add your own" Hype.

:confused: I thought you were a democrat.....

No. I share many beliefs with the democratic party, moreso than the main republican ones, so I vote democrat usually. But things such as gun control, over-humanitarianism, opposition to iraq*, and others make me against them in general. I would much rather have a moderate republican, than a democrat in office.

*I do oppose the war in iraq, but only because we were, and are being lied to about the reasons. Its apparent that there are no WMD's in Iraq, and they werent the biggest threat to us. Its obvious they werent the most flagrant human rights abusers, and we probably should have deposed the ones we set up before any others. I believe it was for two things, oil and strategy. Having virtual control of oil reserves in the future gives us the ability to start calling shots when the oil belt tightens, and taking iraq as a strategic place in the middle east helps to further our plans in the region, also letting us kill many anti-americans in the process(as well as innocent Iraqi's, I know). I may be wrong, but I dont see anything more likely than what I believe, and I agree with the reasons I have put forth as valid ones. The majority of people do not, however, and I find it sad that political parties operate on popularity, as opposed to their real beliefs.

I didnt mean to go off on a tangent about Iraq, I just wanted to clarify what I meant about what I wrote.

I really hope Obama doesn't run too early. He's an asset to the Democratic party and it would be a shame to waste him in an unsucessful bid for the Whitehouse.

He IS very inexperienced, and we know that doesn't matter much in an election, where its the campaign and not the canidate that matters. However, as a concerned citizen I want experienced leadership, not fresh faced congressional freshmen.

If it did somehow come down to McCain versus Obama in 2008 or maybe even 2012, I'd probably vote McCain. Unless the issues that decided the election were somehow highly charged between the two parties, I assume most others would similarly choose McCain as a better choice.

In an ideal world, I would say Obama needs more time to grow into the statesman role. Then he would probably prove to be a very popular president.

My boyfriend said two very scarey words to me today: Jeb Bush.

There is almost certainly going to be another republican in the white house after the next election, unless iraq goes 'nam, because the dems dont have a good candidate. yeah, Obama and Clinton are strong, but Obamas a n00b (not to mention black and that probably won't happen for a while) and Clintons a woman. As optimistic as I am, and as much of a femminist as I am, the country just will not allow it. One of Edwards biggest problems in the primaries was that he was newbie and no one really knew about him, but he ended up strong in the end. Had he had more experience behind him and had he been nominated, I think the dems would have won out. (Kerrys problem was just that he sucked.)

I think we need a more moderate proesident right now. Someone who will appease both sides to soothe some of the tension within the parties and within the factions that are splitting the country. We can't have someone too conservative and who picks and chooses their battles from the bible, but we also can't have some radical who's going to alienate half the country. Even so, dems don't have a chance, but I can't see a huge republican candidate, either.

All I have to say is thank whoever that dubya can't run again, but holy hell lets look out for jeb. The US elected Dubya, who's to say Jeb doesn't have a chance?

I think it will be McCain against Hillary or Kerry in '08. I also think he will give them a run for their money, because he is a pretty moderate Republican. Did you guys know that in 2000, Cheney was added to balance the ticket because he was more conservative than Bush? I thought that was weird myself, but it's true.

I haven't paid too much attention to Obama, tell me his beliefs.

I doubt McCain will ever get the nod for the Republicans. The whole party seems to hate him (or maybe it's just the radical religious base), and I doubt they'd vote for such a moderate Republican to run for President.

I doubt McCain will ever get the nod for the Republicans. The whole party seems to hate him (or maybe it's just the radical religious base), and I doubt they'd vote for such a moderate Republican to run for President.

Unlike the Dems, the republicans haven't had anyone say that they are going to run for the 2008 nomination. The dems have Hillary and Kerry saying they'd like to run, but the republicans have no one.

If it did indeed come down to McCain and Hilary, McCain would win in a landslide.

Honestly, I hope Rudy Guliani runs, however unlikely that may be.

I doubt McCain will ever get the nod for the Republicans. The whole party seems to hate him (or maybe it's just the radical religious base), and I doubt they'd vote for such a moderate Republican to run for President.

I know, its too sad. McCain would be a great candidate for the presidencey. Qualified candidates just dont run for president
Colon Powell, in all likliness wont run
John McCain, will have one hell of a time getting the republican nomination
Rudy Guliani (i know i spelled his name wrong), Probably won't run
Obama, ... wait and see, we might actually get a competent leader for once

I know, its too sad. McCain would be a great candidate for the presidencey. Qualified candidates just dont run for president
Colon Powell, in all likliness wont run
John McCain, will have one hell of a time getting the republican nomination
Rudy Guliani (i know i spelled his name wrong), Probably won't run
Obama, ... wait and see, we might actually get a competent leader for once

The problem with both Obama and Guliani is that they are both inexperienced. Guliani would make a great president, but he is inexperienced at the Federal level.

My boyfriend said two very scarey words to me today: Jeb Bush.


I wouldn't worry about it. Americans are funny about things. I really don't see them going for a third family member in the white house.

Besides Jeb has many blunders that make great weapons against him.

The Schiavo case comes to mind. ;)

The problem with both Obama and Guliani is that they are both inexperienced. Guliani would make a great president, but he is inexperienced at the Federal level.

My New York friends and relatives think he will never run because he has too many skeletons to use against him.....

I take offense to the assumption that we will lose next year. There is a noticeably large pool of talented Democrats who now seem likely to seek the nomination (Russ Feingold, John Edwards, Bill Richardson, Joe Biden and plenty of others we probably haven't even heard of yet.) Who do the Republicans have who hasn't already said they wouldn't run? Pretty slim pickings. The Democratic plans on the White House are more likely to yield success than prospects in the House or Senate, because we don't have a Machiavellian advisor with absolute control over the party.

I don't care who runs against him, i'm NOT voting for obama, no matter how many times he runs for US presidency.

LMAO...even if Feingold runs, which I doubt, there's no way he'd recieve the nomination.

Might as well nominate Dean again...I love Feingold as my senator, but he's just WAY too liberal to ever win a national election. He voted against the Patriot Act...that alone eliminates about 35-40% of voters.

I doubt McCain will ever get the nod for the Republicans. The whole party seems to hate him (or maybe it's just the radical religious base), and I doubt they'd vote for such a moderate Republican to run for President.

Or it could be that McCain has consistently voted against his party on every critical issue.

Moderate = sans-backbone. If you don't have ideals that you believe are worth standing up for, you become a moderate.

Oh, and it just wouldn't be a proper anti-conservative post without labeling anyone on the right as a Bible-thumper. Aren't stereotypes fun?

Or it could be that McCain has consistently voted against his party on every critical issue.

Moderate = sans-backbone. If you don't have ideals that you believe are worth standing up for, you become a moderate.

Its worth pointing out that McCain is actually not a moderate, his voting record indicates a clearly Conservative pattern. Far from being a true moderate, his voting and statments indicate a fairly conservative stance on most issues. What you are doing is equating his refusal to fall into lockstep with the Republican party as spineless, when really, how much further from the truth could that be?

The "critical" issues you refer to are often felt to be unacceptable attempted misuses of federal power. McCain is simply not a party-line voter. Something that has put him at odds with the Republican party in an era where "party loyalty" is seen as more important than principles.

Or it could be that McCain has consistently voted against his party on every critical issue.

Moderate = sans-backbone. If you don't have ideals that you believe are worth standing up for, you become a moderate.

Oh, and it just wouldn't be a proper anti-conservative post without labeling anyone on the right as a Bible-thumper. Aren't stereotypes fun?

Or maybe a moderate can see both sides, and realize that there wouldnt be two extremes with large support if there wasnt common ground?

I would like to think that McCain would go democrat and try to run, if the republicans wouldnt field him.

I live in Il and I will never vote for Obama, as far as McCain, I would never vote for him either.

I doubt McCain will ever get the nod for the Republicans. The whole party seems to hate him (or maybe it's just the radical religious base), and I doubt they'd vote for such a moderate Republican to run for President.
McCain is just the guy Republicans trot out when they want some credibility. It's brutal, he even knows they're using him, and he's just pinning all his hopes that Americans will see him for what he really is and he'll clean up decisively in the primaries for the next presidential election.

I'd bet on the republicans running DeLay. It's a tragedy too, I don't agree with a lot of McCain's views, but I do get the sense of that man that his first question about every problem is "What will make America better?" He has actual integrity, in this day and age... in politics. WTF? DeLay on the other hand is so evil that if your mom and dad found a piece of him in a toaster oven, they're screwed.

But the Democrats forget it. It's almost like they're planning on closing up shop. Too bad, they could easily pick the right platform and crush the Republicans like Regean did to Mondale.

It's useless trying to resist the rise of Jeb. There's really no stopping him - it's been decided. You all know it in your soul of souls to be true. :)

I think it will be McCain against Hillary or Kerry in '08. I also think he will give them a run for their money, because he is a pretty moderate Republican. Did you guys know that in 2000, Cheney was added to balance the ticket because he was more conservative than Bush? I thought that was weird myself, but it's true.

I haven't paid too much attention to Obama, tell me his beliefs.
I thought he balanced the ticket in terms of IQ. Seriously, a lot of people felt more comfortable voting for Bush in 2000 knowing that someone who could tie his own shoes would be there with him.

It's useless trying to resist the rise of Jeb. There's really no stopping him - it's been decided. You all know it in your soul of souls to be true. :)


"It is pointless to resist, my son!" "Search your feelings, you know it to be true!"

:D

I thought he balanced the ticket in terms of IQ. Seriously, a lot of people felt more comfortable voting for Bush in 2000 knowing that someone who could tie his own shoes would be there with him.

Pardon me, but the man graduated from both Harvard and Yale. I'm pretty sure he can tie his own shoes. ;)

Pardon me, but the man graduated from both Harvard and Yale. I'm pretty sure he can tie his own shoes. ;)

Even I'm getting sick of people bashing Bush, and I loath the man. He's quite intelligent, just not that bright in some areas. He's a bit misguided, for lack of better terms. Is he an idiot? No. That'd be Jeb(Anybody who's name is Jeb is an automatic idiot-no offense to any Jebs out there). Some of the things he says though are rather... amazingly stupid, but if you actually listen to what people say, everybody is amazingly stupid.

Alright im a democrat and i think its reasonable to assume that we will lose the next election. Barack Obama is generally seen among the Democratic Party as almost certainly going win Presidency. so what do all you (non-libertarians) people think.

What are you talking about? Unless they screw up incredibly, the Democrats have the 2008 election in the bag.

Even I'm getting sick of people bashing Bush, and I loath the man. He's quite intelligent, just not that bright in some areas. He's a bit misguided, for lack of better terms. Is he an idiot? No. That'd be Jeb(Anybody who's name is Jeb is an automatic idiot-no offense to any Jebs out there). Some of the things he says though are rather... amazingly stupid, but if you actually listen to what people say, everybody is amazingly stupid.

Actually, Jeb is a nickname. His real birth name is John Ellis Bush. :p

Grave digging (posting to long since abandoned threads) is frowned upon. It's even mentioned in the rules! Don't do it!

What are you talking about? Unless they screw up incredibly, the Democrats have the 2008 election in the bag.

I don't know about that. If they run Hillary, the Democrats will be crushed.

However, there's a growing discontent with the Republican Party, (Congress approval at new lows), so we'll see some changes beginning in 2006, a few seats won back. Personally, I think they have a good shot as long as they don't run Hillary.

Grave digging (posting to long since abandoned threads) is frowned upon. It's even mentioned in the rules! Don't do it!

Woah shit! This thing's 6 months old; I wasn't even a member of NS when it was made! I'm out of here.

Who dug this one up?

Alright im a democrat and i think its reasonable to assume that we will lose the next election. Barack Obama is generally seen among the Democratic Party as almost certainly going win Presidency. so what do all you (non-libertarians) people think.

Two things:

first of all, there is no way George Herbert Walker Bush will lose his relection bid in 1992; he has the highest popularity of any president in history. especially to some no-namer from a backwards state in the south.

there is no way Clinton will win relection. he's so unpopular, people elected the first republican congress in 40 years just to put a stop to his crappy policies. we should have known that some nobody from a backwards state in the south couldn't run this country worth jack.

there is no way George W Bush will win this election. Gore can ride on Clinton's coattales right into the oval office. he's obviously more intelligent, more popular, can raise more money, and more well known. when people think of George W, they'll just see the shadow of his father's failures.

et cetera. I hope that you see my point.

Secondly, if Obama is your best hope, then you really are doomed. Obama is nobody--he's barely elected Senator from Illinois. He hasn't done anything yet! All he's done is be black and not come across as stupid. These things do not a president make. I personally think that your best chance is Mark Warner, Governor of Virginia.

I don't know about that. If they run Hillary, the Democrats will be crushed.

However, there's a growing discontent with the Republican Party, (Congress approval at new lows), so we'll see some changes beginning in 2006, a few seats won back. Personally, I think they have a good shot as long as they don't run Hillary.

If anything, the Democrats will easily win if they run Hillary. I don't especially like Hillary, but she wouldn't have too tough a time winning.

Frankly, I want to see Biden run.

Pardon me, but the man graduated from both Harvard and Yale. I'm pretty sure he can tie his own shoes. ;)

There's no question that the man is intelligent.


However, let's not overlook the fact that he got into Harvard and Yale because of his daddy.

P.S. Senator Kerry had almost exactly the same grade point average at Yale as Geoge W did. Both of them had superbly mediocre academics, and both got in because of their dads. Very disappointing.

"It is pointless to resist, my son!" "Search your feelings, you know it to be true!"

:D

I know. I can totally hear the "imperial march" playing in the background. :)

Oh, for crying out loud...

Stop gravedigging! It's not allowed!

I disagree. Obama is a veritable genius; he is very smart, popular, and has a lot of potential. However, I don't think that America is ready for him. I think that Hillary Clinton should be nominated for 2008, and we should see how that election works out before deciding 2012. I know a lot of people dislike Hillary, but she doesn't take any criticism from anyone without having a word about it. In fact, she has been preparing her record from the '04 election so she would be on the ticket in '08.

That's my opinion in a nutshell.

Also, the thread has already been dug up, and it's still on topic, so long live the thread!

There's no question that the man is intelligent.


However, let's not overlook the fact that he got into Harvard and Yale because of his daddy.

P.S. Senator Kerry had almost exactly the same grade point average at Yale as Geoge W did. Both of them had superbly mediocre academics, and both got in because of their dads. Very disappointing.
The President is stupid. There's no running away from the sad truth. And in case you forgot, the elections are over. I don't know why people on the right like to bring it up all the time, that "Kerry was smarter then Bush at Yale" then when the left brings up the elections the right says "get over it." Very hypocritical. But until things like "Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream," ceases to make me laugh, Bush is a moron. He always will be a moron.

Oh, for crying out loud...

Stop gravedigging! It's not allowed!
Holy crap! This is over two months old! :eek: I thought I remembered this thread from before.

I disagree. Obama is a veritable genius; he is very smart, popular, and has a lot of potential. However, I don't think that America is ready for him. I think that Hillary Clinton should be nominated for 2008, and we should see how that election works out before deciding 2012. I know a lot of people dislike Hillary, but she doesn't take any criticism from anyone without having a word about it. In fact, she has been preparing her record from the '04 election so she would be on the ticket in '08.

That's my opinion in a nutshell.

Also, the thread has already been dug up, and it's still on topic, so long live the thread!

I agree that he has potential, but that was my point. He hasn't actually done anything yet!

The President is stupid. There's no running away from the sad truth. And in case you forgot, the elections are over. I don't know why people on the right like to bring it up all the time, that "Kerry was smarter then Bush at Yale" then when the left brings up the elections the right says "get over it." Very hypocritical. But until things like "Families is where our nation finds hope, where wings take dream," ceases to make me laugh, Bush is a moron. He always will be a moron.

It's ironic that you're mocking him for inverting the words "wing" and "dream", but you actually inverted the names "Kerry" and "Bush" in your third sentence.

But you should have noticed by now that Bush was reelected, and we prefer for you to think that he's stupid because it's easier for us to get stuff done.

Also, Bush won in 2000. Get over it. :)

Unfortunately, I agree. I think we, as a nation, ought to shoot for a non-Christian rich white male before we get any crazy ideas about electing a black man. Baby steps, people, baby steps.
I have to agree with you on this Sdaeriji. But I have heard a lot of otherwise people really talking up Colin Powell (before he made it pretty obvious he wasn't going to run), just to shove the fact in every Democrats face that they ran the first black major party presidential candidate.

Also, it would give the racist Republicans an easy out (I'm not a racist! I voted for a black president!). We'd be hearing this for years in the South.

I have to agree with you on this Sdaeriji. But I have heard a lot of otherwise people really talking up Colin Powell (before he made it pretty obvious he wasn't going to run), just to shove the fact in every Democrats face that they ran the first black major party presidential candidate.

Also, it would give the racist Republicans an easy out (I'm not a racist! I voted for a black president!). We'd be hearing this for years in the South.

:eek: They've stumbled onto yet another element of our vast, right-wing conspiracy! :eek:

I think that a non-white presidential candidate would create more of a problem for the Democratic party than the Republican Party. The Republican party loves to elect non-whites... I'm sorry to say that when we do, it seems like we parade them around, "look at us! we're not racist!" etc. There are plenty of promenent black Republicans, both elected and appointed, as well as other non-white members. The reason I say that it would be more of a problem for the Democrats is that your black office holders pretty much only get elected from predominantly black districts; if less than half the district is black, your black candidates can't get elected. I know that the vast majority of Democrats are not racist against blacks, but consider how white the Democratic tickets have been and how white the Clinton Administration was. With all of the non-whites in your party, why has there never been a serious contender (let alone, nominee) for a national position who is non-white? Republicans are use to seeing blacks in positions of significant party power (Colin Powell, Condolezza Rice), but I don't think that the same can be said for the Democrats.