NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,6119,2-10-1462_1715592,00.html

Boy, 7, kills baby

Miami - Florida authorities are trying to figure out how to charge a seven-year-old boy who beat his seven-month-old sister to death with a board in Tampa on May 22.

The boy, who was visiting his father, ran outside to tell his dad that the baby was bleeding.

His father and the man's girlfriend found the baby bleeding from the nose and not breathing.

The boy denied having touched the baby until he was confronted with the results of the autopsy.

"He then admitted that he kicked, punched and hit his seven-month-old (half) sister in the head with a two-by-four," a piece of construction lumber two by four inches (5 x 10cm), said Tampa police spokesperson Laura McElroy.

She said that the boy was apparently jealous of the sister, who would not stop crying.

"The veteran detectives that worked in this case said they had never seen a child - who's only seven - who has shown so much violence and shown so little remorse for hurting his little sister," she said.

Prosecutors are looking at how they can try him, McElroy said. The boy is in his mother's custody, she said.

News reports say that he beat his sister to death because she cried too much and that she got too much attention. Florida does not have a minimum age at which a person can be tried for murder. Should this child be tried as a criminal or does he understand the concept of death and the outcome of his actions?

What would you do if this were your child?

Crucifixion.

You should not be leaving a baby in the care of a child that age. That means, you don't let them play outside together unsupervised. Children don't have the capacity to understand the long term effects of their actions. Kids get jealous of one another. If I leave my three year old alone with my 1 year old, I know there is going to be some damage done...even if she doesn't mean to, she can hurt the baby just trying to play with her if she's too rough.

This is a sad, disgusting story.
It makes you wonder what this boy has been epxosed to or if he has some mental problems.
He isnt old enogh to wipe his own ass properly.

I dont know what I would do if one of my children beat or killed the other, but they are all sound of mind so far and they are all very well cared for in a stable household. I cant imagine this.

Institutionalize him until he's either cured or dead. If he's cured then expunge his criminal record and let him get on with his life.

Crucifixion.

LOL.

I think that's a bit harsh for a young child. Tying him to a pole for a couple of days with no food would teach him a lesson.

thats the kind of person that will grow up to kill many. But why would the parents leave him alone with the baby?

Institutionalize him until he's either cured or dead. If he's cured then expunge his criminal record and let him get on with his life.
That actually sounds like a really good idea.

thats the kind of person that will grow up to kill many. But why would the parents leave him alone with the baby?

I haven't heard why he was left unattended with his sister. I can see how this would happen if the baby was down for its nap and he snuck in and beat her to death...but, where were the parents that they wouldn't have heard this? At 7 he probably doesn't need constant monitoring, but be checked on frequently. A baby, though, should be within hearing distance at the least.

Murder is murder, simple as that. I say hit the little bastard with everything the law can use against him.

I doubt that most 7 year olds would have a full understanding of death. This little guy seems to have understood it enough to know that he could get rid of his sister by beating her to death. Obviously, he has psychological problems. Is he a budding psychopath or is this a one-time mistake due to his immaturity?

whoa - the baby was beat with a 2x4 and the only visible evidence was a nose bleed?

thats the kind of person that will grow up to kill many. But why would the parents leave him alone with the baby?


I definetly agree here

there IS no good legal punishment for this child. he cant go to prison, he cant go to reform school. he can be put on "probation" so that he can get the councilling he will desperately need when he is old enough to know what he did.

Institutionalize him until he's either cured or dead. If he's cured then expunge his criminal record and let him get on with his life.
I agree with DC. I think that the boy's parents should also take some share of responsibility.

Take this from someone who almost accidentally killed his sister once, (I used to be a mean older brother) that kids that age don't really get the point behind death. What should happen? Psychological counciling.

The way some of you people say that kids should be treated would probably get you lynched, btw. If this kid was mentally unstable, then those of you wanting to see this kid executed, in jail for life, etc are just as mentally unstable, probably.

I can't believe this! Only yesterday I was reading about a nine year old girl who stabbed her friend to death over a ball...

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/06/01/1117305628677.html?from=top5

A nine-year-old girl is being held in a New York juvenile detention centre after allegedly stabbing her friend to death with a kitchen knife in an argument over a rubber ball.

Police officials said the girl, whose name was not released because of her age, was believed to be the youngest ever suspect in a killing in New York City, and it was not immediately clear how the case would proceed.

The girl was playing at home in Brooklyn on Sunday with her 11-year-old friend, Queen Washington, when the two girls got into an argument over a ball, a police spokesman cited family relatives as saying.

By the time the suspect's mother returned from an errand, her daughter had plunged a steak knife into Washington's chest, police said.

The victim was declared dead on arrival at hospital.

Cases involving children younger than 14 are usually dealt with in a special family court.

I expected this thread to be about this case, so I'm amazed to find there's another, younger murderer out there.

What is the world coming to?

What is the world coming to?

Actually this stuff has been going on all along. It's just that it's the IN thing to report nationally right now. Kids gone bad is the IN thing. Sorta like the whole sex offender thing last month. These things have happened all through history, and they will keep on happening.

You know what's weird is you never hear what happened to people like this after the trial is over. You never hear about them.... Makes ya wonder.

So we get 2 psychotic little kids out of 6 and a half trillion.

Crazy stuff like that is bound to happen with so many people.

Thats pretty good odds, actually. 2/6,500,000,000

Goverment should use psycological torture so the little bastards learn what's discipline, and cut theri hands too (joking)

They should be put into special attention programmes to see why they did this, in many cases it's the family or well the television

So we get 2 psychotic little kids out of 6 and a half trillion.

Crazy stuff like that is bound to happen with so many people.

Thats pretty good odds, actually. 2/6,500,000,000

Make that 3.... Last month a 13 year old boy in California killed a 15 year old boy with a bat due to the other one teasing him because his team lost.

But yes, you have a good point. Those are good odds. People only are noticing due to the news having no other things to defecate upon.

Oh yeah. I remember that one.

That kid was just a dumbass.

"Hmm.. I think I'll drive my baseball bat into my friend's head. Pff.. No, it won't kill him."


Eyewitnesses said that it sounded like a mallet hitting a pumpkin.

Take this from someone who almost accidentally killed his sister once, (I used to be a mean older brother) that kids that age don't really get the point behind death. What should happen? Psychological counciling.

The way some of you people say that kids should be treated would probably get you lynched, btw. If this kid was mentally unstable, then those of you wanting to see this kid executed, in jail for life, etc are just as mentally unstable, probably.

Thats pure bull. Any kid that age is aware of right and wrong, and if beating a crying infant with a 2X4 doesn't register as anything other than a good way to silence the noise, then you need to take a good long look at his parents. In the meantime, you place the kid in a more restrictive enviorment to ensure he can never do this again to someone else's kid. To let the kid run around free like nothing happened is every bit as irresponsible as leaving a baby alone with him in the first place.

This just shows how violent society is, if a little boy can kill a baby and not feel bad about it. Overpopulation probably has something to do with people becoming more violent and less remorseful, but that's another debate.

Anyway I think the boy's parents (both the mom, dad, and the mother of the baby), should share some of the responsibility, since they should never have left the baby alone with the boy, especially if the boy had acess to a weapon such as a 2x4. A 7-year-old is probably capable of understanding death, and is definitely capable of understanding the difference between right and wrong, that is of course unless he can be proven legally insane, in which case he should be institutionalized regardless of Florida's laws regarding penalties for insane persons, of which I have no knowledge. Since it is difficult to assertain the sanity of a person, especially that of a child, that can most likely not be proven. As to wether the boy should serve jail time or the death penalty, I think that is a little rash for a small child and wouldn't be effective. This boy beat a member of his family to death. He most likely did not intend murder, but nevertheless he did something wrong and he needs to be put in a place where he can get help. Some sort of special learning center or something. That this sort of thing would even ever happen, especially when parents are around (PEOPLE, you have GOT to pay attention to you kids!!!), just sickens me.

i think that the 7yr old should be studied to try and find out what makes a child so young snap like that. all murderers under 15 should be. if they can't be cured, then maybe the military should take them in for the special forces... they need people good at killing and it gets them out of society. (to anyone who didn't get that, it was a JOKE!)
seriosly tho. the parents should get charged with child endangerment. any good parent can see a sibling rivalry, and should know that children who are jealous of each other will beat the crap out of each other. leaving a 7month old baby with an angry 7yr old was just plain stupid. the parents are responsible... they need to act like it.

Liverbreath']Thats pure bull. Any kid that age is aware of right and wrong, and if beating a crying infant with a 2X4 doesn't register as anything other than a good way to silence the noise, then you need to take a good long look at his parents. In the meantime, you place the kid in a more restrictive enviorment to ensure he can never do this again to someone else's kid. To let the kid run around free like nothing happened is every bit as irresponsible as leaving a baby alone with him in the first place.

ANY kid that age huh? Have you SEEN Nanny 911 ever? Some of those kids hang of rail banisters 20 feet in the air because they are so hyper. I know a kid that ran around with knives after his sister before. You really need to get out more if you think most seven year old know right and wrong.

Or perhaps you'd like to see some Marque De Sade type punishment?

It's easy to pass judgement/punishment on someone you don't know or care for. The method I use is this: Imagine that the person you want to punish is your own son/daughter.

It frightens me that people have forgotten the ideas of "change of heart" and of fit of rage. It seems that in most peoples' minds here, this kid knew exactly what he was doing at the time, and is gonna become Michael Myers now. Get a life people. You've seen 1 too many horror movies.

Read a psychological study on fits of rage, and you will see that at the time, those people cannot control what they are doing, nor can they control their own strength.

There's no point in institutionalizing him, because there's probably nothing wrong with him. The chance he has a mental disorder is exactly the same as if you picked some random person. 7 year olds can be vicious, and although they may no something is bad, they can't understand the longterm affects.

I personally believe people are naturally a little more on the evil side, therefore if this type of urge hasn't been curtailed it's because of the parents. I say they should be tried.

-edit- the 9 year old I would say the same thing for, but the 13 year old should be tried and held accountable.

^ I agree. At 13, you know the consequences of killing someone.


A seven year old does NOT understand what killing someone means. They can't comprehend exactly what they're doing. I think the killed should be monitored, and probably given counseling, so that he can understand what he did, and not to do anything like it again.

You know actually, enlisting them in the military sounds like a good idea.

^ I agree. At 13, you know the consequences of killing someone.


A seven year old does NOT understand what killing someone means. They can't comprehend exactly what they're doing. I think the killed should be monitored, and probably given counseling, so that he can understand what he did, and not to do anything like it again.

Thank you for having common sense. Yes, the 13 year old should be tried and sent to some place where he can live out the next 15 or so years of his life away from the media, and attend group counciling for people who murdered or something. A seven year old is different.

Negronian']You know actually, enlisting them in the military sounds like a good idea.

Yeah. We could use the kids as shields like the terrorists do. (sarcasm) I'm sure you should share that with the nightly news. (You probably would be in the hospital by morning).

Uginin brought up an interesting scenerio. Imagine that your 7 year old did this. Suppose that for just a couple of minutes, you ran out to the mailbox, your baby asleep, your 7 year old quietly playing with his Legos. When you get back you find that your son has beaten his little sister to death with his baseball bat. What do you think? What do you do? How do you view your son? What are your feelings towards your son after doing something like this?

How do you then determine at what age an individual has the capacity to understand the long-term effects of an action?

I still say crucifixion. We need to bring it back.

How do you then determine at what age an individual has the capacity to understand the long-term effects of an action? *snip (because it needs to be snipped*

I've seen mentally challenged adults that didn't understand the possible effects of their actions. It varies with each person. It's telling that the police find that this little boy shows no remorse. He's smug and pleased with himself that he now doesn't have to share attention with his sister or listen to her cry. Does he really understand what he has done?

Possibly. If there were a way to make it legal and feasible, the most appropriate means of treatment would be to make juvenile murderers experience just what the victim did, without dying of course, that would make the whole point moot.

It does wonders when you actually walk in the other persons shoes.

Of course I am not advocating actually beating him up, but there should be a way to ensure he knows the extent of harm he has caused. And there is no more thorough way than through experience.

I've seen mentally challenged adults that didn't understand the possible effects of their actions. It varies with each person. It's telling that the police find that this little boy shows no remorse. He's smug and pleased with himself that he now doesn't have to share attention with his sister or listen to her cry. Does he really understand what he has done?

Probably not.
Before punishment, it is essential to make children understand the punishment
In this case, your sister is dead. that is why you are being punished.
I think it's more likely to be hit the baby so it will be quiet, then actual desire to kill though.

My personal view is that he should be put in an institution with therapy for a LONG time
He may or may not understand the consequences of what he has done but that does not make him any less of a potential threat
Lots of therapy ... lots of time to think about it

(and the parents neglect in this case SHOULD be studied)

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News/0,6119,2-10-1462_1715592,00.html



News reports say that he beat his sister to death because she cried too much and that she got too much attention. Florida does not have a minimum age at which a person can be tried for murder. Should this child be tried as a criminal or does he understand the concept of death and the outcome of his actions?

What would you do if this were your child?

I have a feeling the state will hold a compitency hearing, and possible try him, depending on the outcome, as either an adult, or find him insane; and have him remanded for the next 11-14 years at the local nut-house for juveniles.